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Gaim Forks To Get Voice And Video Support

timothy posted more than 10 years ago | from the run-for-the-money dept.

Communications 301

RAMMS+EIN writes "Everyone's favorite instant messenger, Gaim, has recently been forked. The new gaim-vv project aims to provide voice and video chat support, which will eventually be backported into the main branch." Nice to see an amicable fork; it sounds like this will mean competition for GnomeMeeting.

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Well, not everyone's favourite (1, Interesting)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#8963428)

Personally, I'm a kopete fan...

Re:Well, not everyone's favourite (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#8963468)

Shut up and suck Kock, motherfucker.

Re:Well, not everyone's favourite (1)

gid13 (620803) | more than 10 years ago | (#8963475)

Me too... However... It'd be nice if EITHER ONE would implement some of the things that Trillian can do, particularly working file transfer (at least, all of mine in Kopete mess up at 98% either way for no reason I'm aware of, and I don't think Gaim even tries).

I would also love the ability to have sounds only when the window in question is out of focus. A skinnable interface that can be made transparent is nice. Kopete should really get the ability to be integrated into the Universal Sidebar (to approximate Trillian's docking ability) also, although I think they're working on this one.

Re:Well, not everyone's favourite (1)

Narchie Troll (581273) | more than 10 years ago | (#8963552)

Gaim has had file transfer working fine for a few versions now. I use it all the time.

Re:Well, not everyone's favourite (3, Informative)

RAMMS+EIN (578166) | more than 10 years ago | (#8963582)

Gaim evolves quickly. File transfers work both ways for at least AIM and IRC (I wrote the IRC support based on the AIM code), and I think the MSN and Yahoo plugins have been able to at least receive files for a long time now, so chances are they can also send files now.

Re:Well, not everyone's favourite (2, Insightful)

opello (243896) | more than 10 years ago | (#8963597)

'chances are' ? not quite ... at least for me using latest 'stable'

i'd like to see support for msn pics, like amsn
i don't keep up with the drama that is gaim so i don't know if they are planning on implimenting it or not

Re:Well, not everyone's favourite (1)

RAMMS+EIN (578166) | more than 10 years ago | (#8963485)

I don't use kopete a lot (it never really worked for me, and it depends on KDE), so what I say here may not be exactly accurate (hmm, IANAL is a lot shorter. Ok, IANAKU).

I think kopete was/is cooperating with GnomeMeeting for getting video chat. This is a great move, but do know that GnomeMeeting doesn't actually interoperate with any of the major instant messengers anymore. It uses the H.323 protocol, which was used by MicroSoft Netmeeting and old versions of MSN Messenger, but all instant messengers use proprietary protocols these days. gaim-vv aims to interoperate with those.

Re:Well, not everyone's favourite (0, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#8963610)

I find that Imodium-AD works better than Kopete, myself.

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LETS LYNCH THESE GAY NIGGERS! (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#8963542)

WHOSE WITH ME?!?

Too many choices (2, Insightful)

bonch (38532) | more than 10 years ago | (#8963430)

Nice to see an amicable fork; it sounds like this will mean competition for GnomeMeeting.

Great, more "competition." See my sig.

Re:Too many choices (1)

c0bw3b (530842) | more than 10 years ago | (#8963446)

Nah, i think ultimately this will be a good thing. Rather than having a seperate program for video chat and IM an all in one program will be easier to deal with.

Re:Too many choices (5, Informative)

RAMMS+EIN (578166) | more than 10 years ago | (#8963452)

Right, people don't want to be swamped with options, but they do want to have voice and video chat.

The comment about GnomeMeeting is quite inaccurate, as GnomeMeeting uses the H.323 protocol, which was used by Netmeeting and old versions of MSN Messenger, but is not used by any messengers these days. What gaim-vv aims to provide is voice and video chat with AIM/iChat, MSN, Yahoo, etc, that is, the protocols that people actually _use_.

Re:Too many choices (-1, Flamebait)

scmason (574559) | more than 10 years ago | (#8963491)

What do you know about that happy crappy? Someone from Gnome using outdated tech? How about that, wel wonders never cease... ...

Re:Too many choices (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#8963575)

I don't want voice or video chat. I talk to people in real life or via phonograph.

Re:Too many choices (4, Funny)

RAMMS+EIN (578166) | more than 10 years ago | (#8963588)

``I don't want voice or video chat. I talk to people in real life or via phonograph.''

Do write a plugin for that, so that us Gaim users can have it too!

Re:Too many choices (4, Insightful)

MikeFM (12491) | more than 10 years ago | (#8963642)

There is nothing wrong with H.323. It's just that the IM companies like to use their own protocols so they can lock users in. I'd like to see support for all of those protocols and H.323.

Re:Too many choices (3, Insightful)

sglane81 (230749) | more than 10 years ago | (#8963453)

Competition drives innovation.

Homepage says: Friendly fork which will backported (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#8963540)

The project page of gaim-vv says

A friendly fork of Gaim (http://gaim.sf.net) to concentrate on video and voice support, which will eventually be backported.

Was I the only one to follow the link?

Re:Too many choices (2, Insightful)

sirsnork (530512) | more than 10 years ago | (#8963544)

The way I see this fork is basically like an unstable branch of the linux kernel. This way they can just work on the video and voice without messing up gaims normal development and without having to work out why something has broken because someone else applied a patch for something unrelated that breaks it. This way the only patches applied with be fore video and voice, and once thats working properly they can drop it into the current devel branch and make it work

Hey (-1, Flamebait)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#8963431)

I prefer Microsoft MSN Messenger, you insensitive clod!

I wish... (3, Funny)

JThundley (631154) | more than 10 years ago | (#8963437)

I just wish the devs would make something that they could be proud to call a 1.0 release.
But then again, this software is their gift to me, I have no room to bitch :)

Re:I wish... (1)

larley (736136) | more than 10 years ago | (#8963441)

Well, that's the thing about open source. If you've got a problem with it, FIX IT!

Re:I wish... (1)

Erratio (570164) | more than 10 years ago | (#8963472)

Yeah, all you'd need to do to solve that particular problem is somehow wrest control from the maintainer of the project or just convince him to change a decision which was made with a hell of a lot more meditation than some petty want. Open-source allows everyone to contribute, it doesn't allow people to stroll in and casually change the way things are done...why not just rename the project too, perhaps in your image. (This is all directed at the immediate parent, not the original message).

Re:I wish... (5, Insightful)

scmason (574559) | more than 10 years ago | (#8963497)

Are you missing the entire point of post? It is open source, you don't have to wrestle control from anyone. Just take it, fix it and use it. If your changes are useful, they will make it back into the product, or you can start your own fork.

Duh. ..

Re:I wish... (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#8963664)

Yeah, that's real realistic.

Hey you know what happened yesterday, asswipe? I wasn't happy with the performance of my Toyota, so I opened it up and bolted on two turbochargers, then I shipped it back to Japan with express delivery and they fucking employed me and accepted the changes! And I didn't even have to learn anything about cars! Fucking ace huh?

PISS OFF.

Re:I wish... (4, Informative)

ChipX86 (102440) | more than 10 years ago | (#8963549)

We won't have a 1.0 release. Our version number is just the previous number + 1, so a 1.0 just isn't going to happen :) Sorry. Remember though that a stable, full-featured program doesn't have to be labeled 1.0.

Re:I wish... (4, Interesting)

RAMMS+EIN (578166) | more than 10 years ago | (#8963554)

Honestly, they should have called it 1.0 somewhere around 0.55. That version was stable and did everything it needed to do. The port to GTK2 should have been 2.x; I think the change is major enough to bump up the major version number.

How useful is that? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#8963439)


Now everybody can IM me and see all my pasty nakedness at the computer.

You have been warned.

Re:How useful is that? (0)

larley (736136) | more than 10 years ago | (#8963449)

Thanks for the warning. I'll be sure never to IM ANYONE... It's like those people who put on a towel to answer the phone, but now when a message pops up and you're on thehun, you're screwed. ;)

Re:How useful is that? (2, Funny)

RAMMS+EIN (578166) | more than 10 years ago | (#8963495)

Not unless your webcam is supported... :-/

in the name of love (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#8963442)

one more in the name of love...

Possible applications (-1, Offtopic)

Teclis (772299) | more than 10 years ago | (#8963448)

If you can store potential energy in a spring (nano-springs? [uc.edu] ) Why not make use of this concept in modern cars much as hybrid cars [howstuffworks.com] do. Use braking to "wind-up" the spring, then energy from which can be used to give a good boost to acceleration.

Of course, the question is how much energy can we store in a spring and is it practical? Perhaps some research is required.

Thoughts?

Re:Possible applications (0)

SCSi (17797) | more than 10 years ago | (#8963454)

gaim uses nano-springs? Wow, and I thought it was just coded badly.

*ducks*

Re:Possible applications (0, Offtopic)

Mnemennth (607438) | more than 10 years ago | (#8963505)

*Sticks a fork in SCSI's duck* Hmmm... I think it's done...

How high can a duck with nano-springs in his feet jump, anyhow?

Ooops... please forgive me. I've had little sleep and my associations have become rather loose of late...

Mnem
*Toddles off to find something that's actually USER-FRIENDLY*

Re:Possible applications (0, Offtopic)

Teclis (772299) | more than 10 years ago | (#8963459)

Hmm. This story was meant to go to the divinci story. Sorry.

Re:Possible applications (-1, Offtopic)

Frohan (736729) | more than 10 years ago | (#8963464)

A beowulf cluster of nanosprings... HUZZAH!

Re:Possible applications (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#8963470)

sounds like you're confused about the laws of thermodynamics and perpetual motion machines and such. look into it, it's good stuff.

Re:Possible applications (0, Offtopic)

larley (736136) | more than 10 years ago | (#8963463)

Well, I think it may conserve energy, but probably not much. Depends on the mechanism used. Maybe using the brake's friction combined with the potential energy of the spring would be a more prudent effort. But I think I would leave that to an engineer, not a biologist, like myself. ;)

Perhaps.. (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#8963455)

Perhaps the gaim developers should spend more time worrying about actually properly supporting the protocols (especially msn) and less time playing with voice and video chatting.

Re:Perhaps.. (0, Flamebait)

scmason (574559) | more than 10 years ago | (#8963514)

Maybe you don't need to talk to anyone that uses MSN and they, being much wiser than the rest of us knew this already. BTW complainer, what have you contributed lately? ..

Re:Perhaps.. (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#8963530)

Maybe you don't need to talk to anyone that uses MSN and they, being much wiser than the rest of us knew this already.

Or perhaps they're just zealots like you. A lot of people use MSN, and there's a lot to like about the service.

BTW complainer, what have you contributed lately? ..

I develop other open source software such as content management systems. I also contribute to gaim by using it and submitting useful bug reports when I have a problem.

Oh, by the way, the gaim developers don't want to support MSN not because the protocol is lousy or the network is unimportant, but because MSN is related to Microsoft. That's zealotry at its worst. Maybe if the developers were busy making a better product instead of forking and bashing Microsoft, gaim might be a lot farther along in development than it is now.

OMG OMG OMG OMG OMG OMG FAG FAG FAG (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#8963515)

FAG!

Mostly useless . . . (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#8963456)

Great, so now my roommate, who plays EverQuest 20 hours a day (with other 4 being videoIMing with his girlfriend) has an alternative to AIM. He's such a prime candidate, having been such a diverse user of his computer.

Really, Linux? He scoffs. OpenSource software? No. OpenOffice? He shelled out the $150 for M$ Office.

Most of us who are concerned with OSS, digital rights, and other miscellaneous "Slashdot-esque" stuff are perfectly happy with text. How many of you are using Lynx to read this comment?

good thing (5, Insightful)

jangell (633044) | more than 10 years ago | (#8963461)

The way I look at it, this could be a very good thing.. From what I've witnessed currently the gaim development team is busy with many things, and cannot focus on one or two certain features.

Now that It has forked off the developers that are interested in this will have the time to do the one thing they WANT to do, not a bunch of others.

The way I look at it, it is kind of like the introduction of the assembly line, a group will be very skilled at one task and not be working on and assembleing all the other features.

Quite frankly, This is one feature gaim is really lacking. With the introduction of broadband services in the home, video and voice is extremely popular.

It's hard to get someone to try linux when their main tasks cannot be performed.

This is a very good thing.

Re:good thing (2, Interesting)

RAMMS+EIN (578166) | more than 10 years ago | (#8963508)

Of course, Linux has been able to do voice chat and video chat for a long time. I mean, there's speakfreely, rat, GnomeMeeting, ophone, etc, and you can serve streaming MPEGs or such, which is what I used to do.

Re:good thing (3, Informative)

LostCluster (625375) | more than 10 years ago | (#8963535)

Of course, Linux has been able to do voice chat and video chat for a long time. I mean, there's speakfreely, rat, GnomeMeeting, ophone, etc, and you can serve streaming MPEGs or such, which is what I used to do.

Yes. However there's competiting formats for realtime video chat right now... and the so called "open standards" seem to be ignored. GAIM's point is to emulate the proprietary formats that haven't been released for Linux yet.

Oh Jesus Christ that scared me. (0, Offtopic)

iibbmm (723967) | more than 10 years ago | (#8963466)

I seriously started shaking when I read that wrong in my sleepy stupor. I thought it mentioned GAIN starting up in the voice market... calling me with their LOVELY OFFERS. I really need to go to sleep now.

Man successfully dismembers his own member (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#8963467)

Man successfully dismembers his own member
Cherry Hill Times
November 18, 1997

CLAYTON, NJ. Early Tuesday morning New Jersey State Police were astonished to come across a man on the side of the road without any clothing on bleeding from his groin. The 26 year old man was staggering about, holding his hand over his crotch, worried, saying "can somebody please help me?" Police soon discovered that the man's penis had been torn away from him, leaving a bloody stump. Investigating the situation while summoning paramedics, Sheriff William Brown claimed "This is one of the most disturbing things I have ever seen in my career as a police officer, I really don't know what to make of it. The man's penis was gone." As the paramedics arrived the sheriff's deputy had located the detached member about 30 feet away lying in the ditch near the man's clothes. Paramedics had rushed him to St. Francis Medical Center 10 miles north where the ER staff was able to successfully reattach the mans penis." Medical examiner Soren Matthews, doing bloodwork had noticed abnormally high amounts of dextromethorphan in his bloodstream. "Dextromethorphan is a common additive in cough syrup, at recommended doses it can suppress the instinct and urge to cough during colds and flu.", Matthews stated. "At extreme levels, it becomes a dissociative anesthetic, similar to PCP and Ketamine, which can cause hallucinations, euphoria, a sense of detachment from reality."

Several hours later, police were able to speak with the victim and find out what exactly happened. They discovered he had drank three 4oz bottles of Vicks 44 Cough Relief Maximum Strength several hours prior to being discovered. He had gone out for what he liked to call a "wonderwalk" and suddenly got the urge to masturbate. Not realizing that he couldn't feel himself, tried for several minutes and noticed a shock wave resounding throughout his body. He then realized that he was holding his detached penis in his right hand. He was very fortunate that the police found him when they did.

Matthews went on further to state "People need to be aware of what they are doing to themselves. Common over-the-counter medicines have specific dosages there for a reason and when you abuse that tragedies like this happen. Parents everywhere need to look for the signs that their children are 'robotripping'." According to St. Francis Medical Center, this was the 3rd dextromethorphan related incident that they had seen this year. The other two incidents were and both involved teenagers at party situations taking Coricidin, another brand of OTC cough tablets. Both of these incidents were unrelated to each other.

Re:Man successfully dismembers his own member (-1, Offtopic)

scmason (574559) | more than 10 years ago | (#8963523)

I just did the exact same thing! I, like this man, am 'worried' too. ..

iChat AV / AIM Video Chat (5, Interesting)

metalligoth (672285) | more than 10 years ago | (#8963476)

Is it compatible with Apple's iChat AV / AIM's video and audio chatting?

If so, that would most certainly rule. iChat AV is awesome, but chatting on the Windows AIM client restricts one to a tiny window, whereas with iChat you can take up the whole screen if you want.

Also, I have lots of x86 using friends that hate booting into Windows from Linux just to use advertising-ridden AIM.

Re:iChat AV / AIM Video Chat (4, Informative)

RAMMS+EIN (578166) | more than 10 years ago | (#8963520)

``Is it compatible with Apple's iChat AV / AIM's video and audio chatting?''

That's the idea. However, an idea is all there is for now. AFAIK, all major IMs use proprietary protocols for voice and video that have not been reverse engineered yet.

Re:iChat AV / AIM Video Chat (1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#8963638)

I beg to differ, as Apple stated when iChat AV was first introduced: iChat AV operates on the SIP standard to communicate audio/video signals. All you need after that is the codecs to encode and decode signals from any webcam.

Uh oh... (3, Funny)

larley (736136) | more than 10 years ago | (#8963487)

I just realized. Seeing as the true geeks use open source and all, that'll just give us one less reason to go out and be social... As soon as they develop a usb-automated back scratcher and/or fridge/microwave, I'm not leaving the house!

Re:Uh oh... (4, Funny)

flynns (639641) | more than 10 years ago | (#8963633)

..you leave your house to scratch your back and cook/refrigerate your food?

hmm.

GAIM UI (3, Insightful)

BESTouff (531293) | more than 10 years ago | (#8963488)

That's nice, I hope they'll take GnomeMeeting's UI as an example. Gaim'UI sucks big time : it has tons of windows opening for no reason, taking the focus (and the keyboard input) from what you were previously doing. Way too much intrusive if you ask me.

Re:GAIM UI (1)

FryGuy1013 (664126) | more than 10 years ago | (#8963500)

uncheck the raise windows on events and install the tray icon plugin then. I still like Trillian's UI better though.

Re:GAIM UI (1)

LostCluster (625375) | more than 10 years ago | (#8963525)

Gaim'UI sucks big time : it has tons of windows opening for no reason, taking the focus (and the keyboard input) from what you were previously doing. Way too much intrusive if you ask me.

They're just trying to emulate AIM... That description makes it sound like they're getting that part right.

Re:GAIM UI (3, Informative)

RAMMS+EIN (578166) | more than 10 years ago | (#8963547)

Use the preferences, dude.

I personally thing Gaim has one of the _nicest_ UIs around. I group all chats and conversations in one tabbed window, so that I never have to worry about things popping up again.

Want chats in a separate window? Click the checkbox. Want every conversation in a separate window, but all chats in one tabbed window? It can be done. Pretty much any imaginable combination is possible.

Re:GAIM UI (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#8963598)

When I start the program I get two windows. One is the reconmnect window and another is the buddy list (which arrives a few seconds later). Each morning I wait the few seconds before I can move the buddy list to workspace number 4. This is a small problem, but it is a daily nuisanse. (Other gnome programms do not work like this)

When my msn get disconnected for a few seconds I would like to avoid having a popup window at all. Or at least the popup should only appear after the first attempt to reconnect fails. How about adding a small icon to the smileys instead. This icon would tell the user that the connection is bad, but the client is still hoping to resolve the issue.

If my msn gets reconnected many times then I sometimes press the cancel button to avoid further attempts to reconnect. This button does not work (Debian/sid). The only way to avoid further reconnections is to go to the account window and disconnect everything.

I am grateful for the work that the gaim team does to make programs for us users, and I realize that I have no reason to bitch. I also note that the gui has improved a lot since they started following the gnome guidelines. As notec above the chats have improved a lot. Still I would advice them to change the behavior with respect to the popups.

Re:GAIM UI (1)

prockcore (543967) | more than 10 years ago | (#8963590)

Gaim'UI sucks big time : it has tons of windows opening for no reason

What are you talking about? It has windows opening because people are sending you IMs.

By default, Gaim puts all chats into one tabbed window now. So actually there are only 2 windows, your buddy list, and your chats.

Compare this with iChat, which does indeed have the worst UI of any IM client. (If someone sends you an IM, you get that little notification window that pops up, and stays *ABOVE* all other windows until you hit Reply). iChat also doesn't have tabbed chat windows.

Re:GAIM UI (2)

ratsnapple tea (686697) | more than 10 years ago | (#8963694)

This is probably going to come off as another one of those annoying "leap to Apple's defense at all costs!" posts, but what the hell.

It's true that iChat's incoming IM windows pop up on top of all your other windows, but it's not a nuisance at all. It's ghosted out, for one thing, so you can tell it's not a "real" window, and it doesn't take focus away from anything else you're working on. If you want it to obey normal stacking order, just click on it (making it a "normal" window) and then click back on whatever you were working on. No problem. Intuitive. Easy.

I happen to think iChat's interface is actually the best of any client I've ever tried, but that's another matter...

Gnomemeeting/Aim/Yahoo Video (1)

NitsujTPU (19263) | more than 10 years ago | (#8963489)

I don't think that this represents any kind of competition at all.

You can't connect to cams via AIM/Yahoo with gnomemeeting/netmeeting.

It's a different program, with a different aim.

But what about making direct connect work? (1)

Qinopio (602437) | more than 10 years ago | (#8963492)

I like Gaim, I use it myself... but wouldn't it be better to fix the existing issues and give it certain areas of functionality that MiddleMan or MyIM have, before getting into this whole new can of worms?

Recent problems with Gaim (2, Interesting)

cerberusss (660701) | more than 10 years ago | (#8963493)

We use Gaim to communicate with the offshore part of the team and I have to say I couldn't really miss it. But I did have to, since they didn't react to the changes that Yahoo required from clients. It took a looooong time (almost three months) for Gaim to get fixed. Although we use Yahoo's network, Yahoo's own Linux client doesn't run in Xinerama (multihead) mode. The last six weeks, an unofficial patch floated around which had its own problems but at least a connection was made. Only this week, a new release was done which solved all problems.

Re:Recent problems with Gaim (5, Insightful)

mkamp (628400) | more than 10 years ago | (#8963639)

If you want a closed group like for team communication, why don't you go for jabber? You could setup your own server in seconds (at least with debian: apt-get install jabber), have your own rooms and don't have to bother too much about the internet and firewalls.

It is truly open source. That includes the protocol, most client-apis, most clients and most servers.
Furthermore the core is already in IETF RFCs.

No need to worry about vendors checking the protocols anymore and a wide variety of clients to use.

Watch out, your favorite IDE might even get a plug-in for IMing.

another fork? (2, Insightful)

master0ne (655374) | more than 10 years ago | (#8963498)

and this makes how many forks of gaim now? lets see we have gaim, ayttm, everybuddy, and gaim-vv, are there any im missing? sounds like a poll to me... "whats your favorite linux messanger client? aim, yahoo, ayttm, everybuddy, gaim, gaim-vv, cowboy neal's all-in-one messanger. ytalk, or i dont chat you insensitive clod!"

anyway in all seriousness ayttm (are you talking to me) look it up on freshmeat (as im too lazy/tired to link it) already has rudimentry yahoo webcam support, however it is still lacking, i loved trillian for windows, and would like to see gaim go in that direction, with all the eyecandy and skins and plugins... i know, ill learn c and fork gaim myself!!

Re:another fork? (4, Informative)

RAMMS+EIN (578166) | more than 10 years ago | (#8963568)

I may be wrong, but AFAIK ayttm is a everybuddy fork and everybuddy is not based on the Gaim codebase. They are very similar, though. Traditionally, eb has had the features and Gaim the stability. I wish they would cooperate more...

Woot! (5, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#8963503)

Exciting news indeed.

Gaim is the only decent AIM client for I've run across for Windows - the official client is utter crap, and Trillian is bloated payware. Still, some of my less-technically-inclined friends refuse to use Gaim, citing the fact that it doesn't have enough cool features and "bling bling". With cool new features like these, I have more ammunition in my battle to get people to switch ;p

Now, if only the Gaim folks would get their act together on MSN support ...

Re:Woot! (1)

rlangis (534366) | more than 10 years ago | (#8963572)

Gaim is the only decent AIM client for I've run across for Windows - the official client is utter crap, and Trillian is bloated payware.

I stopped using Trillian when they went to the pay model. I then tried to go all-linux on the desktop, but found that my EQ addiction could not be curbed, and had to return to Windows for that...and Gaim for Windows then became my IM client of choice.

Now, if only the Gaim folks would get their act together on MSN support ...

Not sure what you're meaning here though, I've been able to chat with my MSN buddies for quite some time. 0.76 fixes MSN. Er, well...if only. I mean it *works* now...and most of the problems with 'support' aren't on the Gaim Devs side - that's all MSN/Y!/AIM folks breaking the protocol *again*.

Re:Woot! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#8963615)

Not sure what you're meaning here though, I've been able to chat with my MSN buddies for quite some time. 0.76 fixes MSN. Er, well...if only. I mean it *works* now...and most of the problems with 'support' aren't on the Gaim Devs side - that's all MSN/Y!/AIM folks breaking the protocol *again*.

Good point, the support is there, and it DOES work, however, I find the whole process of managing your buddy list, user names (email address) vs display names, and so on, very counterintuitive. I'm not sure what's wrong with it, the UI just seems to confuse things rather than help.

I'm sure if I played around with it for awhile, I'd get the hang of it, but I'm talking about converting non-tech people here. If I, a linux guy, have problems with the UI, I don't expect that giggle-headed teenage girls will fare much better.

On a side note, it's nice to see that the system log is back in 0.77. When I tell people about Gaim, the one feature that seems to hold almost universal appeal is the fact that you can use the system log to "spy on people" and see how often they come online :)

Re:Woot! (2, Interesting)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#8963670)

well, this is certainly should be modded "Opinion" and not anything nearing fact...

I installed Gaim for W32 just a few minutes ago. I had installed in a while back and figured it must have gotten better. It had! I was actually impressed with the look and feel that it had.

Unfortunately it certainly wasn't on par with the official Windows client I regularly use...

The client doesn't have a buddy list that starts left justified in the window. There is a large gap between the left side and where the buddy list starts. That means I have to increase the size of the window to stop it from putting a side to side scrollbar at the bottom of the buddy list window. I like AIM to be open all the time and taking up a small piece of screen real estate. Seems like a UI bug to me.

While it does have a feature to show buddy icons in the buddy list area I could certainly do without that. Problem is, when you disable that the font size of the buddy list names becomes really small. I don't need to squint. Why does the size change? On a related note, why are there very large pictures next to the names on the list? I don't need poster sized notifications of how people are signed on. Should be an option to disable that. Seems like a UI bug to me.

It has a lot of settings that are and are not set by default that should be. Want to succeed in the Windows world? Make it user friendly out of the box.

I have to enable a plug-in to control it from the taskbar. Windows users aren't exactly into fooling around with their settings that much. Make it easy out of the box.

During setup there are a lot of options about GTK+/etc. I know what they mean... Windows users will not. Make it easy to understand (either with details or just completely hidden).

I was overly displeased with the client. I certainly believe that the parent was a free software supporter that can't see past the fact that AOL wants to use ads.

Ads on the client don't bother me and they shouldn't bother you. They aren't as intrusive as the oversized buddy list window you need to have to fit all the text in the window without a scroll bar.

YMMV.

Re:Woot! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#8963673)

Miranda IM is hands down the best Windows IM client. I know you've probably settled in to gaim but seriously you should give it a shot.

Trillian is crap? (1)

antdude (79039) | more than 10 years ago | (#8963691)

I disagree. I like Trillian (v0.74h -- free version) more than Gaim and I don't think it is crap. It's nice. If Trillian didn't exist, I would use Gaim. I wished Trillian existed for MacOS X and Linux natively.

Well, (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#8963521)

It's about forking time!

Since there is absolutely no information... (1)

Monkelectric (546685) | more than 10 years ago | (#8963531)

Does anyone know what voice/video protocols? They should really start by implementing Yahoo/AIM/MSN yahoo and voice functions, if they are going to further fracture the way-too-many-standards-already arena of instant messenger video ... its a waste of their time.

I think libyahoo2 already has voice/video implemented, but GAIM uses an older library.

Skype? (1)

ggvaidya (747058) | more than 10 years ago | (#8963537)

For Windows, Skype [skype.com] is a really good over-internet voice chat program. It uses P2P, and the quality you get is really good (atleast if your friend is on a LAN :P, haven't tried it outside the college LAN yet). Version 0.97 is showing some problems. Still, something like this would be really cool on Linux ...

Re:Skype? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#8963580)

I'll second this. Skype is good for latency and sound quality. I've had skype conference calls die on me though for no apparent reason.

Re:Skype? (2, Interesting)

ChiralSoftware (743411) | more than 10 years ago | (#8963612)

Skype for Linux is on its way, and it can't be here soon enough for me. If you look on their site in the jobs section, they are looking for a Linux/QT programmer. Older versions of Skype ran under Wine, but apparently they are now doing some code relocation/decryption thing that breaks with Wine, so we just have to wait for the official Linux client. And if it's Qt, it will look good and integrate nicely with Suse 9.1 which is also almost here...

----------
Create a WAP server [chiralsoftware.net]

Please be advised (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#8963551)

If you're a Windows user, you should be using Miranda [miranda-im.org] .

Thank you for your time.

Good News... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#8963562)

Any project deadlines or time schedules announced... Looks like I can start going back to gaim...

Phew. (-1, Offtopic)

dj245 (732906) | more than 10 years ago | (#8963569)

First time I read that as Gain [gainpublishing.com] Forks To Get Voice And Video Support`"

Lets hope that Spyware companies don't get the idea that voice and video are spectacularly good ideas for their products. Oops, too late.

iChat uses H.263 (5, Informative)

FreeHeel (620639) | more than 10 years ago | (#8963573)

from Apple [apple.com] :

iChat AV uses the industry-standard H.263 video codec and advanced pre- and post-processing techniques to deliver picture-perfect video. It uses the sophisticated technologies built into QuickTime to compress the video and audio while maintaining rich detail, natural colors, and smooth video over any 100-Kbps or faster Internet connection. Specific technologies include:

  • Spatial anisotropic diffusion to maintain edge detail and sharpness while reducing unnecessary digital "noise."
  • Temporal noise reduction to average out noise between video frames while avoiding motion blurring.
  • Post-filtering of the received video to avoid blockiness and ringing artifacts.

iChat AV uses a sophisticated digital audio codec to deliver the same crystal-clear audio quality that you expect when you use a typical landline telephone. The fullduplex technology built into iChat AV lets you have natural conversations, just as with the advanced speakerphones found in conference boardrooms. Most other solutions force users to talk one at a time, providing an experience more akin to talking on a CB radio.

Apple has recently announced support for H.264 [macworld.com] , which is a good thing

Gaim dev team comprised of losers (1, Informative)

ZeekWatson (188017) | more than 10 years ago | (#8963581)

Hopefully this fork will have a nicer dev team than plain Gaim. At the URL below you can see how the Gaim lead introduces himself to the Gentoo dev team by insulting Gentoo users and basically making an ass of himself. It goes something like:

As Gentoo users are generally an annoying nusiance in my IRC channel...

http://bugs.gentoo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=35890 [gentoo.org]

Best that could be expected from an AOL employee I guess!

Re:Gaim dev team comprised of losers (5, Informative)

lorien420 (473393) | more than 10 years ago | (#8963607)

Clearly you never spent any time in the #gaim irc channel. Before .60 went out of the door, Gentoo offered a gaim-cvs which had many many bugs. This is because they were using a cvs version of gaim. These people would use this and then go to #gaim to complain about it not working, often many times an hour. This created MASSIVE amounts of frustration, because the Gentoo users had absolutely no clue about anything involving gaim's cvs development of .60.

Re:Gaim dev team comprised of losers (1)

lintux (125434) | more than 10 years ago | (#8963643)

I'm very sorry to say, just can't resist, but you're just confirming their point here, it seems. Gaim has nothing to do with AOL, and certainly none of the Gaim developers work for AOL.

Re:Gaim dev team comprised of losers (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#8963674)

.. but Gentoo users are a generally annoying nuisance anywhere!

what are my options right now (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#8963587)

So, what are my options for voice and video chat on Linux right now? Are there any webcams that are supported by stock Linux kernels? I don't want to have to recompile my kernel, just want to plug it in and have it work like in Windows...

competiton (1)

diakka (2281) | more than 10 years ago | (#8963596)

From what I know of these two programs, They really do seperate things. It seems more reasonable that there would be more cooperation than competition. There's no point in reinventing the wheel if you can avoid it.

Maybe it would be better to announce this... (1)

Nuclear_Loser (663599) | more than 10 years ago | (#8963625)

when they have a website! It's kind of jumping the gun when all you have to link to is a sourceforge project page.

win32 client appears broken (0, Offtopic)

theguywhosaid (751709) | more than 10 years ago | (#8963634)

i got an interesting dll loading error on winXP SP1.
it involved some long proc name in a dll and gaim.dll gave error 127. anybody know whats up?

Re:win32 client appears broken (1)

Yusaku Godai (546058) | more than 10 years ago | (#8963681)

No idea, but perhaps you should report [sourceforge.net] that to them.
Are you sure you have the latest version of the GTK+ runtime for windows? Gaim 0.77 needs GTK+ 2.2.4 rev c.

Re:win32 client appears broken (1)

Yusaku Godai (546058) | more than 10 years ago | (#8963690)

Gah! I'm a bit drnk*Q. Sorry.

Fork vs. Branch (1)

RichiP (18379) | more than 10 years ago | (#8963635)

When is a project forked? And when is it a branch? With the way forking is played in newssites nowadays, it seems to connote a difference of opinions and therefore the need to go separate ways. Most of the time, however, code is just branched in order to perform some development on a particular feature with the intent to merge the two branches together eventually.

The question in my mind is: what were the circumstances for the creation of the new source tree? Was it a branch (in which case the term amicable shouldn't even be used as that's what branches normally are without the need to SENSATIONALIZE it)?

Gaim-vv (5, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#8963636)

Gaim-vv is really more of an offsite branch of Gaim than a fork.

From the sf project page:
A friendly fork of Gaim (http://gaim.sf.net) to concentrate on video and voice support, which will eventually be backported

Basicly, I wrote a patch based on some code from libyahoo2 for Gaim to allow viewing other people's webcams. Filamoon independently had done some on msn voice and video related stuff. We decided to start a separate sourceforge project so we could collaborate and stuff.

Eventually we hope to merge it into Gaim proper. Currently it's in a state where it may be useful to users, but not in a state where it can be merged into Gaim. It breaks the core/ui split for example. It uses threads for some things. There's not really any shared code between the Yahoo! and MSN related features yet.

There are no AIM, iChat, ICQ, Jabber, IRC, Gadu-Gadu, Napster, Zephyr, etc, video or voice features. Someone wishing to work on that should contact us and start coding.

I don't consider gaim-vv to be in competition with any other project, GnomeMeeting or otherwise.

Gaim finally out-features CuSeeMe after 10+ years! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#8963655)

It was the best of times...
http://www.rocketcharged.com/cu-seeme/

Seriously, why did this take so long?
Don't flame me, I don't mean why did it take so long for this to happen with Gaim specifically, I mean in general. No IM software that I have tried seems to have outdone the early versions of CuSeeMe...

This is not a fork. (2, Interesting)

Craig Davison (37723) | more than 10 years ago | (#8963672)

It's a branch of the project with AV support. A fork is an entirely new project set off in a new direction from the original codebase. Branches are often created and merged in a development cycle.
</rant>

wrong project (4, Interesting)

pdamoc (771461) | more than 10 years ago | (#8963676)

this shouldn't have been a fork in Gaim but rather a joint venture between developers of IM software to create a library or a set of libraries that will handle the voice and video protocols, this way all the IM software would have benefit.

Adium? (1)

Kethinov (636034) | more than 10 years ago | (#8963687)

It would be nice if the work done in this forked project could be eventually integrated into Adium, seeing as how it's based off of GAIM's source. My one regret of switching from iChat to Adium is it's lack of "vv". So if I want to do some "vv" I have to switch back to iChat.

Not everyone's (1)

pablodiazgutierrez (756813) | more than 10 years ago | (#8963695)

Everyone's favorite instant messenger, Gaim...

I guess not Everybuddy [everybuddy.com] can please everyone!

Smart ass...

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