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Implementing CIFS

timothy posted more than 10 years ago | from the not-a-disease dept.

Windows 199

Bombcar writes "Anyone who has used Microsoft products in the last ten years has used the SMB protocol (now known as CIFS). Some have become experts in the usage of Windows file sharing, Samba, and more. We know that there can be a 15 minute delay before new machines appear in 'Network Neighborhood'. We've read the Official Samba 3 book, and follow the Samba mailing list once in a while, perhaps even answering questions. But there is a limit to the knowledge given by these sources." Read on for Bombcar's review of Implementing CIFS from Prentice Hall.

It is one thing to be able to use Samba, Windows, and the Common Internet File System (CIFS) protocol. It is another thing entirely to understand CIFS with sufficient depth to begin coding using it. This is where Christopher Hertel's Implementing CIFS begins.

This thick book (over 600 pages) begins with a history of NetBIOS in the DOS era. It quickly progresses to NetBIOS over TCP/IP (which evolved into the current CIFS protocol). Hertel documents the beginnings of quirks that will last throughout the life of the protocol. There is an RFC that was proposed in 1987, but many vendors have added extensions to this. (It might surprise you to learn that Samba has added extensions, which are covered in Chapter 24).

After the basic overview, he quickly dives into real coding of an actual (though simple) implementation. This will be his style for the rest of the book (except for humorous asides now and then). An aspect of the protocol, such as Name Resolution, will be explained in some detail, and then expounded in actual code (and in a few cases pseudocode).

The detail is good but not overwhelming. Some people (with names like Jerry Carter or Andrew Tridgell) will want more depth than this book provides, but for with a protocol as varied as CIFS, choices have to be made. As the Samba website mentions, this book is written in "Geekish." The book covers aspects of older and newer SMB/CIFS implementations, including a description of the NTLM2 challenge/auth system.

One thing that should be noted is that the code examples work, but as the author points out, they usually have little or no error handling. This is common to many books, but it is something to remember.

Now, should you get this book? If you're just a user, you probably don't need it. But if you've ever wished you could understand the Samba technical mailing list, or wanted to know why it takes up to 15 minutes to see a new machine, then you'll enjoy this book. If you want to utilize CIFS in any manner (even if just implementing Samba for clients), I'd highly recommend reading this. It will help you to understand what is going on on your network, even if you're not writing the code yourself. And if you want to be a Samba coder, it is required reading.

What didn't I like? I first read the book in an airport, and found that it relies heavily on having access to a computer. I would have preferred more explanations of code fragments than was given. However, this is a minor issue; most people who are implementing CIFS will be using a computer! I was also left with a desire for more information, but the large Appendix D along with many sources recommended provide for further study.

As a bonus, Appendix A tells you how to make a good cup of Earl Grey tea! That alone to some would be worth the price of admission.


You can purchase Implementing CIFS from bn.com. Slashdot welcomes readers' book reviews -- to see your own review here, read the book review guidelines, then visit the submission page.

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IMPLEMENTING MY SHAFT INTO MY GIRLFRIENDS VAGINA (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#8512864)



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Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#8512891)

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And her asshole is "open for business" as well.

Quote... (0, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#8512866)

or wanted to know why it takes up to 15 minutes to see a new machine, then you'll enjoy this book

You insensitive clod, that 15 minutes is allocated to my coffee time!

PENIS PIE, PO! (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#8512874)

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Worst Post Ever Discovered By NASA Earlier Today (-1)

Fecal Troll Matter (445929) | more than 10 years ago | (#8513220)

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But who likes CIFS? (3, Funny)

bbsguru (586178) | more than 10 years ago | (#8512877)

I know this is a difficult topic, but...Can't we just let CIFS to die, already?Alright, barring that, this really is a useful book. I wish I hadn't already learned it in the usual too-much-caffeine-for-rational-thought method.

Re:But who likes CIFS? (3, Insightful)

smharr4 (709389) | more than 10 years ago | (#8512918)

It's all very well saying 'let it die', but just what would you replace it with?

Re:But who likes CIFS? (3, Funny)

azzy (86427) | more than 10 years ago | (#8513072)

Easy, with the Posh Internet File System

Re:But who likes CIFS? (4, Interesting)

Kethinov (636034) | more than 10 years ago | (#8513192)

Replace it with nfs unix file sharing maybe? Oh I forgot. We're talking about Windows here. God forbid Microsoft should support nfs. It's not as if it's better than smb or anything and it's not as if Mac and the rest of the Unix world already support it </sarcasm>

Re:But who likes CIFS? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#8513325)

God forbid Microsoft support a product that competes with its own.

Re:But who likes CIFS? (3, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#8513380)

NFS is cool so long as you don't need passwords or authentication on your network resources. For other people that might be a little issue.

Re:But who likes CIFS? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#8513381)

Replace it with nfs unix file sharing maybe? Oh I forgot. We're talking about Windows here. God forbid Microsoft should support nfs.
You can download the (now) free Windows Services for Unix from Microsoft, it supports nfs.

Re:But who likes CIFS? (4, Informative)

Laur (673497) | more than 10 years ago | (#8513438)

Replace it with nfs unix file sharing maybe? Oh I forgot. We're talking about Windows here. God forbid Microsoft should support nfs.

Download Windows Services for UNIX [microsoft.com] for free from Microsoft, it contains a NFS client and server. I use this on my home network, no more Samba and its confusing config file (even with SWAT it is a nightmare). You can even choose to just install the nfs services and continue to use Cygwin for the rest of your Unix-on-Windows goodness.

Re:But who likes CIFS? (1)

Havokmon (89874) | more than 10 years ago | (#8513532)

Replace it with nfs unix file sharing maybe? Oh I forgot. We're talking about Windows here. God forbid Microsoft should support nfs. It's not as if it's better than smb or anything and it's not as if Mac and the rest of the Unix world already support it

Wrongo! Just like Win2k (which finally met OS/2's standards from 1994), Win2k and WinXP are now modern OS's supporting NFS with the free Unix Services for Windows Addon [microsoft.com] (which of course is appropriately titled 'Windows Services for Unix')

Actually windows does do NFS (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#8513601)

You just need a simple download lots of people already use nfs in a windows setup

Re:But who likes CIFS? (2, Insightful)

cscx (541332) | more than 10 years ago | (#8513691)

NFS is the caveman of network file systems. Sorry, we've moved a bit beyond that, it's not 1994 anymore.

Linus Torvalds himself said "Linux's NFS 'sucks rocks.'"

It's not as if it's better than smb or anything

Wow, you're right on the money!

WS-Discovery (1)

GunFodder (208805) | more than 10 years ago | (#8513514)

This is an excellent question. How about Web Services Dynamic Discovery? Sure, it's vaporware at this point and it was proposed by the Beast. OTOH it has a good chance to be an open standard and it isn't limited to file and print sharing.

Re:But who likes CIFS? (1)

110010001000 (697113) | more than 10 years ago | (#8512936)

No, because 95% of the computers on the planet use CIFS.

Re:But who likes CIFS? (4, Insightful)

smharr4 (709389) | more than 10 years ago | (#8513102)

Exactly the point I was trying to make above.

As much as the slashdot crowd would probably hate to admit that Microsoft got something right, SMB/CIFS is the 'killer app' for sharing files and printers over a LAN.

If there's another application that does the same job as SMB/CIFS and is:

  • Free
  • easy to use client
  • easy to configure server
  • multiplatform - Windows, OS X, varying strains of Unix, and linux
then bring it on. Until then, we're stuck with CIFS.

Re:But who likes CIFS? (1)

110010001000 (697113) | more than 10 years ago | (#8513160)

Personally I think the an open protocol for this needs to be developed. I am the biggest MS supporter and also believe in closed source software, but I do believe in open protocols. The fact that the most heavily used LAN protocol is proprietary and requires reverse engineering is quite silly to me.

Just wondering (1)

rsilvergun (571051) | more than 10 years ago | (#8512978)

what to replace it with for quick and dirty peer-to-peer. Not trying to troll, I genuinely don't know any alternatives. NFS isn't exactly easy to set up, and not much use when I go over to a friend's house to share files. Maybe FTP, but what if I want to share a printer? Plus you're still configuring an ftp server (I haven't done it yet, but it looks harder than adding a share to my smb.conf).

Re:Just wondering (1)

greed (112493) | more than 10 years ago | (#8513189)

Well, obviously the replacement will be WebDAV, over HTTP. That's much better than SMB.</troll>

Re:Just wondering (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#8513657)

Plus you're still configuring an ftp server (I haven't done it yet, but it looks harder than adding a share to my smb.conf).
For quick and dirty filesharing, ftp is very easy. On my linux laptop I use proftpd [proftpd.org] . Setting it up involved only changing "Servertype" from "inetd" to "standalone". To start sharing, I type "sudo proftpd -n" which runs it in nodaemon mode, so output appears on screen. When I'm done, I press Ctrl-C and it's gone. The beauty is that you don't need to muck with Workgroups or Network Places or whatever, just the IP address and IE or the command-line ftp client. On the Windows partition, I use SlimFTPd [whitsoftdev.com] . Configuration is also easy, it involves changing one or two very obvious lines in a text configuration file. Just don't forget to kill the process when you're done.

Re:But who likes CIFS? (4, Insightful)

El (94934) | more than 10 years ago | (#8513004)

Can't we just let CIFS to die, already? As long as people are still running Windows and Windows is still using CIFS, it will be necessary to support CIFS for Windows interoperability. No argument from me that it is a horrible protocol for file sharing; but then NFS isn't much better.

Re:But who likes CIFS? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#8513127)

"...As long as people are still running Windows..."

I think that was the parent poster's point.

Re:But who likes CIFS? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#8513186)

And under EU law you can REverse engineer it legally to get interop.

Re:But who likes CIFS? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#8513281)

What should we use then? WebDAV? (MS integration already there, Linux has it too)

Samba in Linux vs Windows (4, Interesting)

mauriatm (531406) | more than 10 years ago | (#8512879)

Maybe a bit offtopic, but on my network I notice that Windows machines in the Network Neighborhood are slower to access than samba shares on linux machines. Go figure.

Re:Samba in Linux vs Windows (2, Funny)

pilgrim23 (716938) | more than 10 years ago | (#8512960)

In my mixed platform (PC Mac, and more) network with PCMacLAN loaded, and Appletalk turned on for the PCs, I have found accessing a share and copying files to be far faster using that ancient protocol, even from Windows to Windows.

Re:Samba in Linux vs Windows (1, Informative)

SeederGOD (665109) | more than 10 years ago | (#8512983)

someone else did it, just check it out : samba faster [google.com]

Optimizations (-1, Troll)

Melvin Daniels (757374) | more than 10 years ago | (#8512989)

That's because of a couple of optimizations Samba does. More info is available here [utwente.nl] on that.

Re:Optimizations (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#8513201)

WARNING: Do not click that link!

Re:Samba in Linux vs Windows (1, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#8513016)

Maybe a bit offtopic, but on my network I notice that Windows machines in the Network Neighborhood are slower to access than samba shares on linux machines.

Considering that the Windows machines are running upwards of 50 instances of netsky.d, this just shows the robustness of Windows Compared to Linux (which can't even run netsky.a)

Windows XP network problems: Underlying sloppiness (2, Informative)

Futurepower(R) (558542) | more than 10 years ago | (#8513197)


MOD PARENT UP!

I notice that, too. Also, Windows XP machines newly added to a Windows 98 peer-to-peer network have trouble seeing the Win 98 machines. Posting to official Microsoft newsgroups provides no answers to this quirky behavior. Of course, that may be because Chang, Li, Wu, Zhang and others have been told not to discuss it.

I put some of the fixes for quirkiness together so that I could ask Microsoft if there was anything I am missing: Possible Solutions to Slow Network Browsing or Inability to Connect [hevanet.com] . Some of the problems mentioned are obviously not the fault of Windows XP directly, but the fact that they often occur seems sometimes to be the fault of underlying sloppiness in Windows OS code.

Acronis TrueImage [acronis.com] is a Linux-based Windows XP backup utility that never has any problem seeing all machines on a Windows peer-to-peer network.

I've also never had problems with Linux itself.

Re:Windows XP network problems: Underlying sloppin (4, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#8513348)

One thing that should be added to that document is that all the Win9x machines should have the ability to be a Master Browser disabled (so long as there's at least 1 NT machine on the net).

Otherwise, eventually one of the 9x machines with think it's won the browse election even when that should be impossible. This screws the network neighborhood. Very longstanding bug going back to WfW. You can check the state of your network using the "browstat" tool that comes with the resource kit.

(Also, yer correct that NetBIOS or IPX will be faster than NBT for whatever reason. Make sure to adjust the "binding order" so that these protocols come ahead of TCP/IP. Can't recall exactly how to do this, sorry.)

This might not be realistic for a home net, but install WINS/DHCP if possible and put the clients into p-mode. (no NetBIOS broadcasts)

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And first, I have to reply to the older charges and to my first accusers, and then I will go to the later ones. For I have had many accusers, who accused me of old, and their false charges have continued during many years; and I am more afraid of them than of Anytus and his associates, who are dangerous, too, in their own way. But far more dangerous are these, who began when you were children, and took possession of your minds with their falsehoods, telling of one Socrates, a wise man, who speculated about the heaven above, and searched into the earth beneath, and made the worse appear the better cause. These are the accusers whom I dread; for they are the circulators of this rumor, and their hearers are too apt to fancy that speculators of this sort do not believe in the gods. And they are many, and their charges against me are of ancient date, and they made them in days when you were impressible - in childhood, or perhaps in youth - and the cause when heard went by default, for there was none to answer. And, hardest of all, their names I do not know and cannot tell; unless in the chance of a comic poet. But the main body of these slanderers who from envy and malice have wrought upon you - and there are some of them who are convinced themselves, and impart their convictions to others - all these, I say, are most difficult to deal with; for I cannot have them up here, and examine them, and therefore I must simply fight with shadows in my own defence, and examine when there is no one who answers. I will ask you then to assume with me, as I was saying, that my opponents are of two kinds - one recent, the other ancient; and I hope that you will see the propriety of my answering the latter first, for these accusations you heard long before the others, and much oftener.
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I will begin at the beginning, and ask what the accusation is which has given rise to this slander of me, and which has encouraged Meletus to proceed against me. What do the slanderers say? They shall be my prosecutors, and I will sum up their words in an affidavit. "Socrates is an evil-doer, and a curious person, who searches into things under the earth and in heaven, and he makes the worse appear the better cause; and he teaches the aforesaid doctrines to others." That is the nature of the accusation, and that is what you have seen yourselves in the comedy of Aristophanes; who has introduced a man whom he calls Socrates, going about and saying that he can walk in the air, and talking a deal of nonsense concerning matters of which I do not pretend to know either much or little - not that I mean to say anything disparaging of anyone who is a student of natural philosophy. I should be very sorry if Meletus could lay that to my charge. But the simple truth is, O Athenians, that I have nothing to do with these studies. Very many of those here present are witnesses to the truth of this, and to them I appeal. Speak then, you who have heard me, and tell your neighbors whether any of you have ever known me hold forth in few words or in many upon matters of this sort. ... You hear their answer. And from what they say of this you will be able to judge of the truth of the rest.
As little foundation is there for the report that I am a teacher, and take money; that is no more true than the other. Although, if a man is able to teach, I honor him for being paid. There is Gorgias of Leontium, and Prodicus of Ceos, and Hippias of Elis, who go the round of the cities, and are able to persuade the young men to leave their own citizens, by whom they might be taught for nothing, and come to them, whom they not only pay, but are thankful if they may be allowed to pay them. There is actually a Parian philosopher residing in Athens, of whom I have heard; and I came to hear of him in this way: - I met a man who has spent a world of money on the Sophists, Callias the son of Hipponicus, and knowing that he had sons, I asked him: "Callias," I said, "if your two sons were foals or calves, there would be no difficulty in finding someone to put over them; we should hire a trainer of horses or a farmer probably who would improve and perfect them in their own proper virtue and excellence; but as they are human beings, whom are you thinking of placing over them? Is there anyone who understands human and political virtue? You must have thought about this as you have sons; is there anyone?" "There is," he said. "Who is he?" said I, "and of what country? and what does he charge?" "Evenus the Parian," he replied; "he is the man, and his charge is five minae." Happy is Evenus, I said to myself, if he really has this wisdom, and teaches at such a modest charge. Had I the same, I should have been very proud and conceited; but the truth is that I have no knowledge of the kind.
I dare say, Athenians, that someone among you will reply, "Why is this, Socrates, and what is the origin of these accusations of you: for there must have been something strange which you have been doing? All this great fame and talk about you would never have arisen if you had been like other men: tell us, then, why this is, as we should be sorry to judge hastily of you." Now I regard this as a fair challenge, and I will endeavor to explain to you the origin of this name of "wise," and of this evil fame. Please to attend then. And although some of you may think I am joking, I declare that I will tell you the entire truth. Men of Athens, this reputation of mine has come of a certain sort of wisdom which I possess. If you ask me what kind of wisdom, I reply, such wisdom as is attainable by man, for to that extent I am inclined to believe that I am wise; whereas the persons of whom I was speaking have a superhuman wisdom, which I may fail to describe, because I have it not myself; and he who says that I have, speaks falsely, and is taking away my character. And here, O men of Athens, I must beg you not to interrupt me, even if I seem to say something extravagant. For the word which I will speak is not mine. I will refer you to a witness who is worthy of credit, and will tell you about my wisdom - whether I have any, and of what sort - and that witness shall be the god of Delphi. You must have known Chaerephon; he was early a friend of mine, and also a friend of yours, for he shared in the exile of the people, and returned with you. Well, Chaerephon, as you know, was very impetuous in all his doings, and he went to Delphi and boldly asked the oracle to tell him whether - as I was saying, I must beg you not to interrupt - he asked the oracle to tell him whether there was anyone wiser than I was, and the Pythian prophetess answered that there was no man wiser. Chaerephon is dead himself, but his brother, who is in court, will confirm the truth of this story.
Why do I mention this? Because I am going to explain to you why I have such an evil name. When I heard the answer, I said to myself, What can the god mean? and what is the interpretation of this riddle? for I know that I have no wisdom, small or great. What can he mean when he says that I am the wisest of men? And yet he is a god and cannot lie; that would be against his nature. After a long consideration, I at last thought of a method of trying the question. I reflected that if I could only find a man wiser than myself, then I might go to the god with a refutation in my hand. I should say to him, "Here is a man who is wiser than I am; but you said that I was the wisest." Accordingly I went to one who had the reputation of wisdom, and observed to him - his name I need not mention; he was a politician whom I selected for examination - and the result was as follows: When I began to talk with him, I could not help thinking that he was not really wise, although he was thought wise by many, and wiser still by himself; and I went and tried to explain to him that he thought himself wise, but was not really wise; and the consequence was that he hated me, and his enmity was shared by several who were present and heard me. So I left him, saying to myself, as I went away: Well, although I do not suppose that either of us knows anything really beautiful and good, I am better off than he is - for he knows nothing, and thinks that he knows. I neither know nor think that I know. In this latter particular, then, I seem to have slightly the advantage of him. Then I went to another, who had still higher philosophical pretensions, and my conclusion was exactly the same. I made another enemy of him, and of many others besides him.

nothing needs to be said (-1, Flamebait)

z00ky (614811) | more than 10 years ago | (#8512890)

what's there to say? the book's going to be a flop because everyone knows that SMB/CIFS blows.
That's why there's AFP.

O'Reilly Safari (4, Informative)

Erik_ (183203) | more than 10 years ago | (#8512904)

And best of all it's available on O'Reilly's Safari [oreilly.com] service.

More Information is available at this link (-1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#8512912)

Re:More Information is available at this link (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#8512951)

Parent link is troll.

Read/Skimmed it (0, Flamebait)

0BoDy (739304) | more than 10 years ago | (#8512915)

I didn't really gain any practical knowldge from this book: I'd say that it would be best read by programmers wishing to understand how to implement an alternative. This book really show why SMB blows so bad

Network Neighborhood (3, Interesting)

frenetic3 (166950) | more than 10 years ago | (#8512921)

I've always wondered why on some machines it takes so damn long to browse the network on everything from 95 to XP -- most of the time I simply whimper and mumble incoherently waiting for it to eventually finish, but have never been able to diagnose the problem. Over the 'net it's even more agonizingly slow -- minute-long delays when pings are 30ms or less.

The post suggests that this book tells the answer, but do any enlightened here know some typical causes of the ridiculously poor performance?

-fren

Re:Network Neighborhood (5, Informative)

Bombcar (16057) | more than 10 years ago | (#8512969)

The usual cause is badly synced browse lists.

If you add a samba server and tell it to run WINS (with wins=yes), and then tell EVERY windows machine that the wins server is at (IP address of Samba Server), things usually speed up considerably.

Also, there is (I believe), a C:\winnt\system32\drivers\etc\lmhosts file that works as a hosts file for WINS).

Re:Network Neighborhood (1)

MCZapf (218870) | more than 10 years ago | (#8513164)

I thought WINS was outdated. Am I wrong? (Assuming a domain master and not an ad-hoc Win9x network.)

Re:Network Neighborhood (2, Informative)

Vlad_the_Inhaler (32958) | more than 10 years ago | (#8513239)

Win2K only supports WINS in some 'compatability mode', don't know if XP supports it at all.

WINS is dying.

Re:Network Neighborhood (3, Informative)

droid_rage (535157) | more than 10 years ago | (#8513409)

Not true. 2k and XP both fully support WINS. It's generally configured in the DHCP scope, but it can be explicitly defined on the client.
MS is trying to kill it off, but since 9x and NT boxes don't understand DNS for anything but internet name resolution, its demise is still a long way off.

Re:Network Neighborhood (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#8513549)

The replacement for WINS is MS Dynamic DNS -- I dunno if any Unix servers support this.

Re:Network Neighborhood (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#8512998)

It's not just browsing where lists might need to be refreshed, etc. Even if you know the exact IP of the machine, it can still take upwards of two minutes before you can access the files. During this period, the Windows UI is totally and completely unresponsive.

What gives?

Re:Network Neighborhood (1)

gyp (312559) | more than 10 years ago | (#8513280)

You're doing ~WHAT~ over the net?

my review... (-1, Troll)

chmod_localhost (718125) | more than 10 years ago | (#8512925)

I really like this book. The internals of the CIFS protocol is not a subject for the faint hearted, but Chris has really tackled it well. This is just the right book for people like me who want to understand what is going on on their network at the bits and bytes level.

In the Samba Team we have been working on implementing the protocols that Chris describes in this book for the last 12 years or so, but we've always been doing this from sniffer traces and incomplete specifications. It was quite an interesting experience to see all this information distilled into such a readable format.

This isn't the sort of book that one buys grandma for Christmas, but if you run a Windows network and have been curious about what is happening inside all those network packets, how your computers find each other and what that weird error message really means then do yourself a favor and have a read.

Andrew Tridgell
Samba Team

Not Andrew Tridgell (2, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#8512982)

This guy isn't Andrew Tridgell.

He put on a pretense of being some other authoritatian figure ("John Nagle") in some other article (and got modded into oblivion there)

http://slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=91307&cid=7861 607 [slashdot.org]

Knock him down.

Re:Not Andrew Tridgell (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#8513050)

Who cares? The post is on-topic, and at least the guy gave credit to the original author.

Mods, use your points on stuff that matters, not this petty tripe.

Re:Not Andrew Tridgell (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#8513074)

This is the first time I've ever heard that impersonating someone was a way of giving "credit to the original author" ...

But I suppose I've been trolled. Meh.

Re:Not Andrew Tridgell (1)

dknj (441802) | more than 10 years ago | (#8513059)

The grandfather poster is a Theif. [amazon.com] That was actually Andrew's post to amazon. We can all mod him to -1 now kthx

-dk

Re:Not Andrew Tridgell (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#8513179)

I've got split personalities, you insensitive clod!

-- Andrew Tridgell / John Nagle

Re:Not Andrew Tridgell (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#8513236)

Oh crap, it's worse now!

-- Andrew Tridgell / John Nagle / Anonymous Coward

What we *really* want to know is... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#8512993)

Why the hell does windows leave ports 137-9 open all the time? There's nothing I *want* running on there, and I know that I'm not sharing any files/printers/etc. so why the hell is that left open?

Moreover, is there any way to close it? Thanks!

Re:What we *really* want to know is... (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#8513273)

they are open because you dont know dick about security...

Re:my review... (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#8513021)

Another post by chmod_localhost [slashdot.org] :

I have recently converted to the Linux way of doing things, after being fed up with M$ for too long.

In my department, we use proprietary software for all of our data reporting. I would like to use an open source program instead, but since I'm new to Linux, I'm not sure what's out there.

I'm hoping the slashdot community can help me on this one- what are some good plotting programs that run on Linux?

Somebody mod this troll down!

Re:my review... (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#8513048)

Troll/schill!

Posts to every review; give his past posts a look.

Re:my review... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#8513049)

So really, this is a good book for any network administrator who regularly troubleshoots his/her Windows-Linux-Etc hybrid network? I'd like a book that covers common issues between Samba and native Windows hosts, and issues based solely on individual platforms. I sometimes notice CIFS problems that are specific to a platform, and a book that covers the why and the fixes would be really cool IMHO.

Most implementations will be in written in C... (2, Insightful)

tcopeland (32225) | more than 10 years ago | (#8512980)

...but is there any reason why a CIFS client (or server) couldn't be written in a higher level language like Ruby [ruby-lang.org] ?

Obviously there'd be a speed hit, but it seems like it'd be a lot faster to develop in, and time-critical bits could be written in C and accessed via Ruby/DL [ttsky.net] or whatever.

Ditto for Python, of course... same sort of advantages/issues.

Re:Most implementations will be in written in C... (4, Insightful)

110010001000 (697113) | more than 10 years ago | (#8513022)

For what purpose? Ruby is an esoteric language that hardly anyone uses and less people will use as the years goes on. This means that the code base will be unmaintainable.

Now Java or C# is a real option. Microsofts next implementation will be written in C# as a matter of fact.

Re:Most implementations will be in written in C... (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#8513153)

http://anti-slash.org/ [anti-slash.org]

Re:Most implementations will be in written in C... (0, Offtopic)

tcopeland (32225) | more than 10 years ago | (#8513450)

> For what purpose?

Oh, the usual scripting language reasons: easier to program, easier to debug, reduces dangers of stack smashing and suchlike... all that.

> Ruby is an esoteric language that
> hardly anyone uses and less people will
> use as the years goes on

Ruby is a general purpose language that lots of people use and it will continue to grow in popularity.

There, now we've both made assertions. So where do we go from here?

Re:Most implementations will be in written in C... (2, Insightful)

110010001000 (697113) | more than 10 years ago | (#8513578)

Well my assertions are based in fact. Do a poll of every software developer or programmer you know and ask them if they have ever written or seen a program written in Ruby. Then ask them if they have seen or written one five years (or three years) ago.

The same principles apply to Eiffel, et al.

Re:Most implementations will be in written in C... (1)

tcopeland (32225) | more than 10 years ago | (#8513659)

> Do a poll of every software developer
> or programmer you know and ask them if
> they have ever written or seen a program
> written in Ruby

The 50 or so developers on my current project all find Ruby quite handy.

> same principles apply to Eiffel, et al

Yup, not much Eiffeling going on these days, to the best of my knowledge. I guess I feel that there's a bit of a difference btwn Ruby and say, Ada or Eiffel.

Maybe we're the last project in the world to use Ruby... but I doubt it [rubyforge.org] ....

Re:Most implementations will be in written in C... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#8513523)

jCIFS [samba.org] is a Java CIFS client (and the jCIFS project was founded by this book's author).

Re:Most implementations will be in written in C... (1)

ScaredSilly (746387) | more than 10 years ago | (#8513554)

There is a java client called jCIFS [samba.org] that is part of the Samba project.

My Take (5, Interesting)

110010001000 (697113) | more than 10 years ago | (#8512985)


This book is simply the best reference available for CIFS. I only say that because I have spent $$$ getting everything on the subject I can. With the recent changes in Microsoft licensing every sensible IT professional should be exploring alternatives. A SAMBA server is a great alternative. This book is all you need to go from knowing next to nothing to knowing enough to impress your geeky Network Admin friends.

This book is well written, clear and expansive. I didn't read it cover to cover (not at first anyway) I found pieces I needed, applied it, digested it, reviewed it and then went on to the next morsel I needed. If I missed something it was easy to find. By the way, it works with Win2K and WinXP neither of which is well documented by anyone anywhere.

Book is open source as well (4, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#8512988)

The full text of the book is available online as well; I don't want to slashdot the site, but google for "implementing cifs".

Re:Book is open source as well (1)

Lifewish (724999) | more than 10 years ago | (#8513641)

Too late, it's been hammered.

The book that Microsoft should have written (0, Redundant)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#8512999)

For years, developers and administrators have struggled to understand CIFS, Microsoft's poorly documented standard for Internet file sharing. Finally, there is an authoritative, cross-platform guide to CIFS capabilities and behavior. Implementing CIFS not only delivers the priceless knowledge of a Samba Team member dedicated to investigating the inner workings of CIFS, it also identifies and describes crucial specifications and supporting documents.

- Provides essential information for designing and debugging large Windows(R) and/or Samba networks
- Offers clear, in-depth introductions to Server Message Block (SMB), NetBIOS over TCP/IP (NBT), browser services, and authentication
- Drills down into the internals of CIFS, exposing its behavior on the wire and at the desktop?and its strange quirks
- Presents illustrative code examples throughout
- Reflects years of work reviewing obscure documentation, packet traces, and sourcecode
- Includes the SNIA CIFS Technical Reference

Implementing CIFS will be indispensable to every developer who wants to provide CIFS compatibility?and every administrator or security specialist who needs an in-depth understanding of how it really works.

MacOSX Samba (2, Interesting)

selderrr (523988) | more than 10 years ago | (#8513003)

what never ceases to amaze me is that my 400Mhz iMac can pull files faster from my AMD 1800xp than my P4@3GHz can...

Both PCs run XP pro, the iMac runs panther. Go figure.

As far as those 15 minutes concern, I got one solution for ya : rende-vous/zeroconf. Since iTunes/win can find macs using this protocol, a win port is allready done, so we can only hope MS sees the light and uses it for network scanning one day.

Code examples? (2, Interesting)

gpinzone (531794) | more than 10 years ago | (#8513010)

Could someone please explain what kind of code examples the book covers? I thought the whole point of modern OSes was to "abstract" everything for the user, including the method of networking.

Re:Code examples? (2, Informative)

Bombcar (16057) | more than 10 years ago | (#8513371)

The examples are of internal CIFS functions. As I said, if you just want to use CIFS, you may not need this book. This is if you want to write code that directly plays on a network using the CIFS protocol.

jCIFS is one example, Samba is another.

One code example is getting a browse list from another networked machine.

Re:Code examples? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#8513454)

CIFS is for developers, not users.

overgeneralisation (2, Informative)

tverbeek (457094) | more than 10 years ago | (#8513018)

Anyone who has used Microsoft products in the last ten years has used the SMB protocol (now known as CIFS)

Except for the people whose Windows boxes weren't hooked up to a network, or who instead used Netware for file/print sharing, or whose only loaded network components were TCP/IP and the adapter device. And even though it's installed by default, that doesn't mean everybody who failed to deinstall it actually used it.

Network Neighborhood.... (0, Offtopic)

Sentosus (751729) | more than 10 years ago | (#8513034)

And networking technologies have proven to be a letdown to what I was taught in early years of school.

I remember being told that we would have clusters of machines that form a large virtual machine that can multitask using the advantages of each machine. Then when processes needed it, the entire force of the machines could be used.

It was essentially a Mainframe with Beowulf clustering as the power behind the mainframe. I listened to so many unique possibilities with this, but now we have reality and I guess that in the 90's, we could not have guessed what we would be doing just 5-8 years later with computers.

I welcome books that give basics to how protocols evolved and how a person's vision of the future was modified over and over to come up with a new vision for the future to be modified again.

Standing on the edge of Tribal's PowWow, who would have guessed that the vision then would take 5 years to be rerealized again by MSN and Yahoo chats?

The neighborhood is not a neighborhood at all, but more like a grid where communication is not me walking next door to say hello, but me calling up my friend on the other side of town and attempting to move his house next to mine.

SP --- Off Topic and Fine with it.

Re:Network Neighborhood.... (1)

awx (169546) | more than 10 years ago | (#8513195)

DEC had it with VMS on VAX, and later, Alpha. Multi-CPU clustering and seamless failover of all components in the system - software, CPUs, storage...

RIP DEC.

This book is under an Open Source license (5, Informative)

Bruce Perens (3872) | more than 10 years ago | (#8513172)

Like all books in Bruce Perens Open Source Series [phptr.com] , this book is under an Open Source license.

Thanks

Bruce

Re:This book is under an Open Source license (2, Insightful)

110010001000 (697113) | more than 10 years ago | (#8513244)

Now here is a guy I can respect. One who believes in the Open Source spirit enough to actually make the content of a book available for free. Kudos to Bruce for not being a hypocrite like so many of the Open Source "community".

It would be interesting to hear about how well the books sell after being made freely available on the net. My guess is not very well, but I am a fervent anti-open source guy. Please let us know.

Thanks

Re:This book is under an Open Source license (5, Informative)

Bruce Perens (3872) | more than 10 years ago | (#8513400)

Thanks. There are 10 books in the series now, all treated the same as this one - online source and PDF, Open Source license. As far as I can tell, all have at least broken even, and most have made money.

But the fact is that technical book authors are generally writing for some other reason than to get direct income from the book. Most do it for the intangibles - promotion of their own careers or projects they support, etc.

What I like about this series is that the books need never die, since anyone can edit and print them. They don't get into that state where the publisher sells a few hundred copies a year on order and doesn't revert the rights to the author for years. Authors hate that.

But we are careful with timing. We make sure the "pipeline" between the publisher and bookstores is full before the electronic copy is available. So, clone publishers don't have much incentive, as the stores have already filled their orders.

I have to admit that this would not work as well if people liked to curl up with e-books. If that day ever comes, we'll change the strategy, but the end product will still be Open Source books.

If you are very anti-open-source, it's probably because you don't yet understand the ways that Open Source works well for business and business people. I have a paper on the economic basis of Open Source that I'm working on, that you will probably find of interest. It should be out in a week or two.

Thanks

Bruce

Re:This book is under an Open Source license (2, Interesting)

110010001000 (697113) | more than 10 years ago | (#8513470)

I am interested in your paper on the economics of OS. I am personally convinced that the economics of Open Source are damaging to the software industry and to the software developer. Perhaps your paper will give me insight into this. I hope it will be available via your website.

Re:This book is under an Open Source license (4, Insightful)

Bruce Perens (3872) | more than 10 years ago | (#8513567)

Yes, I will put it up on the web. I think I can show you that Open Source isn't damaging to individual software developers and is of benefit to business and the economy in general. But it is damaging to a Microsoft-style business. Home refrigerators were very damaging to the huge industry that harvested, stored, and transported ice.

Thanks

Bruce

How come you have time to shill for your books... (2, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#8513271)

... but don't have time to answer the Slashdot interview questions from last July [slashdot.org] ?

Re:How come you have time to shill for your books. (4, Funny)

Bruce Perens (3872) | more than 10 years ago | (#8513467)

Oops. I thought I sent those off to roblimo. Are you sure?

Bruce

Sure it has never been posted (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#8513510)

This [slashdot.org] doesn't show whether or not you ever sent them to roblimo, but they never got posted. On the right column, there is Ask Bruce Perens, but no answers.

Re:Sure it has never been posted (2, Funny)

Bruce Perens (3872) | more than 10 years ago | (#8513681)

Oops. I'll ask roblimo.

Thanks

Bruce

Apprentice Hell?... (0)

SmackCrackandPot (641205) | more than 10 years ago | (#8513217)

For a moment, I thought this title read "Bombcar's review of Implementing CIFS from Apprentice Hell.'

M$ hides other half of knowledge (3, Funny)

superpulpsicle (533373) | more than 10 years ago | (#8513225)

As good as Samba is... you know M$ is always hiding something about their network neighborhood protocol. It wouldn't surprise me if the code reads "If Samba wait 5 minutes"

This is a great book for implementors (4, Interesting)

dslamguy (644218) | more than 10 years ago | (#8513259)

I read this book on Chris's web site even before it was published (yes, I have bought a copy) and it was an invaluable guide for me as I wrote a CIFS implementation. The book is fairly easy to read, even though it is highly technical. What it does cover, it covers extremely well.

However, I did need the sniffer method of reverse engineering for much of what the book did not cover. One complaint I had is that I needed more information on the higher level protocols such as LANMAN for handling printer queues and this information was either non-existent or schetchy in the book. Although the book is long, much of it is taken up by a CIFS document which you could download for free on the internet. So I do think that the description part of the book could be more extensive (Sorry Chris). Maybe in the next revision.

You might ask why I was implementing CIFS from scratch? Its a valid question, since Samba would/should be anyone's implementation of choice. I did it because we are developing a printer which is not GPL (and unfortunately not based on Linux). We are not using any GPL code in it, and so this was really the only choice besides buying it from someone (but where's the fun in that). I am planning on releasing this code under a BSD license, but it's not ready for prime time yet and I need to get back to it (in a couple of months).

So this was a really good book for CIFS implementors, but how many of those could there be?

Re:This is a great book for implementors (2, Informative)

110010001000 (697113) | more than 10 years ago | (#8513413)

Not a troll, but curiosity: why did you buy a copy of the book when it is freely available on the net? I personally did because I prefer to read from a book rather than a computer screen.

huh? (0)

unbiasedbystander (660703) | more than 10 years ago | (#8513447)

NOT-a-disease???

Definetly not a cure either.

"Network Neighborhood" - what's that? (1)

hey (83763) | more than 10 years ago | (#8513701)

Didn't Microsoft rename "Network Neighborhood" to "Computers Near Me" in XP. That kills me?
Was "Network Neighborhood" too technical. Of course the computers might not be physically near you.

Why CIFS/Samba at all? (1)

Brandybuck (704397) | more than 10 years ago | (#8513710)

I can understand wanting to use Samba in networks with a bunch of Windows shares. And I realize that the MCSE certification process involved a form of lobotomization. But beyond it's Microsoft-ness, what advantage does CIFS have over NFS and other network filesystems?

I've heard of Linux-only networks that used Samba, and for the life of my I can't figure out why.

SAMBA name change? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#8513754)

Anyone who has used Microsoft products in the last ten years has used the SMB protocol (now known as CIFS)

Will SAMBA have to change its name to CIFILUS?

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  • li
  • dl
  • dt
  • dd
  • em
  • strong
  • tt
  • blockquote
  • div
  • quote
  • ecode

"ecode" can be used for code snippets, for example:

<ecode>    while(1) { do_something(); } </ecode>