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Bitstream/Gnome Release Vera Font Family

michael posted more than 11 years ago | from the grand-unified-font-solution-still-elusive dept.

GNOME 363

bluephone writes "Gnome and Bitstream have released the final version of the Vera font family. Go get it, install them, and enjoy! They work for Windows and Mac users too!" Our earlier story.

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word (2, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#5758592)

I'm using them right now, and they're simply beautiful. I suggest someone mirrors them before the site is slashdotted...

Re:word (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#5758700)

.detseuqer sA

A Mirror (2, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#5758738)

here [67.37.26.66]

Make Vera Open Source! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#5758593)

It would greatly benefit the Open Source developer community!

Re:Make Vera Open Source! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#5758772)

It is. You can modify them, as long as you change the name from Vera to something else. Read the license documentation.

YAY (1, Funny)

Sevn (12012) | more than 11 years ago | (#5758613)

New fonts are like christmas. It's like getting a
new version of your favorite mp3 player or P2P
client with new stuff added. Free stuff rules.

I'm obviously retarded (4, Insightful)

AssFace (118098) | more than 11 years ago | (#5758623)

I followed the links in the article and glanced over it and even searched on Bitstream's own site using their font finder...

I just want to see what the fonts look like without having to install/download the actual files.

I'm sure that it would be far too silly for them to have all of this talk and not have a link that shows what they look like - so I'm obviously retarded for not finding said link.

Anyone want to help a special needs kid and give me a link to what the font looks like?

Re:I'm obviously retarded (2, Informative)

Ponty (15710) | more than 11 years ago | (#5758663)

They're a Verdana clone. Which is too bad, bacause Verdana just isn't as good a font as it could be.

It's a great move and a nice thing, but it's not the panacea of fonts (like Helvetica is.)

Re:I'm obviously retarded (5, Funny)

AssFace (118098) | more than 11 years ago | (#5758696)

Yes, but neither can match the beauty of Wingdings.

I use that badboy for everything.

Re:I'm obviously retarded (5, Informative)

13Echo (209846) | more than 11 years ago | (#5758793)

It isn't a Verdana clone. There are a total of 10 fonts making for four sets. There are different types; serif, sans, and mono. Some look like a Times set. Some look like an Arial set. Some look similar to Verdana.

Re:I'm obviously retarded (5, Informative)

insin (579557) | more than 11 years ago | (#5758904)

I've made it my default font in Phoenix and it's a lot smoother than Verdana. I find it to be much easier on the eye and more pleasant to read.

Here's a comparison (Verdana above, Vera below):
Verdana and Vera [barrysworld.net]

Re:I'm obviously retarded (5, Informative)

ebingo (533762) | more than 11 years ago | (#5758711)

Yeah you're retarded :)
Here's a link [bitstream.com] .

heres some images of vera (4, Informative)

hfastedge (542013) | more than 11 years ago | (#5758625)

I did a little googlage:

http://www.bitstream.com/categories/products/fon ts /vera/

Re:heres some images of vera (5, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#5758639)

And clickable [bitstream.com] . You know, it's not _that_ hard, and it helps a lot - particularly with these long links that introduce spaces in plain text...

Re:heres some images of vera (1)

objekt (232270) | more than 11 years ago | (#5758869)

You must be using IE on a Mac, which introduces spaces in long URLs.

Re:heres some images of vera (1)

Fishstick (150821) | more than 11 years ago | (#5758887)

uh, no -- slash does that to stop page-widening trolls, IIRC

Sigh (-1, Redundant)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#5758627)

Muchos gracias, but is it too much to ask to include some nice screenshots when publishing new fonts? People may want to know if these fonts are worth installing, which, under Linux without fontconfig, is unfortunately a pain in the ass.

Windows port? (0, Interesting)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#5758628)

So will these fonts become available for Windows? I would dearly love to to have a good non-MS alternative for Verdana...

Re:Windows port? (4, Informative)

dorward (129628) | more than 11 years ago | (#5758643)

So will these fonts become available for Windows?

Now. Download, extract the tarball, drop the ttfs into your fonts directory.

Re:Windows port? (1)

FearUncertaintyDoubt (578295) | more than 11 years ago | (#5759029)

Hmm, I downloaded both the .tar and .gz files, but winzip just gives me an "invalid header after processing 0 entries" error.

should I use something else to extract them? If so, what?

Re:Windows port? (1)

Simon (S2) (600188) | more than 11 years ago | (#5758645)

"They work for Windows and Mac users too!"

did you read the summary?

Re:Windows port? (0, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#5758681)

What??! We're supposed to read the articles as well now!!?
*grins* I never do actually. I just click the links and read the articles. :-D

But yeah, oops! That was not one of my smarter comments!

Re:Windows port? (1)

PhoenixK7 (244984) | more than 11 years ago | (#5758713)

Works perfectly on my Mac OS X box, just dropped the files in my ~/Library/Fonts

Re:Windows port? (4, Informative)

13Echo (209846) | more than 11 years ago | (#5758746)

It should be noted that the Vera font sets use very minimal delta hinting, as the documentation states. They are designed with the future of Freetype in mind, and traditional OSX and Windows (Cleartype) may not render them as nicely as they would on a standard Unix/Linux machine. Don't even think about using them without antialiasing, because the glyphs wil render horibly. ;)

That said, in a few years, when everyone is on LCD displays and are using subpixel hinting, these fonts will look their absolute finest. Freetype seems to be gearing for the future, and may soon be the best looking antialiasing library on any platform.

Re:Windows port? (-1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#5758798)

ROTFLOL nice troll. Claiming that a font looks better under XFree86 is sooooooo funny!

.otf (1, Interesting)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#5758630)

why no opentype? wasnt that meant to be the next big thing?

Re:.otf (3, Informative)

Jugalator (259273) | more than 11 years ago | (#5758997)

why no opentype? wasnt that meant to be the next big thing?

Yes, I thought so as well...

TrueType info [microsoft.com] , OpenType info [microsoft.com] , TrueType vs OpenType FAQ [microsoft.com] .

The TrueType format was made by Apple. The OpenType format is an extension to TTF, adding support for PostScript font data and designed by Microsoft and Adobe with the following features:

- broader multi-platform support
- better support for international character sets
- better protection for font data
- smaller file sizes to make font distribution more efficient
- broader support for advanced typographic control

This sounds good, but remember MS was part of the design group and this is MS pages. I found this in the FAQ to look fishy in particular:

Q What does the OpenType initiative mean to Adobe's font business?

A The OpenType initiative represents a new opportunity for Adobe to expand its font business into the Windows market because Type 1 fonts will now work out of the box on all Windows systems. In addition, because Adobe will license TrueType technology, it will now be able to develop and market TrueType fonts.

So this could've been a "standard" created by Microsoft and not surprisingly supported by Adobe for the reasons in the FAQ entry I quote above. If that was the major reason for Adobe to support it, it looks more like MS did this "standard" on their own, hoping several others to license it and Adobe simply being an early adopter. I have no idea if this is as properly standardized as TrueType, or if it's more like an "Microsoft extension" which could explain why Bitstream/Gnome didn't want to support it.

Here's another FAQ entry:

Q What is being proposed to the World Wide Web Consortium?

A Adobe and Microsoft together will submit a proposal for Web page font embedding using OpenType to the W3C's working group on style sheets. --snip -- Ultimately we hope that this proposal, or a modified version of it, will be endorsed by the W3C as the standard way to use fonts on the Web.

The FAQ was never updated to say if W3C did indeed decide to endorse it as a standard for font embedding. If W3C instead decided to go for the much more common TTF format, thinking it should suffice, then that would be yet another reason to not use OpenType fonts.

Perhaps someone else has more insight into Bitstream's reasons not to use OpenType?

GNOME Armageddon (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#5758635)

Dear reader the GNOME armageddon has started,

First of all I want to clarify that this text was meant to be a source of information otherwise i wouldn't have spent so much time into writing it.

Belive me it took me a couple of days writing this text in a foreign language.

Even if you don't care at all for GNOME, you may find some interesting information within this text that you like to read. please try to understand my points even if it's hard sometimes, otherwise you wake up one day and feel the need to switch to a different operating system.

On the following lines i'm trying to give you a little insight of the GNOME [gnome.org] community. the things that are going on in the back, the information that could be worth talking and thinking about.

Many of us like the GNOME desktop and some of us were following it since the beginning. GNOME is a promising project because it's mostly written in C, easy to use, configurable and therefore fits perfectly into the philosophy of *NIX, only to name some of its advantages.

Unfortunately these advantages changed with the recently new released version of GNOME. The core development team somehow got the idea of targeting GNOME to a complete different direction of users, the so called corporate desktop user.

In other words they're targeting people that aren't familiar or experienced with desktop environments. usually business oriented people who are willing to pay money for getting GNOME on their computers.

Having this new target in mind, the core development team mostly under contract by companies like RedHat, [redhat.com] Ximian [ximian.com] and Sun [sun.com] decided to simplify the desktop as much as even possible by removing all its flexibility in favor of an easy clean simple interface to not confuse their new possible customers. So far the idea of a clean easy to use desktop is honourable.

Some of the new ideas, features and implementations such as gconf, [gnome.org] an evil Windows Registry-like system, new ordering of buttons and dialogs, the removal of 90%-95% of all visible preferences from the control center and applications, the new direction that GNOME leads and the attitude of the core development team made a lot of users really unhappy. These are only a couple of examples and the list can easily be expanded but for now this is enough. Now let me try to get deeper into these aspects.

You may imagine that users got really frustrated, [osnews.com] because their beloved GNOME desktop matured into something they didn't want. During the time, the frustration of a not less amount of people increased. more, [gnome.org] more [gnome.org] and more [gnome.org] emails arrived on the GNOME mailinglists where users tried to explain their concerns, frustrations and the leading target of GNOME.

But the core development team of GNOME don't give a damn about what their users are thinking or wanting and most of the time they come up with their standard purl. The reply they give is mostly the same -- users should either go and 'file a bug' at BugZilla [gnome.org] or the user mails are being turned so far that at the end they sound like being trolls or the user feedback is simply not wanted. whatever happens the answers aren't really satisfying for the user. even constructive feedback [gnome.org] isn't appreciated.

If you gonna think about this for a minute then things gonna harden that they are directing into the commercial area. The core development team actually don't care for the complaining home user -- it's more important for them to reach the customers with the cash. It seems that this has been told to them by the company leaders -- everything about GNOME has been decided already, a way back or direct communication isn't possible. Don't get trapped by sentences like 'we listen to our users'. They listen to you -- yes, to make funny silly jokes about you afterwards.

I thought that everything was build up on friendship, build on programming for fun, build on understanding each other. But the reality looks like it's all for the big money. The cash is what matters everything else is a lie and a dream. Time for people to wake up.

Not long ago they threw one of the most important long year core developer Martin Baulig [gnome.org] out of team -- a guy who worked really hard on getting GNOME into the right direction, a nice friendly person who put all his time into GNOME.

But narrow minded GNOME elites such as Havoc Pennington [pair.com] were responsible that he left the GNOME project -- the trouble and the pressure that was put on him was to much.

With the new GNOME desktop a lot of user interface changes happened such as button reordering [gnome.org] -- needless to say that this confuse people who are used to the 'right' button ordering for ages. Even our fellow Linux guru Alan Cox [gnome.org] wasn't thrilled about this idea, but the GNOME elites such as Havoc Pennington, Seth Nickell, Calum Benson and Dave Bordoley knew it better. Why following the road of any other desktop that exists ? Why not doing something that don't confuse their users and still stay usable ? Well it seems to be too easy. GNOME needs to be different than anything else so they changed the button order which was one of the reasons that users became unhappy. They said that there was a hard fight about this and the decision was made to change the buttons. But I belive they simply copied the behaviour of Mac OS because most of the GNOME developers use a ? [slashdot.org] McIntosh as either laptop or desktop. Sad that they forgot to keep in mind that users tend to mix applications and that this will lead into weird button searching and clicking.

But as if this wasn't enough the same people decided that the new GNOME Human Interface Guides [gnome.org] were the ultima non plus ultra in human interface guides. The announcement contained informations that the KDE usability people got initiated into it. Unfortunately the KDE people heard about it the first time [kde.org] when Seth Nickell went to the KDE mailing list which happened after the announcement. You can imagine that they got highly pissed off about this attitude. You can read more on this link. [kde.org] To summarize it, the KDE people clarified that GNOME should care for their own business.

The problem that came with the new interface guides was, that every little GNOME hacker started to become an user interface expert over night. A lot of GNOME programs that we like to use matured into a disaster over night. Hackers that never programmed correctly for their life started to blindly follow the hype of simplification. For an example look what happened to Galeon [sourceforge.net] (pay attention for the last paragraph). Even Philip Langdale a long year galeon hacker got highly indignant by the target that GNOME leads and wrote this email [sourceforge.net] to the Galeon mailinglist.

Here another reason why users became angry. The elite assumes, that the user knows nothing about their system. you find a couple of heavily insulting mails on their mailing lists containing sentences like the quoted ones.

  • "the user don't know what a window manager is",
  • "the user don't know what themes are",</ul>
  • "the user don't know what a homedir is",
  • "the user can't compile a kernel",
  • "the user don't want to customize their desktop",
  • "the user shouldn't see preferences which purpose they don't know"

You may imagine that a lot of people are being offended by such lines because it's exactly these GNOME users who are meant by these phrases. To read more such lines on the GNOME mailinglists, simply click on this link [gnome.org] and grep in their archives. Be said that most of these sentences are coming from Havoc Pennington.

Such evil practices shouldn't be tolerated by the users and need to be fighted. *NIX users aren't stupid people. Who actually gave Havoc Pennington the rights to decide what the user wants and what not? Various uaers [gnome.org] told him that people who use a *NIX like system are well aware of their capabilities dealing with such a complex system. There's a reason why people are switching from alternative operating systems. They want to learn, they want to use the full power of the system, they want to change everything they like.

To top all this, look at the future plans of Nautilus. [eazel.com] The current maintainers got the idea of changing the whole Nautilus concepts into an object oriented user interface design. You may be highly interested in reading the exact words of Alex Larsson's vision for Nautilus' future direction by clicking on this link. [gnome.org]

To summarize it, it's assumed that the user don't need to deal with his homedir or his whole filesystem because it may confuse him or because he don't understand it. The new concepts of Nautilus should be that the user deal with symbols in the Nautilus view. E.G. you get a cdrom symbol and by clicking on it you see the directory of your cdrom, you get a photo symbol and by clicking on it you get a list of all your pr0n pictures, you get a music symbol and by clicking on it you get a list of all your mp3's. You don't know where all these files are located because you don't deal with the bottom layer of your homedir or filesystem anymore as mentioned earlier.

The question is why are people that know nothing about their users, that know nothing about correct user interface design destroying GNOME ? The users don't deserve all this specially those that backed GNOME for all the years. Even sun threw a bunch of so called user interface experts together and have them work on GNOME. don't forget that sun are the creators of the Common Desktop Environment. [opengroup.org] We don't need another CDE clone [kde.org] named GNOME. Even Havoc Pennington author of the good user interfaces [pair.com] text isn't able to get his own written software following his rules.

Not long ago there was an report about the 'two captains of Nautilus' where the reporter (Uraeus a GNOME contributor himself) reported Alexander Larsson and David camp. You may imagine that such a report can't be taken serious because it's done by their own people. We here have a saying that sounds like this 'one crow doesn't hack the eye of another crow out'. Now you can click on this link [gnomedesktop.org] and read more. It may be interesting to read the replies from various users all over the globe of what they think about GNOME and Nautilus in general (please pay attention to the listed ip's there). Another nice and informative reading can be found by clicking on this link. [gnomedesktop.org]

The fileselector problem was a long discussed issue in the GNOME community. Finally they came to an solution for this and have decided to go for this ugly fileselector [linuxworld.com] instead going for this one [wanadoo.nl] which was developed by a free volunteer for a long time and in general looks and behaves better.

Most users have no problems with the idea of keeping things simple and clean. Removing some not needed preferences was indeed a good idea but it doesn't stop. People started to remove everything from their apps. You're forced to use dubious programs like GConf-editor which basically works like the Windows Registry editor, to tweak uncommented preferences. I don't think that this is an advantage. Even the possibility to tweak preferences with an editor was taken away with that ugly implementation of GConf. All your preferences are stored in a directory tree with an unknown amount of *.xml files. Even if you delete programs their keys are still remaining orphaned in these trees and finding them is like playing trivia. At the end it's worth a discussion if a system driven by a single home user needs such a registry like system. We didn't need such a system for over 30 years but the GNOME development team got the idea copying one of the most retarded systems from Windows to *NIX. Not to mention that the copy is more retarded than the original.

It's a shame to see how such a nice desktop got thrown into the trash by such people. But there is a lot more behind the scenes that i don't know about. Everything around GNOME is a big marketing strategy. Poor people are working the hell out of GNOME for nothing and companies such as those mentioned above are getting the big cash. for sure you could say - go and fork GNOME - but seriously how can you go and fork GNOME ? such a big project which needs a bunch of people to keep the code alive and compatible. Well you know it's all about open source the code is signed under the GNU/GPL or GNU/LGPL, you can't own it. Even the companies are aware of this. But if you can't own the code - go and hire their developers. You can direct them like puppets in any direction that you - as company - like. Exactly this is happening with GNOME.

well you could easily come up and tell me to simply not use GNOME and let them do whatever they like. Well, you are right with that but things are more complicated nowadays. GNOME is influencing a lot of third party projects such as XFree86 which recently added a lot of GNOME components into their CVS repository. Please know that with the next coming XFree86 version you get a lot of GNOME components without even knowing it. code like, gnome-xml, [xmlsoft.org] pkgconfig, [freedesktop.org] fontconfig, [fontconfig.org] xcursor and xft2 were mainly written by people who're heavily involved into GNOME development. Also the GIMP is maturing more and more into getting the look and feel of a native GNOME application. The CVS version of the GIMP has a lot of GNOME pixmaps inside and they are heavily working on integrate the GIMP into GNOME. If not today but the direction is sure and i fear the day this gonna happen.

It's ok that these things exist and it's ok to see XFree86 and the GIMP are beeing hacked on. But please think about the people that don't like or use GNOME. What about them ? Why force them to have GNOME components installed on their systems ? Why can't GNOME go the same way that KDE went e.g. doing their own stuff without infecting other projects like AIDS. Seeing more and more libraries and applications that were in no way related to GNOME jumping on the pkgconfig boat which's really not needed. Look what will happen to Solaris, the world famous operating system on *NIX used by big companies and long years experts. They really plan to replace cde with GNOME. I know that cde wasn't the best invention of desktops but it rarely crashed and it fits far better into the philosophy of XFree86 with their configuration system than GNOME. You know the good old way having your settings defined with .xdefaults and all nice default configurations are going into /etc/x11/app-defaults/ and so on. Understandable that the good old way may be blocking the future of applications for multiusersystems - but why must it have to be a Windows Registry like system that replaces future configuration ?

Well to come to an end I personally don't like many of this stuff. I can't stand the button reordering, I don't like the GConf system and even more I don't like the commercial outsourcing of GNOME and the bad influence that GNOME has on other applications. The bad attitude of some GNOME developers is another story since we are all different reacting humans. Luckily there are people sharing some of my thoughts otherwise I wouldn't be able to proof my text with so many links. Even amongst the GNOME developers there are silent voices of people that hate many of these decisions and silently use something else.

Right now if you checkout the GNOME CVS repository every day you find out that the whole GNOME development seemed to came to an halt. The contributions to their CVS are poor. While projects such as KDE are reaching easily 10-20K commits per month - GNOME is getting around 1-2K per month on it's best times.

It really looks like the situation of GNOME is unclear so it would be better to have it not influence so much other programs or at the end we deal with an disaster.

Now I hope this text was informative for you. I hope that you start to think about the situation and the global direction. The situation of GNOME is unclear, their target is groggy too since I can't belive that the users that they are targeting ever heard of *NIX or Linux. They plan to get out of the 0.05% desktop niche but this will for sure not happen if they continue their current direction and their bad ugly attitude.

Re:GNOME Armageddon (1)

unixbob (523657) | more than 11 years ago | (#5758703)

What you say is interesting, but the fact that you post anonymously makes the reader think you have an anonymous agenda. If you give your name we can read whether you have a particular axe to grind with the GNOME project, or whether you have an objective argument. But you're still off-topic anyway

Re:GNOME Armageddon (1)

noda132 (531521) | more than 11 years ago | (#5758756)

So shut up and use KDE? Why are you trying to convince other people not to use their preferred desktop environment?

Re:GNOME Armageddon (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#5758996)

The original poster may be off-topic but that doesn't mean he's wrong. Gnome is my prefered enviroment, Gnome2 I consider to be a complete waste of hard drive space and a major step backwards. Computing made simple shouldn't imply the user is simple. And people who chose gnome over kde have every right at feeling frustrated when the feedback they give to the 'community' is ignored.

Re:GNOME Armageddon (1)

grendelkhan (168481) | more than 11 years ago | (#5758812)

Why are you posting this rant, yet again? If you are that unhappy with the current direction of Gnome, fork it or don't use it.

Fonts contributed! -- Let the complaining begin! (-1, Troll)

Anonym0us Cow Herd (231084) | more than 11 years ago | (#5758648)

Free fonts contributed to the open source community.

Let the complaining begin! (Like last time news of these free fonts was on slashdot.)

Work on Windows? (1, Interesting)

DrXym (126579) | more than 11 years ago | (#5758652)

They don't for me. I double click on any .ttf file and XP complains "The requested file was not a valid font file.".

Re:Work on Windows? (1)

bencc99 (100555) | more than 11 years ago | (#5758662)

They work fine under XP here.

Re:Work on Windows? (2, Informative)

DrXym (126579) | more than 11 years ago | (#5758673)

LOL, I solved my own problem. Cygwin's "tar jxf" command helpfully extracted the files without giving me permission to read them afterwards :)

Re:Work on Windows? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#5758838)

Open the fonts control panel and select install new font from the file menu. Then browse to the directory that the fonts are in and select them all.

You can find a more detailed instruction by feeding the xp help and support tool "installing fonts"

This is good news... (4, Insightful)

gillbates (106458) | more than 11 years ago | (#5758654)

Considering that one of Linux/Gnome/KDE's weakest points has been its poor support for fonts.

Quite frankly, I'm glad to see this. The early fonts that came with X were simply horrible when compared to what MS was offering at the time. With better looking fonts, we are one step closer to widespread adoption of Linux on the desktop.

Re:This is good news... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#5758658)

They are all small steps until I can buy any game at EB and play it on Linux, AND I am unable to pirate XP anymore. :P

Re:This is good news... (2, Funny)

OpCode42 (253084) | more than 11 years ago | (#5758695)

They are all small steps until I can buy any game at EB and play it on Linux

Yeah, that does suck. I mean, I bought Vice City last week, and they said I actually had to own a playstation2 to play it!

Re:This is good news... (2, Insightful)

zmotula (663798) | more than 11 years ago | (#5758902)

Still the sad thing about fonts in X is the poor rendering (even with antialiasing turned on) compared to Windows or MacOS X. Without antialias, cursive fonts are nearly unusable (at least on all the machines I work with). With antialias, the characters have got uneven brightness and fuzzy edges; horizontal lines are too thick (antialiased Mozilla being a perfect example)... Paint to look at.

Redhat 9 (2, Interesting)

kajoob (62237) | more than 11 years ago | (#5759026)

I just installed RH9 and the fonts are friggen amazing. Even in Mozilla. I've had XFT running on previous versions of RH and 'borrowed' the TTF's from windows but they still don't look this good. Does anybody know what RH did to make the fonts look this good?

Here's slashdot in Bitstream Vera Serif (4, Informative)

Maxlor (315315) | more than 11 years ago | (#5758659)

click here [maxlor.com]

404 (0)

ChristTrekker (91442) | more than 11 years ago | (#5758668)

Sorry, dude.

Re:404 (0)

Maxlor (315315) | more than 11 years ago | (#5758678)

Nah click again.

Re:404 (-1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#5758706)

four oh four

Re:Here's slashdot in Bitstream Vera Serif (1)

13Echo (209846) | more than 11 years ago | (#5758721)

Mind telling me what your Mozilla font settings are?

Re:Here's slashdot in Bitstream Vera Serif (2, Informative)

Maxlor (315315) | more than 11 years ago | (#5758750)

It's opera 6.12 on FreeBSD 5.0, XFree 4.3 with fontconfig 2.1.92 and Xft 2.1

I use Bitstream Vera Serif 10pt as standard serif font, and the minimum font size is set to 8 points.

Re:Here's slashdot in Bitstream Vera Serif (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#5758729)

Works perfecto here.

BTW, great idea and great community spirit. I congratulate you.

Take care.

Warning: Goatse link! (-1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#5758813)

could the moderators at least check the links before moderating? I guess they put as much effort in as the janitors.

Re:Here's slashdot in Bitstream Vera Serif (1, Interesting)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#5758963)

Ugh! That's horrible. Here's vera looking 10 times better [coob.org] . Gotta love Xft2 and Phoenix (or Firebird, or whatnot).

Thats with the standard font set to sans-serif, witht he sans-serif set to Vera Sans. Funnily enough, monospace and serif are set to their appropriate Vera's.

Nice font, think I'll stick to it over arial. If you think I've got it set a little small it's because it's on a Dell laptop's lcd screen, and suits my positioning/eyesight just fine. The Phoenix theme is Breeze, GTK theme is a modified flaaat.

haha (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#5758667)

Stupid america stooges said anti-war protestors where out of touch with the Iraqi people and yet today there are huge protests in Iraq against the America neocolonialism. Put that in your propoganda pipe and smoke it.

What hope? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#5758672)

Web pages won't look right in them... I mean, just search google for The Best [google.com]

Thanks, Jim! (0, Flamebait)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#5758679)

Thanks so much for this clever bit of Bitstream PR. It's good to see you of all people striving to raise X11 to the level of technique and aesthetic NeWS achieved in the late 1980's.

what, no previews? (-1, Redundant)

Mondain98 (562481) | more than 11 years ago | (#5758685)

Would it have been so hard to create a few images showing what the fonts actually look like?

I never understood how open source/*nix misses the usability bandwagon again and again, even with something as simple as releasing a new font. Please tell me I'm wrong and somewhere, clearly marked, is a picture of this font.

copyright, etc (5, Interesting)

ergonal (609484) | more than 11 years ago | (#5758691)

To me, a lot of fonts are pretty similar to each other (in the various "genres" of fonts, anyway).. Does anyone know HOW much they have to differ to avoid copyright issues, etc? It would appear to be a very fine line.

Re:copyright, etc (1)

n.wegner (613340) | more than 11 years ago | (#5758728)

IANAL, AFAIK they have to have a different name/trademark, and they can't copy the font files. Having the same look is allowed.

Re:copyright, etc (2, Informative)

protoshoggoth (588994) | more than 11 years ago | (#5758795)

In the US, it is not possible to copyright a 'font' itself--that is to say, the actual images of the letters. What is copyrighted and licensed is the software to display/hint the font. So all the usual tests for 'is this the same software' apply.

As for outside of the US, where the fonts themselves are copyrightable...well, I'm sure there are legal standards, and I'd imagine they're rather arbitrary. How could they not be? You're right, so many fonts look so similar. Quick--is it Univers or Albertus Medium??? I'm sure some people can tell, but I'd be hard-pressed to do so.

Re:copyright, etc (4, Informative)

sh4de (93527) | more than 11 years ago | (#5758831)

Copyright laws are strange in this respect. You can't copyright the look of your font, just its name. More information here [mcgill.ca] .

Type foundries have (ab)used this oversight for decades, producing clones of other foundries' popular fonts, with different names.

That's why there's Swiss [myfonts.com] from Bitstream and Arial [myfonts.com] from Monotype, both Linotype Helvetica [myfonts.com] clones, Book Antiqua [myfonts.com] from Monotype, a Linotype Palatino [myfonts.com] clone, and hundreds of others.

Re:copyright, etc (1)

zsau (266209) | more than 11 years ago | (#5758836)

At least in America, the fonts themselves are not copyright. It is the font file. I understand that if you wanted, you could print out your favorite font and use that to redesign the font and it'd all be perfectly legal, even if the outcome was identical. But you can't copy the font file without it being allowed. But IANAL. And I'm not American, either.

Re:copyright, etc (2, Informative)

mdemeny (35326) | more than 11 years ago | (#5758884)

I recall that in old versions of CorelDraw, they had thousands of fonts which were nearly indentical to known fonts, exploiting the fact that you can't copyright letterforms.

Ottawa was Optima, Erie was Eras, Switzerland was Helvetica, etc...

Here's a handy-dandy lookup guide. [nwalsh.com]

Re:copyright, etc (1)

raisin (30710) | more than 11 years ago | (#5758981)

they don't have to differ at all. at least in the u.s., it's not possible to copyright the design of a font. as such, one can take the drawing of a typeface, reproduce the curves for it, then make and sell that font. this is where the libraries of "1000s OF FREE FONTS!" come from. (stealing the name of the font will likely run afoul of trademark or copyright laws, but not the design..)

this is at least part of the reason that fonts are *programs*, meaning that their instruction sets (moveto, lineto, and all the complex hinting commands) cannot simply be copied, as that would be analogous to piracy of a software program.

open/free font editors (4, Interesting)

wfmcwalter (124904) | more than 11 years ago | (#5758701)

On a related note, can anyone recommend a decent open source / free software graphical font design tool ? I looked into this a few years ago and things deemed to be in a crufty state of disarray. What do folks use now?

Re:open/free font editors (5, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#5758748)

Try pfaedit. The user interface is rather spartan but it is very powerful.

Emacs + PostScript (0)

Yellow Brick Choad (464067) | more than 11 years ago | (#5758770)

Write your own PostScript in Emacs.

No, it doesn't get any better than that in the Open Source world.

Screenshot. (4, Informative)

13Echo (209846) | more than 11 years ago | (#5758702)

Here's a screenshot of it on my machine, with OpenOffice.org.

Vera. [freeshell.org]

It's a nice font set to start from. I hope that the community can use it to create a unicode version.

Re:Screenshot. (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#5758878)

Oops. I don't think Charter belongs in there. ;)

Nice (0, Flamebait)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#5758712)

Now if only linus would add support for ttf fonts on the linux console instead of the crappy selection of console fonts we have right now.

Re:Nice (0, Troll)

ajuin (617076) | more than 11 years ago | (#5758834)

If I had any moderator points, I'd mod you +1 Funny. Unless you're serious, in which case I should mod you down and add 'Clueless' as an adjective :)

Re:Nice (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#5758908)

hahaha this was modded as Interesting?? Slashdot's audience has really really gone to crap. Holy christ.

Screenshot of slashdot using vera sans (4, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#5758734)

Click here [pj64cheats.net]

Re:Screenshot of slashdot using vera sans (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#5758916)

Why the hell was this modded down as troll?

So basically... (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#5758735)

With the addition of ONE face with THREE fonts... GNOME is somehow "with it" now? I'm not trolling here or anything, I'm just wondering why the creation of a typeface is, uhm, news worthy. No, I'm not trolling.

Postscript? (5, Interesting)

truenoir (604083) | more than 11 years ago | (#5758751)

Any chance for Postscript versions of the font too in case someone wants to use it for serious printing?

Initial thoughts on Vera (4, Funny)

Jon Abbott (723) | more than 11 years ago | (#5758752)

Vera sans seems very similar to Verdana, while Vera serif seems very similar to Century. I never previously considered Verdana and Century to be similar (disregarding serifs of course), but Vera draws this strange similarity together quite easily.

OK, I admit it, I'm a font geek... I can readily identify what fonts that restaurants use on their menus, and so on. If I ever became a superhero, that would probably be one of my superpowers. :^)

Re:Initial thoughts on Vera (1)

Gropo (445879) | more than 11 years ago | (#5758863)

Nothing to be ashamed of, it's a fun hobby.

On a side note, have you noticed the mass proliferation of Gill Sans over the last 6-12 months? While it's always been a popular font, I have a feeling that its inclusion with both OS X and XP has caused its frequency of usage to skyrocket...

Re:Initial thoughts on Vera (1)

shdragon (1797) | more than 11 years ago | (#5758978)

OMG! your sig rules! I love logan's run! I bought the dvd and I'm sampling the behind the scenes. My friend & I are going to redo the soundtrack and make it a drum&bass soundtrack.

Has anyone noticed? (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#5758755)

Only dumbass illiterate liberal arts people want pretty fonts on everything they do.

The rest of us just want to read.

Vera! (2, Funny)

swordboy (472941) | more than 11 years ago | (#5758761)

Vera!

What has become of you?

Does anybody else in here feel the way I do?

work with windows and macintosh.... (1, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#5758777)

but not with XFree86.


Windows: Drop into the winnt\system32\fonts folder (I wouldn't be surprised if right-clicking a font gave you the option of doing that).

Macintosh: Drop into the System:Fonts folder. Newer Finders might magic-route it if you drop it onto the system folder

BeOS: Copy to the home/settings/fonts/ folder, start up the fonts preferences, and click rescan button

XFree86.... search for half an hour to find where fonts are stored. Copy it there. Restart X. wonder why it doesn't show. search man pages for half an hour. Search HOWTOS for an hour. Realize your copy of XFree86 doesn't support tretype fonts. Reboot into windows.

Re:work with windows and macintosh.... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#5758791)

Or.

Upgrade to XFree86 4.3.
mv *.ttf ~/.fonts

Re:work with windows and macintosh.... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#5758799)

XFree86:
1) copy into ~/.fonts/
2) done

Or just follow the instructions provided. Put local.conf in /etc/fonts, and drop the fonts into /usr/X11R6/lib/X11/fonts/truetype for a system wide installation. done.

Re:work with windows and macintosh.... (4, Informative)

ACK!! (10229) | more than 11 years ago | (#5758803)

XFree86 --

Download fonts.

Drop them onto desktop.

Use KDE's font installer to add them to your list of fonts.

Alternately for the Redhat8 or 9 set simply copy them into their .fonts dir.

Silly people.

Re:work with windows and macintosh.... (2, Informative)

13Echo (209846) | more than 11 years ago | (#5758835)

On most Gnome machines, you can just copy them to /usr/share/fonts.

A Review. (2, Informative)

Frank Grimes (211860) | more than 11 years ago | (#5758797)

I just installed these fonts with

tar -xjvf ttf-bitstream-vera-1.10.tar.bz2
cp ttf-bitstream-vera-1.10/*.ttf ~/.fonts/

They are good looking fonts that render well under X11 with xft. On the other hand, I don't like them that much; as a matter of personal preference, I find them too short and fat.

Re:A Review. (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#5759034)

too short and fat, huh.... I guess that's bad for fonts, but good for your mom?

GNOME Armageddon (posted by someone with balls) (-1, Offtopic)

Jerk City Troll (661616) | more than 11 years ago | (#5758800)

Dear reader the GNOME armageddon has started,

First of all I want to clarify that this text was meant to be a source of information otherwise i wouldn't have spent so much time into writing it.

Belive me it took me a couple of days writing this text in a foreign language.

Even if you don't care at all for GNOME, you may find some interesting information within this text that you like to read. please try to understand my points even if it's hard sometimes, otherwise you wake up one day and feel the need to switch to a different operating system.

On the following lines i'm trying to give you a little insight of the GNOME [gnome.org] [gnome.org] community. the things that are going on in the back, the information that could be worth talking and thinking about.

Many of us like the GNOME desktop and some of us were following it since the beginning. GNOME is a promising project because it's mostly written in C, easy to use, configurable and therefore fits perfectly into the philosophy of *NIX, only to name some of its advantages.

Unfortunately these advantages changed with the recently new released version of GNOME. The core development team somehow got the idea of targeting GNOME to a complete different direction of users, the so called corporate desktop user.

In other words they're targeting people that aren't familiar or experienced with desktop environments. usually business oriented people who are willing to pay money for getting GNOME on their computers.

Having this new target in mind, the core development team mostly under contract by companies like RedHat, [redhat.com] [redhat.com] Ximian [ximian.com] [ximian.com] and Sun [sun.com] [sun.com] decided to simplify the desktop as much as even possible by removing all its flexibility in favor of an easy clean simple interface to not confuse their new possible customers. So far the idea of a clean easy to use desktop is honourable.

Some of the new ideas, features and implementations such as gconf, [gnome.org] [gnome.org] an evil Windows Registry-like system, new ordering of buttons and dialogs, the removal of 90%-95% of all visible preferences from the control center and applications, the new direction that GNOME leads and the attitude of the core development team made a lot of users really unhappy. These are only a couple of examples and the list can easily be expanded but for now this is enough. Now let me try to get deeper into these aspects.

You may imagine that users got really frustrated, [osnews.com] [osnews.com] because their beloved GNOME desktop matured into something they didn't want. During the time, the frustration of a not less amount of people increased. more, [gnome.org] [gnome.org] more [gnome.org] [gnome.org] and more [gnome.org] [gnome.org] emails arrived on the GNOME mailinglists where users tried to explain their concerns, frustrations and the leading target of GNOME.

But the core development team of GNOME don't give a damn about what their users are thinking or wanting and most of the time they come up with their standard purl. The reply they give is mostly the same -- users should either go and 'file a bug' at BugZilla [gnome.org] [gnome.org] or the user mails are being turned so far that at the end they sound like being trolls or the user feedback is simply not wanted. whatever happens the answers aren't really satisfying for the user. even constructive feedback [gnome.org] [gnome.org] isn't appreciated.

If you gonna think about this for a minute then things gonna harden that they are directing into the commercial area. The core development team actually don't care for the complaining home user -- it's more important for them to reach the customers with the cash. It seems that this has been told to them by the company leaders -- everything about GNOME has been decided already, a way back or direct communication isn't possible. Don't get trapped by sentences like 'we listen to our users'. They listen to you -- yes, to make funny silly jokes about you afterwards.

I thought that everything was build up on friendship, build on programming for fun, build on understanding each other. But the reality looks like it's all for the big money. The cash is what matters everything else is a lie and a dream. Time for people to wake up.

Not long ago they threw one of the most important long year core developer Martin Baulig [gnome.org] [gnome.org] out of team -- a guy who worked really hard on getting GNOME into the right direction, a nice friendly person who put all his time into GNOME.

But narrow minded GNOME elites such as Havoc Pennington [pair.com] [pair.com] were responsible that he left the GNOME project -- the trouble and the pressure that was put on him was to much.

With the new GNOME desktop a lot of user interface changes happened such as button reordering [gnome.org] [gnome.org] -- needless to say that this confuse people who are used to the 'right' button ordering for ages. Even our fellow Linux guru Alan Cox [gnome.org] [gnome.org] wasn't thrilled about this idea, but the GNOME elites such as Havoc Pennington, Seth Nickell, Calum Benson and Dave Bordoley knew it better. Why following the road of any other desktop that exists ? Why not doing something that don't confuse their users and still stay usable ? Well it seems to be too easy. GNOME needs to be different than anything else so they changed the button order which was one of the reasons that users became unhappy. They said that there was a hard fight about this and the decision was made to change the buttons. But I belive they simply copied the behaviour of Mac OS because most of the GNOME developers use a ? [slashdot.org] [slashdot.org]McIntosh as either laptop or desktop. Sad that they forgot to keep in mind that users tend to mix applications and that this will lead into weird button searching and clicking.

But as if this wasn't enough the same people decided that the new GNOME Human Interface Guides [gnome.org] [gnome.org] were the ultima non plus ultra in human interface guides. The announcement contained informations that the KDE usability people got initiated into it. Unfortunately the KDE people heard about it the first time [kde.org] [kde.org] when Seth Nickell went to the KDE mailing list which happened after the announcement. You can imagine that they got highly pissed off about this attitude. You can read more on this link. [kde.org] [kde.org] To summarize it, the KDE people clarified that GNOME should care for their own business.

The problem that came with the new interface guides was, that every little GNOME hacker started to become an user interface expert over night. A lot of GNOME programs that we like to use matured into a disaster over night. Hackers that never programmed correctly for their life started to blindly follow the hype of simplification. For an example look what happened to Galeon [sourceforge.net] [sourceforge.net] (pay attention for the last paragraph). Even Philip Langdale a long year galeon hacker got highly indignant by the target that GNOME leads and wrote this email [sourceforge.net] [sourceforge.net] to the Galeon mailinglist.

Here another reason why users became angry. The elite assumes, that the user knows nothing about their system. you find a couple of heavily insulting mails on their mailing lists containing sentences like the quoted ones.

  • "the user don't know what a window manager is",
  • "the user don't know what themes are",
  • "the user don't know what a homedir is",
  • "the user can't compile a kernel",
  • "the user don't want to customize their desktop",
  • "the user shouldn't see preferences which purpose they don't know"

You may imagine that a lot of people are being offended by such lines because it's exactly these GNOME users who are meant by these phrases. To read more such lines on the GNOME mailinglists, simply click on this link [gnome.org] [gnome.org] and grep in their archives. Be said that most of these sentences are coming from Havoc Pennington.

Such evil practices shouldn't be tolerated by the users and need to be fighted. *NIX users aren't stupid people. Who actually gave Havoc Pennington the rights to decide what the user wants and what not? Various uaers [gnome.org] [gnome.org] told him that people who use a *NIX like system are well aware of their capabilities dealing with such a complex system. There's a reason why people are switching from alternative operating systems. They want to learn, they want to use the full power of the system, they want to change everything they like.

To top all this, look at the future plans of Nautilus. [eazel.com] [eazel.com] The current maintainers got the idea of changing the whole Nautilus concepts into an object oriented user interface design. You may be highly interested in reading the exact words of Alex Larsson's vision for Nautilus' future direction by clicking on this link. [gnome.org] [gnome.org]

To summarize it, it's assumed that the user don't need to deal with his homedir or his whole filesystem because it may confuse him or because he don't understand it. The new concepts of Nautilus should be that the user deal with symbols in the Nautilus view. E.G. you get a cdrom symbol and by clicking on it you see the directory of your cdrom, you get a photo symbol and by clicking on it you get a list of all your pr0n pictures, you get a music symbol and by clicking on it you get a list of all your mp3's. You don't know where all these files are located because you don't deal with the bottom layer of your homedir or filesystem anymore as mentioned earlier.

The question is why are people that know nothing about their users, that know nothing about correct user interface design destroying GNOME ? The users don't deserve all this specially those that backed GNOME for all the years. Even sun threw a bunch of so called user interface experts together and have them work on GNOME. don't forget that sun are the creators of the Common Desktop Environment. [opengroup.org] [opengroup.org] We don't need another CDE clone [kde.org] [kde.org] named GNOME. Even Havoc Pennington author of the good user interfaces [pair.com] [pair.com] text isn't able to get his own written software following his rules.

Not long ago there was an report about the 'two captains of Nautilus' where the reporter (Uraeus a GNOME contributor himself) reported Alexander Larsson and David camp. You may imagine that such a report can't be taken serious because it's done by their own people. We here have a saying that sounds like this 'one crow doesn't hack the eye of another crow out'. Now you can click on this link [gnomedesktop.org] [gnomedesktop.org] and read more. It may be interesting to read the replies from various users all over the globe of what they think about GNOME and Nautilus in general (please pay attention to the listed ip's there). Another nice and informative reading can be found by clicking on this link. [gnomedesktop.org] [gnomedesktop.org]

The fileselector problem was a long discussed issue in the GNOME community. Finally they came to an solution for this and have decided to go for this ugly fileselector [linuxworld.com] [linuxworld.com] instead going for this one [wanadoo.nl] [wanadoo.nl] which was developed by a free volunteer for a long time and in general looks and behaves better.

Most users have no problems with the idea of keeping things simple and clean. Removing some not needed preferences was indeed a good idea but it doesn't stop. People started to remove everything from their apps. You're forced to use dubious programs like GConf-editor which basically works like the Windows Registry editor, to tweak uncommented preferences. I don't think that this is an advantage. Even the possibility to tweak preferences with an editor was taken away with that ugly implementation of GConf. All your preferences are stored in a directory tree with an unknown amount of *.xml files. Even if you delete programs their keys are still remaining orphaned in these trees and finding them is like playing trivia. At the end it's worth a discussion if a system driven by a single home user needs such a registry like system. We didn't need such a system for over 30 years but the GNOME development team got the idea copying one of the most retarded systems from Windows to *NIX. Not to mention that the copy is more retarded than the original.

It's a shame to see how such a nice desktop got thrown into the trash by such people. But there is a lot more behind the scenes that i don't know about. Everything around GNOME is a big marketing strategy. Poor people are working the hell out of GNOME for nothing and companies such as those mentioned above are getting the big cash. for sure you could say - go and fork GNOME - but seriously how can you go and fork GNOME ? such a big project which needs a bunch of people to keep the code alive and compatible. Well you know it's all about open source the code is signed under the GNU/GPL or GNU/LGPL, you can't own it. Even the companies are aware of this. But if you can't own the code - go and hire their developers. You can direct them like puppets in any direction that you - as company - like. Exactly this is happening with GNOME.

well you could easily come up and tell me to simply not use GNOME and let them do whatever they like. Well, you are right with that but things are more complicated nowadays. GNOME is influencing a lot of third party projects such as XFree86 which recently added a lot of GNOME components into their CVS repository. Please know that with the next coming XFree86 version you get a lot of GNOME components without even knowing it. code like, gnome-xml, [xmlsoft.org] [xmlsoft.org] pkgconfig, [freedesktop.org] [freedesktop.org] fontconfig, [fontconfig.org] [fontconfig.org] xcursor and xft2 were mainly written by people who're heavily involved into GNOME development. Also the GIMP is maturing more and more into getting the look and feel of a native GNOME application. The CVS version of the GIMP has a lot of GNOME pixmaps inside and they are heavily working on integrate the GIMP into GNOME. If not today but the direction is sure and i fear the day this gonna happen.

It's ok that these things exist and it's ok to see XFree86 and the GIMP are beeing hacked on. But please think about the people that don't like or use GNOME. What about them ? Why force them to have GNOME components installed on their systems ? Why can't GNOME go the same way that KDE went e.g. doing their own stuff without infecting other projects like AIDS. Seeing more and more libraries and applications that were in no way related to GNOME jumping on the pkgconfig boat which's really not needed. Look what will happen to Solaris, the world famous operating system on *NIX used by big companies and long years experts. They really plan to replace cde with GNOME. I know that cde wasn't the best invention of desktops but it rarely crashed and it fits far better into the philosophy of XFree86 with their configuration system than GNOME. You know the good old way having your settings defined with .xdefaults and all nice default configurations are going into /etc/x11/app-defaults/ and so on. Understandable that the good old way may be blocking the future of applications for multiusersystems - but why must it have to be a Windows Registry like system that replaces future configuration ?

Well to come to an end I personally don't like many of this stuff. I can't stand the button reordering, I don't like the GConf system and even more I don't like the commercial outsourcing of GNOME and the bad influence that GNOME has on other applications. The bad attitude of some GNOME developers is another story since we are all different reacting humans. Luckily there are people sharing some of my thoughts otherwise I wouldn't be able to proof my text with so many links. Even amongst the GNOME developers there are silent voices of people that hate many of these decisions and silently use something else.

Right now if you checkout the GNOME CVS repository every day you find out that the whole GNOME development seemed to came to an halt. The contributions to their CVS are poor. While projects such as KDE are reaching easily 10-20K commits per month - GNOME is getting around 1-2K per month on it's best times.

It really looks like the situation of GNOME is unclear so it would be better to have it not influence so much other programs or at the end we deal with an disaster.

Now I hope this text was informative for you. I hope that you start to think about the situation and the global direction. The situation of GNOME is unclear, their target is groggy too since I can't belive that the users that they are targeting ever heard of *NIX or Linux. They plan to get out of the 0.05% desktop niche but this will for sure not happen if they continue their current direction and their bad ugly attitude.

MODERATE PARENT DOWN!!!!! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#5758897)

THIS guy is a TROLL

incase it WASN'T OBVIOUS!!!!

MODERATE him/her/it DOWN!!!

where do they go? (1)

ejaw5 (570071) | more than 11 years ago | (#5758802)

Where are these new fonts suppposed to be copied to on Linux? /usr/share/fonts ? and does it need to be in a subdirectory? I know i'm supposed to know this, but it'd be nice if they explained on the site anyway.

Re:where do they go? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#5758826)

Create a .fonts directory in you home directory. Copy them there. Done.

Re:where do they go? (1)

Loosewire (628916) | more than 11 years ago | (#5758970)

what about other users on the system?

Re:where do they go? (1)

damiam (409504) | more than 11 years ago | (#5758948)

If you're using a recent distro with fontconfig (RedHat 8+ and Debian come to mind, though there are others), you can put them in ~/.fonts/ and they shoudl appear. Otherwise, you'll have to find out where X stores its fonts (check /etc/X11/XF86Config-4) and go through all sorts of voodoo to copy the fonts to those directories and make sure X knows about them.

Nice selection.. (1)

ThreeZee (609147) | more than 11 years ago | (#5758811)

I'm not complaining.. so many fonts are offered for free out there.. add a couple more to the list and put a smile on your face. =) *Make your AMD run cooler! Remove what you don't need! Ph33r my f4n! [pivx.com]

Beautiful font (2, Insightful)

Ender Ryan (79406) | more than 11 years ago | (#5758833)

This font is probably the most beautiful font I have ever seen, especially the serif font. It is by far the most easily readable serif font ever. I normally despise serif fonts because I find them pretty unreadable, but Bitstream Vera Serif rocks.

It's really good to finally have a high-quality free font set.

FWIW. YMMV.

Finally, a decent monospaced font! (5, Informative)

zsazsa (141679) | more than 11 years ago | (#5758882)

I just installed these on my Windows machine. The monospace font is excellent. Until now I haven't seen a decent TTF monospace font that was properly hinted to keep it from looking horrible at 9pt, but still nice and smooth at large sizes.

The Lucida Sans monospace font that came with Windows pales in comparison to Vera Sans Mono, even though the Lucida family was supposedly designed with bitmap screens in mind [adobe.com] .

Re:Finally, a decent monospaced font! (1)

Jugalator (259273) | more than 11 years ago | (#5759027)

Agreed -- this one is *finally* looking rather good. I've previously used Courier New and Andale Mono. I found Andale Mono to look slightly better, but I use ClearType with Windows and the anti-alias seem to reduce the readability of Andale a bit more than Vera already at 10 pt. I'd assume even worse at 9 pt.

Mandrake Rocks (3, Informative)

Christianfreak (100697) | more than 11 years ago | (#5758900)

If you have Mandrake, untar the directory somewhere

click 'Mandrake Control Center'
System-> Fonts-> Advanced

Click add, select the directory, close the Add window. Click install list. Voila! New fonts no messing with X configs or even restarting it.

Sorry for being dumb (2, Interesting)

Loosewire (628916) | more than 11 years ago | (#5758947)

But why are fonts so valuable?
I keep seeing fonts which are expensive to buy.
Buy fonts???? but their just pictures of letters...
Again - sorry for being dumb

Re:Sorry for being dumb (2, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#5758975)

Because someone has to actually draw each character from A-Z, a-z, numbers, funky characters, set the correct kerning for each character, and it all has to look just right at different sizes.

Bitstream Vera Sans Mono font looks great!! (1)

Futurepower(R) (558542) | more than 11 years ago | (#5758987)


Tried Vera on a Win XP machine. The Bitstream Vera Sans Mono (the full name of the font) font looks great!! Thanks to everyone who made it available. Lucida Console is an excellent monospaced font, but it does not have enough space between lines. Bitstream Vera Sans Mono has sensible spacing.

It is very, very difficult to make a good font. Those who are knowledgeable about computers tend to be very insensitive to graphical clarity, I've found, although that is changing, it seems.

Bitstream Vera Serif is useless to me because it has a terrible bold. This is a typical failing of fonts. Bitstream Vera Serif Bold is really a very different-looking font, not a bold of Vera Serif. Vera Serif, not bold, looks great, however.

To be truly useful, fonts meant for general use need a demi-bold. Sometimes you want a full bold, and sometimes a full bold is too heavy.
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