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Gnome 0.99.8 released

CmdrTaco posted more than 15 years ago | from the stuff-to-download dept.

GNOME 94

Sam Vilain writes "Just announced on the GNOME mailing list is GNOME 0.99.8, the "Still Conspicuously Skillful Cow" release. Check out This page for a list of ways to get it and for ftp mirror sites etc. Miguel has obviously been taking lessons from Linus about pre-releases. "

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Yeah? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#2014531)

So where is it? The last news item on gnome.org is from the 12th.

www.gnome.org doesn't mention it. (1)

F.O.Dobbs (17317) | more than 15 years ago | (#2014532)

Nothing on the webpage about 0.99.8 yet, but I am glad they finally updated the RH installation documentation.

it doesn't seem to be on the mirrors yet either (1)

F.O.Dobbs (17317) | more than 15 years ago | (#2014533)

ftp.gnome.org is hammered, the mirrors only have .99.7.
I'm ready to download it, why can't I have it?

Good going Rob (1)

gavinhall (33) | more than 15 years ago | (#2014534)

Posted by OGL:

Even though it's sure to cause tons of pointless flamewars, I'd prefer for Slashdot to keep reporting on each new release of GNOME and KDE, because I run them both and I need to be on the millisecond-bleeding-edge.

-W.W.

Is Rhad pushing for 1.0 for RH6.0 too hard? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#2014535)

I like the whole idea behind gnome, and I admire what the programmers are doing, but I can't help but think that Rhad is pushing it a little too hard to get it into RH6.0

Lurking on the Debian devel list over the weekend, you could see a lot of frustration being vented in there with all the crazy versioning and sonames going on.

getting warmer (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#2014536)

I wonder if someone is going to regret that jump from 0.30 to 0.99 They must be taken version number lessons from Sun. I predict GNOME version 12.0 sometime next week ;)

Where is 0.99.8 (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#2014537)

Try ftp://ftp.geo.net/pub/gnome/sources/gnome-0.99.8pr e1/

Pre1... Looks like its getting close.

Gnome Users (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#2014538)

Q: How did the gnome user break his arm raking leaves?


A: He fell out of the CVS tree!

HAHAHAHAHAHA

I'll stop using KDE... (1)

Hamhead (7565) | more than 15 years ago | (#2014539)

...when GNOME with Enlightenment allows me to minimize windows without losing them forever

I swear, I'm so tired of minimizing a Netscape window, and losing it so badly that I have to go in with a "kill -9 " to kill Netscape -- just because there doesn't seem to be a way to unminimize any windows with Enlightenment + Gnome.

As always, if somebody has some obvious suggestion that I didn't pick up from what I once thought was an intuitive interface, please enlighten me.

Till then, it's KDE 1.1 all the way.

Mooooooooo! (0)

Anonymous Cow (6787) | more than 15 years ago | (#2014540)

Mooooooo! Moo. Moo, moo, mooooo. MMMMMMMOOOOOO! Er... yeah. It's been a long week. Yeah, I know, it's only Monday. Kinda sucks when you have class from 8:00 AM to 4:00 PM and then other stuff (including an exam) from 5 to 10. Ack. MUST HAVE FREE TIME! OK, sorry, the voices in my head have calmed down now. I'll be OK. Really. Maybe. Bingo, Bingo the clown-o! Yeah, maybe I am Bingo. I am. I AM!
Next please.

I'll stop using KDE... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#2014541)

Try using the gnome pager applet. Of course this assumes your running the panel of course. Run e-conf, play with the settings, there is even a toggle switch so minimized windows have/havenot an icon. Dont want those huge icons? run the gnome pager, its wonderful, i dont know how i lived without it for so long.

Ravette.

Yawn. (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#2014542)

This is news? Maybe someone should setup a bot to email Slashdot about KDE's daily snapshots. Sheesh.

Good going Rob (1)

Onnix13 (17856) | more than 15 years ago | (#2014543)

Maybe people should just learn to not flame Gnome or KDE and be happy with having both of them in the linux community.. that is.. also an option, which is sorely overlooked.

TigerT (1)

sigsegv (90) | more than 15 years ago | (#2014544)

i've gotta say, tigert does a great job with the icons. they're all really excellent.

sig

icons dont appear default (1)

Onnix13 (17856) | more than 15 years ago | (#2014545)

Ok.. when you minimize, the icons dont appear by default.. they do not just disappear to nowhere.. you have to get e-conf and have it make an icon by default when you minimize

getting warmer (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#2014546)

Linux did the same thing. Jump from something like 0.3 to 0.9. I know those numbers are wrong but I do know it was a big jump. would someone please correct me.

Maybe they should number it in weeks i.e. name 1999 week 6

getting warmer (1)

crs (163343) | more than 15 years ago | (#2014547)

Somebody should write a paper (white or otherwise) about version numbers. The only reason you use version numbers in the first place is to provide more information. Most important is whether there are changes that break compatability, but also the stability of the code and to just note when changes occur, so you don't have to look at the date.

I see the weirdest fscking numbers (and letters) at freshmeat, and .99 seems to be peculiarly popular, like everyone is caught in some time sink hole that hovers at 1.00.

Fess up! If it sucks, tell us, and name it accordingly -- .01alpha_sucko.tar.gz

chris

Try looking through your menus (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#2014548)

Gnome Pager applet. Requires a gnome-compliant WM, such as enlightenment.

Its funny, the things I see people complaining about sometimes...

The solution is simple... (1)

sterwill (972) | more than 15 years ago | (#2014549)

Don't use Enlightenment, but use a functional, fast window manager like Window Maker [windowmaker.org] .

Are some windows nonresizable yet? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#2014550)

I'm still using some of gnome .30 and I notice that nearly every window is resizable, except for maybe the imlib config thingy.

Sometimes it's appropriate for some things to have a smaller fixed window size, like say, a calculator, or a Real player.

Does .99 have this yet, or is _everything_ still resizable? I guess it's up to the application developer to determine whether a window should be resizable or not?

Understanding the numbers (1)

aheitner (3273) | more than 15 years ago | (#2014551)

Obviously, the one true way to version number is
.., i.e. 0.6.2 or 2.2.1

You start with 0.something.something to indicate an alpha, and start incrementing logically. However, you don't _know_ how many alphas you will have. Just as you may not have 9 revisions before the next minor (eg Linux 2.1.129-zillion), you may not have a full set of minors before the next major (Linux 1.3 to 2.0).

When doing an alpha, you typically jump to 0.99 to indicate you have a near-1.0 product, i.e. has all the core functionality, but needs to be thoroughly tested/polished. It all makes perfect sense.

repost, part of comment was munged (1)

aheitner (3273) | more than 15 years ago | (#2014552)

Obviously, the one true way to version number is
major.minor.revision, i.e. 0.6.2 or 2.2.1

You start with 0.something.something to indicate an alpha, and start incrementing logically. However, you don't _know_ how many alphas you will have. Just as you may not have 9 revisions before the next minor (eg Linux 2.1.129-zillion), you may not have a full set of minors before the next major (Linux 1.3 to 2.0).

When doing an alpha, you typically jump to 0.99 to indicate you have a near-1.0 product, i.e. has all the core functionality, but needs to be thoroughly tested/polished. It all makes perfect sense.

not on web page yet (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#2014553)

Well, rather than post replies to two messages, I'll hope that the posters of "not on web" comments read this. Since I'm not a core GNOME developer or a RHAD labs member, this is speculation, but think about this anyhoo.

CVS will probably always run ahead of web sites, in fact according to changelogs many of the modules have been at .99.8 for a few days already(~3-4). In addition, the gnome-gui news group recently recieved a post about remaking the web page, and asking for aestetic tips. Granted Red Hat should be a bit ore tactful about updating their web page, much of the content recieved on Slashdot is BLEEDING edge; linux web pages tend to be CUTTING edge. I haven't seen to many complaints/whines that www.linuxhq.com is often a day or two behind about kernel releases.
So cut them some slack, we may be computer programmers(largely), but we're not computers. They are, at least, actively developing a very cool session manager, and if you can get daily snaps of it from ftp, who cares what the http site says?

-laMedUck

Speaking of "I'll start using enlightenment when.. (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#2014554)

Why is it that I can't ever find out how
to scroll off the edge of one virtual root window
onto another seamlessly in enlightenment or
windowmaker? I use afterstep solely because I
like moving my mouse off the edge of the screen
and hitting another virtual root window. Am I
missing something? Can enlightenment or window
maker do this?

I'll stop using KDE... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#2014555)

If you're using Enlightenment, add a GNOME Pager applet to the panel. Problem solved.

RE: I'll stop using KDE... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#2014556)

Have you tried Enlightenment recently? The Iconization code went through a major debugging phase about a week ago. I haven't grabbed an E snap in a while(I use what works, so sue me :-P), but I haven't experienced your problem ever.

-lamEduck

Gnome and KDE (1)

PDG (100516) | more than 15 years ago | (#2014557)

Ok, I'm a KDE guy, I have it, I like it, it works, end of story. But who can tell me how to use WindowMaker with it. I love KDE's fm and panel, but I love WindowMaker(the only reason I'd hop to Gnome).

Any help?


PDG--"I don't like the Prozac, the Prozac likes me"

Speaking of "I'll start using enlightenment when.. (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#2014559)

This may be more of a question for raster or mandrake, but the way I unterstand it Enlightenment does not keep track of root windows the same way other window manager do. The current E Way(tm) seems to indicate that if this feature were to be implemented you'd be able to change windows by dragging the mouse to either the top or bottom, but not the sides.
I don't know how high up this feature this is on raster's list, but you may want to email the E mailing list and see what the response is. I personally find this feature a pain, as it's not XBoing friendly ;-).

-lAmeducK

Agreed (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#2014560)

Both KDE and GNOME are huge projects for the linux community right now, as they seem to be critical for mainstream acceptance(assuming this is what we want). I love hearing news about both; even though I don't use KDE, I'm fairy finicky about my desktop and very open to change. If you want even more current information about GNOME, go to http://gdev.net [gdev.net] and start reading changelogs :-). Unfortunately I do not know of such a site for KDE, although one probably exists(any suggestions ppl?).

-lameDucK

Is Rhad pushing for 1.0 for RH6.0 too hard? --when (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#2014561)

Last I heard, some time in March.

-LameduCk

I don't get it (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#2014562)

CVS is a multi-developer versioning system (http://cvs.gnome.org [gnome.org] ). His joke was about how hard it is to compile the latest CVS version (sometimes). They usually call it "CVS tree", because its shaped similar to one. Its usually hard to compile because its whats being worked on currently (i.e. its newer than any tar/rpm). It can have numerous bugs and other nasties. The joke still doesn't make sense.. I always thought you stayed out of trees when raking.

Gnome and KDE (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#2014563)

Just start up wmaker instead of kwm and add the option : -no-KDE-compliant-window-manager to KPanel in startkde.

And it still rather crappy... (1)

Axe (11122) | more than 15 years ago | (#2014564)

... get KDE 1.1 and be happy ;)

It's called bandwidth (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#2014565)

And the Net is a little short on it.

soname brain damage! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#2014566)

From what I can tell, brain damage in sonames is directly proportional to RHAD-involvement. ;) gtk 1.1 just makes me sick. Won't they learn that shared libs are supposed to be binary compatible within a major version number?!

- RF (dfelker@cnu.edu)

Gnome and KDE (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#2014567)

And an easy way to do it is once you've compiled Windowmaker properly and have a working KDE install is to (as root)

cd /opt/kde/bin
cp startkde startwm

change the line in startwm which says kwm to wmaker

Then modify the line in your home directory which executes startkde to startwm.

I guess it would be easier to just edit startkde and change the kwm line to wmaker if you didn't have multiple accounts using kde...

and be a slave to a Troll... n/t (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#2014568)

- RF (dfelker@cnu.edu)

Gnome Users (1)

Fizgig (16368) | more than 15 years ago | (#2014569)

He fell out of the tree because they switched to cows instead of primates. Cows do not do well in trees.

GNOME (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#2014570)

Gnome + Windowmaker.
The ONLY way to go.
KDE is for MS refugees.
(Sure i like some of the kde apps, thats why i keep them in my menu.)

Flame me if you must but remember.. if you do your a MS Refugee.


gnome-gui newsgroup? Where? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#2014571)

news.gnome.org I think

The problem comes when.... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#2014572)

the contents of the window don't resize with the window. If a calculator app keeps its contents the same size when you resize the window, it's kinda silly for it to be resizeable.

Debian (1)

four (110907) | more than 15 years ago | (#2014573)

I would hate to be the person who maintains the .deb for gnome :)
its got to be a lame job keeping up with these guys

Screenshots (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#2014574)

Any screenshots of anything newer then 0.3x

GNOME (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#2014575)

If a new user of Linux feels more comfortable with the familiarity of the KDE desktop and as such continues to run Linux then we should all be happy. Irregardless of what WM a user chooses they are still using Linux, discovering its power and versatility.

A MS refugee is 1 less MS user.

I'll stop using KDE... (1)

elflord (9269) | more than 15 years ago | (#2014576)

AFAIK you can do this. At least I can with thew 0.99.7 release. Each window has an entry on the panel (or the taskbar or whatever), which stays there when you minimize the window. Just click on the appropriate part of the task bar to bring a minimized windows "back to life". You can also minimize by midclicking the spot on the taskpar.


-- Elflord

GNOME and KDE (1)

JamesHenstridge (14875) | more than 15 years ago | (#2014577)

A merger is not very likely as GNOME and KDE have different design internally. KDE is written in C++, and GNOME is written in C with language bindings in mind (ie almost all callbacks pass a user_data argument that makes language bindings much easier).

On the other hand, interoperability is much more likely (and desirable to both groups).

It won't work (1)

akintayo (17599) | more than 15 years ago | (#2014578)

We all enjoy flame wars, but your attempt lacks the subtlety needed to provoke one. I am sorry but you will have to make a less obvious attempt. Maybe remove the MS refugee slur, that makes the comment too obvious or you could include your email address to tempt us.

Gnome and KDE (1)

syntax (2932) | more than 15 years ago | (#2014579)

What you do:
a) recompile the latest Window Maker with KDE support (in the "./Install" script)
b) edit /opt/kde/bin/startkde (or where ever its located) and change the 'kwm' line to 'wmaker'
c) if its not already there, put '/opt/kde/bin/startkde' in your ~/.xinitrc (or whatever your distro uses, i remember old slackware didnt like having ~/.xinitrc)
d) startx and enjoy.

you MAY want to run WPref's and take out the redundant stuff that KDE and Window Maker will both have, and get each other visually out of each others hair (ie: where minimized icons are located)

Testing (1)

Iain Kyte (7043) | more than 15 years ago | (#2014580)

Test

CVS (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#2014581)

If you really want to be on the bleeding edge, try CVS...

you're full of shit (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#2014582)

try GNOME 0.99.8 with the marble3d gtk+ theme

god it looks so sweet...

It compiled! (1)

Scott (1049) | more than 15 years ago | (#2014583)

Oh my god, someone mark this date as the first time in history someone other than the core developers managed to get gnome-libs & gnome-core to compile.

I hate to say it, but even though E is being promoted as the standard gnome wm, it works much better and is much faster with icewm.

Gnome is a pain IMHO (1)

Psiren (6145) | more than 15 years ago | (#2014584)

I personally only want Gnome because there are a *few* apps that I'd quite like to try out. Until GNUstep comes to fruition I will hold off on the harmonised desktop thing. But the list of dependencies that Gnome has is quite staggering. I've never seen an installtion spew out so many libraries. And what happened when I finally got everything compiled? Virtually everything segfaulted. Not even the damn panel would run. It was probably something to do with the way i have my system setup I guess. Anyway, I'm gonna hold off for a while. Downloading all these libraries and compling them for nothing tends to piss me off. Ah well... such is life.

Thing to do before GNOME Pre-1.0 (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#2014585)

The gnome people need to update their documentation much much.... more better.
Try compare gnome-help to kde-help, you will see the different.

soname brain damage! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#2014586)

One advantage to everybody and their brother using gtk+ 1.1 is that that way all the bugs are hammered out sooner. So the 1.2 release should be pretty bugfree and stable.

Blictrix

TigerT (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#2014587)

I totally 100% agree.

Boy does it make a difference to have nice eye candy. It's great when things are stable, but hey, you can't "sell" a crappy-looking-but-functional desktop. You really need both.

Hooray for Tigert :)

AndyM

The breakdown's like this: (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#2014588)

This is AFAIK... hope it answers your question:
I run enlightenment and gnome at home. It's really cool IMHO (and I've tried EVERYTHING), anyway,

- In enlightenment, you have x "desktops", which can be of x "virtual screens" in size. The desktops are layered on top of each other, the "virtual screens" are in a matrix on each "layer"
- I set it up with 3 desktops, with 4 screens in each in a 2x2 matrix. You can however set it up any way you like. Each desktop can have a background image... so I have 3 background images.
- Like Afterstep, you don't scroll between desktops, just between "virtual screens"/pages.

Make sense? No? Think of it this way: In AS, "Mail" "Web" "Work" etc would be separate "desktops", and each page on those is a "virtual screen".

ATM, I run afterstep at work and enlightenment and gnome at home, but I reckon my home config is better, so I'm gonna "upgrade" my work box :)

It really is very good, and all gui-configured. The eye-candy in the configurator is wicked! The gnome-pager works a little differently to the afterstep one but the basic functionality is the same (it's more buggy though... seems to flicker, and sometimes crash if I push it, but it's getting stabler with every gnome release). It also unfortunately doesn't "label" each open application on the pager... just displays a shaded area thingie.

And if you move your mouse to the side of the "virtual screen" it jumps to the virtual screen next to it, like AS.

I mount the gnome-pager on a left-bottom, vertical corner panel, without "hidearrows" :)

Oh, by the way, transparent/tinted/shaded eterms with MENU_BORDER on are fscking great :)

The mini-commander is wicked as well. I just hope they can get "layering" into gnome, so that I can easily bring stuff to the top or bottom.

Cheers

AndyM

getting warmer (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#2014589)

"Linux did the same thing. Jump from something like 0.3 to 0.9"

Yes, but the difference is that Linus mentioned at some point why he did so. I think it was that
he was worried that people wouldn't be too accepting of software that was named .3x. Or something to that effect; I'm sure a net search would turn up what I'm talking about.

On the other hand, not to slam gnome or anything, but I agree that perhaps they rushed up to .99.x rather quickly. The argument that people wouldn't use it is moot, since there are hundreds of people hacking on gnome. Now you get to the situation that happened to the kernel when there were like 8 pre-2.2.0 releases. IMHO, if you have that many pre-releases, then you need another minor revision 1st...

soname brain damage! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#2014590)

Can you spell DEVELOPMENT VERSION? If you mind that kind of problems, don't use gtk 1.1, stick with the 1.0.x series. GTK follow the same versioning scheme that Linux does, you know...

GNOME (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#2014591)

Sorry dudes, I hate KDE vs GNOME flame wars... but that one _had_ to be a joke, It was way too funny. :D

I especially liked the end bit, "Flame me if you must but remember.. if you do your a MS Refugee."

hahahaha

I hope one day everyone can laugh about all this KDE vs GNOME crap and think "Why was I such a cock-jockey?"

AndyM

Sure! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#2014592)

So does KDE at the moment -- its a contest to see
who can hold out the urge to actually DO some
ACTUAL UI DESIGN for the longest.

p.s. I think that GNOME will easily win that one,
since those Dozified wimps runnning KDE are beginning to tire... :-)))

p.s. When the fsck will we get rid of X???

And it still rather crappy... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#2014593)

I just saw an mpg of a chick sucking a dick...

reminded me of kde

kde sucks dicks

yes this is a flame-bait/joke thang

Yawn. (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#2014594)

Here's an idea: ignore the news items you're not interested in, and move on to the next.

Kinda like a newspaper... you skip the items you're not interested in, and read the ones you are.

Is this difficult?

AndyM

Segfault - check linked libraries (1)

Psiren (6145) | more than 15 years ago | (#2014595)

Hmm.. you may be onto something there. I have just recently upgraded to glibc2, and have had a few problems. I'll check it out, thanks :)

Btw, my original statement still holds - there are far too many libraries installed by gnome. Its becoming bloated.

Using Both KDE and GNOME (1)

NikoDemous (8992) | more than 15 years ago | (#2014596)

My company uses and support both KDE and GNOME.
I personally will use a KDE environment with the GNOME-Calander and other GNOME applications. I've never had a problem with drag & drop between the two and the seem to play very nicely with each other...

Nick
LSG

Are some windows nonresizable yet? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#2014597)

The problem is that even the simple popup windows in gnome ARE (most of the time) resizable, and that shouldn't be.

The integrated desktop will not happen on unix (1)

Cassius (9481) | more than 15 years ago | (#2014598)

Sorry folks, but having an integrated desktop means havings every app conform to that desktop and use its toolkits to provide pervasive interface artifacts. Look at the Mac, for example.

Since neither KDE or GNOME is ever going to "win" and gain 100% dominance (because the biggest player - Redhat- is behind GNOME, and "everyone but Redhat" supports KDE as it actually works), you will never have apps outside of the "core apps" distributed with the toolkits.

At this point I don't see much for an experienced unix user who doesn't want to be popping excedrin all the time other than FVWM.

If you want an integrated desktop with unix (or just posix), you will have to look at places where this has been done from the ground up and is pervasive - Be or MacOSX.

The situation on linux is a mess and will become even more shameful as time goes on.

I'll stop using KDE... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#2014599)

If you installed from RPM in the default location, then edit the file:
/usr/share/enlightenment/control.cfg

Search for a line that says:
SHOW_ICONIZED_ICONS 0

and change it to:
SHOW_ICONIZED_ICONS 1

Problem solved.

I think that the default behaviop for minimized icons was changed to allow better integration into gnome when wsing the pager applet.

Regards
Kevin Reid

Methinks I smell some FUD... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#2014600)

...because I grab a CVS snapshot every three or four days, and none of the core packages have failed to compile for me in months.

Oh, and the original poster was right -- IceWM is *very* nice in conjunction with gnome.

I'll stop using KDE... (1)

Stiletto (12066) | more than 15 years ago | (#2014601)

Use Windowmaker. Problem solved.

gnome-gui newsgroup? Where? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#2014602)

The mailing lists are archived here. [gnome.org] Have fun!

-laMeDuck

So where is it? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#2014603)

ftp.gnome.org says it's busy, and none of
the mirrors have them. Anyone with a nice updated mirror somewhere???

The integrated desktop will not happen on unix (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#2014604)

The situation on linux is a mess and will become even more shameful as time goes on.

The point of getting a "standard" and "easy to use" interface is NOT to make an interface that is on every single Unix box. It is to further spread the OS to the less talented and dare I say it less technical users.

Should major vendors start porting software to Unix they will determine which interface ultimately wins out since they would like to minimize their work. Gnome has a minor advantage as it is fully supported by Red Hat which seems to be the darling of all the magazines at the moment and we all know the PHB doesn't make rational decisions, he reads magazines. Gnome also has the minor advantage of being 100% free with no strings attached which we all know gives Linux users a woody since they tend to like the idea of "free". Expect exponential growth.

Now you go ahead and stick with whatever you got, but the cheapest OS will have a good chance of winning. Pay attention to the next 5 years, and the DOJ case which is making it quite clear the MS has already lost. Enjoy the ride.

soname brain damage! (1)

ink (4325) | more than 15 years ago | (#2014605)

What? Like glibc 2.1?

At least gtk 1.1 is labeled as a development version.

The wheel is turning but the hamster is dead.

Or Wegmans (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#2014606)

So you must live in Buffalo or Syracuse or possibly even Ohio. Tops sucks doesn't it? Neither Tops or Wegmans exist in MA, NH, CO, IN, IL, or CA. Wierd eh? Just like Star Market and Stop and shop is only MA, and Kroger and Marsh is IN, and I forget the others.

whatyoumeanbythat? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#2014607)

"shameful?"

I tend to see the competition between GNOME and KDE is good for all. We don't need any winner, as long as programs om linux/unix works moderately good together. And such is the case with GNOME and KDE. I use 50/50 progs from the two systems (kppp and panel are both excellent programs)...
Works like a charm.
/Larry_h

Gnome and KDE (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#2014608)

One other thing ye'll want to do :

./configure --enable-single-app-icon

(or something .. type ./configure --help & it'll show you exactly what the option is called).

Then, when you go to, say, XEmacs or the K File Manager, right click on the titlebar and choose attributes .. from there, choose advanced options and put a check on 'enable app icon'.

This lets you dock apps which couldn't be docked before and lets you hide all the kfm windows at once.

It compiled! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#2014609)

I've been able to compile the last few releases, but only after much hacking and checking of mailing list archives.

Last time I downloaded it, it was an afternoon of hacking and staring at documentation to get the thing to run .. and the only things I actually use are Electric Eyes and the gnome-run applet.

The integrated desktop will not happen on unix (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#2014610)

Hmmmm ..

Well, on a regular basis I have the K file manager, the GIMP, Netscape, and X Emacs running simultaneously. All 4 use different GUI toolkits. But y'know what? Motif, QT, GTK, and Lucid all look pretty much the same. And (with a tiny bit of customization in KDE), the file open/save dialogs look pretty much the same and act pretty much the same in all four.

About as different as, say, the file open/save dialog in Office 97 and in WordPad.

What order should we compile these in? (1)

spboulet (6837) | more than 15 years ago | (#2014611)

What order should we compile these in?

soname brain damage! NO (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#2014612)

"But look at the www.gtk.org website, it even says what you have to _CHANGE_ to make your programs compile for the new version"

Duh! Considering that Gnome is ***also*** in development and not a release version, it follows that some adjustments might be required. And it may even crash. IT'S BETA! Why do all the clueless newbees miss this simple point

FVWM2.1.x + GNOME = faaast + themeable (1)

DP (11614) | more than 15 years ago | (#2014613)

FVWM and GNOME rock.
http://fvwm2gnome.fluid.cx/ - FVWM2GNOME site
http://fvwm.math.uh.edu/ get it. use it. be happy. ;)

getting warmer (1)

fizbin (2046) | more than 15 years ago | (#2014614)

And then there's the version numbering scheme of TeX and metafont, which just helps to point out the silliness of version numbers:

martind:~/public_html % tex -v
TeX (Web2C 7.2) 3.14159
...
martind:~/public_html % mf -v
Metafont (Web2C 7.2) 2.718
...

Yes, they're approaching $\pi$ and $e$, respectively, as specified in Knuth's original TeX book.

You wish :P (1)

BadlandZ (1725) | more than 15 years ago | (#2014615)

Remember when we got to kernel 2.1.99 and everyone thought 2.2.0 was next... hehehehe... Wait a couple weeks and watch the shock when they release Gnome v0.100.0 then v0.101.0 and everyone crys... :-) Just a thought.

Gnome is compile hell (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#2014616)

I finally managed to get gnome to compile and not segfault under Sparc Solaris 2.6 as of version 0.99.7. I'll be damned if I'm going to muck around with it again any time soon unless I'm getting paid.

Hey, I've buit every window manager under the sun. taken out all of the linux-isms so that they run on Solaris and other unices, and Here's my 2 cents on the window manager scene:

olwm: - lame, but consistent, speedy.
olvwm: - quite usable compared to olwm
CDE: - sort of like driving a 1985 caddie Limo -- slow, bulky, and slow
mwm: - if you have your menus configured, and are happy with an xterm as your interface, this is your wm
fvwm2: - maybe a little better than mwm for non-xterm loving users
fvwm95: - good for a laugh
qvwm: - looks like fvwm95, maybe good for another laugh
wm2 & wmx: - minimalists will love these
blackbox: - some people could really dig this. It's small, lite, fast, and has enough features for the avg user.
icewm: - this is the WM sleeper! It's fast, easy to use, easy to compile, attractive, and cool.
afterstep - aside from the fact that the development versions change the whole layout every few releases, it's worth another look. Much better as of recent versions. Stands a chance to be a major WM
WindowMaker: - when you get tired of playing around with compiling wms, you'll probably settle on this.
KDE: - easy to compile on just about any hardware. Stable enough to use. Lots of interesting apps. Many people like it.
GNOME: - will be quite nice when it's out of development. Currently, not stable enough to put on a production machine. Also, if you don't have a fast machine, you'll notice that GNOME is slow. Nice apps, shows promise.
flwm: - recent addition - sort of wacky, but nice and fast. It might develop a small cult following.
mlvwm: - just about useless, but cute
enlightenment: - the default theme is too wacky. With some other themes, can be very usable

So... I've compiled 'em all on linux, sparc and intel solaris, and I usually end up running WM, but I like apps from gnome and KDE. the problem with GNOME is that if you sneeze, your apps will coredump.

The problem comes when.... (1)

VinceJH (14059) | more than 15 years ago | (#2014617)

I just tried this for the calculator, and your right, it is resizable. Howver, using icewm, all dialog boxes that i can remember cannat be resized, and even a tetris game can't be resized (wish it could, its too big at 800x600).

GNOME has won yay! (1)

MattCorby (12464) | more than 15 years ago | (#2014618)

Yeah, i know it's flame bait, but listen... it's probably obvious that i like GNOME better, but that's beside the point and i won't even go into any technical aspects of them. The point is this: GNOME has more support than KDE, and people (hell even me) want to go with the desktop that will last. GNOME has the assurance of the GPL, it has the major distros like Redhat and Debian behind them, and by the number of GNOME apps coming out even though GNOME isn't even FINISHED yet and it's still buggy and hard to compile and not well documented, it looks like much more people are developing for GNOME now. Just take a look at freshmeat and count the number of new GNOME (or GTK+ which is already halfway to GNOME) apps vs. the number of new KDE apps. GNOME has won and KDE may not die but it'll never be big like GNOME will be. It doesn't matter who's better in this war.

Everything is just fine... (1)

Mark Evans (6036) | more than 15 years ago | (#2014619)

Neither KDE nor GNOME exclude the use of each others applications. They've adopted the same drag and drop protocol. And I believe that most viable window managers will eventually support hints from both kind toolkits (as WM already does). Furthermore, Gtk+ is themeable and KDE will be when Qt 2.0 is released. By the time KDE and GNOME have there next major revisions I'd bet you'll be able to select a theme (or two) that will make it hard to tell which apps are using which toolkit. You'll be able to tell, but the novice user wouldn't even notice.

As for consistency across the desktop, MS isn't consistent with its use of menus, shortcuts and mouse clicks across the Office applications, much less the set of applications that ship with Windows 9x/NT and from third party vendors. I know, your example was BeOS and Mac, but winning the hearts of MS users wouldn't be to shabby of a start.

Personally I'm glad there are several Open Source desktop/Window Manager projects (everyone seems to forget about GNUStep and tkDesk), diversity accelerates evolution.

BTW, DNRH (Debian's Not Red Hat - and they support GNOME).

What a lot of noise... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#2014620)

I've been using 0.99.3 since the day it was out.
Crashed my X server once, in a month of full throttle duty. Works fine. Love to see Raster
get E to _really_ comply. If you want somthing to to bitch about, boot your NT partition.

Look at the KDE CVS (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#2014621)

Most apps don't seem to announce on Freshmeat, there are quite a few new apps in CVS development. Also, these apps are of higher quality Gnome equivalents.

Gnome will always be a small project, KDE is already the big thing as far as users are concerned and likely to remain so,

MicroSoft idiot (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#2014622)

"It doesn't matter who's better in this war."

What a moron. This is Linux, not MS and it *does* matter who is better.

soname brain damage! NO (1)

Patrik Nordebo (170) | more than 15 years ago | (#2014623)

So who's going to stop them from calling the next stable version 2.0, if they want to? And how would using C++ have helped? If you need to redo the interface, you need to redo the interface, no matter what language it is in. Using C++ wouldn't have helped at all.

0.100.0!=1.0.0 (Rules different for major 1) (1)

cduffy (652) | more than 15 years ago | (#2014624)

The major 1 is the first fully stable release. Even if the minor is even prior to that point, it makes no difference.
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