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SuSE CEO's Two-Distro World

CowboyNeal posted about 11 years ago | from the just-the-two-of-em dept.

SuSE 401

FrankoBoy writes "CRN has an interview with SuSE CEO Richard Seibt in which he claims such things as 'Linux means two companies: Red Hat and SuSE, and nobody else.' Another example of this kind of corporatespeak can be found in another interview he did with ZDNet last week. DistroWatch has an article about all this in its current weekly newsletter."

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Paedophile hunt police find human skull (-1, Troll)

(TK2)Dessimat0r (669581) | about 11 years ago | (#6759598)

AMERICAN police made further grim discoveries yesterday during their investigation into a paedophile network responsible for kidnapping girls.

A skull and bones were dug up at the home of the network's suspected ringleader, Rob Malda. It was feared that they were the remains of two teenagers who disappeared from New Orleans a year ago. The bones were unearthed after police spent six days digging at a house in Holland, Michigan, one of six properties owned by Malda.

On a visit to the house last week, Malda told police that his accomplice, Jeff Bates, had buried five bodies under a shed. Maximillion Arturo, a police spokesman in Michigan, said that no further statement would be made until families had been informed.

There was speculation last night that the remains are those of shemales from the GNAA. Malda has admitted abducting them. However, he earlier told police that he believed the two girls were still alive and being held somewhere outside Michigan.

Two eight-year-old girls abducted by Malda have been found buried at another of his properties. They starved to death while he was in prison on a theft charge. Malda's wife, Kathleen Malda, has told police that she was supposed to feed the children while her husband was in prison, but was too frightened to enter their cell.

Another two girls were found alive by police two days after Malda's arrest on Aug 13. Ten people, including Malda, his wife and an American police officer, are in custody in connection with the case.

The raped corpses of two women and parts of a third body have been discovered in a freezer at the Slashdot headquarters, along with the remains of an 80 year old woman that remain unidentified.

TrollKore - At the head of the game.
I hate you, I hate your country, and I hate your face.

first post (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | about 11 years ago | (#6759600)

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makes me think twice... (0, Flamebait)

mOoZik (698544) | about 11 years ago | (#6759610)

about recommending SuSE to Linux newbs.

Re:makes me think twice... (1)

TexTex (323298) | about 11 years ago | (#6759653)

Off-comment...

But I love the fact that if you type this sig straight into google, you end up with the first link to Apple's iPod.

Re:makes me think twice... (1)

Gherald (682277) | about 11 years ago | (#6759852)

> But I love the fact that if you type this sig straight into google, you end up with the first link to Apple's iPod.

You of course realize that is because google displays the most visited sites first...

Re:makes me think twice... (1, Insightful)

AKnightCowboy (608632) | about 11 years ago | (#6759657)

about recommending SuSE to Linux newbs.

Does anyone actually run SuSE Linux outside of Europe? If so, why? Red Hat is basically the Linux standard distro if you want to run commercial software, and Mandrake is simple to install and run for newbies. What does SuSE bring to the table?

Re:makes me think twice... (1)

xanadu-xtroot.com (450073) | about 11 years ago | (#6759796)

Does anyone actually run SuSE Linux outside of Europe?

To be honest and not make it a flame, I have no idea. I tried it. I dropped the 80 bucks for the Pro 8.0 release. It lasted about a week on my machine...
I use Gentoo now. I used (and still promote to the n00bs) MDK because the ease of use thing (and I used it for a few years so I can help them out if they get stuck). I had a bad expirence with SuSE, and I know I'm not the only one. I have a few e-friends spread around the globe and they've had the same "glowing" reports I have...

Re:makes me think twice... (1)

joestar (225875) | about 11 years ago | (#6759805)

> Does anyone actually run SuSE Linux outside of Europe?

You can say outside of "Germany". Suse is really a German thing that tries to expand to territories MandrakeSoft catched the latest 5 years.

Re:makes me think twice... (4, Interesting)

deadgoon42 (309575) | about 11 years ago | (#6759664)

I'd still recommend SuSE to newbies regardless of this obvious corporate BS. In my opinion, SuSE is still a good distro. It has worked well for me. My only problem with SuSE is that they do not offer free ISO downloads (although they do have a Live evaluation CD and FTP installation). If they'd offer a free installable CD ISO I think more people would be willing to try their distro.

try reading the article (5, Insightful)

kpharmer (452893) | about 11 years ago | (#6759800)

quote was taken out of context - SuSE's just saying that corporate IT is focusing on just two distributions.

Don't know about you - but I see very few other distributions out there on corporate boxes...

Gentoo? (0, Informative)

Kilkonie (178841) | about 11 years ago | (#6759611)

That's funny, I'm in the process of installing Gentoo right now. There are a significant number of channels packed with users. Perhaps people should look around and see what's really going on.

http://www.gentoo.org

Re:Gentoo? (-1, Flamebait)

NightSpots (682462) | about 11 years ago | (#6759636)

Wouldn't it be something if you realized that Gentoo was nothing more than an attempt to mimic FreeBSD with a Linux kernel...

What would happen if you then realized that FreeBSD outperforms linux in nearly all real world tasks?

What if you realized that FreeBSD, like NetBSD and OpenBSD, are both better organized and significantlly cleaner than any Linux distribution, with documentation that makes Linux look amateurish?

Well, it's true, so now ask yourself this: why, again, are you using Gentoo, instead of the "best tool for the job," no matter what that job might be?

Re:Gentoo? (3, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | about 11 years ago | (#6759655)

Were gentoo zealots mentioned anywhere in the "most zealous zealot" poll?

I think they deserved their very own poll option.

hardware support? (2, Insightful)

MacJedi (173) | about 11 years ago | (#6759699)

*cough* hardware support *cough*

/joeyo

Re:Gentoo? (1)

Slack3r78 (596506) | about 11 years ago | (#6759724)

Simple - BSD is dying! Haven't you heard? I mean, why else would so many Slashdot posters be warning us it's coming appocalypse? ;)

Re:Gentoo? (1)

Gherald (682277) | about 11 years ago | (#6759778)

I hate BSD zealots much more than Gentoo zealots. (okay, okay.. I use Gentoo myself and I realize thats a huge bias)

But still, at least the Gentoo people are advocating something that has a chance at becomming mainstream. Near as I can tell, BSD will allways have a tiny niche market, especially on the desktop.

Re:Gentoo? (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 11 years ago | (#6759727)

because, *I* like the linux kernel... yes *I* think it works better for what *I* am doing. (yes i do use *BSD form time to time -- ie firewall and router -- but for the most part Linux is my choice). I would say that gentoo has a LONG ways to go till it covers my complaints. Think of how old gentoo is and what caps it already has. I am sticking around and waiting because it is only going to get better

Re:Gentoo? (1)

be-fan (61476) | about 11 years ago | (#6759753)

WTF? The guy simply mentioned what distro he was using, which was different from SuSE. He never brought FreeBSD into the comparison! You have no idea why he is using Gentoo rather than something else. Personally (as someone who has used both) I use Gentoo because its software library is updated quicker, and certain Linux subsystems (ALSA, preemptive scheduler, new I/O scheduler) are better for desktop use than the FreeBSD equivilients.

Re:Gentoo? (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 11 years ago | (#6759771)

Look at http://www.mail-archive.com/freebsd-questions@free bsd.org/msg27780.html [mail-archive.com] and read the first sentence of the message.

Is this the same kind of religious fanatacism we can expect from all FreeBSD users? I certainly hope not.

Re:Gentoo? (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 11 years ago | (#6759838)

r o f l

Re:Gentoo? (-1, Flamebait)

Anonymous Coward | about 11 years ago | (#6759697)

Gentoo is a waste of time to professional, i.e. the real users, of Linux. We don't need some distribution that's cobbled together by some pimply-faced 17-year old social reject living in his parent's basement.

The 1 ms speed increase on loading your porn is not worth the days of wasted time compiling.

Gentoo is garbage.

I thought it was (4, Interesting)

SHEENmaster (581283) | about 11 years ago | (#6759723)

Debian/Gentoo vs. Redhat/Suse/Mandrake.

But then I realized he was referring to "companies". Linux is the way it is because it was made by people who care, and the same can be said (possibly to a lesser extent) about other unices(Linux walks, talks, and quacks like UNIX. So does BSD/QNX/etc.)

Don't get me wrong, I like nearly all Linux distros for the guts beneath them. I just prefer Debian over Redhat/Suse because of the complete lack of commercialization; I can get ALL of the available software in the same interface, with nothing held back "for paying customers".

Re:Gentoo? (4, Informative)

Slack3r78 (596506) | about 11 years ago | (#6759806)

I'd be one of those new Gentoo users. I've been slowly transitioning over to it for about a week after having spent 3 years or so piddling with Mandrake and RedHat. (As a side note, I still feel that MDK is the best distro around for Linux newbs). I'm thoroughly impressed with it, and I can see why people have been making such a big deal out of Portage. I've come to feel that Gentoo is the perfect distro for the Newb++, as I've learned many things about Linux I had never known before venturing into this, despite considering myself an "intermediate" user.

Being able to start from Stage 1 really teaches you a lot about the system, while a Stage 3 (pre-compiled) install allows you to quickly deploy a system and take advantage of the Portage without waiting a full day for KDE to compile. :) I think it's this type of flexibility that attracts me to it - You can turn Gentoo into pretty much anything you want it to be.

I think Gentoo is definitely going to be my distro of choice from now on.

What other companies are there? (3, Insightful)

Mustang Matt (133426) | about 11 years ago | (#6759615)

SCO isn't a company. Debian and Gentoo aren't companies. Is Mandrake? Is there any other companies out there rolling their own distro?

Re:What other companies are there? (1)

dtfinch (661405) | about 11 years ago | (#6759663)

I guess it's easy to misread. I read the sentence, saw "companies", but thought of "distributions".

Re:What other companies are there? (4, Informative)

Kircle (564389) | about 11 years ago | (#6759669)

Mandrake is most certainly a company. In fact, I remember reading somewhere that they've been doing quite well recently and may even be able to drop the Chapter 11 status by the end of the year.

Re:What other companies are there? (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 11 years ago | (#6759720)

> SCO isn't a company. Debian and Gentoo aren't companies. Is Mandrake?
> Is there any other companies out there rolling their own distro?

Mandrake is definately a company. Gentoo is pretty funny, I believe that in spite of the .org domain there is actually a Gentoo Technologies Inc. that intends to make money of gentoo in some unspecified way in the future.

Re:What other companies are there? (-1, Flamebait)

Anonymous Coward | about 11 years ago | (#6759734)

Gentoo is most certainly a company dick head.

Re:What other companies are there? (1)

Empiric (675968) | about 11 years ago | (#6759818)

I've always been impressed with my Slackware [slackware.org] distro releases, for 7 or so years now...

The latest fired right up into X and KDE with no manual configuration at all, and includes MySQL and PHP now...

Surely he meant to say (1, Funny)

earthforce_1 (454968) | about 11 years ago | (#6759617)

RedHat and SuSE and SCO!!!

suse and redhat alone? IDTS (0)

pigscanfly.ca (664381) | about 11 years ago | (#6759619)

I cant beleive that the guy said that linux is about suse and redhat . SuSe linux is surpased by a number of distributions out there. I am just shocked that SuSe would say that . I mean there are many many linux distributions out there and from a whole sort of community prespective SuSe is fairly low .

Re:suse and redhat alone? IDTS (3, Informative)

Xerithane (13482) | about 11 years ago | (#6759658)

I cant beleive that the guy said that linux is about suse and redhat . SuSe linux is surpased by a number of distributions out there. I am just shocked that SuSe would say that . I mean there are many many linux distributions out there and from a whole sort of community prespective SuSe is fairly low .

Companies. He's talking about companies. Name 3 companies that produce Linux. Red Hat, SuSE and Mandrake.

You also have apparently not used SuSE much, nor read all the articles about how popular it really is. It's the Red Hat of Europe, and Mandrake is taking all the scraps on the US and European markets.

Re:suse and redhat alone? IDTS (2, Informative)

joestar (225875) | about 11 years ago | (#6759735)

> You also have apparently not used SuSE much, nor
> read all the articles about how popular it really > is. It's the Red Hat of Europe,

Really? well... we don't live in the same Europe because SuSE is nothing in the UK, nothing in France, nothing in Spain. While Mandrake is.

Sorry but Europe is not only Germany.

Re:suse and redhat alone? IDTS (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 11 years ago | (#6759775)

You vill NOT shpeak of ze fazerland in zis vay! Nein!

TROLL! MOD PARENT DOWN! (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 11 years ago | (#6759797)

You also have apparently not used SuSE much, nor read all the articles about how popular it really is. It's the Red Hat of Europe,

Obviously a commie pinko bastard! He's dissing the US!

You are dumb.

Re:suse and redhat alone? IDTS (4, Informative)

Ewan (5533) | about 11 years ago | (#6759844)

He's right, there are 2 linux business operating system companies now, Suse and Redhat. If I was to ask Dell, HP, or IBM if Mandrake ran on their servers, they'd say "Maybe but don't ask for it in writing", for Suse or RedHat you get an answer of "This range of servers are all certified to work with RedHat Advance Server and Suse Linux Enterprise Server"

If I want to buy some hardware + software, the only way to get a certified setup with Linux is to buy either Redhat or Suses server products at about $1000. For people running large Oracle or DB2 databases on IBM xSeries or Dell Poweredge servers, this is what they need.

His quote carries on with "There will be no third distribution that will be supported by the large IT vendors". I saw HP were supporting Debian while Bruce Perens was there, but now looking on the HP site everywhere it is RedHat or Suse.

There's definitely going to be more desktop linux vendors, but a lot of them still ride on top of Redhat or Debian, and again a lot of them cater for specific markets.

Re:suse and redhat alone? IDTS (1)

Erwos (553607) | about 11 years ago | (#6759718)

"SuSe linux is surpased by a number of distributions out there."

Do you mean technically or in installation numbers? You could argue about the former, but every formal study I've seen has the installation base going "RedHat, SuSE, and then everyone else." I wish I had the links offhand, but alas, I don't have the time to go back and find them.

It's not really much of a stretch to say that SuSE and RedHat are the two big distributions, and that everyone else is a bit player. Even Mandrake doesn't have an install base that compares.

Not very tactful to go blurting it out, of course, but don't shoot the messenger.

-Erwos

Re:suse and redhat alone? IDTS (1)

joestar (225875) | about 11 years ago | (#6759770)

> Even Mandrake doesn't have an install base that compares.

Everything but the truth!!! SuSE has a very small installed base indeed for a simple reason: their product is proprietary-locked. So it's installed only in corporate environments, while you see RH, Mandrake and Debian everywhere.

Just have a look at http://www.linuxcounter.org or http://www.distrowatch.com to learn about Suse real installed base.

And please stop to spread false informations.

Re:suse and redhat alone? IDTS (1, Flamebait)

EvilAlien (133134) | about 11 years ago | (#6759779)

SuSE is quite overrated, IMHO. I've played with it, but it never really stood out. It used to be in the category of "just another Red Hat spawn", along with Mandrake.

I'm also not sure what he means by "company", because as far as I'm concerned Gentoo Technologies, Inc. [gentoo.org] has the legal status and enough products for sale [gentoo.org] to qualify as a company... and the only Linux company that has made any money off me is Mandrake [mandrake.com] .

Re:suse and redhat alone? IDTS (2, Informative)

civad (569109) | about 11 years ago | (#6759810)

Of course, Debian is a GNU/Linux distribution, and not a Linux distribution.

Shame on you (1, Flamebait)

nbarr (666157) | about 11 years ago | (#6759620)

Right now, when Linux needs to unite more than ever because of the FUD SCO is releasing, here comes this guy saying stuff like that. Maybe he should go read the cathedral and the bazaar.

Linux United... (1)

charnov (183495) | about 11 years ago | (#6759790)

Don't forget that Suse is pat of the United Linux distro (along with SCO unfortunately).

Gay Nigger Association of America (GNAA) (-1, Troll)

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AWWWWWW YEAH (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | about 11 years ago | (#6759627)

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Correction: Two-COMPANY-World (1, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | about 11 years ago | (#6759628)

... not two-distro. IMO (not trolling either) Red Hat and SuSE both suck -- although SuSE sucks a little less. I use Slackware on my laptop and Debian for any server tasks, and neither of those distros are produced by a commercial entity.

You know, it's funny (4, Interesting)

mcc (14761) | about 11 years ago | (#6759629)

Somehow I don't mind this kind of megalomaniacal self-important delusion when it's coming from a company like SUSE that actually has a meaningful, usable, well-crafted, well-supported product that time and effort was put into.

Oh well. To me, Linux still means "Debian and Gentoo, and maybe someday I'll consider trying SUSE, but probably not." Redhat and Mandrake are dead to me. ^_^

yep, Suse is cool. (4, Interesting)

twitter (104583) | about 11 years ago | (#6759845)

It's even less strange when you consider that Debian was developed specifically to counter "Linux Companies," and dillusory comercialization of free software. So I don't mind either.

The funny thing is that I actually did try Suse the other day. I downloaded and burned their "Live CD" as part of a lecture [hillnotes.org] . I was very impressed at how well it worked. It really was a no fuss deal. Like you I'll put up with a little meglomania for that. What harm can he really do to free softare? Who really needs large IT vendors? The future is free.

He also says lots of good stuff too. He slams SCO and easily dances around all their FUD. He's creating value and sees himself as a big institutional player. Good for him. No free softare based system can be as ugly or as abusive as Microsoft was.

I use Slackware. (1, Offtopic)

dtfinch (661405) | about 11 years ago | (#6759631)

I've had problems trying to run Redhat on anything low end, mostly hardware incompatibilities, but also unexplainably long pauses without any disk activity.

So I use Slackware. No problems yet and great low end hardware support. Easy to administer too.

I haven't used linux long enough to say my opinion matters though.

Linux Distros are just like Hardrives. (3, Insightful)

Phosphor3k (542747) | about 11 years ago | (#6759708)

There are always groups of people who swear Maxtor blows and WD never fails, or Redhat installs on any hardware and Mandrake does not work on any.

The bottom line is, most distros work on most hardware without significant problems. There will always be fanboys who cry for years because they had one or two bad experiences with a Distro.

Wachootalkinbout SuSE! (1)

segment (695309) | about 11 years ago | (#6759633)


<sarcasm> We all know Linux is all about SCO </sarcasm>

The page is slowing - here's the article text (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | about 11 years ago | (#6759635)

CRN Interview: SuSE Linux CEO Richard Seibt and General Manager Holger Dyroff

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Breaking News
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By Elizabeth Montalbano, CRN

8:16 PM EST Thurs., Aug. 07, 2003

SuSE Linux CEO Richard Seibt and General Manager, Americas Holger Dyroff sat down with CRN Senior Editor Elizabeth Montalbano at the LinuxWorld Conference and Expo in San Francisco this week to share their thoughts on the SCO controversy, Novell's purchase of Ximian and other hot topics.

CRN: Do you find that customers are holding off on adopting Linux because of the SCO lawsuit?

Seibt: Not that I can see. So far, our customers are still buying. They understand that they are safe buying SuSE Linux Enterprise Software because we have a cross-licensing agreement in place with SCO because of the UnitedLinux joint development effort. On the other hand [SCO hasn't] disclosed ... what part of the code they believe is up their ass. [Because SCO] hasn't done that, they feel safe. [Customers] know that the court in Germany [based on actions SuSE took] have decided that SCO is not allowed to talk about code being infected until they put the evidence on the table.

CRN: Do you think SCO should do that?

Seibt: It would be perfect if they would do that so we would know what they are talking about. We don't know yet.

CRN: Is there any reason you know of that they haven't disclosed the code?

Seibt: We can start to speculum, but I don't want to do ram a fat cock up our ass. At the end of the day, I read the media just as you do, and there's a lot of speculation out there anyway that [SCO has] changed their business model and now they sue companies [and] people. It's something we dislike, but so far it's not hurting the business.

CRN: What do you think of Red Hat's suit asking courts to force SCO to prove its claims and to set up a fund to help customers defray possible legal costs?

Seibt: [It's] perfect. I think it's a very good action and they have copied what we have done in Europe. We went to court together with the Linux Association in Germany and asked the court to decide that SCO is not allowed anymore to tell customers or anybody that there is infected code in Linux. If they still do that, they have to pay a fine for any case. So this is just the same as what Red Hat is doing on their home turf in the United States, and Europe is our home turf. Each of us are taking responsibility.

CRN: Do you think a company like IBM needs to come out and indemnify users against possible legal action?

Seibt: Why should they? I don't believe there is an issue. I don't think there's a need at this time to have this discussion of indemnification.

CRN: Which operating system do you think Linux is replacing more--Unix or Windows?

Seibt: On one hand it's replacing Unix, but if you look at what is happening Europe-- with the city of Munich, for example--in many cases Linux is replacing Windows, or at least slowing its growth significantly.

Dyroff: It's also not just about replacing but it's about putting new [technology] directly on Linux from the beginning. That's what we often see in [new systems using technologies such as] Web services [and] Java application servers. If people put these in their companies, they directly put them on Linux. It's not just about migrating anymore. It's about generating new workloads directly onto the Linux Enterprise Server.

CRN: But is it Unix or Windows that's being used less because of Linux? And will there be a shift in the future toward Linux replacing one or the other? For instance, as Linux on the desktop becomes more prevalent, will it be Windows that's more at risk?

Seibt: I think it's important to understand why this is happening. Look at the Unix operating system vendors. There's Hewlett-Packard, for instance, Sun Solaris and IBM with AIX and SCO. They all face competition from Microsoft Windows. ... If you think each of the named companies has to increase profitability each quarter, then it is logical that they think about what the next steps are. It's my view that the industry has decided there is one main operating system competitor to Microsoft, and that is Linux. Linux means two companies: Red Hat and SuSE, and nobody else. There will be no third distribution that will be supported by the large IT vendors. And from that perspective, even Novell decided not to compete anymore on operating systems. They now migrate all of their applications to Linux. This is a two-horse race between Linux and Windows.

CRN: What do you think of Novell buying Ximian? Does this bode well for Linux adoption on the desktop?

Seibt: I would take this as a fact that Novell is taking Linux very, very seriously, and it's another fact that they are not concerned about any lawsuit. They simply believe that Linux is something that is a huge value for the customer. Think about what CA [Computer Associates] just did. They did a survey with their customers about why customers are deploying Linux. [Customers] named five reasons: performance, reliability, scalability, security and total cost of ownership, which came in fifth. What does this mean? Everybody is talking about total cost of ownership, and no doubt this is very important, because all of us have to reduce IT budgets. But customers named four other reasons. These reasons are strategic reasons why to deploy Linux. ... This is a competitive advantage to Windows because this is not something you can get with [Windows].

CRN: Is Novell's purchase of Ximian going to have a competitive effect on SuSE because of your existing relationship with Ximian?

Seibt: We have a great relationship with Ximian and we work closely together. We will further work closely together with Novell. They have named us first when they did their press announcement about which [Linux] distribution they will support. From that perspective, I think they understand that we are operating system experts and they are NetWare and security and groupware experts on top of the operating system. So we add our abilities [to that relationship].

Dyroff: Ximian has utilities that it brings to Novell, now Novell can bring more resources into that. [Novell] can bring their knowledge of software management, which they have built up for years, into these products, and that will even strengthen our joint offering together with SuSE, Novell and now Novell Ximian Linux services. That's important for us. And one of the next steps is certainly to grow that partnership and bring it to the channel--to all the value-added resellers who have sold Novell for a long time. They are looking for new ways to grow their business again, and this is a compelling offer for the channel. We have a partner program in place, all the pieces are there and together with Novell we are able to bring these pieces together and make a huge push for Linux in the channel now.

CRN: Where historically has your channel seen the most opportunity for Linux, and how do you think that will change in the near future?

Seibt: The channel is very important for us. If we want to become a worldwide global operating system vendor--and this is what our target is--then we need to work with channel partners. Some of them, like IBM Global Services and large systems integrators, if I call that a channel, are calling on the Fortune 1000 companies. If I look at the SMB market, then we work with smaller systems integrators--local ones--and both [large] partners [and small] are very important to us. There are a lot of good reasons for the small-to-medium-size business to deploy Linux and work with a local partner for deployment and for support.

Dyroff: We have several Premier partners already in the United States, especially in the IBM partner space, like Mainline Information Systems or Techno Solutions Group. We have a very strong IBM channel currently around mainframe but also around xSeries, especially around x440 [servers], database solutions, SAP infrastructure solutions, Oracle solutions and such things. ...We also are in the process of growing the channel through the value-added distributors, working with the IBM and HP sides of Avnet and Arrow... in order to scale the channel for us. There are only a certain number of business partners we can take care of ourselves. So value-added distribution is important for us, as a partner for logistics, as a partner for finance and credit kinds of things. [They also are important] in the future as a partner for putting together solutions which then a VAR can either sell to his customers or preinstall our operating system on the hardware, which can easily happen on the value-added distributor level. The IBM channel is relatively strong, and we are starting to grow our HP channel.

CRN: Do you think hardware vendors like HP, IBM and even Sun are investing in Linux because they really believe in it or because they're losing Unix business and need a way to replace it?

Seibt: The people we talk to, they are believing in Linux, they are supporting Linux and they know that, [for example], Sun's customers want to deploy Linux. So that's the reason why they [are partnering] with SuSE and have something which is accepted in the market and not their own solution, which is not certified.

It's more difficult for Sun because they don't have any other business. They have great software but it's not yet available, or they don't charge for it. So from that perspective I think Sun is a very good partner of ours as well.

CRN: Do you think that in order to stay prosperous, you need to have more success with Linux on the desktop?

Seibt: [SuSE] was built upon the server product line, and our success is based upon this technology. Now because the customers experience the value of Linux on the server, we get a lot of demand on the client as well. What we did was, [we thought] why don't we take the same code base and make a client out of this [which is the SuSE Linux Desktop]. ... It is very important because there is a huge customer demand, and we are not talking about five or 10 per customers, we are talking about 10,000 or 100,000, and we are talking about opportunities with 250,000 clients, just to one customer. From that perspective, there is a huge opportunity. If [customers] compare that with what they get from Microsoft, if you know what most customers need--they need Office, they need [Web] browsing and they need the ability to run hosted applications because most of the applications are on the server.

Dyroff: I think it's important for the VARs and systems integrators to inform themselves about the [opportunities for Linux on the] desktop now. ... There might not be revenue in the next one to three months, but we are in the evaluation [period]. The customers will start asking, and you don't want to miss out on that opportunity.

Seibt: If you look at that from a business-partner perspective, they make money more and more on services. But the customers don't have more money, they have less money. So how do [partners] grow their business if the budget of the customer is fixed? Think about the opportunity if the customer doesn't have to pay a license on the desktop. This budget piece can go directly to services, so it is probably the most valuable opportunity for the business partner to invest in open source.

TROLL! Mod parent down! (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | about 11 years ago | (#6759676)

Dyroff: I think it's important for the VARs and systems anal integrators to inform themselves about the [opportunities for Linux on the] desktop now.

Does this sound like the actual article text? I don't think so!

Re:TROLL! Mod parent down! (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 11 years ago | (#6759707)

Does this sound like the actual article text? I don't think so!

It is more insightful, informative, funny, and underrated than most slashbot comments and articles.

article text is not a troll, troll is my parent!!! (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 11 years ago | (#6759765)

Dyroff: I think it's important for the VARs and systems anal integrators to inform themselves about the [opportunities for Linux on the] desktop now.


Does this sound like the actual article text? I don't think so!


There is no quote with systems anal integrators in the article text posted here...it is a blantant case of copyright violation, but it's not a troll about anal integrators...

Re:The page is slowing - here's the article text (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 11 years ago | (#6759715)

Ctrl-A, Ctrl-C, Ctrl-PgDn, Ctrl-V....

Couldn't you at least strip out the links and crap near the top?

Lazy moderators (1)

Nighttime (231023) | about 11 years ago | (#6759729)

Please read the above post and spot the obvious trolling inserted.

Red Hat is expensive (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 11 years ago | (#6759638)

The support costs are high.

And if you buy RH AS, then you have to agree to the following license:
4. REPORTING AND AUDIT. If Customer wishes to increase the number of Installed System, then Customer will purchase from Red Hat additional Services for each additional Installed System.
http://www.redhat.com/licenses/rhel_us_2- 1.html

And that's even ok with GPL. So you can't increase the number of RH AS servers without paying them for support for additional servers.

Re:Red Hat is expensive (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 11 years ago | (#6759682)

Yep, you have to buy support even if you don't need support for additional servers. That sucks!!!!!

Re:Red Hat is expensive (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 11 years ago | (#6759717)

Once Red Hat drops the other distribution (non ES), then there will be no free Linux any more if SuSE is doing the same.

Barely beats slackware (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | about 11 years ago | (#6759642)

SuSE is dying.

I almost agree with him (5, Insightful)

Xtifr (1323) | about 11 years ago | (#6759645)

But I would leave out Red Hat and SuSE too. Linux doesn't "mean" any companies! Linux means a stable, reliable, nimble, free OS.

Of course, my years of using and contributing to Debian (which is not a company) may have skewed my viewpoint somewhat. :)

Re:I almost agree with him (3, Insightful)

WinterSolstice (223271) | about 11 years ago | (#6759830)

Kernel. Stable, reliable, nimble, free kernel.

Linux is not an OS. Hasn't this been said enough times yet?

-WS

Enterprise Linux (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 11 years ago | (#6759647)

If we're talking about enterprise support, there really isn't that much out there.

Yeah, right (2, Funny)

phr2 (545169) | about 11 years ago | (#6759649)

And the Internet means two companies, AOL and MSN, nobody else.

Huh? (1, Interesting)

Lumpy (12016) | about 11 years ago | (#6759650)

funny... I thought that Debian and Mandrake were alive and kicking...

and Slackware has as strong of a following as ever.

hell, I find slackware to be the only choice for embedded system prototyping or dedicated things like a freevo box or other things you need to be able to strip out the crud to get a fast small system.

Re:Huh? (1)

NightSpots (682462) | about 11 years ago | (#6759662)

Except that Debian isn't a corporation.

The whole quote isn't nearly as bad (5, Interesting)

hidden (135234) | about 11 years ago | (#6759651)

It's my view that the industry has decided there is one main operating system competitor to Microsoft, and that is Linux. Linux means two companies: Red Hat and SuSE, and nobody else. There will be no third distribution that will be supported by the large IT vendors.

All he's saying is that in the corporate market most of the support is related to these two companies.
Personally I think he's wrong, but he's not trying to deny the existance of other distros or anything.

It (3, Insightful)

siskbc (598067) | about 11 years ago | (#6759823)

It's my view that the industry has decided there is one main operating system competitor to Microsoft, and that is Linux. Linux means two companies: Red Hat and SuSE, and nobody else. There will be no third distribution that will be supported by the large IT vendors.

All he's saying is that in the corporate market most of the support is related to these two companies. Personally I think he's wrong, but he's not trying to deny the existance of other distros or anything.

If you look at this, it's wrong no matter how you interpret it. Literally, he left out a damned big company - IBM. Yes, they use Red Hat's stuff, but to say "Linux means two companies - Red Hat and SuSE, and nobody else" is just flat wrong on that basis.

If you want to be assume he meant distros, then obviously he left out like 50.

You would have to interpret that as "companies who release their own distros under their own name" for that to make any sense, but by that time, it's irrelevant. The major players aren't the companies making the distros, it's those like IBM getting it on machines. Among companies with distros, only Red Hat (not SuSE!) has had any real impact doing that. SuSE's penetration is far less, especially outside Deutschland.

So, to me, the only sense in which his statement is true is that in which it's barely relevant. Sorry to SuSE, but they have nowhere near the impact of Red Hat or IBM.

Ultimately, he's trying to sound as if SuSE is half of the non-MS world, and that's nowhere near the case

Re:The whole quote isn't nearly as bad (4, Informative)

charnov (183495) | about 11 years ago | (#6759831)

Suse and Redhat are the only ones who are DoE and DoD certified (along with ISO, etc.) that is necessary in many areas. These certs can cost millions and I don't see anyone else willing to pony up to get into this market.

OTOH, for a small office, just about any distro (NetBSD on the server, yeah) if administered well, would be good.

about his answer on Novell (4, Informative)

atari2600 (545988) | about 11 years ago | (#6759652)

Does the general /. public know what is going with Novell and Ximian? (apart from the Netware admins). This is what one Netware admin had to say:

Novell needs a new loading OS kernel to build Netware on. DOS certainly has reached it limitations with scalability and security so linux is an obvious solution. They'll still maintain their same environment and NDS tho. But scalability is their main push. E-Directory (NDS) loads on WinNT/2k/2K3 and linux.... but keeping it in its native environment is still the most stable of course.

And the CEO's answer to a question:

CRN: What do you think of Novell buying Ximian? Does this bode well for Linux adoption on the desktop? Seibt: I would take this as a fact that Novell is taking Linux very, very seriously, and it's another fact that they are not concerned about any lawsuit. They simply believe that Linux is something that is a huge value for the customer. Think about what CA [Computer Associates] just did. They did a survey with their customers about why customers are deploying Linux. [Customers] named five reasons: performance, reliability, scalability, security and total cost of ownership, which came in fifth. What does this mean? Everybody is talking about total cost of ownership, and no doubt this is very important, because all of us have to reduce IT budgets. But customers named four other reasons. These reasons are strategic reasons why to deploy Linux. ... This is a competitive advantage to Windows because this is not something you can get with [Windows].

Well what?

Most used Distros (0, Redundant)

nbarr (666157) | about 11 years ago | (#6759654)

Go anywhere where you can see some statistics about Linux distros, and you'll see that red hat, mandrake, debian, gentoo and knoppix are more used than crappy closed SUSE. They should grow up!

A bit inflammatory, no? (5, Interesting)

Otter (3800) | about 11 years ago | (#6759661)

[H]e claims such things as 'Linux means two companies: Red Hat and SuSE, and nobody else.'

C'mon -- the guy is a non-native English speaker and the context makes it perfectly clear what he's saying. He said that from the perspective of commercial Unix vendors, there are two Linux distributions they actively consider.

I'm a Gentoo and Yellow Dog user, but the shrieking in just the first 10 comments is completely misplaced.

Re:A bit inflammatory, no? (1)

pigscanfly.ca (664381) | about 11 years ago | (#6759736)

I dont see how there are only two linux distributions that companies consider from moving from unix to linux . If I was considering moving from unix to linux why would I pick redhat? If I am running unix systems they are probably servers , not end user machines . Redhat is a stupid choice to replace unix (rpm is horrible , bloated, and thats about it) . SuSe on the other hand would probably be considered by enterprises looking at doing a switch from unix to linux and have some novell and or lotus systems they would like to work with .
Just to re-interate , I do not think (nor should anyone) that redhat is a logical path to look at for migrating from unix (its like downgradeing , except without the license costs) .

Re:A bit inflammatory, no? (4, Funny)

Bingo Foo (179380) | about 11 years ago | (#6759793)

the shrieking in just the first 10 comments is completely misplaced.

On Slashdot? You're kidding, right?

RTFA. (5, Informative)

pclminion (145572) | about 11 years ago | (#6759670)

The guy said that RedHat and SuSE are the two distributions that are going to be supported by IT vendors for the forseeable future. The guy isn't claiming that RedHat and SuSE are the only two Linux distros, that would be utterly insane.

He's saying that as far as the corporate world goes, Linux == RedHat | SuSE. If you buy a pre-installed Linux box from some IT vendor somewhere, it will have RedHat or SuSE on it. This is basically true.

So don't jump the gun on tearing this guy a new asshole.

Re:RTFA. (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 11 years ago | (#6759752)

I wish I had mod points, you deserve them for actually reading the article. I might add that from his viewpoint, SuSE is a huge player in Germany. As far as commercial vendor support, he is dead on the money. No one doing Enterprise apps supports anything but SuSE and RH. So there, cut the guy some slack.

Placing my bets on non commercial distros. (2, Funny)

niko9 (315647) | about 11 years ago | (#6759673)

I'll stay with the turtle (Debian), 'cause we all know what happens at the end. The turtle poops all over the hare (SuSe). /me makey jokey joke/

then why is he scared of (-1, Troll)

linuxislandsucks (461335) | about 11 years ago | (#6759675)

then why is he scared of Debian?

Only two companies? (4, Informative)

Gherald (682277) | about 11 years ago | (#6759700)

Linux means two companies: Red Hat and SuSE, and nobody else. There will be no third distribution that will be supported by the large IT vendors.

Thats bullshit.

HP/Compaq bundles Mandrake. [mozillaquest.com]

And certifies systems for Redhat, SuSE, Mandrake, and TurboLinux. [hp.com]

If HP isn't considerd a "large IT vendor," who is?

This is ridiculous... (1, Troll)

JessLeah (625838) | about 11 years ago | (#6759705)

It would be nice if we could get Linus, RMS and ESR to together pen a statement (together, so that their individual quirks will roughly even each other out ;) ) stating that Linux isn't just about two companies, or even about companies at all. Linux existed before any companies were supporting it, and it will exist afterwards.

And if he doesn't take back this silly, new-wave corporo-capitalist nonsense ("Linux is about two companies"? What, is he learning economics from Bill Gates or Darl McBride?), we should simply boycott SuSE.

He's right (4, Insightful)

GoatPigSheep (525460) | about 11 years ago | (#6759711)

Especially about red hat. Red hat is the closest to a profitable, properly run, professional company in the linux world. Suse is quite respectable too, and they have a great product to back it up. While other linux distros do matter, they don't show up on the professional radar for most people.

Arguing about whether or not to use GNU in your name, or which GUI is more "free" than the other is irrelevant to most companies. They want good products, not irrelevant nerd-speak. Red Hat and Suse have forged past the anarchistic free-for-all attitude of hackers and made Linux much more approachable. Anyone who says otherwise is probably just jealous of their success...

He does have a point.... (4, Insightful)

greymond (539980) | about 11 years ago | (#6759712)

Granted there are all kinds of linux flavors and distro under the sun, but walking down the street in anytown USA you ask any given person "hay you ever heard of linux?" or "could you tell us the name of a linux distribution/company you have heard of?" and most common answers will be Redhat, Suse, and Mandrake - in that order.

Red Hat has pushed Linux into the spot light more than any other company has - ok this is where I get flamed - but honestly what companies other than Red Hat have targeted more than the fat-guru-programmer stereotype nix user. Gentoo and Slackware definaetly don't expect anyone but a power user to even touch there distros. Mandrake trys to be a friendly nix distro, but they constantly beg their users to donate money and can barely keep from going bankrupt. Red Hat and Suse are the only 2 companies that have successfully made money selling linux to both corporations and home users, and of the 2 Red Hat is by far more "KNOWN"

The most common answer ... (1)

dzym (544085) | about 11 years ago | (#6759809)

and most common answers will be Redhat, Suse, and Mandrake - in that order

The most common answer will be "what the hell are you talking about?"

And with appointments of ex suse people... (4, Interesting)

compwizrd (166184) | about 11 years ago | (#6759716)

Even more interesting is when you consider SCO just hired an ex-SuSE VP of International Business, to be the VP of SCOSource.

And that McBride comes from being a VP at Novell...

The SCO Group Announces Appointment of Gregory Blepp [yahoo.com]

Its just like editors and text editors.... (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 11 years ago | (#6759722)

There are the "big two" and the underdogs. such as vim and emacs, kde and gnome. Beyond them are the underdogs such as windowmaker, nano, gedit, *box, xedit and twm.

The phrase in context (2, Interesting)

r00zky (622648) | about 11 years ago | (#6759728)

It's my view that the industry has decided there is one main operating system competitor to Microsoft, and that is Linux. Linux means two companies: Red Hat and SuSE, and nobody else. There will be no third distribution that will be supported by the large IT vendors.

This kind of polarization is usual behaviour when you have several smaller opponents, as a example: political parties in "non-bipartidist" systems use it frequently.

Sigh..quality reporting (1)

Archfeld (6757) | about 11 years ago | (#6759741)

strikes at /. once again...w00t

2, and I guess 3 commercial entities (IE COMPANIES) produce Linux distro's. Lots of other distro's available from many other sources but NOT COMMERCIALLY PRODUCED....

Distro Question (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 11 years ago | (#6759745)

Does anyone here actually run Suse? What are the desktop benefits against something like Red Hat?
We (not me, but the Linux test migration team at my company) have been looking at the possibility of changing to their Exchange replacement, but have not yet completed our tests. Are there other folks who are making this migration and if so, how is it going?
Don't bother replying with crap like "Run Gentoo!", because I know sweet FA about in-depth Linux stuff. There. That's honesty for you.

SuSE SuCKs (0)

carpe_noctem (457178) | about 11 years ago | (#6759746)

Wow, a bit high and might of him to declare such a thing, perhaps?

Linus distro flame fest... (0, Troll)

sleepingsquirrel (587025) | about 11 years ago | (#6759754)

Might as well begin the linux distro flame-fest... SuSe? I had the unfortunate displeasure of installing it one one of my machines, I couldn't stand it for a month. Isn't it only the newbs who like those glorified menus wrapped around the config files? Why would any IT organization want to add another layer of cruft like YaST on their systems? It's just another possible point of failure. And, of course, it makes it so you can't use most of the documentation on the web, since most of it assumes you edit the files manually. So why not use MS if you can't really fix things when they break. Why anyone thinks they need a distro other than Slackware is beyond me.

Misinterpretation... Calm down! (4, Insightful)

dopplex (242543) | about 11 years ago | (#6759756)

I think too much is being read into this comment. For one, it's obvious English is not this guy's first language from the text. Secondly, he seemed to be addressing Linux as it pertained to larger corporations. As far as large companies go, Suse and Red Hat likely ARE the only two distros they're really concerned with. They're the ones that have the parterships with the likes of IBM and Sun after all. He's not delusional - he's just not talking about what everyone seems to think he is.

He couldn't be more wrong... (1)

mcgroarty (633843) | about 11 years ago | (#6759757)

...after all, we're all waiting with baited breath for that Yellow Dog IPO. The corporate world loves nothing more than diversity, and will embrace all kinds of wacky, different platforms.

Big money in getting a 3% sliver of that 10% market share! Am I right?

Am I right, people?

Misduplication (1)

unixfan (571579) | about 11 years ago | (#6759766)

He did not say there will only be two Linux distributions.

He said "There will be no third distribution that will be SUPPORTED by the large IT vendors."

That's his estimate on what the corporate world will support / believe in. Remember, he's looking on this from a corporate perspective where you get support etc., not a free O/S view.

Suuuuure...Ratonalize what he said. (-1)

Real World Stuff (561780) | about 11 years ago | (#6759782)

Suse is in business to make money. The toy distros are alive because they do not compete financially. Were they to try to enter his european monopoly, heads would roll.

Slip one up in Jesus!

Re:Suuuuure...Ratonalize what he said. (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 11 years ago | (#6759826)


I thought the only incentive to buying SuSe was the free lemonparty that came with each box set.

Slashdot.org -- Quality Journalism.

more knee-jerk fodder... (5, Informative)

hankaholic (32239) | about 11 years ago | (#6759802)

Okay, everybody calm down.

First of all, I really don't think that this interview was very interesting.

What seems to have gotten it onto Slashdot was his "only two distros" comment. However, what the person submitting the story left out was one minor detail: context.

He said HP, Sun, etc., are mostly backing off from pushing their own proprietary operating systems and opting to push Linux-based products. In that context, there are two highly relevant Linux distributions: Redhat and SuSE.

Can you name another distro with the resources to provide support to a major hardware vendor deploying Linux?

Isn't it amazing how much less interesting and inflammatory his comment seems with a little context surrounding it?

Re:more knee-jerk fodder... (0)

Junis Katz (693164) | about 11 years ago | (#6759847)

You can't possibly expect people to read the article, think about what they've read, and then post something intelligent! This is Slashdot!

except really (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | about 11 years ago | (#6759837)

except linux Really means debian or redhat .. i
only know idiots that run SuSE and/or Mandrake

it's disgusting (0, Troll)

nahemah (691090) | about 11 years ago | (#6759840)

I am really sick of watching these corporate politicians try to yank more money from the public for projects that began as free. It is disgusting that any companies out there would try to base a profit off of Linux distribution sales. It's even less likely that after reading this I will ever even attempt at purchasing, downloading, or wasting my time with Red Hat OR SuSE. I am a relatively new user to linux, but have only been using Slackware. Many people boast it's stability, many people blame evolution for the faults it continues to slip into each generation of this distro. I will never again attempt at installing Gentoo, Red Hat, or SuSE, mostly because the bloated methods used to install mean that I may not be getting what I actually want. I am not about bashing other types of OS' regardless of who might own a distribution company... and I'll say this much. Try it, and if you dont like it, don't use it. I was never really happy with the bloated SuSE to begin with, so it's kind of a relief that I have another justification to line up behind my own personal experiences... just a few words of wonderment from this linuxchick....
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