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340 comments

make microsoft bob open source (3, Funny)

el_salvador (681607) | more than 9 years ago | (#10373908)

now that would rock!!! microsoft bob on linux, imagine the productivity increase

Re:make microsoft bob open source (2, Funny)

cletus.the.wonder.sl (817253) | more than 9 years ago | (#10374222)

I would just settle for Clippy. Imagine a penguin running out and kicking Clippy everytime he showed up. pointless but entertaining.

Re:make microsoft bob open source (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#10374235)

Even worse: http://www.3dna.com

like a drug dealer (3, Funny)

unbiasedbystander (660703) | more than 9 years ago | (#10373910)

The first hit is always free...

Re:like a drug dealer (-1, Flamebait)

bratmobile (550334) | more than 9 years ago | (#10374089)

Idiot. Microsoft releases an open-source project, and all you can do is draw drug-dealer analogies. Slashdot... mindless as ever.

Re:like a drug dealer (0, Redundant)

slipnslidemaster (516759) | more than 9 years ago | (#10374325)

You know I was just thinking that.

It's Microsoft's attempt to embrace, extend and extinguish. Old trick that works for them time and time again.

Be very afraid.

Re:like a drug dealer (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#10374349)

What are they EEEing by releasing the code for a wiki?

Service Unavailable (0)

mgkimsal2 (200677) | more than 9 years ago | (#10373917)

I'm only getting 'service unavailable'. Anyone else seeing anything? :(

Re:Service Unavailable (2, Informative)

Guus.der.Kinderen (774520) | more than 9 years ago | (#10373967)

The site works fine for me. Try Google's cache: http://216.239.59.104/search?q=cache:AToSccLZKkwJ: www.flexwiki.com/+flexwiki&hl=en

Click the link... (0, Redundant)

brunson (91995) | more than 9 years ago | (#10373927)

http://www.flexwiki.com/

Service Unavailable

8-Ball says: outlook not good

Wiki spam. (1, Troll)

BoldAC (735721) | more than 9 years ago | (#10373938)

WOohoo... Microsoft cometh... ... and bringth the spam [c2.com].

If wiki's were not getting polluted enough, here comes microsoft into the mix.

I thought it was a joke (2, Interesting)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#10373939)

I read this originally on a press release but dismissed it as a Joke [yahoo.com]

How open source? (1, Interesting)

FooAtWFU (699187) | more than 9 years ago | (#10373952)

Is this open source as in Microsoft calls it open, open source as in it's really open, or is it somewhere in between? Is it under the GPL or similar?

I'm a die-hard MediaWiki guy myself, anyway, and this software can call back when it's successfully handling an encyclopedia site of over a million articles. :)

(now there's a thought: do Encarta with this thing...)

Uses the IBM Public License (5, Informative)

ashpool7 (18172) | more than 9 years ago | (#10374010)

Sheesh, RTFA and click on the SF link.

http://www.gnu.org/philosophy/license-list.html

GPL Incompatible due to patent clauses. Draw your own conclusions...

Re:Uses the IBM Public License (2, Informative)

gr8_phk (621180) | more than 9 years ago | (#10374128)

The FSF has stated that the CPL (is that the one they're using?) is not GPL compatible due to patent issues. They did not express an opinion about the patent requirements of the license, just that it makes it incompatible with the GPL.

WiX and WTL are CPL (3, Interesting)

ashpool7 (18172) | more than 9 years ago | (#10374213)

This one is not.

When I say "draw your own conclusions," I meant "determine for yourself the reason why Microsoft used this license," not anything nefarious about Microsoft or the license.

IMHO, they did it because MS Legal told them they needed to consider the fact that Microsoft thinks software patents are really important. What "consider" entails can be varying.

Re:How open source? (-1, Redundant)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#10374042)

RTFA.

/. effect (4, Funny)

Greger47 (516305) | more than 9 years ago | (#10373956)

Well, regarding which one is best, I think FlexWiki wins the /. effect test, showing a 503 Service not available. Compared to Kwiki that doesn't respond at all... :)

/greger

Re:/. effect (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#10374247)

It just shows who has more money to pay for the increased bandwidth. Nothing more.

But I thought... (3, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#10373959)

What's with all the open-sourcing of Microsoft stuff lately?

Aren't these the guys who said open source harms innovation and damages the economy? Can't have it both ways, guys.

Here's proof. [gearlive.com] Free 27" flatscreen TVs, 17" monitors. [freeflatscreens.com]

Re:But I thought... (5, Interesting)

Swamii (594522) | more than 9 years ago | (#10374098)

A lot of people at Microsoft are changing their thinking regarding OSS. For example, Josh Ledgard, MS's "community evangelist", is a supporter of OSS and was key in brining WiX to SourceForge.

Someone once said about MS's business practices (so no cracks about software bugs please), they make mistakes like any other company, but they'll only make them once. If they discover OSS can help them and benefit them, which it certainly could IMO, they will change their ways no matter how much about-facing they have to do.

Ob:M$-bash HAW HAW! (1)

Thud457 (234763) | more than 9 years ago | (#10374291)

What makes you think that Microsoft is above harming innovation or damaging the economy?!!!

What!! (5, Funny)

bluFox (612877) | more than 9 years ago | (#10373962)

They can't do that, They have no right to be good. or who else do we look up to when it comes to evil?

Re:What!! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#10374002)

I couldn't get it submit an edit. But I'm only using Firefox. If I used a proper browser like IE it would probably work okay.

Re:What!! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#10374159)

Um... sco?

The time is 8:25 AM, the temperatur 0 C (1)

ackthpt (218170) | more than 9 years ago | (#10373963)

Microsoft is apparently releasing its FlexWiki wiki implementation as an open source project.

The evil empire which denounced Open Source... Sysiphus, put down that snowball!

Sorry if I'm a n00b but.... (0, Redundant)

HerculesMO (693085) | more than 9 years ago | (#10373973)

WTF is a wiki? I hear about it all day long on /.

Re:Sorry if I'm a n00b but.... (1)

Derkec (463377) | more than 9 years ago | (#10374236)

The links are fine, but a Wiki is essentially a web page that people can log in to and edit relatively easily. Often they are used as a commons for sharing information or ideas.

From www.flexwiki.com (2, Interesting)

ideatrack (702667) | more than 9 years ago | (#10373974)

If you...

* interested in a good software, leave this page!


Likewise good grammar it would seem...

NO!!! (0, Flamebait)

skraps (650379) | more than 9 years ago | (#10373976)

It's nowhere near as good! How dare they soil the good name of the FOSS movement with this shoddy software. Nobody should use it, and everyone should make fun of it - that will teach them to try to open up their source code!

I find it ironic (2, Insightful)

cyberlotnet (182742) | more than 9 years ago | (#10373977)

"Microsofts third open source project"

Does the right nut know what the left nut is doing over there?

One nut is releasing open source projects, The other nut goes as far as to try to make legislation to slow down or stop adoptation of open source.

Sorry Microsoft, you can't have your cake and eat it to.. MAKE UP YOUR MINDS.

Why Not? (4, Interesting)

Bill, Shooter of Bul (629286) | more than 9 years ago | (#10374072)

Does IBM Open Source everythig they do? How about Novell? Red Hat? It seems to me, that there are situations where companies can profit from making the code open, and others where it would lose more than it would gain. As time goes on, I think thats just going to become more common.

Re:Why Not? (4, Informative)

eviltypeguy (521224) | more than 9 years ago | (#10374110)

Does RedHat "Open Source" everything they do? Why yes, actually. I'm not aware of any product they sell that isn't "Open Source".

Re:Why Not? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#10374227)

The point wasn't that MS isn't open sourcing everything, but rather that it is open sourcing some things on the one hand, and then denouncing and fighting against open source on the other. Big difference. Unless you find IBM denouncing open source in which case we will say MS is not alone in this. Or Novell, for that matter.

Re:Why Not? (3, Insightful)

ironygranny (596328) | more than 9 years ago | (#10374267)

I think the OP's problem was that Microsoft has been so vocally against open-source. IBM, at least, makes commercials with Muhammad Ali egging on the children of the corn in support of open-source. The issue is not that they should either open-source everything they do or nothing at all, rather that they should just stop talking shit about it if they're going to "participate."

Re:Why Not? (3, Insightful)

GreyPoopon (411036) | more than 9 years ago | (#10374328)

Does IBM Open Source everythig they do? How about Novell? Red Hat?

Umm, I think you missed the point the parent was making. The issue isn't whether Microsoft submits all of the software as Open Source. It's the fact that they are trying to litigate against Open Source while at the same time releasing some of their own projects as Open Source. I don't think you can make the same argument about IBM, Novell or Red Hat.

Re:I find it ironic (5, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#10374099)

Sorry Microsoft, you can't have your cake and eat it to..
If you have as much moiney as Microsoft, then you can have your cake, eat it, shit in someone else's cake and make them eat it. Buy lots of cake and eat that too. Sell your cake to everyone in the world, but then eat it anyway. Whatever you want to do with cake.. having shedloads of money will open those options up for you. Now, say you're an open source dev trying to give away your software - you should be lucky if you even see any crumbs. Never mind the cake.

Re:I find it ironic (4, Insightful)

McDutchie (151611) | more than 9 years ago | (#10374120)

Does the right nut know what the left nut is doing over there?

As huge as they are, that would hardly be surprising. Governments are notorious for suffering from this problem, and Microsoft seems to be bigger than many governments.

Re:I find it ironic (1)

accidental_1 (774756) | more than 9 years ago | (#10374218)

AFAIK MS doesn't like GPL not Open Source. They use BSD code and it is Open Source (If I remember correctly). It's the legalities of GPL that mess them up.

Conversely... (4, Insightful)

Sheetrock (152993) | more than 9 years ago | (#10373978)

My question is: Is this software as good as the ever-extensible Kwiki implementation?

My question is: is there anything Microsoft can do that we won't question?

Applaud them for their newfound approach to open source. More alternatives are always better. I'll bet this software does something Kwiki can't do.

Re:Conversely... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#10374069)

like be GPL incompatible... ;)

We need a place... (3, Funny)

sczimme (603413) | more than 9 years ago | (#10374154)


to store all these implementations - some kind of repository.

I propose we call it the Kwiki-Mart.

/thank you, come again

Re:Conversely... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#10374206)

No.

Credit where it's due? (5, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#10373984)

Is this software as good as the ever-extensible Kwiki implementation?

You know, Microsoft has done an incredible number of crappy things, and they deserve most of the flak they get, but I don't understand why we can't just once acknowledge them for taking a positive step without making some cheap jab like this.

"Microsoft released something as open source -- but let's all assume that a non-MS alternative is better even though we haven't made an actual comparison!" How immature can you get?

Yes, I know I could just stop reading /., but it's an unhealthy addiction... :)

Zealots Ahoy! (-1, Offtopic)

TyrranzzX (617713) | more than 9 years ago | (#10373985)

"My question is: Is this software as good as the ever-extensible Kwiki implementation?"

Gnarl and Gnash! Gnarl and Gnash! Burn down the windows and Redmond! Go my flying slashdot monkies! Kidnap Bill gates and smother him in tar and feathers, then tie bricks to his legs and throw him into the river to see if he's a witch!

Like What the hell do you want? Topical, to the point debate about Windows Vs [insert other corp, oss project, linux, ect here]? The best you'll get is "Microsoft is evil, we like the other project" or "both are evil, where's the linux project".

Re:Zealots Ahoy! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#10374166)

What do we want?

How about a monoplistic, criminal company actually face some kind of punishment?

(yes, they are guilty, this isnt up for debate, they went through the system and were found guilty. period.)

Re:Zealots Ahoy! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#10374351)

You know, I really do hate retards like you.

You have noticed that Slashdot has a bias towards Linux & OSS. Apparently this surprises you and you need to make as many people as possible aware of your stunning insight. Perhaps it has not occurred to you that this site is supposed to be a place for supporters of Linux & OSS to discuss items of news?

If you don't like it can I make a suggestion? Hows about you fuck off to e.g flexbeta.com? Once there you can make friends with all the other 31337 WinTards and while away your days discussing the latest pirated beta of Longhorn that you've managed to download from Kazaa :

Ooh l00k at the big clock and the purty k0lors! Those Lunix fags are going to shit themselves! LOLLOLOLOLOL!

Does the title say "News for nerds, objective discussions of the latest Microsoft products"?

No? Then you are a _total_ cocksucker for assuming that that's what you'll find.

Haha! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#10373995)

And let the "this must be some clever plot to kill open source by releasing open source products" theories begin... :-)

You know, I just thought of something... M$ (MSFT) might be migrating into the Encyclopedia market and this is their secret plan to kill Teh Wikipedia... damn you Ballmer! Damn you Gates! Damn you Leo Laporte!... wait? No. :O

Bun Fight (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#10373996)


Let the bunfight begin!

My open source is better than your open source,
My wiki is better than our wiki.

etc and so on ad infinitum.

Prophecy? (1)

yonatanh (815045) | more than 9 years ago | (#10373999)

I hope this is a sign that is foretelling of the future meaning that they will start doing this with more and more of their software in the future.

Wiki open source (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#10374000)



Yay.

Some one got to the site! (1)

1DarkZen (25693) | more than 9 years ago | (#10374009)

I got the image but this is what it say on the get Wiki page!
There are two ways to get Welcome to Fuck Wiki Forum 2_666, in binary form for installation on your server and in source code form (so you can make changes to it and make it better!).

Need to see the licence (0)

joelethan (782993) | more than 9 years ago | (#10374015)

So, what is the licence here?
How open is this open source?

Could someone post a precis of the Ts and Cs?

/JE

crashware (1)

ValiantSoul (801152) | more than 9 years ago | (#10374024)

"if you are interested in a good software, leave this page!"

To go along with typical Microsoft software, I dub this crashware!!

Why the use of the "F" word in FlexWikiBinaries? (2, Funny)

Jerky McNaughty (1391) | more than 9 years ago | (#10374038)

From this page [flexwiki.com]:
The Welcome to Fuck Wiki Forum 2_666 binaries are available by downloading release...[snip]
and
Install and configure your Welcome to Fuck Wiki Forum 2_666...[snip]
and
If you are new to Welcome to Fuck Wiki Forum 2_666 or just want your hand held...[snip]
I almost think that someone, umm, changed that page, because it doesn't make any sense to call it Fuck Wiki to me!

Re:Why the use of the "F" word in FlexWikiBinaries (0, Troll)

CRCates (557541) | more than 9 years ago | (#10374140)

Because microsoft has released more "Secure" software that prevents people from tampering with your system (or in this case... their systems). Just another poster child for security being "top priority" at microsoft. It's like when Ford was promoting "Quality is Job #1" .... you emphasize a weakness as a strength and hope people don't notice.

Re:Why the use of the "F" word in FlexWikiBinaries (1)

ValiantSoul (801152) | more than 9 years ago | (#10374153)

Don't you know, its a part of Microsoft's new security strategy. They are clearly implimenting their new security techniques in FlexWiki. Thank you MS for working so hard to bring security to our homes! NOT

Re:Why the use of the "F" word in FlexWikiBinaries (1)

PitaBred (632671) | more than 9 years ago | (#10374333)

It's someone being petty and stupid. It's like the imbeciles who tag with graffiti, and other vandalism.
Note to vandals: Way to be mature, guys. Maybe you should get out of your parents basement and get a job, and a life.

Re:Why the use of the "F" word in FlexWikiBinaries (1)

LiquidCoooled (634315) | more than 9 years ago | (#10374346)

The grafiti you are seeing is part of the slashdot effect. Some of the hackers heree will swarm around a site looking for entry points. Wikis provide endless fun and amusement.

A wiki allows most pages to be edited by anyone, and you have discovered one of these abused pages.

It looks like its been cured now, but the revision notes still indicate the bad revision.

Most wikis impliment an administrator editable Locked flag to prevent such changes to special pages.

I guess it just wasn't applied here.

Stop with the negativity (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#10374040)

Anybody-but-Microsoft releases some new open source, people rejoice and welcome the variety. Microsoft does it, the reaction is "Meh". For as questionable as some of Microsoft's programs and practices are, they'll never improve if we don't let them.

I just came back from vacation... (1)

starphish (256015) | more than 9 years ago | (#10374046)

....in hell because it was way too cold. Does anyone have an explanation for this drastic drop in temperature?

only works in IE? (1)

cascadingstylesheet (140919) | more than 9 years ago | (#10374071)

Or is their Save button subject to Slashdoting? It sure looks like /. changes have been made in OneMinuteWiki ... but I can't add mine ;)

Information about the CPL (3, Interesting)

FunWithHeadlines (644929) | more than 9 years ago | (#10374085)

Since this is another Microsoft project being released as open source, let's examine which license they chose. My distrust of Microsoft is such that I would prefer they pick the GPL for releasing stuff, since then there is nothing they could do to later gum up the works (what, Microsoft do something sneaky? Never!).

In this case, they chose the IBM-developed Common Public License, or CPL. What is the CPL? Here is what the Wikipedia says [wikipedia.org]. Note this section:

"The CPL is a copyleft license, broadly similar to the GNU General Public License in its terms. The main addition is a patent clause designed to prevent unscrupulous contributors from contributing code which infringes on their patents, and then attempting to charge royalties; in such a situation, the CPL requires the contributor to grant a royalty-free license to all recipients. This additional requirement renders the CPL incompatible with the GPL (in the opinion of Eben Moglen)..."

Hmm..incompatible with the GPL. Let's see what Groklaw has said about the CPL [groklaw.net]. All right, call me paranoid, but with Microsoft's history, I would tread cautiously. This may be altruistic of them, and maybe they are really nice guys, and trying to be good corporate citizens. Or maybe there is another motive that will become clear in the future. Time will tell.

Re:Information about the CPL (5, Informative)

Elwood P Dowd (16933) | more than 9 years ago | (#10374353)

Uh, no, I don't think so. From that discription, it sounds like a totally acceptable license. In fact, from the FSF's page [gnu.org]:
Common Public License Version 1.0

This is a free software license but it is incompatible with the GPL.

The Common Public License is incompatible with the GPL because it has various specific requirements that are not in the GPL.

For example, it requires certain patent licenses be given that the GPL does not require. (We don't think those patent license requirements are inherently a bad idea, but nonetheless they are incompatible with the GNU GPL.)
This is the same issue with the latest Apache license. It's good, it's just GPL incompatible. If they ever make a new version of the GPL, it might contain identical requirements.

And my question is . . . (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#10374087)

Can Slashdot ever post an article about Microsoft's good deeds without being a whiney little bitch about it?

"Open Source" (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#10374105)

Yeah, it's probably open source under the ESR definition, but I would bet my only computer that it dosen't come close to the RMS defintion of free software. And I didn't even RTFA.

Popping noise (1)

nizo (81281) | more than 9 years ago | (#10374123)

I can hear popping noises as the heads of nerds explode from the "Open source good/Microsoft bad" paradox that has been created.

Defaced already (1)

mjfrazer (305120) | more than 9 years ago | (#10374134)

And the kiddies rejoice with thier opportunity to deface a microsoft web site without having to hack into it first.

ASP.NET (3, Informative)

News for nerds (448130) | more than 9 years ago | (#10374135)

As it's implemented in ASP.NET, you are recommended to use IIS to host it with best performance. If you are an OSS-oriented, mono + Apache may be an option. Anyway, comparing it to Perl-written Kwiki is nonsense IMHO.

Re:ASP.NET (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#10374186)

mono + apache is too dangerous to run right now ..

Especially to run Microsoft code on ... at least from patent persepctive.

Microsoft Released? (4, Informative)

enkafan (604078) | more than 9 years ago | (#10374148)

I'm not totoally sold on Microsoft releasing this software as open source. It was written by David Ornstein [asp.net], who works at Microsoft. While this tool is used internally at Microsoft, and I'm sure MS has the rights to the software too, I just don't think it's fair to David to classify this as a Microsoft Product.

BTW, David's weblog has a bunch of info on FlexWiki being posted to SourceForge [asp.net].

kwiki vs mediawiki vs twiki vs.... (2, Interesting)

otis wildflower (4889) | more than 9 years ago | (#10374157)

.... Can someone provide a nice rundown on why I should choose one wiki package over another?

License, Ease-of-use, Power, Compatibility, Language should all be in the chart.

This is getting confusing!

I thought ... (2, Interesting)

JMZorko (150414) | more than 9 years ago | (#10374169)

... that MS employee's were not permitted to participate in OSS projects? Does this mean that, once they release it, they're not allowed to improve it?

Regards,

John

Microsoft on Open Source (1)

hcob$ (766699) | more than 9 years ago | (#10374191)

Oh great, here we go... Microsoft getting on the open source bandwagon.

Since Microsoft can't beat open source software economically and financially, I guess they are gonna try and join it.

But having MSoft join open source is like when you look at someone who has tons of broken cars and they offer to "fix" yours for free......

Channel 9 (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#10374197)

Chris Waddle! Chris Waddle!

not really open source (0)

mAIsE (548) | more than 9 years ago | (#10374214)

unless this is a compatible license it isn't worth your time, or involvement.

http://opensource.org/licenses/

nice try bill ...

fuck you linus fags!!! (0, Troll)

NessusRed (710227) | more than 9 years ago | (#10374229)

Tell your mongoloid wife to suck my dick! Do it now or else! Suck it, mongoloid!all of you pay attention now or else no more talk except about feces understood. now tak moreons talk

Ever-inaccessible Kwiki implementation (1)

lxdbxr (655786) | more than 9 years ago | (#10374307)

Methinks the "ever-extensible Kwiki implementation" needs a "slashdotting" extension.

To be honest I have looked over Wiki software in the past but do not think I have heard of Kwiki - what is so good about it that the submitter felt the need to mention it? I like UseMod [usemod.com] and have made changes to it with ease (and I am by no means a hardcode Perl hacker).

Vandalism (2, Informative)

e.colli (630500) | more than 9 years ago | (#10374322)

Clicking on rename [flexwiki.com] it shows the message:
"Due to excessive vandalism, the rename function has been disabled. Once the vandals get bored, we'll reenable"

License? (2, Informative)

Bob9113 (14996) | more than 9 years ago | (#10374341)

Candera's FlexWiki Contrib [sourceforge.net] uses the IBM license, but the FlexWiki Core [sourceforge.net] project has no license listed. I didn't know you could start a project on SF without selecting a license, I thought it was a mandatory part of the project submission form. Does anyone know what license they are using?
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