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iTunes Indie Meeting Notes

michael posted more than 11 years ago | from the reality-distortion dept.

Music 454

BWJones writes "The CD baby! site contains notes taken from the indie music meeting recently held at Apple. Interesting statistics revealed were that there are about 500k songs/week being downloaded from the iTunes Music store and that 45% of songs are being purchased as albums. Other interesting items of note are that Apple is treating everyone as equvalents in that all labels receive equal treatment with the same deal, the same agreements and you work with the same team of people. What's more is that Apple cuts a check EVERY MONTH which is huge for the smaller labels." Wired has another story about iTunes which notes that what Jobs taketh away, the community is bringing back.

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test post, plz ignore (-1, Offtopic)

Bold Marauder (673130) | more than 11 years ago | (#6133809)

testing test teste.

Re:test post, plz ignore (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#6133816)

It didn't work.

Re:test post, plz ignore (-1, Offtopic)

Bold Marauder (673130) | more than 11 years ago | (#6133834)

OK!!!THNX!!!

Wow... (-1, Offtopic)

Bold Marauder (673130) | more than 11 years ago | (#6133822)

I managed to get all over taht shizit without waking up the cat on my foot.

I @|\/| t3h 1337 CR@PF100d3R!!!

Suck it, trebek (-1)

Juan Epstein (238683) | more than 11 years ago | (#6133906)

You are not funny. Go back to fark.com, monkeytits.

Re:Suck it, trebek (-1)

613746 (613746) | more than 11 years ago | (#6133922)

What do you know, breastulous?

Go back to the docks...

Re:Suck it, trebek (-1)

Juan Epstein (238683) | more than 11 years ago | (#6133950)

Your mom's got dirty knees.

Re:Suck it, trebek (-1)

cyborg_monkey (150790) | more than 11 years ago | (#6134102)

You are such a cum guzzling queen...

Let me think of the appropriate level of concern.. (0, Redundant)

Bold Marauder (673130) | more than 11 years ago | (#6134005)

Fuck off. Or don't. Whatever.

mac problem (-1, Flamebait)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#6133818)

I don't want to start a holy war here, but what is the deal with you Mac fanatics? I've been sitting here at my freelance gig in front of a Mac (a 8600/300 w/64 Megs of RAM) for about 20 minutes now while it attempts to copy a 17 Meg file from one folder on the hard drive to another folder. 20 minutes. At home, on my Pentium Pro 200 running NT 4, which by all standards should be a lot slower than this Mac, the same operation would take about 2 minutes. If that.

In addition, during this file transfer, Netscape will not work. And everything else has ground to a halt. Even BBEdit Lite is straining to keep up as I type this.

I won't bore you with the laundry list of other problems that I've encountered while working on various Macs, but suffice it to say there have been many, not the least of which is I've never seen a Mac that has run faster than its Wintel counterpart, despite the Macs' faster chip architecture. My 486/66 with 8 megs of ram runs faster than this 300 mhz machine at times. From a productivity standpoint, I don't get how people can claim that the Macintosh is a superior machine.

Mac addicts, flame me if you'd like, but I'd rather hear some intelligent reasons why anyone would choose to use a Mac over other faster, cheaper, more stable systems.

Re:mac problem (1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#6133836)

First off, I don't have a mac. And yes, Macs used to suck. But they don't now. They are good now. The new ones are good. Still too expensive though.

Overall that's a troll (1, Interesting)

Andy Dodd (701) | more than 11 years ago | (#6133868)

But the above post describes a machine that could never run OS X.

OS9 and below sucked - They had an ancient core, I'm not surprised you had multitasking issues. OS X is lightyears ahead. OSX is one good reason that some people might choose a Mac.

And this article isn't about their hardware, it's about Apple's iTunes Music Store service. Which is currently Mac-only, and is enough to push some people "over the edge" and get a Mac. I know I've been VERY tempted to buy a used Mac just to be able to use the ITMS. (I'm currently a PC user myself, and going to stay that way unless Apple caters more to DIY types - yeah right.)

Re:Overall that's a troll (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#6133997)

> OS9 and below sucked - They had an ancient core, I'm not surprised you had multitasking issues.

Perhaps, but even Windows 95 (and probably Windows 3.1) could copy a 17MB file faster than 20 minutes :/

What took them so long to get that right?

Re:Overall that's a troll (1, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#6134002)

>>I'm currently a PC user myself, and going to stay that way unless Apple caters more to DIY types - yeah right.

If you're talking hardware, well, pretty much everybody uses serial or USB connections to fiddle with the machine these days--wirewrapping PCI cards just isn't practical now.

If you're talking software, well there's nothing to stop you from hacking in OS X. After all, you're talking FreeBSD utilities, the Darwin kernel, etc.

Seems like Apples are more conducive to DIY than a PC these days.

Re:mac problem (0, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#6133919)


[Pauses to put on troll feeding gloves]

Man, that is a slow computer - you were transfering that same file on that same computer a week ago when you posted. And then a week before that!

That's AMAZINGLY slow... or maybe you are... I dunno but I wish I could get paid "freelance" for sitting and constantly transfering a 17MB file back and forth - regardless of how long it might take...

HA! Like you have a job!

What was that one .sig that used to go something like, "A troll is person who after they find out nobody likes them - tries to make it seem intentional."

Re:mac problem (5, Informative)

Midnight Thunder (17205) | more than 11 years ago | (#6133996)

Okay I take the bait:

You are running an OS that was written 13 years before you bought your Mac and was updated with more and more features, meaning in many cases unoptimized bloat. I am guessing you are running MacOS 9, and this does not have many of the low-level features of a modern OS. The multi-tasking used by the OS is cooperative, so if one process hogs the CPU no other app gets a chance. Other things to take into account is that the OS has virtual memory (the OS doesn't differentiate between what is real and what isn't, when allocating memory) and not swap space, so this can also affect performance if you are trying to do a lot at once.

Windows NT on the other hand had a lot of new code and was essentially a new OS and was written with many of the modern features you would expect from an OS. I am not so sure Windows 95/98 would be performing as well on this machine. One thing you don't say is how much memory you have on that PC, since memory make a LOT of differnce.

MacOS X is the Apple's new OS and has plenty of modern facilities, which should make it fly. The problem is the eye candy and all the other GUI stuff which adds an extra load to the CPU. The OS is improving and is getting faster. In theory if MacOS X had the same GUI as MacOS 9 (in other words one which requires less processing), I am sure that you find it running fast ion the 8600.

Re:mac problem (1, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#6134040)

The problem is with the HFS file system. It uses B-trees which were optimized for small drives. Past 500 MB, every offset requires multiple multiplications (the PPC doesn't have native multiplication instruction). Furthermore, the new file has to be allocated block-by-block --- no preallocation like in windows 2k, or even win95.

BTW .. (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#6133821)

Where are the weapons of mass destruction?

Details pulled (1, Informative)

gerf (532474) | more than 11 years ago | (#6133824)

The details were pulled from the first link, before there's even one post. ya'rg! Anyone happen to have visited before he pulled the info?

Re:Details pulled (-1, Insightful)

johnatjohnytech (632978) | more than 11 years ago | (#6133843)

nope

Re:Details pulled (3, Informative)

ablair (318858) | more than 11 years ago | (#6133862)


As always, good old MacSurfer [macsurfer.com] toi the rescue with a link to the Gnutella News story [gnutellanews.com] .

Lots of interesting details; it looks like Apple is being fair and genuinely trying to help out independent artists as much as possible.

No independant artists (4, Informative)

thefinite (563510) | more than 11 years ago | (#6133874)

One interesting note I remember from reading it: No independant artists. You have to come in through one of the independant labels. Apple pays the label. The label pays you.

Independ*E*nt (1, Offtopic)

thefinite (563510) | more than 11 years ago | (#6133896)

Gosh, I am a dope. Now it will be interesting to see if I get modded down for correcting my *own* spelling.

Re:No independant artists (2, Interesting)

Smitty825 (114634) | more than 11 years ago | (#6133981)

I'm willing to bet we will see that change now that Pearl Jam [msnbc.com] has announced they will be independant!

Re:No independant artists (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#6134126)

Pearl Jam has a label -- themselves.


By independent, they mean johny one-note who records a demo or sells self-produced cds out of the back of his van (that he also lives in).


Apple would rather write a check to the label for 100 cds than 100 checks to the artists for 1 cd.

Re:No independant artists (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#6134041)

And the indie labels are by invitation only: if you have a tiny label with just a couple of artists (like my friend's label, on which I'm signed as a writer, BMI and all), you have to cozy up to one of the approved indies.

Re:No independant artists (4, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#6134093)

Honestly, I'll bet this is just stage 2 in terms of getting content onboard. They're really still in the middle of stage 1 with the major labels, as much of their more obscure content has yet to be added. In stage 2, they get 100+ of the bigger indie labels onboard. Once that's all going smoothly, they can attack stage 3, getting the smaller indies. After lessons learned from all of this, maybe they can start thinking about dealing with small time artists directly. Maybe.

In any case, baby steps. And they've got a lot of other shit going on too -- iTunes for Windows and getting the labels onboard for that (whole different ballgame), international store and all the licensing issues, etc. This is a big, big job but so far Apple is doing everything right. Let's see where this thing is in another year or so. It won't happen overnight.

Re:No independant artists (2, Insightful)

jc42 (318812) | more than 11 years ago | (#6134073)

So you set up your own privately-held corporation to record your own music. This is quite legal in most countries. Then Apple pays your corporation, and your corporation pays you a pittance. (This will help convince your government's tax agencies that it's a real recording company. ;-) And only your "profits" are taxed.

I think I'll go register as a corporation this afternoon ...

full article in case of dashslotting (4, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#6133882)

Cd Baby reports on itunes meeting re: indy music.
Posted by leflaw on June 6, 2003 at 7:44 AM EDT
Apple iTunes + independent music

I got an invitation to go to Apple's office for a presentation/meeting today (June 5, 2003) about how to get independent artists into the iTunes Music Store. There were about 150 people there, representatives from the best independent record labels and music services, in this invitation-only conference room. Steve Jobs came out and started a two and a half hour presentation/seminar/Q&A about iTunes and the benefits of independent labels making their music available there. I type fast and had my laptop, so I wrote down all the major points of their presentation as they went.

NOTE: I've skipped the super-basic introduction to iTunes and what it does, because that can be found so many other places. This is the stuff that I felt was most important to musicians:
The basics

* The basics of iTunes Music Store are covered in many places, so if you haven't used iTunes Music store yet, read these links first:
* Apple's iTunes Music Store website.
* Great video showing the service.
* NOTE: iTunes is not a website! It can only be accessed from the iTunes software run on Mac OS X (now) and Windows (by the end of the year.)
* I highly suggest trying it for yourself. If you don't have a Mac, use a friend's. Enter your credit card info and actually buy a song. Tell it to store your info for future purchases. Buy a few more songs with the one-click system. I'm serious. You should try it yourself to really experience how amazingly cool it is.
* They're using a DRM called Fairplay to make sure you can't put these songs on the internet and have them play on another player.

Current Stats:

* There are 6-7 million copies of iTunes in use.
* 3.5 million songs sold so far. Selling about 500,000 songs a week now.
* More than 75% of songs have sold at least once. There is a wide breadth in purchasing. This is not only fueled by hits.
* 45% of all songs have been bought as an album. In other words: don't worry about the death of the album format. 45% of people prefer to buy as an album anyway, even though they always have the option to only buy per-song.
* 90% of sales are 1-click downloads. (1-click is where customer has credit card stored on file, so that as soon as they click a song title, it starts downloading and their credit card is automatically charged.)
* 10 previews (free 30 second listen) for every purchase. Meaning: 10 listens per buy.

Price of music on iTunes

* Songs must be 99 cents each.
* Full albums are recommended to be $9.99 or lower.
* Album price must be less than or equal to the sum of their tracks. So if you have a 5-song album, it can't be more than $4.95 to buy the full-length album.
* Apple strongly recommends going even lower than $9.99. They'd like to see that price drop to make the full-album purchase even more desirable.
* Only exception: if a song is over 7 minutes long, they won't offer it as a separate download. It will be available as part of the album only.
* There is no cost to put your music on iTunes.
* There will be no up-front advance from Apple.
* Details on the wholesale price to the label will be mailed to us, later.

Sales report to SoundScan

* Apple is reporting all iTunes sales to SoundScan!
* SoundScan measures per-song not per-album.
* So if someone buys your whole album, each track on the album is reported as a song sale.
* SoundScan requested to do it that way. It was their idea, not Apple's.

About positioning and getting attention on iTunes

* Apple has hired an editorial staff with backgrounds in music to decide what gets featured.
* Editorial team makes decisions every day as to what goes where.
* Big labels don't get preferential treatment.
* "We pick music we like, and we think everyone else is going to like."
* "We've had a lot of people offer money", but Apple refuses money, and has no plan to ever accept money for placement.
* Even what looks like a banner ad at the top of the screen is put there by Apple.
* When an audience member doubted they'd stay with this policy, they pointed to their 20 years of selling Apple computers, and never selling icons on the desktop or any of the other things that companies have offered to pay them a lot of money to do.
* (Plus Steve Jobs reminded us they have $41 billion in the bank and are not in debt. They're not desparate for cash.)
* They did admit that when a popular artist gives iTunes exclusive tracks, that may prompt Apple to make a banner an on iTunes promoting it.
* New releases sell really well.
* Exclusive tracks (songs that aren't available on CD anywhere) sell amazingly well. They're the best sellers in whole store.
* Occasionally they make a special featured artist page, with video, photos, a link back to the artist's site, and more. It seems this is just for very high-profile artists, though.
* Top-seller charts on Apple only reflect the last 24 hours. (IDEA FOR INDIES: get all your friends to buy at once!)
* Here's the iTunes info about browsing and searching.

What you CAN'T do

* You can not sell an album as album-only format without allowing the purchase of single-songs.
* Can't search by record label, although you can see the record label on the album info page.
* There will be no links from iTunes to your website, or to buy the physical CD.
* Right now there are no sub-genres, only big genres. (rock/jazz/etc.)

About the deal to independents

* They said "We're going to give you the same basic deal we gave the big 5 major labels".
* Same deal. Same agreements. Same team of people. Same treatment, all-around.
* "We have to be more efficient, though. We're not going to deal with 200 lawyers."
* "Everyone is going to get the exact same deal. It's not negotiable. It's take it or leave it."
* This is a reseller agreement: Apple buys at a wholesale price. Apple resells them to users. "No complicated or messy licenses."
* Apple only deals with the partner/label. It's up to the label to pay the artists, writers, publishing, etc.
* Rights are a 3 year term. For iTunes only, of course. This is totally non-exclusive.
* THEY PAY EVERY MONTH!
* IMPORTANT: the details will be mailed to me soon. They haven't named specific amounts yet. Instead, they had us sign a contract request form, and they'll mail the contract to us. That's when I'll know more.

EVERY artist in the store gets...

* listed in new releases
* found in searches (any search returns up to 250 songs for that artist)
* in the "browse all artists" list (the text-based view)
* an artist page (page showing all CDs by this artist, top downloaded songs, top downloaded albums, also bought...)
* an album page: artwork, song list, top downloads, references to other artists
* listed in cross-references to other albums ("people who bought this also bought...")

Marketing and Promotion

* 10 million customers have opted-in to receive a "New Music" email from Apple every Tuesday. Customers of iPod, iTunes, .mac, Apple eNews.
* You can have a link directly on your site to point to your music on iTunes. (Of course the link will only work for people who have the iTunes software.)
* Google has exclusive discounts for sponsored links into iTunes. Plus some personalized support.
* Macs in 57 Apple retail stores are pre-loaded with playlists called, "Discover Indie Music". A chance at in-store play.

How to get the music to Apple

* It's up to the partner/label to submit all the metadata (artist name, release date, song tiles, etc.), do the audio encoding, and upload the materials.
* Every album needs to have a UPC Barcode!
* You have to use their special Music Store Encoder tool for Mac OS X which will be released in 90 days or so.
* Independent artists themselves, not with a label, can't use this. You have to go through an iTunes partner.
* When asked if artists with their own label would be eligible, the iTunes guys had an odd answer, saying that this was invitation-only and they want to deal with those of us in the room.
* (CD Baby will be an iTunes partner, and will be glad to do the submission and be your pipeline into iTunes, if we can.)

Apple Does:

* Marketing & merchandising
* Advertising, PR, Retail, Direct
* 30-second Previews
* Infrastructure of download & delivery
* Credit card transaction

That's all we know for now!

Re:Details pulled (2, Interesting)

themanwhoknowsmostth (656214) | more than 11 years ago | (#6133883)

Shamelessly copied and pasted from MacSlash [macslash.org] :

Derek Sivers, president of CD Baby and Hostbaby, attended yesterday's meeting between Apple representatives and about 150 indie label produces and executives and has posted his notes online from the meeting. Some of the highlights include a link to the fairplay website, which apple has said it's using for DRM, and the fact that Apple reports iTunes Music Store sales to SoundScan. Apple also told producers that they would not sell ad space to record labels and that all store content is done by Apple editors. Additionally, Apple promised to treat the indie labels the same as the big five, with the "same treatment, all-around."

Patriotic Details for Bush et al.: +20, Patriotic (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#6134135)


Thank you Senator Byrd [senate.gov] for your patriotism through challenging
the Bush regime [whitehouse.org]

Cheers,
W00t

Cmdr. Taco eats horse pussy (-1)

(TK2)Dessimat0r (669581) | more than 11 years ago | (#6133827)

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I don't know which was faster... (4, Funny)

pcaylor (648195) | more than 11 years ago | (#6133832)

I don't know which was faster, the information about the iTunes store on the CDBaby site being pulled or the obligatory post about how slow it is to copy files on an 8600/300.

See Gnutella News (5, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#6133840)

Here [gnutellanews.com]

Re:See Gnutella News (1)

rkz (667993) | more than 11 years ago | (#6133909)

Mod up! Full details on the link mr AC posted!

Who saw this coming? (0, Flamebait)

arcite (661011) | more than 11 years ago | (#6133914)

I mean really, who could have realistically predicted this would happen a year ago? Apple, snobby uppity en vogue computer company who makes shiny, sexy, expensive computers..... now stands to build a new empire built on selling music online. I mean really. I never saw it coming! Mac user 4 ever :)

Re:Who saw this coming? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#6134054)

Its post like this that reaffirm my hatred of you mac users. :P

No. Apple cuts a cheque... (-1, Troll)

ashitaka (27544) | more than 11 years ago | (#6133841)

As in, there should be checks and balances to avoid people spelling cheques wrong.

I know, I know, it's the AMERICAN WAY!!!!

It's still wrong.

Looks like Apple got e-music right, though.

Re:No. Apple cuts a cheque... (1)

ablair (318858) | more than 11 years ago | (#6133895)

I second that. There's already enough confusion in the language without having to decipher things like "Check checked checks" using this spelling of the word "cheque".

Re:No. Apple cuts a cheque... (2, Funny)

_xeno_ (155264) | more than 11 years ago | (#6133935)

Actually... if you look at check [m-w.com] 's entimology:

Middle English chek, from Middle French eschec

Seems to suggest that "check" is the correct modern spelling and that people writing "cheque [m-w.com] " are just weird, or "chiefly British."

Besides, incorrect spelling is one of the cornerstones of Slashdot, like incorrect grammer. (How many people will catch that, I wonder?) Complaining about it is so passé.

Re:No. Apple cuts a cheque... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#6133939)

Why is it wrong? There are no rules to spelling. Correct spelling determined by understanding and social acceptance. If one society spells it differently then fine but you can not say it is wrong.

Re:No. Apple cuts a cheque... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#6133941)

Check is the correct spelling in American English. Just like color. It really is that simple. If you don't like it, bitch at Benjamin Franklin, he de-moronized the King's English.

Re:No. Apple cuts a cheque... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#6134018)

Cheque is a British spelling. The American spelling is check. It is no more wrong than color, meter, or analyze is. Face the fact that British and American have two different orthographies, and that sometimes it is American that is more conservative, and sometimes it is British that is more conservative. (For instance, -ize is more conservative than -ise, because it comes from the Greek -izo).

Re:No. Apple cuts a cheque... (2, Informative)

UnknowingFool (672806) | more than 11 years ago | (#6134027)

The difference between check and cheque is the same between color and colour, humor and humour, authorize and authorise. The spelling is different especially on differnt sides of the Atlantic. If the person writing the article is American, it's not wrong.

Appeasement of labels (3, Interesting)

Gossy (130782) | more than 11 years ago | (#6133842)

Perhaps the record labels had a problem with the streaming, and so Apple pulled it - expecting that someone would just hack their code to bring it back.

What with all the fuss about internet radio and royalty fees, it's not too far fetched that the record companies didn't like people legitimately streaming the songs they had legitimately purchased.

IIRC, Tivo & others have similar hidden features that the masses are unaware of that would probably annoy the TV companies if it were publicised.

Re:Appeasement of labels (2, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#6133871)

Apple's claim is that they do not have an attitude of trying to prevent piracy people who are going to pirate music in any case. What they want to avoid is having their software being used for extremely easy piracy. So once someone sets up a web service to aggregate all iTunes collections on the planet, they modified that feature.

Keeping honest people honest and not worrying about pirates seems to be their strategy.

Re:Appeasement of labels (1)

mjmalone (677326) | more than 11 years ago | (#6134052)

What "hidden features" are there in TiVo?

Re:Appeasement of labels (2, Informative)

Palshife (60519) | more than 11 years ago | (#6134087)

Apple never promised the feature that was taken out of iTunes 4.0. It was made clear in the license agreement as to what would be possible. The feature was an oversight, a bug, that was corrected in 4.1. Apple had to pull it because it wasn't supposed to be there in the first place.

Cool! (4, Funny)

American AC in Paris (230456) | more than 11 years ago | (#6133845)

Wired has another story about iTunes which notes that what Jobs taketh away, the community is bringing back.

I saw a similar story yesterday on a popular community-driven geek news website. [slashdot.org]

You should check it out sometime!

DONT BOTHER (4, Informative)

jayteedee (211241) | more than 11 years ago | (#6133846)

All the details have been pulled and the following remark inserted:

"And yes, sorry, there used to be more details here. I didn't realize yesterday's presentation was supposed to be confidential. When I found out, I pulled the details. Honest mistake."

details have been pulled (4, Insightful)

dbrutus (71639) | more than 11 years ago | (#6133847)

I think that Apple's setting itself up as an honest broker of web services in order to try to stay out of Apple Record's crosshairs. If Apple starts preferring one store above another, one label above another, it can be more realistically be claimed to be in the business and thus afoul of its previous corporate commitments. If what they're doing is just providing a deal for the labels to have their content distributed on Apple's web services platform, it's much more arguable that they're in the music business at all.

Album sales (4, Insightful)

DetrimentalFiend (233753) | more than 11 years ago | (#6133849)

They say that 45% of the songs are purchased as albums as if itâ(TM)s a great accomplishment, but doesnâ(TM)t that mean that very few transactions are actually albums? For example, if there were about 10 songs per CD, then doesnâ(TM)t that mean that about 5% of all transactions are for an album. Or, in other words, only one out of every 20 purchases is for an album? Personally, I donâ(TM)t find this surprising, but I donâ(TM)t think that itâ(TM)s anything to be too excited over.

Re:Album sales (1)

grahams (5366) | more than 11 years ago | (#6133892)

But in the grand scheme of things Apple makes more money off people buying individual songs vs. people buying whole albums (assuming said album is longer than 10 tracks)

Re:Album sales (2, Insightful)

antibryce (124264) | more than 11 years ago | (#6133901)

They say that 45% of the songs are purchased as albums as if itâ(TM)s a great accomplishment, but doesnâ(TM)t that mean that very few transactions are actually albums?


That's on of the points of the iTMS. I don't need to buy the entire album just to hear the 1 or 2 songs I like.

Re:Album sales (1)

krisp (59093) | more than 11 years ago | (#6133921)

I think it is written in a confusing manner. However, I think what the author was trying to say was that 45% of all purchaces are albums, which are 10 songs or so for something around $17. The other 55% are individual songs.

Re:Album sales (5, Insightful)

Jucius Maximus (229128) | more than 11 years ago | (#6133977)

"They say that 45% of the songs are purchased as albums as if itâ(TM)s a great accomplishment, but doesnâ(TM)t that mean that very few transactions are actually albums? ... Personally, I donâ(TM)t find this surprising, but I donâ(TM)t think that itâ(TM)s anything to be too excited over."

It *is* something to be proud of. It is a legitimate, measurable proof with the sales figures to back it up that the traditional channels of music distribution are obsolete and the RIAA should get its head out of the sand and stop trying to prevent evolution.

I'm too young to remember it, but I'm told that the music industry went ape when DAT came out and cassette tapes as well because they would cause rampant piracy resulting in an industry collapse. The fact that most songs are purchased as SINGLE ITEMS makes it very easy to prove what we have known all along: The RIAA was wrong once again. Per-song media-less distribution will not cause industry collapse. People want to be able to get the one track for a small price over the internet - not a whole CD with 12 filler tracks and one good track.

Re:Album sales (1)

A Naughty Moose (672032) | more than 11 years ago | (#6134001)

Another possibility is: The iTunes store has 500,000 sales each week, of which 45% are albums. Or in other words: They are selling about 225,000 albums and and 275,000 singles each week.

Re:Album sales [will quickly fall off] (3, Funny)

DataSquid (33187) | more than 11 years ago | (#6134033)

It's my prediction that they'll start seeing album sales drop rapidly as people finish "switching" their music collection to the new format. Once you've got all your old vinyl in AAC, you'll probably not want to risk the $10 on a new, untested album.

Re:Album sales [will quickly fall off] (1, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#6134066)

But with previewing before buying it won't be a new untested album.... that's part of the beauty of it

Read all of this first (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#6133854)

Allison felt a hot flutter in her belly as Jeff's hand eased down
from her waist and slid onto her bottom. She stiffened slightly, looking
around, but nobody seemed to notice.
They were just walking along, on their way home from a basketball
game, she and Jeff, Molly, Peter, Mike, and Evan. It was dark. The
streetlights were few and far between and few of the houses along the
street had their lights on. It was hot, and she was sweating a little,
trying to keep cool by not moving much.
Up ahead Peter and Mike were wrestling on someone's front lawn as
Evan shouted encouragement and Molly looked on.
Jeff's fingers squeezed in against her soft buttocks and he turned
and kissed her lightly. She kissed him back, feeling his lips between
hers as she nibbled on him.
She felt her breasts swelling under her loose white T-shirt and
squeezed her pussy muscles together as Jeff's hand slid slowly up and
down the cleft between her rounded buttocks, rubbing her through her jeans.
She flicked a lock of blonde hair out of her face and smiled, her
soft, full lips parting to reveal gleaming white teeth. A car passed and
she looked away, a little embarrassed.
But there was a limit as to how much she could do with him anyway,
and when his hand slid lower, his fingers easing beneath her buttocks
and over her pussy mound she pulled slowly back with a look of reproof.
It wasn't as if they had even dated or anything, and even though
she wasn't in high school any more and would be back to college in a
couple of weeks she didn't want tales told about her.
She moved forward beside Molly, and Jeff jumped on Evan, bearing
him to the ground alongside the other two. She and Molly exchanged
glances and shrugs.
Molly was her best friend. The two of them were a lot alike in many
ways. They were the same age, had roughly the same taste in men,
clothes, music and food.
They had similar hairstyles, straight, a little below the
shoulders, and parted in the middle. The difference was that Molly's
hair was a bit thicker, and was a deep reddish brown in colour. She also
had bangs. Allison was a golden blonde, and her hair usually looked just
a bit more mussed, a bit less precisely brushed than Molly's.
They were both of average height, though Allison was an inch or two
taller, and both had athletic bodies. They had trim, firm, flat bellies,
flaring hips, round, firm buttocks and nicely sculpted legs.
Molly had bigger breasts, and they were rounder, but Allison's
breasts were good sized and firmer, her small pink nipples actually
sticking slightly upwards in a way that made all the girls in the shower
at college jealous. They were, the girls agreed, the perfect shape.
She had won the unofficial title of best breasts during one shower
session after volleyball, much to Molly's amusement. Molly had come in
second.
"Come on, you guys," Molly sighed.
"Yeah, knock it off," Allison said. "What are you, children?"
Evan pulled himself away from Jeff with a grunt and stood up, hair
tousled. "Hey," he said. "Why are we wrestling with each other when we
should be wrestling with... the girls!"
He leered at them and stalked forward.
"Go away, Evan," Molly sighed, backing up as she eyed him warily.
Instead he growled, then lunged forward. She squealed and turned to
run but he caught her around the waist and lifted her up into the air,
swinging her around.
Then before she could move Jeff rushed Allison, bending low and
grabbing her around the waist. She screamed as he hefted her up and
lifted her over his shoulder, turning around and around.
"Put me down!" she yelled.
"Me got wo-man!" he growled like a cave man, staggering around.
He slapped her bottom and she yelled, kicking at him. He set her
down heavily and she fell down, glaring up at him.
"Dick head," she said, getting to her feet. Just that small burst
of activity had made her start to sweat. She rubbed her hand across her
forehead and found it moist.
They wandered further down the street, and into a kind of park.
Well, in truth it was a large grassy area surrounded by townhouses. But
it was dark, and there was a little playground there with swings, monkey
bars, and a slide.
A couple of the guys started climbing on the monkey bars, and she
managed to get over with Jeff alone. They climbed up on the swing and
sat up there necking for a few minutes. He managed to grope her breasts
a few times, but she pushed his hand down each time.
Then Peter said he had to get home because he had to work the next
day, and Mike said yeah it was too fuckin' hot to be hanging around out
here anyway. Jeff didn't have a job but Molly did and decided she should
go. Allison didn't think she ought to stay with Jeff and Evan alone. She
didn't know them that well and her reputation could suffer even if
nothing happened. Anyway, Mike was right, it was too fucking hot.
So she joined Molly, and Evan and Jeff followed along for a few
blocks. Then they turned off because Evan wanted to go to a Seven-Eleven
and get a coke.
"So what'd you think of Jeff?" Molly grinned when they were alone.
"He's okay," she said with a grin.
"You guys were making out pretty good," the brunette smiled as they
walked along.
"Yeah. I was getting really horny," Allison confided with a
hesitant grin.
"Yeah, me too. Evan and Peter were both groping me whenever they
could. Pigs."
"Pigs," Allison agreed.
Then they both giggled.
"Oh I hate this," Allison sighed. "How come the guys can do
whatever they want but we have to be good little girls and always say no?"
"Because otherwise everyone'll call us sluts."
"I would really like... promise you won't tell anyone?"
Molly nodded.
"I would really have liked to just throw Jeff down and tear his
clothes off back there," she said.
Molly shrugged and smiled. "Yeah but we can't. At least, not until
September. You going to go out with him?"
"Soon as he asks me."
"I hate being a virgin," Molly sighed.
"Hey, it's worse for me. I've had sex and I miss it!"
They both giggled.
"You know what book I got? I ordered it from a Barnes and Noble
catalogue. Only cost seven bucks."
"What?"
"The Kama Sutra."
"What's that about?"
"God, Allie, you're such a virgin!"
"Oh, look who's talking!"
"It's a book about sex, you know, like all kinds of kinky stuff.
Everything you ever imagined and more about sex."
"Cool. Can I read it?"
"Yeah, when I'm done. It has some really strange stuff in it."
"You get hot reading it?" Allison teased.
"Yeah," Molly admitted, blushing a little. "It has, like, drawing
and stuff. Really hot."
"Don't let your mother find it."
"Don't worry. It's hidden really well."
The area they were passing through was all townhouses. There were
anything from two to five houses in blocks with a lot of common green
space between them. Molly eased off the walkway and she and Allison sat
back on the back of a wooden bench.
"I want go wild and rape a bunch of guys," Molly sighed.
"Slut."
"I mean it," Allison pouted. "I want to do wild and slutty things.
I want to... to, gang bang the football team or something!"
"Right. I'll put an ad in the paper."
"Haven't you ever wanted to do wild things like that? I mean, here
we are two hot sexy girls and our lives are boring as hell. Half the men
in this city would go crazy for just the sight of us naked and we spend
every night alone. It's crazy!"
"You want to hear something?" Molly asked in a low voice. "You have
to promise never ever ever to tell anyone, ever."
"Okay, okay. What?"
"I'll never speak to you again if you do."
"I won't tell. What is it?"
Molly looked a little flushed. She looked around them at the empty
dark area and the lights twinkling from nearby houses.
"I cut a page out of one of my brother's dirty magazines and I
ordered something."
"What?"
"A dildo."
Allison's eyes got huge and her jaw dropped, then she cupped her
hand over her face to smother her laughter.
"You're kidding!?" she laughed when she could talk.
"No."
"What does it... look like?"
"It looks like a cock, Allie. What do you think?"
"God!" She laughed in delight.
"It's really kind of neat. It looks just like one."
"Oh how would you know, virgin?"
Molly punched her lightly.
"So what do you do with it?"
Then her eyes got wide again and she blushed.
"You uh..."
"Yes, Allie. I'm sure you know I jerk off. I know you do too."
"Well..."
Allison looked down, blushing.
"I just... well..you like, put it inside?" she asked.
"Yeah."
"Yech."
"Why yech? It's cleaner than a real one."
"Well, yeah but... I don't know."
She was silent for a minute.
"That's kind of wicked," Allison said finally. "Maybe I should get
one."
"Then you could compare it to the real thing and tell me the
difference," Molly said with a grin.
"Sure." She sighed heavily. "You know, I wanted to do such
really... wicked things my first year at college, and I hardly did
anything."
"You fucked Jason and that other guy, Myles."
"So big deal," Allison said derisively. "I wanted to do, like,
really sordid stuff, stuff that'd make my mother's hair go gray if she
ever found out."
"Like what, gang bang the football team?"
"Yeah!"
"Allie!"
"Well, maybe not that in particular but.. you know, really wild
things."
"Like fucking yourself with a dildo?"
Allison blushed. "No, not... exactly."
"You think I'm sick?"
"No," Allison said. "I mean, well... I guess if we can't, like...
do it with guys it's sort of the next best thing. I mean, like,
masturbating is normal, right, so..."
"I could, like, tell you where to order one."
"No way! I mean, if my parents found it I'd die. I'd just die."
"Just bring it to school."
"Oh right, and my roommate finds it. Anyway, I don't need one at
school. There I can fuck guys without everyone finding out about it."
"It's really... something. I mean, the feeling is..."
"I know."
"It's way better than..you know, just your fingers."
"Molly!" she gasped.
"Well... it is. I mean, well, how do you...you know, do it?"
"Never mind!"
"I was just...wondering is all."
Both of them were embarrassed, but both were also finding the
conversation extremely fascinating, and arousing too. Allison found she
was sweating again, and rubbed at her forehead.
"I kind of... well, usually on my side and I use my panties, kind
of... rub them against me, you know?"
"You never... put anything inside?"
"No. I mean, my finger sometimes but... Do you...always put...well,
I guess you... use that..."
"Yeah. I used to use my hairbrush, the handle."
Allison could not keep from picturing Molly pushing her hairbrush
into her pussy. It made her squirm a little in embarrassment and also...
excitement. The whole conversation was kinky and kind of thrilling.
"The dildo is a lot better," Molly confided in a low voice.
"Man," Allison said, shaking her head slowly, thinking of Molly
with some plastic cock.
"Once I went out into my back yard and did it," Molly gulped.
"What? God! What if you got caught?"
"It was dark, and... well, I was so... horny from being naked
outside. I just felt this huge electrical shock. I came like crazy. I
thought I'd go insane."
"I went skinny dipping in the pool once at school. I know what you
mean. I felt incredibly horny, and I was only with girls not guys."
They were silent for a few moments, various images playing through
their minds.
"Allison?"
"Yeah?"
"Have you ever... thought about, like... doing it with a... like,
messing around with a.... girl?"
Allison turned to her, startled, and suddenly embarrassed.
"No I... well... I mean... not since... you know... since we...
uhm, did that..."
Molly nodded, looking down.
There had been a TV show a couple of years ago. On it two teenage
girls had kissed just to see what it was like. It had caused a huge fuss
in the papers with all the religious freaks screaming and everything.
Molly had been staying over at Allison's house that night, and
after seeing the show the two had experimented briefly, just kissing a
little. They'd been younger then, and hadn't really even known much
about what sex was.
They'd giggled like crazy and stopped almost at once.
"It's just that I was thinking," Molly said. "Well, like, it was
too bad that... you know... like girls, well, couldn't... have a little
fun without boys because, well we wouldn't have to worry about... you
know... anything, like getting pregnant or... one of us telling or
anything like that."
"Well I guess but... I'm not gay or anything," Allison said,
blushing furiously.
"Well I'm not either!" Molly exclaimed.
"Well I mean, you donâ(TM)t have to, you know... be gay I think."
"You don't. You could just... play around... for fun, you know. You
never... wonder what it's... like?"
"No. I mean, not... really."
"There were lots of pictures in my brother's magazines of these
women doing it together. It looked really... well... hot."
"How do they... do it? I mean, they don't... have... you know."
"Well, there's more to sex than just... intercourse."
"Oh right. The virgin telling me that. I'm the one who's had sex,
remember."
Allison looked away, embarrassed, her insides churning with strange
feelings and sensations. She was embarrassed because it seemed like
Molly was suggesting they... do it. Allison wasn't at all sure how to
react to that. She loved Molly like a sister, of course, and trusted
her, but...
She hadn't ever really given any thought to doing it with a girl.
Lesbians did it together, but she had no idea how. And of course that
was fine, that they wanted to do it with each other. But she wasn't a
lesbian, and she hadn't thought Molly was either.
Of course, nowadays you didnâ(TM)t have to be. A lot of girls sort of
hinted that they had - dabbled - with other girls. It was even quite
fashionable at college to say you were bisexual.
But the whole idea was like, totally weird and bizarre.
At the same time she was still feeling excited from their intimate
conversation, and from her recent groping and making out with Jeff.
She turned her head slowly to find Molly looking at her, her eyes
wide and looking a little anxious and worried. Allison was suddenly
aware of her friend's warm shoulder pressed against her own. She looked
into her eyes, feeling her guts start to churn more violently.
"Want to... just... see... what it feels like...to kiss I mean?"
Molly whispered.
"I... someone might..."
She looked around at the darkness around them, her breathing
becoming heavier as her heart pounded.
"Nobody will see us," Molly said softly.
Molly half turned to her, leaning forward. Allison felt her heart
pound faster, felt herself starting to sweat. She looked away again,
making sure nobody was near, then looked back. She felt a tingling in
her loins, a hot, moist ache.
Molly's lips got closer and closer, then they met hers ever so
lightly. They kissed for a second before pulling back. Both of them were
breathing heavier. Allison swallowed nervously while Molly licked her lips.
Then the brunette leaned forward again and pressed her lips much
more firmly against the blonde girl. She opened her mouth slightly, and
Allison felt her tongue sliding along her lips. Their lips pressed
together in hesitant exploration, and their breathing spilled from one
mouth to the other.
Molly turned fully against her then, slipping off the back of the
bench, her arms going over Allison's shoulders as her tongue pushed
slightly forward into her mouth.
Their breasts pushed together, the soft flesh mashing much more
heavily than it had a couple of years ago when they'd been younger.
Allison felt the heat of the other girl's breasts through the thin
fabric of their blouses, felt her own breasts swelling, her nipples
already hard and erect.
She was breathless with shock and heat and excitement, feeling as
though she was doing something terribly forbidden and sluttish. She
slowly brought her arms around her friend, her hands going onto her back
and feeling her radiating heat as she was herself.
The kiss seemed to go on and on and on, with Molly beginning to
slide her lips from side to side, her body rubbing ever so gently
against Allison. Allison tentatively moved her hands up and down Molly's
back as her belly bubbled and steamed with sexual excitement.
Their breasts continued to mash and grind slowly together. Allison
felt the pressure inside her warm breasts swelling higher and higher,
threatening to explode, felt the heat, felt trickles of sweat in her
cleavage as their tongues slipped around each other and their lips
caressed each other.
"God!" Molly gasped, pulling back with wide, hot eyes, her chest
heaving.
"Yeah!" Allison panted, sweating heavily now even though she hadn't
moved, her heart pounding, the blood racing through her body.
She was almost trembling with the sexual excitement inside her. She
put her arms around Molly and pulled her in close again, their breasts
squeezing together as their lips met in soft, hungry embrace.
Allison's hands stroked up and down Molly's back, then, daringly,
shockingly, giving in to impulse, slid lower, down past her waist, over
her round buttocks, squeezing them through the denim miniskirt the other
girl wore.
Molly moaned softly, almost a sob, and one of her hands came up
between them. Allison let out a soft gasp of shocked pleasure as she
felt it push up against her breast, cupping and squeezing her gently,
then more firmly.
Her mind was reeling as the sexual pressure rolled over her in
waves. She felt Molly's hand grasp at her shirt, yanking it up out of
her pants, then felt the brunette's small hand sliding up her belly and
move behind her to unsnap her bra.
She groaned, dazed, overpowered by the need inside her, almost
intoxicated with it as Molly cupped her bare breast, moist, sweating
hand moving over hot, slick breast, stroking and squeezing.
Allison's hands rubbed up and down against the other girl's bottom,
squeezing and kneading the warm flesh. She tugged at the hem, pulling it
higher and higher, then felt the zipper that ran down the side, along
the hip.
Feeling a little shockwave of excitement at the thought, she found
the zipper and slowly pulled it up, higher... higher... higher, until it
was right at the waist. Then she undid the button there and Molly's
skirt dropped off her.
Molly panted with excitement, gripping Allison's shirt with both
hands now, pulling it roughly upwards.
Allison couldn't believe she was doing this, couldn't believe they
were doing this at all, let alone out in a public field with windows all
around. But she let her arms rise, let the shirt pull over her shoulders
and off. She felt a crackle of sexual electricity wash over her as the
shirt dropped off.
Molly yanked her open bra off and Allison was naked to the waist,
her nipples so hard they hurt, sexual fever roaring like a freight train
inside her.
Molly cupped her breasts tightly as they kissed, and Allison's
hands slid onto her bottom, squeezing it through the thin string bikini
panties. She rubbed her hands over the round buttocks, fingers gripping
at the lower edges of the panties, pulling them up until they were
wedged into her girlfriend's crack.
Molly's breathing was rough and ragged as she pulled her lips back.
Her head jerked down and her lips slid over one of Allison's nipples.
The blonde almost screamed as she felt her friend's tongue on her
nipple, and clutched her tight, shaking and trembling as the girl
started sucking.
"Oh God!" she said in a strangled croak. "Oh God! Oh! Oohh! Oh
Molly! Oh God!"
Allison's mind reeled and her breast threatened to explode as her
girlfriend sucked passionately at her hard, aching nipple. She shook and
trembled, her hands running feverishly through Molly's hair.
Molly raised her head, their lips meeting with bruising force,
their tongues sliding together, twisting and turning as their breasts
rubbed and pillowed against each other.
Molly's hand slid down to cup Allison's groin through her jeans.
She squeezed repeatedly as Allison gurgled and moaned and bucked
desperately against her.
Then Allison shuddered violently, grasping her girlfriend tightly
as her head fell back and she gurgled in wondrous pleasure.
Molly rubbed and squeezed her puss furiously, her other hand
squeezing one of Allison's breasts, fingers digging deeply into the soft
flesh as she bit down on her exposed throat and sucked.
Allison humped wildly, sobbing with pleasure as the orgasm
shattered her mind into a million pieces and set off an explosion of
heat in her that threatened to blow her completely into darkness.
She felt her mind spinning, was light headed as the orgasm finally
passed. She gulped in air, groaning, staggering against her girlfriend,
who's arms hugged her tightly as her lips moved onto her breast again.
"Oh God, Molly!" she groaned.
Molly lifted her head, her eyes filled with lust and heat and
passion. She stepped back a half step, her hands cupping Allison's
breasts and squeezing slowly, repeatedly.
Then her right hand slid down the trembling blonde's belly and her
fingers unsnapped her cutoffs. She gripped the zipper and slowly drew it
down until Allison's blue thong was exposed.
She slipped her fingers inside the waistband, then slowly forced
her hand down the front of Allison's pants, her fingers moving along the
hot, slick flesh into the sweating moist sex, then squeezing against it.
Allison trembled, gripping her arm to keep herself upright. She
stared at Molly in shock as the girl's fingers found her slit and
pressed in against it, sinking between her sopping pussy lips, then
rubbing slowly up and down.
"OooohhhhhH!" she moaned. "Wha... what a.... are you dooing to meeeee?"
Molly bent and slipped her lips around one of her nipples again,
chewing as she sucked, her fingers rubbing steadily.
Her other hand cupped Allison's buttocks, then gripped the
waistband and tugged her pants down inch by inch until they slipped
slowly down to her ankles.
Allison was grinding her pelvis into her girlfriend's hand, gasping
and moaning as her juices flowed again, as her heat and excitement soared.
Her body glistened with sweat as her insides burned like fire. She
came again, panting and moaning and humping against Molly's hand until
she fell forward and tumbled to the ground.
Molly followed her down, sliding atop her, shoving her tongue into
the blonde's mouth as she shoved her own panties down and off. She lay
between Allison's legs, their sweaty bodies rubbing and grinding together.
Allison's hands slid around Molly, searching downwards until they
cupped and squeezed her bottom.
Molly was grinding against her, rubbing her sex against Allison's,
spreading her own legs wide and angling her pussy in to rub directly on
Allison's.
Allison moaned, dazed, weak, and filled with confusion. She stared
up at Molly, saw the girl's slack jaw, her slitted eyes as she ground
into her steadily, their pussies mashing and grinding wetly, slickly.
"Gonna come! Gonna come!" Molly gasped.
Then she did, collapsing on the blonde, chewing on her throat as
she rubbed her crotch furiously back and forth against Allison's own
soft, wet pussy pad.

Apple the first, but ... (-1, Flamebait)

SuperDuG (134989) | more than 11 years ago | (#6133858)

... like everything else apple does that takes off (IE: Personal Computer), Someone (*cough* [microsoft.com] ) will come along and make a cheaper varient that has a few more bells and whistles, and to top it off is available to all the windows users throughout the world in built-into-the-os-app.

Here's how I see it, apple basically made a really successful proof of concept, but just wait until BMG or Virgin or whoever comes along with a 35 cent version of a similar service using another format [vorbis.com] and a better bitrate?

I'm happy to see apple made this concept successful, maybe now the value of MP3's won't be based on their album but at the lowest net price available. I do think like the record we may be seeing the demise of the archaic CD media. CD's were supposed to last forever, so long as you don't scratch them or scuff them, what next standard flash media?

I suppose all we could hope for now is (4, Interesting)

gsfprez (27403) | more than 11 years ago | (#6133869)

to know what happened in the meeting... :-(

While the CD Baby page has not been taken down, its been neutered - all relevant info has been removed and I think its obvious why.

Apple only gets about 6-12 months to have their innovations be innovations before someone else copies them.. putting out the info now, instead of in the 90ish days when the details will all be public, only gives MS and Real a head-start on their idea copying.

I'm perfectly willing to wait and see.... tho other sources have already noted that Apple has mentioned a iTMS Compression tool to allow Indie's the ability to compress their own music on their own machines to make their music ready for sale on the iTMS.

and if that's true.. that kicks fscking ass.

Go Apple, you guys r0x0r.
</16 year old pimple faced Apple Fanboy mode>
(note: i'm not bashing their copying of Apple's ideas, i'm only stating fact)

Re:I suppose all we could hope for now is (2, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#6133902)

here are the deatils...

I got an invitation to go to Apple's office for a presentation/meeting today (June 5, 2003) about how to get independent artists into the iTunes Music Store. There were about 150 people there, representatives from the best independent record labels and music services, in this invitation-only conference room. Steve Jobs came out and started a two and a half hour presentation/seminar/Q&A about iTunes and the benefits of independent labels making their music available there. I type fast and had my laptop, so I wrote down all the major points of their presentation as they went.

NOTE: I've skipped the super-basic introduction to iTunes and what it does, because that can be found so many other places. This is the stuff that I felt was most important to musicians:
The basics

* The basics of iTunes Music Store are covered in many places, so if you haven't used iTunes Music store yet, read these links first:
* Apple's iTunes Music Store website.
* Great video showing the service.
* NOTE: iTunes is not a website! It can only be accessed from the iTunes software run on Mac OS X (now) and Windows (by the end of the year.)
* I highly suggest trying it for yourself. If you don't have a Mac, use a friend's. Enter your credit card info and actually buy a song. Tell it to store your info for future purchases. Buy a few more songs with the one-click system. I'm serious. You should try it yourself to really experience how amazingly cool it is.
* They're using a DRM called Fairplay to make sure you can't put these songs on the internet and have them play on another player.

Current Stats:

* There are 6-7 million copies of iTunes in use.
* 3.5 million songs sold so far. Selling about 500,000 songs a week now.
* More than 75% of songs have sold at least once. There is a wide breadth in purchasing. This is not only fueled by hits.
* 45% of all songs have been bought as an album. In other words: don't worry about the death of the album format. 45% of people prefer to buy as an album anyway, even though they always have the option to only buy per-song.
* 90% of sales are 1-click downloads. (1-click is where customer has credit card stored on file, so that as soon as they click a song title, it starts downloading and their credit card is automatically charged.)
* 10 previews (free 30 second listen) for every purchase. Meaning: 10 listens per buy.

Price of music on iTunes

* Songs must be 99 cents each.
* Full albums are recommended to be $9.99 or lower.
* Album price must be less than or equal to the sum of their tracks. So if you have a 5-song album, it can't be more than $4.95 to buy the full-length album.
* Apple strongly recommends going even lower than $9.99. They'd like to see that price drop to make the full-album purchase even more desirable.
* Only exception: if a song is over 7 minutes long, they won't offer it as a separate download. It will be available as part of the album only.
* There is no cost to put your music on iTunes.
* There will be no up-front advance from Apple.
* Details on the wholesale price to the label will be mailed to us, later.

Sales report to SoundScan

* Apple is reporting all iTunes sales to SoundScan!
* SoundScan measures per-song not per-album.
* So if someone buys your whole album, each track on the album is reported as a song sale.
* SoundScan requested to do it that way. It was their idea, not Apple's.

About positioning and getting attention on iTunes

* Apple has hired an editorial staff with backgrounds in music to decide what gets featured.
* Editorial team makes decisions every day as to what goes where.
* Big labels don't get preferential treatment.
* "We pick music we like, and we think everyone else is going to like."
* "We've had a lot of people offer money", but Apple refuses money, and has no plan to ever accept money for placement.
* Even what looks like a banner ad at the top of the screen is put there by Apple.
* When an audience member doubted they'd stay with this policy, they pointed to their 20 years of selling Apple computers, and never selling icons on the desktop or any of the other things that companies have offered to pay them a lot of money to do.
* (Plus Steve Jobs reminded us they have $41 [ed note: that should read $4.1] billion in the bank and are not in debt. They're not desparate for cash.)
* They did admit that when a popular artist gives iTunes exclusive tracks, that may prompt Apple to make a banner an on iTunes promoting it.
* New releases sell really well.
* Exclusive tracks (songs that aren't available on CD anywhere) sell amazingly well. They're the best sellers in whole store.
* Occasionally they make a special featured artist page, with video, photos, a link back to the artist's site, and more. It seems this is just for very high-profile artists, though.
* Top-seller charts on Apple only reflect the last 24 hours. (IDEA FOR INDIES: get all your friends to buy at once!)
* Here's the iTunes info about browsing and searching.

What you CAN'T do

* You can not sell an album as album-only format without allowing the purchase of single-songs.
* Can't search by record label, although you can see the record label on the album info page.
* There will be no links from iTunes to your website, or to buy the physical CD.
* Right now there are no sub-genres, only big genres. (rock/jazz/etc.)

About the deal to independents

* They said "We're going to give you the same basic deal we gave the big 5 major labels".
* Same deal. Same agreements. Same team of people. Same treatment, all-around.
* "We have to be more efficient, though. We're not going to deal with 200 lawyers."
* "Everyone is going to get the exact same deal. It's not negotiable. It's take it or leave it."
* This is a reseller agreement: Apple buys at a wholesale price. Apple resells them to users. "No complicated or messy licenses."
* Apple only deals with the partner/label. It's up to the label to pay the artists, writers, publishing, etc.
* Rights are a 3 year term. For iTunes only, of course. This is totally non-exclusive.
* THEY PAY EVERY MONTH!
* IMPORTANT: the details will be mailed to me soon. They haven't named specific amounts yet. Instead, they had us sign a contract request form, and they'll mail the contract to us. That's when I'll know more.

EVERY artist in the store gets...

* listed in new releases
* found in searches (any search returns up to 250 songs for that artist)
* in the "browse all artists" list (the text-based view)
* an artist page (page showing all CDs by this artist, top downloaded songs, top downloaded albums, also bought...)
* an album page: artwork, song list, top downloads, references to other artists
* listed in cross-references to other albums ("people who bought this also bought...")

Marketing and Promotion

* 10 million customers have opted-in to receive a "New Music" email from Apple every Tuesday. Customers of iPod, iTunes, .mac, Apple eNews.
* You can have a link directly on your site to point to your music on iTunes. (Of course the link will only work for people who have the iTunes software.)
* Google has exclusive discounts for sponsored links into iTunes. Plus some personalized support.
* Macs in 57 Apple retail stores are pre-loaded with playlists called, "Discover Indie Music". A chance at in-store play.

How to get the music to Apple

* It's up to the partner/label to submit all the metadata (artist name, release date, song tiles, etc.), do the audio encoding, and upload the materials.
* Every album needs to have a UPC Barcode!
* You have to use their special Music Store Encoder tool for Mac OS X which will be released in 90 days or so.
* Independent artists themselves, not with a label, can't use this. You have to go through an iTunes partner.
* When asked if artists with their own label would be eligible, the iTunes guys had an odd answer, saying that this was invitation-only and they want to deal with those of us in the room.
* (CD Baby will be an iTunes partner, and will be glad to do the submission and be your pipeline into iTunes, if we can.)

Apple Does:

* Marketing & merchandising
* Advertising, PR, Retail, Direct
* 30-second Previews
* Infrastructure of download & delivery
* Credit card transaction

That's all we know for now!

I've checked the Google cache too, NOT THERE (0, Redundant)

jayteedee (211241) | more than 11 years ago | (#6133872)

I've checked the Google cache too, NOT THERE

Who needs iTunes? (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#6133878)

I can get bad quality mp3s ripped incorrectly, many distorted on purpose, on KaZaA. Just for fun, I tried to download one song from a pop artist the other day. It took me 30 minutes on my broadband connection to find and download one of decent quality.

Kazaa is shit. (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#6133934)

There are much better programs to use, and more reliable.

Re:Kazaa is shit. (0, Offtopic)

Jack Comics (631233) | more than 11 years ago | (#6134084)

I know this is completely off-topic, but such as? I have never P2Ped in my computing life, and I've been using computers for fourteen years. Most of them are slow, crappy, and virus-ridden, which is why I've stayed away. But if you happen to know of some ones that aren't like that, do share.

The now-yanked Full Text (5, Informative)

1019 (262204) | more than 11 years ago | (#6133879)

I got an invitation to go to Apple's office for a presentation/meeting today (June 5, 2003) about how to get independent artists into the iTunes Music Store. There were about 150 people there, representatives from the best independent record labels and music services, in this invitation-only conference room. Steve Jobs came out and started a two and a half hour presentation/seminar/Q&A about iTunes and the benefits of independent labels making their music available there. I type fast and had my laptop, so I wrote down all the major points of their presentation as they went.

NOTE: I've skipped the super-basic introduction to iTunes and what it does, because that can be found so many other places. This is the stuff that I felt was most important to musicians:
The basics

* The basics of iTunes Music Store are covered in many places, so if you haven't used iTunes Music store yet, read these links first:
* Apple's iTunes Music Store website.
* Great video showing the service.
* NOTE: iTunes is not a website! It can only be accessed from the iTunes software run on Mac OS X (now) and Windows (by the end of the year.)
* I highly suggest trying it for yourself. If you don't have a Mac, use a friend's. Enter your credit card info and actually buy a song. Tell it to store your info for future purchases. Buy a few more songs with the one-click system. I'm serious. You should try it yourself to really experience how amazingly cool it is.
* They're using a DRM called Fairplay to make sure you can't put these songs on the internet and have them play on another player.

Current Stats:

* There are 6-7 million copies of iTunes in use.
* 3.5 million songs sold so far. Selling about 500,000 songs a week now.
* More than 75% of songs have sold at least once. There is a wide breadth in purchasing. This is not only fueled by hits.
* 45% of all songs have been bought as an album. In other words: don't worry about the death of the album format. 45% of people prefer to buy as an album anyway, even though they always have the option to only buy per-song.
* 90% of sales are 1-click downloads. (1-click is where customer has credit card stored on file, so that as soon as they click a song title, it starts downloading and their credit card is automatically charged.)
* 10 previews (free 30 second listen) for every purchase. Meaning: 10 listens per buy.

Price of music on iTunes

* Songs must be 99 cents each.
* Full albums are recommended to be $9.99 or lower.
* Album price must be less than or equal to the sum of their tracks. So if you have a 5-song album, it can't be more than $4.95 to buy the full-length album.
* Apple strongly recommends going even lower than $9.99. They'd like to see that price drop to make the full-album purchase even more desirable.
* Only exception: if a song is over 7 minutes long, they won't offer it as a separate download. It will be available as part of the album only.
* There is no cost to put your music on iTunes.
* There will be no up-front advance from Apple.
* Details on the wholesale price to the label will be mailed to us, later.

Sales report to SoundScan

* Apple is reporting all iTunes sales to SoundScan!
* SoundScan measures per-song not per-album.
* So if someone buys your whole album, each track on the album is reported as a song sale.
* SoundScan requested to do it that way. It was their idea, not Apple's.

About positioning and getting attention on iTunes

* Apple has hired an editorial staff with backgrounds in music to decide what gets featured.
* Editorial team makes decisions every day as to what goes where.
* Big labels don't get preferential treatment.
* "We pick music we like, and we think everyone else is going to like."
* "We've had a lot of people offer money", but Apple refuses money, and has no plan to ever accept money for placement.
* Even what looks like a banner ad at the top of the screen is put there by Apple.
* When an audience member doubted they'd stay with this policy, they pointed to their 20 years of selling Apple computers, and never selling icons on the desktop or any of the other things that companies have offered to pay them a lot of money to do.
* (Plus Steve Jobs reminded us they have $41 billion in the bank and are not in debt. They're not desparate for cash.)
* They did admit that when a popular artist gives iTunes exclusive tracks, that may prompt Apple to make a banner an on iTunes promoting it.
* New releases sell really well.
* Exclusive tracks (songs that aren't available on CD anywhere) sell amazingly well. They're the best sellers in whole store.
* Occasionally they make a special featured artist page, with video, photos, a link back to the artist's site, and more. It seems this is just for very high-profile artists, though.
* Top-seller charts on Apple only reflect the last 24 hours. (IDEA FOR INDIES: get all your friends to buy at once!)
* Here's the iTunes info about browsing and searching.

What you CAN'T do

* You can not sell an album as album-only format without allowing the purchase of single-songs.
* Can't search by record label, although you can see the record label on the album info page.
* There will be no links from iTunes to your website, or to buy the physical CD.
* Right now there are no sub-genres, only big genres. (rock/jazz/etc.)

About the deal to independents

* They said "We're going to give you the same basic deal we gave the big 5 major labels".
* Same deal. Same agreements. Same team of people. Same treatment, all-around.
* "We have to be more efficient, though. We're not going to deal with 200 lawyers."
* "Everyone is going to get the exact same deal. It's not negotiable. It's take it or leave it."
* This is a reseller agreement: Apple buys at a wholesale price. Apple resells them to users. "No complicated or messy licenses."
* Apple only deals with the partner/label. It's up to the label to pay the artists, writers, publishing, etc.
* Rights are a 3 year term. For iTunes only, of course. This is totally non-exclusive.
* THEY PAY EVERY MONTH!
* IMPORTANT: the details will be mailed to me soon. They haven't named specific amounts yet. Instead, they had us sign a contract request form, and they'll mail the contract to us. That's when I'll know more.

EVERY artist in the store gets...

* listed in new releases
* found in searches (any search returns up to 250 songs for that artist)
* in the "browse all artists" list (the text-based view)
* an artist page (page showing all CDs by this artist, top downloaded songs, top downloaded albums, also bought...)
* an album page: artwork, song list, top downloads, references to other artists
* listed in cross-references to other albums ("people who bought this also bought...")

Marketing and Promotion

* 10 million customers have opted-in to receive a "New Music" email from Apple every Tuesday. Customers of iPod, iTunes, .mac, Apple eNews.
* You can have a link directly on your site to point to your music on iTunes. (Of course the link will only work for people who have the iTunes software.)
* Google has exclusive discounts for sponsored links into iTunes. Plus some personalized support.
* Macs in 57 Apple retail stores are pre-loaded with playlists called, "Discover Indie Music". A chance at in-store play.

How to get the music to Apple

* It's up to the partner/label to submit all the metadata (artist name, release date, song tiles, etc.), do the audio encoding, and upload the materials.
* Every album needs to have a UPC Barcode!
* You have to use their special Music Store Encoder tool for Mac OS X which will be released in 90 days or so.
* Independent artists themselves, not with a label, can't use this. You have to go through an iTunes partner.
* When asked if artists with their own label would be eligible, the iTunes guys had an odd answer, saying that this was invitation-only and they want to deal with those of us in the room.
* (CD Baby will be an iTunes partner, and will be glad to do the submission and be your pipeline into iTunes, if we can.)

Apple Does:

* Marketing & merchandising
* Advertising, PR, Retail, Direct
* 30-second Previews
* Infrastructure of download & delivery
* Credit card transaction

That's all we know for now!

CD Baby (3, Interesting)

Upright Joe (658035) | more than 11 years ago | (#6133884)

Man, I hope CD Baby works out a licensing deal where CD's from CD Baby's catalog are also sold on iTMS. I plan on selling an album through them this summer and I would love for it to be available in iTunes as well.

Small labels will benefit from the ignorant giants (5, Interesting)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#6133889)

(a little OT)

Thanks to companies like Apple, the smaller labels will really reap the benefits of getting their music out there without heavy tampering to 'prevent' piracy.

I work for a music publication, and it's interesting to see which companies ignore the 'threat' of piracy, and which ones try to fight it.

For example, the new Cradle of Filth arrived with a hand-signed number on the CD, and a b/w CD case with a skull and cross bones on it, warning me (the music critic) that "this disc is watermark protected" whatever that means.

Meanwhile, the new Type O Negative arrived with a 10 second commericial attached (i.e. spliced into) each song ("Your listening to the new Type O Negative, in stores next month"). This CD will NOT get press in our publication, since it's hard to get into a CD when every 3-4 minutes some recorded message comes on; nice job, record executives. Way to prevent piracy!

Re:Small labels will benefit from the ignorant gia (1)

clifyt (11768) | more than 11 years ago | (#6134115)

So -- the TypeO album doesn't get any response simply because they go to the trouble of appending something to the song so that when you rip it and get it uploaded to some fileserver the kiddies will know who it is?

Thats a little juvenile, eh?

10 seconds of commercial is not too much to worry about nor should it effect your judgements of the music. Being from a music pub, you've probably been to one of any number of junkets put out by these guys...music critics come out and listen to this stuff...sometimes they are given a cd to take back with them, other times the music you've heard at the party is all they you get until release day (and they have been known to wand ya to make sure ya ain't bringing in a recorder)...there will be someone talking a good portion of the time that this is playing, yet the music still seems to get reviewed -- or at least pre-reviewed until they can get their hands on the full release).

I'd rather have music have a short advertisment at the end of the song than a watermarking -- marks are expensive (ie., each disc has to be encoded specifically for that person and burned for them -- I have set up a process that does this for a friends company that sells sound libraries -- then again for $1k a disc, they don't mind that it takes them a half hour to get the cd out the door).

What do I know. You are an anonycow that reviews for publications while I'm just a music tech that works for the pros and has to hear them bitch at me constantly about their music being stolen while I sit and explain how this stuff works and try to explain how they can try to stop it OR try to figure out ways to subvert this activity so that it ends up helping them out without alienating their core audience.

clif

DRM (4, Interesting)

Phroggy (441) | more than 11 years ago | (#6133890)

One of the things I've been wondering is, if an indie label wants to make their own songs available without DRM, will Apple let them do so on the iTunes Music Store, or is DRM absolutely required? What if the band wants to sell unrestricted AAC files? What about MP3?

Of course I expect most of them to want the DRM, but some may not.

Re:DRM (1)

DdJ (10790) | more than 11 years ago | (#6133963)

If an indie label wants to make their own songs available in MP3 format without DRM, the logical way to handle it is to use the "Artist's Website" feature of the music store to provide a link to an external site from which DRM-free MP3s can be downloaded.

That'd work, wouldn't it? Personally, I'd love to see this for things like the Greatful Dead's concert recordings, which are largely available for free anyway.

Re:DRM (2, Informative)

Frac (27516) | more than 11 years ago | (#6134042)

the logical way to handle it is to use the "Artist's Website" feature of the music store to provide a link to an external site from which DRM-free MP3s can be downloaded.

Nope.

Quoted from the original article:

What you CAN'T do

* You can not sell an album as album-only format without allowing the purchase of single-songs.
* Can't search by record label, although you can see the record label on the album info page.
* There will be no links from iTunes to your website, or to buy the physical CD.
* Right now there are no sub-genres, only big genres. (rock/jazz/etc.)

Re:DRM (3, Insightful)

wizarddc (105860) | more than 11 years ago | (#6134037)

I don't think Apple would even want to distribute songs over iTunes in a not DRM fashion. I imagine they're making a per purchase profit, so by allowing someone to download a totally unsecure file means they could lose revenue. Like the previous reply'er said, if they want to release a non-DRM track, then they can do it on thier own time, money, and bandwidth.

Re:DRM (1)

FatRatBastard (7583) | more than 11 years ago | (#6134050)

I assume the artist/label could still sell the same track under a different service. I haven't read anywhere where Apple is trying to make this exclusive (since the Big 5 are selling / leasing their wares elsewhere as well).

Frankly I don't blame Apple. Keep everything uniform to keep the costs down. If JoeRecord lable wants to sell MP3s they can still do it, it just won't be thru iTunes.

Canada = Shit (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#6133894)

I'm from Canada and they think I'm slow, eh?

Apple Policy (2, Insightful)

Eglerion (679443) | more than 11 years ago | (#6133899)

I'm actually a little suprised at the heavy handedness Apple has shown with preventing the LAN streaming of mp3's all together. Apple has always been one to promote innovation, well usually unless they think its a threat. But the issue with preventing the iTunes streaming may have something to do with these new deals with the music labels, Apple may have it's hands tied and has pressure on it by the labels, who knows.

Re:Apple Policy (1)

Baumi (148744) | more than 11 years ago | (#6133947)

I'm actually a little suprised at the heavy handedness Apple has shown with preventing the LAN streaming of mp3's all together.

What are you talking about? AFAIK LAN streaming is still working. Internet streaming has been neutered.

(However, 4.0 won't open streams originating from 4.0.1 machines.)

Ho hum (0, Redundant)

SYFer (617415) | more than 11 years ago | (#6133907)

Interesting that they pulled the "details" because they seem to have been reminded that they were confidential (see note at bottom of page). Do we see the shadow of the Long Arm of Apple or a case of sudden recall?

As for the sales figures mentioned in the intro above, they're just a rehash of the oft quoted "million a month / mostly albums" company line. No scoop there. Next time, perhaps we'll see it expressed as "33,000 per day."

I can't imagine that Apple would have divulged much (if any) proprietary info to that auditorium full of mavericks anyway, so I reckon we're not missing much.

Next.

Re:Ho hum (2, Interesting)

Upright Joe (658035) | more than 11 years ago | (#6133949)

Interesting that they pulled the "details" because they seem to have been reminded that they were confidential (see note at bottom of page). Do we see the shadow of the Long Arm of Apple or a case of sudden recall?

It doesn't look that way. It looks like the author misunderstood the purpose of the meeting according to this [macrumors.com] .

I also believe a mirror of the original text on CD baby lives here [gnutellanews.com] .

Re:Ho hum (1)

SYFer (617415) | more than 11 years ago | (#6134024)

Right you are. In fact, he says:

"It wasn't wrath or lawyers that asked me to pull it. It was a friend of mine that works there.

I sincerely didn't know yesterday's presentation was supposed to be confidential. In fact I thought it was like an indie-music press conference.

Nobody's mad, though. Honest mistake.

Sorry guys!"

Also, since posting my comment, I have seen the mirrored link--thanks!

In other news, I also see my math was off (500k*4=2,000,000), so I'll switch from coffee to water now. I'm still sticking to my "ho hum" though!

Re:Ho hum (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#6134046)

Apple didn't get to Derek. Here is the note he left on MacRumors:

sorry - took the details down

It wasn't wrath or lawyers that asked me to pull it. It was a friend of mine that works there.

I sincerely didn't know yesterday's presentation was supposed to be confidential. In fact I thought it was like an indie-music press conference.

Nobody's mad, though. Honest mistake.

Sorry guys!

--
Derek Sivers, CD Baby
http://www.cdbaby.com

It's almost there (1)

OmniVector (569062) | more than 11 years ago | (#6133916)

So lets get the theories out in the open. How long until I can post a song I've made and sell it on apple's service at $0.99 a piece (with apple of cource getting a portion of the proceedes)?

Re:It's almost there (1, Informative)

amichalo (132545) | more than 11 years ago | (#6133967)

RTFA

Apple stated you MUST use a lable to sell music and it would not support people posting their own tracks on iTMS.

Further, the FA says participation by a lable in the iTMS is invitation only.

RTFA

Re:It's almost there (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#6134121)

RTFD, it's "label", not "lable". I would have let it slide if you had only used it once.

regarding iTunes streaming (5, Insightful)

RestiffBard (110729) | more than 11 years ago | (#6133951)

What is it with people wanting to make a good thing unavailable? The streaming capability of iTunes seemed pretty sweet to me. But, of course, some jackasses had to figure out the way to use that capability to further steal music. Why? What the fuck is your problem? Are you a kleptomaniac? An anarchist? You just hate other people and don't want them to enjoy things? You're not cool. You're a retard. You are the reason that good things get taken away. Dude, cut it the fuck out. You're no different than the jackass that first took a hair dryer into a shower.

Go ahead, flame away. Mod me down. I have the karma to burn.

Okay little boy! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#6134065)

Dude, you need intelligence to be an intellectual terrorist.

You also need to be older than sixteen. Sorry, sonny.

Details pulled but.. (4, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#6133954)

According to a post in the MacRumors [macrumors.com] forums from CDBaby the details were pulled and here's why:

--------------
It wasn't wrath or lawyers that asked me to pull it. It was a friend of mine that works there.

I sincerely didn't know yesterday's presentation was supposed to be confidential. In fact I thought it was like an indie-music press conference.

Nobody's mad, though. Honest mistake.

Sorry guys!

--
Derek Sivers, CD Baby
http://www.cdbaby.com

--------------

But.... here it is anyhow...

I got an invitation to go to Apple's office for a presentation/meeting today (June 5, 2003) about how to get independent artists into the iTunes Music Store. There were about 150 people there, representatives from the best independent record labels and music services, in this invitation-only conference room. Steve Jobs came out and started a two and a half hour presentation/seminar/Q&A about iTunes and the benefits of independent labels making their music available there. I type fast and had my laptop, so I wrote down all the major points of their presentation as they went.

NOTE: I've skipped the super-basic introduction to iTunes and what it does, because that can be found so many other places. This is the stuff that I felt was most important to musicians:
The basics

* The basics of iTunes Music Store are covered in many places, so if you haven't used iTunes Music store yet, read these links first:
* Apple's iTunes Music Store website.
* Great video showing the service.
* NOTE: iTunes is not a website! It can only be accessed from the iTunes software run on Mac OS X (now) and Windows (by the end of the year.)
* I highly suggest trying it for yourself. If you don't have a Mac, use a friend's. Enter your credit card info and actually buy a song. Tell it to store your info for future purchases. Buy a few more songs with the one-click system. I'm serious. You should try it yourself to really experience how amazingly cool it is.
* They're using a DRM called Fairplay to make sure you can't put these songs on the internet and have them play on another player.

Current Stats:

* There are 6-7 million copies of iTunes in use.
* 3.5 million songs sold so far. Selling about 500,000 songs a week now.
* More than 75% of songs have sold at least once. There is a wide breadth in purchasing. This is not only fueled by hits.
* 45% of all songs have been bought as an album. In other words: don't worry about the death of the album format. 45% of people prefer to buy as an album anyway, even though they always have the option to only buy per-song.
* 90% of sales are 1-click downloads. (1-click is where customer has credit card stored on file, so that as soon as they click a song title, it starts downloading and their credit card is automatically charged.)
* 10 previews (free 30 second listen) for every purchase. Meaning: 10 listens per buy.

Price of music on iTunes

* Songs must be 99 cents each.
* Full albums are recommended to be $9.99 or lower.
* Album price must be less than or equal to the sum of their tracks. So if you have a 5-song album, it can't be more than $4.95 to buy the full-length album.
* Apple strongly recommends going even lower than $9.99. They'd like to see that price drop to make the full-album purchase even more desirable.
* Only exception: if a song is over 7 minutes long, they won't offer it as a separate download. It will be available as part of the album only.
* There is no cost to put your music on iTunes.
* There will be no up-front advance from Apple.
* Details on the wholesale price to the label will be mailed to us, later.

Sales report to SoundScan

* Apple is reporting all iTunes sales to SoundScan!
* SoundScan measures per-song not per-album.
* So if someone buys your whole album, each track on the album is reported as a song sale.
* SoundScan requested to do it that way. It was their idea, not Apple's.

About positioning and getting attention on iTunes

* Apple has hired an editorial staff with backgrounds in music to decide what gets featured.
* Editorial team makes decisions every day as to what goes where.
* Big labels don't get preferential treatment.
* "We pick music we like, and we think everyone else is going to like."
* "We've had a lot of people offer money", but Apple refuses money, and has no plan to ever accept money for placement.
* Even what looks like a banner ad at the top of the screen is put there by Apple.
* When an audience member doubted they'd stay with this policy, they pointed to their 20 years of selling Apple computers, and never selling icons on the desktop or any of the other things that companies have offered to pay them a lot of money to do.
* (Plus Steve Jobs reminded us they have $41 billion in the bank and are not in debt. They're not desparate for cash.)
* They did admit that when a popular artist gives iTunes exclusive tracks, that may prompt Apple to make a banner an on iTunes promoting it.
* New releases sell really well.
* Exclusive tracks (songs that aren't available on CD anywhere) sell amazingly well. They're the best sellers in whole store.
* Occasionally they make a special featured artist page, with video, photos, a link back to the artist's site, and more. It seems this is just for very high-profile artists, though.
* Top-seller charts on Apple only reflect the last 24 hours. (IDEA FOR INDIES: get all your friends to buy at once!)
* Here's the iTunes info about browsing and searching.

What you CAN'T do

* You can not sell an album as album-only format without allowing the purchase of single-songs.
* Can't search by record label, although you can see the record label on the album info page.
* There will be no links from iTunes to your website, or to buy the physical CD.
* Right now there are no sub-genres, only big genres. (rock/jazz/etc.)

About the deal to independents

* They said "We're going to give you the same basic deal we gave the big 5 major labels".
* Same deal. Same agreements. Same team of people. Same treatment, all-around.
* "We have to be more efficient, though. We're not going to deal with 200 lawyers."
* "Everyone is going to get the exact same deal. It's not negotiable. It's take it or leave it."
* This is a reseller agreement: Apple buys at a wholesale price. Apple resells them to users. "No complicated or messy licenses."
* Apple only deals with the partner/label. It's up to the label to pay the artists, writers, publishing, etc.
* Rights are a 3 year term. For iTunes only, of course. This is totally non-exclusive.
* THEY PAY EVERY MONTH!
* IMPORTANT: the details will be mailed to me soon. They haven't named specific amounts yet. Instead, they had us sign a contract request form, and they'll mail the contract to us. That's when I'll know more.

EVERY artist in the store gets...

* listed in new releases
* found in searches (any search returns up to 250 songs for that artist)
* in the "browse all artists" list (the text-based view)
* an artist page (page showing all CDs by this artist, top downloaded songs, top downloaded albums, also bought...)
* an album page: artwork, song list, top downloads, references to other artists
* listed in cross-references to other albums ("people who bought this also bought...")

Marketing and Promotion

* 10 million customers have opted-in to receive a "New Music" email from Apple every Tuesday. Customers of iPod, iTunes, .mac, Apple eNews.
* You can have a link directly on your site to point to your music on iTunes. (Of course the link will only work for people who have the iTunes software.)
* Google has exclusive discounts for sponsored links into iTunes. Plus some personalized support.
* Macs in 57 Apple retail stores are pre-loaded with playlists called, "Discover Indie Music". A chance at in-store play.

How to get the music to Apple

* It's up to the partner/label to submit all the metadata (artist name, release date, song tiles, etc.), do the audio encoding, and upload the materials.
* Every album needs to have a UPC Barcode!
* You have to use their special Music Store Encoder tool for Mac OS X which will be released in 90 days or so.
* Independent artists themselves, not with a label, can't use this. You have to go through an iTunes partner.
* When asked if artists with their own label would be eligible, the iTunes guys had an odd answer, saying that this was invitation-only and they want to deal with those of us in the room.
* (CD Baby will be an iTunes partner, and will be glad to do the submission and be your pipeline into iTunes, if we can.)

Apple Does:

* Marketing & merchandising
* Advertising, PR, Retail, Direct
* 30-second Previews
* Infrastructure of download & delivery
* Credit card transaction

That's all we know for now!

Re:Details pulled but.. (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#6134091)

Like, oh my god! It's the guy from Hit Me!

No Consipiracy Theory Here Folks... (4, Informative)

computerme (655703) | more than 11 years ago | (#6133966)

Found this on the macnn boards:

Sorry - I took the details down from that page. It wasn't wrath or lawyers that asked me to pull it. It was a friend of mine that works there. I sincerely didn't know yesterday's presentation was supposed to be confidential. In fact I thought it was like an indie-music press conference. Nobody's mad, though. Honest mistake. Sorry guys!

-- Derek Sivers, CD Baby http://www.cdbaby.com

I'm a fan of what Apple is doing (3, Insightful)

emo boy (586277) | more than 11 years ago | (#6133970)

but the article said that in 20 years Apple has never sold an icon to a desktop in their operating system. This may be true but if you install OS X you will be asked to sign up for an Earthlink account. To me that sounds like advertising sold to Earthlink to place their company ahead of others. Just a thought.

Re:I'm a fan of what Apple is doing (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#6134114)

Could that be because Apple has a substantial stake in Earthlink?

ISTR that they bought a big chunk at the same time that .Mac was announced. The idea was to get seamless access, hosting etc. So Earthlink became Apple's prefered ISP.

Free Andromeda Alternatives (4, Informative)

VValdo (10446) | more than 11 years ago | (#6133973)

The "What Jobs taketh away.." article refers to Andromeda [turnstyle.com] , a $35 web-based file streaming program.

There is a free GPL'd alternative, ZINA [pancake.org] (Zina Is Not Andromeda) as well as other solutions [sourceforge.net] . A search of freshmeat.net [freshmeat.net] for "jukebox" will reveal even more...

W

Just "equal" among the indies? (1)

ianscot (591483) | more than 11 years ago | (#6133986)

Apple is treating everyone as equvalents in that all labels receive equal treatment with the same deal, the same agreements and you work with the same team of people.

All the independent labels, you mean?

This clearly isn't true for the big labels. Some "hits" can only be bought if you take the whole album -- they won't sell Don MacLean's "American Pie" for $0.99 -- and exceptionally long tracks (>7 mins) often have the same restriction. Some albums also stick to the $0.99-per rule past the $9.95-per-original-disk rule. That's only fair when a classical or jazz track might be ten minutes long, but it ain't the universal deal we're supposedly talking about.

Not that I'm po'ed about this. Basically Apple had to compromise to get some of the deals with big companies. Seems like they're trying to address the very thing /. spent the first week going over and over -- smaller labels, less well-known artists -- without killing anyone on either end.

Where are these numbers coming from? (2, Interesting)

guinsu (198732) | more than 11 years ago | (#6134049)

I just don't see how Apple is having millions of downloads and sales every month from software that isn't on _that_ many computers. It doesn't seem to make any sense. Are these numbers legit or is Apple cooking the books?

Re:Where are these numbers coming from? (2, Informative)

berniecase (20853) | more than 11 years ago | (#6134103)

Well, let's see. I've bought close to 70 songs from the music store. I'm mostly buying stuff that I didn't have already. I've bought only one album, and single tracks apart from that.

So, if Apple says there are 3 million OS X users (I don't have the exact number), let's take a conservative estimate of maybe 6 or 7 songs per user. That's 19.5 million songs. The iTunes music store was started on 28 April, and if 500,000 songs a day are sold (on average), then you end up with the numbers stated above. I don't think this is too hard to achieve.

Of course, my math could be horribly horribly wrong. I'm sure someone will point that out :-)

The Text (before it was pulled) (-1, Redundant)

Chuck Bucket (142633) | more than 11 years ago | (#6134078)

--
Cd Baby reports on itunes meeting re: indy music.
Posted by leflaw on June 6, 2003 at 7:44 AM EDT
Apple iTunes + independent music

I got an invitation to go to Apple's office for a presentation/meeting today (June 5, 2003) about how to get independent artists into the iTunes Music Store. There were about 150 people there, representatives from the best independent record labels and music services, in this invitation-only conference room. Steve Jobs came out and started a two and a half hour presentation/seminar/Q&A about iTunes and the benefits of independent labels making their music available there. I type fast and had my laptop, so I wrote down all the major points of their presentation as they went.

NOTE: I've skipped the super-basic introduction to iTunes and what it does, because that can be found so many other places. This is the stuff that I felt was most important to musicians:
The basics

* The basics of iTunes Music Store are covered in many places, so if you haven't used iTunes Music store yet, read these links first:
* Apple's iTunes Music Store website.
* Great video showing the service.
* NOTE: iTunes is not a website! It can only be accessed from the iTunes software run on Mac OS X (now) and Windows (by the end of the year.)
* I highly suggest trying it for yourself. If you don't have a Mac, use a friend's. Enter your credit card info and actually buy a song. Tell it to store your info for future purchases. Buy a few more songs with the one-click system. I'm serious. You should try it yourself to really experience how amazingly cool it is.
* They're using a DRM called Fairplay to make sure you can't put these songs on the internet and have them play on another player.

Current Stats:

* There are 6-7 million copies of iTunes in use.
* 3.5 million songs sold so far. Selling about 500,000 songs a week now.
* More than 75% of songs have sold at least once. There is a wide breadth in purchasing. This is not only fueled by hits.
* 45% of all songs have been bought as an album. In other words: don't worry about the death of the album format. 45% of people prefer to buy as an album anyway, even though they always have the option to only buy per-song.
* 90% of sales are 1-click downloads. (1-click is where customer has credit card stored on file, so that as soon as they click a song title, it starts downloading and their credit card is automatically charged.)
* 10 previews (free 30 second listen) for every purchase. Meaning: 10 listens per buy.

Price of music on iTunes

* Songs must be 99 cents each.
* Full albums are recommended to be $9.99 or lower.
* Album price must be less than or equal to the sum of their tracks. So if you have a 5-song album, it can't be more than $4.95 to buy the full-length album.
* Apple strongly recommends going even lower than $9.99. They'd like to see that price drop to make the full-album purchase even more desirable.
* Only exception: if a song is over 7 minutes long, they won't offer it as a separate download. It will be available as part of the album only.
* There is no cost to put your music on iTunes.
* There will be no up-front advance from Apple.
* Details on the wholesale price to the label will be mailed to us, later.

Sales report to SoundScan

* Apple is reporting all iTunes sales to SoundScan!
* SoundScan measures per-song not per-album.
* So if someone buys your whole album, each track on the album is reported as a song sale.
* SoundScan requested to do it that way. It was their idea, not Apple's.

About positioning and getting attention on iTunes

* Apple has hired an editorial staff with backgrounds in music to decide what gets featured.
* Editorial team makes decisions every day as to what goes where.
* Big labels don't get preferential treatment.
* "We pick music we like, and we think everyone else is going to like."
* "We've had a lot of people offer money", but Apple refuses money, and has no plan to ever accept money for placement.
* Even what looks like a banner ad at the top of the screen is put there by Apple.
* When an audience member doubted they'd stay with this policy, they pointed to their 20 years of selling Apple computers, and never selling icons on the desktop or any of the other things that companies have offered to pay them a lot of money to do.
* (Plus Steve Jobs reminded us they have $41 billion in the bank and are not in debt. They're not desparate for cash.)
* They did admit that when a popular artist gives iTunes exclusive tracks, that may prompt Apple to make a banner an on iTunes promoting it.
* New releases sell really well.
* Exclusive tracks (songs that aren't available on CD anywhere) sell amazingly well. They're the best sellers in whole store.
* Occasionally they make a special featured artist page, with video, photos, a link back to the artist's site, and more. It seems this is just for very high-profile artists, though.
* Top-seller charts on Apple only reflect the last 24 hours. (IDEA FOR INDIES: get all your friends to buy at once!)
* Here's the iTunes info about browsing and searching.

What you CAN'T do

* You can not sell an album as album-only format without allowing the purchase of single-songs.
* Can't search by record label, although you can see the record label on the album info page.
* There will be no links from iTunes to your website, or to buy the physical CD.
* Right now there are no sub-genres, only big genres. (rock/jazz/etc.)

About the deal to independents

* They said "We're going to give you the same basic deal we gave the big 5 major labels".
* Same deal. Same agreements. Same team of people. Same treatment, all-around.
* "We have to be more efficient, though. We're not going to deal with 200 lawyers."
* "Everyone is going to get the exact same deal. It's not negotiable. It's take it or leave it."
* This is a reseller agreement: Apple buys at a wholesale price. Apple resells them to users. "No complicated or messy licenses."
* Apple only deals with the partner/label. It's up to the label to pay the artists, writers, publishing, etc.
* Rights are a 3 year term. For iTunes only, of course. This is totally non-exclusive.
* THEY PAY EVERY MONTH!
* IMPORTANT: the details will be mailed to me soon. They haven't named specific amounts yet. Instead, they had us sign a contract request form, and they'll mail the contract to us. That's when I'll know more.

EVERY artist in the store gets...

* listed in new releases
* found in searches (any search returns up to 250 songs for that artist)
* in the "browse all artists" list (the text-based view)
* an artist page (page showing all CDs by this artist, top downloaded songs, top downloaded albums, also bought...)
* an album page: artwork, song list, top downloads, references to other artists
* listed in cross-references to other albums ("people who bought this also bought...")

Marketing and Promotion

* 10 million customers have opted-in to receive a "New Music" email from Apple every Tuesday. Customers of iPod, iTunes, .mac, Apple eNews.
* You can have a link directly on your site to point to your music on iTunes. (Of course the link will only work for people who have the iTunes software.)
* Google has exclusive discounts for sponsored links into iTunes. Plus some personalized support.
* Macs in 57 Apple retail stores are pre-loaded with playlists called, "Discover Indie Music". A chance at in-store play.

How to get the music to Apple

* It's up to the partner/label to submit all the metadata (artist name, release date, song tiles, etc.), do the audio encoding, and upload the materials.
* Every album needs to have a UPC Barcode!
* You have to use their special Music Store Encoder tool for Mac OS X which will be released in 90 days or so.
* Independent artists themselves, not with a label, can't use this. You have to go through an iTunes partner.
* When asked if artists with their own label would be eligible, the iTunes guys had an odd answer, saying that this was invitation-only and they want to deal with those of us in the room.
* (CD Baby will be an iTunes partner, and will be glad to do the submission and be your pipeline into iTunes, if we can.)

Apple Does:

* Marketing & merchandising
* Advertising, PR, Retail, Direct
* 30-second Previews
* Infrastructure of download & delivery
* Credit card transaction

That's all we know for now!

The most interesting statement to me (1)

NaugaHunter (639364) | more than 11 years ago | (#6134083)

was "Plus Steve Jobs reminded us they have $41 billion in the bank and are not in debt. They're not desparate(sic) for cash."

I knew they had money, but sheesh. Though I'm leaning towards it being a typo, and it should read "4.1 billion", as that would be more in line with what I last heard.

Still, they are clearly on solid ground for a computer maker these days. Or for any product manufacturer, for that matter.

I wonder if that's enough to buy SCO....

45% - Lying with numbers (-1, Redundant)

moosesocks (264553) | more than 11 years ago | (#6134112)

Apple is saying that 45% of the songs they've sold are being sold as part of an album.

This does NOT mean that 45% of the music purchased from iTunes are albums. In fact, that number is probably closer to 4.5% (a conservative estimate - most albums have more than 10 songs).

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