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A Look at the CounterStrike Source Beta

michael posted about 10 years ago | from the bullet-time dept.

First Person Shooters (Games) 262

mutewinter writes "CounterFrag.com has posted an article reviewing the recent CounterStrike Source beta. What is unusual about Source is that it keeps the same gameplay, including guns and maps, of the original CounterStrike and simply brings CounterStrike (which uses the original Half Life engine) up to date graphically. Imagine if Doom 3 had been just like the original Doom, but with a better engine. Many gamers look down on recycled content, but is this a problem for a 5 year old game that is still as popular as ever?" S!: We also had an alternative look at the Beta over on Slashdot Games a couple of days back.

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If it ain't broken... (4, Insightful)

kmak (692406) | about 10 years ago | (#10027649)

why fix it? Well, of course, there should be new content, and there probably will be, but that doesn't mean that we have to get rid of the old stuff. There's always a balance somewhere.. but things aren't always as mutually exclusive as people think it be..

Re:If it ain't broken... (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 10 years ago | (#10027849)

Speaking of that...will someone please bitchslap taco until he unfixes all of the themes which weren't broken.

Re:If it ain't broken... (1)

asciono (220392) | about 10 years ago | (#10028102)

"We think it is appropriate to call CounterStrike Source "CounterStrike with a boob job." It looks better -- but its the same thing."

I really disagree. Both feels very different indeed - and they both takes a while before they feels and look more natural.

But if you're right, maybe Counter Strike will break apart someday. :)

Re:If it ain't broken... (2, Insightful)

Gooba42 (603597) | about 10 years ago | (#10028141)

For a long time I've been wishing that console gaming companies would understand this. The Mario Party line of games in particular is a good example. My friends and I loved Mario Party and Mario Party 2 was a big jump forward, simply fantastic. Then Mario Party 3 which wasn't as good. And Mario Party 4 which sucked badly. And Mario Party 5 which we haven't bothered to try. The two best games for this series are on the N64 platform. We would have easily gotten newer prettier versions of the same if they'd been available but they aren't and the "innovative" versions suck. A great way to make use of all of that content which is now supposedly obsolete would be a sort of anthology with mix and match rules. I'd love to play a Mario Party 3 board by Mario Party 2 rules. That however is unlikely to happen because the company involved isn't going to "recycle content". Not even to create a superior product. If gaming companies brought back something like Pac-Man in it's original form and didn't charge some outrageous price for an unnecessarily revamped version they would stand to make some money but it isn't happening in the mainstream because they're all too fascinated with the new content.

Re:If it ain't broken... (1)

kbranch (762946) | about 10 years ago | (#10028142)

But it is broken. The hitboxes are completely fucked up, you get a head shot if you aim for the arm and miss if you aim for the head. I'm talking about controlled tests with an accurate weapon like an AWP, not just what appears to be the case during a fight.

And could somebody please tell me how the hell an AWP can shoot through 20 feet of solid brick and still kill somebody? I'm serious, you can wall people on AWP maps through the bunkers.

CS Source is ausome. (4, Insightful)

JPriest (547211) | about 10 years ago | (#10028174)

I don't care what others say, CS is a much better multiplayer game than Doom 3 and others. CS offers a level of precision in shooting not offered in other games and has more realistic game play. The engine update is amazing if you ask me, the more realistic smoke granades and flash bang rock, as does the new machine gun.

CS still offers a level of gameplay that other cannot match, and CS:S does a very good job of renewing the game. Expect to hear more about CS:S as it moves out of beta, I was impressed with it.

Re:If it ain't broken... (1)

Seft (659449) | about 10 years ago | (#10028183)

It's mainly a graphical update atm - the gameplay is mainly unaffected. One you've played it, you will understand how awesome it is.

CS is insanely popular. (5, Interesting)

mesmartyoudumb (471890) | about 10 years ago | (#10027653)

I work for a very larger server company and Counter strike is still the most popular game, At least 95% of our servers are CS.

Re:CS is insanely popular. (5, Funny)

lateralus_1024 (583730) | about 10 years ago | (#10027668)

Computer Science on the other hand....

Re:CS is insanely popular. (1)

Lisandro (799651) | about 10 years ago | (#10027819)

Absolutely. Where i work people 99% of users play either som MMORPG or Counter-Strike (both versions, pre and post-Steam). The game is as fun today as it was when it first came out.

Typo:CS is insanely popular. (1, Funny)

ryanmfw (774163) | about 10 years ago | (#10027924)

Big Typo. It should be:

Atleast 95% of our servers are CS
*majors*.

Just helping out.

This isn't counter strike 2, just CS: Source (4, Insightful)

Zed2K (313037) | about 10 years ago | (#10027658)

There is a difference. This is not a sequel, just an update. Think of it as CS 1.8 (or whatever version they are up to now).

Re:This isn't counter strike 2, just CS: Source (-1, Redundant)

pinchhazard (728983) | about 10 years ago | (#10027785)

Duh.

I'd mod both this and parent redundant!

Re:This isn't counter strike 2, just CS: Source (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | about 10 years ago | (#10027965)

I'd mod u a pear-shaped virgin loser, so lets call it even. retard.

Re:This isn't counter strike 2, just CS: Source (2, Insightful)

OverlordQ (264228) | about 10 years ago | (#10027855)

Did I miss the part where it called it Counter-Strike 2? Maybe I didn't because it never said that it was.

Re:This isn't counter strike 2, just CS: Source (1)

Zed2K (313037) | about 10 years ago | (#10027898)

No but everyone is saying something like:

Its just like Counter Strike, only better graphics.

As if to say they were expecting a sequel instead of just an update. Everyone and their grandma knows that it is just like CS but better graphics yet all the preview articles seem to start out their previews the same way. Implying they were hoping for something more.

Re:This isn't counter strike 2, just CS: Source (1)

shird (566377) | about 10 years ago | (#10027992)

graphics yet all the preview articles seem to start out their previews the same way

A bit like your first post? Where you started out by saying 'this is only an update, not counter strike 2'...

Re:This isn't counter strike 2, just CS: Source (1)

Zed2K (313037) | about 10 years ago | (#10028114)

Exactly. Just pointing out the obvious, which a lot of folks don't want to admit to being the truth. I'm not the one who mods me up. I believe a person replying had the right idea, redundant.

Re:This isn't counter strike 2, just CS: Source (1)

88NoSoup4U88 (721233) | about 10 years ago | (#10028032)

Counterstrike Source evolved from a 'how hard would it be to port the current HL mods over to the Source engine' combined with a very good sense of marketing by VALVe.

Shame they are taking the shield out though :/

Re:This isn't counter strike 2, just CS: Source (1, Interesting)

CAIMLAS (41445) | about 10 years ago | (#10027889)

An update which costs money. Money which, up until this point, was not required to be exchanged in order to play.

This is like giving away an OS, or charging for updates (and thus requiring the updates to keep the product functional). This is the same thing as the threat of MS charging for product updates (that is, aside from their yearly product release cycle).

Sure, they might alow original CS to be played for a while until enough people transition over. How long will that last, though? Seems like the MS business model to me: get people hooked, and then charge for that 'addiction'.

Re:This isn't counter strike 2, just CS: Source (1)

empaler (130732) | about 10 years ago | (#10028224)

An update which is free for people who bought the CZ-addon to CS.
Apart from that, what do you mean, 'allow'? How hard is it to set up your own server?

We can't make changes to our game... (5, Funny)

atrizzah (532135) | about 10 years ago | (#10027662)

Because if we do, we let the terrorists win

Re:We can't make changes to our game... (1)

RudyG13 (793574) | about 10 years ago | (#10028004)

Yup. My computer is on terror alert orange right now in preperation for the game.

Don't quite> know what that means, but I for sure feel safer knowing that.

Hmm... (4, Insightful)

Espectr0 (577637) | about 10 years ago | (#10027665)

Imagine if Doom 3 had been just like the original Doom, but with a better engine

To me, that is exactly what they did.

Re:Hmm... (5, Interesting)

Lisandro (799651) | about 10 years ago | (#10027867)

iD took too much flak for Doom 3, i think. "Booh, it looks nice but all i do it's killing monsters in dark corridors!". Well DOH, it's Doom, for Christ's sake!

I love it. I love the atmosphere, the level design, the graphics, the sound (underrated, it's excellent), and the nods to other games, including Half-Life, System Shock 2 and of course Doom itself. It managed to freak me out in a couple of parts (one with a ghost women voice truly perturbed me), and it's also funny in parts; check those PDAs as you go along.

Best single player FPS experience in years. I downloaded it, but as soon it's published here (South America), i'll be first in line to buy it. Can't wait for the Linux binary either.

Re:Hmm... (1)

IoN_PuLse (788965) | about 10 years ago | (#10028211)

Doom1 had PDAs? And the soul cube? Funny, I even remember Doom1 having a soundtrack, something Doom3 doesn't...

Re:Hmm... (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 10 years ago | (#10028269)

Yes, it's called being "ironic"...

Why mess with the best (3, Insightful)

kenp2002 (545495) | about 10 years ago | (#10027666)

I think that counter-strike has found an near perfect formula that follow the KISS standard. GAMEPLAY is the real core of a game. The graphics are just icing. The have a perfect sense of gameplay so there is no need to fix it. Just to make it pretty for the new generation.

Re:Why mess with the best (2, Interesting)

CAIMLAS (41445) | about 10 years ago | (#10027915)

I disagree.

It's currently too balanced. It's like a symetrically perfect face - it looks weird and awkward.

That's what CS is like now. Everything is so perfectly balanced, that there's no excitement to playing any longer. There's no challenge.

Re:Why mess with the worst (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 10 years ago | (#10028059)

Well that and the game is horribly lame...

The market will decide (4, Insightful)

nacturation (646836) | about 10 years ago | (#10027670)

Give the people what they want. If there's a market for the exact same game in a better engine, then it will be popular. If it's not there, perhaps the developers will work on totally new content. Not many people complain that the Scrabble being sold today is exactly the same as the one they played as a kid.

Re:The market will decide (3, Funny)

neonstz (79215) | about 10 years ago | (#10028146)

I think the Scrabble developers should add numbers. I've always wanted to lay down PWN3D.

Hitboxes (1)

xsupergr0verx (758121) | about 10 years ago | (#10027673)

I hear the hitboxes are fixed a bit. I stopped playing post 1.0 when the great screw-up-the-hitboxes storm hit.

Re:Hitboxes (4, Interesting)

Zed2K (313037) | about 10 years ago | (#10027829)

Are they even hitboxes anymore or are they what doom 3 has per pixel hits? Give you the ability to shoot between the legs and not hit anything or shoot over the shoulder, etc?

You figure they could stop all the hitbox complaining by getting rid of them entirely. If you get hit you are really hit, if they miss then they really missed you.

Re:Hitboxes (5, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | about 10 years ago | (#10028206)

Doom 3 actually has per-polygon hits, it's not at the point where it's per-pixel yet. Probably will be in the next generation engine after Doom 3 though.

IF? (-1, Redundant)

Anonymous Coward | about 10 years ago | (#10027675)

Imagine if Doom 3 had been just like the original Doom, but with a better engine.

That's a joke, right?

Gameplay (5, Insightful)

asd-Strom (792539) | about 10 years ago | (#10027680)

The fans din't want the game to be changed. The counter-strike fans will go nuts even if there is a small box moved in some map. So this new version will sell good, at least with the hardcore fans.

Re:Gameplay (1)

koniosis (657156) | about 10 years ago | (#10027734)

lmao this is so true!

If it ain't broke, don't fix it. (1, Interesting)

Anonymous Coward | about 10 years ago | (#10027684)

Gameplay is fine exactly how it is. Porting Counter Strike to the Source engine is just an added bonus.

Hmmm. (4, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | about 10 years ago | (#10027698)

Imagine if Doom 3 had been just like the original Doom, but with a better engine

You might get reviews like this [cnn.com] :

"Doom 3" is the most visually appealing and best sounding PC game to date, but it doesn't bring anything new to the "3-D shooter" genre in terms of the game play, which is basically 1993's "Doom" all over again.

Re:Hmmm. (1)

swb (14022) | about 10 years ago | (#10027986)

Presumably Doom 3 adds at least real 3-D worlds. Wasn't the original Doom fake 3-d in that nothing had "real" height, it just looked that way?

Better analogy (1)

EddieBurkett (614927) | about 10 years ago | (#10027699)

Imagine if Doom 3 had been just like the original Doom, but with a better engine.
Isn't this more like what Konami did with MGS: The Twin Snakes. Same game as the original MSG, except using the MGS2 engine. (There's no CS equivalent for the expanded cutscenes, though, is there?)

this is a mistake (5, Insightful)

CAIMLAS (41445) | about 10 years ago | (#10027703)

This is a mistake on Valve's part.

I played CS from beta 5 or so up through the 1.2 or so release. Then I got tired of it: the weapons were -too- balanced, and it lost a good deal of the fun and challenge. That, and things became rediculous, such as the accuracy of headshots and such. It just wasn't fun anymore.

That, and the plethora of people that played it obsessively (not I) were irritating, as they were quite good and made getting killed repeatedly terribly boring/frustrating. Add into that the maps getting replayed an obscene number of times (dust, anyone?), with few people playing the newer (and IMO often better) maps, things got really, really dull.

I'm sorry, but I wouldn't have paid money for Doom with updated graphics. I certainly won't pay for CS with updated graphics.

I bought half-life. With it, I got a dedicated community full of modders, bringing forth DoD, CS, and the like of fun, playable expansions in addition to the single (and multi) gameplay of just Half-Life. What is it, exactly, that I'd get by paying for CS Source that isn't already available in terms of gameplay? Nothing. CS currently looks pretty damn decent, what with the 'modern' textures and such, and runs quite well. An engine change does nothing for gameplay.

If I want pretty, I'll get a povray renderer.

Re:this is a mistake (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 10 years ago | (#10027767)

there was never a version 1.2
went from 1.1 to 1.3

Re:this is a mistake (1)

CAIMLAS (41445) | about 10 years ago | (#10027846)

Which was what, 2+ years ago?

It's not something I lose sleep over thinking about.

Re:this is a mistake (2, Insightful)

grolschie (610666) | about 10 years ago | (#10027806)

Sounds like RTCW Enemy Territory. Still my favourite game at present, but most people keep playing the same 6 maps over and over when there are heaps of better ones. Some people are so rediculously over-practised at these maps that new and even experienced players will find themselves getting repeatedly hammered.....

Re:this is a mistake (1)

stratjakt (596332) | about 10 years ago | (#10027866)

And just like Halo on xbconnect, or other tunneling services.

Team CTF on Blood Gulch. That's it. Even suggest playing, oh say, free for all slayer on Hang 'em High with only pistols, and they'll lynch you.

It's the map with the vehicles, so that's why they like it. IMO, it's the map most conducive to lame-o camping and map hacks (jumping off the banshee to the top of the map where you can snipe with near impunity), which I guess is another reason why the l337 k1dd13z like it.

Re:this is a mistake (1)

JFitzsimmons (764599) | about 10 years ago | (#10028305)

If you're interested in other stuff, try getting together with some friends(gasp!) and playing with them, or getting Halo for PC, which has a vaster selection of servers. I wouldn't really reccomend Halo for PC though... I made the mistake of actually buying it. It is M$ abandonware, they kept none of their promises and hence makes a terrible online game (no vote kicking, muting, etc., no spectating or replay recording, no real mods, if there are new maps they're a pain to play on... need I go on?). And with all that said, I'm not going to deny that CTF on Blood Gulch is by far the most popular setup.

Heck, while I'm at it, not only is the engine flawed the gameplay is too. The game does not require skill the same way that most other games do. Generally you start with the best multipurpose weapon in the game (the pistol) but in clanmatches the outcome of the game is determined by who can get to the heavy weapons and basecamp better.

Give up on Halo. Get a better game.

Re:this is a mistake (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 10 years ago | (#10027885)

Yep, it was the same problem with mp_beach for RTCW.

Re:this is a mistake (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | about 10 years ago | (#10028095)

> Some people are so rediculously

Your spelling is ridiculous.

Seems like Slashdot is trying to coin a new word.

maybe rediculous is when something is so _ridiculous_ is embarassing enough to make you turn red?

If Gmail has a spellchecker why doesn't slashdot?

Re:this is a mistake (1)

JFitzsimmons (764599) | about 10 years ago | (#10028238)

Maybe it is about time you switched servers? Most servers play more than just the orignal maps. I would suggest some examples but I realized that would be pointless because if we didn't share the same locale you would probably get terrible pings. Just look around a little. The good servers are out there.

Re:this is a mistake (1, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | about 10 years ago | (#10027833)

Then I got tired of it: the weapons were -too- balanced, and it lost a good deal of the fun and challenge.


That, and the plethora of people that played it obsessively (not I) were irritating, as they were quite good and made getting killed repeatedly terribly boring/frustrating.


You just contradicted yourself. It was no longer challenging, but yet you were tired of good players running you over? That makes no sense.

CS:Source is not only just CS overhauled with new graphics, there is an entirely new PHYSICS engine (the HL2 engine). The two main rifles (AK, M4A1) feel much different from their CS 1.6 counterparts (due to new crosshair behavior), the shotgun is different (more accuracy long range), the AWP is different (no more slow zooming). All the grenades also have changed as well; the HE grenade has been replaced with the frag grenade, flashbangs have new behavior, smokes are now much more effective.

I will admit, those who play competitively will notice all the subtle differences the most, but calling it CS with only new graphics is a big mistake.

For those of you who want a better review of CS:S, there is one at http://www.gotfrag.com/news/2483 [gotfrag.com] .

Re:this is a mistake (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 10 years ago | (#10027883)

Oops, mislinked. Here is the fixed link: http://www.gotfrag.com/cs/news/2483 [gotfrag.com]

Re:this is a mistake (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 10 years ago | (#10027887)

> This is a mistake on Valve's part. [...] I certainly won't pay for CS with updated graphics.

Well, you're hardly Valve's target audience, are you? It's the "plethora of people that play CounterStrike obsessively" that they're concerned about.

In what strange bizzaro-universe does a company's decision to continue to support and upgrade the worlds most popular multiplayer FPS game count as a "mistake"? Are you seriously suggesting Valve stop milking their cash cow just because some random /.er doesn't happen to like the gameplay?

> An engine change does nothing for gameplay.

Surprise! The vast majority of their customers think the gameplay isn't broken, so Valve aren't "fixing" it.

Re:this is a mistake (5, Informative)

schmoli (105622) | about 10 years ago | (#10027926)

I'm sorry, but I wouldn't have paid money for Doom with updated graphics. I certainly won't pay for CS with updated graphics.

I bought half-life. With it, I got a dedicated community full of modders, bringing forth DoD, CS, and the like of fun, playable expansions in addition to the single (and multi) gameplay of just Half-Life. What is it, exactly, that I'd get by paying for CS Source that isn't already available in terms of gameplay? Nothing. CS currently looks pretty damn decent, what with the 'modern' textures and such, and runs quite well. An engine change does nothing for gameplay.


Uh you're not paying for CS:Source. CS:Source will be a mod for HL2, which will be an entirely new single-player game. You're getting the exact thing you got with HL but newer. Deal with it, and pay for it if you want, but don't bitch about it being a waste as it's not.

Now if I'm wrong and CS:Source is going to be a standalone game sold at full price, flame on but I do not believe that is the case.

Re:this is a mistake (2, Insightful)

HIghoS (177655) | about 10 years ago | (#10027997)

I started playing in beta3. Still remenber racing to my death, and specing for dropped weapons, because back then they were left between rounds, so it was a great way to save cash (or if you didn't have any ;p) Played in a clan for a few years, but gave up on it around when 1.3 rolled around, had gotten more interested in other games or other hl mods at that point. (far more active in TFC these days) ...unless of course i'm at a LAN Party, in which case we have to play CS :)

> I certainly won't pay for CS with updated graphics.

Huh? You've never had to pay for CS, if you've owned half-life. And the same is going to apply here for CS Source, except you'll be required to own half-life 2. [yes, CS did retail, but that was a standalone version, different story]

You also seem to be missing the point that they don't WANT to change gameplay. Not for a port. This is just a 'port' of the game to Valve's new source engine. It's just going to be bundled together (as an extra add-on) via hl2 over Steam.

Now, when CS2 comes along, all that will be a different story, and i'm sure gameplay will be different, and it will be worth paying money for. But considering you don't HAVE to for all this, minus owning hl and hl2, who cares? Geez.

Re:this is a mistake (5, Insightful)

amalcon (472105) | about 10 years ago | (#10028015)

I understand this completely. Counterstrike was a decent game while it was still in beta. You'd still occasionally get people who work in teams, people still occasionally played on non-de_ maps, and occasionally one of your teammates would ACTUALLY rescue a hostage!

I would contend that the weapons did not get "too balanced," at least by 1.1, as everyone still used exclusively mp5/m4a1/ak47/awp and usp/deagle. It was always inherently unbalanced due to the weapon buying system, but this didn't get real bad until the community degraded further, and there was such a gap between the 24/7ers and the casual players that once a team got going, there was no chance of winning. The anti-newbie mentality fueled this further, because people would at first opportunity switch to the team "w/o all teh n00bs."

This is why this game has succeeded. A strongly elitist community has formed, and people take entirely too much pride in being a part of this community. In some games, this sort of behavior is looked down upon, but in CS, it's encouraged.

Re:this is a mistake (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 10 years ago | (#10028071)

> That, and things became rediculous

Your spelling is ridiculous.

Re:this is a mistake (3, Insightful)

d_force (249909) | about 10 years ago | (#10028226)

Bring back Action Quake 2, baby!

Man, I loved that game and still believe that mod was, by far, the most realistic one I've ever seen. (laugh, yes, not completely realistic, but better than most IMHO)

Bolt-action sniper rifle = awesome. Every other game that's tried to come close doesn't do justice to the look and feel of the weapon. Plus, the skull cracking "head shot sound"... truely magificent!

Knifes with the Quake 2 physics engine were also unbelievable. I loved how you had to arc the throw in order to get any distance. It's also one of the few games where knife sniping is hilarious, unbelievable, and entertaining!

Ah, memories...

I would definately pay decent money if someone took that mod and applied it to the Doom 3 engine.

-- dforce

Touchy subject (3, Interesting)

Skandal (624659) | about 10 years ago | (#10027713)

I was actually amazed at how ugly and washed out the screenshots look considering what the engine is capable of. But I appreciate that hardcore CS2 players would revolt if the lighting conditions are changed too much since that would ultimately affect gameplay. But I guess there will soon be new maps which take better advantage of the new engine.

Re:Touchy subject (1)

xsupergr0verx (758121) | about 10 years ago | (#10027741)

Some already hate it. You can see shadows approaching around certain corners that give away positions.
But I don't like 1.x CS anyway, soo....

Re:Touchy subject (1)

eliza_effect (715148) | about 10 years ago | (#10028051)

You can always hear people coming before you see the shadows, anyway. AFAIK, even crouching/walking you still make a noise. A very slight one, but it's a giveaway anyway, if you close enough to see someone shadow around a corner. Man, people will complain about ANYTHING.

Counter-Strike Source, not Counter-Strike 2 (1, Redundant)

emazing (778569) | about 10 years ago | (#10027723)

The game isn't supposed to add new content, but rather give you the CS feel in a realistic enviroment. Also, many more respectable sites in the community have covered this including http://gotfrag.com/cs/news/2483/ Also, ID's intentions were to bring you back in the Doom world, only with modern technology.

Cool (1, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | about 10 years ago | (#10027732)

What is unusual about Source is that it keeps the same gameplay, including guns and maps, of the original CounterStrike and simply adds brings CounterStrike (which uses the original Half Life engine) up to date graphically.

I'm up for anything that adds brings stuff. That's pretty special.

CS has been a great ride (4, Interesting)

FerretFrottage (714136) | about 10 years ago | (#10027743)

CS has had the longest retention of any of the FPS shooters for me (besides maybe Q2 and all of its assorted mods). I think I got hooked because I found a decent, mostly honest server where people would play as a team to meet the objective. You actually felt like you had a job to do and became more immersed in the game.

Once it started to become more and more popular, a lot of the team play went away on "common" servers where it just became a frag fest. I'll definitely check out Source and see how it looks and feels. Hopefully most of the map exploits have been fixed better cheat prevention mentions have been added.

Re:CS has been a great ride (1)

PsychoFurryEwok (467266) | about 10 years ago | (#10028033)

You know, so many people I think have experienced this. If game developers could just harness whatever that energy is that gets people playing and could put that atmosphere into every game. I bought Half-Life 2 months after it came out and hadn't stopped playing it until I got my new laptop about a month ago. It's been a ridiculously long ride.

Re:CS has been a great ride (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 10 years ago | (#10028056)

and a fat white guy who is threatened by change

what makes you think all Republicans are fat white men? There's some pretty hefty Dems too

Source (5, Funny)

SnAzBaZ (572456) | about 10 years ago | (#10027756)

Damn, did anyone else read that title think for a brief second that they were going to be treated to some counterstrike source code oogle at?

"Free" Mac/Linux alternative to CS. (1)

conner_bw (120497) | about 10 years ago | (#10027757)

True Combat [planetquake.com]

Ween yourself of the windows...

Uhh (0, Redundant)

Eric(b0mb)Dennis (629047) | about 10 years ago | (#10027761)

Imagine if Doom 3 had been just like the original Doom, but with a better engine

From what I've heard (reviews, people, and the like) this is what Doom 3 pretty much turned out to be, with a little bit TOO much emphasis on the "fear" factor.

Counter-strike was great until beta 6 on... (at least in my opinion) but bringing it to source might make it fun once again (For at least a few months) while the lamers figure out the new way to h4x0r source.... so, bring it on!

CS (1)

Tesko (719892) | about 10 years ago | (#10027775)

The new Beta that's out is on the Half-Life 2 engine. Even if there never was a graphical or engine update to Counter-Strike, after another 5 years it could still easily be one of the largest multiplayer games available. Why? Gameplay. People simple love the gameplay, and if they are looking for higher quality graphics, there is a huge skinning/modelling community out there for Counter-Strike.

Penny Arcade's Take On CS:Source (5, Funny)

CHaN_316 (696929) | about 10 years ago | (#10027777)

Funny comic from Penny Arcade today about CounterStrike, here's the link [penny-arcade.com] .

If it's not broke (-1, Redundant)

netfool (623800) | about 10 years ago | (#10027778)

...don't fix it.

This is good news for pro computer gaming (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 10 years ago | (#10027790)

I think it's great to see a computer game become insanely popular, stay popular, and then remain exactly the same even through engine upgrades. A strict 'standard' is exactly what's needed if computer gaming is to become a 'pro sport' and popular for spectators. After all, how can anyone who's not already into computer gaming become an avid spectator if the game keeps changing on them?

Doom with a better engine (3, Informative)

ecc0 (548386) | about 10 years ago | (#10027799)

Imagine if Doom 3 had been just like the original Doom, but with a better engine

Oh, like Doom Legacy [newdoom.com] ...

Fair comparison?? (3, Insightful)

dFaust (546790) | about 10 years ago | (#10027810)

Comparing Doom3 to CS:Source??? Come on, that's ridiculous. Wouldn't a better comparison be something like Capture the Flag, Team Fortress, or maybe even Doom's Simpsons mod. I'm sure if any of those were updated to use the Doom3 engine, they'd be fairly well recieved... however, none of those have NEAR the popularity of CS, hence players probably WOULD want to see some newness in them.

In addition, as someone else noted, this is essentially an update, it's not supposed to be Counter-Strike 2. I didn't hear anyone complain about CS 1.6 being just like CS 1.5.

Just my two cents

Just waiting for people to say... (0, Offtopic)

gwizah (236406) | about 10 years ago | (#10027830)

OMG WALLHACK! awp camping W#%&RE!

neat console commands (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 10 years ago | (#10027841)

'shake' - shakes whole team's screen
'buy c4' - buys new c4 as terrorist which you can drop and distribute to your team, costs $0

So it plays like Farcry? (1, Troll)

Graemee (524726) | about 10 years ago | (#10027844)

I might deserve a troll label for this but...

From the "review" it seems he's never played Farcry. The features described in HF2 are all present in Farcry. Not that I'm not waiting for HF2 to come so I can get CS too. But you have to expect any new FPS game to contain ragdoll physics as well as the other effects that Farcry & Doom3 have. IMHO this is why Valve has not released HF2 on time. I don't think it originally did not measure up to some of this years games and they are using the leak as an excuse to add more features.

Again it's my opinion and rather than being a coward I put this forward for comment.

Re:So it plays like Farcry? (2, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | about 10 years ago | (#10027931)

What's HF2? Huckleberry Finn 2?

Re:So it plays like Farcry? (1)

frostbane (660953) | about 10 years ago | (#10028019)

HL2 has much more than just ragdoll physics. Most of the objects in the game are affected by their fairly realistic physics engine, which is a lot of fun to play around with. They even have a weapon made specificially to play around with the physics, not the gravity gun but the dev pistol gun. You can use that thing to do all sorts of things like make the dead ragdolls dance, turn a mattress in a "flying carpet", or adhere stuff together and make planes with O2 canisters.

A stort video of some of the messed up things you can do with the engine [ewandew.com]

Morons (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 10 years ago | (#10027896)

Thank god, it kept all of the fucking idiot players too!

I read this arcticle title... (2, Funny)

NeoGeo64 (672698) | about 10 years ago | (#10027899)

... and thought that the source for Counter Strike had been leaked...

Starcraft 2 by Blizzard (1)

Ylleks (807103) | about 10 years ago | (#10027904)

Perfect!

PA (1, Redundant)

mrpuffypants (444598) | about 10 years ago | (#10027925)

Once again, let Penny Arcade tackle this difficult issue....

http://www.penny-arcade.com/view.php3?date=2004-08 -20&res=l [penny-arcade.com]

Re:PA (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 10 years ago | (#10028242)

How appropriate. You fight like a cow!

Hilarious (4, Informative)

kevin_conaway (585204) | about 10 years ago | (#10027935)

This video [pwned.nl] is a must for anyone who has played Counterstrike

what vALVE did... (1)

zr-rifle (677585) | about 10 years ago | (#10027939)

it isn't suprising for me to discover that cs:source is only it's revamped predecessor.

What vALVE did was shift from what was born and is a basically free game to a pay-for-play model. Everyone needs an income, that's why they hired Gooseman in the first place.

It's ok after all. They make great games and they deserve an income out of it. Still, I wonder what outrage this will cause among the community when vALVE will ditch CS1.6 as they did recently with CS1.5 (the WON version, that worked without installing digital delivery on demand tool STEAM).

Time will tell... I'm still waiting for the linux client ;)

If you changed it people would go ape shit. (4, Interesting)

Anonymous Coward | about 10 years ago | (#10027944)

Counterstrike players complain for months if you even change small weapon balancing issues. I've even people complain about the new graphics. it would be like if you changed the rules of football. Its the game they've learned to play and Its highly upsetting if you start messing with it. I wouldnt be suprised if Counterstrike Was almost identical 10 yeas from now. with maby the addition new weapons.

Cheap Advertising (1)

DeadBugs (546475) | about 10 years ago | (#10027999)

It seems that their engine is finished, but Half Life 2 is not. So to keep in the news... they attach some old content to the new engine and send it out for beta testing.

Not only do they get to work some more bugs out of the Source engine, but now all the tech news sites are talking about it. They can't let Doom 3 have all the news, even if HL2 was supposed to be out last year.

Doom (2, Interesting)

Neurotoxic666 (679255) | about 10 years ago | (#10028005)

Imagine if Doom 3 had been just like the original Doom, but with a better engine.

Honestly, that would've been awesome. I like Doom3, but something from the originals is missing, and it reminds me waaay to much of Half-Life rather than Doom. Actualy, is anybody aware of some group re-creating Doom and Doom2 on Doom3's engine?

And more on-topic now, I think it's good they kept the same maps and guns from the original Counter Strike. For a beta version, it helps to see the differences between the old engine and the new one.

Argh. (1, Interesting)

Telastyn (206146) | about 10 years ago | (#10028081)

I for one will be trilled when Counterstrike dies. Given that everyone plays it to the exclusion of everything else [175,000 to 5,000 any given evening from statistics I've seen] the FPS genre has been CS or nothing for pretty much 4 years. And since I can barely stand the game...

Re:Argh. (1)

Eric(b0mb)Dennis (629047) | about 10 years ago | (#10028266)

There's wonderful other options!

If you computer is decent, UT2004 is great with a GREAT modding community. Lots of good mods out already, but not a lot of players.

Also for half life check out Natural Selection [natural-selection.org] .. My personal favorite mod for half-life (try it, it's awesome)

Re:Argh. (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 10 years ago | (#10028285)

Open your eyes, dude. There's plenty of better games than CS out there, and popular at that. Just because CS has a huge following doesn't make it a good game.

Re:Argh. (1)

Telastyn (206146) | about 10 years ago | (#10028293)

Indeed, but it's hard to play multiplayer games without y'know... multiple players.

Online Gaming is whole different genre then 1p (1)

thx1 (788888) | about 10 years ago | (#10028094)

Comparing Doom3 to CS Source is silly. Doom3 has great 1p and laughable multiplayer. CS has no 1p and refined muiltiplayer. What makes CS good is not gfx, It consistency. I know when I load dust1 up that It will be exactly the same, that my fps aren't going to go in the crapper, and that when I kill someone it is because I aimed better. The reason that CS is so successful is that anyone can be good as long as they have skill, and with skill you really can kill anyone with any gun. It's not a race to the bfg9000 like most other games. Maybee some of the other game companies will catch on one of these days that people want refinement online not cool looking water reflections that lead to the likes of 20fps.

I think people prefer the gameplay to be original (1)

Matt Ownby (158633) | about 10 years ago | (#10028212)

Keeping the gameplay the same as the original is one of the cool things that Valve does that most companies don't do. For example, if you look at Team Fortress Classic (their remake of Quake's Team Fortress) you'll note that they _attempted_ to keep the gameplay (physics, movement speed, damage, etc) authentic.

I definitely think that there is demand for upgraded graphics while keeping the gameplay the same. I can only imagine how cool a revamped Quake 2 would be :)

Most remakes of classic games that fail... fail because they changed the gameplay.

CS:Source is not CS 2 (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 10 years ago | (#10028265)

but guys, there's also going to be a Counter-Strike 2 for half-life 2, which will have new content.

Almost Makes me want to Play CS again (1)

d3ity (800597) | about 10 years ago | (#10028302)

Almost makes me want to play CS once again, the graphics look cool, and I'm a huge fan of good physics. But I despise Steam, I refuse to support something that will eventually try to get me to pay a subscription for a game I paid for.

Dont forget that CS:S is a FREE mod for HL2 (3, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | about 10 years ago | (#10028306)

Ya, that is right, CS:S will be free with HL2, its not suppose to be CS2, nor is it suppose to bring anything new, valve simply ported CS to the new engine, and is offering it for free.. had they taken money for CS:S alone i could understand people being upset, but really.. This is just goodwill from Valve as i see it.. Stop complaining about everything!
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