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Successful Do-Not-Call Complaints?

timothy posted more than 10 years ago | from the klangen-und-sturmin dept.

Privacy 440

bcrowell writes "After some legal delays, today is supposed to be the first day that the Do Not Call registry will be enforced. Got my first illegal call just now, and strangely enough, when I said I was on the list and started asking for information, the telemarketer said my signal was breaking up (particularly strange since I wasn't on a cell phone.) Has anyone successfully gotten the necessary info from a telemarketer and then managed to file a complaint? You're supposed to be able to file a complaint at 888-382-1222, but their touch-tone system doesn't give you any way to do it. You're also supposed to be able to do it via the web, but there doesn't seem to be any form, although they say "You can file your complaint on this Web site using the File a Complaint page, which will be available starting October 1, 2003." Remember, it may take up to 3 months after you register until they're required to stop calling you." Tales of success? Tales of failure?

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LONG LIVE MAO ZEDONG (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#7195015)

All your factory and softwarew development contract owned by chinese.

eeeeeeep (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#7195016)

eepers, dont think i got fp

Re:eeeeeeep (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#7195031)

yep, i might have been able to win if i remembered to put a subject...darn, i'll have to practice my fp skillz. for now i guess i'll just create opportunities for moderators to look good and mod me down.

Re:eeeeeeep (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#7195087)

Dear Queernuts,

You didn't just miss FP but you utterly failed it.

Love,
CowboyNeal

Re:eeeeeeep (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#7195237)

Also, jackass, stupid comments like yours aren't modded down by moderators, but by the editors. You didn't cost anybody their mod points. You fail it on so many levels it's just pathetic. Shut up and die now. Thank you for your cooperation.

Get the information first (5, Insightful)

miracle69 (34841) | more than 10 years ago | (#7195018)

Ask the telemarketer what company is calling and what company they are calling on behalf of BEFORE you tell them you're on the DNC list.

Re:Get the information first (1)

00420 (706558) | more than 10 years ago | (#7195098)

Ask the telemarketer what company is calling and what company they are calling on behalf of BEFORE you tell them you're on the DNC list.


Exactly. Also, try to make it sound like your interested in what they are selling when you ask.

Re:Get the information first (-1, Troll)

Esion Modnar (632431) | more than 10 years ago | (#7195198)

Also, try to make it sound like your interested in what they are selling when you ask.

IANAL, but if you try deception up front to keep them on the line, couldn't the telemarketer come back and say that you got their info under false pretenses? Would that make any difference?

Sure, it's fun sometimes to try stringing them along for 15-20 minutes, but as soon as you get legal on them, they might want to get legal right back, charging you for lost time, etc.

And if you try saying that was the only way to get their info without them hanging up immediately, of course, their official corporate response will be "our policy is to deal with these alleged DNC violations in a courteous and responsible manner, yada, yada... The customer does not need to resort to deception to address these issues..."

A jury (2, Informative)

www.sorehands.com (142825) | more than 10 years ago | (#7195236)

A jury would not be terribly sympathic to a telemarketer's time being wasted when they illegally called a person.


They are supposed to fully identify themselfs at the begininng of the call.

I LOVE TERA SANTUCCI! (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#7195019)

Re:I LOVE TERA SANTUCCI! (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#7195046)

Mod parent offtopic

Re:I LOVE TERA SANTUCCI! (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#7195066)

And how are YOU not offtopic by posting this, you gay homofag?

Re:I LOVE TERA SANTUCCI! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#7195085)

And YOU?! ... er...

Re:I LOVE TERA SANTUCCI! (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#7195102)

I'm just telling you the cold truth, sand nigger.

I love Ally Hilfiger (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#7195097)

Since it's a slow Sunday afternoon, I figure we can all use a picture of a hot, rich chick:

Ally Hilfiger [akamai.net] (she's the one on the left, duh). And she's legal, too. OK, a bit toothy, but I think a few hundred million dollars would more than make up for that.

Sorry Ms. Portman, Ally is this geek's new dream. Let the hot grits ensue!!

No calls today (1)

edanshekar (656936) | more than 10 years ago | (#7195022)

Sunday is usually a good day for the many "financial" calls I receive. People who want to help me refinance with a second mortgage and get the value out of my home. Funny enough, I don't have a first mortgage, and I don't need the money anywho. No calls at all today or pretty much this week. This is from a high tide of 10-15 calls PER DAY on a single phone line.

Re:No calls today (2, Funny)

chriscooper1470 (674321) | more than 10 years ago | (#7195043)

I haven't received any calls in the last few days. I won't miss the calls in the middle of dinner, but what I will miss is the "game-playing" with the people who called. One of my favorites was the: "What color panties are you wearing?" and see how long you can keep them on line.

Re:No calls today (1)

azav (469988) | more than 10 years ago | (#7195154)

On a call a few years ago, we asked if the caller had any information about Satanism.

Re:No calls today (1)

Daniel_Staal (609844) | more than 10 years ago | (#7195128)

Just a quick note (from someone who just got laid off from the mortgage industry, by a firm that would *never* do that.):

A 'second' mortgage is a type of mortgage. You can have a second with no first, or multiple seconds. It gives more flexibility than a first mortgage, with a little higher rate. (And allows some fun things.)

Of course, if you don't need/want the money then you don't want one.

fggfd (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#7195025)

furst

DNC Site (4, Informative)

dj961 (660026) | more than 10 years ago | (#7195029)

The Do Not Call site does have a form that you can fill out to file a complaint the address is https://www.donotcall.gov/Complain/ComplainCheck.a spx

Re:DNC Site (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#7195042)

Wrong, the complaint form is located at www.goatse.cx [goatse.cx] . Dumbass.

Link to DNC compaint form, but SSL problems? (2)

jerde (23294) | more than 10 years ago | (#7195193)

For our html-challenged posters, that should be a link to the Do Not Call Registry complaint form [donotcall.gov] .

By the way, what's wrong with their SSL certificate? It looks like it's supposed to be a Verisign-issued certificate, but it's coming up as "issued by an unknown entity".

- Peter

By Email (1, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#7195034)

I hunted around for a while. From the "Do Not Call" page, click on "File A Complaint". At the bottom of that page, click on their privacy policy (yes, really).

At the bottom of *that* page are three links to click on to file a complaint. I used to first of these.

I'm still not sure if that was correct... The same suggested an email address, so I just used that instead.

this might work (2, Informative)

1000101 (584896) | more than 10 years ago | (#7195038)

i got a call one time from a telemarketer and went along with it and said i was really interested. i told her that i was busy and asked if i could write down her information and call her back. she agreed. busted. i only did that once to see if it would work and it did. now i don't even answer the phone. caller ID is a wonderful thing.

Re:this might work (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#7195233)

you stole my username fag

Good Luck (2, Informative)

NetNinja (469346) | more than 10 years ago | (#7195039)

You are going to need some very good social engineering skills to try and get that information. Most telemarketers only want YOUR information. When you start asking them for thiers they will get suspicious and hang up.

I forsee a large increase in caller ID being purchased.

Re:Good Luck (1)

Shastao (709401) | more than 10 years ago | (#7195052)

Most telemarketers come up "Unavailable" or "Out of area" on caller ID... it's how we ignore them to begin with.

Re:Good Luck (2, Informative)

EvanED (569694) | more than 10 years ago | (#7195083)

I think there's a law that will take effect around the turn of the year that will make it illegal for telemarketers to block caller ID information.

Re:Good Luck (2, Informative)

jerde (23294) | more than 10 years ago | (#7195235)

I found a 1997 Texas law [state.tx.us] that mandates proper Caller ID identification. But individual state laws are harder to enforce...

The federal law that accomplishes the same thing will take effect next year. From the FTC's page [ftc.gov] :

Requires caller ID transmission.
Beginning January 29, 2004, telemarketers must transmit their telephone number and if possible, their name, to your caller ID service. This will protect your privacy, increase accountability on the telemarketer's part, and help in law enforcement efforts.


That should help. Vigilant anti-marketers should notice any blocked Caller ID, and switch into feigned-interested-consumer mode to gather enough information from the company to report them.

- Peter

Re:Good Luck (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#7195059)

Problem with Caller ID: Telemarketers show up as "Unknown Name, Unknown Number". You can't get any useful info from CID.

Caller ID conspicuous by its absence (1)

yerricde (125198) | more than 10 years ago | (#7195093)

Telemarketers show up as "Unknown Name, Unknown Number".

And almost nobody else does.

You can't get any useful info from CID.

Other than "I don't need to pick up the phone," as Shastao suggested above?

Re:Caller ID conspicuous by its absence (-1)

YourMissionForToday (556292) | more than 10 years ago | (#7195140)

Attention Fucknut:

Microsoft warning dialogues are hardly the fucking keystone of proper spelling. Here's a hint: DON'T FOLLOW THEIR EXAMPLE. Programmers are not role models for spelling, hygiene, or anything important.

Re:Good Luck (1)

fire-eyes (522894) | more than 10 years ago | (#7195065)

You are going to need some very good social engineering skills to try and get that information. Most telemarketers only want YOUR information. When you start asking them for thiers they will get suspicious and hang up.

In some states, such as Michigan, it is state law that if you ask a telemarketer operating out of Michigan for their information, they must give their information to you. That means their company's full name and address, their phone number, and their supervisors name. I'm pretty sure it can be bent easily to force the individual telemarketer to give THEIR personal info, as well. I'm glad we had such a hardass attourney general, who is now our Govenor.

Re:Good Luck (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#7195099)

Too bad she's a nazi chick who had to kill our strip clubs. Either alcohol and topless only, or no alcohol and full nudity. Also lap dances have been replaced with "couch dances". Thankfully Canada is only a 20min drive away.

Re:Good Luck (1)

AddictedToCaffine (713582) | more than 10 years ago | (#7195113)

How can you force them to do anything? All they need to do is hang up before you collect enough information to figure out who to prosecute and you're screwed.

Re:Good Luck (1)

dougmc (70836) | more than 10 years ago | (#7195161)

I forsee a large increase in caller ID being purchased.
As if it even helps. 95+% of telemarketers block it, and even on the off chance they forget and you get their number, it doesn't help much.

I've been on the Texas no-call list for quite some time. I received a local call from a telemarketer using a machine (no human) asking me to leave my name and number for more information. Caller ID gave me his (local) number.

I filed a complaint as we're supposed to. Two weeks later, I received a form letter saying that my complaint needed to have the business's name -- obviously having their number wasn't good enough. And the recording didn't actually give their name.

Argh!

Somebody suggested calling the number back at 3am and asking to have my number removed from their list (since the call probably came from somebody's house.) Good idea :)

Re:Good Luck (3, Informative)

pyros (61399) | more than 10 years ago | (#7195201)

I thought it was illegal (federal law) to use an automated dialer and not include all the pertinent info. Perhaps the phone number alone would be enough to pursue under that law. Also, SBC has reverse phone number lookup for business listings on SMARTpages.com [smartpages.com] .

Re:Good Luck (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#7195212)

Spend some time in the online resources where this type of activity is discussed pretty heavily. A lot of the information can be forged so it appears differently on your CallerID system.

Re:Good Luck (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#7195224)

I forsee a large increase in caller ID being purchased.

Really? I forsee a large increase in caller ID blockers being purchased.

Just karma whoring.. (4, Informative)

wfberg (24378) | more than 10 years ago | (#7195055)

You can file a complaint here [donotcall.gov] .

Re:Just karma whoring.. (1)

elmegil (12001) | more than 10 years ago | (#7195164)

Interestingly, the "continue" button was missing yesterday (10/11/03).

play along (3, Funny)

Delight-Delirium (415145) | more than 10 years ago | (#7195056)

We have a local do-not-call for our state. Whenever I've gotten calls of this nature, I'd just petend I am interested so they start telling me who they are and such, and then I kindly inform them that my number is on the list and they are about to get fined.

Its so much fun, too!

Re:play along (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#7195204)

It's so much fun? My idea of fun is drinking beer or fucking my wife. You sound like a real winner.

Wrong. (5, Insightful)

Kelz (611260) | more than 10 years ago | (#7195057)

Tales of a government program.

I work at my county IS department and everything I do is proceeded by a phone book of paperwork. Expect the DNC list to not work for about a year, after which no one will want to file a complaint due to the 73-page form describing the callers information, company's information, their past credit history, and a ransom note for their 3-month old border collie.

Re:Wrong. (0)

Selecter (677480) | more than 10 years ago | (#7195103)

BAH. Dont insert anti-government rants here.

This is clearly one of the things that the public desires of government to do. I have asked friends of every political background from left to hard right what they think of the DNC list. Every single one of them was for it and signed up their numbers. If they didnt want this, no one would have bothered registering their numbers. Last count was 54 million that did. Thats 54 million households that say ME LIKE THIS. Lets find out over time if it works or not. Some government programs actually work.

Not an anti-government rant (1)

dbavirt (543160) | more than 10 years ago | (#7195132)

Didn't look like an anti-government rant to me. I thought it was more like fortune-telling.

I agree, don't expect it to work. Best case, some telemarketers will decide not to call people on the DNC list. This law is difficult to enforce.

New telemarketers tactic (3, Interesting)

Chatmag (646500) | more than 10 years ago | (#7195063)

This past week I've gotten three phone calls, all from Spanish speaking telemarketers. In the three years I've been here, I have never received any calls from any Spanish speakers, a few Jamaicans, but then with the GF being Jamaican, that's expected. I could hear the "boilerroom" in the background, so I'm sure it was telemarketers. I give them my stock reply, this is not a home telephone number, it is a business, and they hang up. I've always found telling telemarketers your number is a business number cuts down on the repeat calls.

Re:New telemarketers tactic (1)

mosch (204) | more than 10 years ago | (#7195149)

Do they start asking purchasing to confirm the billing address for the toner they ordered, instead?

Re:New telemarketers tactic (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#7195152)

Of course you have. They are calling from the country of their birth! Alas..expect more-much more-of this. Just as IT help support desk jobs were moved offshore to cut costs expect to see more telemarketing firms do the same. They cut costs and circumvent the law. It's easy to farm out this type of work to another country. I don't know if an American based company would still be liable for calls placed outside the US. Does anyone here have that info?

Complain URL (2, Informative)

no soup for you (607826) | more than 10 years ago | (#7195067)

Have you tried to complain at https://www.donotcall.gov/Complain/ComplainCheck.a spx [donotcall.gov] ?

NOTE: Seems like only Mozilla will work when submitting a complaint. At least, that was my experience.

Re:Complain URL (2, Interesting)

Sinus0idal (546109) | more than 10 years ago | (#7195091)

lol, a pleasant change for the better...

Joe IE user: "best viewed with a standards compatible browser, please upgrade to view"

Re:Complain URL (2, Funny)

merlin_jim (302773) | more than 10 years ago | (#7195142)

Have you tried to complain at https://www.donotcall.gov/Complain/ComplainCheck.a spx ?

NOTE: Seems like only Mozilla will work when submitting a complaint. At least, that was my experience.


Ironic, considering that this is an asp.NET site...

Re:Complain URL (1)

pyros (61399) | more than 10 years ago | (#7195174)

how is that ironic?

Re:Complain URL (2, Funny)

iCEBaLM (34905) | more than 10 years ago | (#7195190)

Come on man, ironic, you know? It's like rain on your wedding day or a free ride when you've already paid!

Not working (0)

Pingular (670773) | more than 10 years ago | (#7195069)

This [donotcall.gov] link doesn't seem to be working, so here's the

Re:Not working (0)

Pingular (670773) | more than 10 years ago | (#7195077)

Google Cache [216.239.59.104]

MO No Call List (4, Interesting)

TheBracket (307388) | more than 10 years ago | (#7195071)

I have a client who periodically has us subtract 'no-call' numbers from their calling database (little more than numbers and names, from a phone book). They hired me in a hurry when they started calling people on the Missouri No-Call List by accident. Apparently they were not fined for a single transgression - the attorney general gave them a grace period to adjust after learning of their error, with little more than a verbal slap on the wrist.

I haven't heard from them about the federal list, so I doubt that they are compliant yet. They have voiced an interest in getting out of telemarketing altogether because of the growth/success of the Missouri no-call list; with any luck the federal list will be the last straw that makes them jump.

As an aside, I was surprised by how much money some companies are charging to subtract a list of numbers from a call list; I charged my regular hourly fee, which isn't too much for DELETE FROM call_list WHERE phone IN (SELECT phone FROM AGList)! I later found out that some companies were charging thousands for 'safe' call lists on CD!

File Complaints Here (1)

djn (118825) | more than 10 years ago | (#7195073)

You may file a complaint at this [donotcall.gov] address

did you check the front page? (1)

peterjm (1865) | more than 10 years ago | (#7195078)

the front page [donotcall.gov] has a link to file a complaint [donotcall.gov] . follow that, you'll get your web form.

Telemarketer Information (3, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#7195079)

Got my first illegal call just now, and strangely enough, when I said I was on the list and started asking for information, the telemarketer said my signal was breaking up ... Has anyone successfully gotten the necessary info from a telemarketer and then managed to file a complaint?

As far as I know you just need a few details like the company name and maybe a phone number or something. I've had two telemarkers call since the DNC list went into effect, and both times it was relatively siple to get a website out of them simply by role-playing a "naive but cautious" person, saying something like "Hmm, the offer sounds good, but I'm not sure. Do you have a website where I can find out more infomation, just so I can see that you folks are legitimate?" Telemarketers are usually happy to do whatever it takes to make you trust them. If they don't have a website, you should at least be able to get a phone number out of them by letting them give their pitch for a minute or two, then saying you're in the middle of something really important, but what they're selling sounds very interesting, so if you could just get a number where you can call them back... "And what was the name of the company again? Oh, ok. Where are you guys located?"

Of course, if you start off the conversation with "Hey buddy, I'm on the Do Not Call List", you can't expect to get very far...

But if you're polite and play your cards right, you can easily get all the information you need out of them. (If you really feel the need to dig at them, just save the "Hey buddy, guess what" bit until the end of the call, after you have played the nice and interested consumer and gotten all the necessary information out of them.)

That said, both times I've gotten all the information I could possibly want about the telemarketer, but I'll be damned if I can figure out how to submit a complaint...

Availability of the DNC (4, Interesting)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#7195080)

I work in the telemarketing industry... and let me tell you guys, it's been a bitch to try and get a copy of the DNC. It wasn't even available online until a few days ago and the cost is staggering.

I know... I know... not a lot of sympathy, but still, I work for a business who would like to do nothing more than play by the rules, but all kinds of barriers have been put up in our way.

Re:Availability of the DNC (2, Funny)

DerProfi (318055) | more than 10 years ago | (#7195124)

Easy solution: Don't call anyone until you're sure.

Re:Availability of the DNC (1)

t_allardyce (48447) | more than 10 years ago | (#7195157)

This is because the government and its agencies do not work on an impartial basis. If some grumpy old senator decides hes fed-up with telemarketers then he will try and make life hard. It works on who is friends with who and who is being bribed by who, they live in their own little fantasy world and govern the outside the way they please.

Re:Availability of the DNC (1)

DrkShadow (72055) | more than 10 years ago | (#7195163)

Please, provide your home phone number. I'm sure everyone here is willing to play by the rules when they call you to voice their opinion; nothing bad about that.

So c'mon.. go ahead and post it...

-DrkShadow

Re:Availability of the DNC (1)

dbavirt (543160) | more than 10 years ago | (#7195166)

...the cost is staggering.

You have got to be kidding. Telemarketers are being charged for getting a copy of the DNC list? I thought this was all coming out of tax dollars. If we are charging telemarketers for obtaining the list, what would be so different about charging people to put their names on the list?

Re:Availability of the DNC (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#7195196)

You forget how Congress decided to fund the costs for administering this list: telemarketers.

Yes, they have to pay for the noose around their own necks, and for the hangman, and for the guy tying the knot, and for the disposal of their corpse, and for...

Re:Availability of the DNC (1)

starling (26204) | more than 10 years ago | (#7195213)

Or they could go into a different business. One with some socially redeeming qualities, maybe.

Re:Availability of the DNC (2, Insightful)

madmancarman (100642) | more than 10 years ago | (#7195220)

You forget how Congress decided to fund the costs for administering this list: telemarketers.

Yes, they have to pay for the noose around their own necks, and for the hangman, and for the guy tying the knot, and for the disposal of their corpse, and for...

The telemarketing industry can complain all they want, but if they hadn't been so annoying in the first place, and if they had played by the rules already in place (i.e., not harassing or hanging up on someone when they ask to be put on that company's do-not-call list), then it's very likely this national do-not-call list would never have happened.

As it is, it has, and good riddance.

Re:Availability of the DNC (1, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#7195226)

You know, I can't really feel sorry for them.

Oh, I know, there's supposedly 'good' telemarketer firms out there. But show me a single one, will you?

A good telemarketing firm would be opt-in. It would not simply choose my name out of a phone book, it would call because I specifically instructed them that I'm interested in being bothered with details about their products.

It would not buy lists of numbers from 'associates' - just because I buy widget A from Company Foo, doesn't mean I'm interested at all in doohickey B from Company Bar.

It's employees would listen when I say, "Sorry, not interested," rather than continue spewing advertisement into the phone even as I move to hang up.

All my experiences with telemarketers have proven to me that 'good' telemarketers don't exist.

But then again, upon reflection.. I suppose if they do exist, since I haven't contacted them first, they haven't contacted me. ;)

Re:Availability of the DNC (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#7195187)

I don't know whether to feel sympathy or not. People do get mixed up with the wrong companies by chance, and face tough choices (you either get a job or you don't). What I believes it comes down to is if your work is a vice or associated with one, you should not expect to be around forever. I have no problem with eliminating an entire industry which shouldn't exist at the cost of jobs, and I believe it would be nice if the people could find something.

On that same track there are industries which should exist but don't-- their demand is satisfied by other, over generalized industries. If money is what these people are after there is plenty to be made which will benefit everyone by forcing other industries to be more specialized. I'd rather fail at something right than succeed at something wrong.

Completely offtopic, but there's added hope for anyone who reads this.

Re:Availability of the DNC (1)

taustin (171655) | more than 10 years ago | (#7195210)

I know... I know... not a lot of sympathy, but still, I work for a business who would like to do nothing more than play by the rules, but all kinds of barriers have been put up in our way.

I don't believe you. I don't think anyone in the telemarketing industry wants to follow any rules but the rule of the jungle. I think you, personally, should either kill yourself now, or take up a more respectable profession, like prostitution, or child pornography, or maybe masturbating zoo animals for breeding purposes. Then, when you've regained your self respect, kill yourself in shame.

Re:Availability of the DNC (2, Funny)

ScriptMonkey (660975) | more than 10 years ago | (#7195223)

I work in the crack dealing industry... and let me tell you guys, it's been a bitch to try and get a copy of the Do Not Pedal List. It wasn't even available online until a few days ago and the cost is staggering. I know... I know... not a lot of sympathy, but still, I work for a dealer who would like to do nothing more than play by the rules, but all kinds of barriers have been put up in our way.

Too many ways around this (3, Interesting)

bscott (460706) | more than 10 years ago | (#7195081)

Does the do-not-call law cover companies based overseas, like Bermuda?
Can the do-not-call law be enforced if, when you ask what company they represent, they suddenly don't speak-ee the Eeeenglish? (or "My supervisor is not here, sorry " is the other one I get a lot)
What are you supposed to do when the call is an automated recording?
What about when half the calls you DO get are from exempt organizations, like police fundraisers?

This law is a good start, but don't for a minute think that it's gonna make more than a small difference by itself. Neither does CallerID, at least in my case - between my Mom's number being unlisted, my wife working at a place which shows up as "Anonymous", and her family calling from overseas ("Unavailable"), I'm just lucky my number is new and I only get a couple bad calls a week, 'cos I have to answer them all...

Re:Too many ways around this (1)

dasmegabyte (267018) | more than 10 years ago | (#7195117)

I find that saying "Fuck the pigs" is a fairly good way to get off the PBA call list.

It's all in the phrasing.

Re:Too many ways around this (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#7195130)

What are you supposed to do when the call is an automated recording?
Check your state laws. In many states, even those without their own do-not-call lists, it's illegal play a recorded message as opposed to having a real live marketdroid on the line. In my state, they even made it illegal for politicians to do it, so we don't get any more of those annoying "Hello. My name is Candidate X. I'm calling to encourage you to get out and vote this election. Please vote Candidate X for Position Y! Paid for by the committee to elect Candidate X, John Doe treasurer." recordings on the answering machine.

Re:Too many ways around this (1)

bscott (460706) | more than 10 years ago | (#7195199)

> > What are you supposed to do when the call is an automated recording?
>
> Check your state laws. In many states, even those without
> their own do-not-call lists, it's illegal

Sure, illegal... I ask again - what are you supposed to DO?? If the originating phone number doesn't come through, how do you pursue a complaint? If you call them back at the business number provided, they can easily claim that they hired a subcontractor and never authorized them to perform that sort of marketing. (and the subcontractor has doubtless gone out of business just minutes ago...) If that story is legally unacceptable, then it opens the door to pranks - anybody could make a recording promoting some company they have a grudge against, and call hundreds of people from a rented offshore phone number.

Not really (1, Interesting)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#7195162)

The rules apply to telemarketing calls into the US regardless of where they originate. The FCC has already hit a foreign junk faxer for over a million dollars. Matter of 21st Century Fax(es) Ltd., -- FCC Rcd. --, 2002 WL 27541 (F.C.C.) (Jan. 9, 2002). They tried the "we are not in the US" defense and it was rejected.

Keep a log (I have a printing callerID box, and even if there is no callerID transmitted, it still logs the exact date and time) .... a subpoena to the phone company aond voilla - ID of caller.

The local phone companies don't like it known, but they all can produce what is calls a "call detail report" or verbatum, that shows all incomming and outgoing calls INCLUDING LOCAL calls for any number... but those records are not kept indefinately and you have to get them ASAP.

And don't call BS on me... I get them all the time, and I have collected over $100,000 from telemarketers and junk faxers, suing them in small claims court under the TCPA. Soon I'll start going after do-not-call list violators too.

As for automated recordings, they are ALREADY ILLEGAL [tcpalaw.com] - they have to pay you $500 for each violation... more if they don't properly identify themselves. Play along, and leave a "fake" name with your real phone number... when someone calls you asking for that fake name, bingo, you got them.

Re:Too many ways around this (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#7195171)

Does the do-not-call law cover companies based overseas, like Bermuda?

Who cares. What kind of fool is going to be running a telemarketing operation out of friggin' Bermuda. If you do get a call from Bermuda, just keep them on the phone as long as possible, letting the long distance charges run them into the ground.

Can the do-not-call law be enforced if, when you ask what company they represent, they suddenly don't speak-ee the Eeeenglish? (or "My supervisor is not here, sorry " is the other one I get a lot)

Dude, your social engineering skills must be about zilch. I've had two telemarketers call since the DNC went into effect, and both times I was able to get all the information I could possibly want out of them. You should start working on a new technique. (Hint: Saying "Hey Asshole, I'm on the Do-Not-Call list. Put you fuckin' superviser on the line" is not a good technique)

What are you supposed to do when the call is an automated recording?

What, one of those automated recordings that doesn't tell you the name of the company, the name of the product or service being sold, the name of the website, or even give a phone number to call? Yeah, I get lots of them, 'cause that's a really effective way to sell products... :)

What about when half the calls you DO get are from exempt organizations, like police fundraisers?

Then you must live in a place that gets like one telemarketing call a month, or has one big friggin' police force. Or a helluva lot of charities...

This law is a good start, but don't for a minute think that it's gonna make more than a small difference by itself.

Are you totally out of your mind, or do you just say random stuff whether or not it has anything to do with reality?

We used to get 5-10 telemarketing calls a day here on a residential line that is used for business purposes. Since the end of September we've had two. You understand what I'm saying? TWO calls total since September 28th (they actually stopped a few days before Oct 1), down from 5-10 a day.

Are you honestly going to try to argue that the law didn't have something to do with that, that it was just coincidence. You're loony. :)

My experience (1)

Vegeta99 (219501) | more than 10 years ago | (#7195092)

I registered on the PA Do Not Call list last September.

Since then, I have not recieved ONE telemarketing call.

"National Consumer Council" (2, Informative)

Brian Stretch (5304) | more than 10 years ago | (#7195131)

I got another automated call today from "Jeffrey Caldwell at the National Consumer Council" today. You probably know the message [whiteice.com] . The FTC has heard of them [ftc.gov] . They're a "nonprofit" front for a couple of commercial companies [promomagazine.com] .

I filed a complaint, though that "nonprofit" bit might shield the bastards. Other than those folks, I don't think I've received a telemarketing call in the past few days. Good riddance!

Anti-Telemarketing Script (3, Informative)

Doodhwala (13342) | more than 10 years ago | (#7195137)


One of the most useful resources I have found is the Anti-Telemarketing Script [junkbusters.com] from Junkbusters.com [junkbusters.com] . Apart from this, they also have tons of information on how to stop snail-mail junk, etc. Check them out.

Telemarketers are just smarter. (1)

moankey (142715) | more than 10 years ago | (#7195138)

Like spammers I dont think it will stop.
I too am on this list, and while the donotcall.gov legality was being discussed I tried to gather telemarketer info as the site suggested, name of company, phone number, and address (if possible) to see how effective I could be when it became legal. What resulted is telemarketers just hanging up when they realized the direction I was taking and trying again later in the day or the next day. A game of cat and mouse it turned into as I masqueraded my interest and used that to extract the necessary info, still no dice.

One upside is I am glad its now enforceable since if it wasnt, that list could have just become a big telemarketers dream turning from a donotcall list to a here is a free list 50 million potential calls courtesy of the govt.

Sue you phone company or get caller ID ? (1)

zymano (581466) | more than 10 years ago | (#7195176)

The phone company is partly responsible. We buy phone service not to be bothered every minute.

The phone companies are partly the problem in this whole telemarketing mess. They have used legislative clout to block all means of trying to stop 'do not call lists'.

Sprint in this area blocked one law because they PROFIT(There's that word again!) from telemarketing.

Sue your phone company or try to get them to log all long distance calls to your house .

If they don't then tell them you will cancel and find a another company that cares.

Re:Telemarketers are just smarter. (1)

taustin (171655) | more than 10 years ago | (#7195197)

One upside is I am glad its now enforceable since if it wasnt, that list could have just become a big telemarketers dream turning from a donotcall list to a here is a free list 50 million potential calls courtesy of the govt.

No, actually, that has been a federal crime all along, far more serious than a mere fine.

Not active yet (1)

DzugZug (52149) | more than 10 years ago | (#7195139)

The do not call regestry's enforcement has been delayed by a preliminary injuncion issued in response to some telemarketer's law suit. Thus, it is not in effect yet.

Re:Not active yet (2, Informative)

dacarr (562277) | more than 10 years ago | (#7195214)

Old news. It's active again. Telemarketers who aren't compliant have until Friday to get their act together.

Illinois (2, Informative)

elmegil (12001) | more than 10 years ago | (#7195153)

I had the same sort of thing just yesterday. Telemarketer called, I asked if they'd heard of the do-not-call list, they started giving me some BS about it wasn't being enforced yet. I pointed out that indeed it was, why don't you bother someone else, or better yet, give me the name of your >click< company again?

Luckily for me, I have privacy manager, and the only way that calls come through is if they're identified on caller ID in the first place. So I pulled the name and number and had exactly the same problems trying to find a place to file my complaint. Ultimately, linking from my state do-not-call page (which is really only a front for the federal stuff), I got to a generic FTC complaint page here [ftc.gov] . So that's where I filed my complaint. Good luck.

phone numbers on a silver platter... (1)

HitByASquirrel (710289) | more than 10 years ago | (#7195160)

well... if you put your name on the DNC list... and all the companies have the DNC list... and no one enforces the DNC list... then hey... look at that! you just told all the companies your phone number!

recording..... (1, Interesting)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#7195165)

We got a recorded call from a company telling us we were blocked by the DNC list so they couldn't call us. Talk about wasting time, energy and money. Luckily, my machine got it.

Just the Political Calls (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#7195167)

I registered with the Direct Marketing Association's "Do Not Call" list *years* ago. Surprisingly, it worked fairly well; we went from one telemarketing call per day to one every two weeks. Actually, the only commercial telemarketing outfit that seemed to completely ignore the DMA list ... to the point where I had to have an attorney send a letter threatening them ... was the San Francisco Chronicle.

Recently, though AT&T has become the most egregious offender, calling me at work from what appears to be 6 seperate telemarketing outfits, since none of them seem to know about the others. Unsurprising that they've put a web bug on the Do Not Call registry.

Still these are the exceptions; in the last 4 years, I have received calls from other for-profit telemarketing no more than once per month at home. So it seems that telemarkers already do honor Do Not Call lists when they have access to them, with two exceptions:

1) Charities, because checking the DMA list, or the new DMC list, costs $1000+ per campaign;

2) Political campaigns, because the legislators of course made themselves exempt from regulation.

I suspect that the DMC list will be a failure until they start offering the screening list for free, or screening services at very low cost (e.g. $250 per campaign) with rapid turnaround. Otherwise, some telemarketer will challenge the law in court as "exceptionally burdensome" and they will win.

-Josh in San Francisco

FCC FTC news conference (1)

trolman (648780) | more than 10 years ago | (#7195173)

I watched the FTC [ftc.gov] and FCC [fcc.gov] chairmen in a news conference on cspam last week and they both made clear that all the information will be evaluated, digested, co ordinated; then acted upon with no ambiguities.

Overall IMHO listening to the comments in the joint news conference I think that they will go for the easy targets that get the most complaints first although they refuse to specify methods it is clear that they have the will to enforce.

Our Government in action! Who whould have thunk?

Then again...

stuff complaining... screw 'em instead (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#7195177)


Similar problem in the UK with people 'cold calling' we call it. If I'm feeling pissed off I act very interested and then ask if they would hold a second whilst I turn the TV off. I put the phone down in the bathroom and just leave it off the hook. It can take some companies over 10 minutes of wasted employee time before they give up. They rarely call back. It also has the added bonus of preventing my dad from calling me to ask my silly questions about why his Windows machine isn't working.

How about adding a * number? (2, Interesting)

flatcat (464267) | more than 10 years ago | (#7195178)

What if the phone companies added a * number to dial after you hang up with the telemarketer? Kind of like a *69 to call back the last caller, after you hang up on them you just dial *xx to report a telemarketer.

Before the DNC list.. (0)

LinuxThis (646936) | more than 10 years ago | (#7195189)

I had actually started picking up 'Out of area' calls on my phone about a year ago telling the telemarketers to stop calling, and i have actually noted a huge decrease in the number of calls i get.

An interesting tidbit i've heard from a friend (can anyone verify?) whose crummy summer job was being a telemarketer is that you need to say exactly the phrase 'please put me on your do not call list' or they dont actually have to.

Caller ID helps, to a point.
However, I keep getting this automated dialer thing which when I pick up the phone waits about 30 seconds and then gives me the 'hang up, try again'.. because iof the out of area-ness, my telco can't track it down either, i called their abuse line. How are you supposed to track those guys down when you can't talk to anyone?

Re:Before the DNC list.. (1)

jfincher (312236) | more than 10 years ago | (#7195228)

Working for the "largest telemarketer in the world" I can sympathise. But if your telco told you they can't track the call, they are feeding you a load of crap. I would suggect escalating to abuse management. Tracking a call for the telcos is not dependent on CID.

duh (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#7195195)

christ, there's a link on the left to "file a complaint" and it steps you through a process. are you fucking blind?

I've got no complaints so far... (1)

Josh Mast (1283) | more than 10 years ago | (#7195209)

I sat down today and had one of those moments where it just seemed too quiet. I thought about it for a bit and then realized that I haven't gotten any telemarketing calls in at least the past week. Very pleasent feeling considering I was getting 4-5 a day before.

An easy solution (1)

bihoy (100694) | more than 10 years ago | (#7195216)

I have not had to deal with annoying telemarketers after I did one thing. I got myself a second phone number and made it unlisted. The only number I ever give out it the published number, except to family and friends. I never answer that number. The machine gets it. Sometimes (say once every month or two) I get a telemarketing call on my second line. Usually I know it is before I even answer. That's because the numbers are one after the other and I just heard the first line pick up. Sure it costs me an extra 25 bucks a month but it sure is worth it.

Well.... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#7195222)

I signed up, and the number of free vacation to Disneyland, offers of gutter cleaning services, and debt consolidation calls on my answering machine has been greatly reduced.
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