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1 Kilometer Bluetooth Link to Cell Phone

CowboyNeal posted more than 9 years ago | from the long-distance-wireless dept.

Wireless Networking 94

carbolic writes "WiFi-Toys.com has posted an article (with pics) about performing a Bluetooth connection over a distance of 1 kilometer. They claim it is a new world record. They used a Class 1 USB adapter modded using a kit from Bluedriving.com. The over-the-air connection went to an unmodified Sony Ericsson T610 at a distance of 'about 3,300 feet' and they transferred a few pictures. This test was to a paired device pre-configured for the built-in ObexFTP access, but the implication is that now it's easy to Bluesnarf without even being near the target phone."

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94 comments

Yeah (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#9849614)

But does it run Linux.

Had to be said

Re:Yeah (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#9849977)

Linux is the alpha and the omega, and Linux is in all things. Do not ask "does it run Linux" but ask "does it exist" for if it does, it can only be one with the true Linux.

But getting off topic, has anybody noticed the distinct lack of IT section stories today? You know the section where everything is in "that color". Is it possible the editors have eliminated it, saving our eyes from punishment and our topics from redundancy? If it really is gone, many thanks to the editors for the great wisdom they show in not using the IT section.

Beautiful (3, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#9849633)

Now, where's my little bluetooth remote controlled helicopter.

*Rubs hands together in malicious glee*

Now I can take pictures of people 1 kilometer away, and transfer them to my laptop....

Eeeexcelleent..

But.. (3, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#9849636)

why? Doesn't bluetooth have its place, and 802.11x have a separate one?

I guess it has a "cool" factor, but not quite high enough to overcome the redundancy factor in this case.

Re:But.. (1)

Peridriga (308995) | more than 9 years ago | (#9850005)

2 words..... Power Consumption....

Re:But.. (1)

LnxAddct (679316) | more than 9 years ago | (#9850383)

3 words..... Data Transfer Rates....

Imperial conversion (5, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#9849642)

1 kilometer = 4.97096954 furlongs

Imperial conversion that makes SENSE (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#9849675)

1 kilometer = 3,280.8399 feet

Thanks, google.

Re:Imperial conversion that makes SENSE (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#9849695)

How much is this in 1/8s of a mile?

Re:Imperial conversion that makes SENSE (2, Informative)

zeux (129034) | more than 9 years ago | (#9849718)

4.97096954 1/8s of a mile = 1 kilometer = 3 280.8399 feet.

Re:Imperial conversion that makes SENSE (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#9849745)

1 kilometer = .000000000000105702341 light years

Re:Imperial conversion that makes SENSE (1)

Now15 (9715) | more than 9 years ago | (#9850269)

Why would real geeks care about imperial measurements, beyond, of course, the curiosity factor?

Metric just makes sense.

America is the odd one out here purely because their political system is based on populism -- not even a whiff of practicality to be seen anywhere.

Re:Imperial conversion that makes SENSE (1)

sqrt(2) (786011) | more than 9 years ago | (#9850473)

...their political system is based on populism...

Oh, you mean like the Popular Vote? [fec.gov]

Re:Imperial conversion that makes SENSE (1)

Asterisk (16357) | more than 9 years ago | (#9862625)

Metric just makes sense.
Actually, the use of metric for common practical applications makes very little sense. Ironically, this is precisely because of its rigid decimal consistency; after all, the world isn't fixed to decimal factors, and the primary purpose of measuring units is to measure things in the real world. Customary units, however, evolved directly from the circumstances in which they're applied, and are therefore completely suited to them.

Re:Imperial conversion (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#9849806)

What is a furlong? Does anyone actually use that unit? In which country?

Re:Imperial conversion (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#9849856)

horse racing, england, present day

Re:Imperial conversion (1)

Asterisk (16357) | more than 9 years ago | (#9862578)

A furlog is an eighth of a mile, and is used by name in horse racing. It also conveniently corresponds to the length of a typical city block.

Re:Imperial conversion (1)

0racle (667029) | more than 9 years ago | (#9849994)

1 kilometer = 198.838782 rods

How about a relevant unit? (1)

commodoresloat (172735) | more than 9 years ago | (#9850032)

I want to know how many cubits we're talking about here!

Re:How about a relevant unit? (1)

rembem (621820) | more than 9 years ago | (#9851281)

I want to know how many cubits we're talking about here!

1 kilometer = 2 187.2266 cubits

Oh the possibilities (5, Interesting)

f8ejf (755486) | more than 9 years ago | (#9849650)

Since bluetooth is in the 2.4GHz band, hams can probably use boosters of up to 200W legally, just like with WiFi.

We here at the radioclub were able to cover considerable distances with decent directional WiFi waveguides and 10W amplifiers. I wonder if bluetooth would fare as well... Hmmm, something to play with during the holidays :-)

Re:Oh the possibilities (3, Insightful)

LostCluster (625375) | more than 9 years ago | (#9849836)

2.4 GHz is 2.4 GHz... the radio waves don't really know or care which protocol's being used. I'd be very surprised if Bluetooth can do anything WiFi can't or vice versa given the same power and directional constraints.

Re:Oh the possibilities (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#9850031)

I'd personally be curious if the FCC might disagree: Not due to power considerations, but due to the fact that you may be using an unapproved amateur radio transmission mode. There are only so many digital and DSS modes that hams can use.

Re:Oh the possibilities (1)

Jeff DeMaagd (2015) | more than 9 years ago | (#9850035)

2.4 GHz is 2.4 GHz... the radio waves don't really know or care which protocol's being used. I'd be very surprised if Bluetooth can do anything WiFi can't or vice versa given the same power and directional constraints.

There is more to it than that. Modulation is important. Bluetooth isn't meant to go more than 10m, wireless b and g can go up to 100m. wireless b has a few times more usable bandwidth.

You do get more Bluetooth channels though, 79 I think, so more people can use it without interfering with each other.

You can use the same antennas and cabling though, maybe even the same amplifiers assuming the amplifier isn't specific to a signal or modulation type.

Re:Oh the possibilities (1)

Jeff DeMaagd (2015) | more than 9 years ago | (#9850242)

Oops, actually, with stock components, I've managed about 300m range on wireless b. With special antennae, about two miles / three kilometers, and this is through buildings and trees.

Re:Oh the possibilities (1)

Another MacHack (32639) | more than 9 years ago | (#9863271)

A class 1 Bluetooth radio is rated for 100m.

Re:Oh the possibilities (2, Informative)

niktesla (761443) | more than 9 years ago | (#9850188)

Actually, Bluetooth is not explicitly 2.4GHz. It frequency hops a band around 2.4GHz. It only keeps the same frequency for a few ms, before switching to another, which makes it rather noise immune: if a frequency is noisy, it just skips over to the next clear one. It's run by a special interest group (SIG) made up of several leading technology companies [bluetooth.org] . More [palowireless.com] information [intel.com] on Bluetooth [thewirelessdirectory.com] specifications [bluetooth.org] .

Re:Oh the possibilities (1)

Jeff DeMaagd (2015) | more than 9 years ago | (#9850008)

Hams can use that power, but the connection can't be encrypted. It's kind of useless for this thing you call "WiFi", you can't use WPA or even just WEP. You can't even legally connect to anything by HTTPS over that link.

With Bluetooth, you can't do any "pairing" which uses encryption.

Not that this stops anyone.

Re:Oh the possibilities (1)

andreyw (798182) | more than 9 years ago | (#9851247)

No it doesn't. Ethernet isn't encrypted either, and those that must, do splice. Use SSL and ensure safety.

fantastic.. (1, Interesting)

Turn-X Alphonse (789240) | more than 9 years ago | (#9849683)

May just be me here but I can't think of a use which would need that much distance... hell I can't think of a use for bluetooth in any distance... but then I hate mobile phones so I maybe biast

Re:fantastic.. (5, Insightful)

jrockway (229604) | more than 9 years ago | (#9849727)

> I hate mobile phones so I may be biased

I hear you. I'm glad I'm not the only one who doesn't want to replace my computer with a phone. People were suggesting that in 3 years there would be no computers, just phones (in yesterday's article). That, to me, is rediculous.

I personally quite like my PDA and Desktop and Laptop. I want a phone to make phone calls. I want my Desktop to run emacs and make. I want my Laptop to run iCal. Is there a problem with this?

Do one thing and do it well.

Re:fantastic.. (3, Funny)

Atmchicago (555403) | more than 9 years ago | (#9849875)

I want my Desktop to run emacs and make.

Well, actually, I use emacs to run my cell phone. But that's just me.

Re:fantastic.. (1)

jacoplane (78110) | more than 9 years ago | (#9849952)

Well, if you could hook your phone up to a full screen display and a keyboard [infosyncworld.com] & mouse, and you would have all the software you liked, would you still not want to use your phone as a computer? How long till handhelds have enough firepower [brighthand.com] to run things like KDE? Of course you might not be able to run Doom3, but even that might one day be feasable. Things like the PSP [playandview.com] show 3D graphics can be put into mobile devices.

You would of course have KDE mode going for full screen displays, and something like QTopia [trolltech.com] when using the phone display.

You say you just want a phone that can make calls. Well guess what, that's not how most other people feel. Convergence of devices is inevitable. I don't want to carry around my laptop, ipod, phone, PDA, digital camera, gameboy etc around with me all the time. If a company can provide all these features in one device, they've got me as a customer!

Do one thing and do it well is someting we hear all the time these days on slashdot. However, the PC as we know it is the most clear example of a multi-purpose device! You just want to run Make, emacs and ical. Other people use it for totally different purposes.

The PC will probably be with us for a while yet, but eventually I do see smartphones replacing them. It's just a matter of time.

Re:fantastic.. (1)

blitziod (591194) | more than 9 years ago | (#9850700)

I would rather have a black and white( or blue and black) display phone that is REALLY small with almost no screen BUT has a blue tooth connection and is data enabled.

This would allow for lower price, lower power consumption and SMALL size.

WHY have a large color screen on a blue tooth phone when my palm has a bigger screen, faster speed and can connect easily to the phone?

Re:fantastic.. (1)

stimpleton (732392) | more than 9 years ago | (#9849989)



jrockways attitude to mobile phones reiterates a study done recently, and annecdotal evidence I recieve from my non-tech friends:

people want a mobile phone for....phone calls.

Desired additioanl functionality usually extends to somewhere to keep your contact list of phone numbers.

Have you backed up your mobile phone lately? [thefeature.com]

Re:fantastic.. (1)

mewphobia (630153) | more than 9 years ago | (#9851198)

Do one thing and do it well.

I'm a bit undecided on this concept. I love it as a principle of .+nix - I understand that each program generally does one task and this makes .+nix powerful.

But the problem seems to be with defining "one thing". What is one thing? Make calls? Recieve calls? Be my personal communications device?

So far, it seems to me that someone came up with this phrase "Do one thing and do it well." and it stuck, but noone really thought it through. It's kinda like the KISS - "Keep it simple stupid" principal, but less thought out.

Re:fantastic.. (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#9849898)

May just be me here but I can't think of a use which would need that much distance... hell I can't think of a use for bluetooth in any distance...

My best friend and I have houses about 100meters away from each other. This would be awesome. He and I both plan to get a Sony PSP that has bluetooth and wifi. This would be awesome, he could be in his house, I could be in mine, and we could play 2 player PSP.

Of course if the blue tooth wont work that distance theres always the wifi...

Re:fantastic.. (2, Interesting)

MooCows (718367) | more than 9 years ago | (#9851888)

To me the advantage of a mobile phone with bluetooth (and GPRS) is I can connect to it with my PDA and my Laptop.

Result: GPRS/UMTS on my PDA and Laptop.

Which means internet access everywhere there's mobile phone coverage.

Result: Slashdot everywhere :)

Thanks for clearing that up (1)

John Jorsett (171560) | more than 9 years ago | (#9849702)

Two files has been copied previously, while one file was had never been transferred until this test to ensure it was a true FTP over-the-air transfer.

Uhhh ... yeeeaah.

Re:Thanks for clearing that up (1)

sinnfeiner1916 (793749) | more than 9 years ago | (#9849927)

they ain't never got no brain or nothin'

The perfect Friday night story (4, Funny)

FunWithHeadlines (644929) | more than 9 years ago | (#9849709)

So what do geeks do on a Friday night? They discuss extending bluetooth ranges in experiments and speculate on all the ways it could be used, both useful and silly. Now if they could just figure out a way to use bluetooth to get dates...

Re:The perfect Friday night story (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#9849736)

Once the robotic women arrive bluetooth will help. Oh, and how it will tantalize them.

Mmm mmm....

*faints in ecstasy*

Re:The perfect Friday night story (4, Funny)

John Jorsett (171560) | more than 9 years ago | (#9849743)

So what do geeks do on a Friday night? They discuss extending bluetooth ranges in experiments and speculate on all the ways it could be used, both useful and silly. Now if they could just figure out a way to use bluetooth to get dates...

Actually, geeks spend their Thursday nights talking about how to use Bluetooth to get dates [mypdacafe.com] . I guess when their shortrange schemes fall flat, they spend Friday figuring out how to up the distance.

Apparently promote their own online stores (2, Informative)

SuperBanana (662181) | more than 9 years ago | (#9849816)

So what do geeks do on a Friday night?

Apparently promote their online store...

Re:The perfect Friday night story (2, Interesting)

dracvl (541254) | more than 9 years ago | (#9849879)

Now if they could just figure out a way to use bluetooth to get dates...

I believe you're looking for this [theregister.co.uk] .

Toothing (2, Interesting)

baka_vic (769186) | more than 9 years ago | (#9849880)

Well, toothing seems to be all the rage in the EU. Here's a definition by Wikipedia:
Toothing describes the use of a Bluetooth enabled mobile phone or PDA to arrange sexual encounters. Linky [wikipedia.org]

$12 Walkie Talkies (4, Interesting)

aklix (801048) | more than 9 years ago | (#9849716)

I used 2 $12 walkie talkies to control an RC car. Never tested it a mile because i wouldnt be able to see it (suposedly goes 2 miles) but it kept in great range, even when we used binoculars. Simple task too.

Re:$12 Walkie Talkies (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#9850156)

...still waiting for some HAM or RC airplane enthusiast to explain why this is illegal and dangerous.

Re:$12 Walkie Talkies (1)

Exiler (589908) | more than 9 years ago | (#9850344)

I'm not licensed for HAM nor am I an RC enthusiast, but I'm pretty sure those radioshack walkie talkies are on unlicensed CB frequencies, otherwise they wouldn't be able to sell them as if they didn't require any license at all.

Re:$12 Walkie Talkies (2, Informative)

Solosoft (622322) | more than 9 years ago | (#9851060)

FRS FRS Radios are like CB kinda but digital and cheap :)

I have 2 at home and they work well for long distance talking and are very cheap. PLus you need no license

Stop Demonizing Microsoft (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#9849728)

Check out this blog entry [google.com] from a Microsoftie. These are real people trying to do good stuff. Stop demonizing them.

Not very exciting (2, Interesting)

SuperBanana (662181) | more than 9 years ago | (#9849748)

WiFi-Toys.com has posted an article (with pics)

And they're pretty lame pictures, at that. One is of a guy holding something AWAY from the camera that looks like it might be a box. Or a piece of cardboard. We have no idea. Another pic shows a picture of a hill, with a GIANT red hand-drawn arrow pointing to where the phone is. Picture #3 is the boot screen for the phone, courtesy T-Mobile. Then we get a blurry pic of the linksys bluetooth adapter with a giant cable coming off it...and last but not least...a picture of the bluetooth-raped cellphone..so traumatized, it has switched itself off.

Cute the Visene guy- "Wooooooow".

Re:Not very exciting (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#9849870)

you tryin to say that visene guy is cute? gross

Re:Not very exciting (1)

brianjcain (622084) | more than 9 years ago | (#9850100)

Cute the Visene guy- "Wooooooow".

I'm guessing that should be "Cue the Visine guy"?

I assume that you're referring to Nixon's former speech writer, later game show host, Ben Stein [wikipedia.org] when you say, "Visine guy"...?

GENTOO (1)

ircbuddy (732046) | more than 9 years ago | (#9849778)

nt

Stop Demonizing Microsoft (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#9849802)

Sorry, I mean to post this URL [msdn.com] .

Yeah, a 1kilometer link (-1, Troll)

1km Link To My Ass (801752) | more than 9 years ago | (#9849808)

To my ASS!

Yipee!

Does this mean... (2, Funny)

eieken (635333) | more than 9 years ago | (#9849811)

Soon we will see people walking around screaming at their phone because someone hacked it? I think that would be amusing.

Re:Does this mean... (1, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#9849946)

So then...

1) Hack bluetooth phone at random

2) Force it to play an .mp3 of "Can you hear me now?" at maximum volume and for an inderterminate amount of time.

3) ???

4) Profit! (Or at least laughter on my part...)

Re:Does this mean... (2, Funny)

beswicks (584636) | more than 9 years ago | (#9850101)

Shouldn't that be

1) Hack phone to play "give me you underpants"

2) Take Underpants

3) ???

4) Profit

Re:Does this mean... (1)

1km Link To My Ass (801752) | more than 9 years ago | (#9849997)

can u hack my ASS instead?

yipee!

can u smell it? (2, Interesting)

Bog Standard (743863) | more than 9 years ago | (#9849864)

The fact that the device was "pre-configured" and then "unmodified" should raise a few eyebrows. This is pure FUD and marketing bull. Anyone with at least a plebsworth of IT sense knows that to form a connection it takes two ends. I havent read the article but then again I don't need to.

Pfffft (3, Funny)

Billobob (532161) | more than 9 years ago | (#9849904)

My tesla coil has a range of blowing up every light bulb within 5 miles MINIMUM...

Re:Pfffft (1)

OOO0000OO0O0 (799394) | more than 9 years ago | (#9850680)

That means my tesla coil can blow out your tesla coil. Mine is so powerful it doesn't even work, because the powerplants can't charge up that one capacitor.

Re:Pfffft (1)

tekwiz (709188) | more than 9 years ago | (#9850861)

Oh yeah? Mine cause the blackout last year..;)

Re:Pfffft (2, Funny)

The Evil Couch (621105) | more than 9 years ago | (#9851373)

bah. I can use smoke signals to transmit at a range of over a 100 miles.

put that in my pipe and smoke it!

Pringles cans... (3, Funny)

mikael (484) | more than 9 years ago | (#9849928)

The over-the-air connection went to an unmodified Sony Ericsson T610 at a distance of 'about 3,300 feet' and they transferred a few pictures. This test was to a paired device pre-configured for the built-in ObexFTP access, but the implication is that now it's easy to Bluesnarf without even being near the target phone."

And they haven't even started using Pringles cans yet.

Re:Pringles cans... (1)

CarrionBird (589738) | more than 9 years ago | (#9850079)

Just wait until they find the old primestar dish. WOO!!!

Re:Pringles cans... (2, Funny)

beswicks (584636) | more than 9 years ago | (#9850086)

You mean the scary pringles can shaped wireless sniffer boxes like the ones the us army has been developing to drop over battles fields, which each have a range of 1Km and form an ad hock network to report/jam 'the badguys' traffic.

OR

Do you mean 2 pringles cans and a piece of string, like the ones the us army will have to use when 'the badguys' pick them all up and drop them back over the us army?

Re:Pringles cans... (1)

tekwiz (709188) | more than 9 years ago | (#9850885)

lmao...mod parent up please..either informative or funny..you choose

Re:Pringles cans... (2, Funny)

mikael (484) | more than 9 years ago | (#9852270)

I meant the low budget wireless booster cans, with the extra spicy cajun flavour [turnpoint.net] . Our research team spent a weekend determining which cans were more efficient (the original flavor, sour cream and onion, sweet mesquite BBQ, or cheese and onion). So far, there seems to be no difference due to flavor. However, we may have to repeat the experiments, just to make sure weather conditions didn't have any influence on the results.

Re:Pringles cans... (1)

beswicks (584636) | more than 9 years ago | (#9852348)

Te he,

That is soooo, cool.

Its like someone saw the american armys multi-million dollar research project for spying, and thought, mmm...

Its REALLY shows that defense gets totally screwed by defense contractors, i mean $10,000 for an f'ing pringles can.

I mean just get a load of these and use them to hack the troups cells and download all there SMS's etc.

And the american govenment was worrying about these cellphone coke cans, look out for the pringles band coming to your government building soon ;)

The org slashdot story is

http://it.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=03/08/15/152 202&tid=103&tid=193 [slashdot.org]

For anyone who wants to check my random mumblings.

Another ADVERTISEMENT (5, Interesting)

gnuber (605327) | more than 9 years ago | (#9849970)

I hate it when /. posts blatant product advertisements as stories. This story was submitted by "Carbolic", whose given URL (mouse-over his name) is Wifi-toys.com. He talks about a wifi-toys.com story (in the third person), and links to the "kit from bluedriving.com". The small print on that page notes that Bluedriving.com is a member site of wifi-toys.com . The $99 "kit" linked to is just a $45 Linksys adaptor [amazon.com] and a CD of freeware and drivers (you'd be better off downloading the newest versions from the net). A fool and his money are soon parted, I guess. This is the second time [slashdot.org] this week that Carbolic has posted a story linking to his site.

I won't fault Carbolic for pimping his site, particularly since he isn't hiding his affiliation. But the /. editors should filter this spam out.

Re:Another ADVERTISEMENT (1)

callipygian-showsyst (631222) | more than 9 years ago | (#9850337)

What do you expect from the /. editors? They're just dot-com idiots, who never held a real job or had any real responsibility in their lives!

Re:Another ADVERTISEMENT (1)

tekwiz (709188) | more than 9 years ago | (#9850847)

maybe they get kick backs?

Re:Another ADVERTISEMENT (1)

t_allardyce (48447) | more than 9 years ago | (#9851402)

Is it that big a deal? its better than on TV shows where they stop "and take a minute to mention a product that could change your life.." its not like the story shouldnt be on /. and if they are getting paid they gotta keep the thing running somehow, consider that most sites cant even survive 10 minutes of what slashdot.org servers take 24/7

Re:Another ADVERTISEMENT (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#9851657)

And the "Advanced Kit" looks suspicius. What the hell do you do with the N-type pigtail... you rip the Bluetooth adaptor and SOLDER the pigtail to it ???

-AC

The flip side (2, Interesting)

macemoneta (154740) | more than 9 years ago | (#9850043)

With a good sized dish, you can probably monitor anyone in your neighborhood typing on a BT keyboard. Encryption doesn't do any good, if the clear text data is compromised.

Re:The flip side (1)

t_allardyce (48447) | more than 9 years ago | (#9851395)

I would have thought - for a keyboard (or cordless phone, mouse etc etc) it would be very easy for the manufacturer to stick in a very very long symetric key - eg 1Mbit that both the transmitter and reciever units had, that way you would need an awful lot of clear text to break it and brute force would be out. 1Mbit of memory is worth nothing and even something like 16k that comes on most cheap microcontrollers would do. I would even go as far as to have a little metal spot that you could touch them together with and that would make them generate a new key together. It could work for most devices that generally only need to talk in pairs and just need a one-off setup. Is this total crap or what?

Re:The flip side (1)

macemoneta (154740) | more than 9 years ago | (#9851582)

No, it's not crap. What you're proposing is a combination of NFC (Near Field Communications) and BT, where the NFC is used for key exchange. Very large keys are not needed for sufficiently strong security.

My garage door opener has a conceptually similar technology... Instead of setting little DIP switches for the key, you "train" (synchronize) the opener to recognize each remote. It's a very intuitive user interface.

Re:The flip side (1)

t_allardyce (48447) | more than 9 years ago | (#9851688)

yep there are dip switches on my doorbell too but only about 8. is NFC still wireless? i would have thought an actual physical connection would be safer. Long keys might not be needed but considering the cost isnt a problem anymore with cheap memory, the longer the key the more secure, future proof, and geeky your product becomes. Whats the deal with bluetooth? and why didnt they just push wide adoption of this sort of thing from the start? i.e phones having a little metal bit and if both phones have it you just tap them together until they beep and then you've got a super-secure connection (although im sure someone would comeup with a way of picking up the EMF from afew feet away and grabbing the key.

Re:The flip side (1)

macemoneta (154740) | more than 9 years ago | (#9855323)

NFC is very short range wireless (a few centimeters, so it's effectively a touch). More info here [philips.com] , and here [wi-fiplanet.com] . You can consider it an evolution in the user interface of existing wireless systems, like BT or WiFi.

Re:The flip side (1)

scobber (681830) | more than 9 years ago | (#9858197)

It turns out to be much harder than that even for unencrypted data.

The frequency hopping is a major factor. The psuedo-random hopping sequence is determined when the devices first connect. If you're not listening at that time (and know the device addresses of each), to get on track is far more difficult than it is worth. Remember its hopping ~1000 times a second.

I've used $40K USD Bluetooth sniffers for development and debugging. It's difficult enough to get the sniffer to sync when you are carefully controlling all three devices.

I just think it's pretty funny that people are so worried about people snooping in on their BT headset conversations while they sit in a restaraunt annoying the hell out of everyone as it is.

Cheers

Re:The flip side (1)

Another MacHack (32639) | more than 9 years ago | (#9863300)

Although a user could choose not to enable Bluetooth encryption for a keyboard, the specification covering keyboards (HID) mandates that encryption be supported.

Re:The flip side (1)

macemoneta (154740) | more than 9 years ago | (#9863682)

Even with BT encryption, BT is considered weak [linuxsecurity.com] . Remember that BT devices are low-power, which means that they likely don't have the computational resources for strong encryption.

Since a BT keyboard tends to remain in the same general location, and a malicious listener can be a considerable distance away undetected, spending even a few days to crack the encryption is entirely reasonable. Wardriving tools for BT exist in the wild [shmoo.com] .

It's not as easy (or even possible in most cases) to add additional layers of strong encryption to BT as it is for WiFi. So while WiFi can also be cracked, cracking a transported VPN isn't currently feasible. BT has no such option, and once cracked anything typed (userid, password, bank account numbers, PINs, private correspondence, etc.) are easily read, in real-time.

Wasted effort ? (2, Funny)

m4k3r (777443) | more than 9 years ago | (#9850182)

Wouldn't it have been easier to just take the phone with you ? Surely, that's why they're designed small enough to fit in your hand ?

Oh, yeah, I forgot this was /.

now that makes MP useful (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#9850262)

That's 100x the usual MeetingPoint working range.

http://www.net-cell.com/MP

Now we only need a Linux (Sharp Zaurus?) version :-)

mod 3own (-1, Flamebait)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#9850731)

Bluetooth range (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#9851050)

Is it just me, or can anybody else see that there might be a perfectly valid reason why bluetooth does not perform over such a range 'out of the box'?

Not to take anything away from the cool 'because we can' side of it.

Re:Bluetooth range (1)

scobber (681830) | more than 9 years ago | (#9858282)

I have worked with a Bluetooth device from a Swedish company that we were able to get a good connection at about a mile. This was out of the box - just a bigger box :-)

They were very directional dishes (about the size of a Frisbee(tm)). To get a mile range, we had to point them fairly carefully. As you got closer, it wasn't so bad. It came in two flavors (last time I looked): one was essentially an ethernet repeater (point to point) the other was a serial port repeater (again point to point.

The developer claimed that they started using WiFi, but ran into timing or synch issues that drove them to evaluate using BT instead. This was a while ago, so details are vague. I suppose if someone is interested, I could try to remember who made the devices. Clearly, this is p*ss poor attempt at product promotion :-)

Oh, and yes. This particular test was done 2 am on a Thursday night. It was the only time we could get a straight shot on the street without getting killed. While I personally was not using this as an attempt to get dates (I was already married) there may be an advantage to using this as a date scheme from such a distance... It gives either party a better head start when they decide to run away.

Cheers,

Steve

Slashdot - No longer just for geeks (1)

Indomitus (578) | more than 9 years ago | (#9853723)

You can really tell the geek/civilian ratio has gone more and more to the civilian non-geek side by the number of 'What is this useful for?' posts on this story. A real geek knows that a hack is important in and of itself and no usefulness is implied or important.

BluAdverts anyone?? (1)

keithamus (753826) | more than 9 years ago | (#9853828)

I am seeing ALOT of advertising companies trying their hand at this to bluejack people with advertising. An easy way to make money, seeing as the only cost would involve equipment. I for one normally accept bluejacking attempts just because of pure curiosity, Im sure 6months down the line I wont be....

Nice Adversiting (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#9855358)

Nice advertising feature on Bluedriving. I'll bet they'll sell a bunch of "Blue Driving Kits."

1km-Ranged Bluetooth 'Sniper Rifle' (1)

Mekkis (769156) | more than 9 years ago | (#9863874)

Actually, I was at DefCon covering the convention for a documentary about hackers and I interviewed the kids who designed the device in question. The thing about it is that it's not your average Yagi - they've actually mounted the Yagi directional antenna and associated Bluetooth gear on a Ruger Mini-14 stock, along with a scope and a hefty helping of electrical tape. It's creepy seeing one of the inventors standing in front of a window on the third story, 'sniping' phones through walls in another building. Additionally, it's not just snarfing up info or sending annoying text messages on phones or other Bluetooth enabled devices, they can actually hack phones so they can intercept calls, download all information in their memories, or even (theoretically) clone their numbers. This proof-of-concept device shows amazing promise for the espionage field. I have footage of this which will appear in the documentary, provided it passess Q.C. with the DefCon staff. =-Mekkis-=
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