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Fl. County Halts FTTP Until Installation Is Safer

timothy posted more than 9 years ago | from the what's-a-little-sewage-compared-to-a-fiber-line dept.

The Internet 468

celerityfm writes "Warning: Deploying Verizon's new Fiber To The Premises (FTTP, see previous) in YOUR neighborhood may involve geysers of raw sewage spewing onto your front yard or sinkholes opening and swallowing moving vehicles. Well, Hillsborough County, host to one of the first FTTP trial sites, has ordered Verizon to stop deployment of FTTP until they can figure out how to stop creating sinkholes that open up under minivans with children inside. No word on whether SBC is having similar problems with their fiber roll-out."

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FS (3, Funny)

SEWilco (27983) | more than 9 years ago | (#10844972)

First Sinkhole.

Re:FS (1)

iztaru (832035) | more than 9 years ago | (#10845172)

This store sounds just like a urban legend!

201st sinkhole! 202nd sewage geyser! (5, Insightful)

HDlife (714246) | more than 9 years ago | (#10845208)

The problem is that there are 2,000 workers busting pipes that the county has to fix. Even if the county can bill Verizon later, the county certainly doesn't have the staff to play cleanup to Verizon's contractor.

This is probably a great deal for the diggers; the cost of paying the county to fix the breaks is probably less than preventing them. Therfore, the only stick that the county has is to say STOP! No more digging until you clean up your act!

A Little Trite? (5, Funny)

Skye16 (685048) | more than 9 years ago | (#10844976)

>> Warning: Deploying Verizon's new Fiber To The Premises (FTTP, see previous) in YOUR neighborhood may involve geysers of raw sewage spewing onto your front yard or sinkholes opening and swallowing moving vehicles.

Still sounds like a pretty fair deal to me!

Re:A Little Trite? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#10845015)

Indeed, it's a small price to pay to do away with 56k.

Re:A Little Trite? (1, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#10845115)

I like those odds.

Re:A Little Trite? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#10845167)

One of the things Japan does with their infrastructure is they run everything overhead. While it's a bit cluttered-looking, it's a lot more organized than it could be (think of India's power grid). This has allowed for really fast deployment of things such as FTTP while avoiding sewage. Unfortunately, even with typhoons, earthquakes and such here, I don't think elevated fiber would survive spawn-of-Satan weather that is to be found in such places as Oklahoma.

Re:A Little Trite? (5, Funny)

SEWilco (27983) | more than 9 years ago | (#10845227)

One of the things Japan does with their infrastructure is they run everything overhead.

But it sure makes a mess when a bird pecks through the overhead sewage lines.

Re:A Little Trite? (2, Funny)

MikeMacK (788889) | more than 9 years ago | (#10845189)

But wait a minute, this is Florida, seems like it would be a story if sewage and sinkholes weren't opening up everytime someone dug a hole.

Dear gods, its just an optical cable! (3, Insightful)

Kenja (541830) | more than 9 years ago | (#10844987)

"Verizon crews installing fiber optic lines have hit nearly 200 water and sewer lines, costing almost $103,000 in repairs."

This takes incompetence to a whole new level. I mean, its just a cable. I've installed lots of local and wide area networks without hitting even one sewer line.

Re:Dear gods, its just an optical cable! (4, Insightful)

meme_police (645420) | more than 9 years ago | (#10845027)

No kidding. How many things are safely installed underground every day around the country? This has nothing to do with FTTP.

Re:Dear gods, its just an optical cable! (4, Insightful)

shawn(at)fsu (447153) | more than 9 years ago | (#10845132)

It looks like it because Verizon fell victim to using the lowest bidder for it's subcontracting in laying the cable, while it isn't FTTP's fault it's verizons fault for not hiring better contractors and the sub contractors fault for doing shoddy work to save a buck.

I'd want them to stop to if they've had over 200 incidents, boil water notices are a pain, not having phone service is an inconvenience and without 911 a potential lawsuit.

Re:Dear gods, its just an optical cable! (4, Funny)

Megaweapon (25185) | more than 9 years ago | (#10845042)

I was hired to install some fiber in some house in Amityville, NY. I was later accused of giving Satan internet access.

Re:Dear gods, its just an optical cable! (1)

OverlordQ (264228) | more than 9 years ago | (#10845081)

Dont blame Verizon then, you think they actually themselves are digging the wells? Blame it on stupid sub-contractors.

Re:Dear gods, its just an optical cable! (1)

Kenja (541830) | more than 9 years ago | (#10845107)

"Dont blame Verizon then, you think they actually themselves are digging the wells? Blame it on stupid sub-contractors."

Why not blame Verizon for hiring these monkeys? Lowest bidder is not allways the best choice. When given the option of useing reputable contractors or Cletus the gapped tooth back hoe operator I would use the people with a good track record, even if Cletus is willing to work for road kill.

Re:Dear gods, its just an optical cable! (2, Funny)

schon (31600) | more than 9 years ago | (#10845157)

reputable contractors or Cletus the gapped tooth back hoe operator

Hey, Cletus and Merle did damn good work!

Just make sure they keep the dog away from the cement mixer. :o)

Re:Dear gods, its just an optical cable! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#10845175)

When given the option of useing reputable contractors or Cletus the gapped tooth back hoe operator I would use the people with a good track record

More often then not, the Cletus type is the best backhoe operator. Problem is, Cletus knows he is and does not get the lowest bid. The lowest bidder is normally the clean cut guy trying to break into the business and low balling the estimate.

Re:Dear gods, its just an optical cable! (3, Informative)

RPI Geek (640282) | more than 9 years ago | (#10845146)

Incompetence is right! This is ridiculous! There's no excuse for hitting all these water mains and sewer lines.

Well maybe the laws are different in FL, but in NY State there's a number you have to call before digging to ensure that there's no underground wires/pipes/etc. When you call this number, they in turn call the right people to go to the site and mark the underground lines. Every so often there's a mistake, but it's nowhere near 200 times in a month! When I worked at Time Warner Cable for a summer, we'd get faxes from these people, and we'd send the supervisors who knew the area to mark the ground. If no one knew the area, there was equipment to find the wires and mark them properly. This way, when the people who were digging showed up, they knew where NOT to dig.

Re:Dear gods, its just an optical cable! (5, Informative)

Ender_Stonebender (60900) | more than 9 years ago | (#10845205)

I live in Pinellas county, Florida, which happens to be one county over from Hillsborough. The problem is not FTTP installation, it's the fact that the water table is about two feet below the ground, resulting in every underground conduit being stuck in that two-foot space, and shitty as-built documentation. No one here has a basement because if they did, the only thing you could keep in it would be alligators. They run into the same things trying to install natural gas pipelines.

--Ender

Not on my premises, thank you.... (5, Funny)

kngthdn (820601) | more than 9 years ago | (#10844994)

Verizon: Delivering the wrong sort of fiber.

raw sewage.. (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#10845004)

eh, it's a small price to pay for high speed internet :) I'll take 2.

"until installation is safer" (5, Funny)

codergeek42 (792304) | more than 9 years ago | (#10845005)

thank God! We didn't want Joe Q Public running their own unpatched IIS servers, did we?

Easy solution! (2, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#10845006)

figure out how to stop creating sinkholes that open up under minivans with children inside.

Well that's easy, drive your kids around in a different type of car, like an SUV.. problem solved!

Re:Easy solution! (1)

BJZQ8 (644168) | more than 9 years ago | (#10845159)

Won't someone please think of the children?

My question is... (4, Funny)

schon (31600) | more than 9 years ago | (#10845197)

sinkholes that open up under minivans with children inside

How exactly does one engineer a sinkhole that knows whether or not there are children inside a minivan?

Ye gads - intelligent sinkholes!

Cue the "new sinkhole overlords" jokes. :o)

WTF? (0, Offtopic)

Junior J. Junior III (192702) | more than 9 years ago | (#10845008)

How is one causing the other? What's fiber got to do with sinkholes and sewage?

Re:WTF? (1)

millahtime (710421) | more than 9 years ago | (#10845075)

It's more of the people they have installing the fiber. What kind of workers do they hire? I sure hope the HR department there gets a lot of shit for hiring these morons.

Re:WTF? (1)

jav1231 (539129) | more than 9 years ago | (#10845085)

Exactly! Sinkholes are cause by water table drops or drainage issues under ground. How far are these guys burying this stuff?

Re:WTF? (1)

DigitalRaptor (815681) | more than 9 years ago | (#10845203)

Drainage issues such as breaking a water pipe that quickly washes away the dirt under the asphault resulting in the collapse of the asphault?

Charter was just brought to my rural neighborhood and when they ran it past my house they installed a junction box, backfilled, then drove a 1/2 inch copper grounding line right through the water main, skewering it and flooding 3 different yards and disrupting water service to about 400 houses.

Re:WTF? (1)

AyeRoxor! (471669) | more than 9 years ago | (#10845237)

Exactly! Sinkholes are cause by water table drops or drainage issues under ground. How far are these guys burying this stuff?

Seeing as most of florida is mere feet above sea level, in many places you don't have to dig too deeply. Many places can't get buried gas pipelines because of the buoyancy of the gas in the pipes. Also explains the lack of basements. If you dig a hole, water will take that as an invitation.

Re:WTF? (1)

shawn(at)fsu (447153) | more than 9 years ago | (#10845241)

Fl, where I am from has a water table that is really close to the ground, we got sink holes all the time.
But that is unrelated to TFA, they say that they hit water mains.

In either case you don't have to dig to far to hit water.

Re:WTF? (3, Informative)

SEWilco (27983) | more than 9 years ago | (#10845145)

What's fiber got to do with sinkholes and sewage?

More fiber causes more sewage?
More fiber delivers more spam?
More fiber sucks away more time?

Actually, the fiber is being installed underground. When the drilling punctures a water or sewer line, the leaking liquid can cause problems several ways. A puddle of sewage on the surface has several undesirable characteristics. Water or sewage leaking through earth can dissolve various materials and carry them away, creating a space. If this space is on the surface and small, it is a pothole. If this space is under the surface, when the unsupported earth above collapses that is called a sinkhole.

Sinkholes come in various sizes, and since the surface layer and "rock" supporting much of Florida can be dissolved fairly easily, large sinkholes can be created all too easily. A small sinkhole which collapses under a car can cause several dramatic situations.

Re:WTF? (5, Informative)

kovarg (591527) | more than 9 years ago | (#10845209)

I'm local to Hillsborough and all day we've been hearing about this stoppage. Sinkholes are a buzz word because they are a (forgive the pun) a money pit for insurance companies. Potholes, ditches and everything else where the ground is unlevel can be dubbed as sinkholes. That is not to say we don't have sinkholes, but nowhere near as many as are reported. It is a large enough problem that some zip codes are blocked out of renters insurance due to sinkhole problems, but Verizon hasn't been running around and draining pockets of the water table. The real headline should be: Verizon has morons digging trenches.

Re:WTF? (1)

shawn(at)fsu (447153) | more than 9 years ago | (#10845210)

I love when people ask questions that make it blindingly obvious they didn't' RTFA.
If you want to know stop being lazy and RTFA.

And I always wondered how my teacher could tell I didn't read the assignment...

Is that all it takes? (4, Funny)

raider_red (156642) | more than 9 years ago | (#10845010)

I've had all that happen at my house, and I still don't have fiber! That just isn't fair.

Re:Is that all it takes? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#10845216)

No, they have to knock over the 40 ft. light poles in your vicinity by backing into it with a truck at 0.5 MPH.

(Happened in our neighborhood on two separate occasions - I think the light poles were hollow concrete. Sounded funny as hell when it landed, though.)

bah (3, Funny)

nomadic (141991) | more than 9 years ago | (#10845014)

until they can figure out how to stop creating sinkholes that open up under minivans with children inside.

Luddites.

Re:bah (0, Offtopic)

Thumpnugget (142707) | more than 9 years ago | (#10845091)

Request to moderators: Mod down anyone who says "I know I'll be modded down for this."

I know I'll be modded down for this.

Wow, thats crazy (1)

Zanek (546281) | more than 9 years ago | (#10845018)

I suspect this will be happening alot more considering all the digging they will be doing .
Perhaps one day they can lay the fiber over the telephone lines (since everyone needs those) and
avoid all the digging up (though there might be alot of interference).

Re:Wow, thats crazy (1)

Skye16 (685048) | more than 9 years ago | (#10845068)

I don't understand how an electrical current is going to affect light...

Re:Wow, thats crazy (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#10845092)

no there wont be any perceptible interference caused by electrical inductance on the fiber at all. It's a non issue.

Re:Wow, thats crazy (1)

redphive (175243) | more than 9 years ago | (#10845117)

The whole point of laying FTTP is to get rid of the phone lines and enable them to offer a broader spectrum of services (voice/video/data/beer on tap)

Re:Wow, thats crazy (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#10845126)

well, you still want to keep your regualr old copper pots line, ads backup in case your fibre conenction goes down. (not to mention a power outage and your fibre modem dies)

Re:Wow, thats crazy (1)

Kordmp (731261) | more than 9 years ago | (#10845200)

The trend is to move away from copper. People use cell phones more and more as there primary phone. If the power goes out you still have a phone. The pots lines are no longer really needed. And if it comes to 911 most phones have gps in them and since I believe it is mandated that all have them by the next year or two, I believe the plan is when you dial 911 they know instantly where you are from your gps coord.

Re:Wow, thats crazy (1)

lordsilence (682367) | more than 9 years ago | (#10845155)

Ugh.. fibre along airborn telephone lines?
I doubt this would be a viable solution. Not here in sweden at least. There's a reason why you put things underground.

With interference, did you mayhaps mean electornic interference or pure bruteforce? You know, fibre is probably the kind of cabling least suspectable for interferance from electrical devices or cabling.

However, brute force is another matter.. it's hell of a lot more expensive to repair fibre then telephone-lines or powerlines.

Everyear, thousands of incidents with trees falling over telephonelines and other problems. It's expensive enough as it is with telephone, but adding fibre to it..

Re:Wow, thats crazy (2, Informative)

j0shwalk3r (782780) | more than 9 years ago | (#10845184)

Fiber is not affected by electrical interference, as it is an optical transmission. This isn't a bad idea, outside the fact that the point of the fiber is so people don't need phone lines.

The reason they can't just go over phone lines is most likely that phone lines are burried shollow and unprotected. Whereas the fiber would most likely buried deeper in a protective conduit. So to burry over the phone line would require burrying under the phone line.

Low Bid Contractors (5, Funny)

ackthpt (218170) | more than 9 years ago | (#10845025)

Verizon's getting their money's worth.

next on news 10, more sh!t than usual with your internet connection...

Re:Low Bid Contractors (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#10845112)

Agreed,

Having worked as a contractor in thier development group, I can only guess that they are getting the absolute lowest cost contractors and cutting every corner in the book .. just as they did in IT ..

Wow (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#10845028)

Reminds me of the streets of a city I used to live in: Spokane, WA, USA. Watch out for those potholes! I tell you, the wheel alignment business there is thriving.

Ground penetrating radar? (1, Insightful)

FiReaNGeL (312636) | more than 9 years ago | (#10845030)

"Verizon also is looking at other means, including using ground-penetrating radar and other technology, to locate lines before crews dig."

Don't they have maps to locate lines, sewers and such? Don't tell me they're digging blindly...

"County auditors examine the cause of each break and determine whether Verizon or water department officials are to blame. The responsible party is billed, said Rich Cummings, section manager for line maintenance for the water department."

It seem that Verizon will be paying the bill in the end anyway... of course, you can't pay for all the trouble it cause to citizens... can't they be careful?

Re:Ground penetrating radar? (1)

CdBee (742846) | more than 9 years ago | (#10845108)

Rich Cummings has a mildly amusing name for someone who makes a living providing sewerage services...

Re:Ground penetrating radar? (1)

Hyecee (809818) | more than 9 years ago | (#10845156)

In Virginia they have a service [missutilit...rginia.com] that will come out, for free, and mark every underground pipe and cable before you dig. If I understand it right, I think it's even illegal to do ANY digging unless you call them first.

Re:Ground penetrating radar? (1)

Soporific (595477) | more than 9 years ago | (#10845242)

I'm surprised no one has been lit up by a live wire yet.

~S

What's the big deal? (1)

R005G (239995) | more than 9 years ago | (#10845031)

I knew lots of nerds who never made full use of their water service. This just gives them an excuse not to take a shower.

Call Miss Utility (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#10845037)

Don't they have a Miss Utility http://www.missutilityofvirginia.com/ down there?

Installation (1)

RandoX (828285) | more than 9 years ago | (#10845046)

Am I the only one that took a second to make the leap from software to hardware when I hear the word 'installation'?

Re:Installation (1)

thebra (707939) | more than 9 years ago | (#10845097)

Yes

DigSafe (4, Informative)

syphax (189065) | more than 9 years ago | (#10845048)

It's called DigSafe [digsafe.com] . I just learned this is a New England (sans CT) thing- what the hell do the rest of you do?

These guys have scoped out my lot two times in the past month, due to the start of a new addition, an (unrelated) emergency oil cleanup...

Re:DigSafe (1)

christopher240240 (633932) | more than 9 years ago | (#10845111)

In Illinois, we call JULIE [illinois1call.com] before we dig.

Re:DigSafe (1)

nelsonen (126144) | more than 9 years ago | (#10845120)

DigSafe is only as good as the maps it depends on. And the water department in this article did admit "some" of its maps may be inaccurate.

Re:DigSafe (1)

matth1jd (823437) | more than 9 years ago | (#10845134)

We have MISS DIG [missdig.org] here in Michigan. They mark utility lines for free as long as you call in advance. I'm assuming they mark all your utility lines: sewer, electrical (if below ground), and telephone. It seems like other state's (regions) would have something similiar to DigSafe or Miss Dig, or is this just a case of bone head sub contractors?

Re:DigSafe (1)

BrianGa (536442) | more than 9 years ago | (#10845171)

It's the law [njua.org] here in NJ

Re:DigSafe (1)

b0bby (201198) | more than 9 years ago | (#10845211)

Around DC, it's Miss Utility.

DigSafe isn't perfect (1)

crow (16139) | more than 9 years ago | (#10845225)

Despite DigSafe, there was a major gas leak this summer during road construction near my work (I think it was related to installing a traffic light). I belive that the conclusion was that the gas main wasn't exactly where the records showed it. I've heard of other similar problems.

And when you're dealing with infrastructure that may a hundred years old, there simply aren't accurate records indicating where the pipes are.

Expected outcome (5, Funny)

GillBates0 (664202) | more than 9 years ago | (#10845051)

It's well known that fiber "bulks up" waste and moves it through the colon more rapidly, preventing constipation and leading to larger, softer stools.

Large scale deployment of fiber is quite likely to lead to "geysers of raw sewage" if not properly contained.

Re:Expected outcome (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#10845179)

[offtopic]
Only insoluble fiber poses such a risk, because it stimulates the intestines. However, soluble fiber aids both diarrhea and constipation: for diarrhea it bulks up watery stools into a more solid, gel-like substance, preventing overrapid progression through the intestines. This is also good for constipation as it acts akin to a lubricant, preventing stools from moving too slow.

For anyone with IBS I strongly recommend a diet high in soluble fiber and low in insoluable fiber. It has aided me remarkably.
[/offtopic]

(yes, I know you were making a joke!)

New Ads (4, Funny)

SWroclawski (95770) | more than 9 years ago | (#10845053)

Verizon Fiber - Catch The Wave!

Sinkholes---/. (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#10845054)

/. sinkhole just swallowed up the video server!

Stupid News (1, Insightful)

OverlordQ (264228) | more than 9 years ago | (#10845055)

The only reason this is news is beacuse it involves FTTP. ANd it's not even Verizon's fault, it's the subcontractors.

Re:Stupid News (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#10845110)

How is it not Verizon's fault it's THEIR subcontractors ??!! They are still COMPLETELY responsible.

Re:Stupid News (1)

Vellmont (569020) | more than 9 years ago | (#10845127)


ANd it's not even Verizon's fault, it's the subcontractors.


If you're the one funding all the damage, you're also the one that should take part of the blame. It's Verizon's responsibility to hire competent people to dig. Blaming everything on the sub-contractors is beside the point, since Verizon is the one who hired these clowns.

HEY! (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#10845063)

HEY! Fuck you ya african porch-monkey spear-chuckin watermelon seed-spittin moon cricket nigger!

iiiiiiiiiiiiiim a nigger hes a nigger shes a nigger we some niggers wouldnt you like to be a nigger too?

i am black what color are you.. i got big lips and a napy head too.. all this grease runnin down my nose.. i snort cocaine thru a firehose.. werd ep

bring it on... (4, Funny)

revery (456516) | more than 9 years ago | (#10845065)

has ordered Verizon to stop deployment of FTTP until they can figure out how to stop creating sinkholes that open up under minivans with children inside.

For access to reasonably priced, unmetered high-speed internet access, minivan swallowing sinkholes is an evil that I am perfectly willing to face.

--

Was it the sheep climbing onto the altar, or the cattle lowing to be slain,
or the Son of God hanging dead and bloodied on a cross that told me this was a world condemned, but loved and bought with blood.

The real cause (2, Funny)

Artie_Effim (700781) | more than 9 years ago | (#10845066)

The real cause of these events, as yet unobserved, can only be the Devil. You see, about 6 years ago, the Great Destroyer attempted to get DSL installed in his humble abode, told that he was more that 5000m from a C.O. His wrath is just now becomming clear as the Horned Goat himself is now eating up babies.

local geology (2, Insightful)

s4m7 (519684) | more than 9 years ago | (#10845073)

Maybe I'm missing the point here, but don't they have these problems with any kind of underground infrastructural deployments in certain areas? I thought this has more to do with geology than with contractor ineptitude.

Ok, hitting sewer lines is bad, but in theory, before any dig, the local utilites (including sanitation) would come and mark the ground so that this wouldn't happen. But sinkholes? Aren't those things opening up all over Florida all the time anyway? I thought it had to do with the geological makeup of the soil in the area and the lack of firm bedrock, more than bad digging. Not that digging wouldn't exacerbate the problem.

Seems to me the county wouldn't have much room to complain if they hadn't accurately marked underground lines before digging begins, as is usually the law (in every place i've lived anyway.) Also seems like if they did do this, then Verizon's contractors got some 'splainin to do.

Re:local geology (1)

rebelcool (247749) | more than 9 years ago | (#10845214)

Sinkholes are commonly caused by water seepage - say if you break a water main and wash away the sand beneath the surface, you can open up a big ass hole in the ground.

Florida is prone to sinkholes, but breaking water pipes all over the place exacerbates the problem.

Theres really no excuse for this kind of shoddy workmanship. Some contractor must've really low-balled the bid and probably hired some illegal day laborers or other unskilled workers to carry it out. (pure speculation of course)

And at least they didnt break gas lines.

Re:local geology (1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#10845231)

They come out and mark, but that doesn't mean the people that are digging are going to be responsible. Last year there was a road crew putting in new sewer lines in the Westport area of St. Louis. Everything was marked out, but rather than digging the last few inches of dirt/rock with a shovel, they used a back hoe for the closeup work. Needless to say, they ruptured the natural gas and/or the water main almost every day.

huh? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#10845074)

Americans haven't figured out how to lay duct work under their streets? Or is this at the sub's premise? how deep do you have to dig a line to put in a fiber drop? Its not like its dangerous to hit a fiber when digging.

Maybe they should have the utility mark where they are supposed to dig like everyone else does?

Where's the story here/ enough senationalism.

HTTP installation?!? (1, Interesting)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#10845083)

Anyone else read this headline as "Fl. County Halts HTTP Until Installation Is Safer"?


I mean, viruses and email scams are dangerous and all, but there's really no reason to panic.


-HJ

Re:HTTP installation?!? (1)

thebra (707939) | more than 9 years ago | (#10845136)

No

What does this have to do with fiber, exactly? (1)

realdpk (116490) | more than 9 years ago | (#10845088)

Perhaps the submitter could come back and let us know what this has to do with fiber? That'd be great. Otherwise, perhaps we could have some editors remove the sensationalization. It's not like this is the first time a utility company has ever busted up another utilities equipment -- search for NANOG and backhoe on google, for example.

Topic not entirely accurate (1)

Zanek (546281) | more than 9 years ago | (#10845093)

The poster implies Verizon created sinkholes by not filling the holes correctly, but if you read the
article, its really just incompentent employees of Verizon who broke pipes:

Crotty discovered that contractors for Verizon had broken a sewer pipe.
If they had an idea of where the pipes were, maybe they could dig around them and not burst them (Assuming they dont have plans)!

Industry slowdown. (1)

suso (153703) | more than 9 years ago | (#10845100)

Since the logic of this doesn't make much since, it is easy to speculate that large companies are saying this as a tactic to milk people for all they can at a certain speed and all the ones inbetween DSL speed s and fiber to the house. Typical corporate consumer upgrade strategy.

That's why... (3, Informative)

Meostro (788797) | more than 9 years ago | (#10845102)

... we have something called Miss Utility [missutility.net] in the MD/VA/DC/DE area. Each member utility is notified and marks their pipes/wires/whatnot, and then you're not at fault if you bust something that wasn't marked.

Generally, some fella with a metal detector comes strolling through, putting a bunch of fluorescent orange paint stripes on the ground to indicate the general direction/location of underground wires.

We've only ever had cable/power/tv lines marked on our property, and nothing's been damaged during two septic tank repairs, one new well and two additions. I guess PVC would be a little harder, but this is absolutely ridiculous!

I wonder how many Verizon lines have been disrupted as a result of these guys?

Verizon should have put fiber here. (1)

LWATCDR (28044) | more than 9 years ago | (#10845105)

The city just laid new water lines where I live and is putting them in all over the place. They should have run fiber at the same time :(

First computers. Next up, humans! (2, Funny)

TimmyDee (713324) | more than 9 years ago | (#10845122)

As if the internet infecting your computer wasn't enough, Verizon is working on a way to infect you.

Used to work for Verizon... (1, Interesting)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#10845131)

I used to work as a contractor for Verizon (VZ) in the Tampa area for a short time. Do note that to VZ, a Pentium II with 64 MB of ram is considered 'top of the line' to them, so go knows what kind of equipment they are using in the field for keeping track of what fiber is going where.

And now they are doing fiber to the home? Hell, the DSL was slow to begin with when they started with homes and businesses. Can't wait to see what the 'promise' and what they actually deliver. Forget about SLA's... they never heard of them.

Big Government (0, Offtopic)

ValuJet (587148) | more than 9 years ago | (#10845133)

When will big government stop interfering with the private sector?

A Better Network (1)

maokh (781515) | more than 9 years ago | (#10845144)

Oh well, downloading porn at 100Mbps is worth a few thousand gallons of sewage in my yard. Hopefully I can also total one of my cars in a sinkhole, because im just going to get nailed on trade-in anyway.

Wisdom sorely lacking (2, Interesting)

Helpadingoatemybaby (629248) | more than 9 years ago | (#10845147)

Why on Earth are they digging trenches that might open sewer lines, might hit power lines, might hit water lines when the wise man would get a contract with the city and run the fiber through the water line itself.

It would be far faster, it would be far cheaper than digging trenches, and it would be fair easier to pop a fitting inside the house to extract the fiber from the incoming pipe than digging an entire trench!

They have knowledge but they don't have wisdom.

Just Wait... (1)

mogrify (828588) | more than 9 years ago | (#10845152)

Just wait until the Verizon sinkholes start swallowing cable TV vans on their way to service appointments. Or maybe that's why they can't hit an 8 hour time frame for showing up at my house?

Can we... (1)

jd (1658) | more than 9 years ago | (#10845163)

...have Verizon install FTTP to Congress, the White House, ... ? :)


Seriously, this reminds me of a news story in recent weeks where a company installing cable managed to break open a gas line. Incinerated the workforce and a passerby.


What is it with negligence and installation, these days? There's no shortage of people you can call to check if there's something nearby you need to avoid. If you prefer to do the job yourself, you can always hire a ground-penetrating radar [rackspace.com] .


(Given that it's cheaper to rent one of those toys than to replace a house or pay families compensation for deaths through negligence, it wouldn't be such a bad idea for companies to use these as standard.)


Given how much cost-cutting and corner-cutting that companies almost have to do, to stay competitive and profitable, I expect this problem to get worse, as the information demands make upgrading copper to fibre increasingly necessary.

What kind of speeds are we talking about? (5, Funny)

heldlikesound (132717) | more than 9 years ago | (#10845165)

Because if I can crawl out of a sewage filed sinkhole and download new Slackware ISO's in under a minute, you may have yourself a deal.

Good riddance (3, Funny)

DaFallus (805248) | more than 9 years ago | (#10845176)

until they can figure out how to stop creating sinkholes that open up under minivans with children inside.

Good, killing two birds with one stone. I thank Verizon for helping remove more soccer-mom-driven minivans from the road. And as for the children... maybe now I can go seen a R rated movie without having some kid crying up and down the isles.

IN SOVIET RUSSIA (-1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#10845183)

FTTP halts YOU!

I Don't See The problem (1)

vjmurphy (190266) | more than 9 years ago | (#10845188)

"they can figure out how to stop creating sinkholes that open up under minivans with children inside."

I think I'd pay extra to have this happen in my neighborhood. Where do I sign up?

The best part of the article ... (1)

OWJones (11633) | more than 9 years ago | (#10845190)

County workers broke the water line at Lakeview and North Dale Mabry while trying to repair a break in a sewer line caused by Verizon contractors on Friday. That break left sewage spewing beneath the road, opening a hole that nearly swallowed a car.

Whoops. :) Way to go there, guys.

-jdm

Damn contractors... (1)

scribblej (195445) | more than 9 years ago | (#10845218)

Call JULIE before you dig!

6:00 news story (1)

IamGarageGuy 2 (687655) | more than 9 years ago | (#10845236)

C'mon now, sh*t happens. If you are going to dig up the road, things are going to break fromthe old infrastructure. It's a good story for the 6:00 news, but things like this are going to happen anyway. It's only because the name Verizon is involved and they get footage of a car in a hole, that this is newsworthy.

only in fla (1)

dextr0us (565556) | more than 9 years ago | (#10845239)

Only in florida would people not study the problem with sinkholes in the first place. As if the billboards everywhere saying "lost your home in a sinkhole?" didn't let verizon know that they should do better groundwork checking.

At least it was in hillsborough county, and not polk county. In polk, sinkholes are such a problem a city called winterhaven claims "land of 1000 lakes." You know where those lakes came from? You guessed it, Sinkholes. Everywhere.
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