Beta

Slashdot: News for Nerds

×

Welcome to the Slashdot Beta site -- learn more here. Use the link in the footer or click here to return to the Classic version of Slashdot.

Thank you!

Before you choose to head back to the Classic look of the site, we'd appreciate it if you share your thoughts on the Beta; your feedback is what drives our ongoing development.

Beta is different and we value you taking the time to try it out. Please take a look at the changes we've made in Beta and  learn more about it. Thanks for reading, and for making the site better!

cancel ×

827 comments

GNAA NIGGERS (-1, Troll)

GNAA Penisbird128 (742805) | more than 10 years ago | (#8013591)

GNAA (GAY NIGGER ASSOCIATION OF AMERICA) is the first organization which
gathers GAY NIGGERS from all over America and abroad for one common goal - being GAY NIGGERS.

Are you GAY [klerck.org] ?
Are you a NIGGER [tux.org] ?
Are you a GAY NIGGER [gay-sex-access.com] ?

If you answered "Yes" to any of the above questions, then GNAA (GAY NIGGER ASSOCIATION OF AMERICA) might be exactly what you've been looking for!
Join GNAA (GAY NIGGER ASSOCIATION OF AMERICA) today, and enjoy all the benefits of being a full-time GNAA member.
GNAA (GAY NIGGER ASSOCIATION OF AMERICA) is the fastest-growing GAY NIGGER community with THOUSANDS of members all over United States of America. You, too, can be a part of GNAA if you join today!

Why not? It's quick and easy - only 3 simple steps!

First, you have to obtain a copy of GAY NIGGERS FROM OUTER SPACE THE MOVIE [imdb.com] (Click Here [idge.net] to download the ~280MB MPEG off of BitTorrent)

Second, you need to succeed in posting a GNAA "first post" on slashdot.org [slashdot.org] , a popular "news for trolls" website

Third, you need to join the official GNAA irc channel #GNAA on EFNet, and apply for membership.
Talk to one of the ops or any of the other members in the channel to sign up today!

If you are having trouble locating #GNAA, the official GAY NIGGER ASSOCIATION OF AMERICA irc channel, you might be on a wrong irc network. The correct network is EFNet, and you can connect to irc.secsup.org or irc.easynews.com as one of the EFNet servers.
If you do not have an IRC client handy, you are free to use the GNAA Java IRC client by clicking here [nero-online.org] .

If you have mod points and would like to support GNAA, please moderate this post up.

This post brought to you by Penisbird [nero-online.org] , a proud member of the GNAA

CLICK HERE TO SIGN THE PETITION TO BRING BACK GOATSE.CX! [petitiononline.com]

________________________________________________
| ______________________________________._a,____ |
| _______a_._______a_______aj#0s_____aWY!400.___ |
| __ad#7!!*P____a.d#0a____#!-_#0i___.#!__W#0#___ |
| _j#'_.00#,___4#dP_"#,__j#,__0#Wi___*00P!_"#L,_ |
| _"#ga#9!01___"#01__40,_"4Lj#!_4#g_________"01_ |
| ________"#,___*@`__-N#____`___-!^_____________ |
| _________#1__________?________________________ |
| _________j1___________________________________ |
| ____a,___jk_ GAY_NIGGER_ASSOCIATION_OF_AMERICA_|
| ____!4yaa#l___________________________________ |
| ______-"!^____________________________________ |
` _______________________________________________'

Re:GNAA NIGGERS (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#8013740)

Dude you must be bored.

Doop De Doop (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#8013593)

It's a dupe!

Much like Fusion (1)

xeeno (313431) | more than 10 years ago | (#8013625)

mainstream desktop linux is only 10 years away.

Re:Much like Fusion (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#8013719)

Much like duke nukem forever

pist frist! (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#8013596)

1p

FIRST POST (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#8013599)

WOOHOO!

Linux Desktop (0, Flamebait)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#8013601)

Linux Desktop right now is a mess. Seriously, KDE, Gnome etc you name it, none are stable enough to use as a everyday desktop. He got this one right.

Re:Linux Desktop (4, Insightful)

toddler99 (626625) | more than 10 years ago | (#8013677)

I've been linux as my primary desktop for 2 years. Its been working great for me. I write my school papers with abiword, my presentations with open office impress and do all my coding with vim. gnome hardly ever crashes on me and when it does i can typically do one of two things: either login remotely and restart X or cntrl+alt+backspace. Then i can file a bug report and in most cases the problem is solved. Linux just requires patience and an understanding of what and how you plan to use a tool. I think what linus means is it won't be ready for a generic user for a little while longer...

Linux sucks! Use BSD! (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#8013602)

How can people say BSD [freebsd.org] is dying when it has a mascot [freebsd.org] like this?! Linux [debian.org] needs to get its act together if it's going to compete with the kind of hot chicks [hope-2000.org] and gorgeous babes [hope-2000.org] that BSD [openbsd.org] has to offer!

You just can't take Linux [redhat.com] seriously when its fronted by losers [nylug.org] like these. Would you buy software from them? I don't think so! You Linux [suse.com] groupies need to find some sexy girls like her [hope-2000.org] ! I mean just look at this girl [wigen.net] ! Doesn't she [pipboy2002.mine.nu] excite you? I know this little hottie [pipboy2002.mine.nu] puts me in need of a cold shower! This guy looks like he is about to cream his pants standing next to such a fox [spilth.org] . As you can see, no man can resist this sexy [spilth.org] little minx [spilth.org] . I mean are you telling me you wouldn't like to get your hands on this ass [dis.org] ?!

With sexy chicks [minions.com] like the lovely Ceren [dis.org] you could have people queuing up to buy open source products. Could you really refuse to buy a copy of BSD [netbsd.org] if she [dis.org] told you to? Come on, you must admit she [imagewhore.com] is better than an overweight penguin [tamu.edu] or a gay looking goat [gnu.org] ! Don't you wish you could get one of these [drexel.edu] ? Personally I know I would give my right arm to get this close [dis.org] to such a divine beauty [czarina.org] !

Join the campaign for more cute [pipboy2002.mine.nu] open source babes [pipboy2002.mine.nu] today!

BEHOLD MY LARGE GNAA PENIS! (-1, Troll)

GNAA Penisbird8498 (742792) | more than 10 years ago | (#8013612)

The Gay Nigger Association of America (GNAA) is the group that represents the world's Gay Nigger population as well as those non gay, non nigger patrons that support it. Its mission is to foster a gay and free-loving climate that supports and promotes our members' creative and financial vitality. Its members are the gay niggers that comprise the most vibrant national gay nigger conglomerate in the world. GNAA members create, manufacture and/or distribute approximately 90% of all legitimate pro-homosexual propaganda and blue, rubber dicks produced and sold in the United States.

We strongly urge you to join the GNAA and support our cause. Gay Niggers everywhere need your help!

BE NIGGER!

BE GAY!

JOIN THE GNAA!!

Join #GNAA on the EFNet IRC Network today! (irc.secsup.org, irc.easynews.com, irc.servercentral.net)

________________________________________________
| ______________________________________._a,____ |
| _______a_._______a_______aj#0s_____aWY!400.___ |
| __ad#7!!*P____a.d#0a____#!-_#0i___.#!__W#0#___ |
| _j#'_.00#,___4#dP_"#,__j#,__0#Wi___*00P!_"#L,_ |
| _"#ga#9!01___"#01__40,_"4Lj#!_4#g_________"01_ |
| ________"#,___*@`__-N#____`___-!^_____________ |
| _________#1__________?________________________ |
| _________j1___________________________________ |
| ____a,___jk_ GAY_NIGGER_ASSOCIATION_OF_AMERICA_|
| ____!4yaa#l___________________________________ |
| ______-"!^____________________________________ |
` _______________________________________________'
-posted by GNAA [nero-online.org] member Penisbird [nero-online.org]

How much is your time worth now-a-days (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#8013613)

.

One might think he would better serve by not wasting his time doing silly "achive my email" code. Or maybe, his time is not worth that much really. What do you think?

.

Re:How much is your time worth now-a-days (3, Insightful)

kalidasa (577403) | more than 10 years ago | (#8013626)

It was worth it to him. Me, I use Zoe; but then I also use an operating system someone else wrote. I'm not going to gainsay what Linus does with his time - I don't have an entire industry built around what I decided to do as a hobby.

Re:How much is your time worth now-a-days (2, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#8013648)

I use Zoe

Lucky you! Most of us geeks don't have girlfriends to archive our mail for us!

Re:How much is your time worth now-a-days (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#8013630)


Linus would probably be at home among these losers [nylug.org] . If Linux wants to go mainstream, they need to get some seriously hot chicks [dis.org] to use it.

Re:How much is your time worth now-a-days (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#8013631)

His email could be archived in 3 clicks if he used Outlook Express.

lol (3, Insightful)

DrSkwid (118965) | more than 10 years ago | (#8013745)


for some people 'archive' doesn't mean 'zip up into a binary format nothing else understands'

How selfish of him (4, Funny)

DumbSwede (521261) | more than 10 years ago | (#8013634)

Yes, he has only given us the best, most stable, FREE OS in the world. My God! Doesn't he realize he owes us every waking and sleeping minute giving us more for free, than to relax and just do some little quick projects for himself. He really has some nerve!

Re:How much is your time worth now-a-days (1)

tom taylor (610506) | more than 10 years ago | (#8013644)

Did you not read the article?

He did it to enable him to access the relevant e-mails when it reaches court, proving he wrote certain things.

Re:How much is your time worth now-a-days (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#8013660)

Damn, he can do whatever the fuck he wants. Stop bitching. I doubt you even contribute code to the kernel yourself. Dick.

I agree (3, Insightful)

PatrickThomson (712694) | more than 10 years ago | (#8013621)

Linux on the desktop is a long long way off from being as easy to use for beginners as windows is. I think we need to just grit our teeth, clench our buttocks, swallow our pride and set out to emulate windows's simplicity.

Re:I agree (3, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#8013636)

I think we need to just grit our teeth, clench our buttocks [...]

Uh, I'll leave that one to you, champ.

Re:I agree (-1, Troll)

Tony Hoyle (11698) | more than 10 years ago | (#8013641)

Oh god no... Windows 'simplicity' means they moved the 'change password' on XP from Control Panel/User management to Control Panel/Administrative Tools/Computer Management/Local Users and Groups/Users and if that wasn't enough the hid it behind a right click.

Since changing your password is one of the first things you do I'd like to find a newbie who can find that one first time.

Re:I agree (1)

sangreal66 (740295) | more than 10 years ago | (#8013674)

What the hell are you talking about? 'Change password' is still in Control Panel/User Accounts.

Re:I agree (0, Redundant)

Tony Hoyle (11698) | more than 10 years ago | (#8013691)

There's no 'User Accounts' option on any XP I've used... Presumably you're using a special one.

Re:I agree (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#8013720)

Then actually get XP, install it and use it for the first time in your life. You'll see it's right there at the bottom of the list.

Crapola (1)

xant (99438) | more than 10 years ago | (#8013686)

Still Control Panel > User Accounts. Or Ctrl-Alt-Delete > Change Password if you prefer. Windows usability sucks, but don't make shit up.

Re:Crapola (2, Interesting)

caluml (551744) | more than 10 years ago | (#8013762)

Or just do what I do - Start, Run, cmd<enter>echo my_password | regedit /users

yawn (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#8013673)

That was 'literaly' the most boring article I have ever read on Linus.

Re:I agree (2, Insightful)

Leroy_Brown242 (683141) | more than 10 years ago | (#8013680)

Emulating someone else is not the path to being a hero. As I have talked about before, we need tog et some fresh blood intothe design of a new GUI. OSX, Windows, windowmaker, KDE, all suck. Outofo them all, I like OSX and windowmaker the best, but they suck.

Linux/unix will be popular on the desktop, when the GUI is not designed by a geek.

Re:I agree (3, Insightful)

Durin_Deathless (668544) | more than 10 years ago | (#8013776)

when the GUI is not designed by a geek
Yes!! I'm not alone!
True usability is defined(for me) as a machine that my Grandma can use. Not my geeky friends, but my parents and grandparents that aren't into computers.

Re:I agree (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#8013781)

So Gnome is what you're waiting for then?

Re:I agree (1, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#8013681)

Dont emulate it, better it.

Im tired of all this .blah hidden config files which has no standard formats except tabs. how about using something more structured. like XML

How about a DB file system to the core. A better windowing system, and a better coding architecture its just too archane these days.

This is the way to get support , drivers, apps etc.

Drop the ego sheild.

Re:I agree (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#8013770)

how about some integrated b2b .com infrastructure netizens VPN networking solutions??????

Trendy fucker.

Re:I agree (4, Insightful)

caluml (551744) | more than 10 years ago | (#8013779)

Im tired of all this .blah hidden config files which has no standard formats except tabs. how about using something more structured. like XML Why? No reason on earth. foo = bar. Why make it more complicated?

Re:I agree (5, Insightful)

vpscolo (737900) | more than 10 years ago | (#8013711)

At the end of the days users want something that works with their existing apps and documents. They don't care whats going on underneath as long as it works

Rus

Re:I agree (5, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#8013714)

There are many definitions of "The Desktop"

For many, it doesn't necessarily mean anything to do with beginners, or home users, or kiddie-eyecandy.

Personally, i see it as being a strength on the desktop in a business sense, where an organisation like IBM or Telstra or NTT has 50,000 workers all needing a desktop computer to easily email, browse, collaborate with users, plan their day, type documents, organise stuff etc.

For those users, the whole setup and install thing is irrelevant, and that's the hardest part at the moment. When it comes to actually using say, a good KDE install set up by a company for its own users, Linux is ready for the desktop in the middle of last year.

Re:I agree (5, Insightful)

tomcrick (687765) | more than 10 years ago | (#8013716)

I think with the lower end of Linus's statement (5 years), the use (and awareness) of Linux will become much more noticeable. I've noticed recently that the SCO lawsuit has made some waves in UK papers, where previously you'd be hard pushed to find a mention of Linux whenever a computer-related article is published (Microsoft, Microsoft, Microsoft!). Possibly something to do with the fact that the big name of IBM is involved, but surely this is a good thing - getting the Linux name actually recognised!

It's still amazing to see the puzzled look on people's faces when they ask what 'Red Hat Linux' is and when did Microsoft release it.....

Re:I agree (5, Interesting)

Durin_Deathless (668544) | more than 10 years ago | (#8013730)

<rant>Why are we all so focused on cloning something we all agree is awful? Almost everyone I know agrees that overall OS X is a better interface(of those that know both, those that know one don't count here). So why not clone the best instead of cloning the worst?</rant>

Seriously, the whole hiding the apps from the user thing ticks me off. I like the OS X solution better. You can have an optional start menu if you like, but make the apps as easy to add/remove as OS X and Be OS and NeXTstep. All GUI programs should be this way. None of this "Program Files" you're too stupid to look here, and don't mix the GUI apps into the same dir with the command line ones.

OK. I'm done. Do I need to don a fireproof suit?

Re:I agree (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#8013809)

Theyre trying to run a multiuser server platform on the desktop, can you see whats wrong with this picture rofl.

Re:I agree (2, Insightful)

CaptnMArk (9003) | more than 10 years ago | (#8013756)

Windows simplicity? LOL

Re:I agree (1)

Fembot (442827) | more than 10 years ago | (#8013787)

Can someone explain to me why we need to get linux running on every desktop in the world exactly?? As far as I can see linux on the desktop has always been a hacker thing, and it is pretty much the number one choice of desktop for hackers, so why try and take away that greateness???

0wn3d (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#8013623)

All Your base are belong to us

http://intense.homelinux.com

It's all about the desktop journey (5, Interesting)

LibrePensador (668335) | more than 10 years ago | (#8013627)

I don't know about you folks, but for me, when it comes to Desktop Linux, the journey really is much more rewarding and interesting than the destination.

I guess, to some degree that is because I started using Linux as my main desktop close to five years ago, but also because I am aware that profound social changes take time.

I think the key to the desktop is preloaded machines by big-vendor being available at retail stores. Only when the vendors have a stake in the success of Linux will they make sure that the peripherals state on the box that "it runs on Linux".

Re:It's all about the desktop journey (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#8013683)

Gotta love-that-trip ... no work to do, eh pad're? Don't earn a living? Momma must take good care of you. It's back to the closet - grope your fav electro-mechanic blo-up dolly in private.

Re:It's all about the desktop journey (1)

anarchima (585853) | more than 10 years ago | (#8013689)

I don't know about you folks, but for me, when it comes to Desktop Linux, the journey really is much more rewarding and interesting than the destination.

While this might be the case for most..."geeks" shall we say, this certainly won't help Linux on the typical home-user market. And part of the problem is that developers also enjoy this "journe"-aspect of the operating system. We have to discipline developers in understanding that most users just want "destination" and that's that.

Re:It's all about the desktop journey (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#8013785)

To hell with the "users."

Re:It's all about the desktop journey (-1, Flamebait)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#8013696)

Social change all ya want, Until I can run EVERY tool I run today, Linux is going nowhere here.

Dont give me sourceforge fud, its 90% shite.

The quality of software on linux with a few exceptions and theyre very very few, is apawlingly embarasingly laughable.

If it cant do what I can do today or better, its out.

Stop playing catchup grandma.

Linux is just a reverse engineered Unix.

Re:It's all about the desktop journey (3, Insightful)

cerberusss (660701) | more than 10 years ago | (#8013710)

I think the key to the desktop is preloaded machines by big-vendor being available at retail stores

I think the key to the desktop is preloaded machines that can flawlessly interoperate with the existing Windows monopoly. If it would include the ability to run MS Office for instance (free CrossoverOffice included, or a better Wine), that would be good. That way, it would run most things that Windows can, and then some more.

Another interoperability issue would be internet-connection. The various ISPs should support Linux as well.

Re:It's all about the desktop journey (4, Interesting)

Microlith (54737) | more than 10 years ago | (#8013713)

And for some of us the journey, while interesting, is not nearly as good as the end result.

I'd love to have an easy to use system that I could handle without much difficulty while still having the power of Unix at hand should I want it.

This is not Linux.

Apple has it down pat, but that requires an investment in their hardware. Mandrake, Redhat, and SUSE have the install process down pat. The issue comes in just general responsiveness (behavior with hardware, plug & play, getting software installed/uninstalled.)

The question is when we will see something like this for the PC. Who will create the PC equivalent of MacOS X?

Advertising? (1)

arashiken (247701) | more than 10 years ago | (#8013773)

It's easy to sit on here and say to each other 'Linux is great, for so many reasons', and pat ourselves on the back for using it, but much of the world still isn't very aware of what Linux is. I talked to someone the other day who had no idea there was an alternative to Windows - and this was an accomplished university student.

I've been thinking of attacking my city with a strategically placed advertising campaign, using posters on transit and in high-traffic areas, but still haven't come up with what I'd most like to say on a poster. Anyone know of any effort to make large posters touting Linux, that someone could buy a handful of? The typical home computer user, who isn't a geek and just uses their computer for email and web, is an excellent candidate for an easy-to-install distro that 'just works', and doesn't expose them to virii, but this same person wouldn't be the type to stay on top of software news like you'd hear on /. or CNN tech.

Re:It's all about the desktop journey (4, Insightful)

po8 (187055) | more than 10 years ago | (#8013803)

For me, the journey has been more like 20 years. I was running a desktop window system on a UNIX-like OS at home before there was such a thing as X (Smalltalk on LynxOS on a Tektronix Pegasus box).

I have to say that I think the folks who are all over the deficiencies of the Linux Desktop, and how we have to emulate the Windows/Mac/BeOS/Xbox/Sinclair/whatever desktop experience to have a usable desktop are mistaken. I think they underestimate the ability of users to adapt, and overestimate the degree to which familiar = better. For many years I had a PC or Mac sitting on my desktop next to a UNIX/X box. Now I have a Windows box and a Linux box at home. I have always found that I almost exclusively use the UNIX/X box. The monopoly (at best duopoly) is real, and most folks haven't had my experience. I think it's clear that they're going to, and I think it's going to be enlightening for them when they do.

I'm working hard to make the Linux desktop experience better for everyone. But it's pretty darn good now. So good that I finally threw away twm a couple of years ago. :-)

Let's enjoy the ride.

Different interpretations? (5, Interesting)

Mazzie (672533) | more than 10 years ago | (#8013632)

There seems to be a lot of different interpretations of Linus' views of the future of Linux floating around. There was a recent post on /. entitled "Linus says 2004 is the year of the Linux Desktop" or something like that. That seems to be a bit of a conflict with this article.

Can someone clarify his view for me? I don't follow Linux very closely, but am genuinely curious what Linus' real thoughts on the future of Linux for the desktop are.

Re:Different interpretations? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#8013695)

How about you RTFA ?!?

The *article* spells out your answer.

Re:Different interpretations? (4, Insightful)

10Ghz (453478) | more than 10 years ago | (#8013709)

There seems to be a lot of different interpretations of Linus' views of the future of Linux floating around. There was a recent post on /. entitled "Linus says 2004 is the year of the Linux Desktop" or something like that. That seems to be a bit of a conflict with this article.


Not at all. Basically, he thinks that in 2004 Linux will really take on in the desktop-market. But that wouldn't mean that Linux would be mainstream in the desktop-market. Let's assume that number of Linux-users doubles in 2004, and that's due to increase in desktop-use. That would give Linx a market-share of around 5%. If that happened, 2004 would be the "year of the desktop" for Linux, but being mainstream would still be several years in the future.

Re:Different interpretations? (1)

pe1rxq (141710) | more than 10 years ago | (#8013733)

He made a difference in the normal users and big corporations that could support linux themselves.
Those corporations can implement the linux desktop far more easily than the average home user.

Jeroen

Re:Different interpretations? (3, Informative)

ragingmime (636249) | more than 10 years ago | (#8013734)

Can someone clarify his view for me? I don't follow Linux very closely, but am genuinely curious what Linus' real thoughts on the future of Linux for the desktop are.

He says in both articles that there have been a bunch of really good developments in making Linux user-friendly, but it'll be a while before Joe User feels comfortable sitting down in front of a Linux box. The earlier story [slashdot.org] but kind of a spin on it - it sounds like they took what Linus said a little bit too far. He didn't really say that 2004 would be the "year of Linux on the desktop"; he said that "This year there will be a lot of desktop users." That's it. Even if you did RTFA, it's still kinda confusing. That's the media for you. :)

Re:Different interpretations? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#8013764)

That caught my eye too. But I think that this quote from the interview explains things pretty well:

Within the last year, even six months, there are big companies now interested in literally not just selling desktop Linux, but also using desktop Linux internally.

I mean it's going to take, literally five to 10 years before "normal users" start seeing Linux desktop, but in the technical space it's doing pretty well, especially in companies that can support it already.


So, there's been a big push lately to get Linux on peoples' desktops at work--making this the year of the desktop--but it will be a while before it's on their desktops at home. 5 to 10 years, according to Linus. And that sounds about right to me.

Re:Different interpretations? (1)

Spacejock (727523) | more than 10 years ago | (#8013797)

There are different desktop users. I run Linux on my desktop, I'd consider myself an advanced computer user. Early adopter, not afraid to be different. (I had an Atari ST when everyone else had Amigas ;-)

We're swapping to Linux on the desktop at work, that's the '2004 desktop user' category. Configured, locked down, a tool with specific tasks in mind.

My mum runs Linux on her desktop, but I set it up for her. She wouldn't have bought a linux boxed set and installed it, and I think she's one of the '5-10 years from now' users Linus is talking about. I think the fallacy with that kind of example is that my mum wouldn't buy Windows XP and install it over '98, either.

In terms of preloads, I can see that happening but it seems to me that sooner or later everyone has to build an app or kernel driver from source. It sounds offputting, but a good example is Vmware, which goes through the process with three presses of the Enter key.

Cheers
Simon

Re:Different interpretations? (2, Informative)

Trurl's Machine (651488) | more than 10 years ago | (#8013798)

There seems to be a lot of different interpretations of Linus' views of the future of Linux floating around. There was a recent post on /. entitled "Linus says 2004 is the year of the Linux Desktop" or something like that. That seems to be a bit of a conflict with this article. Can someone clarify his view for me?

I'll try. The confusion is actually inherent in the contemporary meaning of the word "desktop". Sometimes this means "just any computer for a non-techie", sometimes "a machine for a home user". Even in this interview Linus has said "it's doing pretty well, especially in companies that can support it already. Linux is ready as a desktop in a corporate environment on machines that are supposed to be nothing more than, say, a locked-in word processing station - but that requires a corporate support. Linux is not ready as a desktop for someone who just bought himself a new PC and want to use it for the same word processing at home, with no corporate support available. Please note that this is not my view, I'm just giving you my understanding on what Linus has said (damn, this sounds like a part of "Monty Python's Life Of Brian").

Linus and the P2P Fileswapper victims of the RIAA (5, Insightful)

cervo (626632) | more than 10 years ago | (#8013643)

I've never seen a lawsuit up this close and personal before

This is what the "lucky" 300 must also be thinking. I don't think they will be spending their time writing an e-mail indexing program.

Linus is the only person I've ever heard of taking a lawsuit as an opportunity to write some new code. The world needs more Linuses!!!

Re:Linus and the P2P Fileswapper victims of the RI (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#8013678)

Should that be "Linii" ?

Re:Linus and the P2P Fileswapper victims of the RI (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#8013800)

Agreed! I'm gonna sound like a fanboy here, but it really gets my rocks off every time I read an interview of him. He really is a cool guy. Very down to earth, and an exceptional visionary!

Linux becoming commercial? (5, Interesting)

anarchima (585853) | more than 10 years ago | (#8013649)

...it's not organised in the commercial conference kind of sense. But that just means it's a lot more relaxed, the people just talk about technology, they don't try to sell stuff. And these days in the US it's unheard of, you can't make money with this kind of conference, so I go to the Australian one and I go to one in Canada (Ottowa Linux Symposium). So even Linus admits that the Linux "project" is moving away from its earlier, non-commercial roots. I wonder what effects the increasing commercialisation of Linux will have, through businesses like Red Hat trying to make a profit and so on. Hopefully it won't be all bad, but I'm worried that Linux will just turn into another Microsoft (obviously with open source, but still)...

I'm sorry.. (1, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#8013718)

But I can't just imagine there will be "another" Microsoft. Microsoft will never be completely destroyed, and linux will never completely take over; I think they will form a balance, and this is nothing but good for everyone; it creates competition, and drives innovation more than just having one behemoth in the playing field.

Witness the true age of information technology...

Re:Linux becoming commercial? (4, Insightful)

10Ghz (453478) | more than 10 years ago | (#8013736)

Hopefully it won't be all bad, but I'm worried that Linux will just turn into another Microsoft (obviously with open source, but still)...


Linux cannot become another Microsoft. Microsoft is about monopoly prices, lock-in, proprietary technologies etc. etc. None of those are possible with Linux. If Linux gained 100% market-share, there would still be several distros competing (and several free versions of Linux), the core-systems would be open and free, so moving between different vendors would be easy. And you could fork your own version from existing distros (for example Red Hat ==> Mandrake, Gentoo ==> Zynot)

You mentioned Red Hat trying to make a profit. How would that affect Linux? Easy: Red Hat would have even more money to spend improving Linux.

Re:Linux becoming commercial? (1)

anarchima (585853) | more than 10 years ago | (#8013765)

But what if these distributors like Red Hat "develop" Linux to the extent that it outdoes every single other Linux distro on the market (because of the availability of capital, which seems to be the argument you're using - more money = better development?)? Then, it would seem, customers are effectively locked in to one particular system even though it is theoretically open and free for anyone to change (most users won't bother).

Of course, one might argue that we'd be back to where we are now, with open source developers working on better solutions on their own time to take market share away from the giants etc. Ah, the irony!

Re:Linux becoming commercial? (3, Insightful)

10Ghz (453478) | more than 10 years ago | (#8013812)

But what if these distributors like Red Hat "develop" Linux to the extent that it outdoes every single other Linux distro on the market (because of the availability of capital, which seems to be the argument you're using - more money = better development?)? Then, it would seem, customers are effectively locked in to one particular system even though it is theoretically open and free for anyone to change (most users won't bother).


If one distro wins by simply being superior to everyone else, then I fail to see how that could be considered bad. And there would be nothing stopping you (or anyone else for that matter) from creating your own version of their distro (or creating one from scratch) and competing with them with your own version. It has happened several times in the past (like when Mandrake was created from Red Hat).

And having money DOES help developement. For example, Red Hat (or some other company) could hire full-time kernel-hackers that would have more time (and better equipment) at their disposal, instead of if they hacked only in their free time.

the biggest barrier of all (5, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#8013653)

Lack of games. The odd FPS game crops up, but dual booting isnt an option for mot point and click users.

Re:the biggest barrier of all (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#8013753)

Get someone (Sony?) to make a Linux-native console! That'd be a huge win in the console marketplace.

10 years away?! (0, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#8013656)

Gosh.. who the hell is gonna use computers 10 years from now?!

Linus commenting (5, Interesting)

xant (99438) | more than 10 years ago | (#8013658)

The interesting thing about his comments about desktop Linux are that he's making them at all. He used to have a position of "Linus is what it is, I don't care where it goes, it's just fun to watch." He's not doing that so much now that it appears to be actually getting the places people imagined it would go 5-10 years ago. To make a specific claim, even one as flexible as that, is out of character for him and shows that he's starting to become interested in seeing his work succeed commercially (other than in the areas he works on directly).

Sat. night (-1)

The Lyrics Guy (539223) | more than 10 years ago | (#8013659)

So I was at River Gods last night and noticed that most of the attractive chicks were the ones with the pixie-like noses. Kind of small, slightly upturned? There was this one chick in tight camo jeans and a tight gray sweater.. I wanted to slam her 'alf a foot so badly. Her boyfriend was a shaggy-looking motherfucker.

On the T coming back from Central Sq, I watched two completly fucked stoners (male and female) stuff their faces with potato chips and cookies. It just re-inforces my dislike for them. Take a shower, you ugly smelly shits.

Ah yes, intellectual observations after a few beers.

93 arrested in gay orgy (-1)

Genghis Troll (158585) | more than 10 years ago | (#8013661)

TAIWAN police yesterday arrested 93 men caught taking part in a homosexual orgy in the first such crackdown on the island, officers said.

The men, including seven from Hong Kong and Japan, "had all stripped to their underwear, and we also found several dozen used condoms dumped in their love-making room", an officer with the Taipei police said.

Would he opensource his little email app? (1)

LibrePensador (668335) | more than 10 years ago | (#8013662)

In the unlilely event that Linus or someone who could get his ear does read this.

Linus, I have been archiving my email with offlineIMap for years and it has been reliable and efficient, but I wonder whether you would share with us the little app that you concocted.

Games! (1)

tr0llb4rt0 (742153) | more than 10 years ago | (#8013671)

It's as old as the hills to say it but once games manufacturers increase the availability of linux native games (WINE is not a long term solution) then you will see Linux fully integrating into the desktop/home market.

A side note to add that Klaus Knopper's Knoppix may be the catalyst that brings desktop Linux to the masses.

Re:Games! (2)

phrasebook (740834) | more than 10 years ago | (#8013796)

The usual points:

- How many game developers are going to want to give away their source code

- If the above isn't necessary, and closed-source binary-only games are acceptable, how can they be successful anyway? How hard would it be to support 'linux' in so many different forms?

Knoppix may be the catalyst that brings desktop Linux to the masses.

Strange. I just tried Knoppix recently and to me it just highlighted how messy and ugly Linux desktops can be! It had all these weird hacks like different mouse cursors, transparency on some menus but not others, wild & blurry (oh I mean 'smoothed', not 'blurred' ;-) fonts everywhere, garish colours, and the biggest hodge-podge of different software in varying states of completeness I've ever seen. Argh. I popped that CD out pretty quick.

Sad thing is - 2 or 3 knoppix versions down the track and it'll probably still be much like that.

E-mail archieving (1)

vpscolo (737900) | more than 10 years ago | (#8013672)

Well like he says he is the sort of man that doesn't bother with backups and lets the world replicate his software, so why don't sco just look at the linux-kernel mailing list? Rus

linux (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#8013684)

linux on the desktop.. what is it all about?.. is it good.. or is it whack?

learn to spellcheck finally, damn it (-1, Flamebait)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#8013690)

"he think"

Speak English or die. Do your job, editors.

Bummer! (4, Funny)

xankar (710025) | more than 10 years ago | (#8013692)

Damn, and I thought it was this year [slashdot.org]

Re:Bummer! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#8013708)

He finally removed his head from his arse.

its so far been every year++ now its 2014 :D

And the number is .... (5, Funny)

McSnickered (67307) | more than 10 years ago | (#8013698)

That was "literally" a great interview. I spent, "literally", 5 minutes reading it. And "literally", I spent another 1 minute determining just "literally" how many times he used the word "literally" in the interview.

The number is, "literally", 7.

Re:And the number is .... (1)

anarchima (585853) | more than 10 years ago | (#8013731)

Ah, you're such a cynic :-) Hey, it's tough doing interviews all day, alright?

Austrailians (3, Funny)

WormholeFiend (674934) | more than 10 years ago | (#8013700)

can't even spell the name of the capital of Canada!

O T T A W A!

Eh.

Re:Austrailians (5, Funny)

f13nd (555737) | more than 10 years ago | (#8013712)

you spelled 'australians' wrong :P (i'm canadian too eh)

Re:Austrailians (1)

WormholeFiend (674934) | more than 10 years ago | (#8013775)

on purpose. notice in the first paragraph of their article, the word 'australian' was in the same line as the word 'Ottowa'.

best part of interview (5, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#8013705)

Q: Do you think that's good, seeing Linux being used in little devices, Xboxes and all sorts of places it wasn't meant to be?

A: One of the must fun things was I bought my wife one of those electronic picture frames... I didn't even know it - I just decided I wanted to buy it because we'd just bought a better camera, and we had some good pictures of the kids. So I went out and bought it, and only when I was uploading my pictures, the night before Mother's Day, I was uploading them and looked at the technical specifications and found out it ran Linux!

That's much more fun than big machines.

The Board is set, the pieces are moving... (3, Interesting)

ttldkns (737309) | more than 10 years ago | (#8013722)

Alot depends on how secure m$ "secure computing" model is. If they do what theyre bragging about and allow pages of memory to go unchecked even by the OS itself i think u have the beginnings of the recipe for a super virus.

The next version of windows and how they move to get it mainstream (new standards, no forward compatibility for older windows, whatever) will be a big factor in how the desktop 'game' plays out...

Linux is developing for desktop with Lindows OS [lindows.com] , its M$ turn, we need to wait for their move.

Literally (-1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#8013728)

I think Linus could get more mileage out of the phrase "leverage the value proposition".

For those who read the interview: Don't you think that Linus uses the word "literally" a bit too much?

Let's try this new phrase on for size:

"For normal people, it will be 5 to 10 years before we can leverage the value proposition of Linux on the desktop".

Wow, that sounds interesting!

Microsoft has it's catch-phrase. Linux should have one too.

Linux's catch-phrase could be "Linux -- Leverage the Value Proposition". It's better than "Linux -- Literally"

Linux desktop had always chased Windows desktop... (0, Interesting)

News for nerds (448130) | more than 10 years ago | (#8013735)

Task bar, start menu, etc. etc. And Windows 2000 supports translucent windows. In Windows, you can use Control Panel. But in Linux, GUI OS configuration panel crashes often. When will Linux stop chasing after Windows and implement something totally new for its desktop or overall OS design which MS wants to adapt like TCP/IP in BSD? After Windows 2000, only security is what MS wanted from outside, and it's successfully taking in Windows XP SP2 and Windows Server 2003. But how about Linux camp? Do they still have something attractive for Windows camp?

Looking Longhorn, I wonder what Linux developers are thinking. They have no uber control power like Microsoft HQ, therefore it's hard for them to make some grand design framework like WinFX/Avalon etc. at once. Though Linus predicts it as 5 - 10 years, I think until some driving force like UserLinux takes off as strong entity Linux desktop will never take off.

The great dunking (3, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#8013739)

"Linus had once noted that he had never been in a dunk tank before, and noted that, without that experience, his life was not complete. He need wait no longer; at Linux.Conf.Au the lucky high bidder got to put Linus into the tank. Here's the photos:"

http://lwn.net/Articles/66665/

about that email archive program... (3, Interesting)

abde (136025) | more than 10 years ago | (#8013752)

I hope it's open source. Maybe Linus will release it? I'm drowning under ten years of archives, spanning email clients from Eudora-Mac v1.0 to Thunderbird and almost everything in between. I'd love to have a cool program that could organizde my scatterred archives ...

from the dupe-a-day-department? (1)

HalliS (668627) | more than 10 years ago | (#8013763)

For those of you who want to post clever comments, see here [slashdot.org] ... ^_^

Re:from the dupe-a-day-department? (1)

platypus (18156) | more than 10 years ago | (#8013808)

That are two different interviews, Watson.

Linus' point (4, Interesting)

zr-rifle (677585) | more than 10 years ago | (#8013766)

Linus is very coherent. He often says that the kernel isn't being developed as a competitor to Microsoft's own thing. That's why his typically relaxed, hackerish timetable is very extended, while most agree that _now_ is the time for the Linux desktop to emerge.

That's why Redhat, IBM, SuSEa re investing in companies like Ximian who focus on the desktop dark-side of Linux.

Longhorn won't be out till 2005 if I'm correct and many users are very insatisfied with Windows XP, from Sobig/Blaster outbreaks dragging down productivity levels to random annoyances like messenger popups and a full suite of internet blockers/virus stoppers/software firewalls needed to surf the web.

Users are keeping an eye open for alternatives, that's why Linux desktop development needs to become desirable, marketable, usable and thus a replacement for the Windows desktop.

Desktop (4, Interesting)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#8013772)

Linux on the desktop will happen when businesses can switch all their machines to linux and not miss anything. When Jim-Bob and Betty-Sue are forced to use, and are taught how to use, linux at work they won't be afraid of it at home.

I think everybody understands the lack of an exchange type collaboration server hurts business adoption, but it's not the only thing keeping people from switching.

My business wants to go linux, but we can't. We use an ERP system called Macola. It makes heavy use of VBA and soon will support only MS SQL Server. There is nothing we can do short of writing our own manufacturing and accounting packages.

Before you point me at compiere, let me inform you that I've done research into that. I'm not a big fan of the lead developer. He's dragging his feet on database independence (when few people want real independence, they just want an open database supported) because he wants to get paid for it. Many people have brought forth suggestions and were willing to get started only to get no response from him. Development companies were willing to put people on it and they get no feedback as to the status of the project. So still the whole system is tied to oracle and there's no feedback at all as to when that might change. For the lead developer of an open source project he is VERY stingy with the information. Let's not ignore the fact that there is no current manufacturing module. There are, however, 3 separate development projects that aren't working with each other because of petty pride issues. The lead dev does nothing to stop the pettyness. So fuck compiere. I'll check up on it next year. I don't expect it to be usable then either at the pace it's moving. You have no idea how many people hit their forum gung-ho ready to start working only to leave again after getting no answers to their questions.

There is nothing else out there that is as close to production ready as compiere. There are erp systems that run on linux, but those are for the big boys. My company is very small, the cost of buying those erp systems would be more than the savings switching to linux would create.

Linux on the desktop (1, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#8013782)

Didn't Linus say that he pretty much thought it would be a battle between Windows and Linux in 2005 and MacOS wouldn't be around ?

Looks like he was pretty far off. Then again Jobs did pull out a lot of white rabbits these last couple of years. I'm certainly not going back to Linux on the desktop any time soon. Not saying it isn't usable - au contraire - I'd rather use it than Windows because of my needs, but OS X just does everything so much better as long as you have enough juice for it.

Five to Ten (4, Insightful)

DumbSwede (521261) | more than 10 years ago | (#8013788)

I have used UNIX the majority of my computing career and LINUX for over five. But at work we are still struggling to get to rh9.0 with many systems at 7.2 and 8.0 though the are now considered depricated. We recently had to reconfigure a machine back to 7.1 to regenerate data for a client who is still using 7.1. Not only this, but our code is notoriously unstable if not running on the OS revision and patch level it was compiled on. I'm sure some will flame about the skill of our sysadmins and make script maintainers, but I think that would be unfair. We produce a lot of floating point intensive code that depends critically on the underlining OS calls, and while the code may run, it becomes quite a chore to justify to the customer (government) why the results may differ from earlier versions. This tendency for code to be brittle with compiler and OS upgrades is not something we observe under IRIX and SunOS, the two other platforms we support, and have supported for longer than LINUX.

I am not saying that SunOS or IRIX are superior, just that the upgrades come at a more manageable pace, and tend not to break our code base when upgrading compilers. I think the reason Linus thinks five to ten years before really conquering the desktop is based on two things. By then LINUX should have slowed down in its development and will be a beast you can run two to three years before upgrading. Secondly, Windows will probably sink under the weight of it is haphazard code base, which is guided not by what is best for users and cleanest in design, but what makes sense commercially to support and lock-in their other products in as covert way as possible to keep from running afoul of the antitrust laws.

Looking forward to the day though!

Okay I can take this !!!!!!!! (1)

Shadow51 (522214) | more than 10 years ago | (#8013795)

Alright thats enough ! I live in Canada's Capital Ottawa... And I am getting tired of people calling it Ottowa !!!!!!! grrr ! Do you see me saying Wachingtin or Nu iork...
Load More Comments
Slashdot Account

Need an Account?

Forgot your password?

Don't worry, we never post anything without your permission.

Submission Text Formatting Tips

We support a small subset of HTML, namely these tags:

  • b
  • i
  • p
  • br
  • a
  • ol
  • ul
  • li
  • dl
  • dt
  • dd
  • em
  • strong
  • tt
  • blockquote
  • div
  • quote
  • ecode

"ecode" can be used for code snippets, for example:

<ecode>    while(1) { do_something(); } </ecode>
Create a Slashdot Account

Loading...