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Examining Bittorrent

michael posted more than 9 years ago | from the systemic-problem dept.

Software 451

ToyKeeper and other wrote in with this: "The Register published a detailed analysis of BitTorrent traffic and user habits today, focusing on four aspects: availability, integrity, download speeds, and ability to withstand flash crowds. BitTorrent carries 53% of all P2P traffic (or ~35% of all 'net traffic), and this paper helps explain why. Also included are data about torrent lifetime, network poisoning, response during downtime or attacks, and lots of pretty charts. A few performance problems are revealed, which will hopefully be addressed in future p2p systems." The original paper (pdf) is available.

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Gimme, gimme, gimme (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#11126871)

Gimme an FP!

-DT

Re:Gimme, gimme, gimme (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#11126917)

Now THAT is a pretty good FP. Bravo!

FP (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#11126872)

WOO HOO
Microsoft sucks!!!

I work for.. (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#11126877)

Two words - avoid BitTorrent. HUGE investigations are going on to bust bittorrent users.

Hammer revolution (1)

hammer revolution (836067) | more than 9 years ago | (#11126887)

--;

The hammer revolution has begun.

--;

Re:Hammer revolution (1)

josmum (828708) | more than 9 years ago | (#11126938)

What about the phallus revolution? I want a revolving cock shafted into me by a man with big eyebrows. It might hurt but it'll be worth it.

Re:I work for.. (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#11126888)

I concur.

It's always started in Finland and Sweden.

These are the test cases. If people get convicted, you can say goodbye to all the trackers AND people who've used them...

I think Michael must work for The Register. (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#11126899)

Or at least they pay him for links from Slashdot. And Roland. And Engadget.

What a wanker Sims is.

What about investigations on violent criminals? (1, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#11126916)

Are those being phased out as unimportant?

I WROTE THE PARENT MESSAGE, and this is to you.. (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#11126933)

WHY WON'T YOU LISTEN TO ME?? I wrote the parent message and this is to all of you who replied. I want to help you out, that's why I said 'avoid BitTorrent' right now. I wanted to help you, that's all! I'm a fellow geek.

Re:I WROTE THE PARENT MESSAGE, and this is to you. (2, Insightful)

calidoscope (312571) | more than 9 years ago | (#11126952)

Take a chill pill...

Now would be a good time to put as much legitimate traffic (e.g. Linux distro's) as possible to make the case that Bit Torrent has legitimate use.

Re:I WROTE THE PARENT MESSAGE, and this is to you. (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#11126961)

You know very well that I wasn't talking about the legitimate traffic.

Re:I WROTE THE PARENT MESSAGE, and this is to you. (1)

tomhudson (43916) | more than 9 years ago | (#11127002)

... not to me, that's for sure. The courts have ruled that downloading music is legal in my country. We pay a levee on blank CDs, cassettes, etc., that gets handed to the music industry to compensate them.

Re:I WROTE THE PARENT MESSAGE, and this is to you. (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#11127003)

Legitimate use is another case. But you wouldn't want to be the one who got busted, right? MPAA took down finreactor in Finland.

Re:I work for.. (1)

mowler2 (301294) | more than 9 years ago | (#11126949)

There are several tens of millions of bittorrent users. I cannot see that they all are going to get sued.

Re:I work for.. (1)

Baki (72515) | more than 9 years ago | (#11127046)

Hmm, locking that many away would be a great way to create an instant revolution, destroying all greedy and corrupt multinationals and lobby groups (who are corrupting democracy by buing laws and politicians).

Let them try it, it will return at them like a boomerang.

Re:I work for.. (1)

PasteEater (590893) | more than 9 years ago | (#11127120)

You're right, but they don't have to sue everyone. They can just sue a few people to try to scare the rest of us.

The RIAA and MPAA have been doing it for years. You can see that their tactics are working because no one is using P2P, right?

Re:I work for.. (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#11126994)

So what? 70% of all net traffic is P2P. This means dozens of millions of people are doing it. You are more likely to be struck by lightning than to be among the miniscule fraction of P2P users who actually get caught.

Re:I work for.. (3, Interesting)

Zebbers (134389) | more than 9 years ago | (#11127041)

You work for....a company who is going to drag people into court and force them to settle under its mighty legal fund?

Wow. Not really impressive. So-called "piracy" and more importantly, the RIAA's and MPAA's tactics are getting more and more press. To date, I know of few cases of people being busted. Sued civilly by greedy and useless corporations, sure. But not busted.

I cannot wait until I am done with law school and can contribute, knowledgeably, to the defense of such bullshit and hopefully the creation of more realistic and fair and beneficial laws. This artificial IP shit is harming the American consumer more than ever.

Mod parent -1, misleading (3, Interesting)

Ghostgate (800445) | more than 9 years ago | (#11127069)

Whether or not there are any investigations against BitTorrent USERS for trading illegal files (of which there is no evidence at all yet... there is only evidence of them going after tracker sites, which makes much more sense anyway), that does not mean you avoid BitTorrent completely. That's the whole point of P2P. It has uses that are legit, and uses that aren't. By all means, keep using BitTorrent for legit uses anytime you want.

To me, the parent sounds more like someone who is actually trying to scare people away in general, not someone trying to be helpful.

35% (4, Interesting)

mistersooreams (811324) | more than 9 years ago | (#11126889)

35% of all 'net traffic

That's enormous!

I guess this proves that BitTorrent is the perfect vector for the largest files, be they Linux distros or movies (public-domain movies, of course). As the article says, BitTorrent is not perfect and will probably be surpassed in the future. But the fact that 35% of all 'net traffic is being carried by one program is simple awesome, and a great credit to BitTorrent's creators.

Also, with such a volume of traffic, surely it would be impossible for an **AA sniffer to track it all? Or at least, your chances of being caught and sued are pathetic small.

All of this is great news for BitTorrent. Long may it continue!

It's you who are to blame (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#11126914)

be they Linux distros or movies (public-domain movies, of course).

Yeah, right. Only an insignificant fraction of torrent traffic is legit. You really think that the scheme will remain legal because of these few users?

BitTorrent and the likes will be shut down in 2005. Mark my words. Since most of the traffic I see (I am an admin) is illegal, I'll shed no tears. It's you who violate copyrights who are to blame for the crackdown and the eventual clampdown on the internet - not RIAA, MPAA or any other corporation.

Re:It's you who are to blame (5, Insightful)

Porn Whitelist (838671) | more than 9 years ago | (#11126951)

Poster wrote:
Yeah, right. Only an insignificant fraction of torrent traffic is legit. You really think that the scheme will remain legal because of these few users?
That's all it takes - see the Betamax decision. However, you might also want to take a look at the stats (below) for why people get high-speed internet.

... again ...

BitTorrent and the likes will be shut down in 2005. Mark my words. Since most of the traffic I see (I am an admin) is illegal, I'll shed no tears. It's you who violate copyrights who are to blame for the crackdown and the eventual clampdown on the internet - not RIAA, MPAA or any other corporation.
How are we supposed to "mark your words" when you post as an AC? Also, you seem to think that downloading music is illegal everywhere, when it's not. Not everyone lives in the US of BushCo. Also, the servers holding the torrent files are not breaking any laws.

From the article:

A few performance problems are revealed, which will hopefully be addressed in future p2p systems.
Well, since, according to El Reg http://www.theregister.co.uk/2004/12/08/brit_net_f ilth/ [theregister.co.uk] One in four Brits on net for Porn, there's a demand for "clittorrent".

The stats:

According to a survey conducted by British ISP Homecall, 23 per cent of Britons are getting broadband for the porn, and it's by far the most important factor in getting wired. 12 per cent cited access to music videos, 8 per cent access to movie trailers, and a gratifying 9 per cent for radio, which is undergoing a renaissance in the UK. Sometimes new media can be the best thing to happen to old media.
All the above are LEGAL.

Re:It's you who are to blame (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#11126982)

That's all it takes - see the Betamax decision.

Which will be overturned - no doubt about it. It's really not valid in the digital age and given the increasing power of corporations there's no chance in hell that it will prevail. Again, I don't see why anyone should have any problems with this. How hard is it to pay for your media?

Also, the servers holding the torrent files are not breaking any laws.

That's what these people [theregister.co.uk] thought. Well, wake up and smell the coffee. It's not legal.

I don't quite understand why you bring the porn into this. As far as porn, or any media, goes trading it is fine and dandy - as long as the copyright owner agrees to it. Trading music CDs and videos/movies is, in most cases, illegal.

Re:It's you who are to blame (1)

tomhudson (43916) | more than 9 years ago | (#11127022)

Nice try, shill.

No convictions in the link you pointed to. Unless you, like the **AA, like the concept of "guilty until proven innocent".

It's not possible to overturn the Betamax decision - there is no legal ground for doing so.

The only thing that can be done is to pass legislation making it illegal - and all that will do is make owning any home computer, and any other device capable of making copies, illegal. It would also make printers and photocopiers controlled devices, as they are also capable of making illegal copies.

And, since bittorrent is a distribution system, you would have to make any system that allows for illegal distribution of copyrighted material illegal. So much for email, and your local postal service.

Re:It's you who are to blame (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#11127058)

Nice ad hominem...

It's kind of telling that you didn't even bother commenting on my question: "how hard is it to pay for your media?"

You just want it all for free, don't you?

Re:It's you who are to blame (1)

Porn Whitelist (838671) | more than 9 years ago | (#11127110)

Nice ad hominem...
Thank you, but I'm just repeating what others have noticed about you. Posting anonymously. Posting what are clearly lies (cf. the Betamax decision, misquoting the Reg to make it look like people have been convicted when none have, confusing the torrent file with the target file, and otherwise toeing the **AA party line). Sounds like a shill to me.
It's kind of telling that you didn't even bother commenting on my question: "how hard is it to pay for your media?"
Because it doesn't apply to me. I pay for all my media. Blank media. On which there is a levy that goes to the music industry to compensate them for my use of their music.

It's the same solution you guys should use - work with the technology instead of against it.

Re:It's you who are to blame (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#11127063)

It's not legal.

Who gives a damn? Since when does that make it wrong??? And don't tell me about changing the law. I can't afford to buy a congressman yet. A cop maybe...

So violating GPL or BSD-licence is OK too? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#11127090)

So you think violating a content producer's copyright is OK? Ok, let's start violating GPL as well... let's see how you like that. It's all about applying the copyright law.

Re:It's you who are to blame (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#11126992)

> see the Betamax decision

Which was "Congress has not made this illegal ...", not that you have the constitutional right to copy stuff.

Re:It's you who are to blame (1)

Porn Whitelist (838671) | more than 9 years ago | (#11127055)

> see the Betamax decision

Which was "Congress has not made this illegal ...", not that you have the constitutional right to copy stuff.
The Betamax decision, along with fair use, gives you the right to use a VCR to time-shift copyrighted materials.

And, yes, I DO have a constitutional right to copy music off the net - it just happens that MY country's constitution is not the same as yours.

Re:It's you who are to blame (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#11127123)

The point was that congress could abridge this "right" at anytime. Sorry you have trouble understanding this.

Re:It's you who are to blame (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#11127084)

The constitution doesn't have to spell out existing rights. We have lots of rights that aren't mentioned in the constitution. I do have and am perfectly willing to exercise my right to copy anything I damn well please. So you, troll, can go to hell.

It's you who are to blame-Soverign decisions. (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#11127017)

Um...what does the Betamax decision have to do with foreign downloaders? And since you're invoking foreign nation status. Your country may view trackers as illegal, even if the US doesn't.

Re:It's you who are to blame-Soverign decisions. (1)

Porn Whitelist (838671) | more than 9 years ago | (#11127072)

The trackers themselves are legal. The site you pointed to in the Reg article was hosting the files themselves, not just the trackers - not the same thing.

The trackers themselves contain no copyrighted material, just pointers to the shared file, just as a link to copyrighted material on a web page is not itself an infringement of copyright.

You really need to brush up on the technology involved, and learn the difference between a tracker, the shared file, etc., because right now, you come off as being, shall we say, uninformed.

It's you who are to blame-Soverign decisions-II (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#11127118)

"The trackers themselves are legal."

In what countries?

"The site you pointed to in the Reg article was hosting the files themselves, not just the trackers - not the same thing."

I didn't point to anything.

"The trackers themselves contain no copyrighted material, just pointers to the shared file, just as a link to copyrighted material on a web page is not itself an infringement of copyright."

What countries copyright law?

"You really need to brush up on the technology involved, and learn the difference between a tracker, the shared file, etc., because right now, you come off as being, shall we say, uninformed."

Not as much as someone who assumes that all AC's are alike.

Re:It's you who are to blame (1)

cpt kangarooski (3773) | more than 9 years ago | (#11127068)

That's all it takes - see the Betamax decision.

Well, actually it only requires that the technology be capable of substantial non-infringing uses. It doesn't matter if no one actually engages in them, though it's always easier to make the case if you have examples to point to.

Also, the servers holding the torrent files are not breaking any laws.

No, they probably are. If they're in the US, they're pretty likely contributory and/or vicarious infringers, though much depends on the specific facts involved. While you're not mistakenly reading Sony too narrowly, you need to not read it too broadly either. I suggest also reading the Napster decision.

Re:It's you who are to blame MOD PARENT SHILL -1 (-1, Troll)

Nom du Keyboard (633989) | more than 9 years ago | (#11126953)

It's you who violate copyrights who are to blame for the crackdown and the eventual clampdown on the internet

Mod this one: Shill -1.

MOD PARENT +5 - GOOD SLASHBOT (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#11126993)

Mod this one: Shill -1.

Yeah. Don't like the message - shoot the messenger.

Good slashbot, good slasbot...

Religious nut (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#11127034)

Banning all religious displays "establishes" Atheism, an unfounded belief in the lack of any higher power.

Where do stupid people like you breed?

What color hair to bald people have on their heads? If that sounds like a nonsensical question, congratulations! Well, it is nonsense. If you're bald, there is no hair on your head and, therefore, no head-hair to have any color. Atheism is just as much an belief as "believing" that a bald person has no hair color.

Bittorrent shut down?! Right. (1)

Chordonblue (585047) | more than 9 years ago | (#11127048)

So they'll be shutting down ports 25, 80, and 21 also? Only the method used to communicate the data is different, the end result is the same...

Of course it can be shut down (-1, Flamebait)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#11127074)

Uh. No.

They judge it by the volume of your traffic. It won't even matter if it's all encrypted. For instance, in the case of a legit user, a port 80 will never transfer gigabytes of data per day.

That's how it's done at our university anyway. Unless you can somehow demonstrate that you have legitimate reasons for ports 80 or 25 transfering such volumes of data, it's no go.

As far as any other ports go, you block them by default and make users to apply for privileged open port while citing a good and verifiable reason.

Re:It's you who are to blame (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#11127031)

...the crackdown and the eventual clampdown on the internet...

As the man said, "Bring it on." It's time for us to clampdown on copyright. Let's see what happens when they have awakened that other "sleeping giant" called "the rest of the world". Damn troll.

Re:It's you who are to blame (5, Insightful)

lheal (86013) | more than 9 years ago | (#11127085)

  • Yeah, right. Only an insignificant fraction of torrent traffic is legit.

Yup. All it takes is any.

The legal principal is this: if the {object, device, chemical, drug} has a purpose for which it is legal, then the thing should be legal.

The exceptions to this (guns, marijuana, and other things we've allowed to be banned) prove the rule. The pressure to legalize or ban something evinces arguments about its legitimate uses, and it's these arguments that are persuasive. Saying "We'll do it anyway" is unproductive.

In this case, since downloading Free software is so much more efficient with P2P, it's inappropriate to ban it even if that software is only a small percentage of the service's traffic.

Re:It's you who are to blame (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#11127106)

has a purpose for which it is legal, then the thing should be legal.

You really think it will work out like that in the end?

Our university is already banning all kinds of P2P and private servers on campus computers because of the fear for law suits. I've got no problem with that. Then again, I'm not trading copyrighted material...

Re:35% (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#11126939)

yes, i think the fact that all the user information is available in the open makes the amount of data overwhelming; <A HREF="http://www.theregister.co.uk/2004/12/17/riaa _sues_754/">El Reg</A> says that's our of a total of 7706 for the riaa... now how many downloads of riaa material have there been...?

Re:35% (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#11126957)

">"

Re:35% (2, Funny)

WizardRahl (840191) | more than 9 years ago | (#11126959)

"Or at least, your chances of being caught and sued are pathetic small." I guess sacrificies have to be made. You going to volunteer?

Re:35% (4, Funny)

Jugalator (259273) | more than 9 years ago | (#11126964)

I have the complete statistics:

35% = BitTorrent
40% = Spam
15% = Slashdottings
10% = Porn Browsing

Re:35% (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#11127035)

But the fact that 35% of all 'net traffic is being carried by one program is simple awesome, and a great credit to BitTorrent's creators.

Have you ever used BT?

You mean one protocol. There are many, many different BitTorrent clients. In fact, I don't know anyone who uses the original client [bitconjurer.org] (at least, not directly). Most people I know use Azureus [sourceforge.net] . And it's much to the credit of the BitTorrent creator. One guy called Bram Cohen.

Why would they need to sniff the traffic? They simply connect to machine advertising torrents of copyright material and note the IP addresses of all the people who send them parts of the file (or at least enough to qualify as having tried to ilegally obtain a copy). This is why people opt for IP blacklists like Safepeer [sourceforge.net] for Azureus or Protowall [bluetack.co.uk] for clients that don't have a blocklist plugin. It blocks connections from organisations with a vested interest in snooping on your shares. In many cases it's a bit overbearing though.

Re:35% (1)

Doppler00 (534739) | more than 9 years ago | (#11127086)

to BitTorrent's creators.
You mean BitTorrent's creator (Bram Cohen)? That makes this even more amazing that one person is responsible for all this traffic. I wonder if he will ever be personally sued for creating this software...

Legal Torrents (5, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#11126921)

aside from movie and music piracy there are legal uses for bittorrent p2p too, like when Linux distros are released the demand is much greater than the file servers can handle and thats where bittorrent plays an important role, i prefer to get my Linux ISOs via bittorrent because it helps others get their ISOs too, for example FedoraCore-3 was released and it came on 4 CDs plus a fifth rescue CD making for a HUGE download, and also offered resume so if you have to log off or have a network problem you don't lose all that data and have to start your download over...

Re:Legal Torrents (1)

GeorgeMcBay (106610) | more than 9 years ago | (#11126958)

Another legal use is World of Warcraft's update system, which is BitTorrent based.

I hope Blizzard has a plan B for next year, when all the major ISPs (in the US anyway) are forced to block BitTorrent traffic.

Re:Legal Torrents (1)

Porn Whitelist (838671) | more than 9 years ago | (#11126991)

I hope Blizzard has a plan B for next year, when all the major ISPs (in the US anyway) are forced to block BitTorrent traffic.
You can configure bittorrent to listen to non-standard ports, just as you can configure apache to listen to http requests on non-standard ports if your ISP blocks port 80 to try and keep you from running a porn^H^H^H^Hweb server from home.

Re:Legal Torrents (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#11127006)

Maybe Bilzzard should just buy their own bandwidth instead of forcing their customers to donate it.

Re:Legal Torrents (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#11127122)

I'm all for BitTorrent but when I'm paying per month to play (ie. World of Warcraft) I expect a better download service where I don't need to saturate my connection by uploading a ton of information to someone else. I mean in the stress test I uploaded about 6GB of information before my download was done. Their shitty downloader was saturating my connection and you can't change it unless you use an unsupported client. Blizzard just needs to get their shit straight and offer a better service.

Re:Legal Torrents - 1 Major Problem w/this (1)

Nom du Keyboard (633989) | more than 9 years ago | (#11126962)

i prefer to get my Linux ISOs via bittorrent

How does a moderator verify that this isn't a fake distro? Or do you go back to the site and verify all the checksums after the d/l?

Re:Legal Torrents - 1 Major Problem w/this (1)

tuffy (10202) | more than 9 years ago | (#11127007)

How does a moderator verify that this isn't a fake distro? Or do you go back to the site and verify all the checksums after the d/l?

Distros should ship with a signed MD5SUMs file containing the proper checksums of the ISOs, in case the tracker is serving up a hacked distro. By checking the signature against the distro's public key (downloaded long in advance) the MD5SUMs file can be validated. Then that file can validate the ISOs' integrity.

Re:Legal Torrents - 1 Major Problem w/this (1)

HeghmoH (13204) | more than 9 years ago | (#11127025)

BitTorrent's protocol is built around the idea of SHA-1 hashing everything in sight. This is both to avoid corruption and to prevent fake dataa. Assuming SHA-1 is secure, then it will be impossible to fake the distro without also faking the .torrent file. If you can fake the .torrent, then you could have faked the distro via traditional means as well, so it's no difference.

Re:Legal Torrents - 1 Major Problem w/this (1)

nkh (750837) | more than 9 years ago | (#11127051)

The moderator can check the file being uploaded against his own file with the SHA-1 sums of the torrent file.

Of course, with the SHA-0 cracked, how much time do we have left before we see modified binaries having the same checksum?

Re:Legal Torrents - 1 Major Problem w/this (1)

Eudial (590661) | more than 9 years ago | (#11127082)

Through the md5s on the distro's webpage.

A recent trend is MMORPG Client software (1)

WotanKhan (150429) | more than 9 years ago | (#11126969)

being offered for download via bittorrent. World of Warcraft and Anarchy Online, both major MMORPGs are are distributing their client software via Bittorrent.

BWAHAHAHAHA!! (0, Flamebait)

Average_Joe_Sixpack (534373) | more than 9 years ago | (#11126970)

LOL! legal torrents ... hehehe ... honestly you people slay me.

Sites that list legal torrents... (5, Informative)

Ghostgate (800445) | more than 9 years ago | (#11127108)

There are also sites that list legal torrents, try File Soup [filesoup.com] or Legal Torrents [legaltorrents.com] for example. These are just two that I remember offhand, I'm sure there are many others as well. Remember, BitTorrent, like any other P2P application, has plenty of legitimate uses. Don't get sucked in by the *AA propaganda machine (not directed towards the parent, just saying that in general).

How would you measure such a thing? (-1)

Recoil_42 (665710) | more than 9 years ago | (#11126926)

Considering the nature of Bittorrent and how decentralized it is, how would you even measure such a thing accurately?

I mean, in a centralized system like Sharman (KaZaA) it would be fairly trivial -- KaZaA even tells you when you start it up how many gigs are currently being traded.

But with Bittorrent?

Re:How would you measure such a thing? (1, Offtopic)

kayen_telva (676872) | more than 9 years ago | (#11126947)

amazing, moderated interesting for not RTFA.

Re:How would you measure such a thing? (1)

Porn Whitelist (838671) | more than 9 years ago | (#11126974)

Considering the nature of Bittorrent and how decentralized it is, how would you even measure such a thing accurately?

I mean, in a centralized system like Sharman (KaZaA) it would be fairly trivial -- KaZaA even tells you when you start it up how many gigs are currently being traded.
Simple - monitor the amount of data going to the ports bittorrent uses - ports 6881 and up (the original stopped at 6890, limiting you to 10 instances, but now it just keeps climbing :-)

Re:How would you measure such a thing? (1, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#11126990)

BT isn't limited to those ports in any way, shape or form, and many users use different ports.

Re:How would you measure such a thing? (1)

Porn Whitelist (838671) | more than 9 years ago | (#11127030)

BT isn't limited to those ports in any way, shape or form, and many users use different ports.
Of course not, as I pointed out in another post. However, the VAST majority of torrent traffic is on the standard ports. You've got to measure *something*.

Re:How would you measure such a thing? (1)

ToyKeeper (17042) | more than 9 years ago | (#11126981)

Oi. RTFA. The links explain exactly how they measured it. The 35% figure, though, is about 6 months old, and represented only one study. The actual number may be significantly higher or lower. (higher, I'd guess, as BT is still growing)

Re:How would you measure such a thing? (1)

Silvers (196372) | more than 9 years ago | (#11127042)

Maybe you should RTFA and find out how they did it.

You know, it may have just answered that question.

Such an unused potential (5, Interesting)

vincob (247090) | more than 9 years ago | (#11126936)

There is such a powerfull distribution mechanism in P2P network, if only the studios/majors/etc would understand it and use it instead of fighting it, their market could explode, while having no distribution costs, their custermers would provide the distribution mechanisms.

But I'm afraid they are not going to get it in time.

My dream about a P2P PVR:
http://www.oberle.org/blog/2004/08/02/a-p2p-video- recorder-box/ [oberle.org]

Such an unused potential-Stop abusing it. (1, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#11126978)

"There is such a powerfull distribution mechanism in P2P network, if only the studios/majors/etc would understand it and use it instead of fighting it, their market could explode, while having no distribution costs, their custermers would provide the distribution mechanisms."

1) They wouldn't be fighting it, if a certain group wasn't abusing it.

2) What makes P2P work isn't the technology, but broadband. Something that's confined to 20% of the US population. A demographic that's primarely affluent, white males 20-30 years of age. That means that the geeks "new business model" doesn't work for 80 % of the US.

"But I'm afraid they are not going to get it in time."

What's the rush?

Re:Such an unused potential-Stop abusing it. (1)

dosius (230542) | more than 9 years ago | (#11127116)

I'm hardly affluent, I'm on SSI, fixed income small enough I get food stamps, I still can easily afford DSL. It's not expensive.

Moll.

Bartering? (4, Interesting)

Hatta (162192) | more than 9 years ago | (#11126940)

the downloaders of a file barter for chunks of it by uploading and downloading them in a tit-for-tat-like manner to prevent parasitic behavior. Each peer is responsible for maximizing its own download rate by contacting suitable peers, and peers with high upload rates will with high probability also be able to download with high speeds.

Does this actually work? I find that when there are limited seeds, those first in line essentially transmit as fast as they recieve, and increasing upload doesn't really affect total speed much. When there are lots of seeders there's plenty of bandwidth to go around so it's always fast. Does anyone notice that restricting upload significantly affects download speed?

Re:Bartering? (3, Informative)

RandomJoe (814420) | more than 9 years ago | (#11127013)

The only effect I've noticed is when I forget to tell my firewall to let BitTorrent connects through to my computer. Then I see a HUGE decrease in speed. Other than that, adjusting the upload bandwidth seldom seems to make a difference. I have a cable connection, 4Mb/512kb, and even throttled down to 50-100kb outbound I'd still frequently see the incoming connection at 2.5-3Mb. On the occasions when torrents were slow, cranking it all the way up (minus a bit for overhead) didn't help speed it up any. In fact, then I would often see my outbound be 2-3 times my incoming speeds.

Note for the militant: I don't throttle down like that as a rule. When I was first playing with BT I did for each stream when I would have 3-4 running at a time. Now I just do one at a time, and play with the settings because I get bored and want to see what happens.

Re:Bartering? (2, Interesting)

Rakshasa Taisab (244699) | more than 9 years ago | (#11127020)

Usually you do not get the best download speeds from seeders, but other peers that are interested in what you got. With good upload speeds you are more likely to be unchoked by fast peers who are downloading from you.

BT is great, but: (4, Interesting)

ATAMAH (578546) | more than 9 years ago | (#11126941)

There are a few things that i would count as it's downsides. For instance, once the object that is being distributed been downloaded by the masses - you won't get a decent speed downloading it. So unless you grabbed it while it was "hot" - you will have to deal with much lower speeds. Also i often find that i upload almost as much as i download, not being greedy or anything, but here in New Zealand broadband is still capped either on speed or on traffic. And quotas are pretty stingy, counting both uploads and downloads... but that is more isp/country specific i guess:)

They missing the most important quality (4, Funny)

Nom du Keyboard (633989) | more than 9 years ago | (#11126943)

...ability to withstand flash crowds

How about the ability to withstand lawsuits? Isn't that more important than flash crowds?

I'd like another name (5, Funny)

Jugalator (259273) | more than 9 years ago | (#11126945)

A few performance problems are revealed

Yeah, performance problems should be fixed, but fix the name too. Name the next generation P2P client something like FuckTheRIAADickheadCunts. It would be interesting to see it get mentioned in the news each time RIAA sues something related to that P2P network. Call the "servers" instead "ejaculators" or something worse, and go on like that to introduce terms that violate various taboos. Soon enough, it can't get mentioned in the news anymore and (...now I get to my point, and now you will understand I'm not crazy, now you will see how this idea will triumph and free information once and for all...) RIAA's plans to scare customers by getting sue news in the newspapers won't work anymore!

HA HA HA!

Are you listening RIAA!?

We have you now!!!

THE NERDS HAVE YOU!

Re:I'd like another name (1)

dteichman (815136) | more than 9 years ago | (#11126987)

File Transfer = 100 RIAA nutjobs per second.

No, no no. (5, Funny)

drxray (839725) | more than 9 years ago | (#11127038)

You're on the right lines, but we should call it something really positive, something they couldn't possibly want to ban. They're pretty hard hearted, they're already happy being know as people who want to ban sharing. But lets see them try to ban JesusKittenShare (the premier opensource implementation of the RespectYourElders protocol) and www.cutebabies.org, the popular .behappy listing site.

Re:No, no no. (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#11127059)

No, that wouldn't work. They'd just reveal that P2P users were hiding behind cute names and such. If www.cutebabies.org was a child porn site, it wouldn't be ignored just because of its name.

Re:No, no no. (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#11127083)

No. The RespectYourElders protocol sounds too much like some sort of Zionist conspiracy for omni-genetic dominance. JesusKittenShare, having Jesus in its name, can't be an implementation of anything, but rather the universe must be an implementation of it. Furthermore, it can't have any dependencies or ever generate a dependency "hell," though perhaps it could harrow what dependency issues your system may have prior to installation (preferably within three days of activation/registration).

BitTorrent is a pirates' delight (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#11126950)

It's easy to download full isos of software and have them error checked while downloading. Bittorrent is much better at transfering binaries than Usenet. Plus no chance of losing parts of the files downloaded unless there's nobody to seed the torrent.

great timing! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#11126983)

A number of the major sites, which I shall not name, have all gone away this weekend due to the actions in the Netherlands.

Swarming Pigeons? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#11126995)

So is it a swarm of carrier pigeons or are they carrier honey bees that transfer the data? With swarmstreaming, do the bees have to get in line?

from tfa (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#11126996)

"However, this comes at a prize: system availability is hampered by the global nature of these components"

nice prize

fp (1)

codergeek42 (792304) | more than 9 years ago | (#11126999)

w00t

What, P2P takes up 2/3 of all net traffic? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#11127000)

And I thought spam did that.

Bittorrent... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#11127016)

The bad thing about bittorrent is that everyone is uploading - so the RIAA could go after everyone with infringement.

--
Don't change browsers, make IE secure [secureie.com]

irony (4, Funny)

bitspotter (455598) | more than 9 years ago | (#11127021)

The irony is that a web site dedicated toward serving a p2p protocol expressly designed to rememdy the slashdot effect gets slashdotted.

So why don't they just use Bittorrent to distribute their mirrors?

Re:irony (0, Flamebait)

MasterOfUniverse (812371) | more than 9 years ago | (#11127117)

The irony is that a web site dedicated toward serving a p2p protocol expressly designed to rememdy the slashdot effect gets slashdotted. ahh another misuse of the word irony...sweet.

I don't infringe copyrights (5, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#11127023)

As a solid, upstanding citizen of the United States (a country which has the best government that money can buy), I firmly believe in strongly adhering to all the laws of this fine country.

That's why I always go to thepiratesbay.org.

They are located in Finland, of course, where US Copyright Law doesn't apply. So it's legal for them to offer files for downloading.

And, of course, in the US it's legal to download files. What is illegal is to offer more than $1000 worth of them for uploading.

So, please, let us all keep our Bittorrent downloads legal, folks. Thank you. ;)

That should be http://thepiratebay.org (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#11127057)

My bad.

slashdot torrents (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#11127029)

so, they traced (all) torrents from nova. But they didn't touch any torrent posted on slashdot?

Just guess what would been happend if they had did it.

Not that great (0)

Vizzue (830695) | more than 9 years ago | (#11127049)

Hey, I use Bittorrent a lot. I use it all over http://www.the-underdogs.org/ [the-underdogs.org] , to save them needed bandwidth, and sometimes, to download fan movies or some other junk. It is a real pain in the neck. That's the only way to download large files on the internet, and it's awfully slow. With my internet connection getting 200-300 kbps on respectable sites, Bittorrent is excruciating. It gave me 100 kbps once, and that was after 5 hours of waiting. At an average of 40 kbps, it takes way too long for this to be a viable solution. I despise it, but it's the only thing I can use in some situations. Recently, one of my friends ordered Unreal Tournament 2004 online. He never recieved it. It was lost in the mail. Since he owned the liscence, he asked me to download it for him, since he had dialup. It is upwards of two gigabytes. Imagine that at 40 kbps. Not a chance. If there's a better, faster solution, I'd go with that, but for now, I'm avoiding 35% of internet downloads.

Re:Not that great (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#11127094)

Perhaps you should stop capping your uploads to 40k?

Re:Not that great (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#11127112)

Patience is a virtue you know. Just leave the computer running and your files will be down eventually.

had to be said ... (4, Funny)

for_usenet (550217) | more than 9 years ago | (#11127077)

Anyone have a .torrent of the article ?
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