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866 comments

FP (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#10840806)

FP

FR (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#10840813)

FR

barcode (5, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#10840810)

If you want to track people, why not just tattoo a bar code on the forehead.

Re:barcode (2, Funny)

DenDave (700621) | more than 9 years ago | (#10840859)

yeah beats having to say: Sorry teacher but the dog ate my RFID tag...

Cutting Class (5, Insightful)

aonnix (612879) | more than 9 years ago | (#10840811)

It should be easier to cut class now. Just give your tag to your buddy, and the school's computers will think your there.

Re:Cutting Class (5, Insightful)

Repugnant_Shit (263651) | more than 9 years ago | (#10840826)

That won't be a problem once the subdermal tags arrive.

Re:Cutting Class (3, Interesting)

hummassa (157160) | more than 9 years ago | (#10840869)

Simple, yet. You just put a tinfoil leave over the subdermal patch and leave the premises. The computer will still think you are inside.

Re:Cutting Class (2, Insightful)

ultrasonik (775562) | more than 9 years ago | (#10840989)

I really don't see any type of implant as being used in the future. Biometrics is comming along too well for that. The school could have just as easily used finger print scanners.

Your not as smart as you're brain thinks it is (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#10840871)

Obviously, you already skip class.

Re:Cutting Class (-1, Redundant)

mobby_6kl (668092) | more than 9 years ago | (#10840891)

>It should be easier to cut class now. [...] the school's computers will think your there.

You obviously know what you are talking about!

Insanity (5, Insightful)

david_594 (735508) | more than 9 years ago | (#10840814)

If I were still in High School I think i would be scared of this. RFID technology seems great for tracking shippments and such, but to track students like this seem pretty insane.

Re:Insanity (5, Insightful)

jokumuu (831894) | more than 9 years ago | (#10840884)

Well, the thing is, actually tracking anything is with this technology is the scary part. The actual use by a school is just the tip of the iceberg. I am sure that in future every person will be tracked "for their safety". I think that some small town will probably go for something like this at some point "to fight crime"

Re:Insanity (2, Informative)

lachlan76 (770870) | more than 9 years ago | (#10840886)

Being in high school now, I'd have to agree with you.

You have no idea how fucked up your country looks from down under.

Re:Insanity (1)

RangerRick98 (817838) | more than 9 years ago | (#10840908)

Hey! Just because our water swirls the other way down the drain.... :P

Re:Insanity (3, Insightful)

tomstdenis (446163) | more than 9 years ago | (#10840903)

The bigger problem I see is you can't really force discipline and respect on children anyways. I mean you can show them how their actions have consequences and all but if the child doesn't take it upon themselves to straighten up there isn't much you can.

For instance, a couple of years ago [ok so roughly 8 or so] the high school I went to started a "10 missed classes and you're suspended". Did that stop skipping? Did that make the students more respectful of the teachers and their peers [specially in grade 9, the first year of high school for us...]? Hell no.

By contrast the "advanced stream" [basically get >60% in advanced courses] I was in was mostly populated with students who behaved themselves, got through the lectures and participated in class. We chose to act like adults we weren't forced to do so.

So left to their own devices most children would come around on their own. The ones who don't want to can live exciting lives with a grade 10 education.

So all this RFID thing is going todo is breed more contempt for "authority" on the part of the students who in my mind are already a bunch of punkagers anyways.

As for "privacy" concerns... um there are none. You're in PUBLIC while at a PUBLIC SCHOOL. So long as the RFID tag is encrypted or something [e.g. not plaintext stored on it] and it's easy to stow when not on campus I don't see the huge security concern.

Tom

Sorry, this is good.... (0, Flamebait)

REBloomfield (550182) | more than 9 years ago | (#10840815)

I'm an admin in a school, and for the pupils, this is actually a benefit. The closest thing we've come to a seamless registration is using swipe cards, which get lost, traded, broken, etc. This system gives the students the freedom to come and go as they please, and in the event of a fire, for example, we know exactly where students are at any time, without having to hope that when they signed out, they remembered to swipe out.... I can imagine the majority of tin foil hat replies to this post, but just for once, if you're not in the position to be affected by this, shut the hell up.....

Re:Sorry, this is good.... (-1, Flamebait)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#10840825)

Fuck you you sactamonious bitch.

Re:Sorry, this is good.... (3, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#10840834)

if you're not in the position to be affected by this, shut the hell up.....

Yeah -- and do the same thing when they come for the Jews, right?

Fuckwit.

Only criminals have to fear (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#10840927)

The Founding Fathers were duped into passing the 4th, 5th, and 6th amendments, which only serve to weaken our freedom-loving society and allow the terrorists to win. Obviously, only people who have something to hide need be afraid of the government.

Thank -o- for our wise leaders like John Ashcroft who want to ensure our continued safety! -o- bless America! -o- damn everyone else!!!!1

Sorry, you are wrong.... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#10840835)

but just for once, if you're not in the position to be affected by this, shut the hell up

Attitudes such as this are very dangerous, sir. I pity your students.

Re:Sorry, this is good.... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#10840849)

No numbnutz you don't know where the kids are in a fire - you know where alll the goddamn rfid chips are - thats all..
Don't worry though we can just give them the implant chips! much more reliable!
Well how about we stick one of those digital angel chips in your ass then too dude? Its for your saftey! Oh and while we're at it how about a gps embedded tracker and cameras to watch you too? Its for your saftey!

Idiot.

Re:Sorry, this is good.... (1)

not_a_product_id (604278) | more than 9 years ago | (#10840852)

You do get all those advantages and I'm certainly willing to accept that this might be a good thing for school pupils. Trouble is, that get's people used to accepting this sort of thing. Next stop - your workplace? Your home?

Re:Sorry, this is good.... (0, Troll)

REBloomfield (550182) | more than 9 years ago | (#10840865)

The difference being, we are required by law to know where our pupils are at all times, i can't see a reason for knowing when you're in your house at all times, although I'm sure a few of the anonymous cowards will think of a reason.

Re:Sorry, this is good.... (2, Insightful)

not_a_product_id (604278) | more than 9 years ago | (#10840923)

"we are required by law to know where our pupils are at all times"

probably another reason why this could be a good thing. The danger here comes when governments try to extend this and that's where this is the thin end of the wedge. It may be a good thing but we'd be stupid to ignore the dangers it also brings.

Re:Sorry, this is good.... (1)

REBloomfield (550182) | more than 9 years ago | (#10840967)

i just don't understand why people are convinced that because RFID tags are acccepted in some areas, means that they'll be forced upon them as citizens. It really is over reaching.... they're great for warehouse stock tracking, and this is another useful application. I will, however, accept an "i told you so" in ten years ;)

Re:Sorry, this is good.... (1, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#10840993)

i just don't understand why people are convinced that because RFID tags are acccepted in some areas, means that they'll be forced upon them as citizens.

I know! I know! Is it because of the terrorists?

Re:Sorry, this is good.... (1)

a whoabot (706122) | more than 9 years ago | (#10840971)

For criminal investigations. There could be a criminal or even a terrorist on the loose and the authorities may wish to contact you because you may have some information that will help them solve the case. Actual human eyes will only see your transmitted location when the authorties look it up when they feel the need to contact you in these rare occasions. If you're doing nothing wrong there won't be any reason to fear this.

Re:Sorry, this is good.... (1)

Ralph Yarro (704772) | more than 9 years ago | (#10840937)

You do get all those advantages

Does he?. He said the problem with swipe cards was that they get lost, traded, broken etc. and he implied that RFID tags magically fix that. He doesn't explain how. Even if we assume an implant, there's nobody on the planet stupid enough to think we've come up with a technology that can't go wrong. After a few years of use we might be able to say that they don't go wrong often, but that's about it.

Re:Sorry, this is good.... (2, Insightful)

mumblestheclown (569987) | more than 9 years ago | (#10840854)

I agree with your assessment that it's a good thing and I also share your dread at the predictable tin foil hat replies. However, "in you're not in a position to be affected by this.." is exactly the wrong attitude.

Re:Sorry, this is good.... (1)

REBloomfield (550182) | more than 9 years ago | (#10840881)

okay, fair enough I can see from the responses that i may have overstepped the mark, but the majority of responses to this come from people who are long out of school, don't have kids in one, but still think they should be able to dictate how schools are run. Pisses me off, is all. I apologise :)

Re:Sorry, this is good.... (2)

Ralph Yarro (704772) | more than 9 years ago | (#10840904)

but the majority of responses to this come from people who are long out of school, don't have kids in one, but still think they should be able to dictate how schools are run.

Does the fact that despite all that I still have to PAY for them give me any voice at all in your world?

Re:Sorry, this is good.... (1)

jokumuu (831894) | more than 9 years ago | (#10840935)

To put this in perspective. I do not have kids and I am out of school a long time ago.

But.. Why does that disqualify me from having opinins about schools or educational systems?

For one I know of many things what were wrong with the system when I was there, and listening to the arguments used currently, some of those things seem still wrong and some even worse, though some are apparently better too.

Your experience during school years is an importan part of your personality, as you form so much of who you are during those years.

So schoolis are important for the whole society and not only those that are directly affected.

Re:Sorry, this is good.... (5, Insightful)

eclectro (227083) | more than 9 years ago | (#10840855)

if you're not in the position to be affected by this, shut the hell up.....

Let me guess, if we don't that would make us unpatriotic as well???

Re:Sorry, this is good.... (1)

lachlan76 (770870) | more than 9 years ago | (#10840874)

I'm in high school. And somehow I feel that making me carry a radio transmitter around, and sharing that information with the admins/police isn't the kind of thing people should do.

The closest thing we've come to a seamless registration is using swipe cards, which get lost, traded, broken, etc.

Explain why these things can't happen to an RFID tag? Or are you planning to implant them?

If it's not on my balls, I'd gladly get my hunting knife and cut it out.

Re:Sorry, this is good.... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#10840912)

you're a high school student with a hunting knife?
do you wear a long leather trenchcoat??

do the proper authorities know?

Re:Sorry, this is good.... (1, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#10840932)

Explain why these things can't happen to an RFID tag? Or are you planning to implant them? If it's not on my balls, I'd gladly get my hunting knife and cut it out.

Now now, don't give them any stupid ideas of where exactly to implant them..

Administrators are trustworthy (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#10840876)

I can imagine the majority of tin foil hat replies to this post, but just for once, if you're not in the position to be affected by this, shut the hell up.....

I agree. And Ashcroft is the one to give the best assessment of US-wide deployment, and citizens who have not yet been tagged should shut the hell up (those who have been tagged, we will deal with you).

That is the new efficiency of dialog in Americagrad. Love it or lump it.

Re:Sorry, this is good.... (1)

kfg (145172) | more than 9 years ago | (#10840913)

. . .if you're not in the position to be affected by this, shut the hell up.....

You sir, represent the trackers.

Would you bother to ask the trackees, the ones actually most affected by this, how they feel about it, or would you 'explain' the benefits to them and tell any who objected because they 'didn't get it' to shut the hell up?

KFG

Re:Sorry, this is good.... (0)

REBloomfield (550182) | more than 9 years ago | (#10840947)

erm, the students are affected by this, so i would welcome their responses. I never said I would tell anyone who objected to shut up.

Re:Sorry, this is good.... (2, Interesting)

achilstone (671328) | more than 9 years ago | (#10840921)

Unless the RFID tags are embedded in their skulls, then they can also be "lost, traded, broken, etc".
The real convenience is that the student doesn't have to make any effort to register in or out but to just ensure that they remember to carry their tag.
What happens with a faulty tag?
Will a student suffer a poor attendance record without recourse?
After all they might not find out until the end of year school report.
"...it must be true because the computer says so."

Re:Sorry, this is good.... (3, Interesting)

erroneus (253617) | more than 9 years ago | (#10840939)

I was going to mod this as interesting but I think I would rather reply to it.

I think it's important to recognize that students (children, minors) are being entrusted to the public school system to make sure that while under their care, nothing bad happens to any student. They are, in essence, the largest daycare provider in any given area and they have a huge responsibility in keeping tracking and accounting of other people's children.

Now I can't say that it's a good thing that the information is fed to the local law enforcement agency unless there is a particular student they wish to keep track of and in that event, there should be some sort of formality associated with "I need to know when 'Johnny' came and went for the past two weeks and for the next two weeks from now." But to have that information fed to them on a regular basis feels kinda wrong.

But one thing to keep in mind -- while a person is a minor, there are no rights to privacy to speak of. The "rights" they might enjoy are whatever has been granted by their parents and/or the school system. I liken this to the same problem that students have with their "freedom of the press" rights in school newspapers -- while it's all well and good to want to exercise those rights, the fact remains that a school newspaper is a SCHOOL newspaper and as such is actually under the control and supervision of the school system, so guess who is in control of "freedom of the press" in that little world? Absolutely.

It just might be a good thing... I'd be interested to see what pitfalls are to be revealed by any of this.

Re:Sorry, this is good.... (1)

jokumuu (831894) | more than 9 years ago | (#10840966)

I violently disagree with this

The schools job should be to Teach, not to be daycare.

Re:Sorry, this is good.... (2)

REBloomfield (550182) | more than 9 years ago | (#10840978)

You send your child to school. Nay, you drop you child at the school gates. You see them walk through the doors.

Four hours later, the police knock on your door, saying they were called to the mall where your child was caught shoplifting on CCTV.

Are you going to blame the school for not ensuring that your child was under their supervision? I can probably guarentee that you'll say you won't, but the vast majority of parents will.

Re:Sorry, this is good.... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#10840950)

"... I can imagine the majority of tin foil hat replies to this post, but just for once, if you're not in the position to be affected by this, shut the hell up....."

Watch you language, kid or I'm taking you to the principal.

Re:Sorry, this is good.... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#10840992)

Yeah, I'm sure its great, until pedos start using their RFID readers to figure out which students walk home without their friends.

Encrypted or not, all you need is to be able to "hear" the RFID response, and then its just like sonar for kids.

Funny (3, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#10840816)

How prejudice and invasive technologies always attack those who cannot defend themselves first. I give it 5 years and you'll see rfid on vehicles or national id's. I mean you have a license plate now, whats the dif between that and rfid. right, right, nudge nudge.

Thank you idiot america.

Re:Funny (2, Insightful)

jokumuu (831894) | more than 9 years ago | (#10840898)

the difference: no rfid YET. Just wait for the new and improved "Crime fighting Lisence plate"

Tin foil hat (4, Funny)

Xeo 024 (755161) | more than 9 years ago | (#10840817)

They won't be able to scan me as long as I hvae my tin foil hat on, right?

Re:Tin foil hat (1)

eclectro (227083) | more than 9 years ago | (#10840907)

Actually, if you put the RFID card under the tinfoil hat there is a good chance that they will not be able to scan you.

However the computer will show you as not showing up for the day, which may cause problems for you if happens enough times.

Because the RFID scanner might be "tricked" by your buddy carrying the card for you, I suspect that they will start to have RFID implants in the hand for kids.

And the sheeple will do nothing to stop it.

a good post (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#10840819)

Not first, but still good. I'm ok with being second, or even third. I am a beautiful thing.

Mark of the Beast (2, Interesting)

cuteseal (794590) | more than 9 years ago | (#10840822)

Hm... I wonder if this is coming closer to the Mark of the Beast that the bible talks about?

In Australia, they use now swipe cards to check attendance at schools. Swiping at a terminal brings up a mugshot of the student on the screen, so the staff member can perform a visual check to see why Abdul Habib has blue eyes and long blonde hair...

Re:Mark of the Beast (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#10840840)

As a red state Christian in the US, I am excited. I can't wait for the world to end, because that means I get to go to heaven to be with Jesus and Busch. We'll be up there laughing our a$$es off at all you Kerry voters in hell.

Re:Mark of the Beast (1)

mkswap-notwar (764715) | more than 9 years ago | (#10840880)

Well, as long as they don't ever want to implant them in our foreheads, or in our hands, I think we're OK. Initially people said the same thing about Social Security Numbers, but that didn't quite pan out.

Re:Mark of the Beast (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#10840936)

of course not, but considering that the ORIGINAL hallmark of the social security number was that it was NOT TO BE USED for TRACKING people yet today you ARE your social security number... people who have it can and will know anything they want about you given a proper credit check (which for YOU costs money, for an outside company pretending to wish to extend you credit... is basically free) odd ?? SSoc is more abused than almost any system except the USPTO and the US legal system. Don't argue too much, I've owned 2 companies to date, and I've seen a LOT of legal battles. I'd rant longer but sadly I've work to get done.

Let me be the first to say (-1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#10840824)

wtf?!?!?!? why are the police notified?

Re:Let me be the first to say (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#10840976)

So they can force the children to rape a goat.

oi (1)

fizze (610734) | more than 9 years ago | (#10840827)

omg Im so glad that I dont have to attend a school. *sigh*

Curious though how/when/if this will be adpoted in Europe....

private schools (2, Informative)

kardar (636122) | more than 9 years ago | (#10840956)

Again, if you send your kid to a private school of your liking you don't have to deal with this crap - and you'll get them a better education while you're at it. This will mean an easier time getting accepted at a better college, will lead to a more fulfilling career, a better quality of life, so on and so forth.

The RFID is probably one of the more minor problems the students at many of our public schools face.

to the police?? (2, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#10840828)

transmitted to both the school administrators, as well as city police

Don't the police have better things to do instead of tracking students? Like maybe fighting crime?

Re:to the police?? (1)

foxhound01 (661872) | more than 9 years ago | (#10840863)

yeah, like the ones being committed by students skipping school?

Cutting class not possible? (1)

messiuh (206505) | more than 9 years ago | (#10840829)

Sure it is.. if there is a signal being transferred, there is a way to Jam [halfbakery.com] it. [insert Spaceballs reference here]

Debian Troll's Best, wherefore art thou? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#10840833)

Debian Troll's Best would have an apt-get themed solution to the problem!

Re:Debian Troll's Best, wherefore art thou? (1)

hplasm (576983) | more than 9 years ago | (#10840893)

apt-get install rfidfkoff

RFID circumvention (5, Insightful)

shadowmas (697397) | more than 9 years ago | (#10840839)

soon we'll be learning tons of ways to circumvent RFIDs. kids are very good at finding out ways to circumvent stuff like this. nomatter how good a system might be when it goes against lots of kids with a lot of time on there hands and new ways of thinking i wonder how long it will take b4 kids find away around this.

Re:RFID circumvention (4, Interesting)

lachlan76 (770870) | more than 9 years ago | (#10840934)

Disclaimer: I am 15

  • Aluminium foil
  • Coming to school and leaving it in my locker
  • Hack the computer system
  • Buying a similar model, reprogramming it, and getting someone to take it to your classes, if need be


And finally, if they eventually decide to implant:
  • Knife...most people won't go this fat to get out of class, but I don't feel much pain anyway



Thos are just the things I thought of in the last two minutes. I could probably think of more more.

Ah the prisoner (5, Funny)

pklong (323451) | more than 9 years ago | (#10840845)

Where am I?
In the School

What do you want?
Information

Whose side are you on?
That would be telling . . .

We want Information
You won't get it

By hook or by crook . . .
We will

Who are you?
The new Number Two

Who is Number One?
You are Number Six

I am not a number . . .
I'm a free man!
(Mocking laughter)

Re:Ah the prisoner (0)

the_duke_of_hazzard (603473) | more than 9 years ago | (#10840894)

Journo: "What do you stand for?" No. 6: "No comment" Journo: "Freedom and democracy, very good sir!"

Freedom to monitor (4, Insightful)

Homology (639438) | more than 9 years ago | (#10840846)

Upon being scanned, the data are transmitted to both the school administrators, as well as city police.

The official USA propaganda is that the rest of the world envy USA because of it's freedom. Well, I don't envy the freedom US authorities has to continously monitoring anyone for no reason at all.

Re:Freedom to monitor (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#10840866)

1 school district in TX != everyone.

I agree that it's a bad idea, but hyperbole like that only makes you look foolish.

Re:Freedom to monitor (1)

Homology (639438) | more than 9 years ago | (#10840933)

1 school district in TX != everyone. I agree that it's a bad idea, but hyperbole like that only makes you look foolish.

Of course I'm aware that this is just one school district in Texas. However, this monitoring crops up just about everywhere in USA, and appears not to meet much opposition. Just witness the speed of the introduction of the PATRIOT act. As if the powers given by the PATRIOT act was not enough, they even have a draft of PATRIOT II. I'm sure you can find some other examples.

Re:Freedom to monitor (4, Insightful)

Kidbro (80868) | more than 9 years ago | (#10840973)

1 school district in TX != everyone.

The interesting thing is that you're so "free" that this gross invasion of privacy is allowed. While in a "less free" country this would be completely against all laws.

I'm not really trying to judge, but it's not clear which of the systems that is best at protecting individual freedom.

Re:Freedom to monitor (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#10840897)

Something tells me they need to bump up RFID enforcement in the English grammar studies department of school.

Re:Freedom to monitor (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#10840902)

You should see cops in smaller towns. They'll harass you and then if you tell them to fuck off, like they rightfully should, they'll literally beat the shit out of you. And what can you do? Nothing.

Re:Freedom to monitor (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#10840955)

They'll literally beat the shit out of you? I'm getting the picture that police officers in small towns induce rectal prolapses in suspects.

Of course, I've met someone who was on a football in a small town in Texas who could attest to the accuracy of Varsity Blues. I guess that's the current workaround.

Re:Freedom to monitor (2, Insightful)

rongten (756490) | more than 9 years ago | (#10840918)

When Thomas Jefferson said The price of freedom is eternal vigilance some of you think he meant this?
Why should we limit our civil liberties in trade of "security"?
Why it is easy of letting something go, but hard and strenous to conquer it back?
Some things we are hearing around start making 1984 sound like a bed time history.

It Moved! (1)

Zeb-9000 (829101) | more than 9 years ago | (#10840848)

From the mapquest link, Texas has moved, or we need to put an RFID tag on it so we can keep better track of Texas

Beating up nerds? (3, Funny)

exeme (831902) | more than 9 years ago | (#10840853)

Pretty freaky "Big Brother" stuff, but I guess its a good way to track students. But then I remember school being better when the trouble makers wern't there beating up us nerds..

Social engineering RFID into the children (4, Insightful)

WCMI92 (592436) | more than 9 years ago | (#10840856)

Something tells me the black market in RFID jammers and duplicators is going to be rampant...

This is totally wrong. You are compelled by law to attend school. Most can't afford to NOT go to government school. Now the government is tagging people like animals.

Be VERY afraid of the first RFID generation, ones who grow up with this commonplace, who never knew an age without it. Who will thing we are a bunch of kooks for opposing it.

That is why those who want to social engineer people ALWAYS want to start with the schools...

As long as it's voluntary (1)

sabri (584428) | more than 9 years ago | (#10840857)

I don't see any problem with it. Only advantages. In case of accidents you know where people are. In case of criminal investigations you can proove where you were. Just make it voluntary.

Re:As long as it's voluntary (1)

soccerisgod (585710) | more than 9 years ago | (#10840909)

Yeah, and if you refuse, you're under general suspicion. Since when do people have to prove their innocense? Last time I checked,it was the other way around!

Re:As long as it's voluntary (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#10840924)

I don't see how you could possibly know where people are with that.
All you know is that the RFID in question passed a sensor at a certain time.
I fail to see how this invasive, expensive tool is going to help in alomost any situation.

Re:As long as it's voluntary (1)

lachlan76 (770870) | more than 9 years ago | (#10840964)

But do the _STUDENTS_ need to volunteer, or the parents?

I'm in high school now, and there is no chance in hell that I would ever put my signature on a permission form. I value not being tracked everywhere I go. Why give it up for slightly more safety, when I know that I'm gonna die younger than most anyway?

well... (-1, Redundant)

northcat (827059) | more than 9 years ago | (#10840858)

I guess cutting class is no longer an option.

Yeah, now it's a necessity.

Maybe this is a case (4, Interesting)

antifoidulus (807088) | more than 9 years ago | (#10840864)

of law suits gone too far. It seems recently the trend has been to blame the school for whatever trouble a kid causes, and since the school may have difficulty tracking down individual students and whether or not they were on campus, the school may very well end up being responsible. At least this way the schools can say definitievely whether or not someone came(provided they actually still have their rfid, w hich may be a big assumption)

Wonder why (5, Interesting)

chennes (263526) | more than 9 years ago | (#10840873)

In an age when parents are suing schools for not keeping adequate track of their children (see http://www.overlawyered.com/archives/001699.html) is this any wonder?

Not the student, the badge (1, Funny)

jamesl (106902) | more than 9 years ago | (#10840875)

RFID as a way to track students' arrival and departure.

RFID is a way to track students' ID badge arrival and departure. Imagine the possibilities: Send security! The whole football team just walked into the girls' locker room. Again.

This is the wrong approach. (3, Insightful)

RandoX (828285) | more than 9 years ago | (#10840890)

If the student to teacher ratio is so large that the instructor can't even accurately take role, what is the level of education going to be like?

Children of the free world (2, Insightful)

Zemran (3101) | more than 9 years ago | (#10840905)

This is the sort of thing we would have screamed about if China had done it a few years ago and now we just accept it. The East is moving West as quickly as the West is moving East. Soon they will occupy the moral high ground.

What is the problem?? (1)

Fatchap (752787) | more than 9 years ago | (#10840914)

So rather than have someone who is underpaid, overworked and likely to have low motivation carry out a labour intensive task like taking a rollcall, we automate it.

Someone tell me the problem (other than it uses the paranoid's current bête noire of RFID)

Serious problems! (1)

MavEtJu (241979) | more than 9 years ago | (#10840916)

Hoping to prevent the loss of a child through kidnapping

Somebody got some statistics(*) on how often this happens?

(*) Feel free to make up :-)

Anyone with kids in school should know... (2, Interesting)

HomerJayS (721692) | more than 9 years ago | (#10840922)

... that the RFID plan is fatally flawed. On any given day, the RFID system will be reporting a 50% absentee rate. The typical high school student is lucky enough to remember to bring his/her bookbag to school every day, much less a small, easily misplaced RFID card.

Re:Anyone with kids in school should know... (1)

Fatchap (752787) | more than 9 years ago | (#10840968)

Subdural implants will solve this minor issue!!

Ferris Bueller (5, Interesting)

Jumbo Jimbo (828571) | more than 9 years ago | (#10840925)

We can all watch Matthew Broderick skip class and reminisce about the days when this used to be possible - it'll become a period piece of a bygone age, along with Remains of the Day and Little Women.

Students are *not* cattle (4, Insightful)

joelparker (586428) | more than 9 years ago | (#10840929)

From the article:
  • a few schools have begun monitoring student arrivals and departures using technology similar to that used to track livestock and pallets of retail shipments.
And adults wonder why our kids aren't learning important ideas like responsibility...

The Slippery Slope.. (5, Insightful)

ObsessiveMathsFreak (773371) | more than 9 years ago | (#10840943)

Are these guys trying to piss off the volcano!?

Seriously, most proponents of RFID technology site its benefits in stock and supply line management only, and keep assurring us that RFID tags embedded in products will never be used to track people.
And yet we're now seeing instances of the middleman, i.e the product tag, being bypassed altogether and people being tagged outright. Is this really what RFID was developed for in the first place? Tracking people?

OK, these people are children. But that doesn't make this any less wrong. First criminals, then kids. They'll start on employees next, move it up to registered drivers, you'll see.

Of course tagging children has nothing to do with their safety. Anyone who says so is a liar or an idiot. As has been mentioned numerous times, the legions of pedophiles that lurk outside scholl gates every day will simply take off the tag, as will the kids when they want to leave for that matter. Of course the response from RFIDphiles is "Let's implant the tag subdermally!!!! FOREVER!!!! What a great(completeely consistent with a free society) idea!!!". *Sigh*. Why can't so many people think past their next meal?

The purpose of RFID tracking people is to cause a chilling effect. This is denied in the case of children and the public, but is the primary reason given for tagging criminals. Bit of a contridiction there. Effectively tagging children is a form of control, and an extreamly invasive one at that. I don't care what age I am, or who you are. No-one should know and have a documented record of my exact movements. Period. You want to protect your kids? Sit down and talk with them once in a while. Find out where they go rather than right clicking on a toolbar icon to see where they are. Don't squash their, or my, freedoms just because your too busy watching fear factor to look after your own kids.

And of course when I start using by blocker tag, I'll be accused of aiding pedophiles and endangering the children. Won't someone please think of the children!!? I am!

I'm ready for people to start with the tinfoil hat cracks, but to them I say, this is the exact kind of thing you said would never happen!! Well it's happening right now! What are you going to do about it.

RFID tracking is data rape.

Under the skin is better! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#10840946)

Advocates of the technology said they did not plan to go that far. But, they said, they do see broader possibilities, such as implanting RFID tags under the skin of children to avoid problems with lost or forgotten tags.

Yeah right.

You really should get rid of those Nazies while it's still time.

Just Imagine (3, Insightful)

Hoplite3 (671379) | more than 9 years ago | (#10840972)

What if they had spent that money on making kids want to go to school? I went to Texas public schools. No, I survived them. The one I attended was divided neatly into honors and regular classes. In the regulars classes, you learned how to take the TAAS (this test was required for graduation and pushed as a part of school accountability under the last federal administration). If you were in honors, you learned how to take the AP exam.

Needless to say, not many people were really turned on to learn. Because nothing of substance was being taught.

Personally, I think that large school reforms are in order. Let's divide students into classes with the type of instruction that suits them best. Let's not teach college prep to everyone, they'll resent it. Few people really connect with the idea of liberal arts anyway (even in college, I was a bit surprised) and it forms the basis for most highschool course requirements. Articles I've seen recently say that boys are doing poorly in American schools. It looks like all girls schools in England do significantly better than comparable coed schools, especially in math and science. Maybe gender segregation would help. Girls seem to be intimidated by boys in these subjects, and boys need more structure and encouragement. There's a lack of adolescent-to-adult ritual in our country. Maybe this could help provide what truant students are missing.

It would be preferable to humiliation like this RFID crap.

what next? (1)

pagal_paanda (824030) | more than 9 years ago | (#10840984)

What are they going to do next? RFID shit balls to see how they go through the toilet?

Required implants (5, Insightful)

hrvatska (790627) | more than 9 years ago | (#10840985)

Where this is leading is required RFID implants. The requirement will initially start out with groups that most of us don't care about, like convicted felons. Next, maybe immigrants. Then it'll start creeping into other sectors of society. Eventually you'll see a wide range of jobs where this is required. Perhaps nursing, police and emergency workers. Then it will start to be required for normal activities. Like you won't be able to board an airline without an RFID implant. The initial selling point will be that it speeds up boarding. And then it'll be required for driver licenses. Can't be too secure after all. I think it's inevitable.

The Police? (5, Funny)

955301 (209856) | more than 9 years ago | (#10840991)

And I suppose the RFID's of the criminal element of the school will transmit data with the Evil Bit turned on? Shouldn't it be a word, or at least a few more bits?

000 - Nothing to see here.
001 - normal kid with mischevious mind. Watch for changes. May be intimidated back to 000 with minor police brutality.
010 - Thief. Arrest if lingering in the parking lot or around school supply cabinets.
011 - Fighter. Arrest if having an animated discussion with any 000's they don't normally congregate with or other 011's.
100 - Stabby. Arrest when outer perimiter metal detectors are set off. Notify cafeteria to dispense plastic silverware to the 100 and immediately surrounding 000's. Exhibits 011 behavior, follow guidelines accordingly.
101 - Brandisher. Arrest when outer perimiter detectors are set off and body mass = yesterday's + #g of any known gun + various # of bullets/magazines.Exhibits 011 behavior, follow guidelines accordingly.
110 - Shooter. Arrest immediately. If no gun is found, plant one or make an announcement that arresting them was the right thing to do.
111 - Dealer. "Accidently" shut fire doors on 111's crushing them to death. Accompany disposed of body with a 110, some stray bullets, and drug paraphenalia.

Yeah, they definately need more Evil Bits...

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