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182 comments

Pectin (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#1976170)

you people are absolutely ridiculous.

Disappointment with ESR (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#1976171)

Frankly, I have been willing to cut ESR a lot of slack with this open source thing- I agree that getting business to use Open Source is a good thing. But Steve Jobs just used and abused him yesterday. Opening up a small and insignificant fraction of OS X should have been a slap in the face to all of us- it was a blatant ploy to get some good publicity without actually doing anything of substance. And ESR not only bought it hook line and sinker, but helped promote the scam. That's sad. Maybe one day ESR will learn to read the individuals who are using him as well as he reads the movement, but until then...

apple & open source (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#1976172)

apple sucks. they are supporting open source as long as they can make any money of it. as soon as apple gets stronger (it probably will) it will cut off all of their open source projects.
apple is no better than microsoft. (btw mac0s is only os out there that is even worse than windows).
and this macosX is faster than linux is probably
just some lame apple advertising trick,like that imac crap
ppl need to get clue and realise this.

/ scud

Yet another thing Apple has done to disgust me... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#1976173)

If this is true, it's just one more way in
which Apple has ensured they won't get my business.

Maybe once they become aware of the situation they'll correct it.. it wouldn't suprise me if
this is something left over from their "pre-open"
days. One can only hope.

Somehow though, I fear Apple isn't sincere about being and Open Source player...

contact info? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#1976174)

does anybody have the sorenson or apple contact information, so that i can bitch? =]

Apple will be the losers (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#1976175)

Yeah that's right.

If you can't come up with a good idea on your own steal someone elses.

contacted (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#1976176)

I did this from home, and the message I got back leads me to believe that Apple will be releasing QT3 for Linux ... NO they didn't say it outright, but their choice of words in replying to me, leads me to this conclusion.

--
KnightFire

STOOPID (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#1976177)

Yeah the lack of the floppy has really KILLED iMac sales. Apple must be kicking themselves.

QT3.0 is cross-platform, just because it doesn't run on your niche OS doesn't mean shit. Stop whining.

Bah. (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#1976178)

Then protest.

Don't buy Apple Hardware or Software. Don't download QT3.0 for Windows (you know the thing on that partition of your HD that you do all your real work on).

You'll be missed.

NOT.

If you're not fully OpenSource you're scum... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#1976179)

Or at least that's what you'd think by listening to all the ranters and ravers on /.

Jeez.

Live and let live people.

apple & open source (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#1976180)

"they are supporting open source as long as they can make any money"

And?

Your point is what exactly?

They're a frigging corporation with stock holders to shut up. They have to make money.

If supporting open source will help they'll do it. If screwing you open source hippies will work they'll do that instead.

Duh.

Email address to complain to? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#1976181)

Can anyone find a Lucasfilm address to complain to?


It would appear that the Apple feedback should go to http://www.apple.com/hotnews/feedback.ht ml [apple.com]


I'm guessing that the category should be Management Comments.

VERY misleading title (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#1976182)

Average time it takes an OpenSource crusader to get 'inflamed': 15msecs...

Limited Audience (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#1976183)

"Probably should also send email to web sites that use sorenson so they know it has a limited audience"

ROFLMAO!!!

Limited?

I guess 3.5 million downloads of the Star Wars trailer prove that it was so limited. I bet 99% of all linux junkies just rebooted into Windooze and downloaded the trailer from there.

Get a life.

STOOPID (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#1976184)

Er, jackass, more systems are running Linux worldwide than are running MacOS X at this point, and quite possibly more than any version of MacOS.

Niche OS? Perhaps. But it's a larger (and growing more so) niche than MacOS...

"...you'd think they invented Apache..." (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#1976185)

From the link [apple.com] you thoughtfully supplied:

"...now Apache is a core component of Mac OS X Server."

" Certified implementation of Apache 1.3.4 Brings the world's most popular web server to the Macintosh platform."

Yeah, that really sounds like they're trying to claim credit for the development of Apache.

-David (in a bad mood today, please pardon my gushing mac advocacy)

why bother? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#1976186)

judging from the posts here, /. readers seem to hate apple enough they boycott it no matter what.

At least with microsoft, people here seem willing to admit when and if MS or their software has good points. Apple they flame no matter what. So a boycott would be pretty silly, seeing as the people participating in it would be the ones who hate apple so vehemently they'd never go near one of their boxes anyway.

Bah. (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#1976187)

i couldnt agree more with you :)
apple is nothing but failed m$ clone... or is m$ is succesful apple clone....

Wow a QT3 for Linux!? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#1976188)

Wow! Really?! I can't wait!

They haven't said no yet (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#1976189)

Hey I think they just want to prevent Microsoft (Who is always hitting on quicktime these days) to get their hands on a good codec... (cause In Fact Sorenson IS BETTER than the others... proof is easy to make!)but I think we could get a special arrangement for Xanim... unless they are Really on their way to make Quicktime for Linux...

Anyway... maybe we should look into a way to be able to use Win32 binairies codecs in Xanim...


Chill guys... it is not because they are trying to be open source but they aren't sure about how to do it that they do everything wrong...
They have a right to be paranoid... After the Mac clone companies almost got them to die...
Let them breathe... they just got out of it!

I wouldn't believe them even if they had said so (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#1976190)

The promised an OS/2 version of QuickTime for at least two years, and never delivered. Never trust
Apple.

Prepare to be flamed (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#1976191)

>You want a free codec as good as sorenson? Go write one.

I posed a similar challenge here last week after they were all bitching about the Phantom Menace QuickTime preview not being in MPEG. They came out of the woodwork, knives drawn. Clever headers like "You're a moron", and so forth. Expect similar treatment from the Linux Cultural Revolutionaries for your transgression.

Apple will be the losers (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#1976192)

No such luck. They're not reimplementing QuickTime in Java, they're just writing a Java interface to the QuickTime libraries. So it only works if you already have QuickTime 3 installed on your machine. In other words, if you're using Mac OS or Windows.

Of course, trying to implement QuickTime in Java would have probably been a mistake itself.

Bullshit (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#1976193)

QuickTIme is not Cross Platform (Runs on MacOS and windoze).

If you want to see a real crossplatform product take a look at netscape communicator. It runs on well over a dozen of platforms.. Windows, (3.1 to NT), MacOS, and all Unices (Solaris, Linux i386/ppc/sparc, Irix, FreeBSD, AIX, HPUX, Digital Unix, etc)

VERY misleading title (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#1976194)

SlashDot readers suffer from selective reading habits. I am starting to believe that most advocates of Open Source and/or GNU are more religious than most people in a church.

Nobody expects the GNU Inquisition!!!


Sean "Irish" Farley

Sorensen != better (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#1976195)

I saw the Sorensen Star Wars trailer on a P300 running Win95. It looked great.

I then saw the same trailer on a P166/Win95 box... skipped and lagged like a mutha.

The .mpg floating around displayed well on both boxes, though the resolution wasn't as good. That's a small price to pay for no skips!

Sorensen is only kewl if your processor has a bunch of extra cycles to devote to real-time decompression. If you're a year and a half behind on the processor market, well, Sorensen isn't gonna do you any good.

(Well, okay. A sore2mpeg utility might be nice. But, still.)

Apple deserves to go bankrupt. (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#1976196)

I get it.

They didn't put a floppy on the iMac, and now in retaliation, people are buying it in droves.

They closed the clone business, and things got worse for their business; now, instead of losing money, they've got a profit!

They can't work with others, so they end up in the penalty box along with Microsoft, Adobe, Apache, and Open Source Initiative.

They decided not to warm up to Linux by supporting LinuxPPC / MkLinux. Instead, they had the gall to go even more proprietary by releasing their code as open source.

Unbelievable, this company called Apple. I give them 15 days before they go out of business from the /. effect.

I wouldn't believe them even if they had said so (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#1976197)

Actually there were QuickTime players available
from IBM on the DevCon CD's. But IBM started
deemphasizing OS/2 and Apple was in financial trouble
at that point so why bother with the work. IBM
was no longer targeting the customers to whom
QuickTime would be useful.

Point to remember (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#1976198)

Apple are happy to open up the stuff they have that's no use. A bunch of badly written drivers, some mucked about BSD code.

I wouldn't say it's of no use - after all they are basing their OS on it. Since it's open anyway, if they're using over Linux/*BSD, there must be _some_ reason, right? Wait til someone actually looks at the source.

When it comes to giving back to the community
by opening up the stuff they've done properly - quicktime, the GUI, etc. - oh, suddenly they aren't so keen.


Of course, you could ignore the fact that they worked on Apache for a year. QT and the GUI is their baby - you might as well ask them to go out of business. Besides - you want it so badly? Write the codec - if it's better people will use it. Join GNUStep - and if it's better people will use it.

OS X isn't even BSD with a nice GUI

Nope. OS X (Server) is BSD with an unbelieveably good GUI.

If you're not fully OpenSource you're scum... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#1976199)

Or at least that's what you'd think by listening to all the ranters and ravers on /.

Well, at least that's what you thought. But, then, you weren't reading carefully.

Here's a better summary: If you're pretending to be "OpenSource" in a callous marketing ploy, while in almost every other respect you're still acting like Microsoft's little brother, well, you're scum.

Speaking of xanim... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#1976200)

xanim's support for mpeg is also horribly slow. The only thing I've found that does a good job with it is mtv, which is shareware (though the mtvp command-line player is free for non-commercial use IIRC) and (IIRC) closed source.

I'm not really AC, I just CBA to log in.

Oh, Nice (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#1976201)

Aren't you the genius, you managed to figure out all by yourself that a OS that has been out since '91 has a larger install base than one released yesterday that you probably can't even buy yet! Come back when you find the other half of your brain.

Who says Sorensen better? (Mail Fox, too) (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#1976202)

> Just don't make Marc Podlipec really mad, or he might reverse engineer the sucker. He's done it before. What say, Marc?

He doesn't reverse-engineer, he duplicates through analysis.

It doesn't matter though - whether you arrived at a decoder through your own efforts or via disassembly or elicitly-gleaned source, it doesn't mean you can legally use the end result. Mark replicated early Cinepak and Indeo himself with a clean-room decoder, but he still had to withdraw the source.

-- a. t. f.

Reverse Enineering Codecs (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#1976203)

Hell, why not brute-force 3-DES while you're at it? The code for that can be written in a 4-line .sig
axolotl

Hello dimwits? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#1976204)

Funny how I just downloaded the source then. OK, the codec modules aren't open but that's not the author's fault.
OK, it may not be Free in the FSF sense, but that's not the same thing at all.
axolotl

Apple - "think different"... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#1976205)

...and they did :(

Open Source posers? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#1976206)

M$ hasn't released anything, why don't people sh*t on them more?

What? WHAT? Somebody on Slashdot complaining that we haven't flamed Microsoft ENOUGH?

WTF?

Sorenbitch doesn't raise a candle to... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#1976207)

...MPEG.

"Open Source" is a trademark of Apple Computer, In (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#1976208)

"I'll wait for Star Wars on videotape as long as it isn't Apple Quicktime for VHS."

Well, guess what! Chances are that Star Wars will be "written" to video media using technologies similar to those used in Apple Quicktime, and it would be made for VHS too.

I believe film trailers are for movie rooms. When viewing is extended to home video and computers (Linux, Windows, Macs, and the likes), I just consider myself priviledged. Now, I believe your machine can boot into another OS to view the Star Wars trailer. Please, lower your pride and boot into the other OS. Remember, if you hide your computer box and show the movie on the screen, all you would see is the movie. Does the OS matter at that time?

I don't think so!

By the way, don't you just like the quality of the Star Wars trailer? I just love it and it's smooth baaaaaaaaabyyyyyyyyyyyyy thanks to sorenson.

whatever sorensen sucks (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#1976209)

MPEG-1, MPEG-2 rules.

what? sorensen? what? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#1976210)

MPEG is available.

Moron (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#1976211)

Gawd, you're probably one of those lusers who think cross-platforms means "runs on Windows and MacOS".

Get real..

STOOPID (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#1976212)

Did it ever occur to you that a lot of Linux users *ARE* Mac and PC users?

Speaking of xanim... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#1976213)

mtv is good. It has not been supported on other unix than Linux however.

Speaking of xanim... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#1976214)

mtv is good. It has not been supported on other unix than Linux however for some time.

Who was it who said... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#1976215)

"A common enemy does not a true friend make"?
Seriously, I don't know where this is from. Someone tell me. Please.

Bah.. (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#1976216)

Everyone's getting so emotional about apple.
They don't matter. They're already gone.
They aren't reaching out to the open source
community *or* clawing at them. Apple's
dead hand has just flopped out of the coffin
due to a muscle spasm or reflex and got close
enough to people to freak them out.

Kind of reminds me of "Thriller"

That's why he used the smiley. (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#1976217)

The glyph ';-)' is meant to be
suggestive of a smiling wink, as
in, "I know my statment is absurd,
and I think it is funny as well".

BeOS also... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#1976218)

Quicktime runs on BeOS also...

Come on people! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#1976219)

Paying people for stuff is a nice way of showing support for their efforts. Kind of a charitable thing to do, like donating money to Save The Children. Software companies don't need it.

Then there's the other side, when you really want what the developer has got, and are prepared to shell out for it. Like I will be doing for Quake 3 soon.

What I find objectionable is this kind of tie-in. Its a kind of Microsoftish hegemony-of-content. If the people behind this agreement (or others like it) have their way, I will be paying a hell of a lot, for a few things (or one thing) I absolutely must have, plus a mass of garbage. Marketing will have christened this a multimedia-3D-realtime-interactive-netblaster package. It will suck to use, thrash the latest hardware, and cost a mint. And everyone will _need_ it.

At that point, you can support me by providing the bullet. :)

Apple will be the losers (1)

Mike Hicks (244) | more than 15 years ago | (#1976269)

Video? In Java?

HAHAHAHAHAHA!

*cough*

sorry, it's just that Java isn't exactly known for, uh, speed...

Did anyone expect otherwise, really? (1)

Wakko Warner (324) | more than 15 years ago | (#1976270)

Sure, Apple will go Open Source when it suits their interests.

They're no better than Microsoft, and, with the way they're pimping Open Source for their own gain (Apache, etc...), they could be considered worse.

Screw them. :P

- A.P.

--


"One World, One Web, One Program" - Microsoft Promotional Ad

VERY misleading title (1)

Jesse Shrieve (585) | more than 15 years ago | (#1976272)

The article title is very misleading. If you go to the xanim page, you'll see that Apple did NOT SAY "NO".

Apple's policy with the codec they paid a lot to help develop is not to license it out. However, no one has asked them to make an exception for xanim. Apple has not said no, because they have not been requested.

Maybe if we request that Apple does, they will. But they've done nothing wrong yet.

I'd sure hate to get slammed for saying "no" to a question that was never asked of me.

I thought MOV was pretty good. (1)

Codifex Maximus (639) | more than 15 years ago | (#1976273)

I have no problem with MOV - as a matter of fact, I kinda prefer it.

If it don't work with xanim... I don't watch it.
.

Boycott Apple (1)

gavinhall (33) | more than 15 years ago | (#1976274)

Posted by His name cannot be spoken:

It is important to note the effect that slashdot postings can have on companies. After Toshiba said that they would not release information for the IR interface, everybody rallied around and boycotted Toshiba. Then 3 days later they gave the information. Now, I personally wouldn't be caught dead in the same room as a mac, but I'm sure there are some who don't mind 'em. Show apple your stripes. Tell them it's not OK to pretend to be supportive of Open Source when their only goals are for their immediate gain. Free the Format! -

Come on people! (1)

Eccles (932) | more than 15 years ago | (#1976277)

>Just because someone is trying to make a dollar doesn't mean they are out to get you.

Yes, but if you want to hop on the open source bandwagon (like Apple just did), the price is at least some respect for the tenets. For example, at least don't inconvenience people for no gain of your own. If I can use this codec on Windows, it's not an Apple exclusive -- so what does it cost Apple to allow it to run on Linux? Nothing. So why should they disallow it?

That is SO Wrong... (1)

mholve (1101) | more than 15 years ago | (#1976279)

Come on Apple, help us out, huh? Allow binary only libraries if you have to, but allow us the CODEC.

Sorenson is brilliant - this is annoying (1)

Jon Peterson (1443) | more than 15 years ago | (#1976281)

Sorenson is the best codec out there by a mile at the moment.

It is really annoying when closed source is not only closed by also _better_

Are there any OS codec projects? It's a pretty tough field...

Pimping Apache - too right (1)

Jon Peterson (1443) | more than 15 years ago | (#1976282)

The way they go on about apache on their web pages is sickening. You'd think they were the first person to discover it. Hell, they aren't even the first big business. IBM was way before them.

Open Source at the moment fits in rather well with Apple's image - the whole 'slightly rebellious, but squeaky clean and terribly stylish "think differnt"' thing. It's all crap.

And they boast about how Apache 1.3.4 is a 'core component' of OS X. Sure... like it's somehow more core than every other BSD/Linux distro that bundles it.

I'm sorry, at least Microsoft are willing to say "We're big, ugly, and we aim to win by any means possible". Apple are just as ugly, want to be just as big, but are twice as slimey.

And, in the balance, Microsoft have produced more decent software than Apple. Scary, huh?

Point to remember (1)

Jon Peterson (1443) | more than 15 years ago | (#1976283)

they are better.

Sorenson is one of the best codecs around. That's why Apple won't show the source or license it.

Apple are happy to open up the stuff they have that's no use. A bunch of badly written drivers, some mucked about BSD code.

Apple are just hoping some programmer out there comes along and fixes a few bugs for them. When it comes to giving back to the community by opening up the stuff they've done properly - quicktime, the GUI, etc. - oh, suddenly they aren't so keen.

At least Microsoft aren't asking a bunch of Linux programmers to help them do their dirty laundry.

I always thought Apple were kinda cuddly but incompetent - flashes of genius amongst lots of well-intentioned screw ups.

Now I think they are just a bunch of tossers who want to cash in on anything and save their sorry asses. OS X isn't even BSD with a nice GUI. It's first and foremost BSD with Apple branding. And, now, apparently, Apache branding.

Hell, looking at the Apple site (http://www.apple.com/macosx/server/apache.html) you'd think they invented Apache, or funded it 100% themselves or something.

Wankers.

So innocent. (1)

Jon Peterson (1443) | more than 15 years ago | (#1976284)

Alas - you are behaving like a rational person and reading all the small print.

After working in the advertising industry, I can tell you that what counts is what the person sees in the first 1.25 seconds.

Your text "Certified implementation.." appears in knocked back (adspeak for 'made less obvious') text in smaller print to the side of the main article.

What the person sees is the Apache logo incorporated AS PART OF an Apple product (the logo is on the screen of a G4). This would break most companies' use of logo guidelines. Alas that Apache has none.

Also, the headline (what the managers remember) says "Mac OSx server proudly presents Apache".
I've ignored the second line of the headline? Sure I have. So will the readers (subconsciously).

It's all very sad, but it's all very true.

Apple will be the losers (1)

mangino (1588) | more than 15 years ago | (#1976285)

How about a general UNIX port, I use solaris and have a great video card, yet I have to use my old Mac to view quicktime!

Come on people! (1)

nstrug (1741) | more than 15 years ago | (#1976286)

The problem as I see it is that Apple refuse to directly support Quicktime under non-Apple/MS platforms - and also refuse to let anone else support it. If they released a Quicktime player for linux/unix things would be fine. As it is I have no access to either a Mac or a windows PC (I run linux at home and work in an SGI/Solaris shop) so I can't watch the trailer. I have no choice. Simple as that. Nick

The licensing restrictions... (1)

Chops-Frozen-Water (2085) | more than 15 years ago | (#1976287)

...are probably (my guess, anyway) to keep Microsoft's hands off it. They're trying to keep something to distinguish QuickTime from its competitors (namely, Microsoft Media Player).

As a public company with shareholders, it has to do something to generate interest in its products, otherwise the perceived value of Apple's stock drops through the floor. They *do* have a bottom line to worry about. That being said, QuickTime being ported to other platforms is very possible, given that they've already moved it to two beyond the MacOS (Win32, OS [Ne]X[T] Server).

With all the locked mindsets about Apple's business practices, it's a wonder anyone drives a Ford (*cough* Exploding Pinto *cough*).

-cfw

--

Come on people! (1)

jelwell (2152) | more than 15 years ago | (#1976288)

First of all, source code is one thing but 0 support is another - which is the case in the Sorenson codec. Apple didn't say, "you can't have the source code". Xanim has 3 modules that are distributed as binaries only because of that sort of agreement. What Apple said was "you have to pay us to allow people to view the movies *WE* made". If they make these movies you would think that they would want people to see them.

Troll Tech is another completely different case. Troll Tech came up with a really good window toolkit that didn't catch on because although it was free for users it was not open source.
Joseph Elwell.

Some more things... (1)

Millennium (2451) | more than 15 years ago | (#1976289)

Talks of a Linux port of QuickTime by Apple have been around for ages. I would consider this a good sign that Apple could be willing to do this; why prohibit something from being ported to a platform unless you have plans to do that yourself?

I think that, once again, we should wait and see what happens. That's one thing I've noticed on Slashdot: the average reader is far too quick to jump to conclusions.

Bah. (1)

Squeeze Truck (2971) | more than 15 years ago | (#1976290)

Apple behaves like just another (failed) Microsoft, yet around here we treat them as if they were brothers or something. M$ - Closed proprietary software Apple - Closed proprietary hardware AND software.


--
As long as each individual is facing the TV tube alone, formal freedom poses no threat to privilege.

My enemy's enemy. (1)

Squeeze Truck (2971) | more than 15 years ago | (#1976291)

I can tolerate Apple for the time being. Every iMac that gets sold is another $500.00 or so that doesn't go to Uncle Bill.


--
As long as each individual is facing the TV tube alone, formal freedom poses no threat to privilege.

why bother? (1)

dattaway (3088) | more than 15 years ago | (#1976293)

judging from the posts here, /. readers seem to hate apple enough they boycott it no matter what.

I made the mistake of recommending an Imac to someone last week. I didn't even hate the guy, but now he is going to be stuck with a cute box that is closed. I cannot help him if he has a problem (except for things like not plugged in, etc...) Apple seems to be the pinnacle of marketing and trapping people into their side of the fence.

Apple will be the losers (1)

Visigothe (3176) | more than 15 years ago | (#1976294)

Apple is/has ported QuickTime to Java... it's still "devel" quality... but once it hits, expect to run it on your box

My enemy's enemy. (1)

Prothonotar (3324) | more than 15 years ago | (#1976295)

Apple is the Italy to Microsoft's Germany. They are inconsequential, but just as ambitios.
--
Aaron Gaudio
"The fool finds ignorance all around him.

Actually ... (was: Limited Audience) (1)

Rick_T (3816) | more than 15 years ago | (#1976297)

| I bet 99% of all linux [users] just rebooted
| into [Windows] and downloaded the trailer from
| there.

Actually, I just downloaded the mpeg. Viewed it with mpegtv on my Alpha. Under Linux.

Kudos to Podlipec (1)

eGabriel (5707) | more than 15 years ago | (#1976301)

Mark Podlipec has put forth an incredible effort to support as many video formats as he has time for. He has sent emails to the various companies involved, has expressed willingness to compromise when licensing has been an issue, and all in all has gone out of his way for the community and the good of the code.

Just wanted to say thanks, Mark.

Next time you want to complain about something xanim doesn't support, find out why; chances are Mark or someone else has given it their best shot.

Bare feet/yellow toe nails (1)

msk (6205) | more than 15 years ago | (#1976302)

Bare feet == healthier feet. Get your facts straight. See The Dirty Sole Society [barefooters.org] web page for more facts. "Yellow toe nails", if meant to imply fungus, happens more frequently to the shod. Dark, damp environments promote fungus growth. Bare feet do not live in such environments.

Bah. (1)

WORLOK (7690) | more than 15 years ago | (#1976303)

I do all my REAL work under Linux and only use M$ for cd burning, playstation game copying, and watching a few videos. Linux 95% of the time, however.

Did anyone expect otherwise, really? (1)

hackcess (7777) | more than 15 years ago | (#1976304)

Aww, lets not be bittermans, you should really *read* the licence (this applies to all). The open source is for Mac OS X Server, IE NeXT/Openstep OS - *NOT MAC OS*. This means that any source which includes Quicktime and the Mac OS is simply *NOT* for the offering - PERIOD. It could not be spelled out more clearly so don't whine about *major* portions of the Mac OS (ie System 8+ and QT) missing because *none* of it has been offered.

Apple will always be the underdog next to MS so they will always struggle to impress the rest of us. As for Jobs pulling the clones out, hell Apple would be the smallest supplier of machines if Power Computing was still around. And if you know Apple then you'd know the HW profits feed and cloth them.

Stop your moaning, Jobs is a hippie who likely smoked weed and walked around barefoot with yellow toe nails. I doubt that Gates even knows what a joint is (or seen a yellow yoe nail)- so who do you trust now?

I doubt that this will affect MS much in the *near* future but I would really be interested in hearing some level headed responces as to what people assume Bill Gates is thinking.

S.L.

STOOPID (1)

hackcess (7777) | more than 15 years ago | (#1976305)

Er er, jackass. What are the figures? Where did you get them? And what is your proof that *more* Linux users *need* access to QT than Mac and PC users?

Maybe a little thought should be put into our comments before posting. Flame away about any OS you choose but please provide some factual basis.

S.L.

Point to remember (1)

eponymous cohort (8637) | more than 15 years ago | (#1976306)

They don't actually need to release the source code to the Sorenson. Xanim already supports a number of binary-only codec modules.

Since they already give away the Quicktime viewer for Windows and the Mac, I don't see what they have to lose, other than the threat that Linux will overtake MacOS in popularity. By some accounts, it already has.

Who says Sorensen better? (Mail Fox, too) (1)

dgenr8 (9462) | more than 15 years ago | (#1976308)

I have seen no objective proof, only hype from Apple, about how wonderful this codec is. To my eye, it's no better than CinePak. Is it also supposed to be better than MPEG?

Apple is so transparent. Their hard-on for Sorenson is just an attempt to beat Microsoft at its own game of CLOSED PROPRIETARY "standards". We are just incidental roadkill.

Send mail to Fox and Lucasfilm telling them that you couldn't watch their clip, thanks to their choice of "technology".

Just don't make Marc Podlipec really mad, or he might reverse engineer the sucker. He's done it before. What say, Marc?

Podlipec CinePak source (1)

dgenr8 (9462) | more than 15 years ago | (#1976309)


I have the utmost respect for Marc, his code, and his contributions to computing freedom, but, lest people be afraid to undertake similar efforts, the truth needs to be known.

He withdrew the CinePak source because Radius threatened legal action, and because Radius paid him to do so.

Apple deserves to go bankrupt. (1)

falser (11170) | more than 15 years ago | (#1976316)

They do. They make decisions regardless of what consumers want (iMac floppy), that are bad for their own business (Mac clones), and will enivitabely cause their future bankrupcy (inability to work well with others). If they want Quicktime to be popular, then they have to let other people use it. Are they morons or something? Eventually people are just going to stop using Quicktime (I really don't know why anyone uses it in the first place).

I thought Apple was warming up to Linux by supporting LinuxPPC/mkLinux. You'd think they'd want Quicktime to be a CROSS-PLATFORM video codec. But no, Apple is just being Apple - stupid.

Oh well, I give em 5 more years before they shoot themselves in the head once in for all.

Reverse Enineering Codecs (1)

bperkins (12056) | more than 15 years ago | (#1976318)

I wonder how hard the codec would be to reverse enginneer.
Hell, the codec modules are around 5K.

You could practically brute force it. ;)

Come on people! (1)

wahay (12517) | more than 15 years ago | (#1976319)

Just because someone is trying to make a dollar doesn't mean they are out to get you. Just because something is *inconvenient* to you doesn't mean it violates the open source ethic.

You want a free codec as good as sorenson? Go write one. Port it to quicktime. Give it away free to lucasfilm and everyone. But don't bitch because someone who -did- put in the effort didn't decide to give it to you for free.

Open source is about admirable people giving away stuff they worked hard on and cooperating. What I hear here is the same lame bitching the script kiddies do when they can't get Q3A on their favorite wAreZ servers.

Worst of all, CmdrTaco seems to have bought in on this one and posted a pretty editorially biased article.

Anyways. I support Apple for making great products, despite the odds. I support Troll Tech for making a great desktop environment possible (one that doesn't crash). I even support Larry Wall, despite the fact that his profit model means I have to buy lots of out-of-date books rather than getting good online documentation and tutorials. All these folks, and more, have given us great stuff, often for cheap or free. Sure, I want more....and if I rub this here lamp and the genie comes out........

Please folks, stop being lame.

Staw Wars trailers... I got the mpeg version :-) (1)

kinesis (13238) | more than 15 years ago | (#1976320)

I just don't like clicking on the "Later" button everytime I want to watch a Quicktime movie.

booting windows...Limited Audience (1)

bunicula (15323) | more than 15 years ago | (#1976326)

i threw win98 onto aspare hardrive and booted that
just to see if there was a noticable difference.

the mpeg version worked fine for me :)

but i would definitely like to see quicktime on linux...


brian

apple & open source (1)

Ty (15982) | more than 15 years ago | (#1976327)

Heh, at least they figured it out before Microshaft...

Open Source posers? (1)

cygnus (17101) | more than 15 years ago | (#1976328)

Alright, the whole open source argument is kind of getting silly. Apple deciding to open the source to OS 10 should be regarded as a good thing, not like they're GNU wannabes that didn't have the balls to go all the way. Deriding Apple for only releasing part isn't very constructive. M$ hasn't released anything, why don't people sh*t on them more? Saying that since Apple isn't releasing all of their code, they're as bad as a company notorious for not releasing all of their API's to external developers is pretty damn dumb.

Apple did NOT say no to Mark Podlipec! (1)

Yasha (17503) | more than 15 years ago | (#1976329)

Here is the text from the Xanim home page:

There is a new Star Wars trailer that has been recently released and it uses the currently unsupported Sorenson Video codec. I have contacted Sorenson about licensing their codec. They responded that Apple won't allow them to license it to others. You may want to drop Sorenson and Apple a line asking about unix and/or xanim support for Sorenson. Probably should also send email to web sites that use sorenson so they know it has a limited audience.

For the record, I would gladly add support for Sorenson if allowed to. Same goes for all other currently unsupported video/audio codecs.



So.. send those letters! Apple has not been contacted yet.. well, likely by -now- it has.. but you get the drift. :-)

----

"Open Source" is a trademark of Apple Computer, In (1)

Alien Being (18488) | more than 15 years ago | (#1976331)

I think it's a typo. Apple probably does however have a trademark on "Open Sores".

I don't understand why the "dec" part or all these codecs are so protected even in binary form. They give it away for other platforms don't they?

I'll wait for Star Wars on videotape as long as it isn't Apple Quicktime for VHS.


- strange planet, Earth.

Apple will be the losers (1)

SiliconProphet (19791) | more than 15 years ago | (#1976334)

This is likely to incense a lot of people. I believe Apple could be prevailed upon either to change their minds or to release a Linux port of Quicktime. If they don't, I imagine an open source project to reverse engineer the Sorenson codec would receive a lot of support. Heck, that'll probably happen sooner or later anyway.

Would anyone who happens to know Steve Jobs' email address please get CmdrTaco to put it up on the front page? An immediate deluge of angry email to the right mailbox would probably be the quickest way round this.

I'll be writing to Lucasfilm to complain too.

Pectin (1)

Beef (19842) | more than 15 years ago | (#1976335)

Apple is a ball or yarn. Mark Podiplek is but a mere goldfish in the pet store of life. Long live Intel Indio!!!!!!

Speaking of xanim... (1)

meldroc (21783) | more than 15 years ago | (#1976338)

When is xanim going to fully support mpeg? The last version I got only supports mpeg 1 - with certain frame types, with no sound.

Oh... And if Bill Gates wasn't around, Steve Jobs would take his place as the Computer Industry Anti-Christ.

Limited Audience (1)

meldroc (21783) | more than 15 years ago | (#1976339)

I ended up getting the mpeg version of the Star Wars Trailer. Xanim will not handle this version though, so I had to get mtv & endure it's bugs & obnoxious nagware/crippleware behavior. I will pay for shareware if it's good & useful, but I get so annoyed when a program is designed to tease you with a vital feature & then not let you use it in a useful situation) (mtv won't let you start in DGA full screen mode from the command line (at least that's not documented) & when you start it up from it's GUI interface, it cuts the sound off after 90 seconds & throws a nagware message on the screen. That irritated me so much that I will not pay for that program, I'm looking for alternatives.

I think that we really do need a good Open Source video format, then we can simply convert from the proprietary formats & watch our movies in peace. (MPEG comes closest - since it is an industry standard, it's easier to get specs for its codecs, but it's algorithms are still patented & can become lawsuit magnets...)

Hello dimwits? (1)

maw (25860) | more than 15 years ago | (#1976340)

xanim isn't open source according to its homepage. It is only free for non-commercial use. It's free beer with a recipe included, but you can't buy it at a packie or at a bar.

You would think that slashdot is a social experiment, and some social scientists are going to come out with a paper talking about how people who post to it are as cattlelike as any other group of people, despite whinging and whining about how individualistic and independant they are.

Point to remember (1)

CrosseyedPainless (27978) | more than 15 years ago | (#1976347)

Of course, these proprietary codecs aren't mandated. People choose to use them. Why this is so, I could not tell you.

Come on people! (1)

vanyel (28049) | more than 15 years ago | (#1976348)

The issue isn't that it should be free, especially
with the new version of xanim that allows dynamically loaded codecs. Sorenson is an excellent codec, and I'd be willing to pay them for it. I'll even grudgingly grant them the right to limit its use if that's what they really want, but that doesn't mean I can't lobby them to change that position. However, I think it's a sign of desperation for Apple to enter into such a restrictive license agreement (assuming that's how they have any say in it at all), and given the fact that my Windoze Premiere has Sorenson support, they've already let the cat out of the bag for their biggest competitor. Any further restrictions are childish.

"Open Source" is a trademark of Apple Computer, In (1)

Sean (111085) | more than 15 years ago | (#1976350)

WTF? The article actually says this. Please excuse me while I destroy something.

--

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