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More on Grid Computing and Gaming

michael posted more than 11 years ago | from the weakest-link dept.

Games 150

securitas writes "Sony, IBM and Butterfly.net will announce and demonstrate a new grid computing network for PS2 online gaming at the Game Developers Conference next week. The network is based on Linux and the Open Grid Services Architecture (OGSA) and is designed to support millions of players. This is believed to be the first major consumer application of grid technology. Read the details at the NY Times, CNET and the Washington Post."

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150 comments

FP (-1, Redundant)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#5395238)

GOD DAMN i rock, tell me how great i am bitchaz.

You don't rock enough... (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#5395255)

...to avoid GETTING VOMITED ON!

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And here I thought.... (1, Funny)

Kenja (541830) | more than 11 years ago | (#5395244)

And here I thought the network interface for my PS2 I purchased was just a fancy means of colecting dust samples from the sournding area. You mean some one may release soem software for it after all this time?

Money to burn... (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#5395320)

Why did you purchase it if there was no supporting software? Christ, I have enough trouble affording the peripherals I need...

post (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#5395253)

of the first encounter

moron crud computing, as it appLIEs to usery (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#5395258)

people, for the most part, automatically give fair value for value recieved. the small # of folks who avoid paying for things, does NOT affect legitimate commerce.

the badtoll here is: how much more monIE can these greed/fear based stock markup frauds, extract from US, without returning anything?

it's write in the pairabulls. those who graft without adding value, shall see their 'fortunes' fade in the gnu millennium.

remember, people will almost AWAYS, automatically, PAY fair value for goods/services received. the only need for excessive .controll, is to fuel the dying gangsterious last gasp efforts of the evile ill eagle kingdumb, & IT's phonIE payper bullshipping industry. we cannot afford to support such execrable (yesterdaze word).

tell 'em robbIE.

About time... (2, Interesting)

Da Fokka (94074) | more than 11 years ago | (#5395273)

X-Box online is a Major selling point for the X-Box right now. I'm surprised Sony didn't come up with anything similar earlier.

moron selling poiNTs of fuddles' phonIE.. (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#5395295)

payper liesense stock markup scams. it's just a game to those fauxking phukes.

x marx the blox.

Feds seizing domain names
Declan McCullagh, Staff Writer, CNET News.com

WASHINGTON--Federal police have adopted a novel crime-fighting tactic: seizing control of domain names for Web sites that allegedly violate the law.

Attorney General John Ashcroft said Monday that the domain names for several Web sites allegedly set up to sell illegal "drug paraphernalia" would be pointed at servers located at the Drug Enforcement Administration. A federal judge in Pittsburgh granted the U.S. Department of Justice permission to do so until a trial can take place, the government said.

Wednesday afternoon, the DOJ said it had taken over the iSoNews.com domain, whose owner pleaded guilty to felony copyright crimes under the controversial Digital Millennium Copyright Act (DMCA). David Rocci, 22, pleaded guilty in December to using his site to sell "mod" chips that let Microsoft Xbox and Sony PlayStation owners modify their devices so they can use them to play illegally copied games, or "warez."

Rocci "attempted to profit by marketing circumvention devices to (the gaming) community knowing they would be used to play pirated games," Michael Chertoff, the assistant attorney general for the DOJ's criminal division, said in a statement. "He thought that there were no risks associated with his actions. He was wrong, and everyone engaged in the warez scene should take note."

best not to go online at all, with something like that.

well... (2, Funny)

borgdows (599861) | more than 11 years ago | (#5395298)

is there really a major selling-point for the Xbox?!?

Re:well... (2, Informative)

Da Fokka (94074) | more than 11 years ago | (#5395379)

It's always easy to bash Microsoft on slashdot but I have to say that the X-box is a pretty decent product. Technologically it beats the crap out of the PS2 although the game line-up could be better. But it's improving.

XOL provides a lot of people with an easy way to play games without the annoyances of cheaters/abuse. I'm not a fan of Microsoft but they're doing pretty well with de X-Box.

The PS2 Linux dev-kit is pretty sweet though :)

Re:well... (3, Funny)

DemiKnute (237008) | more than 11 years ago | (#5395547)

Technologically it beats the crap out of the PS2 although the game line-up could be better.

Yeah, you cannot beat the breast jiggling code that that there XBox has, no sirree.

Re:well... (1)

Alan Partridge (516639) | more than 11 years ago | (#5395608)

"Technologically it beats the crap out of the PS2 although the game line-up could be better."

Just because we are more familiar with the tech of the X-Box doesn't make it better, personally I don't really think any of the big three consoles is indisputably more powerful than the others. Just look at games like GT Concept and Ace Combat 4 on the PS2, then tell me again how the other consoles have better gfx. They're ALL worthy systems, but Microsoft should simply not be allowed into this market. trust me, it'll be IE6 and Outlook on the X-Box before long, and Dell will start to wonder who ate their lunch.

Don't buy Microsoft products.

Console breakdown, reality crashes in... (1, Informative)

CTD (615278) | more than 11 years ago | (#5395910)

Here is where I pulled the data [thexboxstop.com] . You may search to cross verify it. I'm only going to pull the basics, the link has a great chart with complete breakdowns on PS2, GC, Xbox, and DC. Worth a look if you really want to know. You should probably ignore it if you want to continue to personally think that the big three don't have indisputable power differences..

PlayStation 2
CPU: 295 MHz
Video: 150 MHz
Polygon Count: 66 Million
RAM: 32 MB

GameCube
CPU: 485 MHz
Video: 202.5 MHz
Polygon Count: 6 - 12 Million
RAM: 43 MB

Xbox
CPU: 733 MHz
Video: 300 MHz
Polygon Count: 125 Million
RAM: 64 MB

Listed from weakest to most powerful. When presented with the facts, it's clear which machine is superior and which machine is using latent technology. The only quirk point is the poly count on GC, but it's still deserving of second fiddle due to the dominance over PS2 in the other categories.

That has nothing to do with how the power is used. Currently the Xbox has the most power, but the least utility. Granted DOA Beach Volleyball is impressive graphically, but nobody has really pushed the box to it's limits in a game. When that happens, the PS2 and GC will look like N64 in comparison.

Re:Console breakdown, reality crashes in... (5, Informative)

deemah (644363) | more than 11 years ago | (#5396059)

There's more to this debate than pure numbers. The PS2 and the GameCube have radically different architectures to the Xbox.

In fact, in your list, the only numbers that can actually be used as a measure of performance are those of the PC-like Xbox.

If I were to describe the PS2 as having three processors working in parallel, each with their own on board memory and two of them able to operate on vectors directly, you might start to see how it differs from a PC concept.

Similarly with vRAM. The PS2 has a 'measly' 4Mb of video ram but it also has the ability to stream textures in and out of it faster than a frame can be drawn. This gives you a much larger 'virtual' vRAM.

Re:Console breakdown, reality crashes in... (4, Insightful)

EpsCylonB (307640) | more than 11 years ago | (#5396105)

Sorry but this is misleading, the CPU's for the PS2 and GC are both specifically designed for games, the xbox is still more powerful but it is a lot closer than those numbers represent.

The xbox is running a x86 intel chip, I'm sure most of us here don't need to be reminded that the current x86 chips we use today are descendants of of chips designed purely to crunch numbers for business applications. Quite a lot of CPU cycles are wasted in current computers, if you were trying to design a CPU for an interactive entertainment system you would not design it like an x86 chip.

Also the fact that the PS2 is 18 months older than the xbox explains why it's spec seems to be unimpressive.

Re:Console breakdown, reality crashes in... (3, Insightful)

fbg111 (529550) | more than 11 years ago | (#5396145)

When presented with the facts, it's clear which machine is superior and which machine is using latent technology.

Cuz we all know that CPU MGz is the defining performance factor, and that theoretical polygon count is the same as actual polygon count.

Currently the Xbox has the most power, but the least utility.

Define "utility".

nobody has really pushed the box to it's limits in a game

Let me guess, Microsoft told you that?

I actually own both consoles. Yes, Xbox wins out graphically, but not by leaps and bounds. PS2's only flaw is its poor texturing ability and lack of hardware shaders for surface effects. But good devs like Naughty Dog and Rockstar (with GTA:VC) are coming up with some nice software graphical implementations. And in the end, it really is about the games, and PS2 continues to dominate in that respect, although Xbox is slowly getting better.

Re:Console breakdown, reality crashes in... (1)

Alan Partridge (516639) | more than 11 years ago | (#5396207)

really, you've just reinforced my point. We are familiar with the tech specs of PCs, so we recognise that the X-Box is a pretty nifty games playing machine - probably better than ANY currently available notebook PC, anyway. However, trying to break down the custom architectures of the GC and PS2 in the same way is just a fools' errand. We can see on our screens that the GC often has just beautiful lighting effects, we can see that PS2 sometimes has incredibly fast moving / hugely detailed models and that X-Box games often have gorgeously rendered textures. Does any of this affect gameplay? Not really, and with each consoles' other indisyncratic technologies playing their different roles, none gains a tangible lead over the others.

Re:Console breakdown, reality crashes in... (3, Insightful)

gergi (220700) | more than 11 years ago | (#5396604)

Just so you know...
The Polygon count specified for PS2 & XBox are optimum but not "real-world" while the GC polygon count is "real-world". The numbers are actually fairly even across the board.

The CPU for the PS2 & GC are also designed for games, which the XBox is not. This makes a huge difference.

It boils down to this:
Sony relies on different numbers, the number of people who own a PS2 and the number of games available. Which is why the PS2 is #1 in games sold, by a huge margin.
Nintendo doesn't rely on numbers at all, it relies on games to speak for the quality of the GC. Which is why the Gamecube is by far the most profitable of the current systems, despite selling less games than the PS2.
XBox is relying on the argument the TurboGrax and other failed products rely on: "Better" hardware. They need to focus on more games if they want any market-share. Which is why Microsoft is in last place world-wide and losing a fortune.

It's the games, stupid.

Re:Console breakdown, reality crashes in... (1)

Goth Biker Babe (311502) | more than 11 years ago | (#5396621)

You must know by now that a straight comparison of figures on paper is meaningless. An SGI Octane with what, on paper, is a low clock speed trounces all over an equivalent intel machine. Remind me what the main processor of a PS2 is.

Re:well... (1)

Goth Biker Babe (311502) | more than 11 years ago | (#5395809)

"Technologically it beats the crap out of the PS2 although the game line-up could be better"

Surely game play is the whole point of consoles. It doesn't matter how pretty a game is, how many vertices a console can render, how many channels of sound it has etc etc. In the end it's down to game play. The best of the 8 bit micro games are still very enjoyable and in modern terms they have crap sound and graphics. The PC version of Vice City is prettier than the PS2 version but it's still the same game the extra is just icing on the cake. I bought a PS2 purely because there were more really playable games.

Bad comparison (1)

GeckoX (259575) | more than 11 years ago | (#5395961)

You're right except for the really bad comparison.
There IS no version of Vice City for PC, it's a PS2 ONLY game.

If you're looking for the proper comparison, it's GTA3 on PC vs GTA3 on PS2.

But, the playability factor is the major one as you mentioned. I thoroughly enjoy playing GTA3 on the console over the PC, it just feels better. (Besides the comfort factor of being able to lounge on the couch ;-) Even though, as you mention, it typically _looks_ better on the PC.

Re:About time... (1)

Organic_Info (208739) | more than 11 years ago | (#5395376)

They did. Online gaming was touted ages before the PS2 came out. But Sony underestimating the surge in popularity of multiplayer games moved to slow.

Xbox however hot on the heels of the PC multiplayer boom included it from the start.

For all their evil MS can be quick to spot a hole in the law...err I mean market and exploit it. They have a tendancy to drive hard when they smell weakness in the opposition.
.
That and blatent dirty tactics usually put them on top.
.

Re:About time... (1, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#5395579)

Ding... welcome to reality...

Sony has the PS2 online for MUCH longer than the X box.

PS2 online gaming is FREE for most games.. and is a per-month for only the subscription games.

Oh did I mention that I play the halo killer Tribes-2 Arial assult FREE online? as well as twisted metal black online for FREE and several other games for FREE online..

A major selling point against the X box is that the PS2 online gaming is for the most part FREE.

put that in your X box and smoke it.

I cant believe how the X box owners are completely oblivious.. I had one tell me yesterday that there were more games for the X box than the PS2. So I pulled up a list for both and asked this person again what did they mean.. they said "Oh I mean the PS1"... HAHAHAHAHAHA! NOTHING has more games than the PS1.. not even the Atari 2600.

Oh well... X box will still reside as the number 3 gaming console... with Sony at the top and nintendo in the middle.

Oh wait .... there's only 3 players in the console game?? sorry MS...

Re:About time... (1)

borgdows (599861) | more than 11 years ago | (#5396299)

NOTHING has more games than the PS1.. not even the Atari 2600.

actually, Nintendo SuperFamicom (NES) is the console with the most games ever!

Re:About time... (1)

Alan Partridge (516639) | more than 11 years ago | (#5396352)

any idea how many?

surely the PS1 must have thousands - I can't help but wonder now how many games were written for the C=64, Amiga and Sega Megadrive - they all had many hundreds for sure. Got any stats? And what about the Gameboy?

Re:About time... (1)

erdna (558965) | more than 11 years ago | (#5396272)

This is similar to Xbox Live? How?

I don't see any central managing, billing, authentication, single ID, etc, etc, etc. It feels like an interesting network for a game developer to run their titles on, but they still seem to need to do all the rest of the work, no? And at that point, it almost seems easier to go with a known server solution and be done with it.

Don't get me wrong - there could be something here. But the press release is a great example of hype and no substance - where are the dropped names of leading game developers, and killer games? I get suspicious when there's no industry support.

What's so special about the grid? (1, Interesting)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#5395278)

I've read a few Grid papers, and still do not understand what is so original about the "grid" idea. Isn't it essentially the idea of ARPANET, except with better funding? :)

Re:What's so special about the grid? (3, Insightful)

rw2 (17419) | more than 11 years ago | (#5395528)

ARPANET was about creating a network that was resiliant to bad things.

There are parallels. When an arpanet node goes down routing takes place on the other nodes instead.

In a grid there are many nodes. Some have speciallized resources that are fairly single point of failure suseptable (e.g. mass storage systems, large experimental devices), but most can be supplanted by another node.

That's where the analogy stops though. Where arpanet was concerned with networking, grids are concerned with networking on in that they use them. They are really about job movement, data movement, resource discovery and _security_.

Re:What's so special about the grid? (2, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#5395651)

ARPANET was about creating a network that was resiliant to bad things.

No, it wasn't. This myth is till being purpetuated, even though it has been debunked by the original developers of ARAPNET themselves many times over.

ARPANET was designed to link together a whole bunch of very expensive, DoD funded computing centers. It turned out that packet switching was a really great way to do this efficiently. Now, while early packet switching research at RAND in the 50's was concerned with building a survivable communications network, it was irrelvent for as applied to ARPANET.

I recomend the book Where Wizards Stay Up Late for more information.

hmm (2)

Joe the Lesser (533425) | more than 11 years ago | (#5395280)

"Butterfly uses a "grid computing" approach, in which multiple servers work together as a virtual supercomputer, seamlessly shifting processing tasks among individual machines."

How is this different from Parallel computing?

Re:hmm (2, Funny)

Organic_Info (208739) | more than 11 years ago | (#5395317)

"How is this different from Parallel computing?"

Its all in the pattern in which you arrange the servers.

Parallel, butteryfly, grid, hexagon, hypercube....... :)

Re:hmm (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#5395438)

I'd like to see the network diagrams for a hypercube of servers!

Re:hmm (1)

Atzanteol (99067) | more than 11 years ago | (#5395377)

I believe the difference between a 'grid' and 'parallel computing' is that a grid tends to just run individual un-related instances on each server.

Though I could be wrong...

Difference between parallel computing and Grid (4, Interesting)

pbhj (607776) | more than 11 years ago | (#5395395)

It's not! As far as I can discern the only difference is in the length (and quantity) of the connections. Parallel computing normal involves a local cluster of computers (LAN, eg a Beowulf type project) whilst the Grid works on the SETI type system of enlisting processing power across the internet (WAN) - ie many more processors separated by greater differences. Note these are comparative terms so you decide what's a Grid and what's an MPP

Whatis says: Grid computing requires the use of software that can divide and farm out pieces of a program to as many as several thousand computers. Grid computing can be thought of as distributed and large-scale cluster computing and as a form of network-distributed parallel processing. It can be confined to the network of computer workstations within a corporation or it can be a public collaboration (in which case it is also sometimes known as a form of peer-to-peer computing).

pbhj

Re:hmm (2, Funny)

lovebyte (81275) | more than 11 years ago | (#5395647)

How is this different from Parallel computing?

If you go to venture capitalists to sell your brilliant and new idea on parallel computing, they will show you the door.

If you sed 's/parallel/grid/g', then they'll ask you 'How much do you want?'

Re:hmm (4, Insightful)

s.d. (33767) | more than 11 years ago | (#5395839)

How is this different from Parallel computing?

It isn't. Grid computing is the big buzzword of the day these days. I work with, and on, Globus, and this stuff just doesn't work yet. But beyond the fact that it isn't reliable software, what IBM is doing with Butterfly isn't really Grid computing. They're just saying that to get publicity.

Some of the original articles last year attributed features of the "grid" they're setting up to the Globus software, while anyone who has actually installed Globus knows that it can't do (things like accounting, failover services, etc).

This is the difference... (2, Informative)

Manic Miner (81246) | more than 11 years ago | (#5396003)

Shamelessly stolen from www.gridcomputing.com...

What is a Grid?

In June, I attended the Grid Computing Planet conference in San Jose, California and I was suprised to learn that people even call cluster as grid. I believe that it is a marketing hype. Here is my definition of the Grid, which is based on my presentation as part of the "Understanding the Grid" panel:

Grid is a type of parallel and distributed system that enables the sharing, selection, and aggregation of resources distributed across "multiple" administrative domains based on their (resources) availability, capability, performance, cost, and users' quality-of-service requirements.

If distributed resources happen to be managed by a single, global centralised scheduling system, then it is a cluster. In cluster, all nodes work cooperatively with common goal and objective as the resource allocation is performed by a centralised, global resource manager. In Grid, each node has its own resource manager and allocation policy. Some of these points are being highlighted in my panel presentation at P2P 2002 conference.

Note: "multiple" administrative domains can exist within a single organisation. For example, two clusters managed by their own resource managers within an university can form a grid.

*BSD is Dying (-1)

Trolling Thunder (639121) | more than 11 years ago | (#5395294)

It is official; Netcraft confirms: *BSD is dying

One more crippling bombshell hit the already beleaguered *BSD community when IDC confirmed that *BSD market share has dropped yet again, now down to less than a fraction of 1 percent of all servers. Coming on the heels of a recent Netcraft survey which plainly states that *BSD has lost more market share, this news serves to reinforce what we've known all along. *BSD is collapsing in complete disarray, as fittingly exemplified by failing dead last [samag.com] in the recent Sys Admin comprehensive networking test.

You don't need to be a Kreskin [amazingkreskin.com] to predict *BSD's future. The hand writing is on the wall: *BSD faces a bleak future. In fact there won't be any future at all for *BSD because *BSD is dying. Things are looking very bad for *BSD. As many of us are already aware, *BSD continues to lose market share. Red ink flows like a river of blood.

FreeBSD is the most endangered of them all, having lost 93% of its core developers. The sudden and unpleasant departures of long time FreeBSD developers Jordan Hubbard and Mike Smith only serve to underscore the point more clearly. There can no longer be any doubt: FreeBSD is dying.

Let's keep to the facts and look at the numbers.

OpenBSD leader Theo states that there are 7000 users of OpenBSD. How many users of NetBSD are there? Let's see. The number of OpenBSD versus NetBSD posts on Usenet is roughly in ratio of 5 to 1. Therefore there are about 7000/5 = 1400 NetBSD users. BSD/OS posts on Usenet are about half of the volume of NetBSD posts. Therefore there are about 700 users of BSD/OS. A recent article put FreeBSD at about 80 percent of the *BSD market. Therefore there are (7000+1400+700)*4 = 36400 FreeBSD users. This is consistent with the number of FreeBSD Usenet posts.

Due to the troubles of Walnut Creek, abysmal sales and so on, FreeBSD went out of business and was taken over by BSDI who sell another troubled OS. Now BSDI is also dead, its corpse turned over to yet another charnel house.

All major surveys show that *BSD has steadily declined in market share. *BSD is very sick and its long term survival prospects are very dim. If *BSD is to survive at all it will be among OS dilettante dabblers. *BSD continues to decay. Nothing short of a miracle could save it at this point in time. For all practical purposes, *BSD is dead.

Fact: *BSD is dying

We're gonna need grid computers.. (0, Funny)

Organic_Info (208739) | more than 11 years ago | (#5395299)

We're gonna need grid computering soon to keep up with the hardware requirements for these new games.

There's no way I can keep up with the current hardware/game arms race thats going on.

Re:We're gonna need grid computers.. (-1, Offtopic)

Nihilanth (470467) | more than 11 years ago | (#5395325)

Slightly off topic, but i'm pretty sure henry rollins said the quote in your sig before chuck P. wrote fight club.

Re:We're gonna need grid computers.. (1)

ManUMan (571203) | more than 11 years ago | (#5395727)

As a sysadmin, you really understand the need to have the fastest computers. There not paying you to sit there are they? Of course, I really do need a 128 MB 3d card to do my job. :)

'Mister Rogers' dies at age 74 (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#5395315)

Television's "Mister Rogers," the cultural icon and kindly neighbor to generations of American children, died Thursday at the age of 74.

Fred Rogers died at his home in Pittsburgh after a brief battle with stomach cancer, according to a spokeswoman for his production company. He is survived by his wife Joanne Rogers, their two sons and two grandsons, according to his Web site.

Marisa Lynch, who has worked for Family Communications Inc. for nearly 20 years, said she was in shock.

"We just learned about his illness in January," she said. "Luckily, he didn't suffer."

Staff members rushed into work around 2:20 a.m. after hearing that the venerable host of the long-running PBS show "Mister Rogers' Neighborhood" passed away, Lynch said.

"We're very loyal and dedicated," she said of the employees.

The Web site for Family Communications Inc., the non-profit company that produces the show, issued the following statement:

"We are very sorry to deliver the sad news that Fred Rogers died on February 27, 2003 after a brief battle with stomach cancer. We are grateful for the many people, young and old, who have cared about his work over the years and who continue to appreciate Mister Rogers' Neighborhood on PBS. We hope that you'll join us in celebrating his life by reflecting on his messages and taking them into your everyday lives."

According to the program's Web site, Fred McFeely Rogers was born in 1928 in Latrobe, Pennsylvania, 40 miles east of Pittsburgh.

Rogers began developing his ideas for children's programming in the 1950s. He is best known for "Mister Rogers' Neighborhood," which began in its early form in 1963 as a show on Canadian Broadcasting Corporation.

Rogers took the idea to the U.S. and in 1967, the first "Mister Rogers' Neighborhood" aired on Pittsburgh's WQED in 1967. A year later, PBS picked it up.

The last original "Mister Rogers' Neighborhood" aired in 2001, making it PBS's longest-running program ever.

The slow-paced show offered an alternate universe to most of today's quick-edit cartoon children's programming. But on the eve of his final show, Rogers told CNN's Jeff Greenfield he looks at it as more than entertainment; it's a chance to reach young people and give them a foundation for a good life.

"I believe that those of us who are the producers and purveyors of television -- or video games or newspapers or any mass media -- I believe that we are the servants of this nation," Rogers said.

That's why he got into television in the first place.

"I got into television because I hated it so," he said. "And I thought there was some way of using this fabulous instrument to be of nurture to those who would watch and listen."

Up until the end, the show was taped at WQED, and until the end it started with Rogers donning a cardigan sweater and comfortable shoes as he enters his home in the Neighborhood of Make-Believe.

Through the years, Rogers featured artists ranging from cellist Yo-Yo Ma to bodybuilder-actor Lou Ferrigno. He dealt with the death of pets and divorce, while teaching children to love themselves and others. His recurring characters included Mr. McFeely and Lady Elaine Fairchilde.

"Mister Rogers' Neighborhood" won loads of recognition, including four Emmys and a lifetime achievement award. A cardigan sweater belonging to Rogers hangs in the Smithsonian.

Those sweaters became Rogers' identifying characteristic. He credited his mom for the fashion statement that says, more than anything else, "Won't you be my neighbor?"

"My mother made a sweater a month for as many years as I knew her," Rogers said. "And every Christmas she would give this extended family of ours a sweater.

"She would say, 'What kind do you all want next year?' " said Rogers. "She said, 'I know what kind you want, Freddy. You want the one with the zipper up the front.' "

An ordained Presbyterian minister, Rogers' command of innocence won him thousands of young fans.

"I do think that young children can spot a phony a mile away," he says.

And it also made him the butt of parody by adults like comedian Eddie Murphy, who played his own version of Mister Rogers on "Saturday Night Live."

President Bush in 2002: "Fred Rogers has proven that television can soothe the soul and nurture the spirit and teach the very young."
Rogers knew for a fact that Murphy meant no harm with his humor. In fact, they met once.

"He just put his arms around me and said, 'The real Mister Rogers,' " he said.

On the last show, Rogers entered his home and donned his red zip-up sweater and traded his loafers for a pair of comfy blue sneakers.

The finale ended a weeklong tribute to art, with Rogers leafing through a stack of drawings kids made of the Neighborhood Trolley "to see how different people draw the same thing."

Rogers said he hoped kids who watch it will take it with them as they grow into adults.

"We all long to be lovable and capable of loving," he said. "And whatever we can do through the Neighborhood or anything else to reflect that and to encourage people to be in touch with that, then I think that's our ministry."

In 2002, President George W. Bush presented Rogers with the Presidential Medal of Freedom, the nation's highest civilian honor, recognizing his contribution to the well-being of children and a career in public television that demonstrated the importance of kindness, compassion and learning.

On January 1, 2003, in his last public appearance, Rogers served as a Grand Marshal of the Tournament of Roses Parade, and tossed the coin for the Rose Bowl Game.

Re:'Mister Rogers' dies at age 74 (-1, Offtopic)

punkass (70637) | more than 11 years ago | (#5395365)

Mod up...unlike BSD or Stephen King, this story is actually true:

http://www.cnn.com/2003/SHOWBIZ/TV/02/27/rogers. ob it/index.html

Was Mister Rogers Queer? (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#5395387)

Why is Mr. McFeeley the family spokesman?
Are we sure it wasn't AIDS?

Question (0, Offtopic)

HiQ (159108) | more than 11 years ago | (#5395331)

Does anyone know how such a grid could be heated up and poored down one's pants?

news for morons! (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#5395335)

I'd like to grid fuck michael in the ass!

crowded (4, Funny)

Rutje (606635) | more than 11 years ago | (#5395352)

support millions of players
That's gonna be crowded on the GranTurisma race tracks...

moron the 'vanishing' billyuns (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#5395361)

http://biz.yahoo.com/rb/030227/telecom_lucent_1.ht ml

lookout bullow. everybodIE knows bs only floats for a while, & when it sinks... whereas frauduleNT bookeeping/theft hangs around longer & longer. like an anvil, or a big red mark next to your moniker.

XBox Live r0x0rs! (-1, Flamebait)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#5395388)

XBox Live r0x0rs! I know that may not go over well with you open-source terrorists and your virulent anti-capitalist zealotry, but its true.. XBox is a far superior console to the PS2.

Seriously, do you guys realize how fucking gay you all sound? "ph33r linux!!! patents suck! RIAA sucks! M$ sucks!"

Fuck all of you losers.

Butterfly? .Net? hmmm... (3, Funny)

fbg111 (529550) | more than 11 years ago | (#5395392)

Sounds like MSN 8... Hope Sony's not going to get sued by MS for trademark infringement.

moron having butturdflies in your .asp (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#5395419)

you get what you pay&pay&pay.... for?

elmer fudd has more litigatory footing in this cesspool than ANY of those Godless deceptive greed/fear based stock markup felons. execrable is as close a synonym as is available, buy our reasearch.

Re:Butterfly? .Net? hmmm... (1)

NorthDude (560769) | more than 11 years ago | (#5395485)

Butterfly is not a Sony product, it's a company name.
They developed a grid computing architecture, backed by IBM.
Sony is a customer in this case.

Take a look at this press release:
IBM and Butterfly unveil Linux-based computing grid for gaming [linuxdevices.com]

Re:Butterfly? .Net? hmmm... (1)

fbg111 (529550) | more than 11 years ago | (#5395523)

Thanks for the link, but I know about it already. That was supposed to be funny, not interesting, but I guess I didn't phrase it well.

OT: Misunderstood comment (1)

NorthDude (560769) | more than 11 years ago | (#5396017)

Oups, sorry for the misinterpretation, happens to me all the time...

I really think that what is missing when "chatting" online is the "voice intonation".
Maybe we should create a nomenclature for writing
things and expressing feelings at the same time.
Kind of like building/extending on the smillee concept.

Now We Need Games! (4, Insightful)

6e7a (256012) | more than 11 years ago | (#5395412)

It seems to me that the more technology these companies throw at games, the less I feel the desire to play them. Don't get me wrong: I love excellent graphics and sound. I just think the playability suffers when a game developer spends so much effort on the technology. I'm glad we have such a scalable platform for online gaming. I just haven't seen games that are as compelling as they used to be to take advantage of the platform. Am I getting too old for video games?

Re:Now We Need Games! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#5395500)

> I just haven't seen games that are as compelling as they used to be to take advantage of the platform. Am I getting too old for video games?

Get a GameCube. Get Pikmin, Metroid Prime and Zelda : WindWaker. 'nuff said.

Nintendo is about games, not technology.

(I do have a Xbox too, but only for DOAXV and its... hum... let's say "flashy graphics" or "nice textures"...).

Re:Now We Need Games! (1)

6e7a (256012) | more than 11 years ago | (#5395655)

Get a GameCube. Get Pikmin, Metroid Prime and Zelda : WindWaker. 'nuff said.

Actually, I do have a GameCube. Pikmin is a perfect 10. Metroid, on the other hand, is excellent but missing something from the older series. There's not as much exploration and hidden stuff as there used to be. I noticed a lot of places that should have had hidden stuff but didn't. For example, do you remember the statue in the lava? I went back there with the X-ray beam expecting to find something. I was disappointed.

Nintendo is about games, not technology.

I agree. They are the best of the bunch IMHO.

Re:Now We Need Games! (2, Interesting)

Dan Ost (415913) | more than 11 years ago | (#5396013)

No, you're not getting too old. You're just
looking for something in a game that isn't a
high priority for the gaming industry.

Games today are designed to be impressive and
flashy enough to get you to buy them, playable
enough that while you're playing it the first
time through you tell all your friends, but not
replayable so that you're done with it by the
time the next title comes out.

I don't mind story lines in a game, but if finding
out the story line is the only reason to play the
game, then it's not worth the effort because
then the game play feels like work (as opposed
to play) and there's no replay value.

Re:Now We Need Games! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#5396190)

>Don't get me wrong: I love excellent graphics and sound.
>I just think the playability suffers when a game developer
>spends so much effort on the technology.

Have a look at the Gamecube. Great graphics *and* great Games. Zelda, yum... ;-)

Plus, my girlfriend really digs Mario Party.

Butterfly.net (1)

News for nerds (448130) | more than 11 years ago | (#5395417)

For those who are too lazy, here is
Butterfly.net [butterfly.net]
"Welcome to Butterfly.net! Our fully-distributed server technology is pioneering the use of open grid computing protocols in large-scale immersive game networks that support unlimited numbers of players and require the most demanding levels of service."

If it's different Butterfly, sorry for that, thanks for Karma.

I'm excited (4, Insightful)

arvindn (542080) | more than 11 years ago | (#5395426)

about the implications that this could have for other applications. As an example, consider IBM's Deep Blue chess playing program that defeated Kasparov in 1997. It used a massively parallel grid for evaluating positions using custom-built hardware costing millions. Now imagine if the same thing could be achieved over a grid on top of the internet. You have a world champion beating chessplayer right on your desktop!

Another application would be in natural language processors. They require huge databases and computing power to process them. A grid would be a perfect way to build such a system.

Mind you, these applications are equally commercially viable. You could charge say $1000 per game against the world champion chess program, or $100 for 30 minutes of conservation with the most intelligent bot ever, and so on.

Re:I'm excited (2, Informative)

jstott (212041) | more than 11 years ago | (#5395541)

about the implications that this could have for other applications. As an example, consider IBM's Deep Blue chess playing program that defeated Kasparov in 1997. It used a massively parallel grid for evaluating positions using custom-built hardware costing millions. Now imagine if the same thing could be achieved over a grid on top of the internet. You have a world champion beating chessplayer right on your desktop!

What's the bandwidth of your network? What's the latency of your network?

What's the bandwidth of Deep Blue's internal bus? What's the latency of Deep Blue's internal bus?

That's why Deep Blue cost millions.

-JS

Re:I'm excited (1)

PetiePooo (606423) | more than 11 years ago | (#5396069)

Not to mention the security aspect of it.. With Deep Blue, you didn't have to worry about something like this:

Imagine you're playing chess with this "grid player." Only one of the nodes on this grid is a hacked client that is sending bad (but still authentic) results.. Because of this, you advance a pawn instead of moving your knight, leading to your defeat.

Now, imagine this was more life-threatening than a simple game of chess. . . *shudder*

Re:I'm excited (1)

Alan Partridge (516639) | more than 11 years ago | (#5396394)

what, like GLOBAL THERMONUCLEAR WAR?

I wonder what you might call a system that would play a game like that?

how about W.O.P.R.?

just a thought

Re:I'm excited (1)

Eric S. Smith (162) | more than 11 years ago | (#5395543)

You could charge say [...] $100 for 30 minutes of conservation with the most intelligent bot ever, and so on.

Is the most intelligent bot ever, and so on, why you could charge say $100? Tell me more.

I suspect that you'd have better luck charging $10 to spectators to watch someone famous play against the world champion chess program.

Re:I'm excited (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#5395956)


I'm the hottest Brittney Spears like femme-bot ever, and so on, why you could pay say $100? Wanna play doctor?

An even better method?

Re:I'm excited (1)

fbg111 (529550) | more than 11 years ago | (#5395550)

You have a world champion beating chessplayer right on your desktop! Great. As if Chessmaster doesn't already kick my ass badly enough...

Re:I'm excited (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#5395567)

I don't need a world champion chess playing program to thoroughly beat me at chess. A simple hacked together program from 1992 or so can do the job very easily. Most people suck at chess.

Re:I'm excited (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#5395697)

Sure, but there are hundreds (thousands?) of grandmasters in the world, and most of them would love to play against a world-champion strength program.

Re:I'm excited (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#5395798)

conversation with the most intelligent bot? maybe you can pay money to ask 5 questions...oh wait...that's on AI.

"Viable"? (1)

ianscot (591483) | more than 11 years ago | (#5396079)

Mind you, these applications are equally commercially viable. You could charge say $1000 per game against the world champion chess program, or $100 for 30 minutes of conservation with the most intelligent bot ever, and so on.

Uh, that's "commercially viable" in a sense only dot-commers would appreciate. There may be a few people who'd pay a grand to play against a fantastic computer "player," but you'd have lots better luck selling games against Kasparov. Would you rather pay $100 to converse with the most intelligent Eliza ever, or the movie star of your choice? Stephen Hawking?

Most people can already lose handily to $10, bargain-bin Chessmaster. They're already fooled by the original Eliza when someone uses it on chat boards. I doubt there's a market for high-end versions of those experiences.

(Plus, when the most intelligent bot ever answers you with "42," how'll you take it?)

More than 1.1 billion pigs are killed each year. (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#5395481)

More than 1.1 billion pigs are killed worldwide each year. For no reason.

Pork is an unhealthy food source. Most people who eat pork also have access to other, non-meat foods.

Pigs are some of the most intelligent beings on our planet. Why do we kill them by the billions? Just to enjoy the transient pleasure of tasting their flesh?

I didn't know what a "grid" was (4, Informative)

Amsterdam Vallon (639622) | more than 11 years ago | (#5395486)

... so I looked up some simple details.

"Grid is a type of parallel and distributed system that enables the sharing, selection, and aggregation of resources distributed across "multiple" administrative domains based on their (resources) availability, capability, performance, cost, and users' quality-of-service requirements."

So, this project would essentially create one of the above distributed systems using simple, low-cost console gaming systems.

I remember reading awhile ago that Iraq wanted Playstations in order to grid them together and create supercomputers from 99 dollar American gaming devices.

Re:I didn't know what a "grid" was (2, Informative)

lovebyte (81275) | more than 11 years ago | (#5395586)

So, this project would essentially create one of the above distributed systems using simple, low-cost console gaming systems.
No. This project will create some clusters or grids so that game consoles can connect to them to play multi-user games. AFAIK, they do not intend to grid/cluster PS2's.

from 99 dollar American gaming devices.
When you are an american, everything looks American. Even Japonese game consoles.

Re:I didn't know what a "grid" was (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#5396056)

Especially ones that cost more than 99 dollars.

Butterfly.net and Name/Copyright trouble... (1)

Dareth (47614) | more than 11 years ago | (#5395513)

Hopefully the Lindows ordeal will make Microsoft less eager to challenge the use of "butterfly" in a domain name of a competitor. I do not know if Microsoft has a copyright on "butterfly" in regards to MSN, but they have spent a bit on advertising their "Friendly but Tough Butterfly" mascot for their internet service.

Re:Butterfly.net and Name/Copyright trouble... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#5396289)

I thought the MSN mascotte was a Moth?

This is cool stuff IMHO (3, Informative)

Chitlenz (184283) | more than 11 years ago | (#5395519)

Oracle has published a toolkit and several white papers about this technology. It is NOT just for games, and I've been watching this evolve along with their (Oracle's, not the globus project's)RAC technology as a cost efffective way to replace more our more expensive SUN hardware when we outgrow it. In particular, the idea of dispersing large ERP and data warehousing queries to perhaps several groups of inexpensive internal clusters (read: on our LAN) is very appealing, since you could in theory offset new hardware purchases by sharing time between systems. For those interested in perhaps theoretical distributed database applications (for the moment), Oracle has a site here:

http://otn.oracle.com/products/oracle9i/grid_com pu ting/content.html

semi-related topic: gamecube online? (0)

MORTAR_COMBAT! (589963) | more than 11 years ago | (#5395557)

OK, mod me off-topic, but I'm genuinely interested in any news about GameCube online games coming out this year, about which I've heard ZERO. Any takers?

OK, to stay on-topic... IBM made the processor for the GameCube, and IBM makes the hardware and software behind Butterfly.net. So why isn't this demo coming out with GameCube games instead of PS2 games?

Re:semi-related topic: gamecube online? (1)

brakk (93385) | more than 11 years ago | (#5395775)

Because the manager of the butterfly division at IBM plays racquet ball with one of the managers in the playstation division at sony. He just doesn't know anybody on the gamecube floor of his building.

Re:semi-related topic: gamecube online? (1)

fbg111 (529550) | more than 11 years ago | (#5395810)

IBM is making the PS3 CPU as well - the Cell. Derivatives of the Cell will also be used in other devices from both Sony and IBM. GC's PPC-based CPU has little to do with this joint venture b/t IBM & Sony.

Grid (-1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#5395606)

Robocode on the grid! Sounds like fun to me!

Sony's mysterious moves (4, Insightful)

thatguywhoiam (524290) | more than 11 years ago | (#5395690)

I've been following the development of Sony's console-based online efforts for a little while now, and I have to say they are definitely up to something big. Between this so-called Cell chip (or Grid or whatever), and now this interesting collusion with IBM (again) on their Butterfly.net... it raises some intriguing possibilities.

However no one I've spoken to has the slightest clue as to how they plan on using this Grid stuff. Does anyone know any details? All I see are people saying 'no bandwidth, latency', etc.... I still can't figure out what it's supposed to do. Which is maybe on purpose.

If you look at the chess pieces on the board, so to speak... MS with Xbox, MSN, flavours of XP with media/TV style abilities... then Sony, aligned with IBM for a new chip and a radical new network... not to mention the Cell sharing some tech with IBM's forthcoming Power derivatives for Apple...

Strange things are afoot at the Circle K...

Re:Sony's mysterious moves (Another puzzle piece?) (1)

Koatdus (8206) | more than 11 years ago | (#5396613)

Didn't I see a Sony big-wig showing off a set top box a few months ago that was running Linux? Seems to me he also showed that it could send video wirelessly to any screen on the stage.

Also there is the following from

http://www.forbes.com/2002/12/18/cx_ld_1218sony. ht ml
Sony (nyse: SNE - news - people ) and Matsushita, both of Japan, said the operating system will be based on open-source Linux and will be available in March. The software will be used in non-PC devices like TV set-top boxes, digital cameras and DVD players.

Increasingly, content that flows through these and other electronics will be networked via the Internet, and in the future they will all be able to communicate and share information. Part of what will be required is a common underlying software layer that runs on all electronic devices...


More clues can be found here:

http://net4tv.com/voice/story.cfm?storyid=3744

Sony showed its desire to go broadband. They say they weren't announcing any actual products and that these were just technology demonstrations.

First up was Real Networks demonstrating its broadband streaming technology. Sure the demonstration was at the unrealistic speed of a local network, but the demo guy assured us that it would look "almost as good" over a cable modem.

Next up for the Sony PlayStation2 was... wait for it... Linux. Weird, huh? But there it was running the latest version of Netscape Navigator for Linux on a VGA monitor. No it won't work well on your TV because the browser isn't designed to display on TV.

Even more of a shock was seeing America Online on the PS2. We were expecting the battle cry "You've Got Linux!" as it booted up with the favorite non-Microsoft operating system that nine out of ten geeks ask for by name. This dynamic duo were not, however, being displayed on a television, and it closely resembled the PC version of AOL being displayed on a VGA monitor connected to the PS2

What Sony DIDN'T show was a web browser for television. When asked if AOL intended to bring AOLTV to the PlayStation console, the demo guy just smiled and said simply that it was being discussed.

A third demo stand at the PS2 broadband booth showed a hi-definition 1080i movie that had been recorded onto the hard drive of the PS2....



Also look at my own prediction number two in the following post:

http://slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=48171&cid=49 02 698
2) In five years streaming video will be good enough that video over the internet will be the "TV" of choice for most of the /. crowd and will be making the same waves in the main stream press that Linux and open source is making now. (with the same dire predictions from the entrenched dinosaurs)


Finally, from the front page on /.
from the weakest-link dept.
securitas writes "Sony, IBM and Butterfly.net will announce and demonstrate a new grid computing network for PS2 online gaming at the Game Developers Conference next week.


Perhaps something like on-demand interactive games/video/internet/email delivered over broadband and stored/run in your Sony media/dvd set top box and then played/displayed on any TV, PC, or laptop/tablet screen in your house either through wires or wirelessly?

Many of these devices (at least the ones from Sony) will be running an version of embedded Linux.

The grid part allows content to be stored and streamed from close to where it is being requested , reducing bandwidth bottlenecks and allowing content providers to place thier material on the grid (for a fee?) without having to invest in thier own streaming servers and internet pipes.

Perhaps the grid will then track viewership of a product and kick a percent back to the developers and advertisers.

Expect a huge uproar with tails of piracy and armagaden to come (you know congress will be involved) once the networks and greedywood see independent "internet radio" type video programing start to gain market share.

OGSA for gamers (2, Insightful)

tom_conte (108067) | more than 11 years ago | (#5395777)

The OGSA stuff is not necessarily about distributed computing, although the emphasis is certainly placed on this aspect in their docs.

The basic service a Grid infrastructure can provide to gamers is "peer groups": you can discover groups of people willing to share a game online, and join their group, and chat and play with them, without having to log on to a central server.

You could then imaging sharing add-ons and various other files with your peer group, again without using any central server.

The next step would of course be sharing the actual CPU time of all the devices, for example to keep your characters "alive" even when your console is switched off. And then you'll receive an SMS whenever he gets attacked :-)

Imagine ... (0, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#5395792)

Imagine a beowulf cluster of ... uh ... nevermind.

g`day... (1, Insightful)

m1chael (636773) | more than 11 years ago | (#5395882)

grid computing is unfeasible over long distances. maybe they mean when you take your ps3 to your friends house and network them. otherwise this grid computing sounds like sony's little internet.

What is Grid Computing? (5, Informative)

pridkett (2666) | more than 11 years ago | (#5395902)

I've seen a ton of questions asking what Grid computing is. The most common one being how does it differ from parallel/distributed computing?

First off, I highly suggest reading The anatomy of the Grid [globus.org] by Ian Foster et. al. It provides a pretty good overview into this whole Grid thing.

But for the lazy, here's a little bit. The Grid is more than parallel computing. Typically with parallel/distributed computing the problem or resources are static or both. Grid allows both of these to change. In a nutshell, Grid computing means not having to worry about where the compute resources are. Just start a calculation and it gets done. Just like how you don't worry where your power comes from, you just plug in.

The core of the Grid is virtual organizations. Under a VO, I could get together with a few friends and pool our resources. We could set up a registry and some factories (I'm speaking OGSA here, but whatever) and create some certificates. Then, we could submit jobs to the Grid and not have to worry about the resources that they're running on.

GSI provides some really nifty security features (based on X.509 I believe). Basically you provide a mapping that allows other authorized users to run commands on your computer. When you're on the Grid you create a proxy for your certificate that is passed to the process that you run on this other computer. Then if that computer needs more resources, it can create another proxy certificate and delegate to another server.

Also, Grid computing is more than just computing. There is data storage and instrumentation sharing also. You might want to check out PPDG [ppdg.net] , GriPhyN [griphyn.org] and TeraGrid [teragrid.org] for examples of these systems.

If you're interested in playing with the GRID, you can go download Globus Toolkit 3.0 Alpha [globus.org] or the Java CoG Kit [globus.org] which is a pure Java implementation of Globus 2.x (it's much easier to install than the regular Globus 2.2.x).

Now this is what I call a MMORG environment. (1)

Ruger (237212) | more than 11 years ago | (#5396370)

Or the ultimate WAN party. Have the guys at G4 [g4media.com] planned the first event yet?

Ruger

C'mon Nintendo!!! (1)

gergi (220700) | more than 11 years ago | (#5396661)

Sort of off-topic but Nintendo is expected to announce games with online capabilities at E3... Nintendo could clean house with just one simple phrase:

- MarioKart Online -

And this IBM grid computing solution would be a great way to implement it.

'nuff said.
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