Beta
×

Welcome to the Slashdot Beta site -- learn more here. Use the link in the footer or click here to return to the Classic version of Slashdot.

Thank you!

Before you choose to head back to the Classic look of the site, we'd appreciate it if you share your thoughts on the Beta; your feedback is what drives our ongoing development.

Beta is different and we value you taking the time to try it out. Please take a look at the changes we've made in Beta and  learn more about it. Thanks for reading, and for making the site better!

Lithium-Sulfur Batteries Unveiled

CowboyNeal posted more than 10 years ago | from the amping-it-up dept.

Portables 270

mobilemag writes "Sion Power is showing off its new Lithium-Sulfur battery design this week at the Windows Hardware Engineering Conference (WinHEC). SION believes that its new Lithium-Sulfur (Li-S) batteries are the answer to the power hungry devices on the market today."

Sorry! There are no comments related to the filter you selected.

Isn't this already obsolete? (3, Interesting)

shaitand (626655) | more than 10 years ago | (#9146229)

http://www.army-technology.com/contractors/electri cal/ultralife/

Re:Isn't this already obsolete? (1)

akhaksho (233506) | more than 10 years ago | (#9146407)

Those Lithium Manganese batteries aren't rechargable.

Re:Isn't this already obsolete? (1)

Hirsto (601188) | more than 10 years ago | (#9146597)

Dohhh! Of course it's obsolete, just like that new keyboard you just bought! Delete the space in "electri cal" from the pasted URL to visit web site. Enjoy

Re:Isn't this already obsolete? (1)

Breakfast Pants (323698) | more than 10 years ago | (#9146671)

Or maybe there is no problem at all with his keyboard and slashdot automatically entered that space in order to prevent page widening trolls? Regardless he should have used a link and there would be no problems.

Hmmm...Lithium/Sulfur (0, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#9146243)

Good for the heart, bad for the fart.

I'M OFF TO GRAB A NEW IP ADDRESS! EAT MY POOP! (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#9146246)

*_g_o_a_t_s_e_x_*_g_o_a_t_s_e_x_*_g_o_a_t_s_e_x_*_
g_______________________________________________g_ _
o_/_____\_____________\____________/____\_______o_ _
a|_______|_____________\__________|______|______a_ _
t|_______`._____________|_________|_______:_____t_ _
s`________|_____________|________\|_______|_____s_ _
e_\_______|_/_______/__\\\___--___\\_______:____e_ _
x__\______\/____--~~__________~--__|_\_____|____x_ _
*___\______\_-~____________________~-_\____|____*_ _
g____\______\_________.--------.______\|___|____g_ _
o______\_____\______//_________(_(__>__\___|____o_ _
a_______\___.__C____)_________(_(____>__|__/____a_ _
t_______/\_|___C_____)/______\_(_____>__|_/_____t_ _
s______/_/\|___C_____)_______|__(___>___/__\____s_ _
e_____|___(____C_____)\______/__//__/_/_____\___e_ _
x_____|____\__|_____\\_________//_(__/_______|__x_ _
*____|_\____\____)___`----___--'_____________|__*_ _
g____|__\______________\_______/____________/_|_g_ _
o___|______________/____|_____|__\____________|_o_ _
a___|_____________|____/_______\__\___________|_a_ _
t___|__________/_/____|_________|__\___________|t_ _
s___|_________/_/______\__/\___/____|__________|s_ _
e__|_________/_/________|____|_______|_________|e_ _
x__|__________|_________|____|_______|_________|x_ _
*_g_o_a_t_s_e_x_*_g_o_a_t_s_e_x_*_g_o_a_t_s_e_x_*_


Important Stuff: Please try to keep posts on topic. Try to reply to other people's comments instead of starting new threads. Read other people's messages before posting your own to avoid simply duplicating what has already been said. Use a clear subject that describes what your message is about. Offtopic, Inflammatory, Inappropriate, Illegal, or Offensive comments might be moderated. (You can read everything, even moderated posts, by adjusting your threshold on the User Preferences Page) If you want replies to your comments sent to you, consider logging in or creating an account.

Important Stuff: Please try to keep posts on topic. Try to reply to other people's comments instead of starting new threads. Read other people's messages before posting your own to avoid simply duplicating what has already been said. Use a clear subject that describes what your message is about. Offtopic, Inflammatory, Inappropriate, Illegal, or Offensive comments might be moderated. (You can read everything, even moderated posts, by adjusting your threshold on the User Preferences Page) If you want replies to your comments sent to you, consider logging in or creating an account.

Important Stuff: Please try to keep posts on topic. Try to reply to other people's comments instead of starting new threads. Read other people's messages before posting your own to avoid simply duplicating what has already been said. Use a clear subject that describes what your message is about. Offtopic, Inflammatory, Inappropriate, Illegal, or Offensive comments might be moderated. (You can read everything, even moderated posts, by adjusting your threshold on the User Preferences Page) If you want replies to your comments sent to you, consider logging in or creating an account.

Re:I'M OFF TO GRAB A NEW IP ADDRESS! EAT MY POOP! (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#9146288)

I love goatse, I wish I could kiss his big gapping asshole.

Sulfur? (1, Funny)

euxneks (516538) | more than 10 years ago | (#9146255)

Now I don't need a farty dog!, I can just blame it on the laptop!

Re:Sulfur? (1)

System.out.println() (755533) | more than 10 years ago | (#9146312)

I thought farts were mostly methane?

Re:Sulfur? (2, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#9146359)

They also contain a small amount of hydrogen sulfide gas, which is what the smell comes from.

Re:Sulfur? (1, Informative)

JesseL (107722) | more than 10 years ago | (#9146365)

Yes, but it's sulfur compounds that make them stinky.

Bloody Yanks... (5, Funny)

Prowl (554277) | more than 10 years ago | (#9146259)

its sulphur

Get over it. (0, Flamebait)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#9146297)

We've taken your colonies.
We've taken over as superpower.
We're taking over the language.

Don't like it? Learn French.

Re:Bloody Yanks... (5, Funny)

BigBadBri (595126) | more than 10 years ago | (#9146304)

It ain't sulfur, boy - that there is good ol' Biblical brimstone!

The Lord has sent these here batteries to power the iBooks of the Sodomites, and will smite them mightily!

Re:Bloody Yanks... (5, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#9146306)

it's "sulfur" now, the International Union of Pure and Applied Chemistry [iupac.org] says so.

Re:Bloody Yanks... (4, Funny)

dotwaffle (610149) | more than 10 years ago | (#9146606)

IUPAC don't speak for England. They're international. So they're commie chemists! Sulphur! Honour! Colour! Crisps!

Re:Bloody Brits... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#9146314)

Get your cock out of your mouth, no one likes you anymore anyway.

Re:Bloody Brits... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#9146333)

At least our cocks are long enough to reach, you ignorant colonial tosspot.

Re:Bloody Yanks... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#9146321)

and in ye-olde English the f is written like an s
so sulfur would actually read sulsur in 1700

but those yanks make it up as they go along, thats what they do, from WMD and Human rights to spelling English

Re:Bloody Brits... (2, Funny)

ZackSchil (560462) | more than 10 years ago | (#9146350)

its [sic] sulphur [sic] [sionpower.com]

Scroll all the way to the bottom if you need help finding the address of their UK office. Also, work on your grammar and spelling; it's appa(u)lling.

Re:Bloody Brits... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#9146688)

Spelling of this lad is okay (Oll Korrect). "its" normally stands for "it is". "It's" normally stands for "belonging to it". And, "their/there/they're" are interchangeable. "Your" is "you are", etc. It is a new Internet speak, so to speak. Get used to it, dude...

Li-S? (2, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#9146267)

and the dash stands for......e! It's vaporware people! Either way, the NiCad consorteum is sending out hitmen as we speak.

Toxic vaporware. (1, Informative)

Ungrounded Lightning (62228) | more than 10 years ago | (#9146639)

and the dash stands for......e! It's vaporware people!

I thought it said they were shipping samples now. The several-years business is about when they might be competitive as a general service laptop battery.

= = = = =

But that looks like pretty TOXIC vaporware.

Not that the other battery technologies don't contain toxic substances, of course. (Cadmium, for instance, is pretty nasty if you ingest it.) But high-energy storage devices like this are prone to catching fire if they develop an internal short. As a number of users of cellphones with Lithium batteries discovered not too long ago.

If a lithium-sulpher battery catches fire I'd expect it to emit a lot of sulphur dioxide. That's a serious poison gas and a really painful way to die.

Excellent for the Chinese Market (5, Funny)

BigBadBri (595126) | more than 10 years ago | (#9146276)

From the article:

Li-S could be easily packed into the tinniest devices

That means it'll be great for powering my tinny DVD, my tinny digital camera, in fact anything tinny and of far-Eastern manufacture.

Tinny (1)

hot_Karls_bad_cavern (759797) | more than 10 years ago | (#9146470)

Wasn't that the name of one of those "mico webservers on a chip" things? i recall a classmate messing with something like that.

Re:Excellent for the Chinese Market (4, Funny)

NanoGator (522640) | more than 10 years ago | (#9146565)

"That means it'll be great for powering my tinny DVD, my tinny digital camera, in fact anything tinny and of far-Eastern manufacture."

Oh good, I can finally have a heart!

-TM

Re:Excellent for the Chinese Market (1, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#9146644)

tinny (tn") adj. tinnier, tinniest. 1. Of, containing, or yielding tin. 2. Tasting or smelling of tin: tinny canned food. 3. Having a thin metallic sound: a high tinny voice. 4. Weak or thin; flimsy.

So, your DVD is made of tin, wow! And you get some sound or images of out it. Real hitech of 2004...

Very nice. (5, Insightful)

i_am_syco (694486) | more than 10 years ago | (#9146277)

What about heat? I know that isn't always a big deal with batteries, but if you've got a device like a laptop, it can become a huge issue. I can imagine these powering the PowerBook G6 or something.

Re:Very nice. (1, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#9146294)

What about heat?...if you've got a device like a laptop, it can become a huge issue.

I know, you can fry you cock if you're not careful. Believe me, I know.

Yeah right. (4, Insightful)

Dark Lord Seth (584963) | more than 10 years ago | (#9146279)

Li-S still has a long ways to go, only at half the current polymer electrolyte fuel cell technology runtimes and with a maximum of 300 recharge cycles. Polymer electrolyte fuel cells are planned for release as early as 2007, while Li-S is still 3-5 years away.

Right, so much for 'news'. Call me when "still 3-5 years away" becomes "now available", then we'll give it a good look. As for fuel cells, they have been coming "Real Soon Now" (C) since... What? ... 2000 or so? Chances are we'll be stuck with Li-Ion batteries for quite a few years to come.

Re:Yeah right. (4, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#9146408)

Quick update on fuel cells:

The biggest problem of putting fuel cells into small electronics is the heat generated. Only the PEM [dodfuelcell.com] (Proton Exchange Membrane) type fuel cell can operate at low temperatures (as low as 80 C). Obviously this is a little too warm, so it isn't really useful for an MP3 player just yet.

PEM fuel cells must operate with hydrogen or use an external reformer to seperate hydrogen from a hydrocarbon. The big thing that prevents PEM fuel cells from becoming commercially viable (like being used in cars) is that a platinum catalyst must be used so most of the research on PEM fuel cells is to reduce the amount of platinum needed.

Re:Yeah right. (2, Informative)

downunda_wookiee (755913) | more than 10 years ago | (#9146414)

Polymer electrolyte fuel cells are planned for release as early as 2007, while Li-S is still 3-5 years away.

errr.... 2004 + (3-5 years) = 2007-2009.

So polymer electrolyte fuel cells and Li-S will be out at around the same time?

.wook

Re:Yeah right. (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#9146477)

Um.. polymer electrolyte fuel cells have been out for awhile. People just don't use them because they are too expensive.

cool (5, Funny)

hdd (772289) | more than 10 years ago | (#9146283)

" Li-S is still 3-5 years away." Wow just in time for 4.6Ghz longhorn laptops!

Fix a different problem... (4, Interesting)

smart.id (264791) | more than 10 years ago | (#9146286)

How about instead of making better batteries, we make it so the electronics don't use as much electricity? I think working on effeciency would be better. If someone is more knowledgable about this subject, though, feel free to correct me.

Re:Fix a different problem... (2, Informative)

hdd (772289) | more than 10 years ago | (#9146325)

Dha...I am no PhD but i know that greater energy input generally produce more work. And what makes you think no one is working on improving effeciency? Just take a look at the newest Dothan processor from intel. http://www6.tomshardware.com/mobile/20040510/index .html

Re:Fix a different problem... (4, Insightful)

AKAImBatman (238306) | more than 10 years ago | (#9146346)

How about instead of making better batteries, we make it so the electronics don't use as much electricity?

That's the approach that Apple takes. Their iBook line gets ~4 hours on a single charge. The problem is that they're bumping up against the lower limits of power consumption while still offering reasonable performance. If you want lower power consumption, you're going to have to give something up. That something is screen size, processor speed, hard disk, and memory.

Personally, I'd like a little Pu-238 to power my laptop with. I figure that about 600 grams would power my laptop nonstop for ~40 years.

Re:Fix a different problem... (1)

NeoSkandranon (515696) | more than 10 years ago | (#9146438)

it would keep your balls warm too

Re:Fix a different problem... (1)

AKAImBatman (238306) | more than 10 years ago | (#9146518)

it would keep your balls warm too

And the current batteries don't?

Re:Fix a different problem... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#9146567)

Try plugging your AA's into a sock warmer. Doesn't last long. But plutonium! Oh my! But remember to make a deposit at the sperm bank in case you want to have kids in the future. NOTE: and this part is important: deposit only BEFORE you put on the socks!

Re:Fix a different problem... (4, Funny)

hayden (9724) | more than 10 years ago | (#9146586)

Personally, I'd like a little Pu-238 to power my laptop with. I figure that about 600 grams would power my laptop nonstop for ~40 years.
I can see the marketing slogan now.

"The battery that kills you long before it runs out"

Re:Fix a different problem... (4, Interesting)

Spy Hunter (317220) | more than 10 years ago | (#9146366)

Of course they do that already. But there's only so low the power consumption can go and still provide reasonable performance.

Personally, I think the laptop fuel cell [mobilemag.com] mentioned in the article is a million times more interesting than this battery. Available as soon as 2007, they say, with capacity about four times higher than conventional batteries and of course the ability to be refueled instantly.

Re:Fix a different problem... (5, Insightful)

Indian (17922) | more than 10 years ago | (#9146396)

Batteries are not used just in electronics. Just think of hybrid cars, pacemakers etc. Having a portable, high energy density power source benifits a lot more things than just "electronics".

Re:Fix a different problem... (1)

budgenator (254554) | more than 10 years ago | (#9146495)

Hi-tech toys that eat a lot of electricity are good as they can pay the R&D expenses on batteries. Then the batteries can be used in things like electric vehicles.

Re:Fix a different problem... (2, Interesting)

gl4ss (559668) | more than 10 years ago | (#9146503)

Hell, it was a *windows* hardware developing conference(or something)..

the problem with (for example)ms smartphones vs other smartphones? battery life.

Ms's answer to a problem that to most people seems like a software proble: increase battery. Too bad for them that doesn't really make them any better choice for os(because obviously the competing one's could go even longer on this new battery).

the real reason for this announcement at there? they just 'need' the pr, and to start a rumour or few going on in the ms using circles that it doesn't matter that the os is more power hungry than it's competitors for no apparent reason because hey, the super battery is here...

Re:Fix a different problem... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#9146532)

Efficiency is nice, but its not going to change the load that electronics uses. This is because when the engineers who design a piece of electronics get together and write down the requirements, the extra efficiency is just going to be used to do something else. Its sort of like the financial statement that most people use as much money as they make (after taxes). If they make more, they are just going to use more. Same goes with engineers designing a piece of electronics. With that extra efficiency now they can have a *bigger* power on LED!

Re:Fix a different problem... (1)

Flower (31351) | more than 10 years ago | (#9146537)

How about we do what we're already doing and work on both? Oh and add in more work on lead free electronics, etc., etc.. Then we can derive a variety of benefits instead of just one.

Strangely, humans can be grouped to work on these tasks simultaneously. Overlook some minor/major faults and we are rather miraculous.

Hmmmm... (5, Funny)

Alexis Brooke (662281) | more than 10 years ago | (#9146290)

Well, these batteries might smell bad, but atleast they won't be depressed about it.

and to think... (0, Flamebait)

the right sock (160156) | more than 10 years ago | (#9146428)

...i always said 'thank god there's only one new jersey'

Mmmm sulfur (0, Interesting)

Mshift2x (686015) | more than 10 years ago | (#9146292)

Sulfur...just what we need more of in the air/water/soil

Re:Mmmm sulfur (1)

JesseL (107722) | more than 10 years ago | (#9146328)

Where do you think sulfur comes from to begin with?

conservation of mass (1)

bsDaemon (87307) | more than 10 years ago | (#9146380)

there won't be any more of it, merely it'll be in a different place. as JesseL said above, "where do you think it comes from to begin with?"

Re:conservation of mass (1)

Concerned Onlooker (473481) | more than 10 years ago | (#9146571)

there won't be any more of it, merely it'll be in a different place.

Well, then you proably won't mind if we dump some extra mercury in your drinking water. There won't be any more of it overall, it'll just be in a different place. Concentrated.

Re:conservation of mass (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#9146677)

Hint: mercury and sulfur aren't the same thing.

Really.

There's this thing called the "periodic table of the elements" you should take a peek at sometime.

Re:Mmmm sulfur (5, Informative)

no longer myself (741142) | more than 10 years ago | (#9146395)

Environmentally speaking the lithium currently in use is probably more of a threat, and cadmium is most definitely not something you want to eat.

We produce tons of sulfur waste every day simply because it's an abundant element to begin with. It may not smell nice when mixed with other things (as pure sulfur in its crytal form is nearly oderless), but it doesn't pose a significant health risk.

Heavy metals, petrolium distilates, and other exotic chemicals are still the greatest threat to landfill leaching.

All in all, with only 300 charges, I'll keep my fingers crossed they come up with something better.

Re:Mmmm sulfur (2, Informative)

Veramocor (262800) | more than 10 years ago | (#9146557)

In fact all the toilet paper you use and all the paper you use, is made from trees which are broken down using NaOH and Na2S. Thats why paper mills stink so much.

Light on details? (4, Insightful)

Monkelectric (546685) | more than 10 years ago | (#9146301)

It all comes down to how many mah (milliamp-hours) the battery can output, and the voltage/drain curve (not sure what the correct name for this is), and I don't see either of those things on this website. So until then, don't bother getting excited.

Re:Light on details? (4, Insightful)

JesseL (107722) | more than 10 years ago | (#9146391)

With the size, cost, and efficiency of buck/boost switching voltage regulators improving the way they are, I don't think that the discharge curve will be as critical as it used to be.

Re:Light on details? (3, Informative)

iammaxus (683241) | more than 10 years ago | (#9146598)

Not so insightful... What you probably meant to say was "how many milliamp hours the battery stores", but this is also incorrect. Current-time (mah) is a measure of how long a battery can output a certain current, but this does not let you compare the batteries power to batteries of other voltages. The true measure of how "powerful" these batteries are is power or energy per volume or density depending on what you really care about. power is usually given in watts and energy in watt-hours (for batteries). energy per volume is probably important in cell phones while energy (and power)per mass is probably more important in something like an electric car or maybe a laptop. As for not getting excited because the companies website doesn't mention these details, a quick Google search [google.com] turns up much of this information. A Lithium Sulfur battery does appear to be significantly better. Its discharge curve (i think thats what you were thinking of) also appears to be relatively flat. This means that it maintains the same

Of course there are many other important factors in a battery other than these such as the shelf life and "memory effect" but in general, this technology does appear to be as exciting as batteries get.

Re:Light on details? (2, Interesting)

iammaxus (683241) | more than 10 years ago | (#9146626)

Oops, forgot to finish my sentence: This means that it maintains the same voltage for a relatively long time, not decreasing significantly as it discharges

In 3-5 years... (1)

7Ghent (115876) | more than 10 years ago | (#9146302)

We goddamn better be using fuel cells or I'm gonna be pretty pissed.

Re:In 3-5 years... (1)

irokitt (663593) | more than 10 years ago | (#9146358)

I'm hoping we'll be using cold fusion by then, but unfortunately I doubt that will happen either.

Re:In 3-5 years... (1)

Neil Blender (555885) | more than 10 years ago | (#9146361)

Memo

RE: 7Ghent

The party's over, guys. We have to put our noses to the grindstone and get the fuel cell technology to the market and we have only 3 to 5 years to do it. Starting in 3 years, 7Ghent's anger is going to slowly rise . Trust me, you don't want to see the level it will attain if it takes us the whole 5 years. Johnson: your vacation is canceled. Same for you, Collins. Yes, I know you haven't taken one in 8 years but we're talking 7Ghent here. Alright everyone, GET TO WORK!

CC: All other companies working on fuel cell technology.

Re:In 3-5 years... (1)

pavon (30274) | more than 10 years ago | (#9146375)

I won't be. I'd much rather plug my cell phone in to be charged every couple days then have to refill/swap-out my fuel cell cartidge that often.

And as far as transportation goes, we are putting all sorts of research into fuel cells and still haven't found anything remotely practical, while electric rail has been economical for years.

It would will be cool if there is a breakthrough in fuel cell technology, but I am not counting on it.

Personally, I would love fuel cells... (1)

cr0sh (43134) | more than 10 years ago | (#9146592)

...but not for laptops.

If there were commercially available and low-cost fuel cell batteries that ran on butane, gasoline or methanol - I would all over them!

The hacking potential alone - sure, the initial ones might come as "non-refillable" or only refillable with special "cartridges" - but a dedicated hardware hacker could pull out the PEMs and such easily. Then it would be a simple matter to combine them and make a custom fuel cell for all kinds of uses.

I am in the (long) process of building a small electric vehicle (recumbent chassis using bicycle parts). Currently, I plan on using lead-acid gel-cells (good amperage, fast recharge times, rugged - but they weigh a lot) - I would love to be able to swap them out for a fuel cell. Right now I can't (without spending a whole lotta $$$).

I hope in the future this will change - and just like I can now with NiCd and NiMH batteries, I will be able to find them "surplus", and begin to hack on them to do what I want them to do...

The Manufacturer has more information (5, Informative)

PatrickThomson (712694) | more than 10 years ago | (#9146307)

More battery info here [sionpower.com]

Someone else (1)

vinit79 (740464) | more than 10 years ago | (#9146309)

Moltech [moltech.com] is already working on this. And they plan to release it in 2003 .. which means that it should be in the market .. However the parent article claims the batteries will be released in 3-5 years

Re:Someone else (2, Informative)

michael_cain (66650) | more than 10 years ago | (#9146530)

A little digging on the Sion web site shows that they are Moltech, just using a different name.

Re:Someone else (1)

vinit79 (740464) | more than 10 years ago | (#9146590)

Wow, Thats interesting, wonder what causes them to use 2 different names .. sounds fishy to me (Of course in true /. tradition I did not bother to look up the Sion website.

"Pull my finger" (2, Funny)

AtariAmarok (451306) | more than 10 years ago | (#9146311)

Time for "Pull my finger" pranks where someone pulls on your finger, and you boot up the iPod to provide the rotten-egg smell. Hilarious hijinx ensue.

Re:"Pull my finger" (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#9146339)

Sulfur by itself actually has no smell, the rotten egg smell comes from hydrogen sulfide (H2S)

Standard Cell Sizes? (4, Insightful)

Wraithlyn (133796) | more than 10 years ago | (#9146329)

It doesn't say anything about the cell sizes. (It does say "with a better power/weight ratio than anything on the market, Li-S could be easily packed into the tinniest devices"

The thing that's so attractive to me about NiMH's is they come in standard AAA and AA sizes. I make sure all my electronics take those (instead of say Lithimum Ion, which is usually proprietary), and then I can run everything on the same "fleet" of batteries.

I hope this tech follows suit. (I imagine it won't at first, but will eventually)

Re:Standard Cell Sizes? (1)

shaitand (626655) | more than 10 years ago | (#9146362)

What we need to do is update the standard sizes, AAA and AA and C and D and so forth are obsolete and huge. They aren't at all relevant to current technology and devices.

Sorry buddy, standards are good, but backwards compatibility is only good so long as you don't make significant sacrifices for it.

Re:Standard Cell Sizes? (1)

SparkyTWP (556246) | more than 10 years ago | (#9146637)

I'm not quite sure how they are obsolete, could you explain it to me?

C and D batteries aren't really used on electronic devices (At least not anything meant to be portable). Flashlights are about the only notable exception, but those are cylindrical anyway.

AA and AAA are pretty small. Any smaller and I know a lot of people (including myself) will be complaining about battery life. About the only thing I can think of to make them more efficient is maybe making them square instead cylindrical. And I don't know what that would do to manufacturing costs.

Re:Standard Cell Sizes? (2, Interesting)

atrus (73476) | more than 10 years ago | (#9146502)

Generally Li-ions are packed in proprietary packages since they need some temperature monitoring (or in the case of laptop batteries, there is even more circuitry inside) while charging, since the batteries are prone to explode if charged incorrectly. But the actual Li-ion batteries are often made in cells which are pretty close to the standard AA and AAA sizes. Just pop apart some laptop batteries for an example. Of course this rule doesn't always hold, for small form fitting batteries for iPods and such.

Sulfur huh? (2, Funny)

Lord Kano (13027) | more than 10 years ago | (#9146336)

So now you'll have to worry about smelling like rotten eggs when you charge up your PDA.

LK

Only 300 recharges? (2, Informative)

RuneB (170521) | more than 10 years ago | (#9146374)

If I understand the article correctly, it says that this new battery can only be recharged 300 times, and each recharge only lasts about 8 hours. This means that each battery will only last about 87 days, right?

Presumably, the price of the new battery will be higher than existing batteries, and it sounds like it could be a big annoyance factor to be worse than existing batteries. Would anyone spend the extra money for something that isn't that much better than what we have now? Supply and demand, and all that.

Or am I missing something?

Re:Only 300 recharges? (2, Flamebait)

Chairboy (88841) | more than 10 years ago | (#9146657)

Your 87 day has a lot wrong with it. First, it doesn't account for the time it takes to recharge the battery. Second, it assumes that some crazy eyed bandit is charging the battery, then unplugging from the wall and running it down to 0% while cackling madly, then replugging it into the wall.

A modern Lithium Ion battery can only be recharged about 100 times before it starts to fail rapidly, and the charge from those lasts 2-3 hours.

How, exactly, is this supposed to be bad again? Oh yeah, you're an idiot.

Mmmm... (5, Funny)

k4_pacific (736911) | more than 10 years ago | (#9146385)

Q. what would the battery industry give me if I developed a lightweight, portable, inexhaustible power supply?

A. A horse's head in my bed.

... or reduce power consumption! (4, Insightful)

EmbeddedJanitor (597831) | more than 10 years ago | (#9146387)

My laptop has a fan and blows out hot air.My ARM-based PDA at 400MHz is so cool you can't even tell that it is turned on.

The major reason we need these ultra-fast and hot Pentiums in our machines is crap, inefficient software. Look at Longhorn: it wants 2G of RAM and a two CPUs.

A friend of mine has a RiscOS box running a 100MHz ARM cpu. It is slicker than my Winshit PC with a 2GHz processor.

Re:... or reduce power consumption! (1)

Spokehedz (599285) | more than 10 years ago | (#9146494)

But what the heck can it do?

I mean, seriously--I want to play HL2, and I'm going to buy whatever it runs on so that I can. If that was the only thing that played the game at acceptable levels of Frames Per Second, then I'd buy that. but it can't--ever--so I won't.

Linux might run the best, and is the most reliable, never needs to be rebooted, yadda yadda yadda...

But you ain't got shit until you got games that work as easily as they do on Windows.

Period.

That's why there's so many people running windows, and that's why there's always gonna be so many people running windows.

If there was a port of CS over to Linux that came on a distro that its entire purpose was to _play that one game_ and it never crashed... ran on any hardware on the planet... and always worked... you'd make millions. Yes, you would. iD would be wise to release a bootable game CD that would run Doom3 if they want to prove me right.

Re:... or reduce power consumption! (2, Insightful)

LWATCDR (28044) | more than 10 years ago | (#9146609)

Heavens yes games are the only thing we all care about. I mean it is not like anyone ever uses a computer to work.
The point is that you do not really have to use XP or even an x86 CPU. Those programs could be compiled for other chips and OSs.
Some day X86 is going to run out of steam.

Re:... or reduce power consumption! (1)

EmbeddedJanitor (597831) | more than 10 years ago | (#9146635)

The inefficiencoies in Windows are not just a function of the useful speed of the system. You could get high speed gaming etc with a lot less cycle and power than Windows needs. All that XML eye candy takes a lot of processing with very little utility.

While Moore's Law is used as the solution to the processing bottleneck, the software will just get worse and CPU/power consumption will continue to grow. Microsoft is not motivated in any way to make their software more efficient.

Re:... or reduce power consumption! (1)

alphax45 (675119) | more than 10 years ago | (#9146641)

I couldn't have said that better myself. We all know Linux is the superior O/S, but until the games will run on it as easy as they do on Windows, it will always be OUR (slashdot crowd) O/S. The common end user wants some basic things from an OS

- Word (or something like it)
- Outlook (or something like it)
- Internet Explorer (or something like it)
- GAMES!! (current ones, like far cry and HL2)

If the O/S can't provide these, then it's no good for most end users.

Re:... or reduce power consumption! (1, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#9146617)

Can he run photoshop or some equivilent? Video editing? Cd-burning? How bout 3D renders? No? Can he load large spreadsheets without going grey haired?

I'll trade you my 100MHz ARM CPU for your 2GHz processor.

Heck here's a 486 running Linux, I'm sure you'll be fine using lynx, vim, and pine. Hey you said you wanted slick and fast.

You're comparing a Laptop and a PDA. One has a large screen, harddrive, and powerful CPU. Check up a few posts on Apples hardware. You can make things only so efficent before you bump into a wall.

Meanwhile... (3, Funny)

k4_pacific (736911) | more than 10 years ago | (#9146398)

Across the street at the Windows Reverse-Engineering Hardware Conference, a group of hackers got one of the Lithium-Sulpher batteries to work in a laptop running Linux.

Impact on the environment... (3, Interesting)

deragon (112986) | more than 10 years ago | (#9146399)

So, what will be the impact of this kind of battery on the environment, once it is disposed? Anybody can speculate?

At first I thought it read... (1, Funny)

StarTux (230379) | more than 10 years ago | (#9146402)

Linux-Sulpher batteries unveiled...

what is the big deal? (2, Interesting)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#9146404)

According to http://www.army-technology.com/contractors/electri cal/ultralife/ the Lithium MnO2 battery from ultralife provide 50% more power. According ultralifebatteries.com, the C batteries are highest rated at 4500 mAh @ 2V. The NiMH C batteries are available upto 5000 mAh @ 1.25 V. This means that Lithium-Sulfer has only as much power capacity as NiMH.

Did I miss something?

OMG sulfur is teh stink! (5, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#9146439)

For Crissakes people, if you own a car you're driving around with a Lead-Acid battery. Guess what type of acid it uses? Sulfuric. As in it has sulfur in it. Does your car smell like farts or rotten eggs? Not unless you're farting in it.

UPS systems also use AGM (absorbed glass mat) lead acid batteries. Don't smell any farts coming out of your UPS, do you?

Likewise, no, your laptop or PDA will not smell because of a battery containing sulfur. You'll have to keep blaming your flatulence on the dog.

Re:OMG sulfur is teh stink! (1)

John_McKee (100458) | more than 10 years ago | (#9146527)

So what you are saying is the new AIBO is going to take Li-S batteries?

Re:OMG sulfur is teh stink! (2, Interesting)

SlashHoe (730027) | more than 10 years ago | (#9146584)

Actually yes. A client of mine had a data center run by UPS with an undersized control unit for the batter array they were using. When said ups overheated the data center was filled by a rancid smell, evacuated and was shut down until it was cleared by the fire department.

Ok (2, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#9146483)

"Power hungry devices on the market today" had to be written by a marketing drone. Only commercially-obsessed marketing drones use inaccurately hyphenated phrases like "memory-hungry" and "power-hungry."

The phrases are meant to de-sensitize people to gluttony so they will drive 4.5 ton trucks with 18-inch wheels to the grocery store.

This means.. (5, Funny)

daishin (753851) | more than 10 years ago | (#9146485)

That Longhorn will be able to run on a laptop more than 30 minutes!

Could laptops once again be portable? (5, Interesting)

steve426f (746013) | more than 10 years ago | (#9146491)

With gaming laptops weighing in at nearly 10lbs. [techtv.com] and a battery life between 50 minutes and two hours, it seems they are less than portable.

Perhaps the Lithium-Sulfur batteries can provide a reasonable amount of time without adding weight--bringing portability back to laptops. Afterall, all of the wireless technologies are useless when you're tied to an AC outlet.

This has great potential (3, Funny)

daishin (753851) | more than 10 years ago | (#9146498)

For portable personal-pleasure devices...

Umm...I mean something running GNU/Linux ofcourse!

Li-S? How about Pu-As??? (-1, Redundant)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#9146505)

Man, talk about toxic substances. Litium and Sulphur....

I think the Plutonium-Arsenic battery will probably be even better!

Really? (3, Funny)

rixstep (611236) | more than 10 years ago | (#9146713)

SION believes that its new Lithium-Sulfur (Li-S) batteries are the answer to the power hungry devices on the market today.

Really?

They're an answer to Bill Gates, Steve Ballmer, and Microsoft?

Voltage of Cells (1, Interesting)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#9146728)

Can someone point me to a list of potentials for different elements as used in a battery, to figure out the voltage from two compounds?
Load More Comments
Slashdot Login

Need an Account?

Forgot your password?