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Apple Announces New Pro Software

michael posted more than 9 years ago | from the amateurs-need-not-apply dept.

Movies 479

yroJJory writes "Apparently, Apple has just announced new pro software today. First off is the new app Motion, which is a new motion graphics program with real-time previews, procedural behavior animation and Final Cut Pro HD integration. Second, is Final Cut Pro HD, boasting the beauty of HD with the simplicity of DV. Capture DVCPRO HD over FireWire, edit using camera-native footage and output over FireWire with no generational quality loss. RT Extreme, now for HD, can deliver multiple HD streams, effects, filters and transitions in real-time to an attached Apple Cinema Display. Last, but most important to me, is DVD Studio Pro 3, which has slick new transitions, superb HD to MPEG-2 encoding, Graphical View, support for all professional audio formats -- including DTS -- (FINALLY!!), and integration with Final Cut Pro HD and Motion. Motion will be available this summer for $299. The Final Cut Pro HD update is available now for FCP 4 users. DVD Studio Pro 3 is expected to ship in mid-May." Reader green pizza writes "Apple today introduced Xsan, a clustered filesystem for Mac OS X systems."

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#TEENS4CHRIST EXCITES EVERYTHING (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#8900489)

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Re:#TEENS4CHRIST EXCITES EVERYTHING (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#8900810)

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hand! (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#8900492)

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Your attempt is destroyed by T4C nt (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#8900497)

fsoidj

SOMEBODY PLEASE FUCK ME UP THE ASS! I'M DESPARATE (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#8900494)

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g_______________________________________________g_ _
o_/_____\_____________\____________/____\_______o_ _
a|_______|_____________\__________|______|______a_ _
t|_______`._____________|_________|_______:_____t_ _
s`________|_____________|________\|_______|_____s_ _
e_\_______|_/_______/__\\\___--___\\_______:____e_ _
x__\______\/____--~~__________~--__|_\_____|____x_ _
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s______/_/\|___C_____)_______|__(___>___/__\____s_ _
e_____|___(____C_____)\______/__//__/_/_____\___e_ _
x_____|____\__|_____\\_________//_(__/_______|__x_ _
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*_g_o_a_t_s_e_x_*_g_o_a_t_s_e_x_*_g_o_a_t_s_e_x_*_


Important Stuff: Please try to keep posts on topic. Try to reply to other people's comments instead of starting new threads. Read other people's messages before posting your own to avoid simply duplicating what has already been said. Use a clear subject that describes what your message is about. Offtopic, Inflammatory, Inappropriate, Illegal, or Offensive comments might be moderated. (You can read everything, even moderated posts, by adjusting your threshold on the User Preferences Page) If you want replies to your comments sent to you, consider logging in or creating an account.

Important Stuff: Please try to keep posts on topic. Try to reply to other people's comments instead of starting new threads. Read other people's messages before posting your own to avoid simply duplicating what has already been said. Use a clear subject that describes what your message is about. Offtopic, Inflammatory, Inappropriate, Illegal, or Offensive comments might be moderated. (You can read everything, even moderated posts, by adjusting your threshold on the User Preferences Page) If you want replies to your comments sent to you, consider logging in or creating an account.

Important Stuff: Please try to keep posts on topic. Try to reply to other people's comments instead of starting new threads. Read other people's messages before posting your own to avoid simply duplicating what has already been said. Use a clear subject that describes what your message is about. Offtopic, Inflammatory, Inappropriate, Illegal, or Offensive comments might be moderated. (You can read everything, even moderated posts, by adjusting your threshold on the User Preferences Page) If you want replies to your comments sent to you, consider logging in or creating an account.

Re:SOMEBODY PLEASE FUCK ME UP THE ASS! I'M DESPARA (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#8900510)

Looks like an Apple user after they pay for these upgrades.

Re:SOMEBODY PLEASE FUCK ME UP THE ASS! I'M DESPARA (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#8900546)

Congratulations! You found the correct Slashdot section to post your request in. Any Mac luser feeling particularly homosexual and lonely tonight, who can help this poor chap out?

We hate Apple! They're DMCA users! (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#8900500)

Oh, look, Apple's released something shiny!

Re:We hate Apple! They're DMCA users! (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#8900597)

Come now. Don't you realize that Slashdot is now part of Apple's advertising departiment?

Did they sell another TWELVE HUNDRED [slashdot.org] computers too? Phew. If they keep rolling out HUGE numbers like that, they might really go somewhere.

Amateur motion capture? (0, Interesting)

cubic6 (650758) | more than 9 years ago | (#8900506)

Maybe it's just my ignorance of film editing/making, but I was under the impression that motion capture was something done by pro animation studios or 3d modelers. Is it really easy enough now to be done with consumer hardware and software?

Re:Amateur motion capture? (4, Informative)

Spytap (143526) | more than 9 years ago | (#8900519)

Motion capture is completely different from motion graphics. And yes, Motion capture is too expensive to be done at the consumer level.

Not to be an ass, but this could have been cleared up by simply clicking the link in the article and reading the first sentence in the product description...

Re:Amateur motion capture? (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#8900621)

Not to be an ass

Too late!

Re:Amateur motion capture? (5, Informative)

arikol (728226) | more than 9 years ago | (#8900572)

Click the links first, functionality of the software is explained there. Motion capture needs points of reference on the target. Its also usually done in a high contrast environment (similar to blue/greenscreen but not as fancy) and the reference points have to be highly visible on the target (i.e. white tufts on all movement points, black suit underneath). Most ppl wouldnt want to bother with this even if they had hardware/software capable of doing it....

What impresses me (5, Insightful)

ObviousGuy (578567) | more than 9 years ago | (#8900520)

The most impressive thing about the Mac world is that Apple puts so much effort into building a complete software environment for their customers. With (compared to the Windows world) 3rd party software houses effectively shunning Apple because of the lack of users (again comparatively speaking), Apple would no doubt be dead if not for Apple's heavy investment in writing these pro-level tools that have become absolutely essential to the media cartels.

However, I wonder how long Apple can continue with such heavy investment in this excellent software. The return on investment of this kind of thing can't be that great considering the low low price of the software. Granted, it moves Mac G5 boxes, but I wonder if the markup on the Apple hardware can compensate for the loss leading of the Apple software.

Your cause and effect's all out of whack. (2, Insightful)

rodgerd (402) | more than 9 years ago | (#8900528)

People don't write software for MacOS because Apple will compete with them.

Why do you think the likes of Adobe are scaling down their Mac product line? Apple are trying to have their lunch. Why bother writing software to bolster your enemy?

Re:Your cause and effect's all out of whack. (5, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#8900600)

People don't write software for MacOS because Apple will compete with them.

Apple only seems to be stepping in where a competitor's product is languishing on the Mac platform. Two examples:

Internet Explorer for the Mac was left to rot by Microsoft, so Apple came up with Safari.

Adobe Premiere for the Mac was a neglected piece of shit, so Apple came up with Final Cut Pro.

This is a very clear message to software makers: "Shitty, infrequently-updated Mac software will not be tolerated. If you're going to make it, make it right or we'll take your marketshare with a kick-ass app that shows off what the Mac can do."

Re:Your cause and effect's all out of whack. (1, Informative)

CrowScape (659629) | more than 9 years ago | (#8900668)

Yes, because we all know Premiere was the only NLE software for the Mac...

Re:Your cause and effect's all out of whack. (1, Flamebait)

dfghjk (711126) | more than 9 years ago | (#8900773)

Premiere was no more neglected on the mac than on the PC.

The mac also hosted Media 100 and Avid, two very highly regarded packages in their time (not that Avid isn't today). Competitors are abandoning the mac platform because (1) Apple is competing with them and (2) the platform is not performance-competitive (Adobe says this explicitly). The performance claims were pre-G5 but we still don't have a G5 notebook.

Actually, your cause and effect might bekinda off (5, Interesting)

nicholas. (98928) | more than 9 years ago | (#8900620)

You have to ask yourself: is Apple chasing away developers because of their great software? Or is Apple filling a gaping whole that windows-centric developers are leaving open.

It is true that Adobe is scaling back some of their Mac operations. But apps like Premier and FrameMaker have been seriously neglected (four or more year w/o and update). So if these are the applications Apple risks losing because of their great software then so be it.

Avid/ProTools treats the Mac like a second class citizen so thankfully Apple has helped give them some competition. If it hadn't been for Apple who would have provide quality compositing, audio, video editing, DVD-authoring and now motion graphics software? Was Apple supposed to wait and hope that someone would come to the plate?

If anything, Apple is capable of producing great software. They will always be reliant on third parties with limited resources (or interest) for supporting great Mac hardware. Their strength is their software. It'd be great if Apple could get out their hardware sinkig ship and concentrate on bring great softare to different platforms.

Re:Actually, your cause and effect might bekinda o (4, Interesting)

silentbozo (542534) | more than 9 years ago | (#8900779)

I'm glad Apple has taken the lead in giving what would have been 3rd party apps (they bought the foundations of the iTunes music app, FinalCut, etc. all from other companies) and polishing them up to get new customers. When companies start going cross-platform (ie, from a pure-mac stance to a Mac/PC one), it's almost inevitable that one of them (the Mac side) gets short-changed. Some manager or number cruncher decides that there's more money on the Windows side, the Windows side eats up more than it's share of the allocated programmer budget, Mac programmers leave and are replaced, not by Mac programmers, but by Windows programmers, they decide to unify the code base but end up with all of the Windows bugs on the Mac side because their compiler tools are all Windows-based now, etc.

The other advantage in having Apple take these types of software under their wing is that they can strategically coordinate releases of both software and hardware. Looking at the Xserves, the XSAN, the software tools, OS X, etc., you can clearly see that they're targeting high-end, corporate users of media software (ie, entertainment). The scientific community is already sold on the Unix underlayer of OS X - X11 make is possible to port a lot of apps.

Re:Actually, your cause and effect might bekinda o (2)

wvitXpert (769356) | more than 9 years ago | (#8900783)

It'd be great if Apple could get out their hardware sinkig ship and concentrate on bring great softare to different platforms. I hope they don't get out of the "sinking ship". I, for one, like my computer to be a little better quality than a cardboard box and if Apple stops making computers that's all I'll have left to choose from.

Re:Actually, your cause and effect might bekinda o (4, Insightful)

MidnightBrewer (97195) | more than 9 years ago | (#8900797)

"Hardware sinking ship?" I have to disagree with you there. With the release of the G5 bringing the Mac hardware platform on par with, if not ahead of its PC counterparts, Apple is by no means hurting. This is without counting the 64-bit capabilities of the processor that are, as yet, still largely under-utilized. They also have a good price point for their workstation systems, that easily compete with what the other guys have to offer.

Apple is far better off than it was a year ago, or even five years ago, when things were really ugly.

There's a strange (and, IMHO, unrealistic) trend of opinion lately that says that Apple should stop making great hardware and concentrate on making great software that only runs on that great hardware. If you think the software is that damn great, then buy a Mac. That's what Apple's trying to get you to do, but people seem to be missing the point.

Re:Your cause and effect's all out of whack. (5, Insightful)

MoneyT (548795) | more than 9 years ago | (#8900648)

Apple wouldn't need to write software if the developers would actualy, you know, develop, as opposed to letting products die *cough* premeire *cough*. If no one is going to write software for Apple, Apple will write the software themselves.

Re:Your cause and effect's all out of whack. (1)

dfghjk (711126) | more than 9 years ago | (#8900789)

Premiere for mac was killed, according to Adobe, because the performance of macs sucks and Apple has chosen to compete using FCP. Prior to that, Premiere sucked on the mac no more than on the PC. I happen to like Premiere but recognize that others believe it blows. Adobe still provides AE for mac and PS, too.

REPOST due to mods who are dumb. (-1, Redundant)

DAldredge (2353) | more than 9 years ago | (#8900651)

People don't write software for MacOS because Apple will compete with them.

Why do you think the likes of Adobe are scaling down their Mac product line? Apple are trying to have their lunch. Why bother writing software to bolster your enemy?

Re:REPOST due to mods who are dumb. (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#8900819)

DAldredge! I would really like to know how that engagement ring set you bought on ebay has worked? Are you now engaged or something? I just can't stop thinking about it!

Re:What impresses me (5, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#8900555)

The return on investment of this kind of thing can't be that great considering the low low price of the software.

Shake 3 - $4950

The big production houses use it, use it lots, and use it on several workstations.

Apple are making a bit of a profit, but they also have an intensely INTENSELY loyal following just because it's the best of the best.

Their other apps are cheaper, but then they'll all continue to be updated, all continue to need new hardware, and all continue to need newer versions of the Mac OS.

Combine multi million dollar production budgets and that level of loyalty, Apple's video production market isn't going anywhere anytime soon, and is going to keep bringing them in solid profits.

Hey, they're not a market leader by % of total machines sold, but they're still a business with a near $2billion turnover each quarter with profits in the tens of millions. I'd like to be in that position

Re:What impresses me (2, Insightful)

rebeka thomas (673264) | more than 9 years ago | (#8900638)

Their other apps are cheaper, but then they'll all continue to be updated, all continue to need new hardware, and all continue to need newer versions of the Mac OS.

Shake 3 is also out for Linux. Cheaper OS, cheaper hardware, higher performance. I don't see that many houses will use Shake on OS X boxes for much longer.

Re:What impresses me (5, Insightful)

geniusj (140174) | more than 9 years ago | (#8900663)

Shake is also costs twice as much for linux. Enough that it's cheaper to get a powermac and shake than to get a linux box and shake.. that's intentional.

Re:What impresses me (3, Interesting)

phoxix (161744) | more than 9 years ago | (#8900738)

Shake is also costs twice as much for linux. Enough that it's cheaper to get a powermac and shake than to get a linux box and shake.. that's intentional.

It should be noted that Weta Digital opted for the more expensive Shake+Linux combination than going the full Mac route, heh

Sunny Dubey

Re:What impresses me (0, Redundant)

CrowScape (659629) | more than 9 years ago | (#8900677)

Until you realize that Shake for Linux costs TWICE AS MUCH as Shake for OS X. You could buy a good turnkey G5-Shake system for that price.

Re:What impresses me (-1, Troll)

rebeka thomas (673264) | more than 9 years ago | (#8900706)

And with the render times needed on a movie length project the speed that a linux system with good fast cheap hardware could shred the G5 in processing time would more than make up the difference

Re:What impresses me (4, Informative)

geniusj (140174) | more than 9 years ago | (#8900743)

Given that in rendering you are crunching large chunks of data. The fact that G5s are 64-bit and have an insane amount of bandwidth between every subsystem probably helps it quite a bit. Not to mention that while Shake is optimized for the G5 (compiled with 64 bit support), it is doubtful that the same optimizations were given for, say, AMD64. The G5 is no slouch, as you seem to be inferring.

One thing that I am pretty sure about, but not positive, is the cost of running a linux cluster node in the farm. I know the OS X licenses for a cluster node are free. However, I do not believe that to be the case with a Linux node. Again, further driving the cost way up. The most cost effective option for recent shake adopters are most likely XServe G5 Cluster Nodes. As they are relatively cheap individually (for the power they provide) and you do not need to pay a licensing fee for each node.

Re:What impresses me (1)

dfghjk (711126) | more than 9 years ago | (#8900683)

Of course, Apple bought Shake, they didn't develop it, just as they bought the company that developed what eventually became FCP.

Windows has had the same HD editing capability that Apple announced for a while now and Motion appears to be an After Effects competitor. Both Premiere and Vegas can edit HD video out of the box (provided you have the right mpeg2 codecs) and Cineform offers plugin packages that enhance the process. Apple's just playing catch-up here while people believe they're innovating.

Re:What impresses me (-1, Flamebait)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#8900761)

... but they also have an intensely INTENSELY loyal following just because it's the best of the best.


Correction - they have an intensely ignorant following who spend most of their time with their heads up their asses and so consider Apple something special.

Re:What impresses me (2, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#8900557)

The other way to look at it is that by providing their own software they pretty much guarantee lock in. I think it is a good thing they have a small market share. It would scare if a company that controlled they hardware, the os and the software as tightly as Apple. As bad as Microsoft may be at least they don't control much outside of the OS and Office.

Re:What impresses me (2, Insightful)

MoneyT (548795) | more than 9 years ago | (#8900654)

Control like that is only really a bad thing if the person in control is making bad decisions and abusing their position.

Re:What impresses me (2, Insightful)

wvitXpert (769356) | more than 9 years ago | (#8900694)

That may be true, but it seems like the future of computing. As much as I love choices I think Apple's integration is a good thing. Right now computer hardware and software is just kind of stitched together loosely. Apple is optimizing their software for the their hardware with a resulting computing experience that is unparalleled. When I use an Apple I feel that it is a quality product. Not just because the hardware seems so well designed and thought out, or because the software works so simply yet effectively. It's the combination of both hardware and software that makes a computing experience, so it makes sense for Apple to control both.

Re:What impresses me (1)

bfg9000 (726447) | more than 9 years ago | (#8900717)

Well, Apple currently dominates the MP3 market (although the marketshare numbers seem radically different on every site I go to), and the iPod isn't really a *viciously* closed system. There's a *chance* that Apple would be a benevolent dictator if their OS/hardware had a huge marketshare, but it's hard to say -- their Legal Department makes Hitler look like Gandhi.

In short: I use a Mac because I'm too stupid and lazy to handle Linux without falling back to closed source stuff sometimes, but I PRAY that Linux wins the desktop. Because they won't win unless they have everything Windows and OS X have PLUS MORE. Which they will, eventually. And then all those low UID guys here will actually be cool, because they'll be able to say "I knew Linux when..."

Re:What impresses me (4, Insightful)

Selecter (677480) | more than 9 years ago | (#8900563)

Most of the software is not any sort of a loss leader for Apple. They make some serious cash off most of their in house softwarez - iLife 04 was a huge success for Apple as noted in the recent quarterly report.

Hardware delays not withstanding, ( within reason ) Apple's future is pretty bright. Check how many /. readers have and use Macs compared to 3 years ago. 3 years ago, anything Apple was a running joke here, becuase the hardware was so outdated mostly, but also becuase OS X was not ready for primetime.

Big difference today - Apple is the geek computer. Hardcore gamers are the last holdout IMO.

The Cathedral and the Bazaar (-1, Troll)

mnemonic_ (164550) | more than 9 years ago | (#8900685)

The Apple World:
The Cathedral. The Holy Steve Jobs (ever wonder why it's called the Cult of Mac [wired.com]. Systems running tightly integrated software officially sanctioned by the Apple. Little output for customization, creativity or diversity. All Macs have one of a few appearances, with extremely rare exceptions. Apple progress is often characterized by usually large but infrequent bounds, often coupled with impressive corporate acquisitions (e.g. NothingReal) and ruthless business tact (terminating PC support for Shake and FCP). Highly elitist users and developers, often very willing to "preach" to the unfaithful.

The PC World:
The Bazaar. All sorts of manufacturers running about trying to sell competing products through a myriad of resellers. A much more complex market that gives rise to fierce, often chaotic competition, with more incremental but far more rapid advances. All manner of users, from the clueless newbie, the hardcore gamer, the unix guru, the graphics artist and the scientist and engineers. Among the more high-end users, risque hardware customization and minute hardware analysis reign supreme. Software and hardware integration is less integrated than in the Apple World, but needless to say, that does not seem to be much of an impediment. The PC World is far less united, but also amazingly adaptive and incredibly diverse.

The Cathedral and the Bazaar. Which is better? You decide...

Re:The Cathedral and the Bazaar (1, Insightful)

Daniel Dvorkin (106857) | more than 9 years ago | (#8900705)

The Linux world is a bazaar. The Windows world is a cathedral, albeit an incompetently-run one. It's disingenuous at best to talk about "The PC World" without making this distinction. Not to mention that the Apple cathedral has a pretty good relationship with the Linux bazaar these days.

Re:What impresses me (2, Informative)

rduke15 (721841) | more than 9 years ago | (#8900748)

these pro-level tools that have become absolutely essential to the media cartels.

Actually, the media cartels are mostly using Avid (on both Mac and Windows), not Apple's FCP.

It's not in the high-end market they are competing (though that may change), but in the lower end where Adobe Premiere was not good enough and Avid too expensive. That's where everyone jumped on FCP and... bought a Mac. That's not to say FCP isn't good. It seems to be pretty good, and the editors I know tend to rather like it, even if it cannot (yet?) really compete with high-end Avids in some areas. But that seems to be the next step.

They have a very clear business model of providing (good) software to sell their hardware. (iTunes to sell iPods, FCP to sell Macs, what's next?)

Re:What impresses me (2, Insightful)

dfghjk (711126) | more than 9 years ago | (#8900806)

Don't know why you think these tools are "absolutely essential" since there are plenty that don't use them. Don't know why you think the price is "low low" either or that the software is "excellent" since it's only just announced. Finally, I can't imagine why you assume that this software is "loss leading". Apple's not giving this away for free. FCP is not inexpensive and Shake is quite pricey.

Wait ... (3, Interesting)

Sonic McTails (700139) | more than 9 years ago | (#8900521)

The XSan just sounds like network mount points. Like I can mount NFS mounts at /usr, another at /usr/local, and make it behavie like it all one system. To do it, it would just require renaming /usr, and then modify the startup scripts to use the new paths. Is XSan different or is it basically a GUI to mount points ?

Xsan (4, Informative)

daveschroeder (516195) | more than 9 years ago | (#8900552)

Xsan is a typical SAN filesystem, not just "network mount points". It allows storage to be pooled and aggregated, and for multiple machines to concurrently mount the same filesystem(s) simultaneously. The keys in a SAN are things like storage monitoring, management, centralization, and performance.

Just look at Apple's Xsan home page [apple.com] and Xsan press release [apple.com].

Re:Wait ... (2, Informative)

TiMac (621390) | more than 9 years ago | (#8900554)

A SAN is immensely more complex than this, and Xsan does virtualized volumes for data sharing, file-level locking, and several other things that an out-of-the-box setup will not. Read carefully...I'm not sure of all the details on this product yet, but it's not just mountpoints.

Re:Wait ... (5, Informative)

Have Blue (616) | more than 9 years ago | (#8900577)

It's a SAN clustering program. You run Xsan on each of your 4 Xserves, you plug a 3T Xserve RAID into each of them, and the whole backend appears to your G5 (and every other G5 on the network) as a single 12T volume that's faster than any single hardware unit, since Xsan also does load balancing.

Re:Wait ... (0, Flamebait)

Kenja (541830) | more than 9 years ago | (#8900820)

Or you could just put 12TB on one server with several gigabit connections trunked to the network. Seems a waste of money to use three overpriced XServe boxes for this.

Re:Wait ... (4, Informative)

Twirlip of the Mists (615030) | more than 9 years ago | (#8900729)

Xsan is Apple's port of ADIC's CVFS (or "StorNext" as they took to calling it a while back) to Mac OS X, with new administration tools.

A CVFS client on Window, Solaris, whatever, will plug right into an Xsan network.

Apple does it right (4, Interesting)

ericdano (113424) | more than 9 years ago | (#8900523)

Apple really does things right. Look at their products compared to Microsoft. OS X is way ahead of Windows XP. G5's are slick. iPod, Xservers, iMacs, eMacs, and their laptop lines. iLife. Logic. Final Cut Pro, Shake, etc.

Simply, they are the trend setters. Best computer company period!

Re:Apple does it right (-1, Offtopic)

Selecter (677480) | more than 9 years ago | (#8900594)

Exactly why is this flamebait? He's giving what looks like to me a honest opinion - Mod this up or down as you wish, but I dont think it's flamebait material.

Re:Apple does it right (-1, Offtopic)

ericdano (113424) | more than 9 years ago | (#8900650)

Thankyou! Man, you say one good thing about apple with no references to Linux and look what happens!

Re:Apple does it right (1)

dfghjk (711126) | more than 9 years ago | (#8900817)

and such a critical thinker, too! Boy, everything Apple does is so topnotch! Can't imagine why that would be considered flamebait.

But OS X is not free (0, Funny)

the Slashbot (769279) | more than 9 years ago | (#8900608)

OS X is closed source. This means that it is the work of the devil - its purpose is to make the end users eat babies.

Linux is the only free OS. Yes the BSD lincenses may appear more free, but as they have no restrictions, they are actually less free than the GPL. You see, restricting the end user more actually makes them more free than not putting restrictions on them. You must be a dumb luser for not understanding this.

And you obviously dont have a real job. A real job involves being a student or professional academic. You see, academics are the ones who know all about productivity - if you work for a commercial organisation you obviously do not know anything about computers. Usability is stupid. Whats wrong with the command line? If you cant use the command line then you shouldnt be using a computer. vi should be the standard word processor - you are such a luser if you want to use Word. Installing software should have to involve recompiling the kernel of the OS. If you dont know how to do this, you are a stupid luser who should RTFM. Or go to a Linux irc channel or newsgroup. After all, they are soooo friendly. If you dont know how the latest 2.6 kernel scheduling algorithm works then they will tell you to stop wasting their time, but they really are quite supportive.

Oh, and M$ is just as evil as Apple. Take LookOUT for instance. You could just as easily use Eudora. Who needs groupware anyway, a simple email client should be all we use (thats all we use as academics, why cant businesses be any different).

And trend setters - Linux is the trend setter. It may appear KDE is a ripoff from XP, but thats because M$ stole the KDE code. We all know they have GPL'ed code hidden in there somewhere (but not the things that dont work, only the things that work could possibly have GPL'ed code in it).

And Apple is the suxor because they charge people for their product. We all know that its a much better business model to give all your products away for free. If you charge for anything, then you are allied with M$ and will burn in hell.

Re:But OS X is not free (-1, Offtopic)

JudgeFurious (455868) | more than 9 years ago | (#8900718)

"-1, Troll" is a fucking crime. Do mod points arrive and in the process suck your sense of humor out your ass? God I hope I'm not this stoic when I'm modding posts.

I laughed my ass off through this entire post. It's funny. Someone mod this thing funny ASAP. It's just close enough to the mark while being just a hair over the top.

Best post on this entire thread IMO. "the Slashbot" did it right.

they're (-1, Offtopic)

AnonymousCowheart (646429) | more than 9 years ago | (#8900534)

they're also gonna announce new ibooks, and powerbooks, or so it's rumored [macrumors.com] for tommorow

Re:they're (1)

redJag (662818) | more than 9 years ago | (#8900564)

that's been rumored every week for months :-) although I wouldn't surprised at an update, these software updates make hardware updates LESS likely, in my opinion. Seems apple is announcing these to stir the stagnant waters a bit.

Start singing "nearer my god to thee...."` (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#8900547)

Talk about rearranging deck chairs.

The big issue is the G4 is too damned slow, the powerbooks are too slow, the G5's are too hot to use.

And so they reach out to a niche.

Cripes. I might as well sell my PB and iMac's now and get out while they're worth something.

The real news .. (4, Insightful)

naden (206984) | more than 9 years ago | (#8900553)

Has to be the XSan .. this combined with the XServe and XServe RAID really does have to worry companies like Sun and SGI a little.

Re:The real news .. (1)

ajiva (156759) | more than 9 years ago | (#8900616)


Has to be the XSan .. this combined with the XServe and XServe RAID really does have to worry companies like Sun and SGI a little.


How would this affect SGI or SUN? Both companies offer comparable machines, and have 20+ years of experience doing high performance computing, clustering and filesystems. Check out Solaris10 (http://wwws.sun.com/software/solaris/10/). With features like DTrace, NFS v4, a highperformance TCP/IP stack and other enterprise level features Apple has a long way to go to compete.

Re:The real news .. (1)

0racle (667029) | more than 9 years ago | (#8900769)

I would doubt it. XRAID with Xserve do work out cheaper then comparable offerings of storage from HP, IBM, Sun et al, until you actually compare them. XRAID is cheaper because it uses ATA drives, it breaks them up across several channels, but its still just ATA, whereas the rest are at least SCSI360, often however a Fiber channel array. Comparatively then, its cheaper because its not going to be moving the same amount of data in the same amount of time. On top of that Apples products aren't going to be even considered for the types of jobs that actually warrant a SAN, they're new to the whole game, and lets face it, the fast majority of people consider Apples to be toys, or only for graphic artists. Hell it surprises them that a Mac can actually play games.

Re:The real news .. (1)

X (1235) | more than 9 years ago | (#8900799)

Yeah, this would be true if XSan was actually some kind of a new technology. It's just a licensed and ported package that's available on a wide variety of platforms. Hell, you could set it up on Dell boxes if you wanted to.

Wow, how many companies can do this?!!! (4, Insightful)

tentimestwenty (693290) | more than 9 years ago | (#8900560)

I'm not even a big video user but this is amazing stuff. From start to finish they've got everything almost anyone could want to make high end productions and the cost and hardware is stupidly cheap. Real time HD over FireWire on a $3000 computer? Just to get that to work is amazing, but to have a purpose built SAN to handle all the files, and it all works together with amazing fit and finish. I can't see anyone in the industry not going for this. Apple's been saying that having the hardware and the software let's them do all sorts of unique things, but this is the first time it's going to completely change a whole industry. Linux companies take note and make sure you've got a hardware side to your operations.

Re:Wow, how many companies can do this?!!! (-1)

dfghjk (711126) | more than 9 years ago | (#8900707)

Except not as stupidly cheap as it would be on a windows box. They make it sound like realtime HD over firewire is some big deal until you realize it's just 19Mbps HDV video, basically the same data rates that you have with DV. No big deal and even notebooks do it easily.

I can see anyone who understands any of this to not be fooled by the hype. I've edited HD video (realtime!) on my PC's using Vegas and Premiere and stored the work on a Samba share running on a Linux box. None is this is even new, much less industry-changing.

You shouldn't comment on what you don't know.

Re:Wow, how many companies can do this?!!! (5, Informative)

Twirlip of the Mists (615030) | more than 9 years ago | (#8900745)

They make it sound like realtime HD over firewire is some big deal until you realize it's just 19Mbps HDV video

Wrong. HD over FireWire is 100 Mbps. It's only after the program content has been sent to the transmitter that HD gets squeezed all the way down to 19 Mbps. In production, the bit rates are 50-100 times higher than that.

(Real men deal with uncompressed SMPTE-292, of course. Gigabit and a half per second, thank you very much.)

You shouldn't comment on what you don't know.

Right back atcha.

Don't forget Shake! (4, Informative)

TiMac (621390) | more than 9 years ago | (#8900570)

Apple also introduced Shake 3.5 [apple.com] for Mac OS X, Linux, and IRIX...

you yourself forgot shake.. (1)

Hooya (518216) | more than 9 years ago | (#8900793)

look; gawk; talk; date; wine; unzip; strip; touch; finger; head; mount; fsck; more; yes; shake; spray; umount; sleep; leave

HDTV over IEEE1394 (2, Interesting)

mduell (72367) | more than 9 years ago | (#8900578)

How do they plan to run 1080i HDTV (1Gbps if its YUV, 1.5Gbps if its RGB) over 800Mbps IEEE1394? Are they going to require users to buy a optical IEEE1394 (1600Mbps/3200Mbps) card? How many devices out there support IEEE1394 over an optical medium?

Re:HDTV over IEEE1394 (3, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#8900613)

Silly rabbit, they're using 100Mbps of the available FireWire bandwidth, which is only four times higher than a DV stream. This is essentially DV-style compression for HDTV signals. It has the advantages of DV (lossless editing since it's the camera's native format) as well as the disadvantages (one-time lossy compression with some loss of colour resolution).

Re:HDTV over IEEE1394 (4, Informative)

Enrico Pulatzo (536675) | more than 9 years ago | (#8900622)

Well, they are using the DVCPRO HD codec, which requires only 100Mbps stream, 1394b is overkill.

Apple suggests that you have a 160MB(capital B)ps connection to do uncompressed (read: non DVCPRO HD) HD content, which requires a PCI-based solution, not firewire.

HD over FireWire (4, Interesting)

daveschroeder (516195) | more than 9 years ago | (#8900624)

It does not require optical. It works over normal FireWire. It supports Panasonic's 100 Mbps DV-HD (DVCPRO HD) codec.

1080i HD content can be moved between a Panasonic HD VTR and a computer via FireWire with no generation loss:

"With Panasonic's new, compact AJ-HD1200A DVCPRO HD VTR, 24fps or 60fps progressive scan material shot by Panasonic's AJ-HDC27 VariCam HD Cinema camera or 1080i studio / sports truck footage recorded by DVCPRO HD VTRs can be transferred via the VTR's IEEE 1394 interface directly into Final Cut Pro HD without generation loss. Once transferred, the material is instantly available for real-time editing operations. All footage maintains its camera-original quality, because the IEEE 1394 FireWire interface transfers the native DV-HD high definition files, as originally recorded on tape in the VTR or Varicam, directly to the Power Mac G4 or Power Mac G5 host computer's internal hard drive."

Read the joint Apple/Panasonic press release [apple.com]

Re:HDTV over IEEE1394 (2, Insightful)

rduke15 (721841) | more than 9 years ago | (#8900637)

FCP doesn't seem to be supporting uncompressed HD. Apparently, it's only for the Panasonic DVCPRO HD codec.

Re:HDTV over IEEE1394 (5, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#8900686)

Technically, FCP does support uncompressed HD. It's just not for free over FireWire (it'll take a Kona capture card and a storage system of the Xserve RAID's calibre).

Been waiting for DTS support (3, Informative)

nedron (5294) | more than 9 years ago | (#8900582)

As the original poster mentioned, DSP 3 finally supports muxing DTS audio streams.

This has been a requested feature since 1.0. Noce to see they finally got DTS support into the product.

It's things like this... (5, Interesting)

TehChubbz0r (770420) | more than 9 years ago | (#8900606)

Apple putting out complete and all-encompassing software packages like this make me want to invest in Apple hardware, but I'm lacking enough funds to make the switch...

To me, Apple seems a much better development house than Microsoft (not really necessary to state), and their products seem much more reliable/functional than Microsoft's efforts. Maybe it's the extra time spent in development, maybe it's the extra attention spent on details, or perhaps it's just the hardware.

Even though I don't currently use Apple hardware, I still appreciate what they are doing for the computing community in general with products like these that show what great design teams are really capable of.

Re:It's things like this... (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#8900669)

gawd what a shameless karma whore

you dont have (and no doubt have had no real experience with) a mac, yet you can assess that they're a much better development house..

whatever buddy

macs crash all the time, just like pcs. so does linux. who fuckin cares

go suck a cock

Re:It's things like this... (1)

TehChubbz0r (770420) | more than 9 years ago | (#8900710)

I didn't say that I've never used a Mac, I said that I didn't own one. There is a slight difference. I've used a Mac plenty of times before for various projects when forced to, mainly because I wasn't used to them. Once I used one a few times for a few video editing projects, creating presentations, and a few miscellaneous things, I grew to like them, in fact, I like them more than PC's now.

And as for Linux, I've got a nix box running right here next to me that I use for programming, playing music, and recording tv, that I haven't had crash in about 4 months, and the last time wasn't even really a crash, there was a required video codec missing that caused it to hang until I killed the program responsible and replaced the codec file.

I know you were just posting flamebait anyways, because you posted as an AC instead of standing behind your comments.

Re:It's things like this... (1, Troll)

Nogami_Saeko (466595) | more than 9 years ago | (#8900730)

Microsoft's biggest failure is that they keep using the legacy code they've created.

Even though I don't particularly like OS-X, Apple had the right idea migrating their platform to a solid OS to replace the crap that was OS-9 and below. That said, things like Apple's refusal to provide simple UI enhancements (can we say 2nd mouse button standard, as has been on PCs since around the mid-90s?).

If MS was really smart, they'd be working on a unix-based backup plan as well. However I don't think they're going to do that. Eventually, it will catch up with them.

Re:It's things like this... (1, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#8900768)

Uhhh... Mac OS supports a second mouse button just fine. In fact, I'm using an MS Intellimouse Explorer with my OS X (10.3) box right now. I'm using all of its buttons: left, right, middle, scroll wheel, and the two on the side (which are mapped to Expose).

This is a problem that hasn't been a problem for years ... at least as long as OS X, and probably far longer.

weird (2, Interesting)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#8900607)

Of all of these updates, XSan is really at the top of them all. Products like Shake that are meant for using massive render farms, and Final Cut which, on a large enough project, would involve many many editors, will be wonderfully served by giving the users a nice way of accessing a production house's gigantic RAID.

XSan should receive more noteriety for this.

Re:weird (1)

rduke15 (721841) | more than 9 years ago | (#8900670)

large enough project, would involve many many editors

?? What sort of project are you thinking of? Motion picture movies certainly do not use many many editors. They may use one or two assistants, and the sound editing is done later by someone else, but there is usually only one editor, sometimes two.

Re:weird (1)

Twirlip of the Mists (615030) | more than 9 years ago | (#8900754)

Products like Shake that are meant for using massive render farms

Interestingly, Shake has including ad-hoc grid computing for some time now. Any two Shake machines on the network can use each other for distributed rendering, all automatically and with zero configuration.

Apple factored out this aspect of Shake and is now distributing it as a general-purpose grid computing toolkit under the name Xgrid.

Xsan is a preannoucement. And that's Good! (5, Interesting)

777333ddd (525062) | more than 9 years ago | (#8900615)

The Xsan press release is the most interesting to me because it's a long lead time pre-annoucement. Now most companies don't bat an eye with preannoucements. They toss them out like crazy often with an eye to just stoke the stock price or FUD competition. But there is such a thing as a good pre-annoucement.

That is not something Apple does much if at all for its products. While silence until shipping is a good move (I would say) in the consumer space. It's bad for the Enterprise space. Apple has been criticized and justifiably so for not pre-announcing key technology so developers and enterprises can plan accordingly.

Now I agree that it's probably better to err on the side of less pre-announcement, but Apple took this to too much of an extreme.

I think this is an indication that Apple is 'getting it' more and more regarding Enterprise/Pro markets.

What to view it on? (5, Interesting)

gotmemory (732785) | more than 9 years ago | (#8900628)

Uh, this is awesome and all, but what are you going to view it on? As far as I know there is no DVD that supports HD, and by the origional poster, it sounds like you can only watch it on attached displays at full resolution.

This also brings up something with the Panisonic HD DV camcorder simply because it is the only major minidv HD camcorder being pushed.

Good job apple.

Re:What to view it on? (1)

rebeka thomas (673264) | more than 9 years ago | (#8900657)

Uh, this is awesome and all, but what are you going to view it on?

Presumably on a HDTV, as it's broadcast direct from a station. This isn't home editing software, meant for recording home movies, it's for creating the original content in HD format.

I don't know if DVDs support it right now, but soon enough a medium will appear that will.

Re:What to view it on? (4, Insightful)

MoneyT (548795) | more than 9 years ago | (#8900682)

And before the iMac, there were probably less than 10 companies producing USB products. It's all about pushing people forward into the new world.

Re:What to view it on? (1)

dfghjk (711126) | more than 9 years ago | (#8900731)

The only HD DV camcorder is offered by JVC, not Panasonic. The Panasonic product they're referring to is different.

There is no HD DVD standard yet but there will be. The only formats available today are DVHS and WMV. Pros may use HD differently, say going to film for output, but people need to learn how to work with HD in advance of the widespread ability to distribute it. It's not a home format yet.

Kudos to Apple (5, Interesting)

tobycat (722641) | more than 9 years ago | (#8900649)

Apple seems to have remade itself into a premium software developer. I used to think of Apple as the cool hardware manufacturer but now they are bringing that same innovation, simplicity, and style to software. No wonder Adobe has been wary recently. They must be wondering when Apple will be competing with them across their entire product line.

Re:Kudos to Apple (1, Troll)

dfghjk (711126) | more than 9 years ago | (#8900749)

At least they want you to think that. In reality, Apple wants vertical markets like content creation. Where's Apple's Photoshop competitor? They don't have one because there isn't one they can buy out and slap their name on.

iTunes, there's some premium software.

Hear anything about logic? (1)

Thinkit4 (745166) | more than 9 years ago | (#8900659)

I heard it still needs some better integration among its parts. Some rate it neck and neck with CuBase. Been contemplating it, but not if a new logic is coming.

Interesting. (5, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#8900689)

First SGI came out with a port [macworld.com] of their CXFS [sgi.com] filesystem, and now Apple's Xsan. Both of these fill a hole that was blindingly obvious the moment Apple came out with the Xserve RAID.

Both Xsan and CXFS are cross-platform: you can attach heterogenous (Windows, Linux, Irix, Solaris, Mac OS X, possibly others) systems to the one filesystem, and have it all work. The interesting part is that CXFS needs an SGI Irix box at the centre to deal with the metadata updates (as I understand it). Xsan also needs a metadata server, but it's unclear whether it needs to be an OS X box, or if it'll work with other operating systems at its core. If the former, it's understandable. If the latter, it'll be a good chance to make it into the enterprise in a big way.

Either way, it looks like Apple is making some serious, steady steps towards the enterprise market. They're very much the underdogs; people looking at this sort of thing like to see a track record before buying; but still... interesting times, indeed.

Apple Has Done it Right (1, Offtopic)

mslinux (570958) | more than 9 years ago | (#8900791)

Unlike MicroSoft, which decided to take the hard and painful route by attempting to turn a single-user, game-playing OS (Windows) into a multi-user, enterprise class OS, Apple tossed their legacy OS and embraced Unix/Darwin/OS X. It's one of the smartest things they've ever done. If not the smartest.

MS will continue trying to turn their little, historic, cute OS into something it was never designed to be while Apple will continue to do things right.

For example, look at the super-computing Mac cluster at Virginia Tech. There wasn't an Apple system on the top 500 list during the OS 9 days, but a mere two years after they release OS X, they're among the top 5 fastest systems in the world... talk about doing it right. Will MS ever learn?

Is there a MacOS layer like Wine? (2, Interesting)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#8900805)

Things like these tools are something that's really missing from Linux. Is there a project similar to WINE that reimplements the OS X API under Linux?

Updated to FCP HD and looking at Xsan (2, Informative)

goMac2500 (741295) | more than 9 years ago | (#8900825)

I updated to FCP HD today (which is a free upgrade). So far looks the same. I don't have an HD camera so I can't try that out. No problems with the update so far. We're looking at Xsan at work. We are implementing a huge multi-XServe LDAP system and have a multi-terrabyte XServe RAID to back it up. Originally we would have had to partition the XServe RAID, but Xsan would solve that problem. Motion has caused the biggest stir among my creative-type friends,
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