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Take-Two to Publish Next Civilization Game

Zonk posted more than 9 years ago | from the boy-they've-been-busy-this-week,-huh? dept.

PC Games (Games) 363

An anonymous reader writes "Take Two Interactive announced today that they have acquired the rights to the Civilization franchise. They also announced Civ 4, saying that "Civilization IV will also set a new standard for user-modification, allowing gamers to create their own add-ons using the standard Python and XML scripting languages." Okay, so XML's not a scripting language. But it's nice to see open source tech in a major PC game!" Civ IV will be released under the new 2K Publishing Label we reported on yesterday.

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I hope that's not all (5, Insightful)

eln (21727) | more than 9 years ago | (#11484060)

Being able to program the game is geeky and all, but I buy games primarily for the gameplay, so I hope they intend to improve on the game in more ways than just adding a scripting language.

sp (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#11484067)

sp

Re:I hope that's not all (2, Interesting)

TommydCat (791543) | more than 9 years ago | (#11484085)

Perhaps they opened it up in hopes that we will improve it for them?

Re:I hope that's not all (5, Informative)

Nevita (841283) | more than 9 years ago | (#11484121)

Sid Meyer is known to be taking more of a lead role in the design and development of this version, as opposed to the previous Civ game. Given that, I would bet that gameplay will be greatly improved over Civ 3.

Re:I hope that's not all (4, Insightful)

Bander (2001) | more than 9 years ago | (#11484122)

There's a long list of other improvements, but it's the Python scripting that I'm most interested in. Not because I'm planning on making a Lord Of The Rings mod or anything like that, but because other people with more time on their hands will be able to do so. Depending on how deep the scripting engine is, we could wind up with a nigh-infinitely extendable turn-based game, which would be a Very Good Thing.

Plus, the more exposure Python gets, the more likely it is that I'll be able to make money hacking in Python, which would be an Even Better Thing.

-- Bander

Re:I hope that's not all (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#11484248)

Agreed.

I long for the day when Python will be installed on more webhosts than that evil ugly toy language Personal Home Page.

Re:I hope that's not all (1)

drinkypoo (153816) | more than 9 years ago | (#11484491)

If it's got deep enough python hooks you could make persistent universes out of it. That's what gets my attention.

Re:I hope that's not all (3, Interesting)

delta_avi_delta (813412) | more than 9 years ago | (#11484212)

Actually, the industry is very interested in "utilising" the recent professional-level modding community. I wouldn't be surprised if they release the game in a rough-and-ready format, and let the community polish it up, or take it in directions the team could never have envisaged. Civ has a large following, espeically amongst the type of people likely to use the coding facility, it makes sense.

Re:I hope that's not all (1, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#11484352)

i think it would be a mistake to do a rough but ready release. the gamers dont tend to go after those games for long periods of time, the reviews tank it etc etc etc.

its gotta be a SOLID game to begin with, then the mods can take it in new directions.
(you were right there)

Re:I hope that's not all (3, Interesting)

cryptochrome (303529) | more than 9 years ago | (#11484265)

Automatic deployment of units would be a nice start. Micromanaging is fine in the early game but it really drags towards the end.

Making it run in real time would be interesting as well, so long as you control the pace of time. Balancing law enforcement (with the scientists and workers and tax collectors, etc) would be a nice touch that would help with controlling corruption.

Re:I hope that's not all (1)

schwaang (667808) | more than 9 years ago | (#11484377)

Yeah OK, but I can't count the number of times I've wished CivIII would let me script in some features that the devs missed. Simple things like upgrading every unit of a particular type in all cities can take dozens of clicks. So easy to fix with a little scripting.

Re:I hope that's not all (1)

syrinx (106469) | more than 9 years ago | (#11484464)

Simple things like upgrading every unit of a particular type in all cities can take dozens of clicks.

I swear there's an "upgrade all" command.

I haven't played Civ3 for awhile now, but I really think I remember one.

Re:I hope that's not all (1)

MrDickey (653242) | more than 9 years ago | (#11484402)

I can't help but think of Escape velocity- Its original gameplay was good, but all the add-ons available added much more gameplay than it could have come with orginally.

Take-2 vs. EA? (3, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#11484076)

Take 2 and EA seem like they're in a huge arms race for control of the Western video game industry, now...

Remember what happened with Radio? Don't people realize all this consolidation is bad for the industry? Better play as many video games as you still can, they're gonna get a lot more bland in subsequent years.

Re:Take-2 vs. EA? (2, Informative)

Bodhammer (559311) | more than 9 years ago | (#11484173)

I don't think it is bad, it is just a natural part of the business cycle. Successful companies grow. Sooner or later they get big and slow and unable to respond to changes in the market and young upstarts fill the emerging niches. Microsoft did it to IBM, Linux is doing it to Microsoft, etc.

EA has already experienced some of it. The Jane's series was a great franchise and had some great programmers. EA screwed it up with bad business decisions.. Hungry russian programmers developed IL-2 and Lomac to fill the niche and Jane's is gone.

It will happen again to EA.

Re:Take-2 vs. EA? (0, Flamebait)

speedbump (11624) | more than 9 years ago | (#11484533)

You are free at any time to write an uber-exciting and profitable video game which blows the doors off anything the Big Guys are doing.

word (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#11484078)

this is so onto

Just to note... (5, Informative)

DragonMagic (170846) | more than 9 years ago | (#11484079)

Firaxis still owns Civilization, and Sid Meier's still the director on the game. Take Two is just taking over the role of Atari/Infogrames and it sounds like they wish to do more with the title than just make PC games.

Civ IV is scheduled to be out in late 2005. Hopefully, it will be.

PC competition for I-Mini MAC? (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#11484131)

When MAC announced their "I-Mini" McIntosh, it caught my eye. Wanting to buy/build a small computer for my already cramped breakfast bar, I started pricing out similar hardware. The results startled me. Most of the configurations I found were more than the humble US$499 of the "I-Mini" McIntosh. To match price I had to configure with a much bigger shuttle-style case.

My question is this. What PCs are currently on the market to compete with this? When my wife asks for the "cute little MAC", what real computer can I buy instead?

Re:Just to note... (4, Funny)

Jeremiah Cornelius (137) | more than 9 years ago | (#11484274)

XML is not a scripting language? Gotta' fix that! I propose tags that encapsulate the C programming language as C-XML. This allows to C-XML and run!

Re:Just to note... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#11484297)

A simpler way to explain this is that Infogrames, being a French company, surrendered.

Re:Just to note... (2, Funny)

temojen (678985) | more than 9 years ago | (#11484443)

sounds like they wish to do more with the title than just make PC games.

Ah, but will it run on Linux?

Seriously, I know it's a cliche, but the success of freeciv should demonstrate the market is there.

Re:Just to note... (1)

faust2097 (137829) | more than 9 years ago | (#11484447)

Uh, what part of:
Take-Two Interactive Software, Inc., today announced that it has purchased certain rights to the multi-million unit selling Civilization franchise
indicates to you that they didn't purchase the rights to the Civ franchise?

AI (5, Insightful)

fembots (753724) | more than 9 years ago | (#11484093)

One interesting (and new) moddable feature is the computer AI, I'm sure reading Artificial Intelligence for Computer Games: An Introduction [slashdot.org] will help.

This is certainly not the first time XML data files are used in games, Ghost Recon has that too if I remember correctly, and players are able to change the wind, bullet speed and whatnot in the game.

Is this going to be the trend in the future? Players pay $49 to license the game engine, and create their own game?

Re:AI (1)

delta_avi_delta (813412) | more than 9 years ago | (#11484148)

Yes, even less original considering you could do similar things with a text file in Duke Nukem 3D. I remember fiddling with the rocket damage and my values. I could kill almost all the enemies, and uncover the shootable secrets by firing one rocket :)

Re:AI (1)

Zeebs (577100) | more than 9 years ago | (#11484179)

Mods are not new, people edited the hell out of the Dooms, I even had a kill barney(damn puple dinosaur) mod for wolf 3d. If your interested in a low cost high quality game engine you can make your own games with take a look at Garage Games [garagegames.com] You can license the Tribes 2 engine, known as Torque, for next to nothing and make commercial games with it even.

Hmmm...Native Linux Installer, Maybe (2)

KingBahamut (615285) | more than 9 years ago | (#11484095)

Hopefully....though im sure cedega will run it no problem, still itd be nice to see a native installer.

bad use of time (-1, Redundant)

phaetonic (621542) | more than 9 years ago | (#11484096)

I'll spend more time coding than playing!

Python (1)

EricWright (16803) | more than 9 years ago | (#11484097)

Maybe this will give me the kick in the pants I've needed to go learn Python.

Re:Python (3, Funny)

Comrade64 (799539) | more than 9 years ago | (#11484171)

To bad your name isn't Monty...then you could make the Monty Python Civilization IV special add-on edition.

ok..I'll go back to my corner now...

Re:Python (1)

delta_avi_delta (813412) | more than 9 years ago | (#11484289)

Be careful, you may become dissatisfied with every other language you (have to) program in. :)

Re:Python (1)

FlashBuster3000 (319616) | more than 9 years ago | (#11484294)

Yep, you should learn it. Python is just awesome for writing code quick and still readable.
And integrating it in a game is just a very good place for a language like Python.
Personally i can't wait until CivIV is released.
CivIII was fun, but now with support for pythonscripting i bet there will be much addons for CivIV (as i will definitely try this out!)
Hoping for Linuxsupport, too.

Re:Python (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#11484337)

Offtopic post claiming that Ruby is much better due in 3... 2... 1...

Impressive, it hasn't shown up yet.

Waiting for Civ 4 (5, Interesting)

iMaple (769378) | more than 9 years ago | (#11484108)

Civilization is my favorite strategy game and I still like to play Civ 3 fo rlong periods of time. My wishlist for Civ 4:
1)Good multiplayer
2)More diplomacy and humor

Ican't just think of any other way they could improve an already fantastic game. (apart from of course putting in super fancy graphice so that I will have to skip food for a month and get a new graphics card)

Re:Waiting for Civ 4 (2, Interesting)

eln (21727) | more than 9 years ago | (#11484147)

Those are like the exact opposite of what I liked about Civ. Personally, I really got into the military conquest part of the game, with the various military units and global expansion by force. I also really got into the technologies you could learn.

Leaving aside what that says about my psychological state, I was a little disappointed that the newer games moved so much more into diplomacy and "power politics," and made it almost completely impossible to win with tech and military strategy alone. Are there any civ-like games out there that put more emphasis on that part of the game?

Re:Waiting for Civ 4 (2, Informative)

Txiasaeia (581598) | more than 9 years ago | (#11484275)

"Are there any civ-like games out there that put more emphasis on that part of the game?"

Alpha Centauri. You get to make your own military units, for crying out loud ;)

Re:Waiting for Civ 4 (1)

TilJ (7607) | more than 9 years ago | (#11484538)

The weird thing is that I like Apha Centauri for the power politics side of things ... for the first year of playing it (has it been that long since the Loki days? Sigh.) I almost always used Lal and won through world peace or being voted in as supreme leader.

I now favour Santiago and win through technology along with bullying anyone who's closer to finishing a Wonder than I am ;-)

A very moldable game, it seems to be different things to different people.

Re:Waiting for Civ 4 (1, Interesting)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#11484328)

I agree. Civ 3 was always kind of a bore to me. I was kind of hoping it would be like Civ2, with more avenues to dominate and be dominated, but instead it focused much more on diplomacy and things like keeping other nations out of your territory became tedious. The overall focus was much less military oriented (though I guess it is more representative of the real world).

I really loved the increased diplomacy and culture though. I always hated how in Civ2 you would take out all a civ's major cities leaving a few size 4's and then they sucker you into a peace treaty, or even worse, you can't find those last tiny settlements somewhere out there and have to send an armada of carriers all over the place to scour the map for that last city. Pure tediousness.

I really wish they made a civ 2.5- just the basic Civ2 game, with the expanded Diplomacy and culture systems built in.

Re:Waiting for Civ 4 (2, Interesting)

saintp (595331) | more than 9 years ago | (#11484452)

Try "Rome: Total War." For the first campaign, they mollycoddle you with power politics, but after that, it's pure military might. And it's very highly replayable.

Alpha Centauri (4, Informative)

floppy ears (470810) | more than 9 years ago | (#11484110)

If you love Civ 2 but have never played Alpha Centauri, be sure to give it a shot. I still play it occasionally even today, but I don't play anything in the Civ series any longer. The modifiable military units are great.

Never did like Civ 3 myself. Too many boring bombing runs ...

Re:Alpha Centauri (1)

TilJ (7607) | more than 9 years ago | (#11484180)

I agree, Alpha Centauri is the primary game that I play to this day. The diplomancy is better than many other Civ-style games, the "modify everything" attitude is great, and the multiple ways to win are more fun than yet another take-over-the-world Pinky and the Brain scenario.

Damn you for going under, Loki, damn you all to heck! ;-)

Re:Alpha Centauri (1)

Overt Coward (19347) | more than 9 years ago | (#11484303)

Somewhat off-topic, but my copy of Alpha Centauri won't run on my newer computers (with 2.8 GHz processors and Windows XP) -- it claims my processor isn't supported. Any ideas?

Re:Alpha Centauri (1)

drinkypoo (153816) | more than 9 years ago | (#11484322)

Which processor? I only have an athlon xp 2500+ but it runs fine here. Have you installed all the patches?

Re:Alpha Centauri (1)

pezpunk (205653) | more than 9 years ago | (#11484360)

yeah, the truth is it is very tricky to get it to run on modern processors. even with the latest patch, i had to edit the config file with some jargon i found on a messageboard just to get it to run. i'm at work, otherwise i'd paste the config file here. sorry!

Re:Alpha Centauri (1)

Tebriel (192168) | more than 9 years ago | (#11484383)

There are 2 separate patches. One for WinXP and one for Pentium 4 chips. You'll need both to run it. I think they're both on EA's support page. You could also check Apolyton.Net for the patches as well, as they're a pretty decent Civ/SMAC/RoN/GalCiv community.

Re:Alpha Centauri (4, Informative)

pezpunk (205653) | more than 9 years ago | (#11484312)

i agree with this also. even though the landscape is pretty ugly (everything is pretty much a shade of red), the game itself is fantastic. it's a perfected version of civ2.

totally customizable units, functional and relatively deep diplomacy, fantastic story and brilliant characters (in a civ game?!?!), multiple paths to victory (victory by diplomacy, victory by economic domination, victory by Transcendent technology, or of course the good old victory by genocide) and an unceasing number options and worlds to play around with.

my favorite feature, though, is the wonderfully clever quotes or movies you get every time you discover a new tech or wonder of the world. they really give one a sense of not only accomplishment, but wonder at this new, exciting technology your society has just produced.

Re:Alpha Centauri (1)

mszeto (133525) | more than 9 years ago | (#11484329)

Are you serious? I played Alpha Centauri once and thought it was cool - however it never had the staying power. ie I would never play it again.

Now Colonization, *That's* another story. If anyone liked the civ series, and has never played Colonization, you MUST. I've met a few other people that also agree that Colonization is one of the best. This game was made in 96 I believe, and I still pull it up and play once a year!

Re:Alpha Centauri (1)

floppy ears (470810) | more than 9 years ago | (#11484403)

Totally serious. Given the different characters you can play and the different units you can create, it's got great replayability.

But I like Colonization too. It gets a little tedious dealing with the micromanagement of all of the wagon trains and warehouses, but somehow it's fun. I have played it within the last year myself.

Re:Alpha Centauri (1)

TheCaptain (17554) | more than 9 years ago | (#11484490)

I'd like to second this one - Alpha Centauri is great...and don't forget to throw the Alien Crossfire add-on into the mix. It actually does add quite a bit of replay value to the game. (The game isn't lacking any in the first place.)

Alien Crossfire (1)

floppy ears (470810) | more than 9 years ago | (#11484496)

I should have also mentioned that I recently discovered the expansion pack for this game, called Alien Crossfire. It's a pretty good expansion, with a new storyline, seven new factions and a bunch of other stuff that you might expect to see an an expansion. Not revoluationary, but recommended if you are an AC addict.

The best part of Alpha Centauri (1)

GoofyBoy (44399) | more than 9 years ago | (#11484514)

... was the quote voices with accents and everything.

Eg:
Einstein would turn over in his grave. Not only does God play dice, the dice are loaded.
Chairman Sheng-ji Yang
"Looking God in the Eye

AND

A brave little theory, and actually quite coherent for a system of five or seven dimensions--if only we lived in one.
Academician Prokhor Zakharov
"Now We Are Alone"

Thats was the #1 disappointment I had with Civ3.

Game moves? (2, Interesting)

Jpunkroman (851438) | more than 9 years ago | (#11484113)

Is it just me or have there been a way above normal level of announcements and agreements and settlements and movements amongst the gaming companies? Makes you wonder what is going on in the boardrooms of these companies, must be pretty buzy.

open source tech? (2, Insightful)

geoffspear (692508) | more than 9 years ago | (#11484114)

If they don't give me the source to the program, I don't see what "open source tech" has to do with anything. Windows has open source tech in it too, from BSD, but that's hardly a selling point.

reaction (3, Insightful)

greechneb (574646) | more than 9 years ago | (#11484115)

Looks like wallstreet likes the decision. Right now it looks like they are up nearly 5%. Should help them bring another profitable game into their portfolio. GTA keeps doing good, but they needed something else.

Re:reaction (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#11484249)

Probably has as much to do with their announcement yesterday about the MLB agreement as it has to do with this specific game. Still interesting that they choose this time of year to make their move.

No, GTA keeps doing well. (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#11484460)

adv/adj

Take a good idea and work with it... (3, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#11484118)

This is proof that good ideas never die - if you know you have a viable concept, as long as you don't mess with the guts of it too much, you can keep it alive as long as you want. Kudos to the developers for taking their cues from the community in general and realizing that people like making mods for games, so to see one that's mod-friendly (and I'm sure there are others out there - I play a couple of games, but I'm not a big gamer) is a welcome change of pace.

Sounds like Disney movies (1)

Trolling4Columbine (679367) | more than 9 years ago | (#11484188)

"This is proof that good ideas never die - if you know you have a viable concept, as long as you don't mess with the guts of it too much, you can keep it alive as long as you want."

That sounds like how Disney creates their movies. Too bad it usually results in a predictable and unintersting storyline, with cliched characters and bland dialogue.

do clones make for Developer ideas? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#11484129)

I wonder if open-source clones like FreeCiv are reasoning behind the Python and XML support. It's curious to see that they are catering to an open-source framework for modification. one could speculate on resoning, but it's just a parallel that i see.

Neat-o (4, Funny)

cryptochrome (303529) | more than 9 years ago | (#11484137)

Potentially this could allow for people to make more representative/interesting sets of civilization advances and benefits.

For instance: photography (+sci +happy) allows porn (+happy, opens Jenna Jameson wonder)

Re:Neat-o (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#11484378)

What about ancient Japanese wood-block porn? +tentacles?

Re:Neat-o (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#11484381)

opens Jenna Jameson wonder)

uhh..huh..huh....

How it's gonna be (0, Flamebait)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#11484144)

IndentationError: expected an indented block
Wha?! But I ain't playing Tetris!

I like the theme.. (0, Offtopic)

Tepshen (851674) | more than 9 years ago | (#11484150)

..but I honestly have not found a game I like more than Call to power 2 that game is on my HD to this day.

Freeciv (5, Interesting)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#11484159)

Freeciv [freeciv.org] already has all this, and a lot more. And the upcoming release 2.0.0 will blow your minds!

Re:Freeciv (2, Interesting)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#11484390)

Freeciv has a lot to offer, sure. It's free software. It's immensely customisable. It's multiplayer. It's literally packed with features. I've had a lot of fun with it.

Unfortunately they forgot to include modern graphics and addictive single-player gameplay, so it's not going to catch on outside the geek niche that values customisability over eye-candy.

Re:Freeciv (4, Informative)

drinkypoo (153816) | more than 9 years ago | (#11484542)

I sure hope so, because the current release makes me want to blow my brains out. I thought the original Civ and Civ 2 had a craptacular interface, but then I played freeciv.

Civ 3 issues (4, Interesting)

Raul654 (453029) | more than 9 years ago | (#11484160)

I was a big fan of Civ II and I absolutely loved Alpha Centauri, but I did not like Civ III. Why? The waste and corruption was just far too high. (The patches moderated this slightly, but still not to my satisfaction). It ruined the game, IMHO. I hope Civ IV will improve upon this.

Re:Civ 3 issues (4, Funny)

FauxPasIII (75900) | more than 9 years ago | (#11484288)

You have to bring Democracy to the people. Modern history tells us the most expeditious way to do this is to invade and occupy them.

Re:Civ 3 issues (1)

HungWeiLo (250320) | more than 9 years ago | (#11484314)

Well, the quicker you invade and pillage the rest of the world, the faster you'll win the game and the less corruption will matter.

Oh wait...

Re:Civ 3 issues (1, Interesting)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#11484350)

The biggest problem I have with Civ3 are the damned strategic resources. Nothing pisses you off more than taking the time to research a technology to give you a military edge (like 1st gen. tanks), and then seeing you have no oil. Or needing aluminum to build spaceship components.

It didn't make a single bit of difference if you were the single largest landmass nation in the game. You *always* got shafted out of some strategic late-game resource. All the other civilizations were drawing on multiple resources and refused to trade... at all... even your "best buddy" ally.

And I never kept track, but it always seemed that the "We have exhausted this resource" events happened far more often than "We have discovered a new source".

It wouldn't be so bad if they gave the option to turn the damn resources off.

Re:Civ 3 issues (5, Insightful)

Freedom Bug (86180) | more than 9 years ago | (#11484522)

The rule is "the first civ you really get into is the best".

For me, I much preferred Civ 1 over Civ 2. Civ 2 just added a whole bunch of new units, technologies and wonders, without adding anything distinctive to the game. They turned a nice 8 hour game into an exhausting 16 hour game.

Civ 3, on the other hand, added depth to the game. Culture is awesome, and those strategic resources really opened up the diplomatic and trading game.

Waste, corruption and unhappiness are crucial to the game. Without it, however gets the most cities planted early wins. Only the game before 2000BC matters, after, it's just tedium. You may hate it, because it's what's holding you back on your preferred strategy, but without it, it'd be a much inferior game.

I totally agree (1)

Kinniken (624803) | more than 9 years ago | (#11484523)

This was a clear-cut case of a game designer deciding he wanted people to "play well" (in this case, build smallish, advanced nations instead of conquering everything in sight), instead of listening to what his customers wanted.
However, I found some efficient patches for it early on that neatly solved the problem for me. I can't remember what they were though...

i can see myself playing it already! (1)

raarky (653241) | more than 9 years ago | (#11484168)

My Turn! edit-cut-paste-move-edit-cut-paste-move-edit-cut-p aste-move

so... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#11484199)

should we expect a storyline where the player character is hired by competing city states, gaining more power/influence over the centuries?

That would be a pretty cool cross-over with GTA.

Oh - and using a crossbow for driveby shootings in chariots.

Yeah, I know I'm nuts.

In other words. (3, Funny)

Kenja (541830) | more than 9 years ago | (#11484202)

"Civilization IV will also set a new standard for user-modification"

In other words, there will be no game included and they hope that we, the consumer, will finish their prodcut for them.

Re:In other words. (1)

Txiasaeia (581598) | more than 9 years ago | (#11484325)

Ever since NWN went this route, it seems to me that more and more companies are doing this - heck, id has been doing it for years now with Doom and Quake! Anyway, I'm not quite as cynical as you, but I still can't find a decent game that replicates the Civ2 w/Mars scenario feeling - maybe this will be it?

Not the First Time (3, Informative)

lavaforge (245529) | more than 9 years ago | (#11484209)

This isn't the first time that Python has shown up in a major commercial game. Vampire the Masquerade: Bloodlines uses python 2.2 (could be wrong on the minor revision number) to handle almost all of its in-game actions. It's interesting to read the scripts and see how the game works, even if it can spoil things a bit.

Documentation (4, Insightful)

Fr05t (69968) | more than 9 years ago | (#11484242)

World of Warcraft allows users to make their own UI mods and addons using a combination of XML and LUA. The only problem (not blaming Blizz because they don't "offically support" it) is good and complete documentation is pretty much impossible to find.

There are plently of places with fragmented documentation but it's still a lot of trial and error/guessing. It also seems mod developers who started in the begining of the beta do not want to share their knowledge.

My advice to Take-Two is this: If you are going to talk it up make sure you document the damn thing.

Re:Documentation (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#11484487)

thats crap. they dont have to officially support it to provide some decent docs.

support is different than the documentation that should come with it.

they copped out

Civ 2 still the best. (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#11484253)

Civ2 > Civ3 by a long shot. I'm gonna wait for the reviews before I try to buy civ4.

Hmm, A CIV GTA cross-over (1)

cybergrue (696844) | more than 9 years ago | (#11484264)

Hmmm, Take Two is also the pubisher behind Rockstar games. Maybe they could spice things up by making a cross-over between the Civ franchise and the GTA series. Think of it, you could lead you army in first person into your opponents capital, storm his palace, and kill him in one-to-one combat with a spear, and then jack his chariot for a triumphant entry back to your safe house / palace. The only problem with this plan is that the in game leader would have more of a life then I currently do.

SDL? (1)

lost sheep (605129) | more than 9 years ago | (#11484268)

it's nice to see open source tech in a major PC game!


Didn't Civ 3 use SDL?

XMLScript (1)

slagdogg (549983) | more than 9 years ago | (#11484271)

Okay, so XML's not a scripting language.

Right, but a scripting language could be represented in XML.

<for var="i" test="i &lt; 10" mod="i++">
<drop object="nuke[i]" on="civ[i]" />
<clean object="pollution" nearobject="nuke[i]" />
</for>

Re:XMLScript (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#11484351)

Somehow i was waiting for this...

Re:XMLScript (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#11484532)

<for var="i" test="i &lt; 10" mod="i++">
<drop object="nuke[i]" on="civ[i]" />
<clean object="pollution" nearobject="nuke[i]" />
</for>


Man, you have no clue. Try
<!-- pretend there's a DTD here, life's too short
to make parodies perfect -->
<for>
<initialization>
<set>
<variable identifier="i"/>
<integer value="0"/>
</set>
</initialization>
<condition>
<less-than>
<variable identifier="i"/>
<integer value="10"/>
</less-than>
</condition>
<increment>
<assign>
<variable identifier="i"/>
<expression>
<add>
<variable identifier="i"/>
<integer value="1"/>
</add>
</expression>
</assign>
</increment>
<statements>
<attack>
<unit>
<index><variable identifier="i"/></index>
</unit>
<target>
<owner>
<index><variable identifier="i"/></index>
</owner>
<city identifier="capital"/>
</target>
</attack>
<!-- fuck cleaning up pollution, global warming
is only a problem for the weak -->
</statements>
</for>
Now that's XML.

I'm waiting for (1)

Lord Kano (13027) | more than 9 years ago | (#11484278)

Take Two or EA (yeah yeah, I know) to apply for and receive a patent for "Using a computer or other electronic instrument for the purpose of providing entertainment using sound, visual images or a combination thereof".

LK

National Security Risk!!! (3, Funny)

HungWeiLo (250320) | more than 9 years ago | (#11484285)

Looks like Take-Two and Sid Meier will be personally responsible for decreasing America's GDP for the 3rd and 4th fiscal quarters of 2005...

"Open source"? WTF? (2, Insightful)

MoralHazard (447833) | more than 9 years ago | (#11484287)

Since when does "extensible" mean the same thing as "open source"? For all we know, they could claim ownership of any derivatives works of their product, making any user-contributed code the property of the game manufacturer. Even if they don't intend to at first, who's to say they're not reserving the right for later? This is more like the "Anti-OSS", if anything: no guaranteed rights.

And I didn't see a reference anywhere to the license that covers mods. Maybe if someone did see it, they can point that out to me.

How did previous mod communities deal with this? Did modders just not care, or did the fact that the game manufacturer didn't claim rights over derivative works from the beginning save it?

Help enlighten us--maybe I'm being too harsh.

Mac version? (1)

akira69 (621573) | more than 9 years ago | (#11484307)

Since there's a Civ 3 for mac, how about civ 4? I buy about 1 game every 2 years, and it's usually a flavor of civilization. I wouldn't mind buying Civ 4, but would love to play it on my mac...

Re:Mac version? (1)

creep (150035) | more than 9 years ago | (#11484397)

Second the motion. The AI in Civ3 for Mac is horrendous--it's impossible to conduct any type of diplomacy.

XML Scripting Language (3, Interesting)

getusout (827221) | more than 9 years ago | (#11484327)

Okay, so XML's not a scripting language

You sure about that? :) It's been done before. See the stax project: http://staf.sf.net/ [sf.net]

Valve - Take 2 phone conversation (1)

dmrt_viper (701568) | more than 9 years ago | (#11484344)

V:Civ 4 ? Nah man, source is the only way to fly !
T:Source ?
V:CIV SOURCE ! Let me tell you about `steam`
T:Stop calling us okay ?
V:It's tha bomb
T:Hello ?

Mac Version (2, Interesting)

NardofDoom (821951) | more than 9 years ago | (#11484399)

Civ III is one of my favorite games, but they've pretty much stopped producing Mac versions of it. The last patch to Civ III was put out 8/13/2002. 2002!

So while the PC version will be out late 2005, the Mac version will be out two years later, running on hacked-together code that requires a 5Ghz G5 and 512MB of VRAM just to run. Slowly.

Here we go again.... (1)

jborawski (847100) | more than 9 years ago | (#11484425)

I think the Civilization series has been touched by so many companies and has been through so many variations, that it's comparable to the max amount of technologies you can research and discover in an entire game of Civilization I....

Great, now you can CUSTOMIZE your crack (5, Funny)

StefanJ (88986) | more than 9 years ago | (#11484430)

God damn. I forsee many months of lost productivity ahead.

Anyone in the Portland, OR area want to put together a Twelve Step group for Civilization addicts?

"Hello, my name is Bill."

"Hi Bill!"

"I would like to tell you about the time I wore Depends and stewed in my own filth for twelve hours while playing as the Mongols in King mode."

"We've all been there Bill! Go on!"

Stefan

Will mods/scripting be cross platform? (1)

amichalo (132545) | more than 9 years ago | (#11484478)

Is Take Two dedicated to the cross platform capabilities of Civ IV?

As a Mac user, I was put off that Civ III came out for the Mac but no expansions did and even the patches stopped at 1.21f while the PC version went to 1.29g (and no, the 1.29 patch was not PC only bug fixes).

Any information on the support of non-Windows OS's?

Another? (1)

Mazem (789015) | more than 9 years ago | (#11484483)

Civ 3, Civ 2, Civ 1, and all the Alpha Centauri titles are basically the exact same game. There are small changes, tweaks, graphical updates etc, but when it comes down to it they all have nearly the same gameplay.

Civ was such an amazing, addictive, and replayable game to begin with that everytime they release a new Civ everyone starts playing it again, remembers how good the game style is, and likes the new version. However, I'm not convinced that buying and playing Civ X is a significantly different or better experience than just picking up Civ 2 off the shelf, dusting it off, and playing it again.

In related news... (1)

allanc (25681) | more than 9 years ago | (#11484492)

Take Two interactive announced today that it would be changing its name to "Take Everything Interactive". A company spokesman was quoted as saying "We felt that the new name would better reflect the company's new goals and objectives. We found we weren't satisfied with just taking two, so we're going to go ahead and take it all, piece by piece."

Insiders report that the newly renamed company next plans to acquire exclusive rights to all games that feature the concept of 'crates', games featuring the likeness of Jodie Foster, and games that use the musical note B-sharp anywhere in their score.

Great for my 8 year old! (1)

randall_burns (108052) | more than 9 years ago | (#11484512)

I have an 8 year old son that likes Civilization. What I like about this is that he might learn python to make changes to a favorite game.
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