Peer Pressure Porn Filter 1051
Highwayman writes "Wired magazine presents one man's approach to stopping online pr0n 'Instead of relying on filters, the approach, which NetAccountability has been pitching primarily to religious groups, calls for Web users to share records of their online activity. Users pick a friend, spouse or other confidant who receives a regular report showing which sites they visit, highlighting potentially objectionable material.'"
Yes, this is so cool (Score:5, Funny)
Re:Yes, this is so cool (Score:3, Interesting)
Besides, I wouldn't have to send them my new "discoveries" (either pr0n or not). They would be able to find those themselves in the wad of stuff I visit.
One objection, though. Suppose I go visit one site that is so highly objectionnable there is even a virus in the site. Would that mean I would automatically infect people whom I trust because they too will go look at that site? Nice!
"Don't go visit Goatse! It's a virus! Yeah, I tell ya!"
Mike
Really? (Score:5, Funny)
Too easy...
Re:Yes, this is so cool (Score:5, Funny)
TV: "There are over 1,000,000 pr0n sites on the web..."
Me: "Wow. Look like we have some catching up to do."
Re:Yes, this is so cool (Score:5, Funny)
Re:Yes, this is so cool (Score:4, Insightful)
Re:Problem and solution (Score:5, Funny)
Re:Problem and solution (Score:5, Funny)
Re:Problem and solution (Score:5, Funny)
My thoughts exactly (Score:5, Funny)
Re:Yes, this is so cool (Score:5, Insightful)
If you are a legal adult then you don't have to comply.
If your wife wants you to install it, then the real question is why? Is there some agreement that you will never look at pr0n? If you agree, then you should respect your agreement. Or be clear that you no longer intend to keep this agreement to be pr0n free.
If your parents want you to install it, and you are a legal adult, then frankly, it is none of their business.
If you are not a legal adult, then what are the parent's motivations? To keep you pr0n free? Good luck. This may come as a shock to the parents, but once a guy is in his mid teens, he is naturally interested in sex. Are the parents trying to suppress this? Or out of touch with the fact of it? The realistic parents would probably feel about pr0n much like they would about masturbation. Do it in your own room please. Don't have your very own computer? Then do it when nobody else is home.
If the parents really think they are entitled to control how you think then there are deeper problems, and this request for monitored surfing is just a symptom of the problem, not the problem itself. (Assuming a near-adult, not a child.) In this case, you may just be stuck with unreasonable behavior motivated by good intentions until you are an adult.
As for females, I simply don't know. I'm not one. And I make a point to stay away from them. Still, some of the above thinking might still apply. It is possible that some females, for some reason might take an interest in sex. Should they be able to masturbate privately? (If they do so at all? I'm not female and can't speak with any experience.) If masturbation is okay, then should they be able to view pr0n privately? Once they are in the real world, they can do what they wish. They should not be so sheltered from real life that they can't cope.
On a slightly different subject, yes you can find things on the internet that are shocking, disturbing, etc. Of course, to a limited extend, this is true of TV as well. (Violence, etc. until you get de-sensitized to it) So should people be "protected" from seeing the web's content? Surely with the click of the mouse, even a teenager has the necessary power to dismiss and not see sick #$*@ that they don't want to see.
Re:Yes, this is so cool (Score:4, Funny)
Such is assumed, you're on Slashdot last I checked...
Re:Yes, this is so cool (Score:5, Funny)
If your parents want you to install it and you are a legal adult, stop freeloading off your parents and get your own damn apartment and isp.
If they pay for the internet access, and pay for house you are using it in, they can say how it is used, you slacker.
Mass guilt: Favorite of Stalin, A.H., Dubya (Score:4, Insightful)
It prioritizes mass harrassment over reason.It turns the conflict (much of it natural at a certain age) internally on a person with the added weight of others who are contemptible in choosing to subject others under such pressure because:
1. It is dishones; the "right to look your accuser in the face" is taken away. Anyone looking their accusers in the face will be shamed. Any honest (willing to accept convincing evidence) dialogue is silenced and utterly impossible.
2. It is authority by majority, no accountability of the accusers is taken.
3. It is pressure based on raging fears and mass hysteria. 'Nuff said.
Welcome to Salem, MA 1692.
yeah, but... (Score:5, Insightful)
Re:yeah, but... (Score:5, Funny)
exchange (Score:3, Funny)
Me: "Why don't you (^%^@($#)*#&*&#(&# my *#*#^&#$^$*&*$*$ you #*^@%#$*$(*#(&#."
Re:yeah, but... (Score:3, Interesting)
First off, there is the standard religious view that lust is bad. One of the best, if not only, ways of dealing with lust is to stop feeding it. The internet makes it very easy to feed lust; this makes it much easier to resist it.
Secondly, take a walk through google sometime and look for the various studies on porn and psychology. Pornography addictions tend to create feelings of unworthiness, self-hatred, "dirtiness," etc. There are many, many people who generally want to stop using pornography, but cannot. Accountability is key in these situations. The point of these programs is not to catch someone red-handed, but to help them stay accountable, and to improve themselves.
Also, consider the emotional and relationship issues. I've talked with seveal women who found out that their husbands were using, or even addicted to, pornography. To the person, they felt that they were not attractive enough to please their husbands, that they had done something wrong, that they couldn't trust their spouse... pornography has the potential to do great harm to an otherwise healthy marriage.
Finally, consider that a great deal of the women invloved in the porn industry have histories of sexual abuse, and the emotioanl problems that entails... do you really want to take advantage of that situation for a few moments of pleasure?
Re:yeah, but... (Score:5, Insightful)
No, it's the religion that does that. The pr0n just makes you feel horny.
"Finally, consider that a great deal of the women invloved in the porn industry have histories of sexual abuse, and the emotioanl problems that entails... do you really want to take advantage of that situation for a few moments of pleasure?"
And so do a lot of the women who work at McDonald's...doesn't mean you have to stop eating there. Can't it just be possible that some of them LIKE getting paid for having sex? Sounds like a nice job to me. I've known a few women involved in the sex industry at one time or another during their lives who had no history of abuse or what-have-you, never used drugs, and all in all had a good time and made an obscene amount of money. Paying their way through college, actually.
A Note. (Score:5, Interesting)
"When Goldstein found that *all* of the rapists in his study sample had been punished for looking at pornography, while a mere 7 per cent of his cohort sample had been, that set off alarm bells for anyone who really cared about the causes of sexual violence."
Religion is a much bigger threat to women than porn ever could be, on many, many levels.
--grendel drago
Re:A Note. (Score:5, Insightful)
Are you suggesting that those rapists must have been punished for religious reasons, since all atheists condone pornography?
Or are you suggesting that people who believe in certain moral guidelines are more likely to violate those guidelines than people who don't believe in them? Can someone explain how that makes sense?
Re:A Note. (Score:5, Insightful)
On a side note, the first time I remember masturbation being mentioned was at a bible study, where we were taught that God disapproved of the practice. The idea had never entered my head before then (I was probably aged about 9 or 10).
Re:yeah, but... (Score:5, Insightful)
I think you have been watching too much "Sex in the City". My wife and I regularly enjoy pornography *together* and I sincerly doubt that it has any potential to ruin our marriage.
Re:yeah, but... (Score:4, Insightful)
If you could, you'd be so turned on right now....
"And I'm not suggesting that it isn't stimulating or gratifying; simply that it violates the emotional contract of marriage."
But that's a crock and a half. You're essentially saying that his marriage is invalid becuase it doesn't agree with your idea of what marriage should be. I'd say that an open sexual relationship where both partners actually feel gratified is far more fundamental to the success of a relationship than the approval of strangers such as yourself, or myself for that matter. Neither you nor I have any right to judge as illlegitimate something that holds their relationship together. As a matter of fact, my opinion would be that a relationship based on repressed emotions and desires is inherently less stable and emotionally fulfilling than one that is based on open communication, including but not limited to communication about and fulfillment of sexual desires. So if I were to apply your "my way is the only way" mentality, his relationship is far more legitimate as a marriage than yours, because it's honest. How's that feel?
Re:yeah, but... (Score:5, Insightful)
No, that's religion and imposed societal morals that lead to those negative feelings. They want to stop because religion/society says it is bad, but the body enjoys it and really wants it.
Have you ever bought a product produced in a third-world country? Lots of things, right? How can you live with yourself? Don't you know about how workers are mistreated?
Re:yeah, but... (Score:5, Interesting)
that is about trust and communication, not porn.
if they feel they have done something wrong, perhaps the should talk top there husbands about it. I mean, I hate to sound crazy, but wouldn't it be worth a try?
Very few women will want to have sex as often as a man will, so looking at porn to fire one off might be better then either forcing there wife to plaese you, or be all grouchy because they need some relief.
not to say people can't get addicted to porn, they can. However looking at porn doesn't make you a bad person.
*porn being consentual sex between to adults.
Re:yeah, but... (Score:5, Insightful)
Well, that's one view. Another view is that human sexuality is nothing to be ashamed of. We all have different views on what things are shameful and what things are not, I happen to think that it is shamful to use guilt as a weapon, while only backing it up with a book of words that man put into God's mouth.
One of the best, if not only, ways of dealing with lust is to stop feeding it. The internet makes it very easy to feed lust; this makes it much easier to resist it.
Here you have made the leap from saying that some people think that lust is bad, to stating it as fact, by implying that lust is an addiction that is fed by the internet. I do not agree that lust is bad, nor do I agree that common availability of pron on the internet will typically lead to an unmanagable addiction.
Secondly, take a walk through google sometime and look for the various studies on porn and psychology. Pornography addictions tend to create feelings of unworthiness, self-hatred, "dirtiness," etc.
Feelings of unworthiness, self-hatred, "dirtiness," etc. are, in my view, caused by man attempting to control his fellow man by putting words into God's mouth that God did not say.
I've talked with seveal women who found out that their husbands were using, or even addicted to, pornography. To the person, they felt that they were not attractive enough to please their husbands, that they had done something wrong, that they couldn't trust their spouse... pornography has the potential to do great harm to an otherwise healthy marriage.
Is a marrage healthy if its foundation is based on an insecure body image and Church fostered shame for all things sexual? I agree that such feelings are valid, but disagree on the root cause.
Finally, consider that a great deal of the women invloved in the porn industry have histories of sexual abuse, and the emotioanl problems that entails... do you really want to take advantage of that situation for a few moments of pleasure?
All work is exploitation. I agree that the sex industry contains some of the most horrid working conditions there are, but no more so than any other industry that is as free from regulation. Nothing that better OSHA oversight, and some labor organizing can't fix.
Re:yeah, but... (Score:3, Insightful)
Actually, the best way to deal with "lust" is to find a healthy, nondestructive way to satiate it. Recent events in the Catholic Church show that trying to ignore lust and hoping it goes away only lead to problems later on.
Secondly, take a walk through google sometime and look for the various studies on porn and psychology. Pornography addictions tend to create feelings of unworthiness, self-hatred, "dirtiness," etc.
No, those feelings are caused by religions that rail against pornography.
Also, consider the emotional and relationship issues. I've talked with seveal women who found out that their husbands were using, or even addicted to, pornography. To the person, they felt that they were not attractive enough to please their husbands, that they had done something wrong, that they couldn't trust their spouse... pornography has the potential to do great harm to an otherwise healthy marriage.
That's not pornography, that's mistrust and a lack of communication in marriage. If a husband is spending all his time looking at porn without his wife knowing about it, that's a trust issue. There are many couples who use pornography together to enhance their intimacy and their sex lives. The reason it works is because the couple is open and honest with each other.
Finally, consider that a great deal of the women invloved in the porn industry have histories of sexual abuse, and the emotioanl problems that entails... do you really want to take advantage of that situation for a few moments of pleasure?
There are women with histories of sexual abuse in any industry. I have yet to see any non-anecdotal evidence that the problem is worse in the porn industry than in any other. Furthermore, even if there were a higher incidence of sexual abuse in the porn industry, that still wouldn't prove that porn per se is bad, only that the porn industry had some bad people in it.
Re:yeah, but... (Score:4, Informative)
The lust I find most destructive, the most perverse, and the most evil is the lust to prove to yourself and others that you are better than someone else.
But, this is my observation, I do not know about others.
Re:yeah, but... (Score:3, Insightful)
You bring up a lot of good points; but there're two in particular I'd like to address:
Secondly, take a walk through google sometime and look for the various studies on porn and psychology. Pornography addictions tend to create feelings of unworthiness, self-hatred, "dirtiness," etc. There are many, many people who generally want to stop using pornography, but cannot.
I think you'll find this is true of any addiction, whether it's alcohol, heroin, gambling, pornography, etc. The "dirtiness" comes from realizing one has no control over one's behavior and from feeling guilty about both the lack of control and the moral that "this is bad."
I've talked with seveal women who found out that their husbands were using, or even addicted to, pornography. To the person, they felt that they were not attractive enough to please their husbands, that they had done something wrong, that they couldn't trust their spouse...
I think there are more issues here than just the pornography itself, here. If a man would rather surf porn sites than have the real thing, then there's a real issue - probably one of addiction. And trust issues tend to arise based on a lack of communication, whether pornography is involved or not.
Comment removed (Score:5, Insightful)
Re:Big Difference (Score:5, Insightful)
I was just about to post this same thought, and I noticed you beat me to it. There is a huge difference between people who are trying to monitor and clean up their own online surfing habits (for whatever reasons) and what the headline and story description said.
This is just a way for people to keep them accountable in a way described in the Bible. Of course, knowing Slashdot, this will be made fun of to no end. People attempting to live their lives according to an external and somewhat objective standard is just so medieval.
Re:Big Difference (Score:3, Insightful)
Just because Christians *claim* it's objective doesn't mean it is.
Re:Big Difference (Score:5, Funny)
it's a joke, laugh. or don't.
Re:Big Difference (Score:5, Insightful)
What a standard
Re:Big Difference (Score:4, Interesting)
A moral system that glorifies a sociopathic, genocidal tyrant that's all too willing to use orbital bombardment on two bronze age cities, saving only the family that was willing to grovel to him sufficiently.... and that is also willing to drown an entire PLANET simply because the inhabitants of said planet weren't grovelling to him sufficiently... is beneath my contempt.
Grow UP humans!
Re:Big Difference (Score:5, Insightful)
in nearly all areas, the Bible is quite clear. Like it or not, the Bible provides an excellent moral standard.
Dear Dr. Laura:
Thank you for doing so much to educate people regarding God's Law. I have learned a great deal from your show, and I try to share that knowledge with as many people as I can. When people try to defend the homosexual lifestyle, for example, I simply remind them that Leviticus 18:22 clearly states it to be an abomination. End of debate.
I do need some advice from you, however, regarding some of the specific laws and how to follow them:
a) When I burn a bull on the altar as a sacrifice, I know it creates a pleasing odor for the Lord (Lev.1:9).The problem is my neighbors. They claim the odor is not pleasing to them. Should I smite them?
b) I would like to sell my daughter into slavery, as sanctioned in Exodus 21:7.In this day and age, what do you think would be a fair price for her?
c) I know that I am allowed no contact with a woman while she is in her period of menstrual uncleanness (Lev.15:19-24).The problem is, how do I tell? I have tried asking, but most women take offense.
d) Lev.25:44 states that I may indeed possess slaves, both male and female, provided they are purchased from neighboring nations. A friend of mine claims that this applies to Mexicans, but not Canadians. Can you clarify? Why can't I own Canadians?
e) I have a neighbor who insists on working on the Sabbath. Exodus 35:2 clearly states he should be put to death. Am I morally obligated to kill him myself?
f) A friend of mine feels that even though eating shellfish is an abomination (Lev.11:10), it is a lesser abomination than homosexuality. I don't agree. Can you settle this?
g) Lev.21:20 states that I may not approach the altar of God if I have a defect in my sight. I have to admit that I wear reading glasses. Does my vision have to be 20/20, or is there some wiggle room here?
h) Most of my male friends get their hair trimmed, including the hair around their temples, even though this is expressly forbidden by Lev. 19:27. How should they die?
i) I know from Lev.11:6-8 that touching the skin of a dead pig makes me unclean, but may I still play football if I wear gloves?
j) My uncle has a farm. He violates Lev.19:19 by planting two different crops in the same field, as does his wife by wearing garments made of two different kinds of thread cotton/polyester blend. He also tends to curse and blaspheme a lot. Is it really necessary that we go to all the trouble of getting the whole town together to stone them (Lev.24:10-16)? Couldn't we just burn them to death at a private family affair like we do with people who sleep with their in-laws? (Lev.20:14)
I know you have studied these things extensively, so I am confident you can help. Thank you again for reminding us that God's word is eternal and unchanging.
Re:Big Difference (Score:5, Insightful)
Now, to present my side of this argument: Jesus, in the Sermon on the Mount, was using a number of rhetorical devices which when taken in the context of the whole speech clearly indicate, not a rigid hierarchy of right and wrong, but that what is important for humans is that they simply trust in God. Sadly, some of those statements, when deprived of both context and the nuance of delivery, appear to be some new set of even stricter rules-- the very thing Jesus was arguing against!!
Re:Big Difference (Score:3, Interesting)
Re:Big Difference (Score:3, Insightful)
Re: Big Difference (Score:5, Insightful)
> You are looking at "human objectivity"... in nearly all areas, the Bible is quite clear.
Yeah, that's why there are 2,000 Christian sects in the USA, all condemning each other to Hell for misinterpreting the Bible.
Re:Big Difference (Score:5, Funny)
Hey dammit! I look at pr0n too!
Re:Big Difference (Score:5, Funny)
Oh the horror!
Re:Big Difference (Score:3, Interesting)
Re:Big Difference (Score:3, Insightful)
I'd think you'd want a convicted sex offender to get off to net porn. Maybe you'd get lucky and he'd be able to keep himself happy that way instead of doing what got him in trouble in the first place. Kinda like the patch...
That is, unless online kiddie porn was his original offense. Then it might be a good idea.
Re:Big Difference (Score:3, Insightful)
> to get men to stop looking at it via shame/peer
> preasure.
And here lies the problem with our society. I certainly might disagree with porn as something that encourages misogynistic views of women. However, trying to guilt-trip people into not viewing it is stupid. It's like trying to scare people into not mastrobating by telling them how it, "will make you blind." It's nice to see for once that someone isn't encouraging judicial level action, but he's still barking up the wrong tree.
It's like trying to stop drug usage in teenagers by saying, "do you know how dissapointed your parents would be in you?" Seriously...instead of trying to scare/bully/shame people into doing something, you have to alter things at a different level.
Instead, you need to alter the way in which women are portrayed in a lot of other areas of life...heck, MTV alone is just as bad as most porn (as it relates to images of women)...
Whoah. What a concept... (Score:5, Funny)
This is a great idea. (Score:5, Funny)
It's been done (Score:3, Informative)
Just for the record. Don't shoot me!
Re:This is a great idea. (Score:4, Funny)
good idea for other reasons (Score:5, Funny)
Addiction to websites is a serious matter. Online gambling is on the rise, pornography is problematic, and addiction to chat forums like Slashdot and ICQ NSync channels is a big problem for people. As an additional plus, this could be used to recognize and weed out subversive political and religious views, and stop people from looking at questionable material in those veins.
Re:good idea for other reasons (Score:5, Funny)
Reminds me of what happened to a friend of mine (Score:5, Interesting)
Dude, (Score:5, Funny)
Who would trust a guy named (Score:4, Funny)
It sounds like a bad Simpsons joke...
Re:Who would trust a guy named (Score:5, Funny)
Sophomore Chem Class... (Score:5, Funny)
Scribble on paper briefly...
Ignore for 20 minutes...
Teacher-"Trade quizes."
End result:
Jason-"Yeah, Chris got a 98"
Chris-"Jason got a 96"
Yeah, this should be effective *grin*
Re:Sophomore Chem Class... (Score:5, Funny)
Freshmeat again! (Score:5, Funny)
"But honey, it's all about software! Honest!"
"Software, hardcore, whatever, it's all dirty!"
Re:Freshmeat again! (Score:4, Funny)
I know the parent post is being sarcastic but I know similar consersations have happened many times in the past between many different couples, myself included.
I had a little explaining to do when my wife saw the following bookmark in my browser -
Welcome to the tight rack home?!?!
Needless to say I had a little explaining to do but things were quickly cleared up. BTW, this is a site for a really cool pool table accessory that they actually use in the professional ranks. Safe to view from work.
self-censorship! yayness. (Score:3, Insightful)
Seems like when we're online, sometimes self-awareness goes out the window. Nothing new to most of us, but I think we'd all be shocked at how much time we actively spend online, where we go, that sort of thing. Bring it on.
Comment removed (Score:3, Insightful)
Ug... (Score:3, Funny)
I've already explained to my wife that Freshmeat [freshmeat.net] isn't a pr0n site. Now I would have to explain that to someone else too? Great...
(As a side note: my wife's actual comment was "Freshmeat? A porn site? Cool! Let's see!")
Even better... (Score:3, Insightful)
Re:Even better... (Score:3, Insightful)
Crazy (Score:3, Interesting)
What is equally distrubing is that these are probably the same people that think the rest of us have the same problem and must be saved from ourselves. They lobby to get laws passed because "someone must watch over us" to protect us from ourselves.
Re:Crazy (Score:4, Insightful)
I don't see belonging to peer-accountibility group as the article mentions as calling for a defacto label of 'unhealthy'. In fact I'd call it the opposite. Someone who sees a behaviour they deem as self-negative and takes steps to correct/modify that behaviour without imposing their own standard on the rest of society is probably more healthy (IMHO) than many of the rest of us.
Typical Responses (Score:5, Insightful)
It is not invasion of privacy if you install it on purpose.
It is not religious judgement of others if people use tools that monitor their own activity.
This is an example of someone having an idea that ought to be welcome here. Rather than removing choices or limiting activity- people are given new choices to use if they so wish.
Those of you who think pornography cannot be destructive are unaware of the fact that it can ruin some peoples lives. If they want help with that- what is the harm?
Re:Typical Responses (Score:5, Insightful)
I don't know where you're getting this idea that people object to it because it's an invasion of privacy, or some sort of assault on freedom. I haven't seen any posts that claim that. Perhaps that's an easy argument you can assume everyone has, and then easily dismiss it. To me the problem is it seems kinda creepy that you'd need the threat of shame from your friends or family to not do something you consider morally abhorent. I'd suggest to people like this that they either truly believe what their religion says, or get a different religion. There's so many brands these days, I'm sure you can find one that suits you better.
Could limit Slashdot usage (Score:3, Funny)
This reminds me of a joke (Score:4, Funny)
Because if you bring one, he'll drink all your beer.
Cyberconfessions: (Score:3, Funny)
TheRevster31: Do not be disheartened, child, for Satan, also known as the Hun in your case, tempts us at all hours.
Hurry Up!!! (Score:5, Funny)
This is an excellent idea (Score:4, Interesting)
Is the Slashdot crowd anti-morality? (Score:5, Insightful)
I myself meet on a regular basis with other men who share a similar code-of-ethics - we hold each other accountable, voluntarily, as a check on our own behavior. In case no one's noticed, we human's don't do so well with the self control thing. The internet can consume much of our time, and I'm somewhat relieved to see others making an effort to cognatively assess and control the impact it has on their lives.
Feel free to lament the things which bind you (hey, I don't like MS either...), but some of you really need to figure out what - if anything - you stand for. I would expect this crowd to at least be capable of supporting an individual's right to overcome adversity they face.
By the way...accountability works. Yes, it's hard to admit to shameful things. And it's harder still to recognize (and admit to) repeating patterns of destructive behavior in one's life. There are a lot of worthwhile things that are hard.
Re:Is the Slashdot crowd anti-morality? (Score:5, Interesting)
Re:Is the Slashdot crowd anti-morality? (Score:5, Insightful)
To the tune of $3.95 a month.
The guy's trying to profit from other people's "weaknesses" and deserves all the contempt which is thrown at him.
Accountability is Opt-In (Score:5, Insightful)
It is interesting to see everyone getting so indignant about people that have identified someone they think is wrong in their lives (which you can rightfully argue about, but they have made a choice that this is something that they want to work to remove from their lives) and which they are trying to weed out. This is an opt-in choice. No one is forcing a person to sign-up for this service or to receive the reports. This is a free choice between consenting adults.
I don't know about the rest of you, but I know that I have behaviors that I would like to see changed. For some of us these are addictions (sex, porn, alcohol, drugs), for others it is a desire to improve ourselves (spend time with significant people in our lives, exercise, control our tempers better). As various 12 Step programs have shown, and as others knew before them, one of the best ways to do this is to build accountability into our lives.
All this is a high tech version of what happens at an AA meeting or in prayer groups in many churches. People are confessing their "sins" to one another and being encouraged to go out into the world and continue to pursue what they believe is right.
I don't know about the rest of you, but I know that I am not perfect. I am far from it. It would like to see change in my life for the better. I would like to be more regular in working out, focus more attention on my children, give my wife my time, be more attentive to friends, to not procrastinate, etc. I have folks that are my accountability partners. Do I use a system like this? No. But can I see the benefit to some? Yes. If it isn't meaningful or helpful to you, then pass on it. But if it works for the folks in question, then respect them as consenting adults doing something in the privacy of their relationships.
Calm down everyone. (Score:3, Funny)
Daisy: But why?
Robert K. Bowfinger: You slept with Jiff.
Daisy: So?
Robert K. Bowfinger: You know, I never thought about it that way.
Daisy: So I'll see you tonight?
Robert K. Bowfinger: What time?
One significant problem! (Score:3, Interesting)
My, what your friend or loved one will think of you...
Triage (Score:3, Interesting)
Just join a club to form a
- whitelist - stuff that's definitely OK to see
- blacklist - stuff that's definitely not OK to see
- graylist - stuff that's outside the known universe
to define your own internet experience. Sounds like a great idea to me.Think of the possibilities, too. The anti-matter folks and the matter folks can help each other with their respective lists.
Some of the pr0n viewing crowd can join the Moral Majority Virtual web but just set (white=black and black=white) and everyone wins.
What about illegal stuff (Score:3, Interesting)
Not that I know anyone into THAT stuff (except maybe a priest), but I might know some hardware tinkerers that may have ordered a mod chip at some point.
Dissappointing (Score:4, Insightful)
This could be a great opportunity for understanding and discussion. Istead, the slashdot community has latched on to the combined theme of religion and pornography and has used the opportunity to heap derision and ridicule on a group of people simply because they think differently.
It seems rather hypocritical to demand tolerance for your own personal views and then in turn refuse to tolerate views other than your own.
Now for an actual comment on the story: I would say this idea boils down to obtaining self-control by making all of your private actions public. I think such an approach can be viewed as only a means to an end, because as a final solution it is fundamentally flawed. This is because true self-control is the thing that is manifested when nobody else is looking. True self-control must ultimately come from within.
Totally contradictory (Score:5, Funny)
Isn't "taking matters into their own hands" the problem that they're trying to solve?
It's just a technology with an application. (Score:4, Interesting)
As a parent, I allow my children to use the computer. I do, however, place it in the house where there is a lot of traffic and I can keep an eye on what they are doing without interrupting them.
This is a Good Thing(TM). Accountability, in general, is a good thing.
You may not agree with the application of this technology, but why disparage it here? If you feel pornography is a good thing then you can enjoy it yourself.
I, however, feel that pornography has many bad consequences. I know this from personal experience. Who are you to disparage my personal experience, my morals, convictions, values and beliefs? Pornography, just like gambling, drinking, drugs, computer hardware, computer games, MMORPGs, etc can be addictive. These addictions can change you and your life significantly. If you like those changes, or it doesn't change you, or you don't notice the change, then good for you. But don't hate the technology or the people who use it for themselves.
-Adam
An idea is a precious and fragile thing. Don't hate ideas. Hate people.
Brilliant solution to a non-existent problem. (Score:4, Insightful)
It seems to me that you'll just have a big group of people who will all be watching each other not look at porn. The thing is, they wouldn't be looking at porn in the first place. Oh well, if this will occupy their time and keep them out of everyone else's business then perhaps in the end it will be a positive thing. The more that sexually repressed people and groups are distracted and preoccupied, the happier the rest of the world will be.
I think it is truly sad that anyone even CARES about porn. It is irrelevant to anyone who isn't a pervert, whether you're talking about the perverts who are obsessed with looking at it, or the ones who are obsessed with repressing their own sexual desires (if only they would do it right and stop breeding...). For the rest of us porn is an occasionally interesting distraction and nothing more. I've seen my share of porn and the vast majority of it is completely pointless. I get more out of the Sports Illustrated Swimsuit Issue and a Victoria's Secret catalog than I've ever gotten out of porn. Porn is for adolescent males and males who never grew past adolesence. Even so, that doesn't make it a social problem or something in need of remedy. Unless of course you mean that it needs to be better than it is.
This scheme does nothing but prove that technology gives people new ways to express their stupidity.
Lee
Re:Bollocks (Score:5, Interesting)
Just like with any 12 step program, you have to be willing to come to the meeting. For this app, you have to be willing to set up the accountability with a friend(s).
robi
Re:Bollocks (Score:5, Interesting)
The basic idea is "Install this when you are clear-headed and have moral convictions, and let it guide you in the moments of passion." Or something like that.
The programs that I have seen tie into or replace WINSOC, so there really isn't a convinient way to bork the system. Yeah, for those of us in the know, we could get around it, but the average guy can't, and even the average computer guy would have to put some serious effort into it.
The programs automatically generate and send a report on a regular basis, and this is transparent to the user. There is no "Click here to let your firemds know that you've been browsing younglove.com," it just quietly sends an email.
Actually, I think you will find a number of church officials requiering that those in their employ install such software. Couldn't hurt.
Re:Bollocks (Score:3, Interesting)
Interesting. I would assume you would install it when your mind was clouded by guilt and shame. This reminds me of two quotes from St. Augustine-
"Give me chastity and continence, but not yet." [everyone's favorite]
and
"Love and do what you will"
But I am a Jew so, what do I know?
Re:Religious Groups (Score:5, Insightful)
I'm beginning to find that half of my posts have the following question, but I'll ask it anyway:
Did you read the article?
This is about people who voluntarily are wishing to help clean up their own surfing because of a moral code they wish to live by. Why do you say they are "judging others"? They are judging themselves. Yes, they are getting help from others who have that same moral code, but that is exactly what the Bible tells these people to do. Don't turn this into something it's not.
Re:Religious Groups (Score:3, Insightful)
Re:Dumbest thing I've seen in a long time... (Score:5, Insightful)
And about the decision personal or religious not to look at porn... a lot of people's wives arent' too fond of their husbands looking at the stuff.
Re:Dumbest thing I've seen in a long time... (Score:4, Insightful)
Re:Dumbest thing I've seen in a long time... (Score:3, Insightful)
1) First, the whole "my religion doesn't allow me to look at porn" argument is just nuts. If you truly believe this, you won't need your big brother (or whomever) to watch you.
There are two schools involved. The ones who hold deep spiritual beliefs, and as you said, do not need any help living by their beliefs. These are admittedly rare. There are alos others who are merely using that line as an excuse and do actually, as others pointed out, lack the fundamental willpower to stop.
2) Self Control
Discipline is one of the most complex, and difficult, lessons any of us learn. It is very difficult to deny anyone, let alone one's self, something pleasurable. We are fighting eons of evolution (or out nature by Creation) in so doing. This is what makes the religious dictates a challenge to follow. Discipline requires us to fight an enemy always our equal, ourself.
3) Don't want to
Generally, those who do not want to, don't. Those who vocalize that they do not want to and yet continue are facing the challenge of #2, discipline of the mind over the instinct.
While I support other's right not to view things they find objectionable, I do not support anyone attempting to impose that on someone else. If you ask for help, it should be freely given, and for those who do have trouble in the self conflict, this is a good idea. However, no one should force that help on another.
The use of religion, or morality, to impose limitations from one person or group to another has caused (and may soon cause) more and bloodier wars than just about anything else.
Re:Dumbest thing I've seen in a long time... (Score:3, Insightful)
Finally, if you want to look at porn, look at porn. If your religion forbids it, well, that sucks...
And that's what the situation is here. It is VOLUNTARY and people are doing this so they are ACCOUNTABLE to their faith.
If you enjoy pr0n and aren't ashamed, then don't use this software! That's a hard one to figure out...
Dumbest thing ... but it works ... (Score:4, Interesting)
I found this out when I was teaching intermediate macroeconomics at Vanderbilt University. Being an expensive private university, the adminstration has made a real fetish out of teaching evaluations. Several times I noticed in the "anonymous" but handwritten evaluations that students who had poor attendance indicated that my lectures were disgorganized. (Yeah, I see the causality problem, but I really didn't think the lectures were disorganized, but they do build on each other.) So I decided to take attendance at every class, by passing around a sign up sheet. Attendance did not count towards the students' grades, but just the fact that I kept a record increased attendance. I asked a few students about this, and without prompting from me, they said that just knowing that it was written down somewhere that they hadn't been to class made them more likely to come.
& it did seem to improve my evaluations as well. I know that college students are supposed to be adults, and shouldn't need this kind of psychological trick, blah-blah-blah, but it worked, and in academia the moral high ground is occupied exclusively by tenured professors.
Interestingly enough, years later I read a great book on business management written a Buddhist monk who worked in the diamond industry (The Diamond Cutter by Geshe Michael Roach [diamondmtn.org]) that suggests simply keeping track of errors, with no actual or implied punishments, will reduce the number of errors dramatically. The book is very interesting --- I reccommend it highly.
Re:This makes one HUGE assumption... (Score:4, Insightful)
If you don't want to stop pornography addictions, don't use these types of services.
It isn't like someone is forcing you do do this.
robi
Re:It will *never* work (Score:4, Insightful)
Which is exactly why something like this will work, but a centralized "don't let them see this it's dirty" filtering system won't.
These programs email your suriong habits to a friend or pastor, someone who knows you and can agree on what you should and should not be looking for. For example, someone shopping for a valentine's gift for his wife would have a fairly good reason for visiting victoria's secret, but an unmarried man wouldn't.
These programs are about defining your own standards, and having someone help you hold to them.
My pastors actually say that something can be sinful for one person and not another. If a man has a problem with violence, he shouldn't be watching violent movies, but for a man without that problem, the Matrix is nothing but a fun movie. For a man with an alcohol addiction, a glass of wine is a bad idea, but for a man without that problem, it's simply something that goes well with the fish.
Re:It will *never* work (Score:3, Insightful)
I should have elaborated on this point as being one of the reasons why it won't work. In fact,I think the Bible has some verse about this, "blind leading the blind". Basically I get to pick my judge! Where would the conflict come in? If I was secretly addicted to porn, all I would need to do is pick some young unmarried man to be my peer reviewer. Odds are if he's staying celibate he's got to be dipping in the porn fountain, especially if he's good with computers.
Meanwhile Mrs. Chastity Witheredpuss will have one of the ladies from her sewing circle monitor her Internet habits...but since it's pretty much all just aol.com there's nothing scandalous to report.
Now, if your browsing habits were broadcast to a number of people, or people that you didn't choose, that would be something intimidating enough to perhaps prevent you from viewing porn. But as I said, nobody in their right mind would open this can of worms.
The only people I could see this helping are people who confess they are addicted to porn and are asking for peer review because they want help in avoiding temptation. But all it would probably do in this case is return them back to movies, magazines, and other non-trackable porn.
All in all, still a worthless idea.
- JoeShmoe
.
Re:What a stupid article (Score:5, Insightful)
It happens quite often really. I would pay for it. Now granted, most people that I know that would use such a service volentarily are christians who struggle with pr0n (such as myself).