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Linus Says 2004 is the Year for Desktop Linux

michael posted more than 10 years ago | from the huddled-masses-yearning-to-breathe-free dept.

Linux Business 727

lca writes "Linuxworld Australia has an interview with Linus Torvalds about the current state of the Linux desktop and where it will go this year among other things. Also discussed are topics such as hardware support, the SCO issue, and whether or not he will be moving to Australia."

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FP (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#7987046)

FP FP FP from good old earhart 513 woot woot

Re:FP (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#7987069)

523 > 513!

Re:FP (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#7987261)

So you shack up with any of the engineering girls on the upper floors yet?

Frost Pist (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#7987048)

Ooooh that hurts. This post brought to you by the "Ben Collins in an anal-retentive jerk" club.

I am God! (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#7987051)

I am the GOD!

GNAA is gay!

Linus = FAG!

They missed one. (5, Funny)

grub (11606) | more than 10 years ago | (#7987056)


They didn't ask Linus if he paid his $699 licensing fee to SCO. It'd be a shame for him to have to stop working on their OS..

LUNIX != ON TEH SPOKE, OR TEH DESKTOP (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#7987067)

Australia? (5, Insightful)

probbka (308168) | more than 10 years ago | (#7987073)

Why would any computer-savvy person want to move to Australia? They've got some of the toughest Internet censorship laws in the free world, IIRC...

Re:Australia? (4, Interesting)

epiphani (254981) | more than 10 years ago | (#7987185)

Not only that, but the bandwidth is super expensive, and broadband is not exactly overly availible.

But what im curious about is why he says "I definitely won't be moving back to Finland though." Whats wrong with Finland?

Re:Australia? (1)

mirko (198274) | more than 10 years ago | (#7987242)

Whats wrong with Finland?

Freezing Winters.

Re:Australia? (1)

daviddennis (10926) | more than 10 years ago | (#7987257)

Isn't he in California now?

Moving back to Finland would be, well, a bit chilly and far away from his social circle of fellow Linux folk.

D

Re:Australia? (2, Insightful)

somethinghollow (530478) | more than 10 years ago | (#7987320)

I'm under the impression that Linus can afford a decent connection. Not to mention Austrailia's dollar is worth less than the US dollar.

Austrailia is a nice country with alot of nice people. I just got back a few weeks ago from there. I hope to go back sooner than later.

The only thing I would change is the flies. That is, I wish they would have not been so bothersome.

Re:Australia? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#7987342)

Finland is fine if you can live with the eight dark winter months, suffociating conformity (remember to vote the "Kokoomus"-party and ever tighter drug legislation) and 60% income tax.

-A Finn

Re:Australia? (1)

gl4ss (559668) | more than 10 years ago | (#7987253)

because of sun, variety of landscape(in certain areas)? maybe he has a nice place looked up there to raise kids? It doesn't seem to me that it would matter that much where on earth he works for his work though. His not that much of a politician.

But I can promise you one thing: It will be warmer in Oz than it is in Finland(though in this aspect I kind of suspect California to work just as well..).

Re:Australia? (1, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#7987259)


1) they have kangaroos
2) great barrior reef
3) they say "g'day"
4) lots of outdoors stuff to do
5) toilets flush in opposite direction.

ha, same story in 1995, 96, 97, 98, 99, 00, 01, 02 (-1, Flamebait)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#7987074)



Everyear is the year.

SCO Sucks.

Microsoft sucks.

HAHAHAHHAHA LOL!!!!!!!

HAHA LINUX OWNZ3R

I think 2004 is make or break (-1, Flamebait)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#7987075)

And I don't think it's gonna be "make". Linux is still too disorganized for mass desktop appeal.

Re:I think 2004 is make or break (5, Insightful)

twocents (310492) | more than 10 years ago | (#7987278)

Why would any year for Linux be make or break? That makes no sense at all when one considers the strides that have been made in just the last few years.

I personally think Linux is popular because of X,OpenOffice,Gimp,Apache,TuxRacer, etc etc, and ETC and there is nothing but more software coming out for the OS. I cannot imagine everyone throwing in the towel after 2004 if Linux doesn't take over the desktop: "Oh hell, forget it, this was to be THE year, but wasn't so let's shut the doors."

Also, a lot of people are already using Linux as a desktop and feel the "make" much more than the "break" already. If mass appeal picks up, great, but considering the effort that goes into the OS and the software that runs on Linux, to simplify one year as THE defining year for an operating system misses the point.

..and next year on Slashdot: (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#7987079)

"Linus says 2005 is the Year for Desktop Linux"

Followed by

"Linus says 2006 is the Year for Desktop Linux"
"Linus says 2007 is the Year for Desktop Linux"
"Linus says 2008 is the Year for Desktop Linux"
"Linus says 2009 is the Year for Desktop Linux"

Just because 'his holiness' proclaims it, it don't make it a reality.

LINUS COULD CLAIM TO BE JESUS CHRIST (2, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#7987083)

...and all the Linux geeks in the world would follow and worship him like deciples.

Can you say "Bill Gates as Pontious Pilate"?

"Look, I'm Linus Christ. I can serve 5000 webpages using 5 analog phone lines and 3 Amigas!"

Yes, I'm making vauge references comparing the Son of God to the Open Source movement. I'm bored and my mind is wandering.

akedia

Re:LINUS COULD CLAIM TO BE JESUS CHRIST (1)

LowTolerance (301722) | more than 10 years ago | (#7987216)

Calling him Linus Christ and having him perform miracles is hardly a vague reference, is it?

Not that it isn't true..

Re:LINUS COULD CLAIM TO BE JESUS CHRIST (2, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#7987303)

1) Betray Linus
2) PROFIT!!!!
3) ?????

Re:LINUS COULD CLAIM TO BE JESUS CHRIST (1)

KDan (90353) | more than 10 years ago | (#7987327)

Your mind is wandering? What mind is it you're speaking of? You seem to either have none or several... ;-)

Daniel

people say a lot of stuff (3, Funny)

El_Muerte_TDS (592157) | more than 10 years ago | (#7987084)

640kb is more than we'll ever need

Re:people say a lot of stuff (4, Funny)

micromoog (206608) | more than 10 years ago | (#7987152)

Iraq has weapons of mass destruction

Re:people say a lot of stuff (5, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#7987193)

I've got weapons of math instruction!

At New York's Kennedy airport today, an individual later
discovered to be a public school teacher was arrested trying
to board a flight while in possession of a ruler, a
protractor, a setsquare, a slide rule, and a calculator.

At a morning press conference, Attorney general John Ashcroft
said he believes the man is a member of the notorious
al-gebra movement. He is being charged by the FBI with
carrying weapons of math instruction.

"Al-gebra is a fearsome cult,", Ashcroft said. "They desire
average solutions by means and extremes, and sometimes go off
on tangents in a search of absolute value. They use secret
code names like "x" and "y" and refer to themselves as
"unknowns", but we have determined they belong to a common
denominator of the axis of medieval with coordinates in every country.

"As the Greek philanderer Isosceles used to say, there are 3
sides to every triangle," Ashcroft declared.

When asked to comment on the arrest, President Bush said, "If
God had wanted us to have better weapons of math instruction,
He would have given us more fingers and toes.

"I am gratified that our government has given us a sine that
it is intent on protracting us from these math-dogs who are
willing to disintegrate us with calculus disregard. Murky
statisticians love to inflict plane on every sphere of
influence," the President said, adding: "Under the
circumferences, we must differentiate their root, make our
point, and draw the line."

President Bush warned, "These weapons of math instruction
have the potential to decimal everything in their math on a
scalene never before seen unless we become exponents of a
Higher Power and begin to factor-in random facts of vertex."

Attorney General Ashcroft said, "As our Great Leader would
say, read my ellipse. Here is one principle he is uncertainty
of: though they continue to multiply, their days are numbered
as the hypotenuse tightens around their necks."

Re:people say a lot of stuff (0, Offtopic)

74nova (737399) | more than 10 years ago | (#7987340)

*assumes perhaps incorrectly that that wasnt a joke*
you seriously think they didnt just get rid of or hide them in the 12+ years they had to do so?

and for the on-topic part, mandrake 9.2 is getting darn close to useable for my mom. that is the measurement, my mother being able to use it. my wife can already use knoppix, so its getting close.

Re:people say a lot of stuff (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#7987182)

George W. Bush was elected President.

Re:people say a lot of stuff (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#7987273)

I did not have sexual relations with that woman.

Re:people say a lot of stuff (1)

tigershark97 (595017) | more than 10 years ago | (#7987275)

That has never been said. Read here [urbanlegends.com]

Re:people say a lot of stuff (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#7987304)

What are you talking about? A million people probably said it.

Patience little one -- patience! (4, Interesting)

drizst 'n drat (725458) | more than 10 years ago | (#7987086)

"The server space is easier to tackle first with any operating system as it can be applied to specific tasks such as mail serving; however, the desktop is harder to sell." This may be true but it sure isn't impossible. It will just take some time. Can't run until you can first crawl.

No offense, (5, Insightful)

conner_bw (120497) | more than 10 years ago | (#7987087)

Doesn't Linus work on the kernel? How is his input vital for desktops which are KDE/GNOME dominated now, projects he is not involved with...

--
Vegan World Order [veganworldorder.com] - Shut up and eat.

Re:No offense, (2, Interesting)

thebagel (650109) | more than 10 years ago | (#7987138)

Everything is based on the kernel. Maybe he's looking for better optimization for certain routines that, say, OpenGL might utilize.

Or perhaps he's urging the XFree86 team to make some progress with OpenGL performance or card support (like nVidia support without the nVidia drivers). (THAT WASN'T FLAMEBAIT.)

Or perhaps he's urging, say, the GNOME team to make the desktop a tad bit more user friendly.

He could be doing a lot of things; just because he's a kernel dude doesn't mean that his input isn't important.

Easy Peasy -- (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#7987245)

He's gonna trade reliability and simplicity for speed by taking a page from Microsoft's book and putting display drivers in kernel space.

Re:No offense, (3, Insightful)

ainsoph (2216) | more than 10 years ago | (#7987151)

cos the kernel is what all that stuff lays on top of.

Re:No offense, (1)

LordNimon (85072) | more than 10 years ago | (#7987267)

But 99% of the problems that Linux has on the desktop have nothing to do with the kernel, and hence, nothing to do with Linus.

Last time i checked... (1)

conner_bw (120497) | more than 10 years ago | (#7987301)

Last time i checked, KDE/GNOME could compile and run on a BSD kernel.

--
Vegan World Order [veganworldorder.com] - Shut up and eat.

Re:No offense, (1)

jargoone (166102) | more than 10 years ago | (#7987309)

Still doesn't matter. Desktop users need something easy to use. If you could build a Linux system that a KDE or Gnome theme that made the system seem exactly like XP, coupled with applications that behaved exactly like the ones people are used to, you'd have a winner.

Desktop systems are about the users. And the users couldn't give a rat's ass about the kernel.

Re:No offense, (1)

lederhosen (612610) | more than 10 years ago | (#7987317)

Well than we should ask Intel, don't you think?

isn't kernel a part of it? (3, Insightful)

DenOfEarth (162699) | more than 10 years ago | (#7987160)

I was wondering similar things myself on reading the headline. I haven't yet installed 2.6 on my machine yet, but I have heard that it is a bit 'snappier', which I believe goes a long way towards making the desktop seem like you are controlling it, rather than having it control you. The KDE / gnome work, is also very important, but a solid fast user-responsive kernel is a boon to anyone trying to sell anyone else on linux on the desktop.

Re:isn't kernel a part of it? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#7987333)

which I believe goes a long way towards making the desktop seem like you are controlling it, rather than having it control you.

in soviet russia, you control the desktop!

Re:No offense, (2, Funny)

PatrickThomson (712694) | more than 10 years ago | (#7987163)

Heresey! Say 15 "Hail Linus's"

Re:No offense, (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#7987172)

hmm... how is this relevant... let me think...
perhaps because the desktop is based on the foundation of a GNU/Linux OS?

On second thought, you're right. The kernel has nothing at all to do with the rest of the OS...

Go get yourself a clue. I hear Milton-Bradley sells them at $19.95 a pop.

Re:No offense, (1)

octal666 (668007) | more than 10 years ago | (#7987180)

Well, I think he is kinda the soul of the movement, is like if Stallman says anything about SCO, he can't change anything, but all we linux-geeks are waiting for His Holy Word :)

Re:No offense, (4, Insightful)

mydigitalself (472203) | more than 10 years ago | (#7987235)

contrary to some of the other responses to your post - i agree with you wholeheartedly. success and penetration of the desktop will have very little to do with performance from 2.6 kernel - but rather with good usability practices within the community.

Re:No offense, (2, Insightful)

gl4ss (559668) | more than 10 years ago | (#7987296)

among other things hardware support(for CURRENT hardware) is vital for desktop success(which 2.6 may or may not have impact on later on, or whatever he plans to do).

the page isn't loading for me so I can't really comment on if his commenting it somehow.
-

Re:No offense, (3, Insightful)

pyros (61399) | more than 10 years ago | (#7987268)

Doesn't Linus work on the kernel? How is his input vital for desktops which are KDE/GNOME dominated now, projects he is not involved with...


Don't underestimate the importance of a good kernel for the desktop. You need good multitasking support (low-latency context switching, an efficient scheduler, a good VM system) for the GUI environment to be responsive and zippy. You need a good infrastructure and API for device drivers to get the most out of your peripherals. People hate buying a fancy video card only to find that half the I/O ports aren't supported.

Re:No offense, (1)

deadmongrel (621467) | more than 10 years ago | (#7987284)

although KDE and GNOME give you the "interface" its the kernel that is doing actual job behind the scene. Kernel 2.6 has a lot of new and improved features.
Right now the some of the issues that make Linux desktops less appealing to joe six pack and corporate users are "support" as in who would i call to fix a problem, and FUD.
These issues are starting to disappear.InFact sco's case has given a lot of people to take a serious look at linux(and GPL).
also getting a moral push from people like linus is important to any project associated with linux.
So what linus says matters!!!

Re:No offense, (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#7987331)

The user is using their sig for advertisement, which is ok by me, but when I have sigs off I expect not to see them.

I think Slashdot needs a feature that detects when people are putting their sig in their messages, and automatically move it to the sig for display.

Re:No offense, (1)

pete-classic (75983) | more than 10 years ago | (#7987349)

One word: Drivers.

Re:No offense, (-1, Troll)

swordboy (472941) | more than 10 years ago | (#7987352)

How is his input vital for desktops which are KDE/GNOME dominated now, projects he is not involved with...

He's going to pick either KDE or Gnome and merge it with his tree. IMHO, that will be the only way that Linux can succeed on the desktop. Multiple GUI environments are the bane of both programmer and end-user. While I do agree that it is nice to have choices in certain cases, "Desktop Linux" is not helped at all.

Linus needs to pick one and create a "desktop" tree. Otherwise, Joe and Joeanne User will stick with Windows. I know that I will.

Hasn't this been said every year? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#7987096)

What has changed?

I would have to agree. (5, Interesting)

MoOsEb0y (2177) | more than 10 years ago | (#7987097)

With the advent of the 2.6 series kernel, along with the efforts for compatability between KDE and GNOME, I think linux is getting very close for the desktop. I already use it as a desktop OS on my laptop with few problems. With a little bit more effort, even so -called "dummies" will be able to work with it as well.

Re:I would have to agree. (1)

grub (11606) | more than 10 years ago | (#7987149)


With a little bit more effort, even so -called "dummies" will be able to work with it as well.

Some dummies already do [sco.com] .

Re:I would have to agree. (3, Insightful)

aheath (628369) | more than 10 years ago | (#7987254)

"With a little bit more effort, even so -called "dummies" will be able to work with it as well."

The so called 'dummies" really don't care much about the operating system that they are using. They care much more about the applications that they are running. They also care about the availability of training and support for the operating system and applications.

The computer using world can be reoughly divided into two categories:

(1) People who want to think about the work their doing, but don't want to think about the computer technology they are using.

(2) People who want to think about the work they are doing and who like to think about how the computer is doing the work.

The first group wants reliability, stability, and transparency. They d not want to spend a lot of time fixing or upgrading their computer. They do not want to spend a lot of time working on a computer that crashes. They do not want to spend a lot of time thinking about how to do their work. Their main interest is in what works, not necessarily what works best.

They won't switch to Linux from something that is good enough to allow them to do their work. They may switch to Linux if they are upgrading a computer and it is clear that Linux will allow them to do their work without giving much thought to how the computer works.

Linuxworld server already melting... (5, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#7987104)

Linux breaks desktop barrier in 2004: Torvalds

Rodney Gedda , Computerworld

15/01/2004 15:43:16

This year will see Linux finally crack the lucrative desktop market as more commercial software vendors tool up and cash in on the operating system and kernel developers improve graphical interface integration says cult hero and Linux founder Linus Torvalds. Computerworld's Rodney Gedda cornered the penguin power supremo at the Linux.Conf.au in Adelaide.

Computerworld: How do you feel Linux on the desktop is progressing?

Linus Torvalds: Last year was good but I'm seeing a lot more noise about it this year. The server space is easier to tackle first with any operating system as it can be applied to specific tasks such as mail serving; however, the desktop is harder to sell.

Now, the kernel and other pieces are coming together including office applications, games and Web browsers. This has made the Linux desktop interesting to commercials. Commercials tend to choose one desktop, such as KDE or GNOME (GNU Network Object Model Environment), and stick with it. There has been some confusion and rivalry that has helped its development. Right now it looks like the two are closing in on each other, for example, with Red Hat's Bluecurve interface.

I don't think X is going away as it has a powerful infrastructure and throwing it away would be stupid. And its network transparency is good. It's likely that X will be the 2D interface to a lower-level graphics system that is based on OpenGL. The Linux desktop wants to have 3D as the base and X as the interface to 2D.

The fact that X and kernel development have been separate is good; one could evolve without the other but DRI (Direct Rendering Infrastructure) has made them not completely independent. As a developer, having the two separate is good, because different people are good at developing for each.

CW: Any plans for 2004?

LT: I've never had much of a plan for the direction of Linux as I react to outside pressure. This year there will be a lot of desktop users, which will impact kernel developers.

For now I will be working the stabilisation of kernel 2.6 and in a month or two I expect Fedora (the core of Red Hat Linux) to have a release with 2.6 so I expect to get more bug reports.

CW: Would adopting an integrated hardware and software system be good for Linux?

LT: There are pure technical disadvantages of having an operating system that supports a wide range of hardware. The variety of hardware makes it challenging as Linux needs thousands of drivers.

But having an operating system that is independent of the hardware is powerful for the user as it is basically the same on big and small machines. Another big advantage of a wide hardware base is an operating system that is more flexible. This is why Linux is having a lot of impact in the embedded space. An operating system is a complex beast, so it's nice to have an existing one that can be adapted to the hardware. There are a few problem spots with Linux driver support by hardware companies and wireless is one of them. With hardware getting better this problem is being solved.

CW: What about Linux in the enterprise?

LT: The direction Linux takes in the enterprise will depend on what resources enterprise companies put into it. This is the one thing that will push Linux into the high end.

IBM is the most obvious, and although it is impressive to run Linux on high-end hardware, most of the people who work on Linux don't have access to it. It's the regular desktops that get most of the attention by programmers.

CW: What about open source code bundling by commercial software companies?

LT: Quite often that's fine and it is fine with BSD (Berkely Software/Standard Distribution) code. But I like the GPL (General Public Licence), because I want people to give [code] back. If hardware appliance makers don't give back code then that's a problem, but giving it back shouldn't cause any problems. And quite often they don't need to modify the kernel.

CW: How do you view the relationship between free and commercial software?

LT: Software is not becoming free but it is becoming a commodity. Once you have a commodity product the things you make money on are the services and hardware that are built around it. For example, with a lot of mobile phones the software is not the value in the product.

Shrink-wrap software businesses are the exception, not the rule. There are very few pure software houses as it is usually sold as a package.

On the desktop, it's hard to say what the commercial applications market will be like because it hasn't really taken off yet. On the server there are already companies, like Oracle, that don't have any problems selling commercial applications.

Open source is good for general software such as the kernel and development tools, and commercial software is good for specialist software.

For example, MySQL is doing well in the general Web serving space whereas Oracle is doing well as a specialist business database.

CW: What are your thoughts on the recent SCO issue?

LT: This week has been good and I'm happy to see Novell release a letter that SCO is violating Novell's agreements. SCO also had to make available its case to IBM. This reaffirms the fact that this is not about copyrights but a contract agreement with IBM.

It's been very irritating at times with SCO's ludicrous, unsubstantiated claims. Some of the press has picked up the SCO case without a lot of critical analysis but lately SCO press releases have [been subjected to] a lot more scrutiny. Outside the US SCO has not been good at pushing its case. I don't have a PR department so unless journalists come to me I have no way of [commenting on] SCO.

Lawsuits are a big part of the business landscape in the US. It's good that this case has made all the Linux developers aware of code, but it has been bad because it is irritating and I definitely don't want something like this to happen again.

All the Linux developers take copyright very seriously. They are developers and want to do coding, not copying. Because of this, I feel that the code quality of Linux is even better than commercial Unix operating systems. I'm not worried about copyrights but the Linux community doesn't have a lot of lawyers, PR or marketing.

CW: What has working at the OSDL (Open Source Development Labs) been like?

LT: Working at the OSDL has been good and although it's based in Portland, Oregon, I work from home in San Jose.

A lot of the vendors that make up the OSDL want to sell hardware and support services so I don't see any conflict with joint Linux development between them.

CW: So, when are you moving to Australia?

LT: I like Australia but have no plans to move here. My family is well adjusted to life in San Jose; however, I do work from home so I could work anywhere. I definitely won't be moving back to Finland though.

MOD PARENT DOWN! REPLACEMENT TEXT TROLL! (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#7987203)

CW: What are your thoughts on the recent SCO issue?

LT: I'm really sorry for stealing the code. *sniffles* I hope Mr. McBride will go easy and not eat my family.


The CORRECT text is:
"This week has been good and I'm happy to see Novell release a letter that SCO is violating Novell's agreements. SCO also had to make available its case to IBM. This reaffirms the fact that this is not about copyrights but a contract agreement with IBM."

Re:MOD PARENT DOWN! REPLACEMENT TEXT TROLL *TROLL* (1)

GreyWolf3000 (468618) | more than 10 years ago | (#7987310)

The grandparent didn't replace that text at all. The parent is a replacement text troll TROLL.

YHBL YHL HTH HAND (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#7987354)

FURRIES

And I agree. (3, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#7987105)

Look at all the interesting software for linux coming out soon

KDE 3.2
Gnome 2.6
Gimp 2.0
Mplayer 1.0
OpenOffice 2.0
More games than ever
and hundreds of others.

Combine this with kernel 2.6, and with many distros going to be version 10.0 this year, this is going to be great.

KDE 3.2 will be out soon, its so easy to use, no wonder its the most popular desktop environement for Linux.

Re:And I agree. (1)

paul248 (536459) | more than 10 years ago | (#7987241)

with many distros going to be version 10.0 this year, this is going to be great.
Yes, of course. Just like Star Trek movies...

Re:And I agree. (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#7987244)

What is this "KDE" of which you speak? Is it anything like this "80x25 Desktop Environment" I've been using? Will I actually be able to pick a color scheme other than white on black?

Re:And I agree. (1)

GoofyBoy (44399) | more than 10 years ago | (#7987271)


>More games than ever

Really? Like what?

And couldn't you say the same thing about XP?

Re:And I agree. (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#7987343)

"KDE 3.2 will be out soon, its so easy to use, no wonder its the most popular desktop environement for Linux."

That sounds a little too much like "So easy to use, no wonder it's #1" -- an AOL catchphrase. Having a lot of respect for KDE, I'd rather it not be associated with the OMG LOL WTF!!!!111!!!!! l337 AOLers.

Agree (4, Insightful)

bryansj (89051) | more than 10 years ago | (#7987106)

I'd have to agree with it being close to having a real viable desktop solution. Having LiveCD's in place, such as Knoppix, showing off the ease of running Linux will help bring it to the masses. It's much easier to try Linux if you just have to boot from CD and then "play" instead of having to commit to the install process. My Knoppix installed Debian feels solid compared to the "feel" of Mandrake and Suse which makes me more likely to recommend it to others that I see as borderline tech savy.

Won't be moving back to Finland (4, Funny)

burgburgburg (574866) | more than 10 years ago | (#7987111)

I definitely won't be moving back to Finland though.

Or is it "Can't move back to Finland"? Has he crossed the Finnish mafia once too often? Did he wake up to find smelt heads in his bed? What's the REAL story here?

Re:Won't be moving back to Finland (1)

tats (31833) | more than 10 years ago | (#7987237)

but seriously, its attraction, accumulation and assimilation of such brain power from around the world in the melting pot of humanity that has made US great. i hope the immigration program (-temp work status) remains strong for this to continue happening.

Re:Won't be moving back to Finland (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#7987277)

Why would he? Sure Finland is high-tech and all that, but...


-USA is high-tech, too.
-USA is not a socialist welfare state with 60% income tax.
-In the USA you're actually treated like an adult. You're allowed to actually defend yourself and you've got true freedom of speech and thought.
-In the USA winter doesn't last 8 months.
-In the USA temperatures don't reach -40 (Fahrenheit or Celcius) in the winter.
-USA doesn't have a 1000 mile border with the Russia.
-And even if USA did have a 1000 mile border, they'd actually have a credible military to countery the threat. Not some sorry-ass conscript army with low morale and a few token Leopard tanks and F-18s.

I should know. I'm Finnish.

linux.dell.com (2, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#7987115)

no desktop mentions, but cool: linux.dell.com [dell.com]

Slashdotted. Article text here: (-1, Redundant)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#7987119)

Linux breaks desktop barrier in 2004: Torvalds

Rodney Gedda , Computerworld

15/01/2004 15:43:16

This year will see Linux finally crack the lucrative desktop market as more commercial software vendors tool up and cash in on the operating system and kernel developers improve graphical interface integration says cult hero and Linux founder Linus Torvalds. Computerworld's Rodney Gedda cornered the penguin power supremo at the Linux.Conf.au in Adelaide.

Computerworld: How do you feel Linux on the desktop is progressing?

Linus Torvalds: Last year was good but I'm seeing a lot more noise about it this year. The server space is easier to tackle first with any operating system as it can be applied to specific tasks such as mail serving; however, the desktop is harder to sell.

Now, the kernel and other pieces are coming together including office applications, games and Web browsers. This has made the Linux desktop interesting to commercials. Commercials tend to choose one desktop, such as KDE or GNOME (GNU Network Object Model Environment), and stick with it. There has been some confusion and rivalry that has helped its development. Right now it looks like the two are closing in on each other, for example, with Red Hat's Bluecurve interface.

I don't think X is going away as it has a powerful infrastructure and throwing it away would be stupid. And its network transparency is good. It's likely that X will be the 2D interface to a lower-level graphics system that is based on OpenGL. The Linux desktop wants to have 3D as the base and X as the interface to 2D.

The fact that X and kernel development have been separate is good; one could evolve without the other but DRI (Direct Rendering Infrastructure) has made them not completely independent. As a developer, having the two separate is good, because different people are good at developing for each.

CW: Any plans for 2004?

LT: I've never had much of a plan for the direction of Linux as I react to outside pressure. This year there will be a lot of desktop users, which will impact kernel developers.

For now I will be working the stabilisation of kernel 2.6 and in a month or two I expect Fedora (the core of Red Hat Linux) to have a release with 2.6 so I expect to get more bug reports.

CW: Would adopting an integrated hardware and software system be good for Linux?

LT: There are pure technical disadvantages of having an operating system that supports a wide range of hardware. The variety of hardware makes it challenging as Linux needs thousands of drivers.

But having an operating system that is independent of the hardware is powerful for the user as it is basically the same on big and small machines. Another big advantage of a wide hardware base is an operating system that is more flexible. This is why Linux is having a lot of impact in the embedded space. An operating system is a complex beast, so it's nice to have an existing one that can be adapted to the hardware. There are a few problem spots with Linux driver support by hardware companies and wireless is one of them. With hardware getting better this problem is being solved.

CW: What about Linux in the enterprise?

LT: The direction Linux takes in the enterprise will depend on what resources enterprise companies put into it. This is the one thing that will push Linux into the high end.

IBM is the most obvious, and although it is impressive to run Linux on high-end hardware, most of the people who work on Linux don't have access to it. It's the regular desktops that get most of the attention by programmers.

CW: What about open source code bundling by commercial software companies?

LT: Quite often that's fine and it is fine with BSD (Berkely Software/Standard Distribution) code. But I like the GPL (General Public Licence), because I want people to give [code] back. If hardware appliance makers don't give back code then that's a problem, but giving it back shouldn't cause any problems. And quite often they don't need to modify the kernel.

CW: How do you view the relationship between free and commercial software?

LT: Software is not becoming free but it is becoming a commodity. Once you have a commodity product the things you make money on are the services and hardware that are built around it. For example, with a lot of mobile phones the software is not the value in the product.

Shrink-wrap software businesses are the exception, not the rule. There are very few pure software houses as it is usually sold as a package.

On the desktop, it's hard to say what the commercial applications market will be like because it hasn't really taken off yet. On the server there are already companies, like Oracle, that don't have any problems selling commercial applications.

Open source is good for general software such as the kernel and development tools, and commercial software is good for specialist software.

For example, MySQL is doing well in the general Web serving space whereas Oracle is doing well as a specialist business database.

CW: What are your thoughts on the recent SCO issue?

LT: This week has been good and I'm happy to see Novell release a letter that SCO is violating Novell's agreements. SCO also had to make available its case to IBM. This reaffirms the fact that this is not about copyrights but a contract agreement with IBM.

It's been very irritating at times with SCO's ludicrous, unsubstantiated claims. Some of the press has picked up the SCO case without a lot of critical analysis but lately SCO press releases have [been subjected to] a lot more scrutiny. Outside the US SCO has not been good at pushing its case. I don't have a PR department so unless journalists come to me I have no way of [commenting on] SCO.

Lawsuits are a big part of the business landscape in the US. It's good that this case has made all the Linux developers aware of code, but it has been bad because it is irritating and I definitely don't want something like this to happen again.

All the Linux developers take copyright very seriously. They are developers and want to do coding, not copying. Because of this, I feel that the code quality of Linux is even better than commercial Unix operating systems. I'm not worried about copyrights but the Linux community doesn't have a lot of lawyers, PR or marketing.

CW: What has working at the OSDL (Open Source Development Labs) been like?

LT: Working at the OSDL has been good and although it's based in Portland, Oregon, I work from home in San Jose.

A lot of the vendors that make up the OSDL want to sell hardware and support services so I don't see any conflict with joint Linux development between them.

CW: So, when are you moving to Australia?

LT: I like Australia but have no plans to move here. My family is well adjusted to life in San Jose; however, I do work from home so I could work anywhere. I definitely won't be moving back to Finland though.

Important! plz format!! (-1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#7987120)

CHRISTMAS ISLAND INTERNET ADMINISTRATION LIMITED
Notice Regarding AUP Complaint Version 1.1
Page 1 1/15/2004
Complaintant:
Ms Rhonda Clarke,
Poon Saan, Christmas Island
Indian Ocean
Copy to: Cory Visi
This letter is to confirm that we have received your AUP Complaint Form
dated January 11 2004.
Reference Number: goatse.cx.11.01.2004
CONTEXT OF REVIEW
CIIA supports the free flow of information via the Internet. CIIA cannot and
does not actively monitor or censor the content of websites which end in the
two letter suffix ".CX".
On payment of the Registration Fee and registration of the Domain, the
Registrant is entitled to a licence for the exclusive use of the Domain for the
term of the registration no other party will be permitted to register the same
Domain and the Registrant will have an exclusive licence for use of the
Domain, subject to any order of a court in an applicable jurisdiction to the
contrary, so long as the Registrant pays the Domain fees, and complies with
all CIIA Policies and the CIIA Registration Agreement.
The CIIA registration agreement stipulates that "The Registrant shall not use,
display, exploit, or register a Domain in any manner which may constitute
illegal activity or be in contravention or violation of CIIA Policies".
CIIA will not resolve, or in any other way become involved in, a dispute
between a Registrant and a third party (e.g., CIIA will not act as an arbiter or
mediator of a dispute). Moreover, CIIA will not suspend or cancel a Domain,
transfer registration of a Domain, nor place a Domain on hold without a court
order so directing, or without the Registrant's voluntary relinquishment or
transfer of the Domain, unless the use of the Domain is deemed at the
sole discretion of CIIA, to be a violation of the provisions and
requirements of the AUP and terms of use of the CIIA Network.
Broadly speaking, CIIA may act to immediately suspend access to and use of
the CIIA network under the following three circumstances.
1.) When there is a compelling interest to act to protect the "public or
common interest". By way of example CIIA will act immediately to restrict
access to the CIIA network to any entity which is involved in the spread of
child pornography or which is using the CIIA network to incite violence or
encourage or facilitate acts of terrorism.
CHRISTMAS ISLAND INTERNET ADMINISTRATION LIMITED
Notice Regarding AUP Complaint Version 1.1
Page 2 1/15/2004
2.) When there is clear evidence that "the CIIA network is being used to
encourage or facilitate unlawful activity". By way of example CIIA will act
immediately to restrict access to the CIIA network if name resolution by CIIA
is facilitating the downloading of illegal software or music.
3.) If a registrants use of the CIIA network subjects CIIA to liability. CIIA
does not desire to second-guess the courts in the event of disputes between
parties, however CIIA will take action to suspend when there irrefutable
evidence provided of copyright or trademark violation or clear and substantial
abuse of protected intellectual or other property rights.
These three points are summaries only and are not exhaustive; please see
the CIIA AUP, Registration Agreement and Dispute policy for more detail.
In other more subtle cases the registrant will be given an opportunity to
respond to the AUP complaint to challenge or otherwise respond to the
assertions in the complaint. A registrant through this process is provided with
"an opportunity to cure the breach" - make any modifications or adjustments
to the use of the CIIA network as is deemed necessary to align the use with
CIIA policies.
INITIAL EVALUATION BY CIIA
On receipt of an AUP complaint CIIA performs an initial evaluation to
determine whether there is a compelling need to act immediately to protect
the public or common interest, to protect CIIA from potential liability or to
enforce CIIA policy.
In the case of goatse.cx an initial review indicates that the registrant's use of
the CIIA network is in violation of the CIIA AUP. Specifically sections 4 and 5
of the Compliance with Law section and, although the complaint did not
specifically address them, sections relating to electronic mail and messaging.
4. Communication, publication or distribution, either directly or by way of
embedded links, of images or materials where that communication,
publication or distribution would constitute a criminal offence pursuant to
the laws of the Commonwealth of Australia or the Territory of Christmas
Island, including but not limited to pornographic material and images or
materials that are obscene or indecent or any data that is or has been
intentionally constructed to be manipulated into obscene or indecent
images or material, whether incorporated directly into a .CX web site
utilizing a .CX Domain, or made accessible via a link on a .CX Domain.
5. Communication publication or distribution of adult or obscene content
or images by way of embedded links in unsolicited email, postings to
news groups, internet forums, notices to instant messaging programs,
CHRISTMAS ISLAND INTERNET ADMINISTRATION LIMITED
Notice Regarding AUP Complaint Version 1.1
Page 3 1/15/2004
where the internet user is not explicitly made aware that by clicking on
the link they would be directly exposed to adult or obscene content.
I appreciate that the Christmas Island community takes immense pride in it's
natural beauty - of which the spinning dolphins are an important part, and
note that the links to the dolphin sex web site would have been highly
offensive to the users of the IT Centre, particularity children.
As the link clearly constitutes a breach of the spirit and letter of the terms of
use which prohibits "Communication, publication or distribution, either
directly or by way of embedded links, of images or materials where that
communication, publication or distribution would constitute a criminal
offence"
As you will note from the attached "nationmaster" article, goatse.cx is a well
know "shock site" which is intended (one can assume) to be humorous.
Although we have received numerous informal complaints, most have raised
objections to the images. Although the images could generally be considered
to be are offensive and crude, they do not represent child ( or other forms )
of illegal pornography. By internet standards the imagery - although
intentionally offensive, is relatively tame.
The intentional posting of embedded links (without useful disclaimer) to a
site which contains obscene or adult content is a violation of the CIIA AUP
and terms of use of our network.
Generally CIIA prefers to work with registrants to cure minor breaches which
may have occurred or which they may not be aware of. Registrants are
generally given an opportunity to cure a breach before a final decision on an
AUP complaint is made.
In the case of goatse.cx which contains only two prominent links at the
bottom of the site (one of which is to the dolphin sex site) it is hard to
fathom that the registrant was not aware that this would not constitute a
violation of the AUP.
As noted in the attached article goatse.cx is not a "passive web site" - an
home page or the like, but one of the Internets more popular shock sites - it
is common practice for many "internet trolls" and third parties to embed
hidden links to this site.
There is compelling anecdotal evidence to suggest that most viewers to this
site are in some way "tricked" into viewing it, and there can be no doubt that
the object of site is to offend the viewers, many of which may be minors. The
registrant provides advice that he has received legal advice which has
recommended he place a warning on his site, yet this warning appears
directly above, and in clear view of an image he himself suggests legally
requires a disclaimer.
CHRISTMAS ISLAND INTERNET ADMINISTRATION LIMITED
Notice Regarding AUP Complaint Version 1.1
Page 4 1/15/2004
This being the case I have asked Brad to suspend the site immediately
pending further review and notification of the registrant.
There can be no doubt that will be viewed by some as "censorship" and a
restriction of "freedom of speech", however the board has specifically drafted
polices which give CIIA latitude to (act in the absence of a court order) when
there is a completing public interest in doing so (prevent the spread and
publication of child pornography or other unlawful activity). The "freedom of
speech" does not extend to use of our community owned network to facilitate
unlawful activity or to intentionally harass or offend internet users.
This letter and your initial complaint will be posted at:
http://www.ciia.cx/cx.archive.complaints.cfm
WHAT HAPPENS NEXT
This AUP Complaint will be forwarded to the registrant for his comments.
The Registrant has 60 days to reply - until March 12th 2004. If no reply is
received by that date the domain will be permanently suspended.
Once a reply is received from the registrant it will be posted on the CIIA
website and copied to the complainant and the registrant.
Sincerely yours,
Garth Miller
Monday, January 12, 2004
Copy: Chris Bolden

Brother trolls, TO ARMS! TO ARMS! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#7987279)

Access to the image of the portal of the oracle has been cut off by Austrailailailan bluenoses!

Don't they have freedom of religion in Austraila?!!!!

Who will win ? (3, Insightful)

Krapangor (533950) | more than 10 years ago | (#7987124)

If Linux get Desktop world domination then this raises the question which desktop will rule them all. It's relatively unlikely that two desktops will be supported to the same extend by the OSS community.
So, what do you think KDE or Gnome ?

My bet goes on Gnome because it has better backing by Debian, Novell and Redhat.

Krapflinger strikes again (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#7987332)

to the same extend

Proud owner of a Mensa membership card

Obviously, said Mensa membership card was lost by someone else and you found it on the sidewalk. Someone who really belonged to Mensa wouldn't use "extend" [reference.com] in the above phrase because they would know the correct word is "extent." [reference.com]

If he is moving to Australia... (2, Funny)

Soul Brother #1 (15266) | more than 10 years ago | (#7987131)

Also discussed are topics such as hardware support, the SCO issue, and whether or not he will be moving to Australia.

If he is moving to Australia, maybe he can bring LinuxWorld a new webserver.

Article text, (AC'ed for no karma-whoring) (-1, Redundant)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#7987133)

Linux breaks desktop barrier in 2004: Torvalds

Rodney Gedda , Computerworld

15/01/2004 15:43:16

This year will see Linux finally crack the lucrative desktop market as more commercial software vendors tool up and cash in on the operating system and kernel developers improve graphical interface integration says cult hero and Linux founder Linus Torvalds. Computerworld's Rodney Gedda cornered the penguin power supremo at the Linux.Conf.au in Adelaide.

Computerworld: How do you feel Linux on the desktop is progressing?

Linus Torvalds: Last year was good but I'm seeing a lot more noise about it this year. The server space is easier to tackle first with any operating system as it can be applied to specific tasks such as mail serving; however, the desktop is harder to sell.

Now, the kernel and other pieces are coming together including office applications, games and Web browsers. This has made the Linux desktop interesting to commercials. Commercials tend to choose one desktop, such as KDE or GNOME (GNU Network Object Model Environment), and stick with it. There has been some confusion and rivalry that has helped its development. Right now it looks like the two are closing in on each other, for example, with Red Hat's Bluecurve interface.

I don't think X is going away as it has a powerful infrastructure and throwing it away would be stupid. And its network transparency is good. It's likely that X will be the 2D interface to a lower-level graphics system that is based on OpenGL. The Linux desktop wants to have 3D as the base and X as the interface to 2D.

The fact that X and kernel development have been separate is good; one could evolve without the other but DRI (Direct Rendering Infrastructure) has made them not completely independent. As a developer, having the two separate is good, because different people are good at developing for each.

CW: Any plans for 2004?

LT: I've never had much of a plan for the direction of Linux as I react to outside pressure. This year there will be a lot of desktop users, which will impact kernel developers.

For now I will be working the stabilisation of kernel 2.6 and in a month or two I expect Fedora (the core of Red Hat Linux) to have a release with 2.6 so I expect to get more bug reports.

CW: Would adopting an integrated hardware and software system be good for Linux?

LT: There are pure technical disadvantages of having an operating system that supports a wide range of hardware. The variety of hardware makes it challenging as Linux needs thousands of drivers.

But having an operating system that is independent of the hardware is powerful for the user as it is basically the same on big and small machines. Another big advantage of a wide hardware base is an operating system that is more flexible. This is why Linux is having a lot of impact in the embedded space. An operating system is a complex beast, so it's nice to have an existing one that can be adapted to the hardware. There are a few problem spots with Linux driver support by hardware companies and wireless is one of them. With hardware getting better this problem is being solved.

CW: What about Linux in the enterprise?

LT: The direction Linux takes in the enterprise will depend on what resources enterprise companies put into it. This is the one thing that will push Linux into the high end.

IBM is the most obvious, and although it is impressive to run Linux on high-end hardware, most of the people who work on Linux don't have access to it. It's the regular desktops that get most of the attention by programmers.

CW: What about open source code bundling by commercial software companies?

LT: Quite often that's fine and it is fine with BSD (Berkely Software/Standard Distribution) code. But I like the GPL (General Public Licence), because I want people to give [code] back. If hardware appliance makers don't give back code then that's a problem, but giving it back shouldn't cause any problems. And quite often they don't need to modify the kernel.

CW: How do you view the relationship between free and commercial software?

LT: Software is not becoming free but it is becoming a commodity. Once you have a commodity product the things you make money on are the services and hardware that are built around it. For example, with a lot of mobile phones the software is not the value in the product.

Shrink-wrap software businesses are the exception, not the rule. There are very few pure software houses as it is usually sold as a package.

On the desktop, it's hard to say what the commercial applications market will be like because it hasn't really taken off yet. On the server there are already companies, like Oracle, that don't have any problems selling commercial applications.

Open source is good for general software such as the kernel and development tools, and commercial software is good for specialist software.

For example, MySQL is doing well in the general Web serving space whereas Oracle is doing well as a specialist business database.

CW: What are your thoughts on the recent SCO issue?

LT: This week has been good and I'm happy to see Novell release a letter that SCO is violating Novell's agreements. SCO also had to make available its case to IBM. This reaffirms the fact that this is not about copyrights but a contract agreement with IBM.

It's been very irritating at times with SCO's ludicrous, unsubstantiated claims. Some of the press has picked up the SCO case without a lot of critical analysis but lately SCO press releases have [been subjected to] a lot more scrutiny. Outside the US SCO has not been good at pushing its case. I don't have a PR department so unless journalists come to me I have no way of [commenting on] SCO.

Lawsuits are a big part of the business landscape in the US. It's good that this case has made all the Linux developers aware of code, but it has been bad because it is irritating and I definitely don't want something like this to happen again.

All the Linux developers take copyright very seriously. They are developers and want to do coding, not copying. Because of this, I feel that the code quality of Linux is even better than commercial Unix operating systems. I'm not worried about copyrights but the Linux community doesn't have a lot of lawyers, PR or marketing.

CW: What has working at the OSDL (Open Source Development Labs) been like?

LT: Working at the OSDL has been good and although it's based in Portland, Oregon, I work from home in San Jose.

A lot of the vendors that make up the OSDL want to sell hardware and support services so I don't see any conflict with joint Linux development between them.

CW: So, when are you moving to Australia?

LT: I like Australia but have no plans to move here. My family is well adjusted to life in San Jose; however, I do work from home so I could work anywhere. I definitely won't be moving back to Finland though.

Gentoo, Portage, Python (0, Offtopic)

relrelrel (737051) | more than 10 years ago | (#7987145)

2004 will be a year when many corporations, especially those who will try to adapt Linux as a primary desktop platform, will recognize Gentoo for several reasons:

Please, explain to me why.

* Portage gives a corporate IT the most fine-grained dependency control protecting the consistency of installations within upgrades;

I don't agree with this one. Corporations that "roll their own" packages have the same advantage. Movifying SRPMS can acheive the same effect.

* Gentoo makes possible to compile everything from sources on a reference hardware, adapting by that to the last bit of any available performance optimization, and then distribute the compiled binares to compatible hardware cross the enterprise (using GRP for fresh installations and just shared /usr/portage/packages for already installed systems);

Normally I would respond to this one saying that most people who use CFLAGS to optimize binaries actually hurt themselves, but corporations would have people that actually know how to use them best (i.e. -Os over -O3 or even -O2). However, I don't think that this is really an issue for corporations.

* Gentoo (mostly thanks to Portage) represents really the next generation design of Linux distro;

How so, specifically? There is something to be said for having a dedicated box to building binaries for the whole infrastructure, but the idea that Gentoo can do this and no other distro can is rather ignorant.

Gentoo is a really cool distribution (no joke), but I fail to see any technical advantages it has over other distributions. It's real strengths are in how it brings a lot of advanced administration techniques down to the level of an intermediate-level user. Plus the forums are cool, and portage is really well maintained.

Trust me on this one, though, there's no actual technical superiority over other distributions.

By the way, can you do reverse dependency checking yet? Like uninstalling gtk, and having every app that builds against gtk also unistall? I'm not "knocking" it if it can't (this isn't too important to corporations anyways), I'm just curious.
Sick of gentoo zealots throwing plugs in completely unrelated topics? Me too!

I agree with him 100% ... (2, Informative)

torpor (458) | more than 10 years ago | (#7987146)

... and I'm even willing to propose that not only is it ready for the desktop, but its ready for a lot of other things as well.

Linux' recent advances in the embedded industry mean that the desktop is really just one place for vmlinuz-xx to succeed. And oddly enough, I also think - as a long-term linux user - that this is an advantage for both fronts, desktop/embedded.

The cool distro's are doing some interesting work too, I might add. Embedded distro's, or more appropriately "source control", are putting a standard system image in some very interesting places, all at once.

2004 is gonna rock. And I know its just my opinion, but I had to say it ...

Userlinux initiative (2, Insightful)

gounthar (212393) | more than 10 years ago | (#7987157)

2004 will definitely be the linux desktop year.
And IMHO it takes the right direction with Bruce Perens' UserLinux [userlinux.com] initiative, if he succeeds at convincing linux users/developpers to switch to/work on this new DIY operating system.
It's mission statement would be : Provide businesses with freely available, high quality Linux operating systems accompanied by certifications, service, and support options designed to encourage productivity and security while reducing overall costs.

Right... (4, Interesting)

IntergalacticWalrus (720648) | more than 10 years ago | (#7987159)

Future slashdot headline:
"Linus says 2034 really, really is the Year for Desktop Linux, honest! I'm pretty damn sure this time! I swear!"

Seriously, we hear that every goddamn year since 2002. It's an annual thing, like those stupid so-called analysts saying "Apple is dying this year".

It's not that I'm against it, in fact I am a desktop Linux user, but this is just ridiculous.

Re:Right... (-1)

codmate (741841) | more than 10 years ago | (#7987286)

I agree. It's just not ready for the general public yet. How many of us install KDE, Gnome et al, only to mostly use the CLI? I know I do, as do most of my contemporaries. I strongly believe that Linux is still best experienced via a command lineon the machine itself, or through a Samba/Telnet combination from OSX or WindowsXP. Don't get me wrong, it's potentailly wonderful, but GUI design and implementation are costly and difficult. The guys with the money will dominate the desktop market for quite some time IMO.

Re:Right... (-1, Redundant)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#7987315)

No, they found it in the bible code!
In a text matrix, they found "linux" and "2004"!

So much for Finnish pride (2, Funny)

smallpaul (65919) | more than 10 years ago | (#7987161)

Linus says: I do work from home so I could work anywhere. I definitely won't be moving back to Finland though.

The last half of that sentence was a total non-sequiter. Maybe he is trying to get his mother off his back.

Keep declaring it and eventually you'll be right.. (2, Insightful)

Curious__George (167596) | more than 10 years ago | (#7987169)

It's kind of like declaring this is the year that an asteroid will strike the earth. Keep declearing that this is the year and eventually you will be proved right. (not that Linux on the desktop would mean devastation of life on earth, as we know it).

I think more around 2006 (2, Interesting)

relrelrel (737051) | more than 10 years ago | (#7987174)

Partly because it will be my 10 year anniversary of using GNU/Linux... but practically, too.

I can't really put my finger on just why that year sticks out, but it does. I suspect that it will take a year+ for 2.6 to mature/be accepted to the point where most major distros are shipping it and most howtos are being written for it. I also suspect that both GNOME and KDE will reach another major version by 2006 (haven't checked their road maps... just hoping.) I also hope that device support will continue to grow as it has, configuration tools will mature more, and the "your mama" test will be more easily passed. I doubt all that will happen in the next twelve months.

As for what I think COULD happen? I think a major U.S. gov't agency could start putting GNU/Linux into major use. I think we will see a lot more adoption abroad. Maybe even a first world national government promoting it in some way. I understand GNU/Linux desktop usage will top Mac desktop usage (was a /. article on that before.. that or linuxworld.com)...

Now I'm just rambling. This made very little sense. sorry. It is 2:30 AM EST... I'm going to bed.

office (-1, Flamebait)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#7987204)

i dont think so,

microsoft office = desktop

the day office runs on linux, thats the day linux will be ready for the desktop

Re:office (1)

tigershark97 (595017) | more than 10 years ago | (#7987355)

Not likely. Everyone I know has switched (office, not os) I show them open office at $0, compared to MS Office for $hundreds Not a difficult choice, since they work exactly the same for most people to type documents.

Desktop 3D? (3, Insightful)

ZiZ (564727) | more than 10 years ago | (#7987205)

(Linus says:) I don't think X is going away as it has a powerful infrastructure and throwing it away would be stupid. And its network transparency is good. It's likely that X will be the 2D interface to a lower-level graphics system that is based on OpenGL. The Linux desktop wants to have 3D as the base and X as the interface to 2D.

Um...Why do we want a 3D desktop? It seems to me that first of all, 3D is always going to be slower to manage and display than 2D; monitors (even the newer ones with the spiffy multi-layer technology) don't really handle 3D displays well. Yes, I want my 3D displays, such as they are, for gaming; I don't see any real need or use for it in a business desktop, though.

Feel free to correct me here, but I don't read text on a slanted pane very well...:)

Linux Desktop Already Easier for Some Things (2, Interesting)

lukior (727393) | more than 10 years ago | (#7987215)

I use both Windows XP and Mandrake and I use a wide range of programs. While most of my programs wont even work on Linux (I don't count xwindows) There are a crop of programs that I prefer on Linux or actually a crop of applications. One example, Myth, is a program that beats the hell out of Windows Media Center Edition. I think the more Microsoft tries to lock down what you can do with your computer the more success Linux will have.

Time warp or deja vu? (1)

o517375 (314601) | more than 10 years ago | (#7987226)

I thought 1999 was the year of the Linux desktop -- at least that's when I gave Winders the boot and Linux the boot sector.

Its interesting but... (2, Interesting)

CrackedButter (646746) | more than 10 years ago | (#7987228)


... will GenuLinux get the software it needs to make it on the desktop?
Why is it hard to release a well known application for linux? I won't suggest photoshop because somebody will remind me about GIMP and totally sidetrack the question.
But why is there resistance to releasing an a high end application on GenuLinux? The way i see it, the don't want to touch the GPL and i keep hearing that as the cause for resistance. But DO you have to add to the GPL, i thought you could just release the app and make people buy it (like any other app), why the connotations that Genulinux users have to have it for free or won't pay just because the OS is?
I don't think it has anything to do with MS either for say Adobe to release an application for GenuLinux. I think they might be confused as I am, moreso when i see photoshop ported to linux using WINE.

Don't mean to be the naysayer, but.. (2, Insightful)

xankar (710025) | more than 10 years ago | (#7987230)

Linux is ready for the desktop market, concerning speed, power, and(almost) ease of use.

The major obstacle is that people stick with what they're comfortable with.
Linux's office programs are just as good(if not better) than their windows equivalents, but everyone I know who uses Word will stick with it till they die, because they know it backwards and forwards(I got my friend, an author, running linux, and he loves it, but he made me get word to work on it via Wine).

I use openoffice(I dual boot and use openoffice in both XP and Linux), but only because I didnt want to shell out for word when i got my new computer.

People are comfortable with what they've been using in the past. Until the layperson can understand the massive advantages of using linux, they will stick to windows.

Good enough for desktop matters not (4, Insightful)

Silicon Knight (15308) | more than 10 years ago | (#7987231)

This year will see Linux finally crack the lucrative desktop market as more commercial software vendors tool up and cash in on the operating system and kernel developers improve graphical interface integration says cult hero and Linux founder Linus Torvalds.

Yes, Linux is a suitable desktop replacement. I still don't see a significant number of people making the switch. What is the motivation for the average user who has invested time in learning Windows to switch?

Aside from impoverished goverments in third world countries (California anyone?) are the masses going to bother learning something new when what they have tends to meet their needs?

Interesting that Linus's laptop runs Windows too (5, Interesting)

GillBates0 (664202) | more than 10 years ago | (#7987239)

According to this old interview [varbusiness.com] with Linus covered in this old Slashdot story [slashdot.org] , Linus uses a Linux-Windows dual-boot:

What's his latest toy?

A Sony Electronics Inc. Vaio, Japanese edition. It's a handheld PC that has a 4-GB hard disk, 64 MB of RAM and a Pentium MMX 266-MHz processor. It weighs in at just 2.6 pounds and runs both Linux and Windows. "It's cute as hell." Oh, and it has a built-in camera.

Now imagine Billy-boy using Linux (maybe just to give it a test-run) and talking publicly about it. That would never happen because of the expected PR backlash.

Linus, on the other hand can be as frank as he wants to, without an axe hanging over his head.

Interesting, though nothing earth-shattering. Open-source also supports Freedom.

Misprint (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#7987247)

Actually, that's supposed to be 2064. Exactly one year after the first gay president is elected.

So... (1)

JordanH (75307) | more than 10 years ago | (#7987346)

In 2005, it's back to Windows then?

Finally! A Viable Competitor (1)

MissMarvel (723385) | more than 10 years ago | (#7987350)

I've been a UNIX fan forever. I'm ecstatic that Linux is finally making headway. Putting up with Microsoft's sloppy ways is getting very old. Maybe when Bill see's his market-share start to plummet he'll get serious about putting out a quality product.

Linux isn't user friendly. (3, Insightful)

1iar_parad0x (676662) | more than 10 years ago | (#7987356)

I'm a programmer, and I don't mind having to google/read a book/scour the newsgroups to find out how to install XYZ software. However, the average user wants to just point and click. They like having Microsoft/Apple update their software for them. Look how popular Norton is. I just don't see how the open source movement will ever be motivated to work on usability issues related to Linux.

Think about this. How many times have you heard the terms "usability" and "open source" in the same sentence. Now how many times have you heard these same terms without the word "NOT". Have you ever heard of "yet another user interface"? No, instead we have software with names like yacc, Bison, and ANTLR (all of these programs are used in compiler design).

Look, I like Linux too, but as a server. It's just not ready for the desktop.
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