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384 comments

Congrats Firefox (5, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#10672083)

And congrats and not being vulnerable to the latest IT URL spoofing flaw [netcraft.com]. That one's so easy even a kid can do it.

But the NYT site uses popups! (4, Funny)

turnstyle (588788) | more than 9 years ago | (#10672101)

But the NYT site uses popups! Won't Firefox block 'em? ;)

Re:But the NYT site uses popups! (1)

Analog Anomaly (806971) | more than 9 years ago | (#10672177)

What popups? I've been using firefox for some time. I haven't seen ANY popups on the firefox site. :)

Re:But the NYT site uses popups! (4, Funny)

shish (588640) | more than 9 years ago | (#10672258)

Popups in a dead-tree edition of a newspaper?

(Why do I get the feeling we shouldn't be giving advertisers ideas like this?)

Re:Congrats Firefox (2, Insightful)

PhrostyMcByte (589271) | more than 9 years ago | (#10672135)

You can spoof the URL using onmouseover in any browser, what is the big deal?

Re:Congrats Firefox (4, Informative)

shish (588640) | more than 9 years ago | (#10672156)

You can spoof the URL using onmouseover in any browser, what is the big deal?

This doesn't use onmouseover; it still works with scripting turned off entirely

There is no big deal (1)

osmethnee (717516) | more than 9 years ago | (#10672212)

There is no big deal - someone just thought they'd like to see their name in lights by posting a nonsense bug to a popular mailing-list.

Re:There is no big deal (2, Informative)

osmethnee (717516) | more than 9 years ago | (#10672238)

Actually, I'll expand on that...

Having the status-bar and the link-target disagree is a non-event (and has been ever since 99% of people enabled javascript in their browser.)

A major event would be where the address bar and dislayed-url differ. That is not the case here.

Re:Congrats Firefox (2, Informative)

antifoidulus (807088) | more than 9 years ago | (#10672155)

Oddly enough(ok so I'm bored), in the ancient Mac version of IE, that exploit doesn't work.....

Re:Congrats Firefox (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#10672185)

It does however trick Safari under OSX too.

Re:Congrats Firefox (1, Offtopic)

Jugalator (259273) | more than 9 years ago | (#10672157)

And congrats and not being vulnerable to the latest IT URL spoofing flaw. That one's so easy even a kid can do it.

Doesn't work in my IE 6 under Windows XP SP2.

The address bar says "http://www.google.com/" just like Firefox.

Re:Congrats Firefox (1)

Jugalator (259273) | more than 9 years ago | (#10672169)

Ah, later down in the article it says it only affects XP that hasn't installed SP2... Yet another reason to do that, I suppose. :-P You're crazy if you haven't (and even if you have you're still using a huge hacker target to an OS). If you can't for some reason, you should use a different OS.

Re:Congrats Firefox (1)

slaad (589282) | more than 9 years ago | (#10672248)

Doesn't work in my IE 6 under Windows XP SP2

I was disappointed to see this myself... I wanted to see how cool it would be to go to a different site than it says...damn me for keeping my system patched!


(After that, I noticed that the original link mentions that IE SP2 is safe)

Re:Congrats Firefox (1)

pe1chl (90186) | more than 9 years ago | (#10672310)

It does not work in other versions either.

This bug only means you see http://www.microsoft.com/ in the status bar while hovering over that link, but as soon as you click it the address bar will show the real location you are visiting.

So it is useless for phishing. It is just a bug, not a security problem.

firefox has it's own url problems. (1)

oliverthered (187439) | more than 9 years ago | (#10672291)

Open two tabs.
In one tab open a url, and wait for it to load.
Then open another URL that you know will take a while to load ,firefox displayes the url you've just typed in the address bar.

Switch to the other tab and back again.
Firefox now displays the url of the old page in the address bar.

Way to go, maybe try mistyping the url in a blank tab, switch to another tab, switch back... wow it's blank, cheers for blanking out my typo firefox.

Re:Congrats Firefox (1, Offtopic)

NtroP (649992) | more than 9 years ago | (#10672366)

Sonofabitch. I just checked the Netcraft report out in Safari and the spoof worked!

I can't find anyone mentioning it anywhere. What's the best procedure to report this?

woohoo! (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#10672084)

#18

Feck off! (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#10672302)

The answer is #42 idiot...

frist prost? (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#10672086)

wow new story, frist prost and hot grits.

FP! (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#10672093)

FP!

This is fantastic news. (5, Insightful)

isolationism (782170) | more than 9 years ago | (#10672097)

Not that New York is the only place on earth I'd want to advertise FireFox; I've been signing it from the mountaintops for months now and haven't looked back. Are there any further marketing plans by the Mozilla group to spread the good word? Aside: I'm a little disappointed in myself for not having remembered to contribute. Oops. Guess it's T-Shirt time ...

Re:This is fantastic news. (4, Funny)

revery (456516) | more than 9 years ago | (#10672162)

I've been signing it from the mountaintops for months now and haven't looked back.

Julie Andrews uses Firefox?!?!

--

How do you solve a problem like Mozilla?

Do you live under a rock? (3, Informative)

tommck (69750) | more than 9 years ago | (#10672215)

The New York Times is probably the most widely distributed newspaper in the world!

It's not just advertising in New York, Jeez!

Kids these days!

Re:This is fantastic news. (3, Informative)

slaad (589282) | more than 9 years ago | (#10672219)

Not that New York is the only place on earth I'd want to advertise FireFox

The NY Times sees national distribution. It's one of the most read papers in the country. I know that someplace on spreadfirefox.com there is a faq that explains this and also mentions that they they may advertise in other areas (ie europe) in the future as well, and I'd love to link to it but it seems to have been hit by the slashdot effect already... :) And you're right, you can still contribute. They probably raised a lot more money than they need for the advertisement here. The extra just goes to helping out in other areas. You can always donate [mozilla.org] straight money, or like you said, buy a shirt. You can also contribute by spreading the word about firefox, posting flyers [spreadfirefox.com], and of course by using it.

Re:This is fantastic news. (1)

3770 (560838) | more than 9 years ago | (#10672345)


I think the point is that they aren't necessarily aiming only for NY.

They are doing this in a way that it might be picked up by other mainstream media as news about what is happening in New York.

Take this thread for instance. It is of course preaching to the choir, but the actual news article could have been carried by CNN.

Other side of coin. (5, Interesting)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#10672112)

""The Firefox full-page NYT ad campaign finished off today with an impressive $250,000 over 10 days. Impressive to say the least, and it goes to show just how much momentum Firefox has.""

Or just how badly we want to get rid of IE.

Re:Other side of coin. (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#10672171)

What major features other than tabbed browsing does firefox really have over IE? I've been using mozilla and the KDE browser a lot and love the tabbed browsing. I've been playing with firefox and think it's okay. mozilla has other browsing features that aren't in firefox and as a result, I'm probably going to go back to mozilla. While I have linux on a bunch of my machines, windows is my default desktop and when IE comes out with tabbed browsing, I'm not really sure why I'd not want to use it. It definitly integrates better with the OS than firefox. I despise MS, but I'm not going to hinder myself by not using their stuff when it works well.

Hehe (4, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#10672120)

An individual contribution of $30 will get your name included in the ad ($10 student rate).

The problem with $250,000 is that the ad might be 99% names, and 1% content.

Nice and legal like... (1)

twoslice (457793) | more than 9 years ago | (#10672263)

The problem with $250,000 is that the ad might be 99% names, and 1% content.



Not if you print in 6pt type. You obviously never looked at a Microsoft EULA - What the BIG print giveth the fine print taketh away....

Oh, no problem. (5, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#10672288)

The 99% name list is the content. It sends a clear message.

FeedTheLizard.com (2, Interesting)

exnuke (734919) | more than 9 years ago | (#10672125)

Anyone interest in a similar campaign for Mozilla? I'll donate FeedTheLizard.com and FeedTheLizard.org to the cause.

Re:FeedTheLizard.com (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#10672146)

I'll donate FeedTheLizard.com and FeedTheLizard.org to the cause.

Your porn startup not working out?

Re:FeedTheLizard.com (1)

exnuke (734919) | more than 9 years ago | (#10672160)

Yeah. After you cancelled your membership, I couldn't afford to keep the doors open. ; )

Seems a shame to waste it on a newspaper ad (4, Interesting)

smartin (942) | more than 9 years ago | (#10672128)

That kind of money could be better used to finance developement.

Re:Seems a shame to waste it on a newspaper ad (5, Funny)

Poltras (680608) | more than 9 years ago | (#10672216)

That kind of money could be better used to finance developement.

You're a developper, admit it.

Re:Seems a shame to waste it on a newspaper ad (5, Interesting)

bogie (31020) | more than 9 years ago | (#10672235)

What good is all the development money in the world if nobody ever hears about your product? Or to put it another way, ask Microsoft which is more important. Designing a good product or marketing?

Re:Seems a shame to waste it on a newspaper ad (1)

KAMiKAZOW (455500) | more than 9 years ago | (#10672346)

Designing a good product is more important. IE already lost market share to Mozilla (Firefox) without that stupid ad.
Mouth-to-mouth propaganda is the best ad.

Re:Seems a shame to waste it on a newspaper ad (1)

HoneyBunchesOfGoats (619017) | more than 9 years ago | (#10672351)

That's probably a bad example, since we're pretty unhappy about the results of the Microsoft way of doing things.

Re:Seems a shame to waste it on a newspaper ad (3, Informative)

Southpaw018 (793465) | more than 9 years ago | (#10672264)

It says in the redherring article referenced from SFX that the ad will be just under $50k. The rest will go straight back to Moz. Go Firefox!

Re:Seems a shame to waste it on a newspaper ad (5, Informative)

smoking2000 (611012) | more than 9 years ago | (#10672277)

That kind of money could be better used to finance developement.

They will, according to the interview with Rob Davis at redherring.com [redherring.com]:

To date, close to 10,000 people have funneled almost $250,000 through Mr. Davis' campaign into the Mozilla Foundation, the Mountain View, California, non-profit organization that is developing Firefox.

The ad will cost just under $50,000, and the left-over cash will be plowed back into the Mozilla Foundation.

Re:Seems a shame to waste it on a newspaper ad (1, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#10672278)

This is a good way to spend the money. Mozilla, and open source in general fail at the very first purpose of marketing: awareness. Most of the the people that could use them do not know Mozilla and Firefox even exist. If people have never even heard of your product, then obviously they won't consider using it.

Whoah! (0, Redundant)

Apreche (239272) | more than 9 years ago | (#10672131)

How much does an ad in the NYT cost?? 250K is enough to buy a house, or a superbadass server farm, or a Ferrari! You can't seriously tell me that an ad in the times costs as much as a Ferrari, that's ludicrous. They definitely need to take that extra money and go for some television ads. Or even give some to the developers, they deserve it.

Re:Whoah! (1)

ztirffritz (754606) | more than 9 years ago | (#10672158)

Don't forget that the NYT is distributed nationwide as well as internationally. That is alot of ad space. I agree that 250k still sounds like alot though. 50k maybe, but 250k?

Re:Whoah! (5, Informative)

ControlFreal (661231) | more than 9 years ago | (#10672165)

A full-page ad in the NYT costs between $75k and $120k, depending on the page, and when it will be shown. The Firefox team have not chosen a particular day for the ad, but rather a time-window of ~10 days in which it will be shown once. This is cheaper.

I don't know where the rest of the money will go now. There are tentative plans, however, to raise similar campains in other countries if the ad proves to be a success. Maybe some of the excess money can be used for that.

Re:Whoah! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#10672184)

I believe they said their time window was 3 weeks, and that they got a really really good rate which they can't disclose publicly. I'm guessing it's under $50,000.

Re:Whoah! (5, Informative)

ricotest (807136) | more than 9 years ago | (#10672280)

Acocording to this article [redherring.com], the advert costs only $50,000. We already know that The Mozilla Foundation are getting discounts because of the time window, and also because of their non-profit status.

Re:Whoah! (1)

Xepo (69222) | more than 9 years ago | (#10672375)

The donation that people put in was not supposed to go solely to the ad. The money that's not used on the ad they specifically said will go to other launching expenses, be that more advertising or whatever.

It doesn't all go to the ad (2, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#10672166)

If you don't remember, the original campaign was for 2500 people in 10 days (so we'll assume they'd raise about a quarter of the money ~$62,500) and even then they said not all of the money would go to the ad but to fund additional publicity for the launch. If we assume the ad costs the same, you see they probably have $200,000+ for other publicity... or a big slush fund.

Sponsors? (1)

Man in Spandex (775950) | more than 9 years ago | (#10672170)

Some of that 250K should go in development directly given to the mozilla foundation. They made firefox and they could always use more help financially. Who doesn't?

Some of that other 250K should go in advertisement such as being a sponsor in rally events or something? We see HP/Compaq logos on McLaren in F1 so why not the Firefox logo? :D

Re:Whoah! (1, Redundant)

naelurec (552384) | more than 9 years ago | (#10672178)

The NYT ad will cost less than $50k.. The rest of the $250k will be used by the Mozilla Foundation for other needs (promotions, developers, equipment, etc..)

Re:Whoah! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#10672229)

No, this money all goes towards promotion.

How about double-page ad? (1)

MtViewGuy (197597) | more than 9 years ago | (#10672227)

I think they should seriously consider doing a double full-page ad in the New York Times given how much they've raised. And see if they can do it in full color, too. =)

TV Ads?? (1)

tommck (69750) | more than 9 years ago | (#10672228)

What are you smoking?

250K MIGHT buy you ONE 30 second spot in prime time!

You reach MANY more people with a newspaper.

They also have the time to read all the information that is presented rather than getting up to go to the bathroom or pushing the ">>" button on the Tivo.

And, yes, this is a fair price for the ad. It's just the laws of supply and demand.

In other news... (5, Funny)

sl8r (104278) | more than 9 years ago | (#10672133)

A mention of the spreadfirefox website on popular website slashdot.org brought new woes to the spreadfirefox team:

"We completely went over our bandwidth for this month, and I was just served with a bill over $250'000 for this month's bandwidth usage!!" ;)

How about a campaign.. (3, Insightful)

Tracer_Bullet82 (766262) | more than 9 years ago | (#10672138)

to get /. to show correctly in firefox.

Re:How about a campaign.. (3, Interesting)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#10672175)

If Slashdot switched to an HTML standard... any standard... that validates (even almost validates), then I'd buy another subscription. Also, if they switched to PNG, I'd buy another subscription. Until they do, they're just wasting money and I won't have them waste anymore of mine.

Re:How about a campaign.. (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#10672181)

Why are people always bitching about this? It displays perfectly with a gtk2 build of Firefox 1.0-pre in Linux. Maybe you're using weird fonts or something? It works fine for me with Bitstream Vera fonts.

Re:How about a campaign.. (1, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#10672205)

It's a very real bug, but it's sporadic. I have two computers here, one with XP and one with 2K. I copied the profile from XP to 2K. The XP one shows the bug, but the 2K one doesn't. It's part a Gecko bug, but it's also part bad HTML.

Re:How about a campaign.. (3, Informative)

shish (588640) | more than 9 years ago | (#10672245)

The bug is like so (or I may be talking about a different bug, I'm not quite sure...): The page is loaded, the layout set in stone, and then any images that weren't quite ready get drawn on top. The problem is when the images that get drawn in the last stage are larger or smaller than expected, and they don't affect the layout. Hence images used for padding (a Very Bad Idea to begin with) sometimes mess up the layout if they don't load fast enough.

A key part of the struggle (5, Insightful)

jlrowe (69115) | more than 9 years ago | (#10672139)

The average user thinks the IE *is* the internet.
The key point then Is to educate the user that the browser is not the internet, but just software that accesses the web. And that Firefox is better at doing that and protecting them from intrusion.

Re:A key part of the struggle (5, Funny)

Aruthra (826467) | more than 9 years ago | (#10672176)

You can't fool me. The internet is clearly stored inside my hard drive and IE is required for me to access it.

Re:A key part of the struggle (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#10672299)

This is fine and dandy, but when the IE only pages don't render on their browser what will you tell them then? Sure _you_ can and will complain to the webmaster, but joe-schmoe won't. My dad's stock-trading site is actually implemented in asps. He's not shifting until he moves to a different brokerage site...and that's not happening anytime soon...

Re:A key part of the struggle (1)

lintux (125434) | more than 9 years ago | (#10672348)

Implementing a site in ASP/.NET doesn't prevent you from supporting multiple web browsers... Just as using PHP doesn't prevent you from making MSIE-only sites...

10 days, 10,000 names, $250,000 (5, Informative)

helfen (791121) | more than 9 years ago | (#10672151)

Notice that they were preparing for about 2,500 donors in 10 days at first. And at the end of the 10th day we have a donors from over 80 countries. Quite amazing.

This is kind of bizarre (-1, Flamebait)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#10672159)

Raising money to "promote" Firefox? No shortage of wierdos out there.

Firefox is gaining momentum allright (4, Interesting)

Lisandro (799651) | more than 9 years ago | (#10672188)

I see it among non tech-savy people. I have friends coming and asking me if i've tried it; in the cybercafe i work it's installed on every PC and something like 7 out of 10 clients choose it over IE.

I'm very happy to see this. I still like Opera better, but Firefox is a terrific browser. And the price is right.

This Is Serious (5, Insightful)

blueZhift (652272) | more than 9 years ago | (#10672198)

Congrats to Firefox on the $250K! This is the stuff that sends ripples through the market and makes the CEOs stop and take notice. You don't just raise a quarter million dollars in less than two weeks unless you have something seriously good, or illegal!;-) Anyone in the browser or browser add-on business is going to have to take notice of this because it is real. Browser stats from various web sites are nice, and so are download stats. But at the end of the day, money talks louder than all of that, and $250K is some pretty loud speech!

Next step: Hire Ellen Feiss for a TV ad (5, Funny)

Poro (14468) | more than 9 years ago | (#10672200)

The next logical step is to make a TV ad. A switch ad with Ellen Feiss, this time switching from IE to Firefox. And looking as stoned as always.

"I was surfing in the net. And then, like, bleep bleep bleep bleep bleep! And then, like, half of the web page was gone. And I was, like, Huh?"

Re:Next step: Hire Ellen Feiss for a TV ad (2)

twoslice (457793) | more than 9 years ago | (#10672284)

you missed the fact that IE is slow. it is kind of like...

wait for it...

a bummer

More adds? (-1, Flamebait)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#10672203)

I use Firefox so that i can turn off all ads now i have to watch firefox ads on NYT? Hmmm....
No more ads, no more garbage! I'm tired of all this marketing stuff... Open source guys are just as bad as every other company. Just look at all the FUD being spread in Slashdot!

Re:More adds? (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#10672240)

Yeah and now you're modded down. So much for the free speach. Seems like telling trues on Slashdot gets you negative points while selling lies gets you +.
There are some sites on the internet teaching you what to say on slashdot in order to get some positive mod points. You might want to take a look at them.

Re:More adds? (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#10672312)

Dude, if he wanted to get modded up he just had to do the following, watch:
BUSH SUX! Vote Kerry!

Re:More adds? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#10672321)

Yeah, even Osama Bin Laden could get modded up on Slashdot by posting that. michael would probably post a submission by him, too.

Momentum? You mean charity.. (1)

NekoXP (67564) | more than 9 years ago | (#10672253)


People contributing to a fund is not momentum, it's charity.

"Just goes to show how much charity Firefox can endear" would be
more accurate statement.

Why NYT? (4, Insightful)

BobGregg (89162) | more than 9 years ago | (#10672273)

I still say they should've bought the ad in USA Today instead. NYT has limited average-Joe distribution. USA Today is sold in all the cheesy work cafeterias where America's IT workers take their morning coffee. It's in every 7-11 (well, those in the States anyway) where the non-IT workers take *their* morning coffee. What the blazes is a NYT ad going to do, other than waste precious money?

Re:Why NYT? (1, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#10672308)

The New York Times is read by the decision makers (also why WSJ would be a good place). If the boss reads about this Firefox, tries it at home and likes it, well, he might just demand everyone in the office start using it.

Re:Why NYT? (1)

heptapod (243146) | more than 9 years ago | (#10672378)

Well since the ad in the NYT is only going to cost 50k, they should use the surplus to get an ad in the WSJ and USA Today.

Re:Why NYT? (5, Insightful)

KublaiKhan (522918) | more than 9 years ago | (#10672311)

All the CEOs and CFOs and other people with impressive titles read the New York Times.
Said people have the "final word" on workplace policy or some such.
If enough of these corporate types know about Firefox, and it gets into their thick skulls [ for corporate executives are among the stupidest people, technology wise, that I know of ] that it's a Good Thing, then said executives may pass down an Order from On High relating to it.

Is it just me that feels slightly uneasy? (1, Insightful)

phaze3000 (204500) | more than 9 years ago | (#10672276)

Am I the only one who thinks that this $250 000 could have been put to better use?

Don't get me wrong, I'm typing this post in Firefox right now, it's undoubtedly a great browser, but wouldn't $250 000 be better spent fighting third world poverty or providing clean drinking water?

Of course, when one compares it to the vast sums of money spent on unnecessary gas-guzzling 'SUVs' it doesn't seem so bad after all..

Re:Is it just me that feels slightly uneasy? (1, Interesting)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#10672293)

By that logic, we should figure out the worst problem on Earth and put all of charitable resources into it. If it's hunger, so that means ignoring cancer, AIDS, diabetes, etc. Is that how you want to run the world?

Re:Is it just me that feels slightly uneasy? (0)

pe1chl (90186) | more than 9 years ago | (#10672358)

Take any issue of the NYT, or any newspaper, count the pages with full-page ads, and you get a very large sum that could have been spent on poverty or clean drinking water.

And then we are not even talking about all the trees that were used up to fabricate the paper the ads were printed on... how much could they have contributed to cleaning our atmosphere, adding oxygen and removing carbon dioxide.

But be careful, such thinking does not fit into the American way of life!

Money to spend (-1, Flamebait)

toriver (11308) | more than 9 years ago | (#10672294)

Of course the Firefox-using geeks have money to spend: The money they don't use to buy the CDs and DVDs they download, dirty pirates that they are.

I havn't heard of this up until now... (1)

kidlinux (2550) | more than 9 years ago | (#10672347)

And I'm wondering if it's still possible to send in a donation?

Unintentional Insight from NYT (1)

FauxReal (653820) | more than 9 years ago | (#10672379)

"While it's an unusual situation in advertising to have a special interest group endorse rather than criticize a product, it's not unheard of," said Toby Usnik, director of public relations for the New York Times.

Sounds kinda like a certain political race taking place at this very moment.

Just got back (1, Interesting)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#10672383)

From my sister's house after she got infected by ad/spyware through IE, it completely corrupted Windows meaning a reinstallation was necessary, after doing that I instantly installed Firefox as default (with AdAware), somebody else who will not be using IE again (I made sure to drum it into her) and now she's surfing via Firefox and loving it.

No more racing to close 1,000 pop-ups every time the browser is opened or she goes to a website.

IE is rather like a virus, in a bad way, now let's make Firefox spread and spread through word of mouth like a virus.

IE, your time is up, just like the 90s, and now there's a new kid in town.

Where did the internet go? (4, Informative)

yonatanh (815045) | more than 9 years ago | (#10672387)

Yeah, just yesterday my sister asked me why I don't have the internet on my computer I replied to her by blatantly asking, "What the fuck are you talking about?" Of course her reply was where did that Internet Explorer icon go. Just to show you how IE is dominating the damn browser market, people don't even know there is other software that can be used to visit websites (other than AOL users).
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  • dt
  • dd
  • em
  • strong
  • tt
  • blockquote
  • div
  • quote
  • ecode

"ecode" can be used for code snippets, for example:

<ecode>    while(1) { do_something(); } </ecode>
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