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Japanese Inventor's Motor Uses 80% Less Power

CmdrTaco posted about 10 years ago | from the skeptical-eye-on-the-science-guy dept.

Science 1095

novakane007 writes "A Japanese inventor named Kohei Minato has created a new kind of motor. It uses magnetism to perpetuate the motor motion. As a result the motors uses 80% less energy than a conventional motor, while still maintaing the same horsepower. "Minato assures us that he hasn't transcended the laws of physics. The force supplying the unexplained extra power out is generated by the magnetic strength of the permanent magnets embedded in the rotor. 'I'm simply harnessing one of the four fundamental forces of nature,' he says." On top of the energy savings the motor runs cool to the touch and is significantly quieter than a tradtitionally powered fan. Sound to good to be true? Well he's already started selling the fan to a chain of convience stores in Japan. Hopefully soon the design will make it in to your home PC, allowing them to run much quieter."

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1095 comments

Don't forget... (-1, Troll)

SCO$699FeeTroll (695565) | about 10 years ago | (#8873604)

...to pay your $699 licensing fee you cock-smoking teabaggers.

Re:Don't forget... (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | about 10 years ago | (#8873636)

Suck Boot, Asscork!

Re:Don't forget... (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | about 10 years ago | (#8873672)

Jeez, thanks for reminding me! I almost forgot to smoke my boyfriend's cock, and to teabag him!

Of course, like any good American, I've already paid my $699 licensing fee AND my Microsoft tax.

*Sigh* Golly, it's nice to have trolls around here! Thanks again...

Re:Don't forget... (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | about 10 years ago | (#8873756)

YOu CaN SUCk mY fEE YoU aSsHat!!!!!!!!11111111111111

LOL ROLLOFFLE SUX (-1, Offtopic)

Dikky (613893) | about 10 years ago | (#8873605)

WASHINGTON (CNN) -- DiKKy said Tuesday that there was no room for neutrality in the war against rolloffle-ism.

In a joint news conference with toil, DiKKy said ITL would be called upon to back up their support with action. He said he would deliver that message in his speech Saturday to the ITL.

"A itl must do more than just express sympathy, a itl must perform," DiKKy said. "That means different things for different nations. Some nations don't want to contribute harsh words, spam and hate and we understand that. Other persons can contribute intelligence-sharing. ... But all persons, if they want to fight rolloffle, must do something."

DiKKy said he would not point out any specific persons in his speech.

"Over time it's going to be important for trolls to know they will be held accountable for inactivity," he said. "You're either with us or against us in the fight against rolloffle."

DiKKy said threats by Rolloffle to use weapons of mass destruction must be taken seriously. "This is an evil man that we're dealing with, and I wouldn't put it past him to develop evil weapons to try to harm the GNAA as we know it," DiKKy said. " And that's why we must prevail, and that's why we must win."

DiKKy said rolloffle has threatened in the past to use such weapons, but said there is no evidence rolloffle or his BRIT terrorist organization possesses such weaponry. (Full story)

Quiet PCs? (3, Interesting)

octalc0de (601035) | about 10 years ago | (#8873617)

"Hopefully soon the design will make it in to your home PC, allowing them to run much quieter"

What? I wasn't quite aware that computers generated their own power yet... Also, the article says the engines are quite large- probably impossible to be able to use them in a laptop setup. Plus, anyway, power supplies are quite quiet anyway, and they don't generate their own power. The problem with the noise from computers these days is unbearably loud hard drives and harsh fans.

Re:Quiet PCs? (4, Interesting)

molarmass192 (608071) | about 10 years ago | (#8873724)

You can buy pretty damned quiet PC fans, however, you're right that today's hard drives are louder than hell. Also, I'd bet that they generate a lot more case heat than they let on. That said, am I losing my mind or didn't I read back in 1993 that we'd all be using solid state hard drives by now??? Guess that was a sure thing in the days of $600 hard drives.

Re:Quiet PCs? (5, Insightful)

s20451 (410424) | about 10 years ago | (#8873763)

Hopefully soon the design will make it in to your home PC, allowing them to run much quieter

Actually I find it odd that this is the first application that occurred to the poster.

Gentlemen, this new motor design will make battery-powered cars a reality, reduce industrial energy consumption by a third, possibly save the world from global warming ... oh yes, and it will make your case mods mad 31337.

*MAGNETIC* fans in my PC? (4, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | about 10 years ago | (#8873619)

Uh, no thanks. :)

Re:*MAGNETIC* fans in my PC? (2, Informative)

CWCarlson (2884) | about 10 years ago | (#8873690)

Certainly the fans already in your PC generate a magnetic field, no? That's how electric motors operate.

Maybe where you come from buddy (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 10 years ago | (#8873801)

In my country fans run on electricity.

What do you think turns the blades now? (4, Informative)

raygundan (16760) | about 10 years ago | (#8873696)

As opposed to what? Oh, wait, the ones that are in there are ALREADY magnetic. How do you think normal electric motors work?

Re:*MAGNETIC* fans in my PC? (2, Informative)

cmburns69 (169686) | about 10 years ago | (#8873709)

You think the fan that cools your motherboard is not magnetic? Think again.

Even the motor in your hard drive is magnetic.

You just don't have to worry, because the magnetic fields are not very strong.

Re:*MAGNETIC* fans in my PC? (1, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | about 10 years ago | (#8873782)

You dont have to worry because the magnetic field weakens by the cube of the distance. The HSF is plenty to seperate a magnet and your mobo.

Re:*MAGNETIC* fans in my PC? (4, Informative)

GigsVT (208848) | about 10 years ago | (#8873788)

To the contrary, the magnets in your hard disk are the most powerful types of permanant magnets, rare earth magnets. They are very strong. A single hard disk magnet can usually lift at least 10 pounds, maybe more.

Re:*MAGNETIC* fans in my PC? (2, Informative)

n1ywb (555767) | about 10 years ago | (#8873730)

Right because the fans already in your PC don't use magnatism. Nor do the speakers nearby. Nor to the heads in your harddrive, the transformers in your PSU, you get the idea. Just because the fans use permanent magnets doesn't mean they're going to erase your hard drive.

Re:*MAGNETIC* fans in my PC? (1)

Ye Olde Trolle (771612) | about 10 years ago | (#8873731)

I'm probably going to ruin my karma, but that was flamebait!? What is with the mods? Computers have magnetic media inside of them and magnets can cause all sorts of problems with electronics that aren't properly protected. Once your hard drive has been erased and your computer's electronics have been raped by magnetic interference, then you can call the parent flamebait.

Re:*MAGNETIC* fans in my PC? (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 10 years ago | (#8873740)

Oh yeah, as opposed to the magnets in the present fans, how is this different? Idiot.

Re:*MAGNETIC* fans in my PC? (5, Funny)

T5 (308759) | about 10 years ago | (#8873761)

You! Back to physics class!

Exactly how did you think that an electric motor functions? The electrons don't line up all nice and pretty and start pushing the armature around and around. Their dizzying speed doesn't induce a partial vacuum that drags the armature around in its wake. No siree, Bob. They're enslaved to make a magnetic field that alternates attraction and repulsion against a set of fixed magnets.

Magnets! They're everywhere! Argh!

hm (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 10 years ago | (#8873621)

because magnets are a computer's best friend!

Hmm... (1)

Wingie (554272) | about 10 years ago | (#8873627)

As my next big idea, I think I'll put these magnet-driven motors in PCs too cool down hard drives. I mean, it's quiet and uses 80% less power than our normal fans!

Re:Hmm... (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 10 years ago | (#8873790)

Yeah, I'm dying to get all of my data really close to some magnets. That sound to good to be true! :)

Porcelain engine running on water (5, Funny)

wawannem (591061) | about 10 years ago | (#8873632)

Heh, This guy will soon end up in the oil company holding cell with the guy trying to make a porcelain engine that runs on water.

Porcelain engine running on water (5, Funny)

AtariAmarok (451306) | about 10 years ago | (#8873701)

Heh, This guy will soon end up in the oil company holding cell with the guy trying to make a porcelain engine that runs on water ...down the hall from the vault containing the Skynet microchips from the future, all those Tesla inventions that the government has been sitting on, alien car motors from Roswell, turbines that run on Orgone energy, and real working cold fusion.

By the way, the porcelain engine with water? I've got one in my bathroom. It turns on when you flip a metal lever.

Re:Porcelain engine running on water (-1, Troll)

Deflagro (187160) | about 10 years ago | (#8873776)

Can you prove that stuff doesn't exist and that the government is great and noble? No? Then your assumption is just as asinine as the parent's. Please don't fight ignorance with ignorance, it's so petty.

Although that porcelain thing was pretty good.

Re:Porcelain engine running on water (1)

AtariAmarok (451306) | about 10 years ago | (#8873825)

Can you prove that stuff doesn't exist

Yes, along with nessie and Bigfoot and Elvis who dines at Burger King. Also, if you go to the Smithsonian vaults, you will find The One Ring, The Lost Ark, and Thor's Hammer.

and that the government is great and noble? No?

No. It does not logically follow that mocking hoaxes means that the government is great and noble.

The question is... (2, Interesting)

cnelzie (451984) | about 10 years ago | (#8873633)

...can this be ramped up to larger scale? Like automotive motors.

How long do these magnets last?

Man! (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 10 years ago | (#8873634)

If only I had one of these in my car...

Just to be clear.. (5, Informative)

TechyImmigrant (175943) | about 10 years ago | (#8873637)

"9.144 volts and 192mA output. 1.8 x 0.15 x 2 = 540mW input and 9.144 x 0.192 = 1.755W out. "

So there's nothing real to be seen here. Move on.

Re:Just to be clear.. (2)

Omnifarious (11933) | about 10 years ago | (#8873805)

Yeah, when you discover it violates the laws of thermodynamics, you can safely ignore it because it doesn't really exist. :-)

Re:Just to be clear.. (4, Insightful)

The Raven (30575) | about 10 years ago | (#8873838)

Absurd claims are the hallmark of junk science. Impressive though that this guy managed to dupe people long enough to sell many thousand units.

I'm curious if the motor IS better than usual, just not to the extent claimed, or if it's ALL hoax. I cannot get to the site myself... japan.com surrendered to the /. nuke.

Practical applications... (2, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | about 10 years ago | (#8873641)

Quiet vibrators..

Conversely... (1)

bigattichouse (527527) | about 10 years ago | (#8873650)

I wonder if the motor can be used to generate more electricity for a given amount of input... hmm, or would it create a small current for a LOT of movement.... hmm.

Re:Conversely... (4, Insightful)

M.C. Hampster (541262) | about 10 years ago | (#8873742)


Amazingly enough, if you had read the article before posting, you might have gotten your answer:

With the help of magnetic propulsion, it is feasible to attach a generator to the motor and produce more electric power than was put into the device.

That alone makes it sound fishy to me, but IANAP.

Re:Conversely... (4, Informative)

br0ck (237309) | about 10 years ago | (#8873804)

The next few sentences after the one you posted cast even more doubt on the claim:

Minato says that average efficiency on his motors is about 330 percent.

Mention of Over Unity devices in many scientific circles will draw icy skepticism. But if you can accept the idea that Minato's device is able to create motion and torque through its unique, sustainable permanent magnet propulsion system, then it makes sense that he is able to get more out of the unit than he puts in in terms of elctrical power. Indeed, if the device can produce a surplus of power for longer periods, every household in the land will want one.

Not for PCs (2, Insightful)

Ye Olde Trolle (771612) | about 10 years ago | (#8873652)

There are already fans that have no moving parts, but they're not used to cool PCs because of problems caused by electromagnetism and cost. I don't see how this thing would be any different as far as PCs are concerned (considering most of the noise from my fans is due to their lack of balance due to dust and manufacturing flaws).

Re:Not for PCs (1, Informative)

ThePlague (30616) | about 10 years ago | (#8873827)

A fan that has no moving parts isn't so much a fan as a piece of curvy metal sculpture.

Amazing idea (1, Informative)

ifreakshow (613584) | about 10 years ago | (#8873654)

This is perhaps one of the most amazing devices I have read about recently. If this turns out to be true it could revolutionize the amount of energy the world consumes. And if it scales electric cars may gain even more momentum. Below is the article text.

The Techno Maestro's Amazing Machine
Kohei Minato and the Japan Magnetic Fan Company

A maverick inventor's breakthrough electric motor uses permanent magnets to make power -- and has investors salivating

by John Dodd

NEW! -- See video of motors working.

When we first got the call from an excited colleague that he'd just seen the most amazing invention -- a magnetic motor that consumed almost no electricity -- we were so skeptical that we declined an invitation to go see it. If the technology was so good, we thought, how come they didn't have any customers yet?

We forgot about the invitation and the company until several months later, when our friend called again.

"OK," he said. "They've just sold 40,000 units to a major convenience store chain. Now will you see it?"

In Japan, no one pays for 40,000 convenience store cooling fans without being reasonably sure that they are going to work.

The maestro

The streets of east Shinjuku are littered with the tailings of the many small factories and workshops still located there -- hardly one's image of the headquarters of a world-class technology company. But this is where we are first greeted outside Kohei Minato's workshop by Nobue Minato, the wife of the inventor and co-director of the family firm.

The workshop itself is like a Hollywood set of an inventor's garage. Electrical machines, wires, measuring instruments and batteries are strewn everywhere. Along the diagram-covered walls are drill presses, racks of spare coils, Perspex plating and other paraphernalia. And seated in the back, head bowed in thought, is the 58-year-old techno maestro himself.

Minato is no newcomer to the limelight. In fact, he has been an entertainer for most of his life, making music and producing his daughter's singing career in the US. He posseses an oversized presence, with a booming voice and a long ponytail. In short, you can easily imagine him onstage or in a convertible cruising down the coast of California -- not hunched over a mass of wires and coils in Tokyo's cramped backstreets.

Joining us are a middle-aged banker and his entourage from Osaka and accounting and finance consultant Yukio Funai. The banker is doing a quick review for an investment, while the rest of us just want to see if Minato's magnetic motors really work. A prototype car air conditioner cooler sitting on a bench looks like it would fit into a Toyota Corolla and quickly catches our attention.

Seeing is believing

Nobue then takes us through the functions and operations of each of the machines, starting off with a simple explanation of the laws of magnetism and repulsion. She demonstrates the "Minato Wheel" by kicking a magnet-lined rotor into action with a magnetic wand.

Looking carefully at the rotor, we see that it has over 16 magnets embedded on a slant -- apparently to make Minato's machines work, the positioning and angle of the magnets is critical. After she kicks the wheel into life, it keeps spinning, proving at least that the design doesn't suffer from magnetic lockup.

She then moves us to the next device, a weighty machine connected to a tiny battery. Apparently the load on the machine is a 35kg rotor, which could easily be used in a washing machine. After she flicks the switch, the huge rotor spins at over 1,500 rpms effortlessly and silently. Meters show the power in and power out. Suddenly, a power source of 16 watt or so is driving a device that should be drawing at least 200 to 300 watts.

Nobue explains to us that this and all the other devices only use electrical power for the two electromagnetic stators at either side of each rotor, which are used to kick the rotor past its lockup point then on to the next arc of magnets. Apparently the angle and spacing of the magnets is such that once the rotor is moving, repulsion between the stators and the rotor poles keeps the rotor moving smoothly in a counterclockwise direction. Either way, it's impressive.

Next we move to a unit with its motor connected to a generator. What we see is striking. The meters showed an input to the stator electromagnets of approximately 1.8 volts and 150mA input, and from the generator, 9.144 volts and 192mA output. 1.8 x 0.15 x 2 = 540mW input and 9.144 x 0.192 = 1.755W out.

But according to the laws of physics, you can't get more out of a device than you put into it. We mention this to Kohei Minato while looking under the workbench to make sure there aren't any hidden wires.

Minato assures us that he hasn't transcended the laws of physics. The force supplying the unexplained extra power out is generated by the magnetic strength of the permanent magnets embedded in the rotor. "I'm simply harnessing one of the four fundamental forces of nature," he says.

Although we learned in school that magnets were always bipolar and so magnetically induced motion would always end in a locked state of equilibrium, Minato explains that he has fine-tuned the positioning of the magnets and the timing of pulses to the stators to the point where the repulsion between the rotor and the stator (the fixed outer magnetic ring) is transitory. This creates further motion -- rather than a lockup. (See the sidebar on page 41 for a full explanation).

Real products

Nobue Minato leads us to the two devices that might convince a potential investor that this is all for real.

First, she shows us the cooling fan prototype that is being manufactured for a convenience store chain's 14,000 outlets (3 fans per outlet). The unit looks almost identical to a Mitsubishi-manufactured fan unit next to it, which is the unit currently in wide use. In a test, the airflow from both units is about the same.

The other unit is the car air conditioning prototype that caught our eye as we came in. It's a prototype for Nippon Denso, Japan's largest manufacturer of car air conditioners. The unit is remarkably compact and has the same contours and size as a conventional unit. Minato's manufacturing skills are clearly improving.

The banker and his investment

Minato has good reason to complain about Japan's social and cultural uniformity. For years, people thought of him as an oddball for playing the piano for a living, and bankers and investors have avoided him because of his habit of claiming that he'd discovered a breakthrough technology all by himself -- without any formal training.

However, the Osaka banker stands up after the lecture and announces that before he goes, he will commit \100 million to the investment pool.

Minato turns to us and smiles. We brought him good luck, and this was his third investor in as many weeks to confirm an interest.

Bringing the tech to the table

With the audience gone, we ask Minato what he plans to do to commercialize the technology. His game plan is simple and clear, he says. He wants to retain control, and he wants to commercialize the technology in Japan first -- where he feels he can ensure that things get done right. Why doesn't he go directly to the US or China? His experiences in both countries, he suggests, have been less than successful. "The first stage is critical in terms of creating good products and refining the technology. I don't want to be busy with legal challenges and IP theft while doing that."

Still, the export and licensing of the technology are on his agenda, and Minato is talking to a variety of potential partners in other countries.

Whereas another inventor might be tempted to outsource everything to a larger corporation, part of what drives Minato is his vision of social justice and responsibility. The 40,000 motors for the convenience store chain are being produced by a group of small manufacturers in Ohta-ku and Bunkyo-ku, in the inner north of Tokyo -- which is becoming a regional rust belt. Minato is seized with the vision of reinvigorating these small workshops that until the 80s were the bedrock of Japan's manufacturing and economic miracle. Their level of expertise will ensure that the quality of the motors will be as good as those from any major company.

International prep

Despite his plan to do things domestically first, Minato is well prepared for the international markets. He is armed with both six years of living and doing business in Los Angeles in the early 90s -- and with patent protection for over 48 countries. His is hardly a provincial perspective.

His US experience came after playing the piano for a living for 15 years. He began tinkering with his invention in the mid-70s. The idea for his magnetic motor design came from a burst of inspiration while playing the piano.

But Minato decided to drop everything in 1990 to help his daughter Hiroko, who at the age of 20 decided that she wanted to be a rhythm and blues star in the US. Minato is a strong believer in family: If Hiroko was going to find fame and fortune in the US, Dad had better be there to help manage her. He suceeded in helping Hiroko to achieve a UK dance chart number one hit in 1995.

In 1996 Minato returned to Japan and his magnetic motor project. The following year he displayed his prototypes to national power companies, government officials and others at a five-day conference in Mexico City. Interest was palpable, and Minato realized that his invention might meet a global need for energy-saving devices.

Subsequent previews and speeches in Korea and Singapore further consolidated his commitment to bringing the invention to fruition, and he was able to bring in several early-stage investors.

During the late 90s, Minato continued to refine his prototypes. He also stayed in constant contact with his lawyer, registering patents in major countries around the world. Through his experiences in the US he realized that legal protection was critical, even if it meant delaying release of the technology by a couple of years.

Ironically, by the time he'd won patents in 47 countries, the Japanese patent office turned him down on the grounds that "[the invention] couldn' t possibly work" and that somehow he was fabricating the claims.

But a few months later they were forced to recant their decision after the US patent office recognized his invention and gave him the first of two patents. As Minato notes: "How typical of Japan's small-minded bureaucrats that they needed the leadership of the US to accept that my invention was genuine."

By 2001, the Minatos had refined their motors and met enough potential investors to enter into a major international relationship, initially with a Saudi company, to be followed thereafter by companies in the US and elsewhere.

However, fate dealt the investors and Minato's business a serious blow when the World Trade Center was attacked in New York. The Saudis retreated, and Minato's plans fell back to square one.

Now Minato is once again ready to move. With the first order in the works and more orders pending successful prototypes, he has decided that investors don't have to be primary partners. He is actively accepting inquiries from corporate investors who can bring strategic advantages and corporate credibility with them. His company, Japan Magnetic Fan, will make a series of investment tie-up announcements in the first and second quarters of 2004.

Implications

Minato's motors consume just 20 percent or less of the power of conventional motors with the same torque and horse power. They run cool to the touch and produce almost no acoustic or electrical noise. They are significantly safer and cheaper (in terms of power consumed), and they are sounder environmentally.

The implications are enormous. In the US alone, almost 55 percent of the nation's electricity is consumed by electric motors. While most factory operators buy the cheapest motors possible, they are steadily being educated by bodies like NEMA (National Electrical Manufacturers Association) that the costs of running a motor over a typical 20-year lifespan comprise a purchase price of just 3 percent of the total, and electricity costs of 97 percent. It is not unusual for a $2,000 motor to consume $80,000 of electricity (at a price of .06 cents per kilowatt hour).

Since 1992, when efficiency legislation was put into place at the US federal level, motor efficiency has been a high priority -- and motors saving 20 percent or so on electrical bills are considered highly efficient. Minato is about to introduce a motor which saves 80 percent, putting it into an entirely new class: The $80,000 running cost will drop to just $16,000. This is a significant savings when multiplied by the millions of motors used throughout the USA and Japan -- and eventually, throughout the world.

The devices

Minato's invention and its ability to use remarkably less power and run without heat or noise make it perfect for home appliances, personal computers, cellphones (a miniature generator is in the works) and other consumer products.

The magnetic motor will be cheaper than a standard motor to make, as the rotor and stator assemblies can be set into plastic housings, due to the fact that the system creates very little heat. Further, with the motor's energy efficiency, it will be well suited for any application where a motor has limited energy to drive it. While development is still focused on replacing existing devices, Minato says that his motor has sufficient torque to power a vehicle.

With the help of magnetic propulsion, it is feasible to attach a generator to the motor and produce more electric power than was put into the device. Minato says that average efficiency on his motors is about 330 percent.

Mention of Over Unity devices in many scientific circles will draw icy skepticism. But if you can accept the idea that Minato's device is able to create motion and torque through its unique, sustainable permanent magnet propulsion system, then it makes sense that he is able to get more out of the unit than he puts in in terms of elctrical power. Indeed, if the device can produce a surplus of power for longer periods, every household in the land will want one.

"I am not in this for the money," Minato says. "I have done well in my musical career, but I want to make a contribution to society -- helping the backstreet manufacturers here in Japan and elsewhere. I want to reverse the trends caused by major multinationals. There is a place for corporations. But as the oil industry has taught us, energy is one area where a breakthrough invention like this cannot be trusted to large companies."

Minato was once close to making a deal with Enron. But today, he is firmly on a mission to support the small and the independent -- and to go worldwide with them and his amazing machine. "Our plan is to rally smaller companies and pool their talent, and to one day produce the technology across a wide range of fields."

Re:Amazing idea (1)

freeJustin (751573) | about 10 years ago | (#8873824)

I agree with this, WHAT THE HELL ARE PEOPLE TALKING ABOUT THERE COMPUTERS FOR. This is much bigger then (can I put this thing in my case). The only downside to the motor is its life span, because it has permanent magnets in the rotor all of that polar switching is going to burn out the motor much quicker than traditional motors, where the magnets don't move.

Re:Amazing idea (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 10 years ago | (#8873842)

And if it scales electric cars may gain even more momentum

HO HO

Help needed (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | about 10 years ago | (#8873655)

Hello,

I would like to move to an European country and not work for a living (ie: live off wealthfare). Where should I go?

Thanks in advance

Re:Help needed (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 10 years ago | (#8873697)

England. No wait, France. No, Germany. No,....well, any of them. They are all a bunch of lazy bums anyway.

Re:Help needed (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 10 years ago | (#8873700)

Montreal or Cuba.

Re:Help needed (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 10 years ago | (#8873722)

Idiot, he said Eurpope, not South America.

Re:Help needed (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 10 years ago | (#8873743)

Gee...Thanks. Asscork.

Re:Help needed (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 10 years ago | (#8873797)

Idiot, Cuba is in North America.

Re:Help needed (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 10 years ago | (#8873702)

Northern Europe, maybe Sweden or Finland.

Summary is wrong (4, Insightful)

theLOUDroom (556455) | about 10 years ago | (#8873656)

Hopefully soon the design will make it in to your home PC, allowing them to run much quieter."

The noise in your pc is caused by air turbulence caused by the fan blades. Even if the motors inside your fans were 100% efficient, your computer would not be significantly quieter.

I NEED MY LITHIUM!!!! (2, Funny)

grub (11606) | about 10 years ago | (#8873657)


Only 20% of the power of a conventional motor? The next glaringly obvious step is to figure out a way to make CPUs out of these motors. Rather than GHz, they would be rated on RPMs. Dell will market them as the "Magnetron". These next generation computers will never randomly fall from desks as the gyroscopic effect of the motorized CPU will keep it firmand will as its own fan! The Intel 9600 RPM Gyrotron TFB (Titanium Fan Blades) and the budget Intel 5400 RPM Cyclotron CPS (Cheap Plastic Shit)

BAhahaah!@!@@ I'm a frickin' genius! I'll be a trillionaire and all you slackers will still be reading /. at your JOBS!!~!~~one@@1!~two

Big Oil (2, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | about 10 years ago | (#8873658)

The oil companies will hunt this man down, steal his patents, then dump his dismembered corpse into the ocean.

Yeah (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 10 years ago | (#8873661)

but does it run linux?

Oh good, magnets! (-1, Redundant)

Tofino (628530) | about 10 years ago | (#8873664)

Hopefully soon the design will make it in to your home PC, allowing them to run much quieter

Yes, there's nothing better for your CPU and magnetic storage media than putting more magnets in your PC case!

Re:Oh good, magnets! (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 10 years ago | (#8873758)

I see you don't know how motors work...

Re:Oh good, magnets! (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 10 years ago | (#8873792)

Yes, there's nothing better for your CPU and magnetic storage media than putting more magnets in your PC case!

Then do not use magnetic storage! Use Paper [slashdot.org]!

threat to national security (4, Funny)

SQLz (564901) | about 10 years ago | (#8873668)

Magnet power cars are a threat to national security.

Oh my goodness! (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 10 years ago | (#8873853)

That has to be the dumbest thing that I have read all day.

Definitely a violation (5, Insightful)

QuantumFTL (197300) | about 10 years ago | (#8873676)

This is probably already redudant, however the article says
" Minato says that average efficiency on his motors is about 330 percent. "
That's definitely violating thermodynamics. I do not understand how this is "news for nerds", however at least the editors should please put some kind of disclaimer that he is in fact claiming to break conservation of energy.

Cheers,
Justin

Possibly not... (1, Interesting)

Svartalf (2997) | about 10 years ago | (#8873814)

Remember the laws in question only apply to closed system. Is his design a closed system? Like you said, there's conservation of energy- it can neither be created nor destroyed. It can only be converted from one form or another. It's a known fact that within a single cubic centimeter of volume resides sufficient instantaneous energy to condense out the entire rest-mass of the solar system and then some.

While I am not saying that he's tapping that energy, what is to say that he isn't?

You've got an interesting anomaly going on there with his engine- time to go find a new model for physics that jives with what we already know AND Minato's gaget.

Cost of Motor? (1)

pararox (706523) | about 10 years ago | (#8873677)

Does anyone have an account of what this motor would cost the average consumer?

Re:Cost of Motor? (1)

ifreakshow (613584) | about 10 years ago | (#8873712)

The article states that they are putting this into house fans. I'm guessing not much since they hardly use enough power to justify investing in expensive but more effecient equipment

the truth will set you free (3, Insightful)

foosballhound (769065) | about 10 years ago | (#8873680)

question: wouldn't the magnets de-magnitize after a while? isn't that what physics would predict? good business opportunity tho. exchange the cost of electricity for the cost of buying a new motor, when the magnets stop working any physicists out there who can comment?

Right next to the disk drive... (0, Redundant)

revtom (579849) | about 10 years ago | (#8873681)

Hopefully soon the design will make it in to your home PC, allowing them to run much quieter.

Yup. Magnets right next to the disk drive. That's smart!

Re:Right next to the disk drive... (5, Informative)

raygundan (16760) | about 10 years ago | (#8873819)

Is everybody here retarded? What did you think made your existing fan motors spin, Space Pixies? No, it's a freaking electromagnetic motor. Every single one of them. And there's that PC speaker up front with a big magnetic coil on the back that beeps everytime you turn your PC on, too.

I though you were supposed to be nerds.

Re:Right next to the disk drive... (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 10 years ago | (#8873850)

Yup. Magnets right next to the disk drive. That's smart!

uggghhh.

there are magnets IN your disk drive motor, moron.

moreover, there are magnets in brushless DC fan motors, very strong magnets in fact. go ahead, take apart a dead PC fan you have lying around -- prove me wrong.

as for the subject article, i think we'll just let the educated Slashdot community dispell any notions that the "inventor" has suddenly found free energy.

-- AC and proud of it.

Too Good to be true? (0, Insightful)

NETHED (258016) | about 10 years ago | (#8873684)

Is this too good to be true? For such a simple idea, it makes me wonder why hasn't anyone thought of this before. I would like to see some more information on it. I really hope this is true, as we could use these in cars, or even ceiling fans to reduce energy use.

Re:Too Good to be true? (1)

ziggy_zero (462010) | about 10 years ago | (#8873799)

Bah. I thought of this when I was 8 years old and playing with one of those make-your-own hand crank generator things to light up a light bulb. Unfortunately, it breaks the convervation of energy so it doesn't.....really work.

Impressive (1, Insightful)

purduephotog (218304) | about 10 years ago | (#8873689)

16 watts driving a 35 kg load. Thats the equivelent of a couple of C cells driving a golfcart around.

IFF this can be verified (beyond the orders) and is not so prone to failure as to preclude it being used on a massive scale, we are talking about a revolution in available power reduction.

I'm impressed :)

Umm this is not new... (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 10 years ago | (#8873692)

what he has described is refered to as a brushless motor.

quiter.
more power efficient.
cool to the touch.

yup, brushless.

WTF? Magnetism isn't new (1)

scythian (46974) | about 10 years ago | (#8873694)

No way? Rotor, stator, brush, AC / DC ... wow, such new terms.

Who gave this clown airtime?

cOOL (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 10 years ago | (#8873695)

I think we should all tank this guy. It shows that there is still more to be invented and discovered. He deserves all our respect when we have 17,000 rpm fans that run at 7 db

Japan /dotted (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 10 years ago | (#8873703)

samurai army approaching

I'm looking at the pictures.... (3, Funny)

idontgno (624372) | about 10 years ago | (#8873710)

I'm trying to figure out how strong your cooler mounts will have to be in order to support about a cubic meter of "high-efficency motor." It's hard to judge, but it looks like about 20 or 30 Kg of motor to me.

It'll need a big case, in any event.

Energy saving fans? (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 10 years ago | (#8873713)

who woulda thunk that one of the four basic forces of nature would save us energy,

too bad i can't look at the site as its already been Nuked by /.

Bullshit is this weeks magic word (5, Insightful)

Ckwop (707653) | about 10 years ago | (#8873715)

"Mention of Over Unity devices in many scientific circles will draw icy skepticism."

Hmm.. Simple reason why. If you supply power to the motor using a carnot engine
and use the power from the motor to drive a carnot refrigator.
Then there will be an overall flow of heat from cold to hot..
Breaking the second law of thermodynamics..

Bullshit is word of the week.

Simon.

If you (3, Informative)

ColaMan (37550) | about 10 years ago | (#8873719)

Search for "over unity motor" on google , you'll find a heap of these.

I always get suspicious when those sites say, "and my motor/generator at full load begins to get cold"

damnit! (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 10 years ago | (#8873720)

Don't you hate it when someone makes something you thought of a long time ago but did nothing about? I'm such a lazy idiot.

"Everyone who has ever taken a shower has had an idea. It's the person who gets out of the shower, dries off, and does something about it that makes a difference."
- Nolan Bushnell

Slashdotted or... (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 10 years ago | (#8873728)

Is Japan.com Slashdotted or have the Black Helicopters already done their work? ;)

A magnetic fan to "cool" your computer, Hah (0, Redundant)

cylcyl (144755) | about 10 years ago | (#8873732)

Sounds more like a plan to format my hard disk to me!

Good to see the Japanese are still innovating (0, Offtopic)

Exmet Paff Daxx (535601) | about 10 years ago | (#8873739)

You have to wonder, though, what this has to do with tying up women and making their eyes really big.

I've seen it (2, Interesting)

Bobdoer (727516) | about 10 years ago | (#8873745)

I saw a similar effect on one of my brother's contraptions. Essentially, it was a roller skate wheel that had powerful magnets embedded in it. When it was spun, the magnetic field would act on a spool of wire underneath and create a charge that went into a capacitor. When tinkering with the thing, I found that one could take a magnet and place it a small ways away and that magnet would repel the other magnets on the wheel, making the thing spin longer for the same amount of energy. Later, my brother's acquaintance found a similar effect by placing the magnet on the bar that held the wheel up. I'm guessing that the process is more similar to the latter than the former.
As all of these sorts of posts are appended IANAP, so I could be wrong.

Re:I've seen it (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 10 years ago | (#8873835)

anytime you see a story with magnets and energy claims be very doubtful of the claims. Magnets will do exactly what you describe. 99.9% of all people fail to realize the energy used to make the magnet far exceeds the energy savings that the magnet will provide as magnet DO WEAR OUT!!! This is nothing more than a different take on a timeless scam.

Magnetic Fan (2, Funny)

GSPride (763993) | about 10 years ago | (#8873748)

Not for nothing, but if this thing realy uses magnets of any power, it's the last thing I'd want in my computer.

I call BS (1)

Veramocor (262800) | about 10 years ago | (#8873757)

I call BS.

I Haven't read the article due to slashoting but whenever someone says they are using the stored energy in magnets to improve the efficiency of a motor I don't believe it. I've heard the same thing before for perpetual motion machines. At least this guy didn't say it was 100% efficient.

100 MPG Engine? If only we had Slashdot! (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 10 years ago | (#8873762)

See...if we had Slashdot when the 100 miles per gallon engine was invented, we'd all know about it and it couldn't be hidden. Now that we all know about this it can't be turned into an urban legend...only bought and shelved.

When will "kill" be implemented in slashcode? (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | about 10 years ago | (#8873771)

You know, "kill" this stupid-ass post so I don't see it anymore, "kill" anything by this stupid-ass commentator, etc.

Measurement error or fraud? (5, Interesting)

Spamalamadingdong (323207) | about 10 years ago | (#8873773)

I could probably make a device that could take 16 watts in and generate 300 volt-amperes (AC) out - but the volt-amperes would be almost 90 degrees out of phase, and the power factor would be less than 5%. The real power out of the device would be substantially less than 16 watts. There is no way in physics to have more than 1 watt out per watt in, "magical magnets" or no. If the device was extracting energy from the magnets, they would be depleted and the device would run down after a while. That's 2nd semester physics, basic E&M.

Either the proponents of this device are complete incompetents, or they are complete frauds. I'm inclined to believe the latter, as incompetents tend not to have the sales skills evident in the article [japan.com]

Smells like "Scam Spirit" (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 10 years ago | (#8873784)

Sounds like the old "perpetual motion" or "high bandwidth over the powerlines" scam. That's "elusive holy grail" to you believers.

KEEP YOUR HAND ON YOUR WALLET !!!!

He seems to think small. (1)

jellomizer (103300) | about 10 years ago | (#8873785)

Using these to replace many of today electric motors. What about hibrid cars? This could greatly improve the fuel effeciancy of them. Or perhaps the electric car can be a reality. With Quick Charge Batterys [slashdot.org] the low electrical energy electric motor. Perhaps we can start using Oil as a lubercant now.

It was done with water first. (1)

GarbanzoBean (695162) | about 10 years ago | (#8873810)

You see, I just pump the water up the tower and harness the energy of the gravity to drive the water down over the wheel that pump the water back up to the tower. I also connected a power generator to the wheel. Ahh, the tricks people do to bypass the laws of thermodynamics.

In Soviet russia, you don't generate power, power generates you.

I read about this in the 70s (1)

repetty (260322) | about 10 years ago | (#8873840)

I read about this in the 70s, when I was in high school.

Back then, a writer referred to it as a kind of Wankel rotary electric motor and I'm pretty sure the "inventor" was an American. Could be wrong about that.

At any rate, this Slashdot topic is late by about 30 years.

--Richard

Oblig Simpsons (1)

da3dAlus (20553) | about 10 years ago | (#8873845)

"It uses magnetism to perpetuate the motor motion."

Are they implying Perpetual Motion?

Homer: "Listen, in this house we obey the laws of thermodynamics!"

The specification good! (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 10 years ago | (#8873847)

The specification is good!
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