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265 comments

Gee, wonderful Valve. (3, Interesting)

eviltypeguy (521224) | more than 9 years ago | (#10609118)

I just love how Valve changed what they originally said about this...

All hail Valve, our next Microsoft Product Activation-like overlord.

Re:Gee, wonderful Valve. (-1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#10609350)

Changed what they said? What in the world are you talking about?

When Valve started switching everyone over to Steam a year or so ago, you had to throw in your HL cd-key to download everything. They've said all along Steam would be their distribution system for playing HL2, so I fail to see what exactly has changed. Please explain.

Re:Gee, wonderful Valve. (4, Informative)

eviltypeguy (521224) | more than 9 years ago | (#10609401)

They originally said you could install the game and play singleplayer without 'activating'. But once you wanted to update the game or play mutiplayer you had to activate it via Steam.

Thanx valve (5, Insightful)

ramunas (771197) | more than 9 years ago | (#10609701)

so how am I supposed to play it when it's imposiible for me to use STEAM?!?! I must use a proxy server to connect to the internet, which is also used by many other people, so port-forwarding is not an option. Therefore no steam for my PC. And thus I can't even play the legitimate version of it, oh well I guess I'm just going to need to find a cracked, boot-legged version of it anyway :(

Re:Thanx valve (2, Funny)

arose (644256) | more than 9 years ago | (#10609827)

We are not sure about your particular setup, please buy a retail package to test it out*. * Opened packages can not be returned. Thanks for your interest in Half Life 2, Valve

Re:Thanx valve (1)

cannon fodder 0109 (787777) | more than 9 years ago | (#10610165)

I did something similar with Doom 3. When I got my preordered copy, put it in the drive and found it wouldn't work because of Deamon tools installed on my PC, I just put it back in the box and downloaded a cracked version using bittorrent. "No problem with that" you might say as I bought a copy so ID software got paid for their work - except that while downloading it bittorent uploaded almost 2 copies worth, just one more example of how excessive copy protection actually hurts the games industry. Note: I use Deamon tools because my DVD drive has run out of region changes (I live in the UK and watch an approximatly 50:50 mix of region 1 and 2 DVDs as anime is usually released region 1 long before region 2 and I'm too impatient to wait) and there are not any firmware updates available yet to workaround this. So to watch a DVD from a different region I have to rip it and mount the ISO.

Re:Gee, wonderful Valve. (1)

cgenman (325138) | more than 9 years ago | (#10610221)

Agreed. You can get away with a lot more when you're selling a word processor than when you're selling a videogame. Having seen Steam's "performance" over the years, I swore that I would never install it until it became A: minimalist B: stable and C: open to any vendors.

I'd also been planning on buying Half-Life 2 when it was released. But with Doom 3 out and Halo 2 coming out, I don't see how they can require Steam and feel they can get away with it in the competitive marketplace. It's amazing that in this situation Microsoft is actually the non-evil one, but there it is.

I can understand their desire to protect their revenue stream, but not via steam. Don't make me install your poorly written bloated proprietary closed sales gimmock just to play something I've paid you for. Stop being RealPlayer, or suffer their fate.

Team Fortress 2? (5, Insightful)

avalys (221114) | more than 9 years ago | (#10609122)

"Q. What's the latest status on Team Fortress 2?

Doug Lombardi: After we announced TF2 on the HL1 tech, we made the decision to move it to the Source engine. It is still in development and we will be announcing more on that title soon."


Don't bother, no one cares any more. You blew it.

Re:Team Fortress 2? (1)

Rayonic (462789) | more than 9 years ago | (#10609671)

And yet here people are still posting about it.

Re:Team Fortress 2? (3, Insightful)

supabeast! (84658) | more than 9 years ago | (#10609911)

Agreed. I might have cared about TF2 before the online gaming world had moved to CS, but at this point it would just be another weird mod that pisses me off...

Glad to see... (5, Insightful)

Godeke (32895) | more than 9 years ago | (#10609134)

that they have given me an excuse to not purchase the game. I use my machine for programming, with a bit of light gaming on the side. I'm not interested in Steam (I get my rear end handed to me in multiplay) and if I have to sell my machine's soul to their marketing drones, well they can take their delayed, litigated and now "strings attached" game and shove it.

Sad really, reviews are high and I loved the first one. I guess I will be more productive next month than I expected.

Re:Glad to see... (1, Insightful)

sgant (178166) | more than 9 years ago | (#10609260)

Yeah, big pain in the ass. But you know, you could register with Steam giving bogus info then just block steam from accessing the Net.

But look at Steam this way, it's just a Valve game launcher. It's how you launch Valve games. That's how Valve does it.

It's minor. A very minor thing and yet people act like Valve is asking for the their first born child! Let's see what happens first next month before we start jumping to conclusions.

Re:Glad to see... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#10609299)

It's minor. A very minor thing and yet people act like Valve is asking for the their first born child!

Just because it's minor in nature doesn't mean that it's totally unacceptable.

Re:Glad to see... (4, Insightful)

cjpez (148000) | more than 9 years ago | (#10609406)

I dunno, I don't think it's that minor. They've done a couple of things here which violate a couple of things I feel are integral to a single-player game. First off, a single player game just shouldn't have to talk to the internet. Suppose I didn't have a connection where I was. Suppose I just moved and my connection's not installed yet. Suppose I have restrictive firewall settings on that I don't want to have to bypass just to play a game against the computer. It's just unacceptable.

The second, and to me more annoying thnig, is that they've just made it impossible to install and play the game once they go belly-up. As soon as Steam stops becoming available, nobody can play the game on a new installation without hacking it. That's just ridiculous. I still pull out old DOS games from when I was a dorkling in junior high, and I expect them to just install and WORK (well, provided the DOS emulators are up to snuff, anyway). Would they do so if they had to dial up and talk to some server from the 80s that doesn't exist anymore? No, they wouldn't.

All in all, a horrible decision. I was so excited about this game, too.

Re:Glad to see... (1)

Txiasaeia (581598) | more than 9 years ago | (#10609422)

Sandbox and crack, my friend. This will not be a problem 10 years down the road.

Re:Glad to see... (4, Insightful)

cjpez (148000) | more than 9 years ago | (#10609505)

Right, obviously if you either go to the trouble of hacking it yourself, or just wait a few hours for the inevitable Clever Hacker to do it for you, then you're good to go. The thing is that I shouldn't have to resort to methods which can probably be construed as illegal by our lovely judicial system just to play a game I purchased against my own computer.

Re:Glad to see... (2, Insightful)

irc.goatse.cx troll (593289) | more than 9 years ago | (#10609751)

Its been like that for a long time, and is why I don't purchase games. I'm not going to jump through hoops to get something I paid for working when its infinately easier to download the fully working version. It would be like if buying a cd required you to fill out 5 pages of paperwork (which isnt too far off from what I predict the future will be like) -- If I payed for it, it should JustWork(TM)

Thats why the only games worth what they charge are made by ID. Even their cdkey auth is more lax allowing much easier use for lan parties and such. In the ~10+ years ID has been in buisness, I don't think they've ever required you keep the cd/floppy that you installed off of. Why? Because ID consists of gamers, not buisnessmen.
Not that they don't make good buisnessmen(I've seen pictures of carmack's car.), but they put their gaming side first and don't release something that isn't worth playing. Compare that to Valve, who's been milking the same engine AND STORYLINE for ages. No, Valve, Playing as some stupid dude in a vest and a helmet won't make your game interesting again.

Re:Glad to see... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#10609842)

But they own the game, they can do whatever they want with it. /ip apologyst

Re:Glad to see... (3, Insightful)

igrp (732252) | more than 9 years ago | (#10609508)

It's minor. A very minor thing and yet people act like Valve is asking for the their first born child!

It very well may be minor but it's still an annoyance. I can understand their desire to protect their IP, especially after their ridiculous security policies have resulted in several breaches.

But this will simply not prevent determined people from pirating or leaking the game. It will, however, inconvenience those people who buy a legitimate copy of the game.

I guess the old "some people don't have Internet/broadband/whatever access" argument doesn't hold a lot of water anymore, especially with regard to the intended HL2 audience. But the fact remains that some people simply don't want to forced to active their software because they're opposed to the idea of having to give out private information in general, or just don't want to be bothered or simply find the whole concept of treating a paying customer like a criminal unless he or she proves otherwise iniquitous.

Yes, I suppose you could give Valve fake information. But I why am I supposed to give them any personal information in the first place? Compare it to Windows XP. Microsoft's product activation scheme hasn't prevented one determined individual from pirating their software. Sure, it has raised the bar so-to-speak for some "casual, wannabe software pirates" (which was probably what they were trying to do). They also managed to piss off millions of legitimate users in the process.

I sure hope they put a big fat red warning sticker on the boxes. Hardcore gamers will still want to play HL2, even if they have to give their firstborn to Valve (and that probably goes for a lot of not-so-hardcore gamers, too). But that way, people at least have a choice and don't have to find out the hard way (ie. after installing the game) that they can't play the game they just purchased without Valve's blessing.

Re:Glad to see... (1, Funny)

baywulf (214371) | more than 9 years ago | (#10609426)

I gave up playing games on my PC. I bought one of those new PS/2 systems and hooked up to the TV card on my Linux system. The PS/2 display will be in another window in X. Now I can switch between playing games and browsing, etc on one system and I don't need a noisy expensive video card on my PC anymore. Console games are not so expensive anyway if you wait a little while. I see plenty of games under $20 since new stuff comes up on a weekly basis.

So, Steam is still good? (3, Interesting)

Drakino (10965) | more than 9 years ago | (#10609140)

Sounds like a move to try and get people to see Steam, and consider not buying the next Valve product in the stores.

Some ideas of Steam are nice, but I still don't like the idea of buying a product through it. Skipping the publishers is a bad thing, as they fund the new games. Sure, publishers need to treat the developers better, but to try and axe them out of the picture completely is a bad idea.

Why is that bad? (3, Interesting)

2nd Post! (213333) | more than 9 years ago | (#10609319)

Your logic is, "Skipping the publishers is a bad thing, as they fund the new games."

But the whole point of skipping the publishers is to get enough money so the developers can "fund the new games". And when you get to that point, WHY do we, as gamers, or developers, need or want publishers?

Re:Why is that bad? (2, Insightful)

Ford Prefect (8777) | more than 9 years ago | (#10609448)

But the whole point of skipping the publishers is to get enough money so the developers can "fund the new games".

Who do you think funds a new development studio with no released titles already making money for them?

Valve's got to the stage where it doesn't need the financial backing of a publisher, but for smaller people, it's a very important source of monetary investment.

As for the Half-Life 2 requiring product activation - I'm not sure if this is the best route to be going down. Yes, nearly everyone has an internet connection these days, but there still are some people without. A friend of mine is a big fan of Half-Life (and games in general) but has no internet access at home. An outlier? Yes, but there's probably more of them than we think, especially in the casual PC gamer market the original Half-Life has more recently done so well in. Such people are a bit unlikely to be posting on here, for a start. ;-)

I've nothing against persistent user profiles and product registration for online gaming - a bit less anonymity might cut down on the number of idiots currently infesting servers - but requiring activation for an offline, single-player game does seem to be going a bit far. Anyone pirating the game will most likely have a registration-free hacked version, as already mentioned...

Re:Why is that bad? (3, Informative)

Drakino (10965) | more than 9 years ago | (#10609504)

Ok, I'm a new developer. How do I fund my game? Pre-sell it through a Steam like program collecting money at the pre-sell, then coming out with it 3 years later? No.

I go and talk to a game publisher, they loan me money, then when the game does well, the loan is paid off. If it doesn't then thats another story. The publisher also has people to decide if the game idea will do well, by testing it on play testers and such.

I am not saying existing publishers are great. I'm just mostly trying to say getting rid of them completly to me seems like a very bad idea.

This is all overly simplistic, but I think it gets the point across.

Re:Why is that bad? (1)

irc.goatse.cx troll (593289) | more than 9 years ago | (#10609770)

You release something really cool as a mod to get your companys name known, then its easier to get money for further devel. Look at Natural Selection and Flayra's new company, UnderWorldsEntertainment. Had he just started a company from the begining, noone would pay any attention. Now he has a following, people with money like that.

Greymatter(I think) did the same thing with RTCW:EnemyTerritory.

Re:So, Steam is still good? (1)

Soul-Burn666 (574119) | more than 9 years ago | (#10609415)

For a company that is already stable enough financially and well known (such as valve), they can figure out how to pay the development costs. If they sell their products only through a Steam like system, they can cut the costs of publishing and the percent they have to give the publishers.
If most of the sells will be through an online system, cutting off the publishers' share, they can earn much more money from it, easily cover the development costs and have enough money to develop the next game.
Any surplusses above that can go to lowering the price of the game, thus making users happier and probably increasing the number of legal copies of the software.
Moreover, if you buy it digitally, it means their database says you bought it, meaning you can download it whenever you want, in case you have an HD failure or the like. This is something that you can't usually do with physical distribution, as the publishers don't like giving away new media in case the media is rendered useless.

Re:So, Steam is still good? (1)

Txiasaeia (581598) | more than 9 years ago | (#10609445)

Stardock has been releasing games online and offline for a while now, and their method is *much* less draconian than Steam's.

Re:So, Steam is still good? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#10609599)

By your logic, the only quality music you could buy would be from big record labels; not indie local bands and the only movies worth watching would come from the major movie houses.

Some of the best games I've ever played have been downloaded directly from the developer and purchased directly from the developer. Publishers and distributors of games are an unneccesary and limiting step, just like music and movie publishers and distributors are bottlenecks. They limit the number of good games that ever see the light of day and focus on mass appeal to the common denomanator.

I also think people are being too paranoid. I'm one of those "keep your hands off my data" people, but I don't see what the big deal is here. So far, Steam is pretty cool and I like that when I login to play CounterStrike, I know that everyone (including myself) is playing with the latest fixes automatically, seamlessly and painlessly updated during login. This made fixing the %n exploit and a number of other problems pretty nice this past week.

The only problem I do have with it would be that I want to be sure I can play HL2 and other single player games without an internet connection. Maybe I want to play on my laptop while traveling? The other is that it would be nice if a large company like Valve said "since we are increasing our profit margin by cutting out the publisher, packaging, shipping, distribution expenses... we will sell our games for a reduced cost from the $50 store-value".

I'm sure they currently have a contract with their publisher that prohibitis them from selling the game to people cheaper than their publisher does, though. Still - it would be nice.

By the way, not only did I buy one copy but I bought a second for my brother. I guess the spookie-ookies at Valve are going to haxor my boxors now and control all my data through Stream. Soon they'll be ordering women's panties through Fredericks of Hollywood online for me without my knowledge. THEY ARE SO TEH EVIL NOW!

Good god, people.

Argument for piratation? (5, Interesting)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#10609151)

Sorry Valve, but I have no intention of letting Steam ever tough my PC. I will buy your game (if it turns out to be worth it), and I will acquire a crack to enable it.

Don't fuck over your customers. Things will get much worse.

abso-frigging-lutely (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#10609413)

Great, so now I have to wait for a crack as well as a demo (so I can be sure it runs OK and is worth the cash). Luckily the cracker community is much more obliging than the average developer!

Or maybe I'll decide it's not worth the hassle.

Re:abso-frigging-lutely (3, Interesting)

irc.goatse.cx troll (593289) | more than 9 years ago | (#10609796)

No you really don't. The crack already exists today (the Steam debug client that most hl related leaks use), It just needs to be hacked onto the final hl2 release, which will take about 30minutes. As for the demo.. Go download CS:Source and see if it runs on your machine.

If you're not afraid of your console and making your game ugly, theres plenty of ways to speed up the game. If I didn't hate Valve and Counterstrike with a passion now, I'd make a howto, but cvarlist mat_ and screw with those settings for better fps, namely mat_dxlevel 70 as I said in another post.

Won't stop piracy (2, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#10609152)

This'll barely even slow the warezers down. I bet there'll be a crack out within a week of release, if there isn't one already.

Well, another game I won't be buying. (5, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#10609153)

If I'm going to be treated like a copyright infringer, I'll just wait for the crack.

I can see the game returns now (2, Insightful)

happyhippy (526970) | more than 9 years ago | (#10609179)

from the average public joe.
"Hey mister, this game wont work. Can I exchange it?"

Re:I can see the game returns now (1)

vegetablespork (575101) | more than 9 years ago | (#10609195)

Sorry, no returns on opened software. You'll have to take it up with the manufacturer.

Re:I can see the game returns now (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#10609878)

Sorry we can't deal with each and every one of you. You better talk to whoever sold it...

Re:I can see the game returns now (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#10610000)

Or in the case of me trying to get a refund for the buggy tribes 2 through Sierra; "We will take the game back and give you a refund, just spend $10 on S&H to send it back to us, go through the hassle of shipping, wait a while, and we will give you back less then what you paid for it."

Of course I didn't bother with it, and while I don't remember the full details, from what I remember it wasn't worth it. For all I know or care the refund might as well have been in Sierra Fun Bux(TM), and $40.00 in Sierra bucks could equal $0.01 US.

I have cancalled my Amazon order... (3, Insightful)

thesp (307649) | more than 9 years ago | (#10609191)

...I urge others to do the same. If we, the consumers, keep on permitting u-turns by companies, and cheerfully accepting them, it will only encourage this culture of mendacity that is more prevalent each day in this world.

Re:I have cancalled my Amazon order... (1)

McTimson (700517) | more than 9 years ago | (#10609297)

It doesn't matter how many people cancel their online preorders, every 12 year old dipshit with a Dell will be getting their parents to buy them the game anyway. We're not the consumers, we're the community that they say they care about, but turn their backs on anyway. They care about cash, nothing more, nothing less. Making everyone install Steam means they can advertise their own products more, sell advertising space to other companies, and do whatever else they want. But as long as there's a shitty game involved in it, it'll sell.

Re:I have cancalled my Amazon order... (3, Insightful)

sgant (178166) | more than 9 years ago | (#10609367)

I have a 12 year old and I can tell you, he isn't interested in HL2 at all. He's like...what's that?

But anyway, I love how people all of a sudden turn on a company and to the old "sold out" routine that is as old as the hills. Of course they care about cash, but from everything I've seen, they care about the quality of their game. I've heard great things about this game, but bottom line, if it isn't good, it isn't good and they will NOT rake in the cash.

Word get's out now. Not everyone is lumped into the "dipshit" masses any longer. There is too much competition out there to just release a crappy game and hope people will buy it just because of the name. Look at Doom3, it was an "ok" game, but it's certainly not breaking sales records across the world.

Having everyone install Steam does give them some control...control that you can buy directly from them and also update the games as a patch comes out. I see as being helpfull and easy.

But hey, they don't have control over my computer. No one does. If in the future they want to get into a pay-per-use model, I'll leave. It's no big deal. It's not like it's spy-ware that you can't get off your computer.

I don't see it as a big deal, but I guess others do. It will be interesting to see what happens in the coming months.

Re:I have cancalled my Amazon order... (2, Insightful)

EngineeringMarvel (783720) | more than 9 years ago | (#10609443)

I understand if you do not agree with the Steam authentication, but why is it that people want everyone to do the same thing they are doing. It is like people want an excuse to not buy the game. Games are about entertainment and fun, so why are so many people complaining about HL2, a game that hasn't even come out yet. I think people are forgetting the whole point of buying a game. How can you judge a game's quality if you haven't played it yet.

I'm beginning to think people use the whole HL2 "drama" just to get attention on the internet. People want to actually think that others care if they are buying a game or not. I know I don't. If I hear my friends like a game, then I'll buy it, but am I gonna not buy a game because one person says they are cancelling their pre-order....I don't think so. The whole irony of all this is that in a few months, if HL2 turns out to be a great game, the very same cancelling people are going to be the first one to jump on the, "omg, this is the greatest game ever and I knew it all along" band wagon. As for me, I was ready to buy the game last year on release day, now, I'll probably wait a few days after release. Either way, I'll eventually buy the game I think because Valve produced an amazing product on the last go around.

Re:I have cancalled my Amazon order... (0, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#10609552)

Why in the hell would I cancel my order? Steam is pretty damn nice.

For instance, this past week there were a number of server-exploits that would crash entire games for everyone on CS:S. They issued a fix that was downloaded and updated automatically before logging into the game. No hunting down the news. No digging around to find a website with the patch. No downloading. No updating. No screwing around. Simply clicked a button to play like normal and everything was handled for me.

Seriously, having a system that handles automatic patching and such is great. I mean, what are you afraid that they're going to do, activate your webcam remotely and stream the live feed to the NSA, CIA and FBI?!

You fuckers are WAY too paranoid. Just buy the god damn game and have fun and quit turning everything into a travesty.

Here we go...let the bashing begin (5, Funny)

sgant (178166) | more than 9 years ago | (#10609207)

Here we go again!

(in sarcastic tones)

HOW DARE THEY! They expect us to have a net connection! What year do they think this is? 2004 or something?!?! Don't they understand that people that have the horsepower in a computer to run the Source engine as in HL2 usually do NOT have any sort of net connection! What do they think we are, NASA?!?!

Valve is nothing but a bunch of money-grubbing jerks to make us pay for a game...A GAME! They should open source it!

Here is a list of demands for Valve:

1. Stop lying to us! We trusted you...er...don't know with what, but lots of people are saying you let us down...somehow...so stop it!

2. I don't want you spying on me 24/7. I know Valve is out there, looking through my window, looking through my mailbox, now you want to invade my machine and spread all your viruses and spyware to watch everything I do so you can sell it to the Iraqis for some oil-for-games program you have going! YOU'RE EVIL!

3. I want every game and every map and every mod ever made for HL/CS/DoD etc etc to be converted to the Source engine AND be included on the HL2 CD. AND I want everything on one CD.

4. I want Source to run 150fps on my Pentium 90 with Stock VGA graphics...using DX9.0c. Anything more than that and you guys just don't know how to program.

5. I don't want any bugs, none. If one bug shows up I'll sue you!

6. I don't want any type of security on these games. I should be able to install on any number of computers. I have 150 friends that all would like to "try out" this game so I want to burn 150 CD's with a copy on it so I can let them have it for a low price of $20 (that covers the cost of the CD).

Do these things and perhaps maybe I'll play the game...but only maybe.

Re:Here we go...let the bashing begin (2, Insightful)

vegetablespork (575101) | more than 9 years ago | (#10609241)

That's amusing, but disingenuous.

No one should have to cede control over his machine and agree to a Draconian agreeement that indemnifies Valve in the event of any screwups to play a game he legitimately purchased. This is about control, not about copyright infringement. The crackers will have this one on Usenet inside of a week--the only ones inconvenienced will be those who purchased a game that has to call home to use single player mode, and a company that's going to collect and sell Bob-knows-what information about them in the process.

Re:Here we go...let the bashing begin (1)

sgant (178166) | more than 9 years ago | (#10609303)

Of course I was trying to be amusing, certainly not a troll.

But I really don't see what the big deal is. I use Steam now. I have been since day one. It has been nothing more than a way to launch the game. It doesn't take info from my computer like my bank account or keep track of what websites I go to. It's NOT SPYWARE.

Why does everyone jump over this, yet not any antivirus software that has to connect all the time to the net to get updates? What about iTunes checking for updates? Real player? Photoshop? etc etc etc. The list goes on.

Then again, I understand people are upset about this. They don't want to jump through hoops. Nothing I can say can sooth that feeling other than suggest if you truely are afraid of some info leaking out on the net, simply give them false information when registering. Give them a yahoo mail account and be done with. I have a yahoo account set up simply to register with many different things. That way, any junk goes there and is filtered out. It never sees my computer.

Yes, it's a pain, but I don't see it as one anymore because I just work through it and go on with my life.

Re:Here we go...let the bashing begin (1)

vegetablespork (575101) | more than 9 years ago | (#10609606)

Why does everyone jump over this, yet not any antivirus software that has to connect all the time to the net to get updates? What about iTunes checking for updates? Real player? Photoshop? etc etc etc. The list goes on.

In every one of the examples you cite, except anti-virus, I can turn off the ability to call home without losing any function not legitimately requiring network access (e.g. song rental from the iTunes music service). Since the virus-writing divisions of the anti-virus software companies (grin) are always creating new viruses, constant updates are naturally necessary.

Re:Here we go...let the bashing begin (1)

gl4ss (559668) | more than 9 years ago | (#10609331)

dude.. fuck you.

it's entirely understandable to bitch about it _NEEDING_ a net connection.

and you know what it leads to? using cracks.
and you know what? in 8+ years when valve has gone belly under.. YOU CAN'T INSTALL AND PLAY IT ANYMORE(without cracks)!

and they've lied to their fans over and over again(dates and even what they're up to doing, in what state it is).. but fans don't care, because they're fanboys.

Re:Here we go...let the bashing begin (1)

sgant (178166) | more than 9 years ago | (#10609397)

Thanks...but it was ment to be funny, not serious...as I even started off with a sarcastic tone.

I of course don't see them doing any of the things I listed.

But then again, no one bitches about NEEDING a connection to play like Everquest or SWG or other online games. Ok, you may say bad example because it's listed on the box before you buy that you need a connection to play. Well, it also lists on the box that you need a connection with HL.

But anyway, 8+ years from now I'll be playing something else. There isn't one game from 8 years ago that's gone belly up that I still play. Name one game from 8 years ago that the company is no longer around supporting that you still on a regular basis. Come on, give me one game. And be honest, don't go looking at Google, I mean that YOU play. And we're talking about games that there are no support for anymore from anywhere.

Re:Here we go...let the bashing begin (2, Insightful)

dougmc (70836) | more than 9 years ago | (#10609453)

But then again, no one bitches about NEEDING a connection to play like Everquest or SWG or other online games.
Actually, some people do bitch about this. Granted, most people understand the need immediately, but not everybody. Even Grandma might want to play the Sims Online, but not understand why she needs to be dialed up while doing so.

But for a single player game, it makes no sense, beyond marketing and copy protection, things we hate (newsflash: even people who paid for their game hate copy protection. It's rarely as `invisible' as it's supposed to be. Ironically, many end up getting the pirate patches, because it makes the game better.)

In any event, MMRPG vs single player game Internet requirements -- it's hardly the same thing.

Re:Here we go...let the bashing begin (2, Insightful)

gl4ss (559668) | more than 9 years ago | (#10609455)

hl2 isn't an online game.

to quote the interview "Doug Lombardi: During installation the user will be prompted to authenticate the copy and create a Steam account. After that is complete, the single-player and LAN games do not require an Internet connection."

so.. to play the _single_player game you need to authenticate during the installation.

Re:Here we go...let the bashing begin (2, Insightful)

Japong (793982) | more than 9 years ago | (#10609526)

I'm not the parent, but I can still say that I play Die By the Sword - at least 3 times a week - it's only SIX years old, but Treyarch and Interplay have long stopped caring about or supporting the game.

And the big issue here with HL2 is that it's a single player game, there's no need for anyone to have to log online, yet they're making it mandatory anyway. It's something I and many others are becoming increasingly fed up with, because they make you go through increasing circles of bullshit in order to play a game you spent hard-earned money on.

When Doom 3 came out I bought a copy the day after release, and then I was told I had to remove CloneCD, Daemon Tools and Nero in order to get the game to work with their moronic copy protection. As much as you like to say Valve and id can do whatever they want with their software, this is crossing the line between "protecting their copyright" and "taking over my computer". I can't wait until Windows Media Player will automatically uninstall and registry-ban Winamp and iTunes...

As things go, I don't want Steam. I don't want the 500-some-odd megabyte install I had to do when they decided to move TFC over, I don't want to wait for Steam to patch itself, I don't want the memory and processor overhead of having Steam running as a background process whenever I start my computer and checking for updates, I don't want to hear about Valve's latest news whenever I login to play whatever game I bought years ago, I don't want to play CS:Source.

I would have bought Half-Life 2 because I was interested in playing Half-life 2.

Now I'll just download the game a week early on Bit Torrent, crack it, and then purchase the box copy and leave it sealed on my shelf. I shouldn't have to, but at least my way everybody wins.

Re:Here we go...let the bashing begin (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#10609531)

Duh, no one's complaining about needing a net connection for multiplayer. Your everquest point is utterly foolish.

I recently loaded up Quarantine again and played through it, using the DOSBOX emulator. I often play Doom (using zdoom), and this week I've been playing starcraft and total annihilation (ok, not quite 8 years old, IIRC). Granted, it's quite possible that id and blizzard would still be allowing people to authenticate the games, and Doom is now open source so any code like that can just be ripped out. But the other two, I don't think so.
Don't forget that even if the company is still around, it isn't cost-effective to allow people to play old games, when you can turn off the server and make them buy the new one. Stuff like steam lets publishers effectively move to a game-rental model, one that will be a pain for all customers (canceling subscriptions is always a gauntlet of telephone support annoyance) and will punish people like me who enjoy dusting off an old game for a weekend.

Re:Here we go...let the bashing begin (2, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#10609667)

Maybe you should try seeing the other sides point of view.

For example, my current machine can not run HL2, and I will not be getting one that can for quite a while. I will be picking up the collector's edition when it is released because I like collecting them and want to secure a copy.

Cracks aside, what guarantee do I have that I will be able to play the single player HL2 and HL: Source game when I do have the machine to run it? What about 5 years from now when I want to play through HL2 and HL: Source again? And what about mods, from what I understand the system isn't as open as it use to and Valve has control over them. A lot of PC game companies have died over the years, and so have multiplayers severs, but at least I can still play the single player versions as well as mods with my legally bought copies.

Also while it is unlikely, what is there to stop Valve from pulling a Microsoft, and have them no longer supporting HL2 single player, HL: Source, old mods, or any of other their classics?

Don't assume that it is just pirates who are the ones complaining, I bet there are quite a few legit buyers like me that don't like this turn of events. Seriously, I purchase all my software, have never used any cracks and have no intention to do so. But given the requirement to authenticate games to just play single player I might reconsider this policy I have. I just might have to start downloading and backing up cracks, BUT only for games that require authentication in order to play single player and if I can no longer authenticate my legally purchased game.

PC games are really getting bad (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#10609250)

The copy protection, authentication, drive matching, advertising, punk buster, etc are really bogging down games. I tried to use Steam but it was repulsive to me - I don't want to have to enter information, click 10 times and wait minutes just to get into the game. But it isn't just steam. Tribes Vengeance takes more than a minute to get into. The Tom Clancy Rainbow Shield games are just ridiculous. UT2004 even takes a while.

I am very appreciative of game designers, and publishers, who keep total user experience in mind. Call of Duty will probably stay on my hard drive forever. Not necessarily because it's an all-time great game, but it doesn't require me to leave the CD in the drive and loads quickly. I can load Call of Duty, join a server, choose a team and get a frag in the time it takes to use Steam to even join a game.

Pirates may never be able to play Rainbow Six 3 Raven Shield thanks to its monolithic copy protection, but guess what, I'm never buying a Rainbow Six - or Ubisoft - shooter again thanks to that experience. And I resold my copy on the used market, thus depriving them of another potential sale. These guys are shitting where they eat, and so I hope they like the taste.

Re:PC games are really getting bad (1)

metalhed77 (250273) | more than 9 years ago | (#10609638)

I remember waiting 4 minutes for each level of wing commander III to load on my friend's PC. Things are getting better as far as wait imes go.

Re:PC games are really getting bad (1, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#10609848)

Long load times in the bad old days were due to a combination of slow CD-Roms and expensive hard drives.

If a game takes a long time to load because it has so many game objects or it's a huge map, I have no problem. Okay, maybe a little problem, but I understand. It's physical limitations which are the problem. I didn't like swapping disks in the bad Really old days, but it was necessary so it was endured.

But these days it isn't due to basic media problems, it's because the designers/publishers think the benefits of Securom, Steam and whatever else are worth the degradation of the total user experience. When you think about it, it's really a slap in the face to legitimate consumers.

Re:PC games are really getting bad (0, Offtopic)

DrSkwid (118965) | more than 9 years ago | (#10609767)


My creature in Black and White shit where we ate, was great for killing rival villagers!

Godspeed, Valve! (5, Funny)

gothfox (659941) | more than 9 years ago | (#10609292)

After all, product activation did a miracle for Microsoft. Stopped those evil software pirates completely, yessir.

There goes that game off my list (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#10609341)

I guess they won't be getting my 49.99. Just like everytime Best Buy runs a sale and never has any of the items that are on sale available, I save whatever the price is. I bought all the Half Life titles (Opposing Force,Blue Shift), but if they require a Steam account I won't be buying HL2. At least not until a crack for it comes out!

OK, so... (2, Insightful)

Snowspinner (627098) | more than 9 years ago | (#10609345)

What is an acceptable way for companies to deal with piracy then? I mean, come on. We really damage our credibility if we bitch at every attempt to curb piracy. But we complain about Microsoft barring modded XBoxes from their servers, about copy protection like this, we complain when companies sue file sharers...

Are people really arguing that there should be no way to prevent piracy? Because based on the aggregate outrage of the /. populace, that's increasingly what we're looking like. And down that road lies us no longer being considered worth pandering to.

Personally, I think that good old-fashioned copy protection is by far the best method of preventing piracy. Nobody gets sued. Nobody gets hurt.

Re:OK, so... (5, Insightful)

dougmc (70836) | more than 9 years ago | (#10609554)

What is an acceptable way for companies to deal with piracy then?
You need a list? Ok then ...

Acceptable forms of copy protection :

Ignore it. That's certainly acceptable, and works well for many game developers and publishers.

Add extras in the box that add value. Cloth maps, figurines, trading cards, etc.

Make a complex game that requires lots of documentation, and include it in a printed book.

Make an awesome multi-user component that requires logging into a server with a unique CD key to play online. It must be something that needs to use the Internet already, however (like a multi-user component would.)

Include the phrase: Please don't copy this game illegally.

Barely acceptable methods include :

Require use of that CD key to download patches and updates.

Having a unique CD key for each copy of the game.

Include copy protection methods that make it hard to copy, or make copies not work -- Safedisk, bad sectors, etc. These aren't very effective, but as long as they don't cause problems for legitimate users, they're acceptible -- barely.

Require that the CD be in the drive while playing the game. We don't like this, but we generally tolerate it if there's no other problems.

Hidden registry keys to keep track of previous installations and such.

Utterly unaccecptable forms of copy protection for a game :

Contacting the Internet (or requiring that you call up a phone number to get a code) for a single player game

Dongles (and other hardware keys.)

`Please enter the third word of page 25 now.' (or other sorts of code wheels, books, etc.)

Writing to the boot sector or other `off limits' part of the disk. (Turbo Tax did this recently.)

Installing Spyware that reports back to the publisher.

Programs that look for `cheating' or `cracking' programs on your disk and either refuse to run the game if found, or (worse) remove/break the offending programs. (EQ has done this, as and several programs refuse to work if programs like Daemon Tools or even Nero are even installed.)

Protections that damage the system if they feel they're being messed with (recent example: program that deleted your home directory if it detected a `pirated' CD key.)

Special device drivers that must be installed just to run the game -- like a special CD rom driver.

Unmovable files (if you put a file down, we should be able to defrag it!)

I'm sure I've missed a few in each category, but this should get you started. Game developers, you listening?

Re:OK, so... (1)

Temporal (96070) | more than 9 years ago | (#10609933)

Personally, I consider requiring the CD in the drive unacceptable. I own lots of games, and the first thing I do with any new game I buy is make a CD image of it. It is far easier to mount an image with Daemon Tools than to rummage around for the CD.

Re:OK, so... (4, Insightful)

fwitness (195565) | more than 9 years ago | (#10609595)

Umm, no. Product activation is something that has been tried a bunch of times, to no avail. While piracy is a problem, it doesn't mean it's an insurmountable one. For one thing, people *lose* money through piracy, and that sucks. That doesn't mean they make *no money* or even a drastically reduced amount. I think we all know the windows piracy problem helped establish it's market dominance.

Also on the "no longer being considered worth pandering to" note, I don't think I've ever seen any demographic ever cease to be marketed to due to piracy. Cable TV, lot's of pirates, still makes money. Dish TV, same. Windows, same. Any popular pc Game, same.

People keep thinking of piracy as something that can be eliminated, like polio. It's not some disease that threatens humanity. It's an aspect of human nature that has been around for quite some time (like, uh, pirates? You know, the swashbuckling kind?). There is a reason banks and large commercial retailers have insurance. Nobody has ever said "lets start a campain to stop bank robbery!" People are going to still rob banks, despite having 50 cameras and untold security. Some will succeed. If your business model relies on not having anyone *ever* steal from you, I suspect you have bigger problems. Does anyone have theft insurance? Why is that? Theft has been around a long time, why haven't we started 'The War On Theft'?

Now, making me give you my personal info to buy your product, that's fine, but don't expect me to do so. There are plenty of other games out there. Keep in mind this is the *single* player version that also requires activation. Would you buy console games this way? Oh yeah, that next Zelda is so cool, I'll just tell the Nintendo people my personal details, because I *know* they won't share them with anyone.

Please.

If you feel it's fine, you go right ahead, but in my mind at least, this is not a bright idea.

Shocking! (1)

samael (12612) | more than 9 years ago | (#10609348)

Requiring you to register online.

Anyone would think they didn't trust you to pay for it.

Need more DETAILS... (3, Informative)

meanfriend (704312) | more than 9 years ago | (#10609360)

About how this authentication is going to affect future installations. Will Steam keep track of some unique product id (like a CDKey) and tie it to a specific install?

ie. You install HL2 and the next day some hardware/OS failure requires you to reformat/reinstall. Will you be able to re-authenticate on the same CDKey? What about if you delete an old install and want to re-install on a new PC?

What if you trade in your HL2 at EB for some reason (runs too slow, too buggy, you plain dont like it), will the next person who buys it even be able to authenticate and play it? This could effectively destroy the pre-owned market (at least for this game). Which would be total BS; if I want to sell my game, I should be able to. Is that not my right as a consumer?

Go look at the Steam website faq. They specifically state that CDkeys cannot be transferred between Steam accounts. Without a doubt, Valve (and probably every publisher out there) would love nothing better than to ensure that everyone who plays their game has to always buy a full priced new copy. There is just too much potential for abuse here...

Maybe I'm way off base, and I'd love nothing better than Valve to prove me wrong. I was on the fence about buying HL2, now I'd say my mind is made up...

Re:Need more DETAILS... (1)

sgant (178166) | more than 9 years ago | (#10609418)

no, it isn't tied to your hardware. In fact, you can install it on 100 machines if you have 100 machines...yet you can only play it on one at a time.

I've reformated my HD and even upgraded quite a bit of hardware...Steam loads right in and I install up my games. Hell, I don't even know where my original HL CD is anymore...lost in so many moves...yet my account is right there and I loaded it up and off I was playing again.

But again, no. It's NOT TIED to your hardware.

Re:Need more DETAILS... (2, Interesting)

gl4ss (559668) | more than 9 years ago | (#10609438)

***What if you trade in your HL2 at EB for some reason (runs too slow, too buggy, you plain dont like it), will the next person who buys it even be able to authenticate and play it? This could effectively destroy the pre-owned market (at least for this game). Which would be total BS; if I want to sell my game, I should be able to. Is that not my right as a consumer?***

well, that's where you're onto them.

(besides.. the hl1-key state is horrid.. you can't really buy hl1 in shrink wraps and be sure that it has a key that you could use online)

you're _NOT_ offbase as it is essentially true already with cs:cz.

What about people without 'net connections? (2, Insightful)

david.given (6740) | more than 9 years ago | (#10609365)

Because there still are some, here and there. 'Net access isn't as ubiquitous as you think it is.

Re:What about people without 'net connections? (1)

sgant (178166) | more than 9 years ago | (#10609458)

What about people without 3D cards? What about people without CD-ROMs? What about people without computers at all? What about people with Macs? What about people running Amiga's?

I could go on...but I'm not.

Re:What about people without 'net connections? (1)

gl4ss (559668) | more than 9 years ago | (#10609617)

**What about people without 3D cards? What about people without CD-ROMs? What about people without computers at all?**

Idiot. you _need_ those things to play the game.

net connection is just an artificial requirement to the single player game(to make tie the purchase you made to just you... more theoretical profits as you can't loan it to your friend after you played it through. would you buy a dvd you wouldn't be able to loan to your friends?).

Re:What about people without 'net connections? (0, Flamebait)

sgant (178166) | more than 9 years ago | (#10609946)

net connection is just an artificial requirement to the single player game(to make tie the purchase you made to just you... more theoretical profits as you can't loan it to your friend after you played it through. would you buy a dvd you wouldn't be able to loan to your friends?)

What is so goddamn wrong with making a profit? Who elected YOU to tell Valve "hey, you're making enough money"? No, your friends will have to buy it too. Why the FUCK is that so wrong? Why is a company so evil because it wants to try...at least try to get compensated for the games out there. They KNOW there will be little fuck-wads running around cracking the game and giggling like Beavis and Butthead because they think their so goddamn clever.

Yes, Valve will make a shitload of cash from this game. But again, who are you to say they've made enough and decide that you can just give it to whoever you want? Huh?

Don't buy the game. Don't like what their doing, don't buy it. Plain and simple. But no, I'm sure you'll go and get a cracked copy of it because you think you're "stickin it to the man". You'll justify it somehow in your brain that you're doing the right thing because Valve wanted a fucking little program on your computer. HOW DARE THEY!

wow....just.....wow.

So again, you need a net connection to play this game. Don't have one, fucking don't buy it. My analogy still stands.

Re:What about people without 'net connections? (0)

billybob (18401) | more than 9 years ago | (#10609819)

If you dont have a net connection, I'd say there's a 99.999999% chance that your computer is probably an old outdated piece of crap that couldnt handle HL2. I mean seriously.. you think there's anyone out there with a 9800 Pro or X800, but yet doesnt have any access to the internet? Please. :P

Re:What about people without 'net connections? (1)

thirty2bit (685528) | more than 9 years ago | (#10610007)

To those who didn't understand your message, an example: not everybody gives internet access to their kids. So how do you activate HL2 on your kid's computer when said does not have internet access?

Re:What about people without 'net connections? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#10610078)

To those who didn't understand your message, an example: not everybody gives internet access to their kids. So how do you activate HL2 on your kid's computer when said does not have internet access?

Explain what principle might be used which would restrict kids from unsupervised internet access but would allow for unsupervised playing of bloodbath FPSes like HL2 or its mods? Especially multiplayer-centric FPSes? Are children too young to use the net unsupervised and who are forbidden from playing online really going to be a key demographic for HL2 sales? You decide.

The reason Valve are ignoring the extremist, emergency-lifeboat-situation hypotheticals like what you've floated is because they are useless in the real world, where practically all of HL2's potential customers will have no problem with it - other than slight annoyance, perhaps.

Re:What about people without 'net connections? (1)

david.given (6740) | more than 9 years ago | (#10610140)

Explain what principle might be used which would restrict kids from unsupervised internet access but would allow for unsupervised playing of bloodbath FPSes like HL2 or its mods?

Because single-player FPS games are about as violent as a Bugs Bunny cartoon. It's completely fake. The images on the screen have no relation to reality at all. Children are really good at distinguishing fantasy from reality; don't let anybody tell you otherwise, and they know that this isn't real.

But once you've connected the computer to the 'net, you suddenly have access to real human beings. This adds a whole new level to things. Those figures on the screen stop being cardboard shadows and start becoming avatars of real people that you establish relationships with, talk to, and learn from. They affect your behaviour. The game becomes real.

If I were a parent --- which I'm not --- that's what I'd be concerned with, not what colour the pixellated polygons on the screen that look a little like blood if you squint hard.

Whats the surprise? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#10609374)

Valve has said all along from the very start that Steam would be their tool for playing and running HL2. When Valve switched everyone over to Steam a year or so ago, you had to put in your old Half-Life cd-key when you created your Steam account to download the games. It's been running mostly smooth for a year now, so I fail to see how this is anything new/surprising/cause for concern.

Wait, this is NEWS? (2)

Jeff Reed (209535) | more than 9 years ago | (#10609380)

My understanding is that you were going to need Steam for offline play of HL2 since it was announced. This is about as news-worthy as the sun rising in the morning or Bill Gates having an assload of money.

While I can fully understand not liking the idea of Steam (hell, I still think it's a buggy piece of garbage, and it's gotten much better than the old versions), it's not that big a deal. Once you register your CD-Key with Valve through Steam, you can play the game, get updates quickly, and run the game on any machine with Steam installed (after it downloads the necessary data, of course). You can even run it in offline mode and not "report in to the mothership," if you're so afraid of that. I'm not seeing the downside, unless you're really paranoid about some company seeing your private data and think that "offline mode" doesn't mean "offline."

But then, if you're that crazed, maybe you shouldn't be on the internet at all.

Re:Wait, this is NEWS? (4, Informative)

gl4ss (559668) | more than 9 years ago | (#10609546)

* My understanding is that you were going to need Steam for offline play of HL2 since it was announced.*

that is not true. they said you would need steam for updates and online play, but if you wanted to just play the single player game out of the box then you wouldn't need a net connection(this would be the sensible thing, as some don't have net even).

among other things this makes it basically impossible for there to be a 2nd hand market for these as well(_this_ is what they're after.. making it impossible for even legally to buy it cheaper than store from someone who already played through it).

Re:Wait, this is NEWS? (1)

Lisandro (799651) | more than 9 years ago | (#10609562)

that is not true. they said you would need steam for updates and online play, but if you wanted to just play the single player game out of the box then you wouldn't need a net connection(this would be the sensible thing, as some don't have net even).

Which is logical, i might add: if you're not interested in online play, it probable your system won't even have an internet connection - my first thought were laptops. Asking for online activation on what's mainly a single player game is retarded.

Yay! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#10609385)

All the advantages of retail (having to wait until the game ships, paying the "middleman" instead of directly to valve), and all the advantages of steam (being online to play solo, paying for steam, drm, etc).

Come on, Halflife wasn't such a great game in the first place.

Simple workaround (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#10609435)

-Buy game
-copy cdkey
-bring back game to store "I dont have internet at home"
-play game

Limiting number of customers? (1)

gothzilla (676407) | more than 9 years ago | (#10609511)

http://www.techdot.com/doc/00223.html [techdot.com]
75% of americans are connected to the internet. Is Valve really making it so that 25% of the population cannot play HL2? There's got to be more to the story. I wonder if they'll have a way for people to telephone in activation somehow.

Re:Limiting number of customers? (1)

ssand (702570) | more than 9 years ago | (#10609549)

That's 75% of Americans, and does not nessesarily mean 75% of gamers don't have the internet.

You want to look at the gamer % (1)

Numeric (22250) | more than 9 years ago | (#10609570)

HL2 is a world wide game so you're numbers you are viewing are incorrect.

the question is:
Of the percentage of gamers, how many have internet access?

Hay... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#10609521)

This is big news, why isn't it on the main page? I would think that the other slashdotters who don't read the games section would be interested in hearing about how single player games are now going the product activation route.

so they can dupe it on the main page later today (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#10609553)

I love the editors :)

This defeats the purpose of the box.... (2, Insightful)

rsilvergun (571051) | more than 9 years ago | (#10609594)

The whole point of getting a box is you can install the CDs even if Valve goes under and stops running activation servers. Welp, no more. It's pretty annoying actually. I think I can expect Microsoft to be running Activation servers 10 years from now (if only out of fear of a 250 million+ class action lawsuit), but a game company? It's like divx all over again....

Some of you guys just don't get it! (3, Interesting)

Fallen Andy (795676) | more than 9 years ago | (#10609677)

Oh no not again (crashing bowl of petunias time).
I'm going to ROTFL because the innocent notion of
requiring "Product Activation" has not so innocent
consequences.

Here goes:
Once upon a time there was a Greek company (yes, I'm the dumb programmer who had to do it) who thought that having a product *locked* to a machine was a good idea. They thought about Dongles (yuck) and other stuff, and eventually came up with a relatively innocous scheme.

So, they *required* product activation. Here's the bad news. Customers machines *break* and hence they trouble your support lines in lemming like droves. So, the more product you sell - the *LESS*
money you make because you have to hire more zombies for the support dept. (So, in our case a
$20 product ended up losing us $21... - or something like that).

AAARRGGHH!

One activation code - yes, and then forever more you allow *reactivation* on other machines. OK, that doesn't kill piracy, but you have to take the
rough with the smooth here...

(and remember you don't know how much information
is going back over the wire about your machine + environment. Get seriously FUDDED). Hell, just buy
from another company. (Like the Coca Cola classic
fiasco, if they want to sell it they'll have to listen).

You still have a choice (0)

Datasage (214357) | more than 9 years ago | (#10609682)

The orginal half-life has to be one of the most pirated games ever. We used to play alot of CS and HL at the lan parties i went to. Some people bought the game, while many other pirated it. Without steam we could play lan games with each other just fine.

The people who orginally bought the game now use steam to play. Everyone else complains that steam sucks because they dont want to buy a copy of the game.

Al they are doing is making it harder for those who cant understand the idea that you have to buy the game to play it. If your are in one of those situations where you cant connect to the internet to activate the game, then dont buy the game. A majority of gamers have some form of access to the internet.

Re:You still have a choice (1)

Shaiken (743878) | more than 9 years ago | (#10609809)

The people who bought the game when it came out can't even use steam. I HAVE bought the game. I HAVE the CD key. Unfortunately steam expects a totally different key (letters and numbers, and more of them) than I have.

Re:You still have a choice (1, Interesting)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#10610003)

Really? After installing Steam, I was able to go find all the old CD-keys I had and activate them with Steam, download the games and play them with absolutely no problem. The best part is that for HL1, I didn't even have the game anymore - only the cd-key. So thanks to Steam, I no longer had to go without it just becuase I lost the disc. W00t!

Re:You still have a choice, steam is evil! (1)

majid_aldo (812530) | more than 9 years ago | (#10610010)

Re:You still have a choice (1)

arose (644256) | more than 9 years ago | (#10610009)

AFAIK they still made obscene amounts of cash.

Re:You still have a choice (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#10610098)

Al they are doing is making it harder for those who cant understand the idea that you have to buy the game to play it.

CS built an enormous community on those illegitimate numbers. Locking out the so-called thieves will probably just drive them to a different game... where their numbers will create another enormous community which can be profited from.

What's better, to have 30,000 pirates and 70,000 legit customers playing your game, or to have no pirates and 50,000 legit customers?

Some people are not thinking straight. (2, Insightful)

ryulinho (822999) | more than 9 years ago | (#10609758)

I am already entitled to a copy of Half-Life 2. I have purchased an ATI video card what seems to me now like ages ago. Had I not, I would have thought about buying Half-Life 2. I know many who might have been interested in purchasing it as well. After this, no one I know or I would ever consider buying the product, would it be only out of spite. This new security measure is ludicrous.

I anticipate more than usual will now be downloading it from an alternative source (no pun intended) more simply than Steam users will. This will be done without silly activations being required and possibly days before November 16th.

Congrats to Valve, they managed to alienate another chunk of the gaming community with this decision.

Other areas affected by this? (2, Insightful)

DumbWhiteGuy777 (654327) | more than 9 years ago | (#10609801)

First of all, I want to say this is totally uncalled for. I dunno why they can't just go Blizzard's route and make only one CD-key run at once online. You can't really get an online key for Starcraft without buying it, and it's been out for years.

Also, I want to know how this will affect reselling of the game. Let's say in a few months I'm tired of HL2 and decide to sell it to a friend or something. Will he be unable to make a steam ID? Will he have to use mine? Because that would suck a bit.

It just seems they put way too much into this stuff when there are such easy answers already out.

CD-key is tied to account, (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#10609833)

So what if someone steals my steam account? I can't even install my own game anymore?

UT2K4 (1)

DeadBugs (546475) | more than 9 years ago | (#10610123)

Unreal Tournament 2004 came out with a patch so that you do not need to even have the CD in the drive to run the game.

So instead of limiting the use of thier product, they listen to their customers and make the product better. (not too mention their support of mods is the best in the industry).
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