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BellAtlantic ADSL absurdity

CmdrTaco posted more than 15 years ago | from the amusing-things-to-read dept.

Links 136

Aleks writes "MacInTouch.com has an absurd story about BellAtlantic ADSL and its non-sensical policy about supporting only Windows machines (and only iMac). If you wanna see an excercise in human innanity and corporate logic, read it at here " It pained me to read this. I can't fathom the world we live in sometimes. Anyway this is amusing enough to read, but you might suffer sympathy frusteration.

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136 comments

$60 a month! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#2034910)

And slower than cable. I thought it was going to be $40/month. For $60, I think I'll stick with the 'ol modem. What a bunch of bozos.

BAtlantic ADSL (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#2034911)

I have this service (Pittsburgh) and generally it works pretty well. The techs that setup the line have no concept of what an 'operating system' is, so basically you just need to have whatever they want installed while they are there installing the line. I was forced to install NT on the spot to make the tech's happy, and to prove that the line was working correctly. (BTW - be prepared for a 6-7 hour visit from a bunch of clueless techs.) After that, it was back to linux. Works great!

Borrow an iMac already??? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#2034912)

Hello!

Are all mac users this slow? I had to do this with my Linux box and the @home service. Sure they dina know jack about Linux. I hid the box in the closet , and put a win95 box on my desk. They came. Did their thing(4 hours) and left. Out went the 95 box , in went the Linux box. Done and done..

I suggest that this guy borrow an iMac from some other mac looser and get on with things.

It's the phone company! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#2034913)

It seemed that she had no idea about anyone or anything outside of her office -- rather strange for a supervisor, I think, to be so closed-off from the rest of the company.

Remember, we're talking about the phone company. They actively seek out people like this, if they can't find them, they breed them from within.

Call a Regulator (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#2034914)

I've experienced similiar run-a-rounds with U.S. West regarding POTS (nothing as neat as the ADSL service). After much frustration, a call to the Corporation Commision complaining about my situation resulted in next day resolustion by U.S. West, and several follow up calls to verify my satisfaction.

-- Anonymous Coward --

$60 a month! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#2034915)

I'll second that! I'm up here in Vancouver, Canada and I get a full 10MB/s (both ways) line up to my suite for a mere $50CDN a month. And I don't even have to get a lousy xDSL or cable modem. Just a plain RJ-45 cable and plain Ethernet card.

Yes, that's right, we have fibre optic T1 running into the building :) :) :)

US West (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#2034916)

I use US West's DSL service, and they had no problem with my running Linux. One of their people even knew what it was. You also have the option to "self install" so no tech will come to your house.

You can also just plug your "router" into your hub and all of your machines are instantly on the network.

No Subject Given (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#2034917)

I got myself a nifty cable modem (in the Netherlands), and though the cable company only "supports" windows and 3com cards, I've got a $12 ethernetcard, and run windows and linux dualboot.
As long as you take care of the software installation yourself, they don't really care.

Connecting a LAN to the cable modem is also unsupported, but you are allowed to do it.

Unsupported in this case simply means that if it doesn't work, don't ask us how to fix it (unless you're willing to downgrade to windows).

Monopolies (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#2034918)

A friend was telling me about the local ISP they have where he lives (a very rural area). It's run by the phone company, and there aren't any others in the area. You want to talk idiocy? The guys bought a brand new decked-out server box to handle the main service (mail, DNS, maybe the modem pools too). They then proceeded to strip it of all but 8 megs of RAM (they moved the RAM into a PC so they could play games better in the office, IIRC), and wondered why their fast, expensive new server was slower than their old one.

And want to guess how they deal with people's mail spools taking up too much disk space? Do they buy a bigger hard drive? No. Do they institute quotas? No. They periodically purge user mail spools, and they don't even announce that they're going to do it beforehand. All of a sudden you log on one day and all your mail is gone -- and they do this to everyone, wiping the drive, instead of just deleting the user spools with the most stored mail. You learn real quick to not leave your mail on the server.

I think that this place is the definition of "incompetency".

Amusing? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#2034919)

It might be amusing if you don't live in Boston. The city of Boston has no residential high speed internet access, Bell Atlantic is our only hope (so far.) God help us.

Other BA.net services... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#2034920)

I'm a BellAtlantic.net customer in southeastern Pennsylvania, currently using only a regular POTS connection. Seems to me that ADSL is much more difficult to get for such "unsupported" platforms than V.34/V.90, but there still are glitches. I only called a 1-800 number, which got me into an automated voice response system that asked for my postal address and phone number. A week later (approx.), I received a CDROM with the software needed to subscribe. And sure enough, it was for Windows. I don't remember if the CD works with Macs, though, but I wouldn't be surprised if it didn't.

Before you flame - Get a clue! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#2034921)

I've just called the Infospeed DSL number, pressed a couple of buttons, got a man on the line, and asked him what "not supported" means. He said that it means that the technician sent to set up my service will not be able to configure my computer, and if I have Linux (yes, he said "Linux" first!) or some other Unix or whatever, I will have to set it up myself. Like I would let those jerks touch my computer! I'll throw them out of my apartment as soon as I see that all the boxes are in place.

As for cable vs. DSL, guys, do you know that cable works just like your Ethernet: the more users you have connected, the slower it becomes. You are lucky to be the first on your physical medium. We'll see what you say in a couple of years, when all your neighbors and their dogs are connected.

Conspiracy Theory? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#2034922)


Hmmmm...

What if...Some large company with Monopolistic tendencies (or one of it's puppets) made a large investment in this particular company or even to a few board members. Later this company makes a not so polite request that they support only Brand X products with their new service...and just to throw any suspicious people for a loop...they will support Brand Y as well. After all, Brand Y is popular, but hasn't had time to build up enough numbers for them to care about.

Buwahahahahaha...maybe I watch too much TV...

"Supported" vs supported (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#2034923)

Wow.. hand it to a Mac user to not have a clue. I guess if they had a Linux/Unix box they would have known how to handle this one. IE: LIE.

ISP's typically employ the lowest common denominator when it comes to bottom line support
so its understandable that they only want to "SUPPORT" iMac's. Mac techs are hard to come by
but any ole schmuck can handle windoze.

I've already been told by the local Bell bastards that i dont have the right equipment to be "Supported". Fine screw you.. run the damn asdl to your damn asdl modem/router whatever. I'll get it on the network and working. Its not rocket science and ANY geek worth his salt can get it running quicker than those poor saps who install on site.

Who cares about support, i never use it anyway but i guess i'm special since i use a Unsupported OS anyway and like it a hell of a lot better. Who says getting support for Mac or Windows was EVER helpful!

Just plug the damn thing in and get the hell out..

USWest xDSL (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#2034924)

I've had USWest's xDSL service now for a little over two weeks with my RH5.1 box and works great. Of course they say they only support 95/98/NT/Mac but its just an ethernet connection using DHCP. Hell they said to configure the cisco 675 you had to run HyperTerminal, but minicom worked just fine :) . They give the option of self install (which took all of about 40 mins) or pay $149.95 to have some joker come out and do it.

I will say this, USWest has numerous ISP's that you may choose from and one, psn.net actually provides support for Linux and xDSL. But alas I didn't realize this until I had already choses USWest.net as my provider and didn't want to hassle with trying to change ISP's since the service was working flawlessly.

Bell Atlantic (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#2034925)

Actually.

Considering that I know the product manager for ADSL personally. Are you really surprised? He's the same guy (and the same supporting team) that worked ISDN in the old Nynex region.

Here's what you do, lie. I've seen the way those policies were written. Anal, doesn't even begin to describe it. Written by consultants making $275 an hour, and reviewed by Directors so far up the food-chain that they wouldn't know the difference between a Router, and Porsche.

Actually, I could post under my nifty bellatlantic.com alias, and I'd probably get flamed. Original poster, email me at this address, and I'll see if I can sniff out anything for you. pappy_Malo@excite.com

US-West (DSL) (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#2034926)

I don't understand why this guy doesn't have BA mail him the hardware? He seems smart enough to install it, and setup dhcp on the mac, voila he would have DSL running right now. Instead he is just bitching about a corporate policy that is in place because BA's techs (probably) don't know how to use a Mac.

And to all the people bitching about Dsl is expensive, doesn't give you this or that...Blah Blah... Think about this, in my area I can A. Use a modem, B. Go to college Campus, C. Buy a wireless T1 (1-2,000), or D. Pay 60 bucks a month for DSL.

My telco is far less anal. (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#2034927)

The local Telephone company here in British Columbia (BCTel) only officially supports Windows and MacOS with their ADSL offerings. However, they do not refuse to give you service if you run something else. They do not care what you have. They install the line, and give you your ADSL modem, phone splitter, and some ethernet cable in a box then leave. You can pay extra to have them setup the service on your Windows or MacOS based computer (installation of ethernet card, which would cost extra, as well as software setup). If you run anything else, you'll just have to plug in the ADSL box, install that ethernet card and setup dchp yourself. Some of the phone support guys actually like dealing with Unix rather than windows. Obviously, it's easier for them to tell you to type a command than it is for them to tell you to click here and there and look for certain information.

Why not contact the Public Service Commision? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#2034928)

Why not contact the Public Service Commision? They are there for this very reason, to make sure companies such as Bell Atlantic do their job and provide good customer service. A note to them explaining the problem in detail such as been done on the web page and having that carbon copied to the people at Bell Atlantic will get their ass in gear. The PSC can bring down huge fines on companies for doing things such as this.

A quick observation about BAnet... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#2034929)

Not sure if anyone else has noticed, but if the iMac restriction was in fact handed down from on high from BA's "ISP", that would be IBM Global Network (now in transition to AT&T). BAnet is branded IGN service in most (if not all) of their service area. Just do an nslookup on, oh, news1.banet.net...

Just a thought.

Bell Atlantic is a disaster.. (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#2034930)

Having spent the better part of 6 months trying to get ISDN installed in my apartment, I can tell you that BA is an absolute disaster.
At first, all I wanted was a POTS line. They didn't show up for the appointment, cost me a half-day's work, and lo and behold, I saw the BA truck at the bar down the street at the end of the shift.. Same guys?? Naa..
So I kicked POTS, went AT&T PCS wireless. Great stuff. But then I need ISDN for work? So I call back BA, and they REFUSE TO INSTALL ISDN UNLESS THERE IS A POTS LINE! Why? Because their )(&(*&%( billing/accounting system won't handle an account w/o a phone number!!!!!
Fast-forward 4 months. I now have ISDN, and it fails on me. Down for 2 weeks. The cause? They re-appropriated my circuits for another connection! Did they ever tell me? Hell no! Refund? Took 2 hours on hold.
BA will screw you any chance they get, and they are completely inflexible. Complain to the State Regulatory Board if you have problems with them. Why? Because as a regulated monopoly, they need the states' permission to raise rates! Enough complaints, they get zero raise! Complain, and you'll get all the help you need.

My email to this guy about his story (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#2034931)

This was my email to this guy about his story:


Hello, Steve. I read with great interest your account of the troubles
you've had with Bell Atlantic concerning ADSL for your Mac.

Once thing I would suggest is that you write a letter to the Public
Service Commission. Their job is to insure that companies such as Bell
Atlantic does theirs and do not give you the run around that you are
receiving.

You already have a good log of what has transpired between you and them.
I would write a letter to the PSC stating what's happening adding that
"companies that show such a lack of service and respect to their customers
should not be allowed to do business in ." Include a copy of
your article at http://www.macintouch.com/adslbell.html

Be sure that at the bottom of the letter you put:

CC: Bell Atlantic Customer Service
CC: Nakkia

I'd be sure to edit your story to put last names and phone numbers back in
because the PSC will investigate.

Now send a letter to Bell Atlantic Customer Service and Nakkia telling
them that you don't like the way you, the customer, have been treated and
given the run around and that you have informed the Public Service
Commission. Be sure to include CC: Public Serivce Commission at the
bottom of that letter.

The PSC can bring down large fines (possibly in the hundreds of thousands
depending on the severity) on companies who pull this kind of stunt. I
had a problem with my cellular phone company where they changed my phone
number and refused to change it back. They would also not allow me to
speak to anyone in charge. A letter to the PSC and the cellular company
got me a call back from a higher up who put my number back and gave me
several months of service for free.

You pay for government, so use it and let them lean hard on these big
companies rather than having the big companies lean on us little guys.

Use VirtualPC (and Window, not Linux :) (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#2034932)

Macnn http://www.macnn.com/ [macnn.com] had the following to say:

[...note that we've been working with Bell-Atlantic representatives to get non-iMacs certified in their DSL program, but at least one reader has been able to use Virtual PC with Windows to sidestep the iMac/Windows requirement...]

Illegal? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#2034933)

I thought it was illegal for the phone company to specify which brands of phones you could use on their lines as part of de-regulation. Isn't it just an extension of this existing legislation to say that the phone company can't tell me which computer or OS I have to use on their lines?

What do you expect! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#2034934)

This is typical of almost all large corporations. A policy is set at corporate headquarters, for good, bad, or indifferent. And then some yahoo argues about it with some 9-to-5'er sitting behind a desk somewhere. It's like teaching a cow to dance; it doesn't work and it only annoys the cow.

DUH People! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#2034935)

Think about this:

It's a PHONE COMPANY. When did anyone ever get good treatment from their local telco?

I mean come on... my local telco is still sending me bills for the ISDN line I had removed 8 months ago.

Absurdity?!? Hahaha. Welcome to Bell Atlantic (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#2034936)

This is pretty standard.
We complained so much about crosstalk on our lines, and after the tried to fix it 18 times with their idiotic techs, they sent us a letter saying they wouldn't support using a modem on a voice line anymore. If we wanted to actually be able to complain that their service was horribly shitty, and that we had crosstalk, that while very hard to hear in voice conservations, trashes modems, we'd have to pay 60 bucks a month for a "data" line.

Funny stuff.

Surely you've also heard how many lawsuits there are against Bell Atlantic for refusing to follow the law and allow others to compete in their market?

I for one wish the FCC would approve of them entering long distance.
They'd destroy themselves.

My experience (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#2034937)

I was looking into both ADSL from Bell Atlantic and cable from MediaOne at one opint last year. When phoning the companies I mentioned to both that I run a PC exclusively with linux on it. I got the same response from tech support at both companies:

As long as the machine is running windows when the installers come round we don't care. Both tech support people suggested this and one went so far as to suggest borrowing a windows PC fron a friend and swapping in my own ethernet card.

So you see, we have people working on the inside too...

Nick(nstrug@bu.eud)

terrible support people and clueless customers (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#2034938)

Is it just me or isn't it obvious that the support people he talked to were just clueless.
For a "manager" not to be able to handle a situation like this in about 3 minutes is just
ridiculous. A rational explanation that their support people have not yet been trained on any
other systems yet so they cannot yet provide the "support" should have been an adequate explaination to a normal person (not sure if it would have worked on this guy).
I would have to agree with the other posts I have seen - lie and deceive them to get the install done then take care of the rest yourself.
Large companies like this providing support MUST limit what kinds of machines they support for two reasons:
1- clueless users
2- clueless tech support employees (in the real world it is getting very dificult to hire people
that know what they are doing without a "script" in front of them, and scripts only work for when they have a controlled list of supported equipment)
(this is not to say people should be stopped from running any OS they want - just that people should be aware that if you deviate from their "supported" config you are on you own for OS troubleshooting.)
I have experience with getting a cable modem and the people doing the install were fairly incompetent when it came to deviating from a step by step install. but the company (mediaone) does state that they "support" 95/98/nt/macs but that other OS's are the users own problem (ie. they do NOT say you can't use them just they won't help troubleshoot them) they even set up news groups for people running linux with their cable modems.

so here is his solution: 1-get an iMac 2-get the install done 3-return said iMac for refund 4-hook up real machine and call company say "I just replaced my imac due to a HW failure here is my new address xx:xx:xx:xx:xx:xx 5-install your machine yourself 6-sit back with a nice fat pipe to the 'net *if you can't handle the install yourself then sit back with the rest of the unwashed masses and wait for a solution to be spoonfed to you.( in this case you're the reason its taking this long to get good net connections to people that want it and don't need hand holding)

If you want to get what you need, then you gotta play the game. :)

GTE and ADSL (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#2034939)

GTE prohibits people with T1s on the same trunk line as their phone line from getting GTE, due to "spectral interference". They don't even allow you to order a "clean" line, although they should.

Is this legal?

CincyBell ASDL/DHCPD Experience (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#2034940)

Here's the similar story with Cincy bell.

Same thing, only windows, I had to get my PPP
account working win Windows before they would install ADSL.

So I had to get it working in Linux.

The problem is that there are three different
DHCPD implementations, and all have different files.

1) ISC DHCPD
-complicated config file, I could care less about
many of those options.

2) dhcpcd 0.6x, 0.7
-required patch to compile in Redhat 5.1
-required patch to fix seg fault.
-Doesn't work in Linux2.1
-takes 30-60 seconds to resolve initially.

3) dhcpcd 1.2x, 1.3x
-buggy
-does not work int Linux2.0
-I had to ping the Site I wanted to reach
before I could telnet or Netscape to it.
-when DSL router timed out, I loose ability to
see sites with 'logging in' first.



Also I had to log in via the web to my ISP and Cincy bell.
I wrote a perl script to do that for me.

-don

See beyond the problem...to the solution. (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#2034941)

GTE here is Dallas said the same nonsense to me about only supporting Win9x/NT that this person said BA told him. GTE contracts out the "installation" part of DSL install. The line is done by a qualified GTE tech but they do not touch your computer or the DSL router. A second company, working with GTE, comes to your house and installs the router, software, and ethernet card.

It seems to me like Steve was so focused on the "support" issue when all he wanted was DSL service. Did he really need his hand held for the router and software install? I doubt that the BA tech that installing the line would give a rats ass what kind of computer he had because he wouldn't be messing with it. Does anyone really believe that BA trained all their DSL techs on both Mac and PC networking software. I doubt it!

The prices here for the line(384in/out) and service plus 8ip's and DNS hosting is $100. Too rich for my blood but not a bad deal. As far as using a cable modem goes, I wouldn't. Just as some people mention, I'm sure the cable company has that line maxed out so you never get the full bandwidth. Not to mention the shared circuit. Yeah, I want to run sniffit all day long on that thing just for kicks.

His Own Damn Fault (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#2034942)

ADSL in this area doesn't support Linux. My ADSL is connected to my Linux box which is acting as a masquerader for several machines, I know a dozen other people that are doing the same. I suspect there are many, many more also doing something similar.

If he'd dump his holier than thou, I'm going to make you support this and play the martyr for my beloved brand, crap, he could actually get an ADSL connection instead of makeing life hard on a bunch of people trying to do their job. I somehow doubt he's this anal when it comes to tax time...

BellSouth ASDL (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#2034943)

BellSouth seemed perfectly willing to let me support myself (but made it clear they would not support me). They'd install the line if I prove my network card works (and if my line "qualified", which it did not). The message may have been in error, but I'd have taken 'em up on it. Maybe when I move this spring that'll be one of the criteria...

"Supported" vs paying for support not received (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#2034944)

do they get QUALITY support ???

CincyBell ASDL/DHCPD Experience (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#2034945)

OK. Cincinnati Bell does not officially support anything other than Windows and Mac for installation. Setting up a linux install is very easyif you do the self install. It took about an hour but it works. If you want more information about CBT's service please see this unofficial site: http://w3.one.net/~garyc/adsl/

This guy has developed a very nice Windows login app and he has linux to a site where they is good set of linux shell scripts for CBT's ADSL service.

I know of at least one programming effort to provide a command line login app for Linux for this adsl service. It will be released under the GPL whe it is done.

The good fight. (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#2034946)

Steve was fighting a winless war. At best he was going to get a moral victory. That doesn't make it not worth fighting.


I saw 2 mistakes. He never asked to speak to the supervisor's supervisor. Especailly after being juked like that, maybe skipping a level in the chain of command is the right approach. It's a dick thing to do to some people as second line managers generally don't like to hear complaints about the worker bees but it can be an easy way to get amazing things done.

I had a DMA problem with an True Blue IBM PC a few years back, it wouldn't play sound with most games, being a non-gamer it didn't bother me too much and they said they were working on it. After about 9 months of getting the "probably be fixed in about 3 more weeks" story I started getting worried. I spoke to a service rep who tried to stall, I told her that I had been stalled for close to a year now. Great games of phone tag started, return calls started taking 3-4 days instead of 3-4 hours. Finally after a year, and I think that is more than patient enough, I started talking to managers. At first I was greeted with the same stalling techniques. Then one day while speaking to an operator who was trying to connect me with the right manager, he suggested calling the president of IBM's office and then gladly connect me. Within about 2 hours I was presented with 2 choices: a new computer (actually a bit of an upgrade) or a refund.


He also didn't say if he got DSL or not. If they don't support your hardware then tell them they don't have to, just start the service up and do the technical bits on your end yourself. It can't be too hard to make a mac talk to a DSL router over ethernet...

Solution... (1)

Shiska (131) | more than 15 years ago | (#2034963)


0.) Setup a decoy 95 machine.
1.) Get the goobers to come out to your place and set the line/modem up
2.) Once they leave, you're free to reverse engineer the hardware and write a linux driver.


----------------- ------------ ---- --- - - - -

Bell TITANIC (1)

drwiii (434) | more than 15 years ago | (#2034964)

Ahh, bad old Bell Titanic, the Microsoft of the telecommunications industry.

If Bell Atlantic is indeed "the heart of communication" as they say in their commercials, they desperately need a bypass operation.

ADSL (1)

Jordy (440) | more than 15 years ago | (#2034965)

This is why you don't use Bell Atlantic as your ISP, you use them as your ADSL connection and then get a real ISP.

Bells and Cable companies make lousy ISPs.

$60 a month! Cable is cheaper, but (1)

Herschel Cohen (568) | more than 15 years ago | (#2034966)

one is NOT assured of a minimum connection rate.

Many times, I suspect my cable connections approximate POTs and a 56K modem! Nonetheless, in total net costs, cable is cheaper than that option. I was paying $20/month to the ISP, but Bell Atlantic had these 1000 or more local units that had to be 90% or more due to the internet connections. That's over $80 a month for lousy 28.8K connections (with a 56K modem), hence, it might be a bit cheaper with "true" 56K POTs rates but never less than the flat $40 for cable.

Regarding, ADSL - I pass no matter what the price. Someday there will be true DSL from some source with reasonable tech support (absent from the @home, so far).

Most people think "Not supported"=="Won't work" (1)

J. J. Ramsey (658) | more than 15 years ago | (#2034967)

Bell Atlantic gave the impression that they could not work with anything but Windows PCs and iMacs. The only way that the poor guy could find out that 'not supported' only meant 'not something our technicians can deal with' would be to ask the question. Seems to be that the guy did have a clue and knew enough to know Bell Atlantic wasn't giving him the straight deal.

BA's lack of knowledge (1)

gavinhall (33) | more than 15 years ago | (#2034968)

Posted by libtech:

The run around this guy is getting from BA really isnt that surprising. The vast majority of people who work at companies such as this (including the tech support ppl) really have little more than a basic knowledge of what they are required to talk about. Not to say everyone at BA is computer illiterate. Just most of them. Having worked in the past at small scale computer mfg. co's ive seen this first hand.
Service Mng. == knows his way around a system just cant explain why or how.
Production Mng. == no better. just knows other things.
Upper Managment == Great and administration. poor at accepting some customers know more than their staff. Wont make policy they dont understand cause they are afraid of what could possibly happen.

Its a shame.... but I expect this sort of technical ineptness when dealing with such companies.

MAC Address? (1)

echo (735) | more than 15 years ago | (#2034970)

Why would they want your Mac Address?

Do they configure the ADSL router so it will only work with YOUR machine (to keep people from putting in more than one machine?)

What happens when you buy a new ethernet card or whatever?

Would this allow them to track me closer than they currently could?


iMac sticker (1)

jpatters (883) | more than 15 years ago | (#2034971)

He should just put a sticker on his machine that says "iMac", and forcefully insist that it actually is an iMac, even when the installation techs tell him it isn't.

Charter Cable and Earthlink. ( WinX only ) (1)

Damon C. Richardson (913) | more than 15 years ago | (#2034973)

This is not very funny. Im seeing this more and more. I used to have a Linux box set up with a ISDN to the internet that I would use as a gateway for my Linux/windoze box and my wifes windoze box. Well I got a cable modem from Charter Cable and Earthlink. Now I have to use a windoze computer with wingate to get on the internet from my Linux computers. And let me tell you I am bummed.

Borrow an iMac already??? (1)

Wyatt Earp (1029) | more than 15 years ago | (#2034974)

When I got US West ASDL they told me "We Support iMacs, that's what you have?" I said "no, but I'm sure it'll work. "They transfered me to someone that knew something and all they wanted to know is did I have Open Transport and a newish OS (8.5 beta in my case). The kit even had one of thos funky AAUI-15 Adapters for Ethernet.

Took me 20 minutes to hook it all up myself.

Here's what I think.. (1)

Scott (1049) | more than 15 years ago | (#2034975)

I think Apple struck a deal with Bell Atlantic to only support the iMac, at least in the early stages. Kind of like how MS bought out ISP's Netscape contracts then paid them to use IE instead.

"Oh, you want to use this new ADSL? Well even though you just bough a new PPC, we only support the iMac. You'll have to go buy one of those now."

Not alone (1)

dcp (1250) | more than 15 years ago | (#2034976)

I'm currently subscribed to Cincinnati Bells ADSL service. Were having our own troubles with the phone company. Service isn't usually a monopolies strong point.

When I talked to the installers they said the macs were the easiest installs they had. Most of the problems are from CBT having inept technicians, and no regard for customers (ADSL reconfig from 3-7 pm)

Linux is, of course, is unsupported, but the webserver for the internal page is running on Linux. I had linux up and running much easier than windows.

The only reason phone co's are rolling out ADSL is because of the threat from cable modems.

The speed is addictive though.

dave

Before you flame - Get a clue! (1)

ptomblin (1378) | more than 15 years ago | (#2034977)

Hey, smart guy: do you know that your ISP's connection to the backbone works just like your Ethernet? The more users you have connected, the slower it becomes. But you know what else? When they get more customers, they ADD MORE CAPACITY! DUH!

My cable company has a guaranteed level of service - if they can't meet the guarantee, then they subnet the local neighbourhood (or whatever they call it) until the amount of traffic is what they can handle and still provide the required level.

Silicon Valley Woes (1)

Iffy Bonzoolie (1621) | more than 15 years ago | (#2034978)

This sucks! Here I live in the Bay Area, and I get 384/384 DSL for $189 a month!! Why is it so expensive here?

On the other hand, they just give us a router, and don't care what kind of computers we are running, OS or hardware, whatever. We pretty much just plug into the hub and get assigned an IP address via DHCP and viola! I don't know why they would care what hardware/OD you are using... I just never call them up with Linux questions, I figure it out myself, or ask for help in different places...

From experience, I'm not surprised at BA... (1)

jaraxle (1707) | more than 15 years ago | (#2034979)

I used to work for AT&T Worldnet Service as a tech support guy, and I had some real problems with support boundaries (that's part of the reason I don't work there anymore). For instance, our company would provide software to customers so they can setup the service on a WinCE system, but we didn't support it. Nor did we support MacOS 8.0 even though our entire Mac support department knew how to support it and tried explaining that it really isn't much different than MacOS 7.x something or other. Bah... it's all scripted and pounded into your head and the techs really don't know much more than what they're told (except for some rare few like myself who would support anything). It's really sad, almost all tech support drones are just that... drones, reading scripts and never deviating from them.

Clueless people (1)

apilosov (1810) | more than 15 years ago | (#2034980)

Blah. Same thing as ISP's supporting Windows only. Who really cares what they "support"? Everyone's CAN do PPP to any ISP that supports PPP, and that's what matters. If the poster was more clueful, they'd just go "Yeah ok, I got an Pentium, just drop me the RJ-45 ethernet, and here's MAC address of the card". I personally know people who are using BA ADSL with linux without any problems. Not to say that the BA isn't clueless...They are.

So, we have identified 3 clueless people: User (Steve Godun), BA rep, and CmdrTaco who posts stories like that without thinking who's more at fault, BA or user.

$60 a month is chump change (1)

bobalu (1921) | more than 15 years ago | (#2034981)

Do you guys have any idea of what a leased line costs? A 56K line is almost $400/month, 256K can cost up to $1200.

I'd dance a jig if I could get the high-end ADSL setup going for $200/month.

.. same old story.. (1)

Ex-NT-User (1951) | more than 15 years ago | (#2034982)


When I applied for my ADSL service with Uswest I was told they only suport Windoze and *some* Macs. When I told them I wanted to run it on my linux box.. they said and I quote "Oh!.. Your one of those.." and then continued on to say that they can't provide me with the service.
I told them alright I'll install windows. The service guy came over a few weeks later. Configured my line, dicked around with my 'puter (I dual booted a tiny Win95 partition) and when he left I rebooted into linux and configured it myself. Works like a charm.

-Ex-nt-user

USWest (1)

quadra (2289) | more than 15 years ago | (#2034983)

I'm not sure what USWest's DSL support policy is.. but i simply let them install it on my Windoze machine.. and promptly plugged it into my Linux system when they left. Works great.

Hub it. (1)

Squeeze Truck (2971) | more than 15 years ago | (#2034985)

I have the filtered ethernet connection from my ADSL bridge (router with the routing turned off) coupled with a simple crossover cable connecting into a simple workgroup hub. Works great.

Ignore what the retards at your local telco tell you, and just tell them you have Windows 95. In reality, you can hook anything with an IP address (including a real router) up to that bridge.

Borrow an iMac already??? (1)

Waxman (3025) | more than 15 years ago | (#2034986)

Why hide the box? I had both systems sitting on the desk, and had to help the "techie" setup the ethernet card in the win95 box, since I had 2 ether cards in it. Moved it to linux right after they left, and never looked back. Now, if only I hadn't had to move out of that town. :(

-------------
Are all mac users this slow? I had to do this with my Linux box and the @home service. Sure they dina know jack about Linux. I hid the box in the closet , and put a win95 box on my desk. They came. Did their thing(4 hours) and left. Out went the 95 box , in went the Linux box. Done and done..

ADSL support -- yeah, right (1)

msuzio (3104) | more than 15 years ago | (#2034987)

Yeah, I got the same flack from Ameritech when I told them I wanted an ADSL line for my Linux box.

Them: "Oh, no. Windows95/98 are the only supported OS's."

Me: "Huh? Why is that?"

Them: "Well, that's just the way it is".

Actually, it turns out they use a really lame ATM card, so the lack of Linux drivers for it actually *is* a stepping-stone I can't seem to get over.

Luckily, TCI offers cable modems now, and so I'll just go with them... leaving me in the strange state of getting cable service from Ameritech (via Americast, which I highly recommend) and Internet connectivity via TCI (whose cable services I always hated).

Strange world.

Oh brother... (1)

Ken (3185) | more than 15 years ago | (#2034988)

I love the way some /.ers can put a spin on this to make it looks like Apple's fault. If you haven't noticed, Apple as of late has been sinking it's money into high profile marketing and the advancement of it's systems. It's seems VERY unlikey to me that they'd do something so underhanded and risky considering that BA doesn't even serve a vast part of the US.

Yeah, that makes a lot of sense.... (1)

Lamont (3347) | more than 15 years ago | (#2034989)

I'm sure Apple has the time and energy to bother with crap like that.

Apple would much rather you buy a spanking new PPC box instead of an iMac, there's a lot more profit to be had in one of those.

Support? WDNNS Support! (1)

kid (3373) | more than 15 years ago | (#2034990)

What's all this about DSL?

When Shaw Cable (Toronto, Canada) tried to balk at my use of OS/2 and Linux, I merely told them that I wouldn't ask for support. They gladly installed, waived all installation fees, the cable-modem appears to be free (been a year now), as is the ethernet card (two actually, I didn't like the original cheapo 3-Com), and it's $39.95/mo CDN. I immediately hit a download high of 150M/s from Netscape (4.05, 12MB) since their bastardized Netscape 3.0 for Win was useless to me.

if you are using Open Transport... (1)

W84thend (3549) | more than 15 years ago | (#2034991)

If your computer is using Open Transport (OT) 1.1
1. Open the AppleTalk control panel.
2. Go to the Edit menu and select User Mode.
3. Select the Advanced radio button and click OK.
4. Click Info.
5. The hardware address is displayed in the AppleTalk Info window.

Well... maybe. (1)

Shag (3737) | more than 15 years ago | (#2034993)

ADSL is the kind of thing I'd consider getting. Sure, it's kinda pokey, and even though BA claims to offer speeds up to 7Mbps/second, once it hits them, I'd be lucky to see 128Kbps. But compared to their highest-in-the-galaxy ISDN rates ($240 a month for unlimited local usage?!), it's damn cheap. And since the box hooks up via ethernet, it's probably really easy to do IPmasq and whatnot. Maybe next year.

An island of no DSL... (1)

Dastardly (4204) | more than 15 years ago | (#2034994)

I feel like bitching too. I live in a spot where there is no DSL in Southern Claifornia. Only thing is... If I drive 2 miles west there is DSL. If I drive 2 miles east there is DSL. If I drive 2 miles north ther is DSL. South are hills and then the ocean so that doesn't count.

Pretty lame huh?

Not A Solution (1)

Keith Russell (4440) | more than 15 years ago | (#2034995)

Those of you saying "borrow an iMac or 95 machine" are missing the point. You can swap out your "approved" OS/machine for your prefferred one and bask in the glory of having fooled Bell Atlantic, but that doesn't solve the problem.

Bell Atlantic is giving their on-site techs a script, telling them to follow that script, and punt if anything deviates from that script. I've seen this mentality before: "Our trained-chimp techs know more than you, because they work for us."

If you want that to change, you must stand up to Bell Atlantic. If you can't use your non-Intel, non-iMac hardware, your non-Windows, non-MacOS8 operating system, your non-3Com ethernet card, take your business elsewhere. If enough people tell them this upfront, they'll get the message that they can't run a public service like a heavy-handed internal IT department.

It's all about *CONTENT* (1)

colonel (4464) | more than 15 years ago | (#2034996)

I'm a WAVE@HOME cablemodem subscriber right now,
and I can tell you that it's not only about technical support. See, these big companies don't consider the end-user the customer. The end-user is the *product* to sell advertising to.

The system requirements listed on the page aren't the requirements for the network, they're the requirements for the proprietary client software. The CD they send you to install the "network" actually installs their proprietary client (Usually a modified NetScape) and change all your settings. Icons are replaced with their logos, etc. They expect to make their money off advertising on the things they force you to look at.

@HOME recently bought EXCITE. AOL bought Netscape's portal. Yahoo paid IBM a shitload of money to make it the default start page on Aptivas. See where this is going? ADSL subscribers in Ottawa are forced to use a web proxy, and I'm taking bets on how long till they get a proxy that strips out banners and replaces them with home-grown advertising. They're selling the ADSL at such a profit-loss that that's the only way they'll make money in the long run.

End users don't have money - advertisers do. What has to happen is for the government to be pressured by the people in to regulating a difference between connectivity providers and content providers.

Separate ISP & ADSL Provider (1)

Flicker (4495) | more than 15 years ago | (#2034997)

I had a very similar experience with GTE/Linux (Could you spell UNIX please? said the operator). After 20 calls to GTE I found out that ordering service through an affiliated ISP was quicker and easier, and allowed a much broader range of service plans (with static IP's and no filtering for a start). The ISP I settled on is a Linux house, they understand what I want to do, they hate Windows, and they give good support. Plus there was no hassling with morons at GTE, the ISP handled all that stuff gratis.

Think it's Steve's fault (2)

Alan Shutko (5101) | more than 15 years ago | (#2034999)

Having worked tech support before, it's pretty clear to me that Bell Atlantic isn't supporting Macs other than the iMac because they don't have enough knowledge in-house to train their techs to do the installs, write docs for users, etc. This is pretty standard.

I'm sure that if Steve didn't go off on this whole "My Mac is just like any other Mac" he could have gotten service. For example, by explaining that he's capable of handling all client-side issues and giving them the information they need, he'd probably get a response like "Great. We can't help you with problems unless you show they're on our end, but we'll hook you up." They already do stuff like that with third-party ethernet cards.

Instead, Steve went off frothing at the mouth and tried to force them to support his machine at the same level as an iMac, because it's the exact same thing. Is it surprising that a confrontational customer is going to get blown off?

Quit Whining! At least you have the ASDL option! (1)

clintp (5169) | more than 15 years ago | (#2035000)

In Ameritech Country, deep in the heart of Michigan, ISDN is it. No xSDL. Also no Cable Modems in the heart of TCI country, either.

I'd beg, borrow, or steal a Win95 box long enough to get the xSDL hardware set up and make your provider happy. Consider yourself lucky to even have the option, and quit whining.

At my 128Kbits/sec, I really can't sympathize.

$60 a month!...and the Cust. Svc. SUCKS! (1)

Electric Eye (5518) | more than 15 years ago | (#2035001)

First of all, I am in CT and I pay $35/mo for cable. There is no way in hell I would pay for this lame-ass ASDL for a minimum of $60/mo!
Whatgets me is that it is SO simple to hook up ANY Mac to such a network, it goes to show you how incompetent many of the IT companies are.

And you just have to love this typical example of corporate drone-hood. "Uh, I can't make myself think, so I'll play it safe and just use the 'It's Policy' excuse." God-forbid people take advantage of self-empowerment....... If I were a BA exec., I'd feel sick. This is an embarassment.

Borrow an iMac already??? (1)

Electric Eye (5518) | more than 15 years ago | (#2035002)

I am sure even with an iMac, the techs are probably clueless. You should have seen the guy who showed up at my apt. a few months ago from Cablevision of CT to hook up my cable service. Took him two hours to set up my 9600. I could've done it in 20 minutes easily. ABSOLUTELY clueless about the OS. Funny thing is, after going through all the bullshit of setting up the login program, I haven't had to use it since October! So what had to be done? Plug in the cable modem. Plug in the cable. Attach the Ethernet cable to the modem and Mac. Launch Netscape. But, nooooooooo....... It would be nice to see ONE of these companies get a clue...
Unfortunately, this guy needs to win his case. Sure, he can do whatever he wants to fool BA. But how many other people will just blindly say "Ok..." and find another service? BA needs to actually THINK in order to let ALL customers use their service.

Clueless people = apilosov (1)

MushMouth (5650) | more than 15 years ago | (#2035003)

The point is that BA does get the fact that all you need is a line. Steve Godun is fighting the fight for all of us. If you don't that that you are the only clueless one here.

Clueless people = apilosov (1)

MushMouth (5650) | more than 15 years ago | (#2035004)

The point is that BA does not get the fact that all you need is a line. Steve Godun is fighting the fight for all of us. If you don't see that, then you are the only clueless one here.

Although I guess I too am clueless for not clicking the "Preview" button

Cable modems (1)

jmpvm (6160) | more than 15 years ago | (#2035005)

I have had a much better reation from our local Cable company. (Time Warner, Austin) While they don't outright support linux, they don't say "it won't work and you can't have it". I have not ever had to call them for support, cause it just works. They even made changes to their configurations to make it EASIER for linux users to use it and even provided links (in the mailing list) to the proper 3rd party login source code.

It took me a few hours to get mine to work in Linux, and they don't even care that my whole network is being masq'd from behind it.

That is much better service, and BA should take some lessons from them.

BA, ADSL, and linux (1)

Jackal (7054) | more than 15 years ago | (#2035006)

We tried to get BA to connect ADSL to linux and failed - they aren't willing "support" it. Our
solution was seting up a windows 95 box just for them to install on. Then we figured out the MAC and IP for the windows box and setup a linux box with the same MAC and IP. (you must get both IP and MAC correct)

I had the same type problem... (1)

mindedc (7819) | more than 15 years ago | (#2035007)

with Bellsouth.net in Alabama...

I got arround it by loading 95 on a spare hard disk..the old guy came out to do the install and nearly crapped his pants when he saw the computer room... (I don't have any cases on, it impedes proper cooling :) I let him do his thing, call the MAC address, tore my walls up, wired stuff in etc.. then when he left I pulled the 10 mbit isa 3com card and 500 mb ide hard drive and put my netgear 10/100 and UWSCSI/Linux back in the machine... I had already set an old 486 up as a "router" with a coupple of NICS and Caldera linux.. I use a piece of .c code off of www.rootshell.com called changemac.c to change the internet-side card's mac address to the one that the ATM/ADSL bridge was looking for and set up the DHCP client (had to get/compile the latest to support a dual homed system). Everything works GREAT.

Just remember, these guys are mostly idiots. They don't want to do any more work than they have to. They don't want to get mired in any fiascos. I understand the need to have liunx and MAC OS and BE officially supported, but it's realiztically not going to happen anytime soon. The only thing we can do is to fight when it makes sense to fight, and bend like a reid in the wind when fighting will do no good. The phone factory is the only place more beaurocratic than the military, and they lack the command structure that the military has.

PEOPLE, Please! Quit whining (1)

aaarrrgggh (9205) | more than 15 years ago | (#2035008)

While it seems like a bit of a stretch, this is a legitamate way for a company to operate. They have no problem with you using whatever kind of system you want; they will only support the "common" systems, though.

If you are running Linux (or MacOS, or DOS 2.0), I hope that you would be savvy enough to figure out your own IP information. If not...

I'm using it right now... (1)

DdJ (10790) | more than 15 years ago | (#2035010)

I'm using Linux with BellAtlantic ADSL right now.

They claim to support only Windows, but they don't use DHCP or anything goofy like that. All that it *really* means is that their techs will only know how to make it work for Windows.

During the install, while debugging problems, we even used Linux to debug problems that were hard to figure out under Windows (like whether a particular ethernet problem was a hardware problem or a Windows driver problem).

Macs can be scary (humor) (1)

TrentC (11023) | more than 15 years ago | (#2035011)

Well, you know, them "Macintoshes" are pretty weird, compared to PCs. They probably had to wait until Apple made a cute and cuddly-looking one (the iMac) so the trained tech chimps wouldn't get scared and fling their feces at it.

*rolls eyes*

Maybe someone should buy a "lime" iMac, and give it great big googly eyes and sharp teeth sticking out of the CD-ROM drive. That'll teach 'em...

Jay (=

DHCP not implemented right in old Open Transport (1)

jonbrewer (11894) | more than 15 years ago | (#2035012)

I have heard that most versions of MacOS and Open Transport do not implement DHCP in the standard way. I was given the example that MacOS, when shut down and restarted, attempts to grab the address it had during the previous session. And I have heard that it does numerous other sloppy and un-standard things that make DHCP servers unhappy and can lead to address conflicts.

This all was related to me by a M$ guru at my place of employ. (I know that is an oxymoron)

But I tend to believe what he says because of several corporate networks I know of that still assign all Macs static IP addresses, even though they are capable of using DHCP.

This *could* be a reason Bell Atlantic is not supporting Macs other than the iMac. They know that the iMac will be running at least System 8, and a modern implementation of Open Transport.

I'd suggest to the poor guy that he buy the ADSL service from the Telco and get his Internet from another ISP.

- Jon

PS. I love Macs. I've owned several.

Beurocracy inaction (1)

smertens (12060) | more than 15 years ago | (#2035013)

This is all the fault of a higher-up decision. Yes, getting the address is easy - if you know what you're doing. The 'techs' barely knew what a Mac was; nobody bothered to train them on anything other than PCs. BA wasn't about to assume the liability of sending them out into the field and make a real mess of things. The solution: lie. Tell them what they want to hear. The author could quite evidently set this thing up himself. Assure the installer onsite that it'll be your secret, you'll assume full responsibility, etc. He gets paid either way, and remind him of that. Of course, this assumes that *you* know what you're doing... :)

Maybe Life is Better Here (1)

mikeraz (12065) | more than 15 years ago | (#2035014)

Not only was his service bad, but the prices for BA aDSL seem shitty too.

At least in US West land you can order aDSL with a "self install" option. No telephone person will mess with your computer or even ask what it is. They didn't care that I have multiple Linux machines going through my connection.

$40 for circuit, $20 for service (1)

decaym (12155) | more than 15 years ago | (#2035015)

I believe that they charge about $40 for the circuit and another $20 for the service. This puts it somewhat on par with outside offerings if you consider the ADSL line like a second phone line.

iMac sticker (1)

A Big Gnu Thrush (12795) | more than 15 years ago | (#2035016)

This is the best suggestion yet. Who could doubt that the Jedi mind trick would work on a phone tech? In fact, if Steve's forceful enough, the tech will probably refuse service on future iMacs because they don't look like the iMac he serviced this morning.

True in Atlanta too.. (1)

vaidhy (14207) | more than 15 years ago | (#2035023)

This is true in atlanta too where Bellsouth offers ADSL service. They support only intel machines with Windoze or macs with macos. They refused to give me service when I said I ran Linux.

Back to dual boot.... :)

Liar liar pants on fire! (1)

machineryofJoy (14321) | more than 15 years ago | (#2035024)

Plus, the BA rep told him that if he lied about what kind of machine he had, when the tech showed up to install, the tech wouldn't touch it & he'd get charged for the visit.

"If you have a Pentium machine that you want to put DSL on than we can proceed with the order. I just want you to know that if you say that's why you have, but when the tech comes out and you have a Power Mac he will not install the equipment, but you will be charged for the visit."

Remember that? Sure the same thing would have happened if he lied about having an iMac, because it goes against "policy".

=moJ
- - - - - -
Member in Good Standing,

Dancing Cows (1)

machineryofJoy (14321) | more than 15 years ago | (#2035025)

That's pigs you're thinking about. And singing.

Never try to teach a pig to sing: it only wastes your time and annoys the pig.

BTW: I've never had any problems teaching cows to dance. In fact, not only are they fast learners, but they're actually really good at it.


=moJ
- - - - - -
Member in Good Standing,

This is typical Bell (1)

boethius (14423) | more than 15 years ago | (#2035026)

This is hardly unusual and is a perfect thesis of the neolithic corporate philosophy of the RBOCs. I've known RBOC personnel pretty well and the notion of change of any sort of entrenched corporate policy is embedded in layers of management hierarchy that inherently prevents swift customer service resolution issues. On the front lines, CSRs are just as easily plucked from any sampling of people waiting at a bus stop. "Training" is limited to CSR manuals that are not easily digested; in any case, proficient CSRs are very very hard to come by in any organization.

The frustrated BA customer here is going to have move much further up the managerial food chain than a front-line supervisor to get any real action. Having done tech. support, it *is* impossible to support every variety of hardware out there, but a pure 10Base-T connection eliminates the need to exclude any platform. Management that's still clueless about this formed the policy and it must be altered at a higher, more clueful strata. Give customers the right to accept a policy that their platform *can't* be supported, but that they can still get the service and will deal with support issues themselves.

Philly ADSL (1)

irqzero (15301) | more than 15 years ago | (#2035028)

According to Bell A, I was supposed to be cruising
at 640k/s in early fall 98, then late fall 98, now
"possibly" this month or next. What the hell?
They're such a bunch of jokers....

It's not the cost, it's the value [$60 a month] (1)

JasonB (15304) | more than 15 years ago | (#2035029)

If Bell Atlantic is anything like PacBell, ther differences between cable modem for $40/month and DSL for $60/month are this:

1. DSL service agreement does not prohibit the running of servers. AtHome, MediaOne, and RoadRunner (not sure about RR) strictly prohibit the running of servers (httpd, ftpd, BIND, smtp, etc.).

2. DSL service ususally comes with a static IP address. AtHome and MediaOne use DHCP.

-jason

hide the linux...boot up the windows nt? (1)

orangeman (15305) | more than 15 years ago | (#2035030)

maybe it is a plot to get people to install Windows and prevent any license refund

Man you americans get soaked! (1)

boywndr (15310) | more than 15 years ago | (#2035031)

ADSL here in Edmonton, Alberta costs $49.95 CDN a month and it's currently 1.5MB downstream and 640K up. I just can't believe the pricing on that page

That's how they track it I suppose. (1)

Samurai Cat! (15315) | more than 15 years ago | (#2035032)

With BellSouth, if you want to switch machines, you just call'em up and give'em the new MAC addy. They'll switch it. Pal in my building initially had his hooked up to a Mac, then once he was satisfied it was working ok and had a Linux box set up with dual ethernet cards and IP masquerading going, called'em up and gave'em a diff addy - and he's good to go.

Here they also supposedly cycle IPs every 12 hours, though they haven't done it on that schedule yet to my knowledge... we've had IPs last days at least before. Reasoning is to keep folks from running permanent servers... too bad ml.org killed that handy little service of theirs.

Ethernet Address on Macs (1)

brendan (15326) | more than 15 years ago | (#2035033)

It *is* frustrating that there is no official way to read a macintosh motherboard ethernet's MAC address without having the machine already on a network. On many Windows machine, that isn't an issue.

Granted, you can connect the mac up to a hub, and then read the MAC address from the either the Appletalk or TCP/IP control panels. But you've got to have that hub first.

Apple even has a program called "Apple LAN Utility 1.0b4" which supposedly can read the MAC address on macs that aren't connect to an ethernet network. The problem is that it doesn't support all models, and hangs the machine more than half the time. They need to update that utility. Apple could remedy this.

I don't like BA's approach (customer service, as well as 'one computer' per ADSL connection), but they have a point about non-iMacs being somewhat harder to support when it comes to the MAC address. I doubt they would issue hubs to all the service techs doing installs just to take care of this problem.

Of course, if you already know the MAC address of your mac, or you have a hub, they shouldn't just leave and charge you for the visit either.

-brendan

The Author is an Idiot (1)

thoreau (88062) | more than 15 years ago | (#2035040)

I don't mean to be rude, but that's the general jist of the situation he put himself in. First of all, the Mac is Dead. The iMac made sure of that. What a piece of degenerate crap. Secondly, why is the author dicking around with a tech guy or a supervisor when he wants to revamp Company policy? What the fuck is he doing? Does he think these people have ever met the CEO of Bell? Damn, clueless twit. Thirdly, if this Mac degenerate had a clue, he wouldn't be using a Mac.. And if he ever worked as a tech, he would have long ago killed himself trying to tell Mac users why their computer has a "Frowny" face. That's the level where most Mac people start off. People bought the iMac, because it was being sold as easier to use than windows.. hehe.. Shit. I didn't know there were negative Intelligence Quotients. I don't mean to be overly hostile towards this person, it's just that he is acting from ignorance of computers, company command, and capitolism in general. That's why he got no results. That's also why the Mac is Dead.

Just to be fair (1)

tenchi (90280) | more than 15 years ago | (#2035041)

Just to be fair I should recount my good fortune with Bellatlantic and Infospeed DSL. I live in Pittshurgh and we must just have good local reps or something. I myself filled out their webpage back when it said it was currently being rolled out. One day, unexpectedly, long after I had forgot all about it, I recieved mail from Candice saying that it was available and I could call her and order it. I called, she told me the pricing, I told her what I wanted. I said I used an intel based machine, I ran Linux, I had an ethernet card and asked her what free ones they gave out, she told me 3COM brand ISA or PCI my choice, so I said I'd take a 7.1 connection and ethernet card. She took the order then transferred me over to the ISP. They set me up an account, gave me my IP address, and told me the tech guy would be out in exactly one week to install the hardware. The modem came in the mail, the tech guy showed up bright and early, attached the filter to my phoneline, hooked up the modem, and gave me my ethernet card. I decided to hold off on putting in the 3COM, so I did an ifconfig to get him my current MAC address, he called it in, we connected it, he gave me my books, we sat and drank some mt dew and BSed about ADSL for a little bit and then he took off. I've been enjoying DSL ever since along with 4 other Linux users in my area that I know.

Mediaone (1)

PDG (100516) | more than 15 years ago | (#2035043)

Mediaone claims that for their cable modem service, only 95/98 will be supported or installed on. When the guy came, I booted up a base 95 install and let the guy seem pleased. Their reasoning was that if they allow NT or other server based products, you can acheive the ability to mess around with their equipment. They really can't control it. I'm running Linuxes and NTs all over their network and not only that, I CAN screw with their network if I want to.


Simular problem with Mediaone (1)

cvmvision (245679) | more than 15 years ago | (#2035044)

I had a similar experience with Mediaone. At the time of my installation they only supported Win95 and no not support networks. Like you or your friend who dealt with Bell Atlantic - I to argued with them and got no where.

After consulting a sysadm who has a network and home and mediaone, I was told to just let them think what they want. When the techs comeout to your site, you can probably get what you want if you don't argue with them. Remember, the techs think that management sticks also. However their job is at stake.

They arrived to find my system on a LAN and not running Win95. We talked a while and then I proceeded to do all the setup up myself. I moved the network cable to my transceiver to the cable modem (hence no LAN!) and after switching to their DHCP server I was on-line. Soon they went away.

As soon as the door closed, I rewired the network, only to find that all the additional IPs I needed were already taken. Since I had to have a LAN - I thought - maybe I can put 2 network cards in the stupid machine.

My neighborhood Cantonese computer store sold me a NE2000 card for $2 to $7 - don't recall. But it was a steal.

I installed the 2nd card, using 10.0.0.x for my LAN card and within a few minutes was up and running. Later I installed ip-masqurading and now all my internal machines have net access without any special config.

Since that time, all has been well with my setups. The only problems have been with their DHCP server. Sometimes it randomly changes my IP address - while I'm using it. After this your assigned IP is no longer matches your host name (I waited a week once). After numerous calls to tech support - I've given up and just started using a static IP. Its been months without any problems. I guess if I get messages about another machine using my IP address I'll consult the DHCP server and get a new IP.

I guess in summary -

* Don't argue or try and reason with corporate idiots. Subconsciously they already know they are idiots - but all day they have to act like they know what they're doing - else their wives will leave them and not see their kids anymore. If its a woman - she knows she'll lose her job and then be dependant on a man.

* When the techs arrive talk with them. Let them know you are fully knowledgeable, but let them think they know a little more than you. Be friendly and get to know all about the system. You'll need this info later!

* When they leave - set the system up like you want.

* When they say a system isn't support - they only mean - we don't know anything about it. IF you do - your one your own. Some cooperates think this means - do it and your off the network.



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