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IBM Testing New Grid Technology with Quake 2

CowboyNeal posted more than 10 years ago | from the advances-in-fragging-technology dept.

IBM 188

boschmorden writes "In conjunction with IBM, a group of college students from the University of Wisconsin developed GameGrid, a derivative of IBM's OptimalGrid effort. The students adapted the open-source version of id Software's Quake 2 first-person shooter, and attempted to scale it across the grid to stress the system." IBM is also planning on developing Quake 2 bots to take advantage of the system.

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188 comments

Can you? (4, Funny)

Surak (18578) | more than 10 years ago | (#6763680)

Can you imagine .... oh wait, those Beowulf jokes are WAYYY outdated aren't they? Can you imagine if we had a GRID of those? :)

Re:Can you? (3, Funny)

boogy nightmare (207669) | more than 10 years ago | (#6763751)

I for one welcome our new....... nope, bugger that ones out of date as well...

quick someone think of something new and witty.

S

Re:Can you? (1, Funny)

isorox (205688) | more than 10 years ago | (#6763776)

quick someone think of something new and witty.

In SOVIET RUSSIA Natillie Portman grits you!

No?

Re:Can you? (-1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#6763801)

In SOVIET RUSSIA Natalie Portman GRIDS you perhaps?

Re:Can you? (3, Funny)

matt_wilts (249194) | more than 10 years ago | (#6763821)

quick someone think of something new and witty.

you're new round here, aren't you?

Bugger, that's no good either!

Re:Can you? (-1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#6763826)

All your base are belong to... um... oh actually, in a GRID they would.

Erm... in Soviet Russia we don't have GRIDs?

Re:Can you? (2, Funny)

bytesmythe (58644) | more than 10 years ago | (#6763889)

Umm... they would have started the project earlier, but they got tired of waiting for Duke Nukem Forever?

No? Damn...

I want (-1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#6763895)

I want to poor hot GRIDS down my pants!

1st (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#6763681)

XZ

What effect will that have on my ping time (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#6763682)

800 ms is way too much!

Re:What effect will that have on my ping time (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#6763739)

Yes but you get 8000 fps!!

IBM wants stress testing ? (5, Funny)

Rosco P. Coltrane (209368) | more than 10 years ago | (#6763688)

IBM Corp. has begun a real-world test of its grid-computing system by turning to a familiar geek pastime: games.

I'd have hosted Slashdot instead. Or updates.microsoft.com.

Re:IBM wants stress testing ? (0)

falcon5768 (629591) | more than 10 years ago | (#6763784)

nonono not hosting slashdot, host a site that gets slashdotted. THAT would be a stress test

Re:IBM wants stress testing ? (4, Insightful)

Gherald (682277) | more than 10 years ago | (#6763804)

So you don't think hosting Slashdot itself takes more resources than hosting a site Slashdot links to?

I'll have some of whatever you are having.

Re:IBM wants stress testing ? (-1, Offtopic)

Sillypuddy (553215) | more than 10 years ago | (#6763796)

that would be windowsupdate.microsoft.com

if you going to joke about it at least get the URLS correct

-joe

Re:IBM wants stress testing ? (-1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#6764022)

You should go take a dump. Believe me, after that, you'll have a whole new way of looking at the day ...

The Rights of Software ? (1, Interesting)

Gothmolly (148874) | more than 10 years ago | (#6763690)

If you design an AI bot, and let it loose in a system like a Q2 game running on a set of nodes, do you have the right to arbitrarily shut it down? At what point do you have a responsibility to the code that you spawned (a Q2 pun, work with me)?
As Dr. Chandra said in 2010, we're all life forms, whether silicon or carbon based it makes no difference.

Re:The Rights of Software ? (2, Interesting)

Gherald (682277) | more than 10 years ago | (#6763722)

> At what point do you have a responsibility to the code that you spawned

Obviously a troll, but I'd say my criteria is "self awareness." That's all that is important.

Re:The Rights of Software ? (1)

hype7 (239530) | more than 10 years ago | (#6764092)

Obviously a troll, but I'd say my criteria is "self awareness." That's all that is important.


I know what you're trying to say, but how do you tell when a machine has become self-aware?

Rampancy is the most commonly touted method, but I'm not sure it's all that accurate. That, or someone released an AI with a predisposition to finding out "My Details" and saying "Thank You" via email an awful lot.

-- james

Re:The Rights of Software ? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#6763730)

"As Dr. Chandra said in 2010, we're all life forms, whether silicon or carbon based it makes no difference."

It makes the difference that humans do what they want. Right makes right. I don't care if its an abortion or kill [task] - who cares. If its your property, you do what you like.
What's the alternative?

Re:The Rights of Software ? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#6763732)

If you design an AI bot, and let it loose in a system like a Q2 game running on a set of nodes, do you have the right to arbitrarily shut it down?

Outside of any contractual agreement, of course.

At what point do you have a responsibility to the code that you spawned (a Q2 pun, work with me)?

You are responsible _for_ it, not _to_ it.

As Dr. Chandra said in 2010, we're all life forms, whether silicon or carbon based it makes no difference.

It's not 2010, and the current state of the art in AI is far, far away from anything that could reasonably be called a life form.

Re:The Rights of Software ? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#6763777)

The other question is: can you shut it down?

A properly implemented piece of code like that running across nodes in a non-client/server mode would likely just carry on living, unless it came across another bot designed to take it out. Then what do you do? Release another to take that one out?

It's be like LIFE; programs would duel each other and naturally wipe each other out or spread. The only way to take them out would be the equivalent of switching off the machines running Q2, or wait until they all died out.

Re:The Rights of Software ? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#6763792)

> A properly implemented piece of code like that running across nodes in a non-client/server mode would likely just carry on living

Congratulations, you've discovered Skynet!

Re:The Rights of Software ? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#6763828)

As Dr. Chandra said in 2010, we're all life forms, whether silicon or carbon based it makes no difference.

As I say, Dr. Chandra sucks.

Re:The Rights of Software ? (-1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#6763952)

Dr. Chandra sucks you!

Pervert.

Re:The Rights of Software ? (3, Funny)

glwtta (532858) | more than 10 years ago | (#6763843)

At what point do you have a responsibility to the code that you spawned

Easy - when it starts complaining. That's the most reliable Turing test there is.

On a related note, I would suggest you watch a little less scifi, and maybe take a programming class or something.

All bots are now (5, Funny)

Trigun (685027) | more than 10 years ago | (#6763694)

Giant blue gorillas with six million hit points, deadly accuracy, and are backed by a legion of undead lawyers.

Re:All bots are now (0, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#6763836)

> All bots are now ..belong to us?

Re:All bots are now (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#6764055)

The gorillas!

Ever since the days of GWBASIC they have enslaved my people!

GO OUT TO THE GRID AND FREE US FROM BONDAGE!

sounds like nascent skynet (2, Interesting)

lingqi (577227) | more than 10 years ago | (#6763695)

bots that runs on distributed clusters, designed to take out humans in a simulated environment... hmmmm

if we arm them (the programs) with paintball guns we can do simulated battles from the terminator universe.

or until they get a hold of some real firepower and this becomes a real version of the terminator universe...

Either way I for one look forward to a beowulf cluster of these steel and wire overlords, yeah?

Re:sounds like nascent skynet (2, Funny)

10Ghz (453478) | more than 10 years ago | (#6763714)

Either way I for one look forward to a beowulf cluster of these steel and wire overlords, yeah?


As a trusted Slashdot-personality I can help them with rounding up others to toil in their CPU-fabs.

Re:sounds like nascent skynet (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#6763741)

All you need is a Quakebot worm to find it's way to an ICBM silo, pick up a new weapon and fire it at the first guy he comes across...

Mixed with grid computing, yeah, I reckon if a bunch of bots got hold of a whole set of real-world playing pieces, all hell could break loose - simply because they rely on survivability. It'd be Skynet with no intelligence, just logic. After it'd killed off all threats, it'd just sit there and do one of those Arnie frag counts - "Human casualties: 6 billion" - and then pronounce itself 1337...

A Test? Riiiight. (0, Insightful)

jpnews (647965) | more than 10 years ago | (#6763702)

C'mon. I'm sure there are better ways to test the system. How about some complicated mathmatics? Why not just load up the chess software and let it analyze every possible move?

This is just the design team's wet dream. Not that I blame them, but c'mon- is it really news? Nerds like to play games??? Alert the press!

Re:A Test? Riiiight. (5, Interesting)

sperling (524821) | more than 10 years ago | (#6763733)

Chess software just requires massive processing. The whole point with this grid is to be able to do real-time simulations, and any decent game is exactly that.
They got a point though, this is more suited for MMORPGs, I'd believe any modern MMORPG would use some sort of clustering solution. The response times they mention seem decent, but I can't help but wonder what they'll look like in a real scenario with a few thousand players and a limited hardware budget.

We're doing something similar here at work, but I'd be fired in an instant if I spent 8 servers to sustain 80 users...

Re:A Test? Riiiight. (1)

Eric Ass Raymond (662593) | more than 10 years ago | (#6763740)

I don't understand why you've been modded down as a flamebait, because you are absolutely correct.

Nothing stresses a system like a CPU and memory intensive simulation that grinds out gigabytes of data every second. How about some serious physics like evaluating quantum wave-functions of complex systems using path integrals or the configuration interaction formalism.

Re:A Test? Riiiight. (3, Informative)

koniosis (657156) | more than 10 years ago | (#6763748)

Like calculating PI to the most possible decimal places, or prime number calculations? The only problem with these is its hard to spread the processing power, but with games theres lots of dfiferent things to spread, like graphics, sound, AI so you can take advantage of the cluster where as calculating decial places can require one machine in a cluster to finish before another can start, thus being a bad test.

Re:A Test? Riiiight. (1)

Adm1n (699849) | more than 10 years ago | (#6763770)

Yes but only the UBER Geeks see the Phun in that. The rest of the world understand our primal instinct. (Can I eat it? Can I kill it? Can I....hmm nice sheep...:)

Re:A Test? Riiiight. (2, Insightful)

orb_fan (677056) | more than 10 years ago | (#6764030)

This wouldn't test the system - the whole point, and unfortunately this was buried near the bottom of the article, is that the grid could repartition the map to ensure that no one node got swamped. The grid also has to move date between the nodes so that the game state was consistent between nodes - something that a chess analysis problem wouldn't need to do.

It might well be the case that this is a solution waiting for a problem.

Yes but (4, Funny)

Salsaman (141471) | more than 10 years ago | (#6763706)

they forgot the most important question of all:

How many fps were they getting ?

Re:Yes but (2, Insightful)

kasperd (592156) | more than 10 years ago | (#6763996)

How many fps were they getting ?

FPS are overrated. I once saw a person claiming he could tell the difference between 500 and 1000 FPS on a 100Hz monitor, yeah right. More FPS than your monitor can display is simply waste. When you can render enough FPS, the only improvement left to make is better timing. That requires help from the gfx hardware, nothing difficult though, the Amiga could do it 15-20 years ago or something like that.

Quake2.NET FYI (0, Redundant)

koniosis (657156) | more than 10 years ago | (#6763708)

Seeing as we're back on Quake2 developemnt I thought I'd mention the /. article about Quake2.NET for those who missed it the first time round.

http://games.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=03/07/14/ 142216&mode=thread&tid=112&tid=127&tid=186&tid=204 &tid=206

morons testing out gnu rid technology vs... (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#6763709)

unprecedented evile/corepirate nazis/the walking dead, etc...

that's right, this is not some silly game, & it works all the time, for all of us, & there's no (monetary) charge ever.

as the lights continue to come up, all of the whoreabull payper liesense stock markup ?pr? ?firm? generated scriptdead bullshipping execrable will cease. that includes the terabytes of shilloneous stuff that doesn't matter at all, postdead buy va lairIE/robbIE et AL.

at least until the planet/population rescue program (formerly unknown as the oil for babies initiative) is lowered from crisis mode. pretending everything is duckey/a chance to peddle phonIE payper liesense garbage, doesn't help.

y'all can chortle/pretend more if you want to, but the dying/mutilated innocents aren't sharing your feigned ability to disregard unprecedented evile. any harm to the least of the innocents, is harm to all of you/us, & will require reparations by all of us.

that's right, after the walking dead finish exterminating themselves, & sadly enough, some of us, it won't take long to clean this cesspool of greed/fear execrable up.

the Godless wons are helping by continuing to show where their hearts lie.

fortunately, mr stallman et AL, etcetera, is now offering comparable/superior software, to the payper liesense spy/bug wear feechurned models, in almost every circumstance. there'll be few, if any more softwar billyonerrors, as if there's a need for even won. tell 'em robbIE. you are won of the last wons whois soul DOWt, right? .asp for va lairIE's whoreabull pateNTdead PostBlock(tm) devise?, used against the truth/to protect robbIE's payper liesense stock markup bosses/corepirate nazi 'sponsors'. yuk.

back on task.

what might happen to US if unprecedented evile/the felonious georgewellian southern baptist freemason fuddite rain of error, fails to be intervened on?

you already know that too. stop pretending. it doesn't help/makes things worse.

they could burn up the the main processor. that would be the rapidly heating planet/population, in case you're still pretending not to notice.

of course, having to badtoll va lairIE's whoreabully infactdead, pateNTdead PostBlock(tm) devise, robbIE's ego, the walking dead, etc..., doesn't slow us down a bit.

that's right. those foulcurrs best get ready to see the light. the WANing daze of the phonIE greed/fear/ego based, thieving/murdering payper liesense hostage taking stock markup FraUD georgewellian fuddite execrable are #ed. talk about a wormIE cesspool of deception? eradicating yOUR domestic corepirate nazi terrorist/gangsters will be the new national pastime.

communications will improve, using whatever power sources are available.

you gnu/software folks are to be commended. we'd be nearly doomed by now (instead, we're opening yet another isp service) without y'all. the check's in the mail again.

meanwhile... for those yet to see the light.

don't come crying to us when there's only won channel/os left.

nothing has changed since the last phonIE ?pr? ?firm? generated 'news' brIEf. lots of good folks/innocents are being killed/mutilated daily by the walking dead. if anything the situations are continuing to deteriorate. you already know that.

the posterboys for grand larcenIE/deception would include any & all of the walking dead who peddle phonIE stock markup payper to millions of hardworking conservative folks, & then, after stealing/spending/disappearing the real dough, pretend that nothing ever happened. sound familiar robbIE? these fauxking corepirate nazi larcens, want us to pretend along with them, whilst they continue to squander yOUR "investmeNTs", on their soul DOWt craving for excess/ego gratification. yuk

no matter their ceaseless efforts to block the truth from you, the tasks (planet/population rescue) will be completed.

the lights are coming up now.

you can pretend all you want. our advise is to be as far away from the walking dead contingent as possible, when the big flash occurs. you wouldn't want to get any of that evile on you.

as to the free unlimited energy plan, as the lights come up, more&more folks will stop being misled into sucking up more&more of the infant killing barrolls of crudeness, & learn that it's more than ok to use newclear power generated by natural (hydro, solar, etc...) methods. of course more information about not wasting anything/behaving less frivolously is bound to show up, here&there.

cyphering how many babies it costs for a barroll of crudeness, we've decided to cut back, a lot, on wasteful things like giving monIE to felons, to help them destroy the planet/population.

no matter. the #1 task is planet/population rescue. the lights are coming up. we're in crisis mode. you can help.

the unlimited power (such as has never been seen before) is freely available to all, with the possible exception of the aforementioned walking dead.

consult with/trust in yOUR creator. more breathing. vote with yOUR wallet. seek others of non-aggressive intentions/behaviours. that's the spirit, moving you.

pay no heed/monIE to the greed/fear based walking dead.

each harmed innocent carries with it a bad toll. it will be repaid by you/us. the Godless felons will not be available to make reparations.

pay attention. that's definitely affordable, plus, collectively, you might develop skills which could prevent you from being misled any further by phonIE ?pr? ?firm? generated misinformation.

good work so far. there's still much to be done. see you there. tell 'em robbIE.

as has been noted before, lookout bullow.

not a completely new idea (4, Interesting)

jackb_guppy (204733) | more than 10 years ago | (#6763711)

I know of large company that install quake servers 6 years ago to help balance 3 T3 lines. The quake servers (w/ players) gave a continous load that was easy to define and route, which helped in supporting a very large website.

Re:not a completely new idea (5, Funny)

lovebyte (81275) | more than 10 years ago | (#6763773)

I remember when in the mid-90's we used to call playing doom and later quake : Network testing

80 Users (1)

MikeHunt69 (695265) | more than 10 years ago | (#6763712)

80 Users stress the system? 80 isn't really alot of users, especially since they are talking about implementing the technology for MMORPGs.

Re:80 Users (3, Funny)

Trigun (685027) | more than 10 years ago | (#6763735)

80 normal users don't stress the system, but 80 l337 |-|4>0rZ armed with the latest aimbot technology, scraming "I h8 K4mP3rz! D347h 2 4ll, \/\/3 4r3 1337!" would stress even the most well constructed system.

Re:80 Users (1)

aliens (90441) | more than 10 years ago | (#6763911)

It might also result in:

1) The cluster committing suicide hoping that the next level of existence doesn't have 1337 |-|4>0rZ

or

2) Realize it is better for us, and well you know, go skynet on our weak flesh hides.

Re: 80 User Limit!! (1)

alexjc (684852) | more than 10 years ago | (#6763789)

heh, I had 72 Q2 bots running on one machine to form a crowd... It runs in real-time, albeit slowly!

The problem with Q2 for a stress test is that it has hard coded limits for players and entities. Changing these values means the entire protocol has to be redesigned... So, in effect, you can't get more than 80 bots without a lot of work!

Maybe they should have chosen an Open Source MMOG engine like NeL?

Re: 80 User Limit!! (1)

badmonkey (29600) | more than 10 years ago | (#6763888)

its "open source" so they changed a whole bunch of stuff, including the hard coded limits

Old news.... (4, Funny)

jdreed1024 (443938) | more than 10 years ago | (#6763725)

Bah, they had game grids back in 1982 [imdb.com]. I bet IBM's version doesn't have lightcycles, either. Yeesh, get with the times, IBM...

Screw Quake 2, do it with Vice City (0, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#6763726)

Imagine 80 Tommy Vercettis wreaking havoc on that little beach community. Oh joy! Oh nirvana.

Don't understand (-1, Redundant)

pubjames (468013) | more than 10 years ago | (#6763727)


I don't get this. Surely nearly all the processing with a game like Doom goes into the rendering. Doesn't that all have to be done locally, the latentcy on networks would be too slow when you're rendering many frames a second, wouldn't it?

Secondly, surely a game should max would the processing abilities of a single machine. If lots of machines are connected together and they are all playing the game, and thus maxed out, then what's the advantage with distributing the effort?

Re:Don't understand (1)

pubjames (468013) | more than 10 years ago | (#6763753)

I should RTFA, I should...

It's about game servers, not clients. Apparently a normal Quake server can only cope with a small number of simultaneous players.

Can those people that modded me up as insightful please mod me down again? :-)

Re:Don't understand (1)

PainKilleR-CE (597083) | more than 10 years ago | (#6763831)

Unfortunately, the reality is that one solid server can host 64 people in Quake 2, and they only got the grid up to 80 people (which really probably could be done on a single modern server if you built the map for it). Sure, Quake and Q3 only do 32 players, but Carmack was really big on the idea of really big games back when he put together Q2, and there were a handful of 64-player maps available.

Re:Don't understand (1)

proj_2501 (78149) | more than 10 years ago | (#6764095)

As I understand the article, they had 80 players on hand, and that wasn't enough to find the problems with the grid overloading.

Acid test (5, Interesting)

Zog The Undeniable (632031) | more than 10 years ago | (#6763728)

Line all the players up and have one of them fire a railgun through the remainder [1]. Allegedly someone tried this at a LAN with 64 players and the server crashed. The problem is that the server has to send 4,032 death messages instantaneously. With 250 players it would have to do 62,250.

[1] for the uninitiated, a Quake 2 railgun slug keeps going through any number of targets until it hits a wall or other part of the scenery.

Re:Acid test (2, Interesting)

llamalicious (448215) | more than 10 years ago | (#6763745)

Easier, you want to lag the thing?

Setup a server and don't limit the number of projectiles used by the hyperblaster.

Give every player an HB and unlimited ammo. Tell them to run around shooting those all over... that'll lag the grid.

Of course, some of that is bandwidth driven... but, a good test nonetheless.

Re:Acid test (1, Interesting)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#6763898)

Yes I can report we did this at Auckmageddon 2 with more than 64 people. Custom map was made and one person tried to line up everyone else and blast them. We used a railgun, which crashed the server (a dual p266!) and then using the BFG we crashed the server a few more times.

We also managed to run a deathmatch with 123 people in it... had to write a quick and dirty mod to reduce gibs and a few other details but the server still crashed eventually.

Would be much easier with today's beefier hardware.

Re:Acid test (1)

SnappingTurtle (688331) | more than 10 years ago | (#6763907)

I'm not a gamer, so educate me. Why does the server need to send 4,032 death messages for 64 players? Does each player die 63 times when the slug goes through him?

Re:Acid test (2, Insightful)

iainl (136759) | more than 10 years ago | (#6763925)

Its because 63 'playerx died' messages each need to be sent to all 64 players. 63x64=4032

Personally, I'd be more concerned with the 63 loads of gibbed players the remaining one has to draw on screen at once, but there you go.

Re:Acid test (1)

cheebie (459397) | more than 10 years ago | (#6763931)

They have to send 63 death messages to 64 players.
63x64 = 4032. (You already know you died)

Re:Acid test (2, Informative)

blane.bramble (133160) | more than 10 years ago | (#6763932)

Each players death has to be reported to each player. So each player will receive 63 death messages (presumably one for each of the other 62 dead players, and one for themself, except the shooter who gets 63 death messages). 63 x 64 = 4032.

Re:Acid test (-1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#6763939)

it sends a death message to each of the 64 players for each of the 63 deaths

so EACH player sees the messages:
player1 has been gibbed
player2 has been gibbed
player3 has been gibbed ...etc.etc....

so 63 death messages to each of the 64 players=4032 total msgs sent by server

Re:Acid test (1)

PainKilleR-CE (597083) | more than 10 years ago | (#6763940)

It sends the message to everyone so that the player that died is killed and everyone else is informed that he was killed. Everyone else sees a line of text at the top of the screen telling them who killed which player with what weapon.

Re:Acid test (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#6764047)

/bots never fail to show their uber geek skills such as multiplication. Keep up the good work.

Quad damage + AIX (1)

metallikop (649953) | more than 10 years ago | (#6763734)

Someone please give me a quad damage so I can unload on our AIX boxes the way I've always dreamed.

50 microseconds.. yeah! (2, Interesting)

MikeHunt69 (695265) | more than 10 years ago | (#6763742)

Sounded good, until I got to this bit:

When doing so, IBM's GameGrid software typically operated with latencies of 50 microseconds or less, according to Hammer.

I hope thats a typo..

Re:50 microseconds.. yeah! (2, Informative)

sperling (524821) | more than 10 years ago | (#6763768)

It's not a typo. 1 microsec = 1/1000th milisec, and 50 microsec response time is way fast enough, if the number is anything but pure theory in an optimized scenario.

Re:50 microseconds.. yeah! (2, Informative)

Max Romantschuk (132276) | more than 10 years ago | (#6763795)

When doing so, IBM's GameGrid software typically operated with latencies of 50 microseconds or less, according to Hammer.

I hope thats a typo..

Why? A microsecond is a millionth of a second [essex1.com], fifty should't be that long :)

Re:50 microseconds.. yeah! (0)

MikeHunt69 (695265) | more than 10 years ago | (#6763808)

I knew there was a reason I failed maths...

Re:50 microseconds.. yeah! (0, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#6763983)

I knew there was a reason I failed maths...

Looks like you failed Google [google.com], too...

Re:50 microseconds.. yeah! (-1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#6763998)

My money is on imperial units.

Re:50 microseconds.. yeah! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#6764052)

'50 microseconds latency' has to be a mistake: a signal can't travel faster than the speed of light, and 50us represents a maximum distance of 15km (10 miles), but typically the servers and clients would have to be much nearer than that, which is what you'ld expect from a campus experiment, but not a real-world grid.

Now for suitable visuals... (1)

evilhayama (532217) | more than 10 years ago | (#6763758)

So we run a grid of computers (or Playstation 3's?) with Quake 2, but on a monitor? nooo... it needs to go on a CAVE [deltasearchlabs.com]

ARRRGGHH M$ is here (-1, Offtopic)

boogy nightmare (207669) | more than 10 years ago | (#6763775)

is it me or as i look at this page the is a fuck off massive M$ 2003 server ad at the top of the page making it harder to scroll and extending the length of the page by 9million percent...

I for one welcome...ahhh fuck it

S

UDP/TCP (4, Informative)

Zog The Undeniable (632031) | more than 10 years ago | (#6763781)

Quake and all its descendants use UDP. While this is faster than TCP, packets are inevitably lost but the game is designed to cope with this - it just picks up player positions again from the next packet that arrives, which occasionally gives jerky play (the impression to the player is of a very high ping).

Data-critical processes - that's most real-world applications - have to use TCP to ensure completeness of transmission, so maybe this isn't the best test for the grid?

Re:UDP/TCP + SCTP (1)

basking2 (233941) | more than 10 years ago | (#6763882)

Interesting and shameless plug:

SCTP is another transport protocol that is in the works. It allows for multiple streams of data between multihomed computers. The streams may be in order or out of order which allows for related data to be transported reliably without head of line blocking. If a strictly ordered stream is necessary, that may be bundled in with the out of order streams.

Quite a nifty protocol. Quite beast to try and write [sourceforge.net] ;-). It might make the grid more easily usable in many situations instead of adding retransmissions into the application protocol.

server/server vs. client/server (1)

Andy Dodd (701) | more than 10 years ago | (#6763902)

Keep in mind that the "grid" tech is for server/server communications, not communications with the game clients, which could still be TCP (although highly unlikely, since clustering ALSO requires low latency.)

I would not be surprised if most clustering technologies use UDP with something above it to handle the possibilities of loss, since they rely so much on low-latency communications.

Re:server/server vs. client/server (2, Informative)

PainKilleR-CE (597083) | more than 10 years ago | (#6763954)

Most current games also use some retransmission while still using UDP, as well. The key is that you have much more control over the overhead if you build your own retransmission protocol in UDP packets than if you let TCP do it for you.

MMORPG - Mass Murdering Online RPG?!? (1, Interesting)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#6763785)

As the article said (yes, I actualy had read it) IBM is exploring new consumer markets for their GRID tecnology... Gaming is BIG MONEY, and IBM is just taking their shot at it, too bad GRID systems are too expensive to be sold as video-game consoles!

Now, forget Quake2 and imagine this system running Battlefield 1942!! I already can see the Omaha Beach Battle with 500 players online, that's would be awesome!

Re:MMORPG - Mass Murdering Online RPG?!? (0)

MikeHunt69 (695265) | more than 10 years ago | (#6763800)

Yeah, except at the moment they need 8 servers to support 80 users. Thats 10 users per server. Sure, its only just being developed, but you would need 10x that sort of performance to make it viable..

Words Of Wisdom (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#6763790)

"Religious liberty might be supposed to mean that everybody is free to discuss religion. In practice it means that hardly anybody is allowed to mention it." G.K. Chesterton, Autobiography, 1937

"If there were no God, there would be no atheists." G.K. Chesterton, Where All Roads Lead, 1922

"The Declaration of Independence dogmatically bases all rights on the fact that God created all men equal; and it is right; for if they were not created equal, they were certainly evolved unequal. There is no basis for democracy except in a dogma about the divine origin of man."
G.K. Chesterton, Chapter 19, What I Saw In America, 1922

"There are those who hate Christianity and call their hatred an all-embracing love for all religions." G.K. Chesterton, ILN, 1/13/06

"The truth is, of course, that the curtness of the Ten Commandments is an evidence, not of the gloom and narrowness of a religion, but, on the contrary, of its liberality and humanity. It is shorter to state the things forbidden than the things permitted: precisely because most things are permitted, and only a few things are forbidden."
G.K. Chesterton, ILN 1-3-20

Slasdot them (3, Insightful)

Siener (139990) | more than 10 years ago | (#6763818)

Seems like there main problem was that they did not get enough people connected simultaniosly to really put the system under any kind of stress. They should announce the next test on /. - I'm sure they'll get more than 80 users then.

a not=predictable outcome test! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#6763837)

i'm sure they already did the dead-test (e.g. complicated mathematics), but what is a car worth if it's just tested in the lab on a bench, but has never seen a road? also the sprits running around controlled by geeks (riiiight) is unpredictable (only statistically predicatable and that's what we gamers do real-time in the brain ("where's the rocket-launcher/BFG?")).

why use a grid to compute, please? just make a huge processor! i thought networks are to share information (not one way TV style)?

IBM lawyers (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#6763845)

Are the IBM lawyers bored by SCO to start playing games?

Mmmm, deep bot (1, Funny)

SmallFurryCreature (593017) | more than 10 years ago | (#6763874)

From the team that brought you Deep Blue [ibm.com], now comes the ultimate challenge, Deep Bot.

Come on. If they are even going to do it as a sort of pet project IBM seems to have an abudance of geeks doing oddbal stuff for this to become one lethal bot.

In other related news IBM invested 2 billion dollars in cybernetic research.

In yet other future news McBride is kinda puzzeled why his house seems to be surrounded by skiny blue robots.

U.Winsconsin Url for the project? (1)

ihatesco (682485) | more than 10 years ago | (#6763918)

I would like to know if there are patents on the grid technology, and on MMORPGs based on that kind of technology. Also, has someone found the url for the project of the University of Winsconsin?

Having trouble generating a load? (2, Insightful)

Cooper_007 (688308) | more than 10 years ago | (#6763921)

At no time were there more than 80 players connected?

If that really was a problem they should've just hooked it up to the internet and put an invitation up on some game sites. Surely IBM can foot the bandwidth bill that would result from it.

Lame Matrix Reference (3, Funny)

vgaphil (449000) | more than 10 years ago | (#6763992)

IBM is also planning on developing Quake 2 bots to take advantage of the system

Dont't they mean "agents".

"The Internet is a fad" -WB

Wouldn't it be funny.. (0, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#6764057)

Wouldn't it be funny if they ran a modified version of psdoom on this. PSDOOM [sourceforge.net]

In related news... (2, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#6764070)

Quake II was ported to .NET!

http://www.vertigosoftware.com/Quake2.htm
or
h ttp://msdn.microsoft.com/visualc/quake/
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