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P2P vs. The Clones

CowboyNeal posted more than 10 years ago | from the hidden-payloads dept.

Software 289

smash writes "Rebranding software then loading it with spyware and adware (or just selling it for profit) has become a recent trend with oversea individuals trying to make a few bucks. We all remember the KaZaA Gold, don't we? Shareaza, which recently went open source under the GPL, has been subject to a similar type of theft by a company going by the name RockSoft Development. Surprisingly enough, their software labelled as 'Go Music' hasn't been pulled from C|Net's Download.com after more than a week."

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Hahaha.... (5, Insightful)

Izago909 (637084) | more than 10 years ago | (#9953862)

You can never go bankrupt betting on the ignorance of average PC users.

Re:Hahaha.... (-1, Troll)

RLiegh (247921) | more than 10 years ago | (#9953875)

theives stealing from theives; what sweet, sweet delicious irony!

Re:Hahaha.... (0, Troll)

Izago909 (637084) | more than 10 years ago | (#9953922)

You sir have won the daily "Tool of the Industry" award by spouting their corporate spin and calling pirates thievs. You shall recieve you prize tomorrow moring when you show up to your desk at the RIAA. The dictionary.... er... prize doubles as a stress reliever. Just bang repeatedly over your head.

Re:Hahaha.... (1, Funny)

RLiegh (247921) | more than 10 years ago | (#9953943)

You sir have won the daily "Tool of the Industry" award by spouting their corporate spin and calling pirates thievs.

Are you going to have one sent around your desk too, or do you accept the corporate labeling of copyright infringers as "pirates" and only object to them being called "thieves"?

Re:Hahaha.... (-1, Offtopic)

Izago909 (637084) | more than 10 years ago | (#9953987)

Here [reference.com] is the definition of "pirate". Please pay close attention to line #3 for both singular and plural definitions. Here [reference.com] is another word that applies to your previous post. Please pay close attention definition #1 as it is the only one that applies to your writing style.

Re:Hahaha.... (3, Funny)

sqrt(2) (786011) | more than 10 years ago | (#9954043)

WRONG. That is a popular definition and not an acceptable LEGAL definition. Piracy is murder and plunder on the high seas AND THAT'S IT.

Re:Hahaha.... (3, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#9954221)

In the context of computers, "pirate" is a shorter name for "copyright infringer." It's been this way since the first Apple ][ game was copied from one floppy to another. Deal with it.

In this context, "pirate" refers to a roaming stealer of ships as much as "mouse" refers to a furry animal. When you start closing your "windows" to stop the draft coming through your monitor, you can start getting incensed by the use of the word "pirate."

Re:Hahaha.... (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#9953921)

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Re:Hahaha.... (3, Interesting)

JPriest (547211) | more than 10 years ago | (#9954203)

Something I was thinking about the other day. It is pretty obvious that spyware is a gray area in legislation, but maybe there would be a loophole in this. Say I require anyone that develop software for my OS have a free license to do so. I could simply refuse less than credible companies a license. Instead of going after them for writing intrusive software, you could go after them for license violations.

A big company like MS could never get away with this, but I wonder if one could build a Linux distro with a module or something that requires such a license. The idea would add another layer of security for people that use that distro again legit companies whose software is not considered malicious but should be. Is anyone doing something like this?

Restricting Free (as in speech) Software (4, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#9953864)

This does, in fact, represent a flaw in current open-source licenses such as GPL, and in the free (as in speech) software movement in general.

I've noticed this happening more and more as I am called upon to uninstall this kind of garbage from my friends' computers; "Uhh, this looks rather like Gnucleus; you could have just gotten that for free, without the spyware, you know...."

The idea is that adding spyware to open-source projects circumvents the "You can't take this software and sell it" restriction of the licenses because it's not being sold. It's just adding spyware to. And in some cases, the source code isn't even modified, so there is no need to redistribute the modified source code as per the license. It's just open-source software bundled with spyware in an installer.

The problem in using a license such as the GPL, and giving people essentially unlimited rights to incorporate your code into their software is that you'll end up with situations like this, and most critically, have absolutely no recourse against them so long as they are following the letter of the agreement.

(In this particular case, I don't know if they're following it or not. I don't see them providing the source code for download, so they may be in violation if they have modified it. But I may just have missed the link, and I'm not about to install their spyware fest on my box to see if it comes with source code or some such.)

The solution, unfortunately, would seem to be to add more restrictions to the licenses, similar to how the you-cannot-sell-this-software-for-more-than-the-co st-of-copying-and-the-media clause works. The difficulty comes in deciding exactly what needs to be restricted, and how to word it properly. You then combine this with a proper copyright on the code, and you have something you can enforce.

Because at that point, once you can clearly show that the company pulling this crap is in violation of your license, you can start using the DMCA as your friend, and issuing takedown notices to their ISP. Do you think for a minute that C|Net would still have the files available for download if they'd been told that they are an illegal distribution of copyrighted material? Doubtful.

That's funny; I didn't see that clause (3, Informative)

tepples (727027) | more than 10 years ago | (#9953915)

The solution, unfortunately, would seem to be to add more restrictions to the licenses, similar to how the you-cannot-sell-this-software-for-more-than-the-co st-of-copying-and-the-media clause works.

What clause? Gnucleus, Shareaza, and eMule are licensed under the GNU General Public License. This license lets a redistributor sell copies or digital deliveries of a covered program provided that the source code is either included or available at cost.

Re:That's funny; I didn't see that clause (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#9954120)

Who would believe in a "right to choose" to kill your own children?

you obviously don't have children of your own. ;)

Re:That's funny; I didn't see that clause (-1, Flamebait)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#9954265)

Who would believe in a "right to choose" to kill your own children?

As long as they are under 2 or 3 years old, since they have likely not reached the level of self-consciousness yet. I don't see any problem with leaving a young infant out for the wolves if you don't want it.

Re:That's funny; I didn't see that clause (-1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#9954314)

> Who would believe in a "right to choose" to kill your own children?

Any terrified teenage girl who just found out the hard way that the condom broke and the pill isn't 99.9% effective, you sanctimonious fuckass.

They HAVE modified it (2, Insightful)

Savet Hegar (791567) | more than 10 years ago | (#9953917)

By rereleasing the software with spyware included, they have modified the software. Certain linux distributions contain proprietary software, but linux = the kernel. linux does not equal the distribution.

gnucleus, gtk-gnutella, etc are covered by the GPL. So modifying the program itself means they MUST release the source code at no additional charge.

They aren't actually doing anything wrong by charging a price for this software either. Technically, they could justify it for their "enhancements" to the software such as spyware and adware.

GPL allowes selling the program (1)

TorKlingberg (599697) | more than 10 years ago | (#9953931)

The GPL does not forbid you from selling modified versions. It only says that if you have distributed the binary to someone, you cannot charge for the source (more than shipping etc.)

Re:Restricting Free (as in speech) Software (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#9953939)

i couldnt find the part where you arent allowed to sell gnu software
you just have to supply the source

Re:Restricting Free (as in speech) Software (2, Insightful)

FuzzyFox (772046) | more than 10 years ago | (#9953948)

If someone managed to package up something they found for free, and sell it to somebody, good for them! They managed to separate a fool from his money. That's what the economy is all about, after all.

Users are supposed to not be stupid. They should shop around, check out the market. If they do that, they will find that the software is available for free, and they don't need to pay for it, or even download a re-branded form of it. Caveat emptor!

Stupid users are always going to end up with spyware on their machine.

Re:Restricting Free (as in speech) Software (4, Informative)

pavon (30274) | more than 10 years ago | (#9953953)

This doesn't change the main point of your argument, but you are slightly misinformed about what the GPL says about selling software. The GPL allows you to take the software and sell it at any price you want, bundled or not. However, you must either

A) include the source with sold binary, or
B) make it available seperately at additional cost.

It is just this additional cost that is limited to reasonable compensation.

Re:Restricting Free (as in speech) Software (1)

eurleif (613257) | more than 10 years ago | (#9954092)

Er, not quite. The additional cost can only be "no more than your cost of physically performing source distribution", and you're certainly not required to charge anything for distribution.

Re:Restricting Free (as in speech) Software (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#9954132)

(I'm the AC who wrote the original post in this thread.)

I think it really says something--even more than what the actual details of the license are--when three people in these cascading posts, all of whom obviously have some experience with free software, had three different ideas of how the GPL actually works. It's almost as if the GPL has attained some sort of cult status that everyone just defers to, assuming it fits whatever their perfect vision of free software is, without bothering to really look at all the details of.

I now see that I was mixing in a lot of free-as-in-beer with the free-as-in-speech in my understanding of the GPL. I, personally, read it all once back in the mid 90's, and haven't really looked at it since, just assuming that I'd remember all the important details over time. Obviously my memory was both selective and spotty. Certainly it would be a good time for me to take another look; perhaps others might be inspired to as well.

Re:Restricting Free (as in speech) Software (2, Informative)

Artega VH (739847) | more than 10 years ago | (#9954097)

being a bit more specific

From the GPL: "1. You may copy and distribute verbatim copies of the Program's source code as you receive it, in any medium, provided that you conspicuously and appropriately publish on each copy an appropriate copyright notice and disclaimer of warranty; keep intact all the notices that refer to this License and to the absence of any warranty; and give any other recipients of the Program a copy of this License along with the Program.

You may charge a fee for the physical act of transferring a copy, and you may at your option offer warranty protection in exchange for a fee."

And from the GPL FAQ: "Yes. You can charge any fee you wish for distributing a copy of the program. If you distribute binaries by download, you must provide "equivalent access" to download the source--therefore, the fee to download source may not be greater than the fee to download the binary." but note that "The right to sell copies is part of the definition of free software. Except in one special situation, there is no limit on what price you can charge. (The one exception is the required written offer to provide source code that must accompany binary-only release.)"

Re:Restricting Free (as in speech) Software (2, Informative)

forlornhope (688722) | more than 10 years ago | (#9953964)

Not exactly correct. Acctually very wrong. First, the GPL doesn't say you can't sell a piece of software. You actually can and many people do(Red Hat, SUSE, etc.).

To counter the rest of your argument, its unclear as to how far the GPL extends, but some people read it to say that if you distribute GPL source inside your _product_ the product must be licenced under the GPL. This is because the definition of a Derivative Work is kind of hazey as far as software is concerned. It sounds like these people took the shareza software and created a derived product called Go Music that now includes SpyWare. So it may be possible for the developers of Shareza to demand the release of all the source including the spyware. Oh, and the GPL doesn't give people unlimited rights to include your code anywhere. The distribution of your code is governed by a very strict set of rules and if they don't, they deal with copyright law which is no fun.
I think the Go Music people are in trouble wrt copyright, though I may be wrong.

Re:Restricting Free (as in speech) Software (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#9954038)

To counter the rest of your argument....
Er, why would you want to do that, exactly?

This slashdot website is broken? (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#9953877)

I click on the link ( Read More... ) and I see the exact same paragraph and nothing more. What's wrong?

Re:This slashdot website is broken? (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#9953902)

You suffer from mild retardation. Perhaps a form of ADD.

download.com sucks... (0, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#9953882)

since they went 100% commercial with a pay per listing model. freeware is rarely seen and tucows is much better anyway.

Re:download.com sucks... (2, Informative)

NeoThermic (732100) | more than 10 years ago | (#9954034)

Or, use the service which is free, and has been for a while:

SnapFiles [snapfiles.com]


NeoThermic

Re:download.com sucks... (0)

Stevyn (691306) | more than 10 years ago | (#9954200)

You should try this: http://packages.gentoo.org/ [gentoo.org] . It's almost all GPL'd freeware and it's only a matter of a command to install. It's much easier than download.com.

this just in from SCO (4, Funny)

JeffSh (71237) | more than 10 years ago | (#9953886)

Well, DUH!! you cant just give away source code and not expect this to happen. This is what you open source people get!! /begin astroturfing

Could somebody fill me in? (0)

thephotoman (791574) | more than 10 years ago | (#9953887)

I don't have the background knowledge on P2P services, as their peak was during a time when I had an unreliable, low-speed Internet connection. Therefore, I don't remember Kazaa Gold. I don't even know much about the original Napster.

Re:Could somebody fill me in? (3, Informative)

BlueCup (753410) | more than 10 years ago | (#9954164)

I'll give it a shot...

Back in days of yore, Kazaa was given away for free for people to download to connect to the fast track netword. Then someone came along and modded the program, and created kazaa-lite. This gave users many added benefits, and made getting files easier. But, the changes were freely available, and then a company took those changes, renamed them, "gave" them away on a website that required your email address, and they bundled a ton of spyware crap in (not that the regular Kazaa didn't already start out with enough of that as it was.

If you want to see the evil that is Kazaa Gold, it still exists, and can be found here [kazaagold.com] ... just don't download it =) forms of Kazaa Lite can still be found if anyone must use the Fast Track network... =) hope this helped.

that's because... (-1, Troll)

yipyow (317154) | more than 10 years ago | (#9953890)

download.com only has the highest quality crap.

Re:that's because... (1)

RLiegh (247921) | more than 10 years ago | (#9953927)

Are there any alternatives for those of us on a crap-free diet?

That gives me an idea (4, Funny)

prostoalex (308614) | more than 10 years ago | (#9953893)

Tune in next week for my version of EnhancedOffice Gold Edition for WinXP [openoffice.org] with super enhancements such as

Internet accelerator

Bandwidth optimizer

Password manager (Gator, the industry standard)

HotBar

and many other goodies you would have never got off some open source site.

Re:That gives me an idea (4, Funny)

BlueCup (753410) | more than 10 years ago | (#9954241)

Gator?! Man, get with the times! Claria is all the rage now, it's completely seperate and better than Gator could ever be. Sheesh.

Bleh, P2P programs (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#9953898)

Real men write their own cracks. Thats why I'm not a real man.

Kazaa gold? (4, Interesting)

Billobob (532161) | more than 10 years ago | (#9953900)

If anything, this reminds me more of how Morpheus completely ripped off Gnucleus after Kazaa kicked them off their networks, leaving Morpheus pretty much screwed. They changed a few pictures, and originally presented none of the code to the public.

#1 problem (4, Insightful)

deutschemonte (764566) | more than 10 years ago | (#9953904)

These programs are the #1 problem I encounter when I get the oh so common call from friends and family about how their PC just keeps popping up ads and is running really slow.

Damn them all to hell!

This being /. I am sure a great deal of you know my pain.

Re:#1 problem (1)

AvantLegion (595806) | more than 10 years ago | (#9954141)

These programs are the #1 problem I encounter when I get the oh so common call from friends and family about how their PC just keeps popping up ads and is running really slow.

Damn them all to hell!

This being /. I am sure a great deal of you know my pain.

No. This is Slashdot. We don't have friends, and family doesn't invite us over anymore.

Re:#1 problem (2, Funny)

Veridium (752431) | more than 10 years ago | (#9954250)

I say God bless them.

They've been nothing but good for my consulting business. Buhahaha.

Download.com is pay to list now.... (4, Insightful)

Kenja (541830) | more than 10 years ago | (#9953906)

Ever since download.com went from a free listing of free/shareware to a pay for listing service they've gotten far less scrupleless. They realy dont seem to care what they host so long as they get paid.

Re:Download.com is pay to list now.... (1)

M.C. Hampster (541262) | more than 10 years ago | (#9954035)


Ever since download.com went from a free listing of free/shareware to a pay for listing service they've gotten far less scrupleless

Ok, I don't think scrupleless is even a word. Do you mean "having less scruples" by that word? If so, are you saying that now have more scruples through the double negative? I'm honestly not trying to be a Nazi here, I'm just trying to figure out what you attempting to say. Some people must understand because you've already been modded insightful.

Re:Download.com is pay to list now.... (1)

martinX (672498) | more than 10 years ago | (#9954085)

I think he means "less scrupulous". Of course "having less scruples" would have achieved the same thing.

Now please excuse me I have to flush my memory of that word. I have thought it too many times and it's causing problems.

Re:Download.com is pay to list now.... (1)

Kenja (541830) | more than 10 years ago | (#9954130)

Ment "scrupulous". My bad. Blame it on having to code for Lotus Domino. It makes chunks of my brain shut down.

Re:Download.com is pay to list now.... (1)

alex_ware (783764) | more than 10 years ago | (#9954198)

the word is: scrupulous [cambridge.org] it think

Best P2P client? (-1, Redundant)

Espectr0 (577637) | more than 10 years ago | (#9953913)

Kinda offtopic, but what p2p client is everyone using these days? Everything i get on Kazza sounds ok for a few seconds then gets scratched and garbled.

Re:Best P2P client? (2, Informative)

Coke in a Can (577836) | more than 10 years ago | (#9953944)

I use a combination of eMule, BitTorrent, and DC++. eMule is great for small files like MP3s and files that have been out for a long time (and therefore BT won't have many peers). BitTorrent is great, naturally, for big stuff that's popular. DC++, I just use for use with friends on my private registered-users-only hub.

Re:Best P2P client? (0, Troll)

sqrt(2) (786011) | more than 10 years ago | (#9953958)

eMule plus [sourceforge.net] . Unless you listen to that pop/rap/hiphop shit.

Re:Best P2P client? (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#9953992)

boo-fucking-hoo for you! Listen, I have 105 MB of an awesome 112 MB porn clip of Olivia from Big Breast of the West -- Coast to Coast downloaded off KaZaA and I can't find anyone to download the final part from. So I've got everything put the "finale" (I can't begin to tell you how frustrating that is!) and because it's one of those crappy KaZaA .dat files I have to use AVIPreview to watch it instead of something that could handle a real AVI. So I'm forever stuck using KaZaA in the hope that one of these months I can find someone to download the last few megabytes from!

Re:Best P2P client? (1)

OverkillTASF (670675) | more than 10 years ago | (#9954053)

With a little finangling, you can import that incomplete download into Shareaza.

Haha, I know your pain. (1, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#9954101)

I, too, have traveled down that road. Having 99% of some large file done, only to find out that apparently nobody has the final little chunk. I use eMule, and as of version 0.43b there is an attribute "Percentage of complete sources" (or something) that tells you the percentage of sources with that file who have the COMPLETE file. So, if that number is 0%, don't bother trying to download it because some piece is forever lost. This is especially annoying with porn movies, where you can preview part of it and the part that is missing seems like it should be good! I had an archive file I was trying to download (like 400MB or so) and I could only complete 95%. Using the preview function didn't recover some necessary files in the archive, so I kept looking for that file for a couple months. After a while, I just gave up because NOBODY seemed to have the missing piece, so I just deleted it. I would advise you to do the same thing, it will make life much less frustrating!

MOD PARENT UP -- INFORMATIVE! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#9954178)

And who modded the grandparent poster down? I bet porn is the largest percentage of traffic on p2p networks anyhow!

Re:Best P2P client? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#9953997)

Usenet if I want newish TV shows twenty minutes after I begin downloading, BitTorrent if I want very new stuff a few hours after I start downloading, or very big stuff (like 8 gig comics archives) a few days later.

I still use Kazaa Lite TK++ (or whataver the hell it's called) for single songs. I just download every different hash that comes up in a search; I can usually guarantee that I have a valid file in there somewhere.

Re:Best P2P client? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#9954084)

What ever happened to kazaa lite kpp? It seems to have disappeared and been replaced by pay sites.

How is repacking a GPL'd program theft? (2, Interesting)

nlinecomputers (602059) | more than 10 years ago | (#9953914)

How can you steal something that is free? I admit that I have yet to read the links. Off to do that now but that line in the story above sure seems incorrect to me.

Re:How is repacking a GPL'd program theft? (1)

alex_ware (783764) | more than 10 years ago | (#9954168)

can you steal 'free beer' no
can you steal 'free speech' yes
OSS is free speech

Re:How is repacking a GPL'd program theft? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#9954259)

can you steal 'free speech' yes

WTF?!?! Can you give one example of this? Without resorting to FUD?

Fake user opinions on CNET (5, Insightful)

brokencomputer (695672) | more than 10 years ago | (#9953916)

Those user opinions have got to be fake. " "I like it :)" No spyware is bundled with it, and it is a fairly reliable software package. This must be the best Thing in the world. Now my life is excelent!" ""Great Program No Ads!" Fast, easy to use, plenty to choose from My roommate and I both use this program and we think it's stupendous! This program is excellent." Give me a break. They could have at least made it a little less obvious.

Re:Fake user opinions on CNET (3, Interesting)

darth_MALL (657218) | more than 10 years ago | (#9953949)

I'm loving the negative ons like this:
""Virus Infected Shareaza Ripoff" Included malware: 1. Win32:Trojan-gen. {Other} 2. New.Net spyware 3. Search Toolbar adware "

Re:Fake user opinions on CNET (1)

onewing (754420) | more than 10 years ago | (#9953988)

Yeah, I also noticed all the positive reviews on the first few pages were submitted by usernames with no capitals or numbers.

If you look for a capital letter or number theyre pretty much all negative.

Re:Fake user opinions on CNET (1)

arkanes (521690) | more than 10 years ago | (#9954087)

Look at the timestamps on the postives, too. If CNet , after being alerted/this getting publicity/etc doesn't at least strip out the most obvious of bot postings, I'll... well, I won't do anything. But they'll still suck.

Re:Fake user opinions on CNET (1)

Pheonix5000 (661842) | more than 10 years ago | (#9954231)

In addition, notice that all the positive reviews are each either 2 hours or 2 hours and 10 mins apart.

Sounds to me like someone's using an automated program to submit those fake reviews.

Ironic (0, Troll)

carcosa30 (235579) | more than 10 years ago | (#9953924)

So the makers of p2p software are annoyed with opportunists stepping on their copyrights?

Sorry, but I have no pity for Sharman Networks.

Re:Ironic (1)

Izago909 (637084) | more than 10 years ago | (#9954040)

I don't remember seeing Shareaza authors complaining about their copyrights. Please reply with link. Also, Shareaza is not part of Sharman Networks. It uses, guntella, G2, donkey, and bittorrent, but no fasttrack.

WinMerge has been stolen I think (1, Interesting)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#9953959)

I think someone said that WinMerge has been stolen and sold as well (sf.net/projects/winmerge)

75% popular my donkey! (4, Interesting)

B747SP (179471) | more than 10 years ago | (#9953963)

A quick read of the user comments pages on C|Net makes it pretty clear that all of those positive comments are written by the same person with the same fractured ESL English and the same misgivings about what is 'really cool' and how to make one's life 'complete'.

Some might call this 'astroturf', but I reckon that even blind freddy could see that this grass is brown!

sig (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#9954008)

Megatokyo? Do you have one of those blue 'Kimiko in the snow' blankets you'd like to sell to me? (I'm in

nice sig, buddy. didn't you bother to proofread it?

Re:75% popular my donkey! (1)

arkanes (521690) | more than 10 years ago | (#9954036)

The last time I remember this happening, it was with the open-source CD ripper CDex (BSD license). Downloads.com didn't de-list it, but did add a big yellow spyware warning label, and user comments quickly caught up with it. The same thing will probably happen here - even automated astroturfing will only take you so far.

theft or copyright infringement. (5, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#9953972)

"Shareaza, which recently went open source under the GPL, has been subject to a similar type of theft by a company going by the name RockSoft Development."

Oh, so When you steal something from a record label, it's copyright infringement, but when you steal GPL software, it's actually theft?

Re:theft or copyright infringement. (0, Troll)

sqrt(2) (786011) | more than 10 years ago | (#9953985)

Say this:

"The GPL is to be respected, Copyright laws are not."

Repeat until learned.

Re:theft or copyright infringement. (1)

OverkillTASF (670675) | more than 10 years ago | (#9954089)

Well, what does P2P have to do with stealing music? I know we've all been through this before... I won't make my usual "pirates/p2p/criminals/guns" comparison... Whoops. :-) P2P has many GREAT applications that are both legal and... GREAT. And uh... useful.

Re:theft or copyright infringement. (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#9954138)

I hope you are being sarcastic (I think you are).

In case anybody actually "learns" that, I would advise you to read this [gnu.org] . Without copyright laws, the GPL could not exist.

Re:theft or copyright infringement. (5, Funny)

ad0gg (594412) | more than 10 years ago | (#9954147)

Oh, so When you steal something from a record label, it's copyright infringement, but when you steal GPL software, it's actually theft?

Welcome to slashdot newcomer! Please follow the following guidelines when posting in order of importance

  1. Microsoft = Bad
  2. GPL = Good
  3. Linx = good
  4. Copyright/Patent = bad
  5. RIAA/MPAA = Bad
  6. Apple = good
  7. Real = Buffering
I hope you enjoy your stay.

Re:theft or copyright infringement. (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#9954174)

You = insensitive clod

eMule and clones (1)

sir_lichtkind (651434) | more than 10 years ago | (#9953984)

why o why in such articels no one talks about eMule, wich once grown out the eDonkey thing. It has many cutting edge features supports most networks (Kad may be the future) ans last but not least most of my buddies use ist(most of them dont even heard about Bittorrent).

Foreign ? (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#9953995)

uhm

$ whois -h whois.opensrs.net rocksoftdevelopment.com

Registrant:
Domains by Proxy, Inc.
15111 N Hayden Rd., Suite 160
PMB353
Scottsdale, Arizona 85260
United States

Registered through: GoDaddy.com
Domain Name: ROCKSOFTDEVELOPMENT.COM
Created on: 15-Mar-04
Expires on: 15-Mar-05
Last Updated on: 31-Mar-04

Administrative Contact:
Private, Registration ROCKSOFTDEVELOPMENT.COM@domainsbyproxy.com
Domains by Proxy, Inc.
15111 N Hayden Rd., Suite 160
PMB353
Scottsdale, Arizona 85260
United States
(480) 624-2599 Fax --
Technical Contact:
Private, Registration ROCKSOFTDEVELOPMENT.COM@domainsbyproxy.com
Domains by Proxy, Inc.
15111 N Hayden Rd., Suite 160
PMB353
Scottsdale, Arizona 85260
United States
(480) 624-2599 Fax --

Domain servers in listed order:
NS1.DOWNLOADFILES.ORG
NS2.DOWNLOADFILES.ORG

This information was obtained from a different whois server, so we cannot verify
its authenticity.

perhaps you want to clean up at home first before condemming those pesky foreigners ?, self denial is a common sympton amongst <a href="http://www.spamhaus.org/rokso/index.lasso">u nsociable activities</a> or perhaps some nations are just more skilled at pissing the rest of the world off

Re:Foreign ? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#9954110)

Well this does stink of a sub-species like those in India who can't be original and leech of those who are.

Cut some slack holmes!

What's To Stop... (1)

reallocate (142797) | more than 10 years ago | (#9954004)

...someone from taking a popular open source application, adding some nefarious code of their own, rebranding and selling it as a proprietary, closed product?

If the license violation was detected, would anyone have the resources to enforce the license? E.g., if someone in Shanghai pulls this off, who's the FSF going to sue?

Perhaps this has already happened. Anyone know?

Re:What's To Stop... (1)

Toby_Tyke (797359) | more than 10 years ago | (#9954226)

If the license violation was detected, would anyone have the resources to enforce the license?

That is a pretty big if. After all, if I take some source code from an OSS project and cut n' paste it into my closed source app, how would you ever know?

Open source software on eBay (5, Interesting)

mbrubeck (73587) | more than 10 years ago | (#9954019)

I work on the Audacity sound editor [sourceforge.net] , a free software project that is being re-branded and sold on eBay under names like LuxuriousitySound [audacityteam.org] . Most of the sellers try to conceal the app's identity, and of course they don't mention that it's free and open-source. The same vendors are also selling rebranded versions of Open Office and GIMP. We get a lot of messages from angry users who find out that they payed $15 for software that's free for everybody.

The vendors are obeying the GPL, so they aren't guilty of copyright infringement. They're careful not to use the software's real name, so of course they aren't guilty of misusing our trademarks. They might be in violation of deceptive advertising laws, or eBay's own "Brand Name Misuse Policy," but eBay hasn't yet acted on any of the buyers' complaints.

Re:Open source software on eBay (2, Insightful)

timmyf2371 (586051) | more than 10 years ago | (#9954049)

If I understand you correctly, I don't see the problem with this scenario.

Audacity is distributed under the GPL - therefore anyone can take the code and distribute the application providing they make the code accessible - and of course, the GPL allows it to be sold for a fee.

Sounds like a perfectly legal, profitable, albeit arguably immoral, business model. Guess thats a potential drawback to using the GPL.

Re:Open source software on eBay (1)

The Bungi (221687) | more than 10 years ago | (#9954075)

Seems to me all is peachy. "Deceptive advertising" AFAIK is that only if they're misleading consumers as to what the thing does. Are they doing that?

They're not violating your own copyright or trademarks (if you have them), by your own admission. Also by your own admission they are obeying the GPL.

So what's your problem? That they're making a buck on your creation? You should have thought about that before you made it open source, mmm?

Not only open source (3, Interesting)

ad0gg (594412) | more than 10 years ago | (#9954199)

I've seen this all applied to public domain works by the government. I've seen the US Census data being sold for up to $750, when you can just download it from their site. I've also seen people selling access to NOAA weather images for a subscription rate of $100 a year. It all comes down to marketing, there's no way a producer of free content can compete against someone selling their stuff on the marketing side.

Selling NOAA data for $100 a year [terrafin.com]

Re:Open source software on eBay (2, Insightful)

BenjyD (316700) | more than 10 years ago | (#9954295)

Looking through the adverts for things like "Professional photoeditor 4" (otherwise known as GIMP 2) on ebay, the thing that really shocks me is just how stupid people must be. From the buyer feedback there must be real people buying the software - even if you assumed every positive feedback is fake, there are enough negative ones there as well.

Who buys software from a company with adverts so badly spelt, with english so bad as to be incomprehensible in places? Who can't type "free photo editor" into google? Are these the same people who believe they really have won the Dutch lottery?

SFW? (1)

Toby_Tyke (797359) | more than 10 years ago | (#9954311)

The vendors are obeying the GPL, so they aren't guilty of copyright infringement. They're careful not to use the software's real name, so of course they aren't guilty of misusing our trademarks.

So, whats your point? Are you saying you disklike people re-branding your software and selling copies of it? If so, might I suggest you do not release it under the GPL.

They might be in violation of deceptive advertising laws

I doubt it. Advertisers are under no obligation to point out that cheaper alternatives (in this case, the same thing for free) are available. If they were, Microsoft would never sell another copy of office.

The Danger of Open Source (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#9954023)

This is a clear example of the danger of open source. You don't know what you are getting. I say just avoid this problem altogether and use a secure, trusted operating system like SCO Unix.

simple answer (-1, Flamebait)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#9954044)

if download.com wont remove it perhaps we should remove them from the internet ?

just dev>null any request on your network for cnet servers if you run a dns, or just add it to your friends and familiy and users-you-care-abouts Hosts file

if cnet are distributing trojans and malware then they are a security risk and none of their software can be trusted

Re:simple answer (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#9954161)

Mod parent up^

i wholeheartedly agree...

original KaZaA had spyware, right? (2, Insightful)

Rai (524476) | more than 10 years ago | (#9954061)

"Rebranding software then loading it with spyware and adware (or just selling it for profit) has become a recent trend with oversea individuals trying to make a few bucks. We all remember the KaZaA Gold, don't we?"

Doesn't the original KaZaA client have it's own spyware? I don't see a reason to cry over someone robbing a company of spyware revenue in favor of their own spyware revenue. Now, if someone robs the client to remove the spyware altogether (like KaZaA Lite supposedly did), I'm all for that.

Re:original KaZaA had spyware, right? (4, Informative)

sinner0423 (687266) | more than 10 years ago | (#9954190)

Doesn't the original KaZaA client have it's own spyware? I don't see a reason to cry over someone robbing a company of spyware revenue in favor of their own spyware revenue. Now, if someone robs the client to remove the spyware altogether (like KaZaA Lite supposedly did), I'm all for that.

Kazaa came bundled with a client for BDE [brilliantdigital.com] which was used to sell your spare cpu cycles to someone else. Basically like a huge distributed computing project, that the end user had absolutely no idea about.. I believe this single act kick-started the whole anti-adware/spyware movement.

I'd recommend using KazaaLite K++, which has removed all of the extra FUD. Although, good luck finding a legitimate download. 98% of the files on Kazaa are fakes, planted by the RIAA to dissuade you from downloading music. In the end, it is not going to matter what client you use, if all of the files on the network are bogus.

Let's Call Spyware "Fraud" and Be Done With It (4, Insightful)

reallocate (142797) | more than 10 years ago | (#9954071)

Marketing a product that secretly does something other than what the seller acknowledges seems to me to be equivalent to fraud.

Before the F/OSS community gets all hot and bothered about changing licensing language (ignoring how they might enforce any language) maybe the best course is to go after spyware using the fraud laws.

Re:Let's Call Spyware "Fraud" and Be Done With It (1)

fikuvin (719130) | more than 10 years ago | (#9954239)

Go after them with fraud laws, why didn't I think of that? I'll just grab this stack of money I made with my open source software and find a lawyer and oh, wait...

Re:Let's Call Spyware "Fraud" and Be Done With It (1, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#9954301)

How about if we continue with those ideals that started the open source movement and spend more time educating users about malware? You know, like they educate kids about safe sex?

So? (3, Insightful)

amalcon (472105) | more than 10 years ago | (#9954074)

If a user is too lazy to type the name of their software into google before they download it, that's their loss.

tl;dr (0, Offtopic)

codergeek42 (792304) | more than 10 years ago | (#9954103)

f1rst ps0t

Spyware? Where? (5, Funny)

clubin (542806) | more than 10 years ago | (#9954117)

It can't have spyware; it's site says it doesn't.

"It is totally free from spyware, adware and other similar stuff."

"And the best thing about this program is that it has been thoroughly checked and built so it is free from spyware , adware , pop up ads etc."

See?!

Dude, check out the astroturfs (2, Interesting)

RPoet (20693) | more than 10 years ago | (#9954180)

Look at the user comments [download.com] at download.com. The newest comments are shown first, which are users warning about the GPL theft and bundled spyware. Then there's a LOT of REALLY HAPPY users.

Three different users actually say "This must be the best Thing in the world. Now my life is excelent!"

"This is a great program, works well and easy My roommate and I both use this program and we think it's stupendous! Would recommend this to anyone"

"I'm using only best well-tested soft, and here it is."

"The speed is shocking"

"It id very-very-very and one million more times very NICE stuff i ever had" ... and so on.

The entire happy part of the user base seem to apply bad punctuation and similar spalling erors ;)

Re:Dude, check out the astroturfs (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 10 years ago | (#9954240)

Not only that, but the positive comments are all spaced exactly 2 hours or 2 hrs 10 minutes apart (+/- a few seconds).
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