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Nullsoft's Waste: Encrypted, Distributed, Mesh Net

CmdrTaco posted more than 10 years ago | from the p2p-gets-more-and-more dept.

Encryption 674

Myriad writes "Nullsoft, makers of the venerable Winamp MP3 player, released today a secure, distributed mesh-like networking protocal and platform called Waste. This v1.0 beta release uses RSA (key based) and Blowfish encryption for security, and features Instant Messanging and group chat, along with file browsing, searching, and transfer. Waste has been released under the GPL, with source and binaries available here."

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674 comments

I hate niggers (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#6065655)

Heil Hitler

Information wants to be wide (-1)

Carp Flounderson (542291) | more than 10 years ago | (#6065802)

An Explanation of the
Variation in Effects between Batches of Ketamine
by MorningGlorySeed

Because street Ketamine usually originates from legitimate pharmaceutical supplies that have been illegally diverted to the black-market, the question of purity and actual chemical content is not generally as much of a concern as it is with other street drugs such as Ecstasy. However non-medical users of ketamine often comment that they notice varying effects from different batches of street ketamine. Although set and setting can have a dramatic influence on one's subjective experience with any psychoactive, there may be other reasons why some ketamine users feel one bag of ketamine may differ from the next.

According to an article written by Karl Jansen in the Journal of Psychoactive Drugs, Ketalar ® [produced by Parke-Davis] contains benzethonium chloride as a preservative, which may have its own psychoactive effect. In addition, some brands differ in which stereoisomers of ketamine they contain. Most brands contain equal mixtures of the S(+) and R(-) isomers (racemic ketamine), but at least one brand has been found to contain only the S(+) isomer. According to Jansen, S(+) ketamine is more likely to suppress breathing, induces a faster loss of consciousness, and has a quicker recovery time (Jansen, 2000). Jansen also states that S(+) ketamine is a more potent psychedelic drug than R(+) ketamine, but he does not elaborate as to how.

References
Jansen, K. L. (2000). A Review of the Nonmedical Use of Ketamine: Use, Users and Consequences. Journal of Psychoactive Drugs, 32 (4), 419-433.

Re:I hate niggers (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#6065891)

Sieg Heil!
Todt die untermenschen...

Gnutella (2, Insightful)

Nermal6693 (622898) | more than 10 years ago | (#6065658)

Didn't they make Gnutella too?

Re:Gnutella (1)

terrox (555131) | more than 10 years ago | (#6065673)

I dunno, I just hope shareaza will be compatible with it :-)

Re:Gnutella (2, Informative)

terrox (555131) | more than 10 years ago | (#6065702)

oops now i realise it is for small secure/private networks - sounds good for VNC type stuff.

Re:Gnutella (4, Funny)

localghost (659616) | more than 10 years ago | (#6065746)

No, Ferrero [ferrero.de] makes Nutella [nutella.de].

Re:Gnutella (2, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#6065776)

As a matter of fact, Gnutella has nothing to do with Nutella, except for the similar name.

As you already pointed out in your links, Nutella is a chocalate spread. It is a FOOD item.

Gnutella is a SOFTWARE item. It is used for P2P (point-to-point) networking. Usually, Gnutella is used to distribute music, although it can be used to distribute any files.

I hope this comment has been helpful in clearing the matter.

Re:Gnutella (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#6065889)

I read your comment while I was on the shitter (wow, wireless is SO great!), and right as I readched the end, a great log of poo burst forth from my anus. So, thanks!

Re:Gnutella (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#6065910)

that comment has really helped clear "the matter" for you :)

Re:Gnutella - YES (3, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#6065748)

Yes, Nullsoft originally created Gnutella then parent company AOL forced them to stop development, but the cat was out of the back and code was leaked/reverse engineered.

Re:Gnutella (5, Informative)

MacJedi (173) | more than 10 years ago | (#6065763)

Yes, they did. However, AOL didn't like it and got it shut down within the day. Then someone (Justin Frankel?) leaked the source and the rest is history.

/joeyo

Re:Gnutella (5, Informative)

Magila (138485) | more than 10 years ago | (#6065774)

Indeed, here [slashdot.org] is the original slashdot story. Of course AOL quickly ended development at nullsoft, it lived on after the protocol had been reverse engineered and others picked up where nullsoft left off.

Re:Gnutella (1)

bobibleyboo (13303) | more than 10 years ago | (#6065791)

Yeah they did and they did. And they did it after they where bought by AOL. Strangeley the Gnutella down load site dissapeared pretty quickley ;) so grab it and mirror it while you can.

The USA is Dying (-1, Offtopic)

Michael's a Jerk! (668185) | more than 10 years ago | (#6065659)

It is official -- The UN is now confirming: The USA is dying

One more crippling bombshell crushed the already beleaguered American economy
when x-rates.com confirmed that the American Dollar has dropped yet again [x-rates.com],
now down to .9 of a Euro. Coming on the heels of a recent Usenet survey which plainly states that The American Economy is in a recession [google.com], this news serves to
reinforce what we've known all along. The USA is collapsing in complete disarray, as fittingly exemplified by failing dead last [samag.com] in the recent Sys Admin comprehensive networking test.

You don't need to be a Kreskin [amazingkreskin.com] to predict the USA's future. The hand writing is on the wall: The USA faces a bleak future. In fact there won't
be any future at all for the USA because it is dying. Things are looking very bad for America. As many of us are already aware, the US continues to lose relevence. Red ink flows like a river of blood.

The IT industry is the most endangered of them all, having lost 93% of its core
developers. The sudden and unpleasant departures of long time IT jobs to india only serve to underscore the point more clearly. There can no longer be any doubt: The American IT Industry is dying.

Let's keep to the facts and look at the numbers.

Microsoft Encarta states that there are 291,065,636 people in America. What is the US's national debt? Let's see. According to the The Debt clock [brillig.com] the USA's National Debt is 6,465,271,811,559.14. Therefore each American
is $22,212.42. in debt. In fact, the USA's national debt has continued to
increase an average of $992 million per day since September 30, 2002. Indeed,
it can clearly be seen the the US is going broke faster then the Soviet Union did

Due to the troubles of American Meddling, An Capitalist Gorvernment and so on,
South Vietnam was attacked was taken over by North Vietnam who sell another
a more compassionate government. Now Iraq is also dead, its corpse turned over
to feed the US media.

All major surveys show that the USA has steadily declined in the world economy.
America is very sick and its long term survival prospects are very dim. If
the USA is to survive at all it will be among a broken collection of warring
factions. America continues to decay. Nothing short of a miracle could save
it at this point in time. For all practical purposes, the United States of America is dead.

Fact: The USA is dying

Re:The USA is Dying (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#6065682)

Fact: The USA is dying

Well at least Vladamir Putin will get to take credit for it happening "on his watch".

effpee (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#6065661)

yes!

FIRST POST (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#6065665)

FIRST SHARED POST BIZZZAH

Good work (1, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#6065666)

Happy to see the spirit of Free Software continues thrive. We've been seeing too many proprietary offerings of late. I'm glad that Nullsoft is "with the program". This is a great idea, and they deserve our support.

Hmmm.... (4, Insightful)

leviramsey (248057) | more than 10 years ago | (#6065670)

AOL Time Warner (IIRC, owners of the second biggest recording company, not to mention one of the major recording studios) owns Nullsoft, which releases a program that the RIAA and MPAA will undoubtedly call a tool whose sole purpose is to illicitly distribute copyrighted works....

A cliche regarding:

  • a left hand
  • a right hand
  • and a lack of knowledge

...comes to mind.

Re:Hmmm.... (5, Informative)

glob (23034) | more than 10 years ago | (#6065753)

"undoubtedly call a tool whose sole purpose is to illicitly distribute copyrighted works"

uhh, waste is for small workgroups only ..

WASTE is a software product and protocol that enables secure distributed communication for small (on the order of 10-50 nodes) trusted groups of users.
it's not about p2p file sharing, rather it's a colaborative tool.

sure, you could use to to share illegal stuff, but it's really no different in that respect to email, icq, whatever.

Re:Hmmm.... (-1, Troll)

Debian Troll (676582) | more than 10 years ago | (#6065800)

A cliche regarding:

* a left hand
* a right hand
* and a lack of knowledge


Strangely, these qualities are exactly those required for the infamous 'fists of fury' masturbation technique, and to be a raving Debian zealot. I should know!!! apt-get apt-get hooray!

isn't this really... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#6065671)

skazaa (secure kazaa)?

DEAL SIR / MADAM (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#6065672)

URGENT ASSISTANCE - FROM USA
IMMEDIATE ATTENTION NEEDED: HIGHLY CONFIDENTIAL
FROM: GEORGE WALKER BUSH 202.456.1414 / 202.456.1111 FAX: 202.456.2461

DEAR SIR / MADAM,

I AM GEORGE WALKER BUSH, SON OF THE FORMER PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED
STATES OF AMERICA GEORGE HERBERT WALKER BUSH, AND CURRENTLY SERVING AS
PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA. THIS LETTER MIGHT SURPRISE
YOU BECAUSE WE HAVE NOT MET NEITHER IN PERSON NOR BY CORRESPONDENCE. I
CAME TO KNOW OF YOU IN MY SEARCH FOR A RELIABLE AND REPUTABLE PERSON TO
HANDLE A VERY CONFIDENTIAL BUSINESS TRANSACTION, WHICH INVOLVES THE
TRANSFER OF A HUGE SUM OF MONEY TO AN ACCOUNT REQUIRING MAXIMUM
CONFIDENCE.

I AM WRITING YOU IN ABSOLUTE CONFIDENCE PRIMARILY TO SEEK YOUR
ASSISTANCE IN ACQUIRING OIL FUNDS THAT ARE PRESENTLY TRAPPED IN THE
REPUBLIC OF IRAQ. MY PARTNERS AND I SOLICIT YOUR ASSISTANCE IN
COMPLETING A TRANSACTION BEGUN BY MY FATHER, WHO HAS LONG BEEN ACTIVELY
ENGAGED IN THE EXTRACTION OF PETROLEUM IN THE UNITED STATES OF
AMERICA,AND BRAVELY SERVED HIS COUNTRY AS DIRECTOR OF THE UNITED STATES
CENTRAL INTELLIGENCE AGENCY.IN THE DECADE OF THE NINETEEN-EIGHTIES, MY
FATHER, THEN VICE-PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA, SOUGHT TO
WORK WITH THE GOOD OFFICES OF THE PRESIDENT OF THE REPUBLIC OF IRAQ TO
REGAIN LOST OIL REVENUE SOURCES IN THE NEIGHBORING ISLAMIC REPUBLIC OF
IRAN. THIS UNSUCCESSFUL VENTURE WAS SOON FOLLOWED BY A FALLING-OUT WITH
HIS IRAQI PARTNER, WHO SOUGHT TO ACQUIRE ADDITIONAL OIL REVENUE SOURCES
IN THE NEIGHBORING EMIRATE OF KUWAIT, A WHOLLY-OWNED U.S.-BRITISH
SUBSIDIARY.

MY FATHER RE-SECURED THE PETROLEUM ASSETS OF KUWAIT IN 1991 AT A COST OF
SIXTY-ONE BILLION U.S. DOLLARS ($61,000,000,000). OUT OF THAT
COST,THIRTY-SIX BILLION DOLLARS ($36,000,000,000) WERE SUPPLIED BY HIS
PARTNERS IN THE KINGDOM OF SAUDI ARABIA AND OTHER PERSIAN GULF
MONARCHIES, AND SIXTEEN BILLION DOLLARS ($16,000,000,000) BY GERMAN AND
JAPANESE PARTNERS. BUT MY FATHER'S FORMER IRAQI BUSINESS PARTNER
REMAINED IN CONTROL OF THE REPUBLIC OF IRAQ AND ITS PETROLEUM RESERVES.

MY FAMILY IS CALLING FOR YOUR URGENT ASSISTANCE IN FUNDING THE REMOVAL
OF THE PRESIDENT OF THE REPUBLIC OF IRAQ AND ACQUIRING THE PETROLEUM
ASSETS OF HIS COUNTRY, AS COMPENSATION FOR THE COSTS OF REMOVING HIM
FROM POWER. UNFORTUNATELY, OUR PARTNERS FROM 1991 ARE NOT WILLING TO
SHOULDER THE BURDEN OF THIS NEW VENTURE, WHICH IN ITS UPCOMING PHASE MAY
COST THE SUM OF 100 BILLION TO 200 BILLION DOLLARS ($100,000,000,000
-$200,000,000,000), BOTH IN THE INITIAL ACQUISITION AND IN LONG-TERM
MANAGEMENT. WITHOUT THE FUNDS FROM OUR 1991 PARTNERS, WE WOULD NOT BE
ABLE TO ACQUIRE THE OIL REVENUE TRAPPED WITHIN IRAQ. THAT IS WHY MY
FAMILY AND OUR COLLEAGUES ARE URGENTLY SEEKING YOUR GRACIOUS
ASSISTANCE. OUR DISTINGUISHED COLLEAGUES IN THIS BUSINESS TRANSACTION
INCLUDE THE SITTING VICE-PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA,
RICHARD CHENEY,WHO IS AN ORIGINAL PARTNER IN THE IRAQ VENTURE AND FORMER
HEAD OF THE HALLIBURTON OIL COMPANY, AND CONDOLEEZA RICE, WHOSE
PROFESSIONAL DEDICATION TO THE VENTURE WAS DEMONSTRATED IN THE NAMING OF
A CHEVRON OIL TANKER AFTER HER. I WOULD BESEECH YOU TO TRANSFER A SUM
EQUALING TEN TO TWENTY-FIVE PERCENT (10-25 %) OF YOUR YEARLY INCOME TO
OUR ACCOUNT TO AID IN THIS IMPORTANT VENTURE. THE INTERNAL REVENUE
SERVICE OF THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA WILL FUNCTION AS OUR TRUSTED
INTERMEDIARY. I PROPOSE THAT YOU MAKE THIS TRANSFER BEFORE THE FIFTEENTH
(15TH) OF THE MONTH OF APRIL. I KNOW THAT A TRANSACTION OF THIS
MAGNITUDE WOULD MAKE ANYONE APPREHENSIVE AND WORRIED. BUT I AM ASSURING
YOU THAT ALL WILL BE WELL AT THE END OF THE DAY. A BOLD STEP TAKEN SHALL
NOT BE REGRETTED, I ASSURE YOU. PLEASE DO BE INFORMED THAT THIS BUSINESS
TRANSACTION IS 100% LEGAL. IF YOU DO NOT WISH TO CO-OPERATE IN THIS
TRANSACTION,PLEASE CONTACT OUR INTERMEDIARY REPRESENTATIVES TO FURTHER
DISCUSS THE MATTER. I PRAY THAT YOU UNDERSTAND OUR PLIGHT. MY FAMILY
AND OUR COLLEAGUES WILL BE FOREVER GRATEFUL.

PLEASE REPLY IN STRICT CONFIDENCE TO THE CONTACT NUMBERS
BELOW.

SINCERELY WITH WARM REGARDS, GEORGE WALKER BUSH

Switchboard: 202.456.1414 Comments: 202.456.1111 Fax: 202.456.2461
Email: president@whitehouse.gov

until when (3, Insightful)

Vej (199488) | more than 10 years ago | (#6065675)

Makes you wonder how long it will be until protocols/network designs are attacked on the same basis as the product derived from them. ie p2p/filesharing.

Considering nullsoft, might be a risky move.

Re:until when (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#6065798)

One of the most common punctuation errors is in the abbreviations "i.e." and "e.g." the author of the above comment does not even know how to use punctuation as he has written
> from them. ie p2p/filesharing.
where he should have written
from them, i.e., p2p/filesharing.

JabberIM does this (1, Interesting)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#6065678)

I think this is a waste of time.

We already have JabberIM [jabber.org] which does this and at the same time provides tunnels to other IM networks.

Interesting (5, Insightful)

harikiri (211017) | more than 10 years ago | (#6065679)

I haven't yet spotted any cryptographic "reviews" of this yet, but it certainly looks like an appealing platform to work with.

Going through the documentation, I found this:

From here [nullsoft.com]

Note: It might be worth implementing WASTE using a subset of SSL, to avoid any concern of flaws in this protocol. Feedback is gladly accepted on any potential weaknesses of the negotiation. We have spent a decent amount of time analyzing this, and although we have found a few things that are not ideal (i.e. if you know public keys from a network, you can sniff some traffic and do an offline dictionary attack on the network name/ID), but overall it seems decent. The current implementation probably needs work, too.

Which suggests to me that it isn't worth rushing out and developing application with *just* yet, until further reviews have occured (and the protocol has matured/evolved).

I have to ask.. (1, Insightful)

the unbeliever (201915) | more than 10 years ago | (#6065681)

What's the point? If you can only connect to people who's key you have, and if only people who have your key can connect to you, this is going to be a pretty private thing. If it was more "anonymous", I could see a reason behind it. As it stands, I'll be the only person in my circle of friends who'll "get this", and it'll just spend time wasting on my HD. To be completely honest, crypto on file sharing protocols won't be commonplace until AOL or Yahoo decides to put it in AIM/Pager.

Re:I have to ask.. (1)

terrox (555131) | more than 10 years ago | (#6065691)

that is the point. small secure networking, they don't seem to want to compete with the other 40 thousand P2P programs.

Re:I have to ask.. (2, Interesting)

ergonal (609484) | more than 10 years ago | (#6065700)

You're right. But you have to remember that, by the brief look of it I got, makes PGP-style stuff a lot easier. And what do most people use IM's for anyway? To chat to their friends? You bet. It wouldn't take long to develop a web of trust of, say, your entire school or workplace. But you're also right, it won't gain wide acceptance unless there's easy way to connect to the "network".. I just opened the "Network status" dialog, and what do I type in? Nothing right now, until I can get someone else to load it up.

Re:I have to ask.. (4, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#6065839)

But you're also right, it won't gain wide acceptance unless there's easy way to connect to the "network".. I just opened the "Network status" dialog, and what do I type in?
There is no network. The goal isn't "wide acceptance". This isn't another way for you to get your mp3s, porn, whatever. Front page of the site, emphasis added:

WASTE is a software product and protocol that enables secure distributed communication for small (on the order of 10-50 nodes) trusted groups of users.

WASTE is designed to enable small companies and small teams within larger companies to easily communicate and collaborate in a secure and efficient fashion, independent of physical network topology.

Re:I have to ask.. (1)

mpxcz (448928) | more than 10 years ago | (#6065714)

I'll have to agree with you on that...
seems like they're just bloating up winamp, although the security and technologies that have integrated into it are cool.
Maybe the secuity was mainly focused on the IM part.

Re:I have to ask.. (5, Insightful)

kliment (627259) | more than 10 years ago | (#6065719)

I think this is meaningful, as it is an ad-hoc way of creating aa VPN. Also it would probably be faster if a few of the nodes have fast connections. If your friends don't see a reason behind this, then maybe it is not meant for your circle of friends. About the anonymous issue, note that Freenet already exists and works to handle that problem. This is meant to address a completely different issue

Re:I have to ask.. (5, Insightful)

Motherfucking Shit (636021) | more than 10 years ago | (#6065728)

What's the point? If you can only connect to people who's key you have, and if only people who have your key can connect to you, this is going to be a pretty private thing.
Exactly, privacy is what it's all about. People tend to forget (or not realize to begin with) that every bit of chatter they send to one another on AIM goes through AOL's servers, every message they send to their buddy on MSN Messenger passes through Microsoft's servers, etc. Waste gives you the ability to conduct reasonably secure conversations and chat. Sure, it's not as geeky as running your own private IRC server wrapped in stunnel, but hey, the easier crypto becomes, the better.

The next time you want to have a chat with a friend, but you don't exactly want the contents bouncing all over the internet in plaintext, this looks like the perfect application. Reminds me somewhat of a program called SIMP [winfosec.com], which is a minimalistic Blowfish-ized IM program.

Re:I have to ask.. (4, Insightful)

junklight (183583) | more than 10 years ago | (#6065786)

The problem that we have here is that this network is NOT for piracy and therefore a lot of slashdot readers cannot see the use for it. Think instead of people working together - a workgroup as it where. For example why pay rental fees on an office when you can have a virtual one using tools such as this? Now I am not sure how great this tool is for that right not (I'm guessing - first release - not very) but I am sure it will come if people start using it.

Five minutes later (5, Interesting)

Jacer (574383) | more than 10 years ago | (#6065684)

I read the article and immediately got excited. I downloaded all of the software and had it all setup and working within a few minutes. As of right now I'm living in an apartment and have no practical use, but on Monday I'm moving into my dorm room to start my summer class (bleh!) Anyway, I think this is so wonderful! I've been thinking about a secure network computing solution for my three computers when I'm at school. I have my server, workstation, and my laptop that I'd like to tie all together. The leading choice was vpn, but after playing around with this, I do think that running on my server and having the three of them connect to it, and maybe a few of my friends computers on campus, we can create a very nice, effective, small, and secure lan. Then again, after five minutes I haven't decided if the whole reinventing of the wheel is worth it. I'll probably try it out, and setup a vpn server too, and see which I like more.

Re:Five minutes later (-1, Flamebait)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#6065811)

Glad to have you aboard for the summer, Jacer. Looking forward to "seeing" you again. I and the other gays meet every Tuesday at 3:00 PM in the 3rd floor men's room of the library for a "round table" (heh heh). We look forward to your presence. It is a BYOL (bring your own lube) affair, and strictly bareback. Hope to be "seeing" you there. Yum.

-- Bruce

Re:Five minutes later (5, Interesting)

graveyhead (210996) | more than 10 years ago | (#6065835)

VPN is better if you're a gamer...

Once you've set it up for a firewall, the f/w effectively vanishes inside the VPN. A friend and I struggled with firewall configs for years tweaking for the game of the day. Enter VPN, and now we have a private TCP network without firewalls. Any game supports that, no reconfiguration required.

The other thing is that it is built into w2k (my gaming platform of choice) and XP (friends platform). This means you can be up and running after reading some quick instructions on setting up the server, your shares (properly!), forward one TCP port (yes, only one) from your firewall to desktop, and that's it forever.

Add an uber-IM like Trillian, and that's all you will ever need.

Re:Five minutes later (1)

Jacer (574383) | more than 10 years ago | (#6065898)

Yeah, I had a VPN setup from work to home before, and it didn't always take kindly to the network address translation. Certian things wouldn't function, and I'm hoping that's fixed here. Also, we have a whole chunk of public addresses on campus. I could easily configure the pool to assign some of them, and not worry about the nat, but then there is always a chance that there will be an address conflict. As a former net admin before coming back to school, I can tell you that I don't take too kindly to rouge DHCP servers messing with my address block. (I had a user bring in a access point that was also a residential gateway. The nerve!)

SSH! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#6065885)

ssh, now!

Download and mirror this (2, Interesting)

scrod (136965) | more than 10 years ago | (#6065686)

while you can. Remember what happened when they first released Gnutella? If I recall, AOL forced them to pull it within hours (though it was already completely reverse-engineered almost immediately afterward).

Re:Download and mirror this (4, Interesting)

Farley Mullet (604326) | more than 10 years ago | (#6065796)

+4 RTFA [nullsoft.com]! more like it.

And I blockquote:

WASTE is a software product and protocol that enables secure distributed communication for small (on the order of 10-50 nodes) trusted groups of users.
So this isn't really a thing like gnutella. It's an enterprise product. As other posters have noted, it could conceivably be used to share (AOL-TW) copyrighted works, but that doesn't seem to be anywhere near it's main purpose. Heck, AOL is probably releasing the core technology as OSS to get the community to shake it down for bugs, in anticipation of releasing a commercial product built on top of the protocol. Kinda like how Apple has worked on open source technologies like zeroconf, and released commercial products like rendezvous built on the technology.

What's better? (-1, Flamebait)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#6065688)

(a) Nullsoft's Waste

or

(b) sex with a mare?

Interesting, not your usual peer to peer app. (5, Informative)

rmlane (589573) | more than 10 years ago | (#6065693)

Designed for small groups of people (up to 50)

It allows easy colloboration across firewalls, and only one user inside the firewall is required to allow all users inside access to the mesh.

Each link is encrypted, but each message is decrypted and re-encrypted at each hop of the mesh, so you have to trust all of the nodes. It's also very hard to drop a node onc it is trusted, as each node shares public keys around to make sure all nodes have all public keys. Initial connection to the mesh requires manual key exchange. PITA, but moderatley secure.

All network traffic is encrypted, it will flood each mesh link with a minimum amount of bandwidth to foil traffic analysis.

For readers of Pynchon. . . (4, Informative)

BitHive (578094) | more than 10 years ago | (#6065695)

That's W A S T E, not 'Waste'.

Re:For readers of Pynchon. . . (-1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#6065843)

We Await Silent Torvalds Empire .

Re:For readers of Pynchon. . . (5, Informative)

IntlHarvester (11985) | more than 10 years ago | (#6065847)

Above post was not at all offtopic. Crying of Lot 49 is a good nerd book, so go read it.

In the book, W.A.S.T.E is an underground postal system that allowed people to exchange messages without the authorities finding out.

Off-topic: your sig (1)

Osty (16825) | more than 10 years ago | (#6065867)

Come play good old-fashioned Team Fortress Classic @ chase.bithive.net.

What a sad day it is when TeamFortress Classic is called "old-fashioned". Back in my day, we played the original TeamFortress, the modification for Quake 1. We played on modems, and if we had a 300ms ping, we liked it! Bah, new-fangled TFC. The Holy Hand Grenade server (24/7 canalzon, may it rest in peace) was the place to play.


And don't even get me started on the butchering of TF that TFC did. (HWguy can walk and shoot? and what was that monstrosity cz2 that was supposed to be a follow-up to the venerable and perfect canalzon? And the scout must've put on 30 pounds, because he sure slowed down. Ack!) I guess I'm showing my age (mid-20s, and already ancient).

nice name... (1)

boog3r (62427) | more than 10 years ago | (#6065696)

best name yet for a p2p app. hope they polished it up a little bit more than gnutella was, because this is gonna get tossed by AOLTIMEWARNERNEWSCOPRATTetc PDQ and then we will have another MIA P2P APP.

Acronyms. The Breakfast of Champions.

Thats Nice (-1, Flamebait)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#6065697)

Yeah thats all nice and good but how about releasing a deacend versing of winamp. cuz everyone in /. knows that 3.0 was the worst winamo ever.

License? (0, Interesting)

harlows_monkeys (106428) | more than 10 years ago | (#6065699)

I just download the source and took a look. No COPYING file. No README. The string "gpl" (case insensitive) does not appear in any of the files.

Worse, there is an "rsa" subdirectory, and the files in there all say they are copyright RSA Data Security, and all rights are reserved. Worse, the MD5 source files contain a license that is incompatible with the GPL.

I'd stay away from waste until they straighten this stuff out.

Re:License? (1, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#6065723)

Well, the Windows version has the GPL in the 'Accept/Don't accept' stage of installing the app, if that means anything to you.

Congratulations (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#6065731)

YOU'RE A FAG!

Re:License? GPL (1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#6065760)

This is in the asyncdns.h file, and most of the other files in the .gz file.

WASTE - asyncdns.h (asynchronous DNS class)
Copyright (C) 2003 Nullsoft, Inc.

WASTE is free software; you can redistribute it and/or modify it under the terms of the GNU General Public License as published by the Free Software Foundation; either version 2 of the License, or (at your option) any later version.

Seems like conflicting information to me.

GPL Licences (2, Informative)

rmlane (589573) | more than 10 years ago | (#6065772)

Quoting from the source:

Copyright (C) 2003 Nullsoft, Inc.

WASTE is free software; you can redistribute it and/or modify it under the terms of the GNU General Public License as published by the Free Software Foundation; either version 2 of the License, or (at your option) any later version.

Yes, it's GPL and it says so... (4, Informative)

malakai (136531) | more than 10 years ago | (#6065828)

I don't know, are you a troll?

Try searching on 'GNU General Public License' Einstein.
/*

WASTE - connection.cpp (Secured TCP connection class)
Copyright (C) 2003 Nullsoft, Inc.

WASTE is free software; you can redistribute it and/or modify
it under the terms of the GNU General Public License as published by
the Free Software Foundation; either version 2 of the License, or
(at your option) any later version.

WASTE is distributed in the hope that it will be useful,
but WITHOUT ANY WARRANTY; without even the implied warranty of
MERCHANTABILITY or FITNESS FOR A PARTICULAR PURPOSE. See the
GNU General Public License for more details.

You should have received a copy of the GNU General Public License
along with WASTE; if not, write to the Free Software
Foundation, Inc., 59 Temple Place, Suite 330, Boston, MA 02111-1307 USA
*/

Re:License? (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#6065872)

Sorta like GNUtella, which wasn't.

Check this one as well... (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#6065706)

FS/OSS community, the makers of the most vulnerable OS among the rest of the unices still, after how much - 10 years?, are trying to deliver a proper OS. Regardless their support from the commercial sector, the OS is not there. Or what is there they call it an OS. One only needs to check what is going over at securityfocus to persuade him/herself -viva OSS/FS OS.

Saint Joan of Arc We Remember You! (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#6065716)

Saint Joan of Arc : Born at Domremy in Champagne, probably on 6 January, 1412; died at Rouen, 30 May, 1431.

Saint Joan of Arc Pray For Us!

Waste? (1, Redundant)

arvindn (542080) | more than 10 years ago | (#6065720)

Why would anyone call their product waste? I thought it must be an acronym, since they've spelt it in all caps, but they haven't said what it stands for.

Re:Waste? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#6065795)

Oh, kinda clear. It's such waste to use encryption ;)

Go read Pynchon (2, Interesting)

billstewart (78916) | more than 10 years ago | (#6065829)

In "The Crying of Lot 49" [powells.com], which is a nice short fast spacy read, there's a plot thread about competing mail services and a conspiracy that conducts its private communications in a way that, if you refer to the name of the product as "waste" rather than "W A S T E", indicates you're clearly not part of their group. There are also email systems called "Trystero" for similar reasons, and it makes looking at post office boxes in Scandinavia quite silly even without sampling the local agricultural products.

fix what needs fixing (-1, Flamebait)

UniverseIsADoughnut (170909) | more than 10 years ago | (#6065721)

Why don't they go and do what they need to do. Fix winamp, it was months into winamp3 release before it even worked. It still barely works. Most people have given up on it and use 2.81 or whatever the latest 2x version is. Also how about fixing the BS versioning. That is, if you release 3.0, and then an updated version it should be 3.1 or 3.0.1 or similar. They made at least 3 versions that i saw that kept the 3.0 version number, from the first one to my current one 3.0 shrank by a .5 - 1 meg (can remember how much off hand for sure).

They are a perfect example of fucking something up good and then seamingly covering it up. I think winamp 3 has been out for many many months, maybe nearing a year, and it still sucks. Stop adding new widgets and make it work, make it stop randomly having no volume for songs, or loosing settings and any of the other bugs.

You can make new random products all you want but if you can't even get your main product working right your screwed. If and when the iTunes for windows comes out winamp is going to be in a world of hurt.

Re:fix what needs fixing (5, Informative)

misuba (139520) | more than 10 years ago | (#6065749)

Winamp 2.9 is the latest release of the Winamp 2.x codebase, which takes most of the good ideas that went into Winamp 3 and codes them back to an API free of excessive abstraction. It's been out for weeks, if not months. Check your facts before posting.

They already fixed Winamp, whiner (3, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#6065794)

Firstly, the WA2 group backported the two major features of WA3 (video support and the media library) to WA2 and released it as WA 2.9. Development continues on a hybrid tree under the working title WA5 (2 + 3 == 5).

Secondly, not everyone shares your idea of "what they need to do". Winamp is a nice media player, but nevertheless just a media player; to many people, a protocol that facilitates cryptographically secure collaboration is infinitely more useful.

Thirdly, I'm not clear on what obligation you think Nullsoft owes you even when they're on company time, but I wouldn't be surprised if WASTE was written in spare time--you know, for fun.

Is Groove doomed? (4, Interesting)

misuba (139520) | more than 10 years ago | (#6065726)

Resolved that: Gnutella aside, this technology is really a direct shot at Groove Networks, the company founded by Ray Ozzie of Lotus Notes fame to sell P2P-derived technology to small and large business.

Discuss.

Re:Is Groove doomed? (4, Funny)

reaper20 (23396) | more than 10 years ago | (#6065854)

If

a) Groove was actually used by anybody and
b) It wasn't such horrible software

then I would say yes. Unfortunately Groove is a solution looking for a problem, and how many people get excited when you hear "designed by the guy that designed Notes."

Re:Is Groove doomed? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#6065878)

Well, most people don't know that the WWW is just a text-based, non-proprietary copy of Notes.

Beep! (2, Funny)

BladeMelbourne (518866) | more than 10 years ago | (#6065729)

Thanks for the link!

On their site I found a program called Beep. It makes noises on keyboard/mouse input :-)

http://www.nullsoft.com/free/nbeep

It gets annoying after a while, but it is 'cute' enough to impress my girlfriend. And that matters as much as keeping my RedHat system up2date. LOL

Re:Beep! (4, Funny)

millwall (622730) | more than 10 years ago | (#6065766)

"[...] It makes noises on keyboard/mouse input :-) [...] it is 'cute' enough to impress my girlfriend."

Where do you find a girl that could be impressed that easily? No need for fancy restaurants or expensive gifts, just type on your keyboard and she goes mental.... nice!

Re:Beep! (0, Troll)

Debian Troll (676582) | more than 10 years ago | (#6065788)

It gets annoying after a while, but it is 'cute' enough to impress my girlfriend. And that matters as much as keeping my RedHat system up2date. LOL

If you were using Debian and its fantastic apt-get package management system, you wouldn't need to worry about that (using up2date or having a girlfriend).

apt-get zealotry makes life simple in more ways than one!

Re:Beep! (1, Informative)

BladeMelbourne (518866) | more than 10 years ago | (#6065927)

RedHat has apt-get support, although not out of the box.

http://shrike.freshrpms.net/rpm.html?id=393

Don't worry DebianTroll, I will try Debian soon... I have heard many great things about it. My modem connection only achieves 50.6 kbps maximum. I will try to get a copy of Debian 3.0r1 at the next Melbourne Linux User Group meeting.
http://www.mlug.org.au/

Mike

St Joan of Arc Information (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#6065736)

Catholic Encyclopedia - St. Joan of Arc:
http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/08409c.htm


Joan of Arc (1999/I) (TV)
http://us.imdb.com/Title?0178145

So many alternative products (-1, Flamebait)

XMichael (563651) | more than 10 years ago | (#6065737)

there are countless products just like this, many with countless more features take eyeball chat, totally free, does everything waist does + video chat (www.eyeballchat.com) theres also jabber, blah the list goes on and on why do people keep reinventing this whole instant messaging file transfer deal? am I missing something?

It's kinda First Class. . . (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#6065738)

on steroids?

first class [firstclass.com]

maybe, maybe not.

.deb packages for Winamp? (-1, Offtopic)

Debian Troll (676582) | more than 10 years ago | (#6065743)

Hi Fellow Debian Users, As a special 'thank you' to all the tireless community volunteers and developers who make Debian such a great Linux distribution, I would like to announce that I have made Winamp available as a Debian package. It is available for download from the Debian web site.

Please note however that this is in fact a Windows Win32 binary and you will not be able to install it on either Debian (because it's Linux) or Windows (because it doesn't support apt-get....yet).

Those following my progress closely will know that win-apt-get is not far from completion! Soon we shall all be able to enjoy the rich, unadulterated MP3 sounds of Winamp, the security and configurability of Windows, and the superior package management of apt-get. It's a great day to be a Debian user.

But... (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#6065744)

does it run linux?

Cool! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#6065755)

Its about time that we got something like this! Way to go guys!

Hope... (-1, Flamebait)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#6065765)

it doesn't suck as much as Winamp 3 and Wasabi did... (I mean they continued developing the 2.x series because of too many complaints...)

4 years later May 28th (5, Interesting)

Isosonys (589846) | more than 10 years ago | (#6065823)

Did nullsoft do this to thumb its nose at Aol? It was released May 28th 4 years after Aol paid a nice sum to buy Nullsoft.

I'll waste you... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#6065842)

Its now common to say "I'll PM you"... If this is a success we are soon going to hear things like "i'll waste you"

As for the "What's the point" question... (5, Interesting)

malakai (136531) | more than 10 years ago | (#6065853)

put on your conspiracy hats...

Think of it this way, these guys know probably better than anyone else NOT on the AOL IM team, just how much of IM conversations are monitored, logged, mined for information, media metrics...etc.

Not to mention, they work in that environment, they prolly want to be able to say "god damn, our executive VP is a bitch" and not have some network engineer provide a log documenting that conversation later.

Yeah, i wish it scalled, but wtf, its opensource. Go make it scale. For now, 10-50 is plenty for most groups of online friends.

Personally, I'd loved to see technology like Pastry [microsoft.com] get hacked into it.

-malakai

Full description of WASTE (0, Informative)

mrklin (608689) | more than 10 years ago | (#6065855)

Fresh from http://www.nullsoft.com/free/waste/:

WASTE is a software product and protocol that enables secure distributed communication for small (on the order of 10-50 nodes) trusted groups of users.

WASTE is designed to enable small companies and small teams within larger companies to easily communicate and collaborate in a secure and efficient fashion, independent of physical network topology.

Some bits of information about WASTE:

  • WASTE is currently available [slashdot.org] for 32-bit Windows operating systems, and as a limited functionality server for FreeBSD and MacOS X. Porting to other operating systems should be a breeze, as the source [slashdot.org] is provided (and the network code itself is pretty portable).
  • WASTE is licensed under the GPL [gnu.org].
  • WASTE currently provides the following services:
    • Instant Messaging (with presence)
    • Group Chat
    • File browsing/searching
    • File transfer (upload and download)
  • Network architecture: WASTE uses a distributed architecture that allows for nodes to connect in a partial mesh type network. Nodes on the network can broadcast and route traffic. Nodes that are not publicly accessible or on slow links can choose not to route traffic. This network is built such that all services utilize the network, so firewall issues become moot. more information [slashdot.org].
  • Security: WASTE uses link-level encryption to secure links, and public keys for authentication. RSA is used for session key exchange and authentication, and the links are encrypted using Blowfish in PCBC mode. The automatic key distribution security model is very primitive at the moment, and may not lend itself well to some social situations. more information [slashdot.org].

Linux port ? (4, Interesting)

theefer (467185) | more than 10 years ago | (#6065861)

How many minutes before we can see the first Linux port (it works under W$, FreeBSD and MacOS X) ?

Re:Linux port ? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#6065924)

Makefile.posix is included, so forget about "minutes".

AOL Time Warner... (4, Interesting)

tolarianacademy (580638) | more than 10 years ago | (#6065886)

...owns Nullsoft, (as already mentioned by leviramsy) but an interesting theory had been presented to me, suggesting that AOL Time Warner has for some time been planning to trump Apple's iTunes store. Maybe they are planning to power such a service with peer networking? I have never beleived this personally because AOL Time Warner would just as soon want to have everyone surfing from the same servers anyhow, and a decentralized system would only tax their bandwidth more. Maybe...maybe they will release such a service that utilizes both p2p transfers in combination with traditional server-to-client transfers, and maybe use it as an advertising platform for AOL, giving AOL users better functionality, or maybe even restricting server-to-client transfers to AOL users once the service becomes popular. Does anyone else think this idea is bogus? I find it hard to beleive, but I can't figure out how else Nullsoft could be /allowed/ to create this new service.

Grammar Nazi, alive and kicking (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#6065917)

features Instant Messanging and group chat

ahem, it's Messaging.. no N

Thank you, have a good day/evening
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