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iMac Factory Burns

CmdrTaco posted more than 15 years ago | from the doncha-hate-that dept.

Apple 115

BobRainGod wrote in to tell us that a fire has apparently wasted Apple's Mexican production plant, and stunted iMac production. No this doesn't have anything to do with the APSL.

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doH not burn (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#1948942)

Where did you hear about this ? and when has apple moved into Mexico ? hehe i dont think it happened.

Freaks Macintosh Archives
http://freaky.staticusers.net/

baked apple with cinamon.. hmm... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#1948943)

There is redundancy in their production... just not enough. As for the European iMacs, they are manufactured in the exact same plants as the American ones, so I'd assume the differences are next to nil.

Wintel Resorts to Sabotage! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#1948944)

Do you doubt it?

How interesting (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#1948945)

How interesting it is to see people rejoicing at someone's business burning. One comment even came from a firefighter saying he'd approve of it somehow. Sad! Really sad firefighting propaganda. The next time you receive a phone call from firefighters for fund raising ... anyway.

I don't care much if Bill Gates has created a striving business or Apple leads in new technologies, or that UNIX is "that good." What I see are some people whose sole reason to live is to be nasty to others.

Now, I will put my finger into your eye and I hope it will hurt you a little bit, because you see, our goal, yes, our goal, if we are true Linux fan, is to make this world a better place. So let's stop being arrogant and let's lend a hand no matter who.

billg's a firestarter... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#1948946)

Bill's also fear addicted, a danger illustrated.

Well, if that isn't.... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#1948947)

...a sign from god, I don't know what is.

On the otherhand maybe Billy boy just hired some cheap mexican organized crime labor to do the right thing.

I wonder how many of those iMacs were actually sold in Mexico?

...burn down the mission if we're gona' say alive...

Bullshit happens. (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#1948948)

| If you worked for cents an hour, would you be happy about it?

irrelevant. ever hear of `cost of living?' mexicans can support families on `cents an hour.' just because it costs you $1000/mo to rent an apartment and $5 for a cardboard meal at mcdeez doesn't mean it costs everyone the same.

Pretty colors (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#1948949)

Yes....I bet the locals are getting quite a fireworks show.

You know...those mac lovers were right....imacs do run "hotter" then pc's....

"I love the smell of IMACS burning in the morning...:

Sucks for Apple (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#1948950)

"Mucho mucho" - would that be a technical term? And who's benchmarks are you going to believe, Apple's? Any independent source will show you that the G3 is at most 10-15% faster than a Pentium II at the same clock speed. While the iMac is stuck at a paltry 233 mHz, similarly priced K6-2 systems are running at 400 mHz or faster. Come this summer, the K7 is going to destroy anything that Intel or Motorola can produce.

"need a new hard drive, you got the usb port" Hmm...USB is 10 mbits/sec, which is 1.25 MB/sec...wow, that's cruising.

"The imac is a 900.00 computer that a. has built in monitor, a G3 CPU, 32 Megs of Ram, USB Bus, 10/100 Base T network card, 56k Modem, and a 2-6 gig hard drive.. "
Add to that some crappy two-year old ATI video chipset with only 4 MB of RAM...while many budget Compaq-class computers are shodily assembled, some carry Riva TNT class video cards that are as much as 2-3 times faster than the ATI Rage chip that the iMac uses.

Plant didn't burn - Yeah right! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#1948951)

That article is aimed at apple stock holders..
what do you think they are going to say? - "Hey
our plant just burned to the ground, we're laying
off employees and we basicly suck - please keep
your investments with us" of course not.. they
are going to make it as low-key as possible..

I would tend to put more faith in the previous
article.. besides.. if it wasn't so bad.. why
is production ceasing for a month (that fact is
common among both stories)they are obviously
fudging the facts.

lucky for OSS (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#1948952)

lucky for OSS there is no single building to burn down that could stop production. too bad for Bill G.!

Oh come now (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#1948953)

because they are easier to beat?

USB for hard drive? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#1948954)

I thought the iMac has firewire too, or am I hallucinating???

Sucks for Apple - no floppy? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#1948955)


Really? You still put floppy drives into home brew clones? Why? Last few PII boxes I built I didn't waste time/money/extra cable hassle with a stoopid floppy drive. If you use a decent mobo and CDROM drive, any OS I would want to run can boot and install from CDROM - including NT. And besides, according to the FreeBSD book - UNIX doesn't like floppies ;)

About that iMac thing - yeah, it's a fine piece of hardware - I think its cool that its translucent and you can get it in different colors but there are other aspects of its physical appearance that I don't like. But that's just IMO - some people think its great. Here's to hoping the next generation of Apple "pro" machines will be available in multiple colors ;)

OH MY GOD, SCORE = 1 (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#1948956)

I CAN DIE HAPPY NOW
i think ill go jack off just thinking about it

Sucks for Apple (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#1948957)

I don't have much to say but just......CISC processors won't live very long in the future.

And when talking about RISC in may be the coming decade, I just DO NOT believe in Intel.

AMD? we'll see......

doH not burn (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#1948958)

Uhm, just because Apple is based in the US doesn't mean they produce all of their computers here, dumbass.

"hehe!"

stupid twat.

How disuade potential Linux users (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#1948959)

Amen. I've never seen such a crowd of testosterone filled pants-pissers. You expect Fortune 500 companies to adopt an OS for their mission-critical operations when they read this and think it's a representaional cross-section of the Linux support community? Go back to your usual routine and get a bottle of Surge from the fridge and wank off to bigjugs.com instead of doing your math homework.

huh? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#1948960)

Profit losing? I think you're about a year and a quarter behind the times, bucko. 5 straight quarters of profits. And herein lies the problem. People talking about things they've been brainwashed to believe. If it weren't for posts which are so blatantly wrong, then I think there'd be a pretty good case against mac/linux/windows zealotry, but since all camps seem to have their cheerleaders, I suppose it's all a wash anyways.

crappy mouse (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#1948961)

Everyone I know has had a lousy "out of box" experience with the iMac for one reason: the mouse sucks!

It's round. It twists around. It's connected to the keyboard. The cable is always getting tangled.

I dunno, if I were a multibillion dollar company, I think I could do a much better job of designing a mouse.

I agree! - usenet (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#1948962)

It's still better than the usenet, but dropping.

What happened was the site was mainly populated by true-blood geeks for a long time. The anonymous coward facility was mainly used for people who were speaking out against their employers, and didn't want to lose their job.

Then, more people latched onto linux, and articles in the (relatively) mainstream press tended to include a list of linux links, one of which was often slashdot.
There was a sudden influx of non- [linux|*BSD|amiga] users, often loud, opinionated, but simultaneously clueless about the subject matter. There are people whose idea of a good time is to "troll" - post argumentative comments, and watch a little flame war develop.

Many of these comments come from non-linux (or whatever) users, even some which are written as if from a linux ( or whatever) users standpoint. Recently, there have been scare stories of microsoft flunkies being payed to deliberately post subtly pro-microsoft junk, and to spark unrest within the Free Software (capital F for Free as in Free Speech, not Free Beer) community.

Do not take the vociferous but clueless fools who hang around these parts seriously. There is a vast, but relatively silent, majority of people who are reasonable. The moderation scheme is designed to allow you to skip over the fools- set your threshold to 1 to lose the anonymous coward postings and flame bait.

You can tell the AOL and Windows ( and some clueless linux and BSD) (l)users by the way they complain about being "censored" - their inane comments are merely being relegated to where they belong - threshold less than 0

To those who think they have a right to say whatever they want on slashdot- YOU DON'T - it's a privately-owned web site run by CmdrTaco - he an his selected agents have every right to control it utterly. If they were to censor, instead of moderate, they'd still be within their rights. It's their web site, their choice. If you don't like that, then go away / play in the traffic / troll the USEnet / troll the AOL chatrooms




don't repeat excessive redundancy twice (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#1948963)

He forgets his PIN number so often that he decided to burn it onto
a CD Disk, using his IBM Machine that runs on DC current and has
lots of LED diodes. He runs the OS/2 operating system which has a
GUI interface that runs on top of the SOM object model. The nice
thing about OS/2 Warp is that it uses less RAM memory than OS/2 v2
did.

crappy mouse (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#1948964)

Why was this moderated?


Yep, no-one likes the mouse, "out-of-the-box". But most people I have spoken to that have bothered to use it for a week or two. Actually like it better.
The trick is that you no longer hold it with your finger tips; it's more like you rest your hand on it. It is more comfortable and puts your wrist at a better angle.

You would have a hard time using a mouse this way if there was more than one button, but luckily, there is only one needed.

I agree and disagree, but I'm not disagreeable (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#1948965)

I don't think that your assessments of usenet and /. are entirely correct.

While there are plenty of flames and trolls on both, there's still a lot of useful posts, clearly and politely written by genuinely nice people.

Even in the absence of an active moderation system, people will tend to filter things out mentally. Regulars with useful information will become evident rather quickly, as well as the regular trolls. (I've found that most trolls are either not so malicious or are sufficiently random as to not troll a board for very long, thus minimizing their impact)

Even the local bunch of sour pusses, heck, even once in a blue troll, they'll post something very interesting that would never have popped up if you were in a homogeneous bunch of people. (furries, linux users, etc.) I'd much rather see both linux and non linux (as well as Un*x/*BSD/Amiga) users here than a more exclusive group.

That's why I set my preference for 0-level posts here and don't filter usenet. I really do believe that there may still be one or two ACs out there who are whistle blowers, or just mistyped their account password. I suppose that if I needed to, I'd post anonymously, but that just hasn't come up. I don't think it's smart to demean people for who they post _as_, however, but what their post content is.

Heck, one of my other posts in this very thread is at -1. Try to guess which one. I think you'll be pleasantly surprised. ;)

I agree that /. is not a free and open forum for debate, like unmoderated chat and usenet groups. That it has a better signal:noise ratio may not be sufficient justification for this though, IMHO.

On the whole (just watch me get dropped to -1 or something for this) I'd rather use my own brain to decide what's worthwhile to read than let other people do my thinking for me. Lord knows, if I was called upon to moderate (is this the /. equivalent of public service? ;) I would not serve.

BTW, how come _you're_ posting as an AC, if you have such a low opinion of them? Didn't you want this to be read by the very person you're offering advice? I read it though.

Sucks for Apple (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#1948966)

Drizzit said:

"Plus this is running 8.5 which is still 45% 68K code.Wait til fully PPC native OS X."

I've been hearing that excuse since I got my first PowerMac in 1994. Five years is not enough?

Anyway, the vast majority of that 68k doesn't run very often. Even with the original release of the PPC version of MacOS back in 1994 Apple said that 90% of the time the CPU was executing OS code, the code it was executing was native. And a lot more of MacOS has gone native since then.

OS X will be feel faster because it should have decent multitasking and a lot of the old cruft cleaned out of it, but I doubt native code will be much of a contributor.

Pretty colors (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#1948967)

Then why are you posting?

check the date (1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#1948972)

Apple Insider -- Your source for reliable April fool's news.

glad nobody was hurt. (1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#1948973)

this stuff can happen in the modern USA too. search for 'chicken plant' and 'fire' w/in the past
few years, some people died (smoke inhalation,burned) in that one.

the point is not to destroy government, or destroy corporations..
its to make sure that the people who work for these entities
have control over their own lives. 'big brother' is in any form of one person controlling another,
and abuse of power is inherent in human nature.
for instance, companies like apple do not care if factories burn down. they can just switch production to another factory and build
another dump in mexico in the meantime. they will still get a profit for the quarter/year, and that's their job.
they dont care about pollution, wages, rights, etc. nor are they supposed to. they have no responsibility to. so basically, its apples fault that the factory burned down, but its not a big deal to them.

Misinformation (1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 15 years ago | (#1948974)

I work at Apple, and the fact is that the fire wasn't that bad. The water damage (from sprinkler systems and such) shorted out some of the machinery, however. This DOES NOT mean that iMac production has stopped, however. An Apple factory in Sacremento is now producing some iMacs (previously it only made PowerMac G3s), and LG Electronics, which ownds the factory in Mexico, is moving its production elsewhere. The fire is expected to have a minimal effect on availability.

With that all said, I am discusted by some of the reactions to this article! Fires are no joke, thank god no one was hurt. I know only a vocal minority is being so bad, but it's also no way to interest people in open source. And while I'm on that topic, let me assure you all that Apple is really interested in refining the APSL to make people more comfortable with it. But that's for a different thread...

Why this wont be much of a setback... (2)

MacJedi (173) | more than 15 years ago | (#1948975)

If the rumors are to be believed, the current iMac is to be discontinued soon with a new model (code named "8-ball") to replace it.

  • This link [nobeige.com] speculates that the current iMacs are being held in tight supply because of 8-ball.
  • This link [nobeige.com] is about the possible feature set of the new iMac (17 inch monitor!!)

heh (1)

drwiii (434) | more than 15 years ago | (#1948976)

Reminds me of the SNL skit where Bill Gates blew up "Apple Computer's new Korean manufacturing plant" live on Microsoft TV.

Sucks for Apple (1)

John Campbell (559) | more than 15 years ago | (#1948977)

I built a machine just about that good for my sister for around $500, including a larger (and seperately upgradable) monitor. The CPU's not quite up to spec, but another $50 would've fixed that.

And it has a floppy drive.

Sucks for Apple - no floppy? (1)

John Campbell (559) | more than 15 years ago | (#1948978)

The box was for my sister... she's only marginally networked, so she still needs floppy disks for things like taking files in to class and transferring things between her computer and her friends'. I don't use floppies much anymore, myself... with a LAN in the house and a 24x7 dialup, I don't need 'em. I don't even use my CD drives for much more than playing music/MP3 CDs... all my software comes off the 'net. Her needs are different, though.

That's where I think Apple missed its target with the iMac, actually... people like me don't need floppies and can put that integrated ethernet to good use, but we won't be happy with the lack of RAM, the underpowered CPU (yes, I know the G3's a good chip... the iMac's is the runt of the litter, though), or the lack of expandability. People like my sister don't need a screaming CPU or a lot of RAM, but they need that floppy drive, and don't have a use for the ethernet card (but have to pay for it anyway) - and the monitor is too small any way you figure it.

The one place I can think of that they're really suited for is schools, which tend to be short on competent computer help and for whom LANs are practical, and which have always been one of Apple's strongholds (though, unfortunately for Apple, brainwashing 'em early hasn't worked on most kids ;) ). Even there, they're running into problems because of that lack of floppy drive (according to my mother the school librarian)... the kids can't take files home with them.

8ball=best computer ever!!! (1)

gavinhall (33) | more than 15 years ago | (#1948979)

Posted by Stanks:

Oh my god,

A 17 inch monitor, AND a DVD Player?

When will the PC world Catch up to those trailblazers at Apple? Next thing you know, they'll put floppys on the things!

*Sarcasm included*

Apple in trouble? (1)

pingouin (783) | more than 15 years ago | (#1948980)

This means Apple might not do the heavy laying-off it had planned to do at its Cork facility.

Layoffs? Plant closings? Have iMac sales tanked or something? Or would this have to do with the (I presume) enticing cheap wages they pay at the LG Electronics plant in Mexicali? And what was the cause of that fire, anyway? Substandard wiring? Shoddily-constructed factory?

Inquiring minds want to know :)

--

Bullshit happens. (1)

pingouin (783) | more than 15 years ago | (#1948981)

Yeah, who wants low wages when you can have even lower ones, or none at all. Damn Apple for employing cheap labor!

It's not like they're the only ones doing it.

And damn that Mexican gov't for not forcing the people to protect themselves!

It's more like corporations doing the forcing. The Mexican government wants low wages and weak unions and minimal regulation, so they can keep the likes of GM and LG happy. How would you like it if corporations were able to dictate policy in your country?

Seriously, don't be so protectionist and paternalistic.

Protectionist? It's not like I live in Cork -- or Ireland, for that matter. Paternalistic? Since when is it paternalistic to give a damn about people? Where I come from that's called compassion. If you worked for cents an hour, would you be happy about it? Would you piss on "paternalistic" do-gooders?

Call all the little names you want, but what we have here is rent-a-slave, and we've both got a piece of that timeshare. We benefit from it, but when it comes time to acknowledge it, we drag out the old FUD. If the workers in Mexico have such a good thing going, why do so many of them end up in the US?

--

Bullshit happens. (1)

pingouin (783) | more than 15 years ago | (#1948982)

irrelevant. ever hear of `cost of living?' mexicans can support families on `cents an hour.' just because it costs you $1000/mo to rent an apartment and $5 for a cardboard meal at mcdeez doesn't mean it costs everyone the same.

That's bullshit, too. You go see what kind of housing you can get on what they make. Then try to live in it. You go see what culinary delights are on offer with the money you have left for food. Then tell me how great it is. Cost of living arguments are bullshit -- do those workers in Mexicali do the same work as the iMac workers in Ireland and California? Shouldn't they be able to enjoy the same material benefits that those Irish and Californian workers do?

Stop trying to rationalize slavery. Just because slaves in the US got room and board, it doesn't mean they were all that pleased with it. I seriously doubt your "cost of living" arguments were used in the 18th and 19th century.

--

Not good enough. (1)

pingouin (783) | more than 15 years ago | (#1948983)

I agree that Apple is an accomplice in the slavery initiated by the Mexican government (something I almost pointed out in my last posting).

It's not just Apple, it's other corporations. It's also the US government, which doesn't raise a fuss. It's also you and me, since the US government is comprised of our elected representatives, and because we tend to see places like Mexico as "investment opportunities" rather than as nations with people, people with the same dreams and desires as you or me. Our hands are dirty too, with every purchase and with every vote and with every letter we fail to send to our elected officials and every piece of legislation that serves to enhance or reinforce this state of affairs. It's also the media, since they tend to report consumer news, business news, or financial news, but no real economic news of substance other than what relates to consumer/business/financial matters; that ignores some weighty issues -- though it ensures that advertisers like Nike, Apple, and GM will keep those ad dollars coming. It's a shame that more mainstream-media coverage of Nike's labor practices has come from sportswriters than from "serious" mainstream journalists.

My original posting was meant to oppose the idea that people should be paid more than market value merely because they have less than others. Clearly, there are other issues, and the fact that Apple (and any other company) takes part in employing people who are partly enslaved is a serious problem.

It's more than a problem. It's literally a sin, from the standpoint of my religious tradition, and sin (especially on a mass scale like this) has its consequences. (I don't mean to go into bible-thumping mode here; I'm just stating the origins of my ranting -- this isn't a plea for you to go to church or to vote for this or that political party).

I'm all for opening up the borders. Let the immigrants come here for the honest living, not the handouts.

Here we go again. Back to blaming the victim. It's not the "handouts". Everyone comes here for an honest living, but there aren't enough jobs to go around, partly because some of those jobs are farmed off to the Third World -- it's a vicious cycle. I don't begrudge them taking those "handouts" as a consolation prize -- it's a much sweeter deal than they would have gotten back home, though people like you seem to think it's a mountain of money. I've never met a Mexican or Central American immigrant (or illegal) who wasn't a work-your-ass-off sort of person. For that matter, I've only met a handful of American-born "handout" recipients who weren't equally as industrious, and I don't think their bad attitudes grew in some sort of ghetto vacuum; society at large has helped add some fertilizer over the generations.

--

Not understood enough. (1)

pingouin (783) | more than 15 years ago | (#1948984)

I'm blaming the US gov't for supplying handouts paid with OPM (other people's money) and then clamping down on the borders to prevent "outsiders" from getting it. No handouts, no problem, open up those borders. Attract the immigrants who are excited by the notion of earning an honest living and nothing more.

But OPM pays for roads and schools and such -- things that profit the few or the many, depending on context. Surely you see the benefit -- beyond profit and loss -- of an educated populace or a sane commute to work. "Handouts" also flow through the economy by paying rents and buying goods (things like food and clothing, for instance) that otherwise wouldn't be bought. I find the notion of "good" subsidies and "bad" ones to be often in the eye of the beholder; unfortunately, the richer recipients usually get off scott-free (due to voter apathy), while the poorer ones get demonized. A culture that is willfully God-less still seems to want to finger a Satan and a legion of devils.

But my original point was about the free flow of immigration, as with the capital that leaves the West and goes to Third World factories. If immigration were that free, we'd have millions of Central Americans crossing the border within a year, plus Boat People from the Caribbean -- one of the consequences of letting people really seek a decent wage. In that scenario, you and I don't get to decide who is a "worthy" immigrant, just as we don't get to decide whether or not the movement of that capital is a net gain for our communities. And the government has to pay for such consequences as the vast majority of these hypothetical immigrants not being able to find immediate work. You didn't get that part of my question. In the real world, we allow anarchy and chaos in one direction and not the other.

That's one of the invisible things we pay for in the free lunch of cheap labor. Bailouts of foreign economies that never really seem to benefit anyone but the banks, foreign pols, and bondholders -- though OPM is used for those that. If not for those handouts, we might have had a domestic bank failure or two; we'd certainly have implosions in Third World economies, with a long-term loss in exports. There's a lot more, but I gotta go back and ruin^H^H^H^Hedit some code :)

Just keep in mind that we're dealing with an ecosystem here, not the Wild Wild West fantasy of those who would equate most taxation with theft. It's a corrupt ecosystem these days, but the poor people in Mexicali, Moscow, Malaysia, and Minneapolis are the last ones we should tee off on; they're often the ones who take the biggest beating. In a global economy, we all live in the same neighborhood, and Americans will eventually find that out when Brazil and Korea sneeze and Peoria gets a belated and persistent cold. We'll blame the usual devils for it, but we'll be the real culprits.

--

Bullshit happens. (2)

pingouin (783) | more than 15 years ago | (#1948987)

They should have the right to pursue a quality of life, but no one has the right to HAVE a quality of life.

I think the fact that they get paid a hell of a lot less for doing the same work as their US/EU counterparts has nothing to do with their "rights" to anything. I'm not arguing for their rights, I'm just arguing about our complicity in their "less than human" status. They, in practice, don't have a right to pursue a quality of life on the scale of people in El Norte. And if they tried, via collective bargaining or petitioning their political leaders, they'd be slapped down faster than a CPU cycle.

Slavery is not the same as cheap labor. Slavery is forced employment. People who work for cheap wages do so because they have no other employment alternative, usually because they either don't have the skills, or they live under the heavy hand of an oppressive gov't (the latter often contributing to the former).

Of course, in this case the "oppressive gov't" (i.e. de Mexico) has a hand in making LG an attractive proposition to Apple, by offering policies (or, rather, non-policies) that would be the envy of those who find the US government "oppressive". Your defense essentially just blames the victim. The people at the LG plant have skills, the very same ones utilized at the plants in Cork and Sacramento. Yet they're paid a small fraction of the wage. They're hemmed in as surely as any old-style slave, though they won't be hunted down or shot for leaving -- they would only receive punishment if they tried to assert themselves on the "plantation".

And there's no quick fix (e.g., minimum wage) to the problem.

I'm not asking for a quick fix. I'm just asking for the same "fix" that you or I would get.

Basically, we're all getting a free lunch out of this. But we pay in other ways. Blow it off if you want to. I don't want, henceforth, to see your name attached to whining about "gov't this" and "gov't that" when the problem at hand can probably be traced to the guy staring at you in the mirror. Can we also safely assume your defense of the rights of Mexican workers to come to the US by any means necessary in order to seek an "employment alternative"? If manufacturing capital is free to roam across borders in search of a free lunch, why shouldn't its victims be able to freely cross borders in search of a decent wage? Shall we petition the INS to bring down the fences and call off the dogs, then?

It's amazing that this "Christian nation" that puts "In God We Trust" on its currency and inserts "under God" in the Pledge of Allegiance and has a chaplain begin each Senate session would conveniently ignore Matthew 7:12 just to make or save a couple of bucks.

--

What about the rumour? (1)

Eccles (932) | more than 15 years ago | (#1948988)

Any truth to the rumour that a bald guy and a geeky-looking guy who referred to each other as "Bill" and "Steve" were seen fleeing the area, laughing about how much they loved to compete? :-)

Burning Apple Logo (1)

zonker (1158) | more than 15 years ago | (#1948989)

Here is a burning Apple logo I made a few years ago, when I was using Macs quite a bit. I just got so fed up with them and just wished they went away. Funny now, the Macs really are burning... Anyway, I made this animated GIF. You may copy it and post it wherever, just provide a link to my webpage. Here is the GIF...

http://members.xoom.com/zonk3r/oldpage/apple.gif

and my webpage is at the bottom here:

Apple, Disasters, & Production (2)

Frater 219 (1455) | more than 15 years ago | (#1948990)

This means Apple might not do the heavy laying-off it had planned to do at its Cork facility. Since layoffs suck in general, that would rule. :)

To those scum who would consider this disaster a good thing --- don't forget that Apple, like any other company, carries insurance. This is only a blip in the upward-curving MacOS trend.

(We could really do far worse than to have MacOS X dominate the user desktop and Linux the server. KDE and Gnome have a lot of catching up to do ... they're doing it, but it'll take time.)

baked apple with cinamon.. hmm... (1)

mvw (2916) | more than 15 years ago | (#1948991)

Hard to believe that they have no redundancy in their production process.

Does anyone know in how many aspects a European i-Mac differs from the U.S. version?

Thats what happens. (1)

Squeeze Truck (2971) | more than 15 years ago | (#1948992)

That's what happens when you shift production to Mexico to take advantage of the low wages and lax fire codes.


--
As long as each individual is facing the TV tube alone, formal freedom poses no threat to privilege.

Really? (1)

Ken (3185) | more than 15 years ago | (#1948993)

Really? In what way?

USB for hard drive? (1)

Ken (3185) | more than 15 years ago | (#1948994)

No. No Firewire, yet. But rumor has it that the next generation iMac will have firewire.

Microsoft is old (1)

CrAlt (3208) | more than 15 years ago | (#1948995)

Making fun of MS and BillyG is like beating a dead horse, Its just /TO/ easy :)

Not 100% (1)

CrAlt (3208) | more than 15 years ago | (#1948996)

More like 90%....MS has had it's little hands in MacOS a little. :)

Apple in trouble? (1)

MouseR (3264) | more than 15 years ago | (#1948997)

Apple, in a cost-cutting effort, has decided to move iMac manufacturing from it's Cork (Ireland) plant to a subcontractor (LG Electronics) in Mexico.

Since Apple didn't have other manufacturing needs (and because it suited their cost-cutting frenzy quite nicelly), they decided to close the Cork factory.

There was an open letter, last week, from a Cork employee called "Put a Cork in it, Apple!" wich was a good read. Look it up for details.

hmmm, redundancy... (0)

gambit (3767) | more than 15 years ago | (#1948998)

DORK! NIC Card? That's redundantly redundant. Network Interface Card Card.

iMac=AMC Pacer of computers (1)

gambit (3767) | more than 15 years ago | (#1948999)

Or is it the Gremlin? Or is it the Pinto? No matter which way you look at it it's UG-LY

Wah! So many negative people =( (1)

gambit (3767) | more than 15 years ago | (#1949000)

I think what irks most people so much about Apple is the arrogance of the established user base. I dont' think anyone would / could argue logically that the Mac sucks from top to bottom. It does some things really well and has shortcomings like all other OS's.

The main rub with the user-base is that most of them don't know what the other OS's can do and that other systems are superior or equivalent in many ways. This can be said for huge devotees of every OS, but the Mac has a more vocal and loyal base than any other platform.

I wish everybody could ease up on things and realize that different systems fit the need of very different people. Quit bashing already.

what's with all the hate? (1)

cpt kangarooski (3773) | more than 15 years ago | (#1949002)

really people. even if you don't like apple &| macs, can't y'all find a better target that's more suitable (pragmatically) for these negative feelings? hell, why not bitch at microsoft - they're worse and not suffering, like apple has been of late. after all it's not apple's plan to kill linux/OSS now is it?

(sheesh - if gates, allen and ballmer dropped a ton of bricks on y'all and jobs dropped a pebble you'd blame apple)

Oh come now (1)

cpt kangarooski (3773) | more than 15 years ago | (#1949003)

People have been predicting that Apple would go out of business any day now since they were founded. I'm not saying that it's difficult to attack either one, but why can't you attack the more entity that poses a more immediate problem? again, if microsoft dropped a ton of bricks on you and apple a single brick, why do you make the single brick a higher priority?

water damage (1)

bert (4321) | more than 15 years ago | (#1949005)

Surely Apple will give away those slightly water damaged iMacs to poor cs students to install Linux on?

McPinball? (1)

bert (4321) | more than 15 years ago | (#1949006)

The McPinball Special?

(Eight Ball Deluxe used to be this great Pinball game -- for PC's)

OUCH! Coupled with low supplies in warehouse. (1)

Sleepy (4551) | more than 15 years ago | (#1949007)

Apple's been keeping their supply lines at just a few days in order to maximize profit. Their build-to-ship is like half that of Dell's..

There isn't much of a buffer for this. This is a new contractor for Apple, so hopefully the other builders can keep up...

hmmm, redundancy... (1)

WhiteDragon (4556) | more than 15 years ago | (#1949008)

> The fire was bad, but then the water damage
> caused even more damage.

right. You probably have a NIC card and use the cddb database. :-)

burn baby burn (1)

arielb (5604) | more than 15 years ago | (#1949009)

remember those Apple commercials with the bunny suit guy burning up? How ironic

Wah! So many negative people =( NOT! (1)

AppleJuice (7359) | more than 15 years ago | (#1949010)

Re-read the comments so far. I counted maybe two or three that were *truly* negative. Some poked fun or commented neutrally on the news or other comments. All of the rest are positive!

Please ease up on the persecution complex. :)

iMac delays vs. no income for a month -- folks... (1)

couvares (7434) | more than 15 years ago | (#1949011)

Gee, we have to wait a month for an iMac -- meanwhile the idled Mexicali workers have to wait a month to go back to work and get another paycheck.

Got no mention in the article, but seems like the bigger tragedy to me...

-couvares

Thats what happens. (1)

Dwebb (10959) | more than 15 years ago | (#1949012)

Yeah, who wants low wages when you can have even lower ones, or none at all. Damn Apple for employing cheap labor!

And damn that Mexican gov't for not forcing the people to protect themselves! Apple, or any company for that matter, certainly isn't smart enough to think about protecting itself against the threat of fire. If it weren't for gov't regulations, we'd all be pulling out guns and shooting ourselves in the feet all day long. Thank you, big brother.

That's sarcasm, if you didn't notice. Seriously, don't be so protectionist and paternalistic. It isn't good for anyone.

Bullshit happens. (1)

Dwebb (10959) | more than 15 years ago | (#1949013)

Shouldn't they be able to enjoy the same material benefits that those Irish and Californian workers do?

Actually, no. They should have the right to pursue a quality of life, but no one has the right to HAVE a quality of life. The same argument goes for all the entitlement programs of the US gov't. Arguing that everyone deserves a particular material thing shows a lack of understanding of basic economics, as well as an unconscious belief in slavery (slavery of the productive).

Slavery is not the same as cheap labor. Slavery is forced employment. People who work for cheap wages do so because they have no other employment alternative, usually because they either don't have the skills, or they live under the heavy hand of an oppressive gov't (the latter often contributing to the former). And there's no quick fix (e.g., minimum wage) to the problem.

Bullshit happens. (1)

Dwebb (10959) | more than 15 years ago | (#1949014)

I agree that Apple is an accomplice in the slavery initiated by the Mexican government (something I almost pointed out in my last posting). My original posting was meant to oppose the idea that people should be paid more than market value merely because they have less than others. Clearly, there are other issues, and the fact that Apple (and any other company) takes part in employing people who are partly enslaved is a serious problem.

I'm all for opening up the borders. Let the immigrants come here for the honest living, not the handouts.

Not understood enough. (1)

Dwebb (10959) | more than 15 years ago | (#1949015)

Perhaps you misunderstood my last statement. I'm not blaming the immigrants. I'm blaming the US gov't for supplying handouts paid with OPM (other people's money) and then clamping down on the borders to prevent "outsiders" from getting it. No handouts, no problem, open up those borders. Attract the immigrants who are excited by the notion of earning an honest living and nothing more.

Regarding sin -- I'm not religious. But I do believe in absolutes and morals. I require rational arguments, not faithful ones. I don't mind rants, as long as there's a mind behind it.

"People like me?" I didn't say I think the handouts are a mountain of money. They aren't. But I do see them as dangerous, no matter how big they are or what they pay for, because they grow like a cancer, taking away more and more of the wealth of honest, productive people over time. And the middlemen in charge of it all (the politicians and their "friends") ARE getting a mountain of money. It's a corrupt system, and it will continue to grow until more people wake up and start opposing the confiscation of their property.

Hmmm... (1)

belbo (11799) | more than 15 years ago | (#1949019)

I hope RMS has a good alibi *grin*. Possibly someone didn't paid attention to the warning sign:
"iMacs are supposed to blow up at customer's home ONLY"

Wah! So many negative people =( (2)

IntlHarvester (11985) | more than 15 years ago | (#1949020)

I think what irks most people so much about Apple is the arrogance of the established user base.

Compare the relative level of arrogance of the Mac user base with the Linux user base. Oops!

(Of course most Mac users would say "I like my Mac because it just works and I don't have to spend all day munging plug n play or reading technical documentation.", where as most Linux users would say "I like my Linux box because it has a distributed display protocol system and when that locks up I can telnet in from another computer to a fully programmable command environment in order to restart the display system without affecting my uptime statistics.")
--

This is just too easy... (1)

jabber (13196) | more than 15 years ago | (#1949022)

Oh the humor of it all, and on a Monday at that!

"I always knew they ran a little hot.
"See where overclocking will get you?!?!
"I accept no responsibility for Apples inability to innovate in such a competitive market - B.G.
"Smoke colored iMacs for subtle yet distinct CEO offices.
"They're selling like hot-cakes, and they smell a bit like'em too...

Thank you, thank you.. I'm here all week.

Obviously a PowerBook 5300 (1)

Weasel Boy (13855) | more than 15 years ago | (#1949023)

*sigh* I told Steve it was a bad idea to build an Appleseed [ucla.edu] cluster out of all those unsold PowerBook 5300s!

How disuade potential Linux users (1)

Bobo Kaput (15026) | more than 15 years ago | (#1949024)

The reports regarding the APSL were valid, but this is nonsense. Why not just yell: "PIG PILE ON APPLE!". What other reaction could CmdrTaco have hoped for, but the all-too-predictable slashdot evil glee that ensues whenever an Enemy of the Revolution mis-steps?

Smugness is hardly an attribute suitable for a movement in need of as much help as this one does.

New addition to colors...Charred Black and Brown! (1)

strider5 (15284) | more than 15 years ago | (#1949025)

while they are still expanding theiur color line, why not make a nice char-colored imac with nifty "simulated" melted cases ;)

Apple in trouble? (1)

Maktoo (16901) | more than 15 years ago | (#1949026)

Actually it's a little more (and a little less) than that.

Apple has signed a 5 year, billion dollar, contract with LG Electronics for them to produce *all* iMacs.
They will be made in Mexico, Asia and Europe (all cheaper than Apple's facilities)

Apple hasn't really layed anyone off. They hired thousands of "temp" workers before the iMac introduction at the Cork, California, and Singapore plants. Now that they don't make iMacs they don't need those workers so they are all being released.

Unfortunately, there is a nasty *rumor* that they will close production completely at Cork. I don't see what benefit would come of this since Cork manufactures most of the PowerMacs and PowerBooks for the European market and shipping those machines from the US or Singapore would seem more expensive.

Time will tell. As for the fire. AppleInsider said that the Mac production plant wasn't severely damaged by the fire but rather by the water used to put it out. They didn't say what started it.

crappy mouse (0)

resteves (16923) | more than 15 years ago | (#1949027)

Yep, no-one likes the mouse, "out-of-the-box". But most people I have spoken to that have bothered to use it for a week or two. Actually like it better.

The trick is that you no longer hold it with your finger tips; it's more like you rest your hand on it. It is more comfortable and puts your wrist at a better angle.

You would have a hard time using a mouse this way if there was more than one button, but luckily, there is only one needed.

Pretty colors (0)

Gottjager (17214) | more than 15 years ago | (#1949028)


I wonder if the flames are cool colors from the iMacs burning. Seriously though, I can't say I care...

Persecution? (1)

Anonymous Shepherd (17338) | more than 15 years ago | (#1949029)

I run a WinNT machine on an Intel PPro200...

I was just commenting on the fact that at 8:40 this morning or so, with about 30 comments, a lot were speaking as if how Apple deserved this, this is karma, fate, justice, or how this just shows the universe knows what it's doing.

Now that I check again, my comment has been scored up above most of the negativity, and with more people reading positive comments, there are less negatives too...

AS

Wah! So many negative people =( (2)

Anonymous Shepherd (17338) | more than 15 years ago | (#1949030)

What is with all the anti-Apple sentiment?

They are as much a legitimate competitor, innovator, and supplier of PCs as Intel, Alpha, IBM, M$, etc., though I guess enemies of each firm would pop out if a disaster struck any of them...

It's not as if Apple has some overwhelming market share, and is pushing profit-oriented market decisions on us, or is taking advantage of its market share to push into other markets.

Perhaps people are upset that Apple doesn't exactly target the geeky crowd... or that Apple is too trendy, or something. Whatever happened to rooting for the underdog and being anti-establishment? As pompous or arrogant as Apple is sometimes, they really are in the position of underdog... and they do have a good chance to fight their way back into greater relevance.

It's not even as if Apple isn't useful or hasn't innovated in the market. If I am not mistaken, they still are unprecedented for the level of support they offer for desktop publishing, what with hardware level color pre-press technology, software and OS level support for color calibration among monitors, computers, printers, scanners, etc., even as PCs are just catching up. Likewise they introduced the market to high performance subsystems with SCSI, compared to the PC's IDE/EIDE, or high color graphics vs 256 color, and simple peripheral hookup, though today a PC has access to all of them, and the PC OS of the averaged desktop, Win9x, has effectively caught up and surpassed the Mac OS. Though it was saddled with the Win3x series for the longest time.

Perhaps I'm biased too, because Apple comes from my hometown, but they are still pushing innovation, at the risk of failure. See the Newton, a few years back? Its a shame they halted development on it. Or FireWire, today, to replace/supplement any host of slower more expensive connections? Or, and this is a big gamble, a stable, Unix based, consumer grade, competative OS?

Ah well, c'est la vie, or something like that.

AS

Poetic Justice... (1)

DMDx86 (17373) | more than 15 years ago | (#1949031)

Kinda odd how Apple had a "Burn Baby, Burn!" commercial and now this..

Sucks for Apple (1)

Mr. Piccolo (18045) | more than 15 years ago | (#1949032)

So what you're saying is that on a HUGE portion of the things the "normal" consumer cares about (Quake and Microsoft products) the Pentium !!! is faster.

Oh well, just gimmie my K7 (unless Mac OS X is scheduled to take over the consumer market by then).

Sucks for Apple (1)

Drizzit (18580) | more than 15 years ago | (#1949033)

"Any independent source will show you that the G3 is at most 10-15% faster than a Pentium II at the same clock speed." Sorry but PC Mag (aka KissWinTel Ass Mag) just ran a real world bake off and the 400MHz G3 beat the 500Mhz Pentium III overall, the only thing it lost on was Quake and Microsoft products. And Hell will freeze over before M$ products run faster on a Mac than on Windows, and for Quake, I guess that proves the TNT card is faster than the ATI Rage 128. So despite a 100Mhz difference the G3 rules. Plus this is running 8.5 which is still 45% 68K code.Wait til fully PPC native OS X.

I am a Mac User (1)

csw (18984) | more than 15 years ago | (#1949034)

Well, they're not all rabid idiots. Actually, I'm in almost the opposite position. I've used Linux for years and am planning on getting a Mac soon, for almost the opposite reason.
I admit, I don't get religious over source code licensing; I use Linux because it makes a first-rate server machine. However, several months of doing Real Work on a Mac was enough to convert me. It's a lousy platform for tinkering, but unbeatable for actually doing work. The interface is light years ahead of KDE, Windowmaker, or anything else that Linux has.
When I can get the MacOS interface with the stability of Unix, with bash and friends thrown in, I'm buying it. (Unless it costs $500.) Which means I'm buying MacOS X Desktop and a Mac to coexist with the Linux box in the closet.
The Gimp, Gnome, StarOffice, etc. are not going to be a real competitor to something as polished and well-thought-out as the MacOS with Photoshop, Illustrator, and Word. I'll let Linux do what it's good at: being a server. And I'll keep a Mac on my desk.

Flaming Apples? (0)

Alpha42 (19695) | more than 15 years ago | (#1949035)

First the "flame-broiling powerbook" of a few years ago, and now this?

Not what I had in mind when I said "just watch apple, they'll be on fire once people get tired of lining Bill's pockets" a while back..



I agree! (1)

InstantCool (19982) | more than 15 years ago | (#1949036)

I always thought /. was a place where one could find intelligent conversation about a topic. Instead, it is a place where most people are looking to start a flame war. I was hoping that /. was above the usenet, but I guess I haven't been here long enough to see that this isn't so. If you don't like Apple, /. has these neat little preferences that allow you to disable any Apple related news.

I enjoy watching Apple's climb back out of the grave that Wall Street prematurely dug. Hopefully the situation in Mexico will not be a major set back for the company.

--

Glad to hear it (1)

InstantCool (19982) | more than 15 years ago | (#1949037)

Good to hear that problems aren't as bad as they were made out to be.

I think most people got out hand.

Remember, if everyone starts using Linux, you're no longer special.


--

I am a Mac User (1)

InstantCool (19982) | more than 15 years ago | (#1949038)

I am a Mac user that was looking into learning more about Linux. I would never completely abandon the Mac because there are programs I can't do without (Photoshop rules), however, I wanted to learn more about Linux as a possible server solution.

If this is the support community that Linux users are so proud of, I'm sorry, but it certainly takes some of the steam out of my excitment for this platform.

--

Burning Apple Logo (1)

InstantCool (19982) | more than 15 years ago | (#1949039)

...like a phoenix from the ashes...

--

8ball=best computer ever!!! (1)

InstantCool (19982) | more than 15 years ago | (#1949040)

The word "inexpesive" comes to mind...

--

Sucks for Apple (1)

cybrthng (22291) | more than 15 years ago | (#1949044)

well, i disagree.. a 233/266mhz G3 is mucho mucho mucho faster then any Pentium II Processor out there.. better design, better everything..

The imac is a 900.00 computer that a. has built in monitor, a G3 CPU, 32 Megs of Ram, USB Bus, 10/100 Base T network card, 56k Modem, and a 2-6 gig hard drive..

you cant beat that in ANY OEM/FULL pc.. even e machines don't come with a monitor/keyboard/mouse/soundcard/networkcard and a software package for that price..

come on people, wake up and smell the coffee.. if you gonna diss cheasy hardware then Don't buy compaq, don't by HP and don't by Packard Bell because THEY ARE THE ONES USING SHITTY HARDWARE, by far Mac G3's and iMACS are FAR SUPURB to any 900-1000.00 pc you could ever buy at the store..

its HP using crapy softmodems and softsound cards and single slot upgrade motherboards (one free pci slot) its Compaq using Crappy motherboards and different cpu's on every box they deliver, its packard bell never building a good system


sure the lil green imacs don't have much to upgrade, but atleast its a standard.. need a new hard drive, you got the usb port, need another floppy or a zip disk, use the usb port..

but if you going for a workstation or graphics box the imac wasn't built for that.. otherwise for your price and the product behind it you can't beat it at all.

and thats the truth!

my next pc will be an imac!

Sucks for Apple (1)

cybrthng (22291) | more than 15 years ago | (#1949045)

mucho mucho isn't a techno term dumbass :) if you can't read and learn whats the point.. k7's aren't out yet.. And they will cost more then an imac costs (when you add motherboard,ram,disk and what not) Basically comparing apples to apples, an Imac is a superior machine.. k7 will kick ass, Pentium III Second Gen chips will kick ass.. point is, for 900-1100 bucks this is what you get: iMac, now available for $1199, includes a Pentium-toasting 266MHz PowerPC G3 processor, 32MB SDRAM, 6GB hard disk drive, 24x CD-ROM drive, built-in 56K modem, 10/100Base-Tx Ethernet, two built-in 12Mbps Universal Serial Bus ports and more--plus Mac OS 8.5.1 and a ton of great software. BTW - 12 Mbps is the USB ports.. and as far as speed, sure my ultra DMA bus mastering ide claims 33mbs but i'd sure as hell like to see that.. i'm not dissing your machine, i'm happy with my pc.. but i've never had problems with any mac getting new hardware to work device drivers and compatibility problems have never been an issue on any mac i've used (except for them stupid ass modems). But if you want to compare high end to high end i'll happily do that.. but for 900-1100 for a complete system with only 2 things done to setup from out of box to being on the internet you can't beat that..

Sucks for Apple (1)

cybrthng (22291) | more than 15 years ago | (#1949046)

on another note.. if you want to compare apples to apples :) http://www.apple.com/powermac/benchmark.html this is comparing - comparible bus speeds/cpu speeds/ram configurations and disk speeds.. these would make lovely linux boxes!

karma (0)

lightPhoenix (28084) | more than 15 years ago | (#1949047)

This is purely karma. Lovely. -jeff

Plant didn't burn (1)

Shishigami (30600) | more than 15 years ago | (#1949048)

According to another source [zdnet.com] , the fire wasn't all that bad. Sorry to disappoint all of you mac-haters.

I like redundancy.... (1)

DonkPunch (30957) | more than 15 years ago | (#1949049)

....because I like redundancy.

Bullshit happens. (1)

Adrian De Leon (30979) | more than 15 years ago | (#1949050)

Cents an hour?? I hope you are not talking about "salario minimo", (minimun wage) that is a complete joke.

More than 20 million mexicans live in extreme poverty.

Like, heh, heh (1)

PhoneMonkey (32729) | more than 15 years ago | (#1949051)

It truly is a shame that this arson^H^H^H^H^Hfire occurred. But it's like I've been saying all along, Apple just can't compute, we've burned them all along. While the iMacs were hot, Microsoft just burned them.

*ahem*

What I mean is...

-Bill Gates
CEO, Microsoft



"Responsibility for my career? I'm just a freakin' phone monkey!"

Sucks for Apple (2)

Patman (32745) | more than 15 years ago | (#1949052)

Although I think the Imac is a pretty sucky piece of machinery, I hope this doesn't spell the end of it - compeition is always good, and the Imac certainly made computers look cool. Besides, even if I hated the Imac, this isn't how I would want it to die - I'd rather see it die by loss of market rather than some fire.

BTW - Bill Gates wasn't seen in the area with a can of gas, was he? :-)

Plant didn't burn - Yeah right! (1)

Lowdown (84458) | more than 15 years ago | (#1949053)

because, although the plant didn't burn (really. it didn't), the sprinklers killed off all the manufacturing equipment.
and hey braniac, how does a fire at an LG plant and a bit of outsourcing make Apple suck?

Apple fire (0)

termite666 (101297) | more than 15 years ago | (#1949054)

I am so sick of the cult of Steve(tm),I guess after the fire they now live up to their name once again.


Arrogant People Profit Losing Entinty=APPLE

billg's a firestarter... (0)

white rabbit (148617) | more than 15 years ago | (#1949055)

...a twisted firestarter...


Sigh. Couldnt resist.

Heh! (0)

tarcus (206701) | more than 15 years ago | (#1949056)

They got a right royal flaming over the APSL didn't they...

--

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