Can Communications Be Learned From Chimps? 312
Pine UK writes "The Zoological Society of London are looking for volunteers who are willing to 'talk chimp' in everyday life. The ZSL will be studying the volunteers to see how talking chimp affects situations like workplace conflicts. According to BBC News, the volunteers are expected to show their emotions in a chimp like fashion. This can be done by baring their teeth and by using submissive body language such as lowering their heads and crouching. The ZSL will publish their findings later this year."
The future.. (Score:4, Funny)
Animal behaviour experts at ZSL are asking volunteers to 'talk chimp' in everyday life and see how primate patter can resolve workplace conflicts
I can just imagine the natural progression of such an experiment:
2004: "Oooo oooo ooohhh AAHH AAHH ooo oo AAHHH AHHHH ooo ooooo..."
2005: "We own Linux."
Well, (Score:3, Insightful)
Re:Well, (Score:5, Insightful)
Is Learnt a word? (Score:2)
Re:Is Learnt a word? (Score:3, Informative)
Re:Is Learnt a word? (Score:5, Informative)
So now you've learnt something new for today...
Re:Is Learnt a word? (Score:2)
Re:Is Learnt a word? (Score:2)
I find it interesting that "learnt" is often (in the US) associated with a lack or education and/or a rural background. It's much like "ain't".
Re:Is Learnt a word? (Score:3, Funny)
Re:Is Learnt a word? (Score:2)
Re:Is Learnt a word? (Score:5, Interesting)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/American_English [wikipedia.org]
This is why "the universal language is American English" - Britian spread English throughout the world during it's rampant empire building in the 15th and 16th centuries, and because of the distances involved British "english" evolved and the rest of the world was largely uneffected by the changes.
<joke>So you limey Brits can take your extra vowels and shove it!</joke>
=Smidge=
Re:Is Learnt a word? (Score:2)
Re:Is Learnt a word? (Score:5, Insightful)
Then how come we write and speak "British English" (aka Commonwealth English) in Australia, New Zealand, and most other nations of the Commonwealth, despite the fact that we are far more geographically separated from Britain than the USA is?
Another thing that is strange is that (Australian) historic documents from the 1700s and 1800s use something much closer to Commonwealth English than American English.
Commonwealth English is far more widespread than American English worldwide (despite American English being the de-facto standard language of the Web).
Even the link [wikipedia.org] you provided to Wikipedia claims that "language reforms [in America] were not driven by government, but by textbook writers and dictionary makers". It also explains that "Webster's particular contribution was to show that the region spoke a different dialect from Britain, and so he wrote a dictionary with many spellings differing from the standard. Many of these changes were initiated unilaterally by Webster."
It does, however state that "standard American English of the upper Midwest has a sound profile much closer to seventeenth century English than contemporary speech in England". However, this is not referring to spelling and grammar.
So, American English is a version of English that is peculiar to the United States, and is far from a "traditional" approach (it was unilaterally changed by Webster to appear different from British English), and it certainly has no historical claim to be "the universal language".
Re:Is Learnt a word? (Score:3, Funny)
Britian spread English throughout the world during it's rampant...
Obviously we didn't spread it well enough...
Chimp Journal reports (Score:5, Funny)
chimps (Score:5, Funny)
Re:chimps (Score:2, Funny)
If by "commnuication" you mean throwing your own poo to show disgust, then I would say "yes!".
Oh it's much worse than that. Bored chimps in the zoo masturbate to relieve the, er, boredom.
Imagine all the bored /. nerds at work unable to read (it's not chimp communication), and instead taking up the chimp's ways....
Actually, that's not something to imagine. (shudder).
Yes (Score:2, Funny)
The Chimpsons (Score:5, Funny)
Re:The Chimpsons (Score:2)
Simple answer... (Score:5, Funny)
Re:Simple answer... (Score:2)
-The Librarian*
yeah, yeah, he's an orangotang, but what are the odds of getting an orangotang story?
Sorry boss... (Score:2, Informative)
Re:Sorry boss... (Score:4, Funny)
CEO: Profits are well and truly up because of my wonderful leadership!
*sound of several bits of dung being flung through the air with dull plops*
CEO: You're too kind, really.
Interesting... (Score:5, Funny)
Legitimizing Ape-Shit behavior between team managers definately does not provide a positive answer to the question: "Is this good for the Company?".
Well.. (Score:2, Funny)
Um... (Score:5, Funny)
I'm no expert in Zoology, but I'm assuming you'll have the shit beat out of you by the end of the day. It would be about as bad as saying "someone has the case of the Mondays" on a construciton site.
Re:Um... (Score:2, Funny)
Well....then..okay
They would have the BLOODY shit kicked out of them by the end of the day.
April 7, the New Fool's Day? (Score:4, Insightful)
This is too rich: parody that writes itself.
Are we sure that April 7 isn't All Fool's Day
-kgj
Nothing new... (Score:5, Funny)
You can't be on the Internet for more than five minutes without seeing this.
OMG! Lik can u beleev teh chimps r talkin now? ROFLOLOKOL!!1!1!
The chimps is here, and they is us.
Aren't we chimps? (Score:5, Insightful)
And this is different from how human body language is used how?
-Colin [colingregorypalmer.net]
Re:Aren't we chimps? (Score:2)
"What are you doing, dumbass?! AUGH! You wrecked it!" *Smacks coworker in the head* *Scratches ass* *Whistles at attractive female coworker*
Method B:
"Ooh? AAH! AAHHA AHHHHHEEEHAAAAAAA!!!" *Grabs wrench and beats co-worker with it repeatedly* *Stands over unconcious body and screeches loudly while pounding chest* *Wipes ass with hand and sniffs it* *Chases attractive female coworker into closet while grunting loudly*
Man. Suddenly I wish we were doing this study at MY workplace too...
Re:Aren't we chimps? (Score:2)
In human body language, baring your teeth implies a friendly attitude, while pressing your lips together signals agression. For most mammals, it's the exact opposite.
Disclaimer: This was first noticed by Douglas Adams.
Re:Aren't we chimps? (Score:2)
In humans, smileing or laughing at a dangerous situation, or an accident is the same, it is baring the teeth as a fear response.
In prey animals (cattle) they don't bare the teeth, they face the danger, or try to stare it down. Perhaps while attemtping to gain some distance or allow herd members to gain some distance before fleeing.
Re:Aren't we chimps? (Score:3, Funny)
Re:Aren't we chimps? (Score:2)
Second, we're not usually violently threatened the way primates would be. They don't have laws or cops.
Third, body language can transcend language barriers. Look at two people who don't speak the same language 'talking' to one another, and you get a little bit better idea of the situation that many chimps are used to.
I have an idea (Score:5, Funny)
Talking Chimp? (Score:5, Funny)
The trolls here have been communicating on the level of lower primates for years.
Can Communications Be Learned From Chimps? (Score:4, Insightful)
I really don't think there is a need for "throw shit at each other" as a way to communicate.
Re:Can Communications Be Learned From Chimps? (Score:2, Insightful)
> shit at each other" as a way to communicate.
No... but it seems to be our standard way of settling international disputes.
"Hey, you have a towel on your head. Eat lead."
Re:Can Communications Be Learned From Chimps? (Score:2)
"Hey, you have a towel on your head. Eat lead."
Chimps rarely kill each other out of the blue, and don't conduct wars.
Re:Can Communications Be Learned From Chimps? (Score:2)
Bzzzzzt! Wrong Answer! [telegraph.co.uk]
Re:Can Communications Be Learned From Chimps? (Score:5, Insightful)
We would NEVER throw poop at someone - WE'RE CIVILISED!!!
RS
Re:Can Communications Be Learned From Chimps? (Score:2)
Fast forward 50 years, hmmm, an oil dispute again.
If both sides are willing to compromise then it works, this has happened and wars have been prevented, think Cuban Missile Crisis.
I'd say we are pretty sophisticated but when the person you are dealing with refuses to reciprocate you have to respond in kind. Just like when someone has a prob
Re:Can Communications Be Learned From Chimps? (Score:2)
You've never seen a political campaign before, have you?
Re:Can Communications Be Learned From Chimps? (Score:2)
You just violated our copyright. I've hired several lawyers to fling feces at your house.
Re:Can Communications Be Learned From Chimps? (Score:2)
No. You see, we are human beings. We have developed written and spoken language, art, music, drama and culture which allows us to communicate. Rather well, in fact.
I really don't think there is a need for "throw shit at each other" as a way to communicate.
Tell that to Karl Rove.
Chimps (Score:5, Funny)
Give a finite number of chimps a finite amount of time and they will produce slashdot comments.
Give a single chimp a broken typewriter and a banana and he will post dupes as CowboyNeal.
Silly idea (Score:5, Interesting)
Honestly, if a co-worker of mine bared his teeth and cringed or tried to wave his arms about, draw himself up tall, and shriek, I'd be convinced that he was stark, raving insane. While the researchers are trying to make a point about showing off your emotions better, I think they miss the need in human society to NOT show your emotions at times.
Heck, even confrontational chimps will hide their nervousness until after a stand-off.
only ... (Score:4, Funny)
Hmm... (Score:3, Funny)
chimp translation engine (Score:2)
Communication CAN be learned from chimps (Score:3, Funny)
I fail to see... (Score:2, Funny)
What about orangutans? (Score:4, Funny)
Too late! (Score:2)
Yes, I do... (Score:2)
I do, but they are called "co-workers" where I do.
checklist... (Score:4, Funny)
parasite grooming (a.k.a. the search for salty snacks)... check
flying off the handle for no readily apparent reason and causing others around you to follow same panicky behavior... check
Just like looking into the mirror!
Obviously not looking for great response (Score:2, Insightful)
Re:Obviously not looking for great response (Score:2)
Close... (Score:2, Funny)
has it already started? (Score:4, Funny)
so what they are looking for (Score:2)
better way to do it (Score:5, Interesting)
Re:better way to do it (Score:5, Insightful)
Re:better way to do it (Score:2)
As long as they are poor people its ok I guess.
Re:better way to do it (Score:3, Funny)
Re:better way to do it (Score:2)
Actually, we're too slow & low to speak Bonobo (Score:2)
But recently researchers started listening to those high pitched "simple squeaks" that Bonobos have. They discovered two things:
Re:better way to do it (Score:2, Informative)
|>oug
Re:better way to do it (Score:2)
You can't copy language without the society (Score:5, Funny)
Re:You can't copy language without the society (Score:3, Informative)
Unlike the chimpanzees, whose behaviour consists of aggression, threats, and chest-thumping I-am-da-alpha-male etc attitudes, bonobos resolve conflicts by cuddling up to each other and having snuggly therapeutic sex. Sometimes the whole troupe gets into it.
Nothing like an orgy to defuse aggression.
So, if it were bonobo beha
Oh, too much fun... (Score:5, Funny)
You mean like picking bugs out of each other's hair to show support?
Or having sex with all the females in the office in front of the men to show your power?
Or flinging sh*t at people who say stupid things in meetings?
The funny thing is, it'd still be better than the way things work at my office.
Re:Oh, too much fun... (Score:3, Insightful)
Eh? Can somewone explany why is this scored +1 funny?
Training Video (Score:2)
Doing this for a couple of years... (Score:2)
This research has been done before (Score:2, Funny)
Re:This research has been done before (Score:2)
Judging from the average /. comment . . . (Score:2, Funny)
Frats (Score:2, Funny)
Poo (Score:2)
-Colin [colingregorypalmer.net]
excellent! (Score:2)
(/me) urinates into own mouth. Just because.
That oughta be interesting... (Score:2)
Absolutely you can learn things from chimps (Score:2)
Alpha Male (Score:2)
Just think if we did this for the selection of President of the United States. We could have Arnold the bodybuilder fighting John Kerry the ex-SEAL.
Didn't this experiment already occur? (Score:3, Funny)
{ducks tomatoes}
One giant leap (into the poop) for mankind (Score:2)
So, either way, it seems rather silly.
If we really think this is a good idea, I vote we cut to the chase, and learn to communicate like, say, ticks. You don't mind if I bite you and squeeze ny head in under your epidermis, do you? That's how I communicate, "Hey! I'm surviving! And you have Lyme's disease now!"
Look at military for partial answer (Score:2)
Not to imply that
Are they talking about chimps here? (Score:2)
> submissive body language such as lowering their
> heads and crouching.
I've done this exact same thing over a fresh box of sweet rolls on Doughnut Day. I wonder if chimps would do the same...hmmm
IMPS (Score:2)
Perhaps we need to revise it to allow poo flinging, though.
People already DO "talk chimp". (Score:2)
It's just that in some cases we're not that blatant about it and in others our dialect has diverged.
For instance: "Pout Face" (squeeze the lips together and extend them toward the reciever) is a nearly universal primate "I'm friendly toward you" getsture. In humans it has apparently evolved into the kiss (at least in western societies). So you're likely to be misunderstood if you address this gesture to another human other than your lover
April Fools was last week (Score:2)
Would someone really do this?
Re:The BBC news article asks an important question (Score:2, Funny)
Writing PERL is like playing (Score:3, Funny)
Re:Simple Answer (Unheard Phonemes) (Score:4, Interesting)
We adults may not even be hearing the differences in all the sounds that chimps can make (and mean). And I doubt anyone is going to let a human infant be raised by chimps to properly learn their language.
It happens! (Score:3, Informative)
Sometimes these things just happen [bbc.co.uk]. From article:
Impressive (Score:2)
Re:Simple Answer (Unheard Phonemes) (Score:5, Informative)
Actually, all human languages use some phonemes that don't have precise correspondents in other languages. basically, if your language doesn't use a particular phoneme, you cease (after about the age of three or four months) to "gear" it -- instead you categorize it as the phoneme in your language it is "closest" too. Indeed, studies show that the brain does less work when heard sounds are closest to the learned stereotype, and more work for ambiguous sounds that "straddle" two or more known phonemes. So bigger "gaps" between "adjacent" phonemes are preferred.
This makes all kinds of sense by the way: diff'rint pee-pulp sow-nd diff-or-int, and their voices differ based on mood, emotion, wakefulness. By having broad categories for phonemes (and by using contextual clues, which is outside the scope of this discussion), you're able to understand a tired, gum-chewing tourist who doesn't share your dialect. Having to understand indistinct and potentially ambiguous utterances in your language happens much more often than attempting to learn a wholly foreign language. The human brain is adapted to "latch onto" the language it hears in infancy, and specialize in that -- and most times -- in the six million years of human evolution --, that's been the best utilization of resources.
But while adults might not be able to distinguish non-native phonemes sounds by ear, they can by oscilloscope.
The more parsimonious conclusion is that chimps don't have language -- at least not like humans do.
Do they have vocalizations? Sure. Can those vocalizations mean things? Sure -- it's not news that various species of monkeys use different vocalizations to warn of different predators. And it's known that, like human babies differentiating phonemes, juvenile monkeys must learn the meanings of those vocalizations. We even have recent evidence that some birds can understand those monkey vocalizations -- and ignore those warning of predators that don't threaten the birds [nationalgeographic.com].
But language is not just the vocalization of unconnected nouns: "eagle!" or "leopard!"; language, as we understand it in humans, allows far more nuanced and precise explanation than anything we se in animals. At the most mundane level, as Steven Pinker and Paul Bloom point out "It makes a big difference whether a far-off region is reached by taking the trail that is in front of the large tree or the trail that the large tree is in front of." At a more sublime level, a series of unconnected nouns hasn't the power that Dante Alighieri's verse has, to make alive again in our minds his love Beatrice.
Don't misunderstand me: I agree that chimps have a social life -- a complex social life, and I accept the more controversial opinion that they have a culture, and that they transmit that culture.
But language is something else, a special "trick", and it goes beyond, and indeed doesn't require vocalization at all -- as a deaf person or for that matter, any post written on Slashdot will demonstrate.
If we aren't "hearing" language from chimps -- and we've been hoping and listening for years -- it's most likely because chimps don't have language -- at least in the sense we mean language when we describe what any normal human three-year old can do.
Re:coming to take me away, haha.... (Score:2)