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ESR steps down from OSI

CmdrTaco posted more than 9 years ago | from the holstering-his-pistol dept.

News 503

Hope Thelps writes "According to an article on news.com.com, Eric Raymond is stepping down from his role as president of the OSI. His replacement will be our very own Russ Nelson. "

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Bye bye birdy (-1, Troll)

VE3ECM (818278) | more than 9 years ago | (#11543211)

I have karma to burn!

Did I do it?

Holy shite! (1, Funny)

VE3ECM (818278) | more than 9 years ago | (#11543232)

I *actually* got a first post.
I can not believe this is so!
Oh happy day! I think I shall call my mother and share with her the wonderous news!

Re:Holy shite! (4, Funny)

hoggoth (414195) | more than 9 years ago | (#11543262)

> I think I shall call my mother and share with her the wonderous news!

Don't shout. Just walk upstairs from the basement and tell her.

Hearing aid.... (1, Funny)

VE3ECM (818278) | more than 9 years ago | (#11543277)

Naw, I have to call. Her hearing aid is acting up.

Re:Hearing aid.... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#11543651)

His mother probably has a TDD phone, in which case, calling her is much better.

Re:Hearing aid.... (1)

eugene ts wong (231154) | more than 9 years ago | (#11543666)

You're hilarious. I would have modded you differently so that you might get to keep the Karma.

Re:Holy shite! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#11543514)

I'd hold that call if I were you...

[tt] You could see this one coming (-1, Flamebait)

daniil (775990) | more than 9 years ago | (#11543213)

The way i see it, it's a sign that Open Source is finally growing up. Fanatics like ESR might do good to the cause in the early stages of revolution, but in the longer run, they will always prove to be an annoyance and will be dealt with. See, for instance, what Stalin did with the veterans of the Russian Revolution, or how Fidel Castro got rid of Che. Every revolution has ended up eating its children; i can't see why the Open Source Revolution should be different.

Re:[tt] You could see this one coming (2, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#11543235)

Fanatics like ESR might do good to the cause in the early stages of revolution, but in the longer run, they will always prove to be an annoyance and will be dealt with. See, for instance, what Stalin did with the veterans of the Russian Revolution

So in this analogy, ESR is represented by the veterans, and Russ Nelson is Stalin? :/

Re:[tt] You could see this one coming (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#11543490)

Stalin killed over 3 million Gypsies.

Too bad ESR wasn't one of them.

Re:[tt] You could see this one coming (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#11543685)

Stalin killed over 3 million Gypsies. Too bad ESR wasn't one of them.

The Gypsies would have kicked ESR out for smelling too bad.

Re:[tt] You could see this one coming (1, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#11543247)

Yep, it's time to execute ESR. Might as well do RMS while were at it.

Re:[tt] You could see this one coming (-1, Flamebait)

Saeed al-Sahaf (665390) | more than 9 years ago | (#11543367)

I'm with 'ya on that! God knows Open Source can do without the images in the press of RMS picking fleas out of his beard as he pontificates on Socialism.

Here Here!!!! (2, Funny)

eno2001 (527078) | more than 9 years ago | (#11543304)

But no!!! You're wrong! You're so wrong! FOSS is different. It's not meant to fall victim to the ravings of mad dictators like Fidel or the commies. ESR is simply stepping down in order to let someone else have a turn. After all, what fairness would there be in not letting everyone in the community have a shot at being the top dog for a while? ESR probably has a lot of more important things to get on with right now. I hear he has a fantastic glass eye collection he's been working on for the past decade or so. That kind of thing consumes a lot of time and would prevent one from being able to participate in FOSS evangelizationism as ESR has done. Just imagine how great his collection of glass eyes is going to be after only a year or two of being away from the FOSS evangelizationism. It would put to shame the glass eye collection that Terry Gilliam used in the cut scenes from Brazil. I, for one, welcome our hiatus taking squanderlords! (In case you people are curious, I am completely substance free)

Re:[tt] You could see this one coming (2, Interesting)

JPelorat (5320) | more than 9 years ago | (#11543307)

See, for instance, what Stalin did with the veterans of the Russian Revolution, or how Fidel Castro got rid of Che. Every revolution has ended up eating its children; i can't see why the Open Source Revolution should be different.

Yeah, now it's free to slaughter 30 million developers and subjugate every user to its iron grasp for fifty years. WTF?

Re:[tt] You could see this one coming (2, Insightful)

eln (21727) | more than 9 years ago | (#11543311)

I think a lot of it may be that the OSI is interested in fulfilling its original goal of creating an environment in which corporations feel comfortable using and contributing to Open Source software, and while ESR had his purpose in building the bridge between open source development and the corporate world, he's not capable of exploiting what's on the other side of that bridge. He knows enough about the business world, and he's charismatic enough, to get his foot in the door, but he doesn't know how to close the deal.

Hopefully Russ Nelson, who I believe has a longer history as a professional consultant to these corporations, will be able to close the deal and get more of these corporations to support Open Source in a monetary way, rather than just paying lip service to the idea.

Re:[tt] You could see this one coming (4, Interesting)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#11543322)

Every revolution has ended up eating its children; i can't see why the Open Source Revolution should be different.

Actually, this isn't always the case. For instance, the American Revolution is a good counter-example. Not only were the original revolutionaries not "eaten" but flourished in the government that followed the revolution.

Re:[tt] You could see this one coming (5, Insightful)

Hope Thelps (322083) | more than 9 years ago | (#11543366)

For instance, the American Revolution is a good counter-example. Not only were the original revolutionaries not "eaten" but flourished in the government that followed the revolution.

Or at least, that's the way the eaters wrote the history books.

Re:[tt] You could see this one coming (1)

Usquebaugh (230216) | more than 9 years ago | (#11543518)

Hmmm,

go and check what happened to the original signatories of the constitution.

Re:[tt] You could see this one coming (4, Insightful)

mcc (14761) | more than 9 years ago | (#11543555)

The American Revolution wasn't a revolution, exactly. The people who orchestrated and lead the American Revolution weren't revolutionaries in the sense we normally use that word-- they were extant local political leaders, almost all of them elected local political leaders. The American Revolution wasn't the people rising up to overthrow a system, it was two empowered groups fighting over spheres of influence. The people generally happened to be on the same side as the empowered group that eventually won-- again, in large part they'd elected this empowered group-- but I don't think that's enough to call it a revolution.

The group who took control of Britain's holdings in America in the American Revolution-- the "founding fathers"-- were already established as the people who controlled America prior to 1750, 1750 being when Britain decided to stop taking a passive, absentee-landlord stance to its American colonies and instead assume a position of active control. The 26 years after that were basically a process of Britain's empowered group going going "hmm, you know, we own you, and we have the right to determine your affairs", and America's empowered group going "you don't have the right to determine our affairs, and you know what, come to think of it, you don't own us anymore either". We call this a revolution but "war for independence" would be a far more accurate way of putting it, since the American side of the war was 13 established and self-sufficient states and their goal was autonomy, not change.

Re:[tt] You could see this one coming (1)

plague3106 (71849) | more than 9 years ago | (#11543656)

By your reasoning, the communist revolution in Russia was not a revolution either..granted those involved in the revolution were not elected, but certainly a vast majority of the people didn't necessarily want the communists in power either. Just enough of the military, as I remember.

Re:[tt] You could see this one coming (4, Funny)

lucabrasi999 (585141) | more than 9 years ago | (#11543331)

. See, for instance, what Stalin did with the veterans of the Russian Revolution, or how Fidel Castro got rid of Che. Every revolution has ended up eating its children; i can't see why the Open Source Revolution should be different.

You know, a psychologist would probably be able to interpret many interesting things from your post.

Re:[tt] You could see this one coming (1, Interesting)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#11543396)

What does [tt] mean?

Re:[tt] You could see this one coming (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#11543483)

It means they're posting using an NNTP newsreader (though not an English one). You can read a little more about it <a href="/comments.pl?sid=137970&cid=11539952">here</ a>. On Tuesdays, a beta of Slash's NNTP server is opened up. You don't see a lot of these because NNTP news isn't really that popular these days.

--
// Professor J. R. Hartley
// ucbvax!deathstar!hartleyx!jrhartley
\\// BITNET: jrhartley%hartleyX.BITNET
XX !!TEAM AMIGA!!

Re:[tt] You could see this one coming (1)

tepples (727027) | more than 9 years ago | (#11543404)

Every revolution has ended up eating its children; i can't see why the Open Source Revolution should be different.

Because Dance Dance Revolution is now available as open source [stepmania.com] .

The problem is (4, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#11543409)

in the echo chamber of technology news, all it takes-- as ESR did-- to get branded as a "fanatic" is to speak your mind.

The stepping aside of the "fanatics" doesn't mean anything more or less than the stepping aside of people with opinions, vision, or a desire to succeed. In the future the "open source movement" will be run like a business, like traditional charities and not-for-profits: i.e., inefficiently, carelessly and by bloated fat parasites who care about their own career, not the organization. In the future, groups like OSI will be operated not for the benefit of open source, but for the benefit of the "grown up" OSI group and its personal power. And we will hail it as the "fanatics" losing power.

Does the person taking ESR's place at OSI represent this process? Probably not. But almost certainly his successor will.

Open source isn't a revolution. This isn't Vladmir Lenin trying to convince people to take up arms and shoot people. This is software development. It is a creative endeavor. In a revolution. Revolutions are tricky because you need people who inspire at the beginning and people who are stable after the beginning. But this isn't a revolution. What is creativity without inspiration?

Re:[tt] You could see this one coming (2, Interesting)

wrp103 (583277) | more than 9 years ago | (#11543414)

I'm not sure I agree with your examples, but I agree that it is a sign that Open Source is growing up. The article also mentioned how Open Source has transitioned from a few volunteer hackers to corporate backed programmers. GNU went through the same transformation, so again I view this as a good thing.

The only concern is how much influence corporate needs drive open source rather than individual desires. However, I think in the end the coporate influence can help solidify Open Source due to the pragmatic nature of most corporations. I would rather have one fairly standard tool (e.g., Open Office) that works pretty well, is quite common, etc. rather than a wide variety of tools that all do pretty much the same thing. Rather than building on the shoulders of those who came before, programmers tend to stand on their toes. ;^)

A good example of the problem I hope this will solve is the age old /. question: "Which Unix Distro do you recommend?" I'm guessing there are a lot of people who haven't tried Linux simply because it is too confusing taking that first step of getting a "Linux".

Re:[tt] You could see this one coming (1, Interesting)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#11543420)

The way i see it, it's a sign that Open Source is finally growing up.

Or a sign that the OSI is finally selling out.

First they approve Non-Free Sun licenses as Open. Now they lose the biggest spokesman for Open. What next, recruit Balmer and Schwartz to the OSI board?

Re:Sun owns OSI (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#11543629)

Actually Sun has owned OSI for quite a while.

After ESR posted the open letter that Java should be open source, it was only a matter of time before Sun had him booted.

Re:[tt] You could see this one coming (4, Informative)

blahtree (55190) | more than 9 years ago | (#11543522)

Fidel Castro did not get rid of Che. Che was given several high ranking posts in the government but he chose to leave in order to fight for other oppressed people.

Poor example.

Re:[tt] You could see this one coming (1)

Locke2005 (849178) | more than 9 years ago | (#11543524)

You seem to be confusing RMS with ESR. ESR is not a fanatic (except about guns).

[tt] ? (2, Interesting)

_Sprocket_ (42527) | more than 9 years ago | (#11543554)

...so is "[tt]" a new, friendly, and convenient Troll Tag system?

Uh, ESR is hardly a fanatic (5, Insightful)

FreeUser (11483) | more than 9 years ago | (#11543558)

The way i see it, it's a sign that Open Source is finally growing up. Fanatics like ESR might do good to the cause in the early stages of revolution, but in the longer run, they will always prove to be an annoyance and will be dealt with.

1. ESR is hardly a fanatic. He is much more of a pragmatist, falling somewhere between RMS and Torvalds, but much closer to Torvalds than Stallman.

2. OSI is an organization intended to promote Open Source software. As such it behooves OSI to have someone at the help that WON'T compromise the open source initiative's goals and philosophy, so arguing that his successor (who I know nothing about and wouldn't assume to be a great deal different than ESR) should be willing to change the organization's philosophy, political, or technical stance for some short term gain is very short sighted and ultimately destructive to the entire movement.

3. Having said all that, OSI has always been vulnerable to a "corporate takeover." Whether or not this is the case here (I kind of doubt it is), the position they've sought out as "mediator" between the corporate mindset and the free software movement certainly makes them vulnerable to that kind of thing.

4. I sleep much better knowing that RMS heads up the Free Software Foundation. These folks definite the stance of the movement. It isn't their job to compromise with those who oppose their philosophy, it is there job to articulate their philosophy and argue effectively for it. It is then up to the rest of us to choose our own stance, either 100% one or the other, or some middle-of-the-road mixture of the two. OSI falls somewhere in the middle, but to imply that moving toward the business end of the spectrum to the point where they become indistinguishable means the movement has "grown up" is to miss the whole point of the movement entirely.

Revolutions only eat their children when the revolution betrays its own ideals and becomes something very, very different. Contrast for example the Bolshevik/Communist revolution is Russia, which ran amok and never established communism, merely a dictatorship that called itself communist without practicing any of the economic or social advocated by Karl Marx, and the American revolution, which did remain true to its ideals for the most part and did in establish a democracy in its wake.

One became a monster with an entirely different agenda than the revolution and its revolutionaries while the other did not. One did "eat its children," while the other did not.

A more accurate statement would be to say that

"Each evoluton which betray itself and its ideals had ended uyp eating its children." In which case I can see every reason to expect the Free Software movement (and hopefull the Open Source movement with which it shares some adherents) should be different.

As a corallary, I would say that if history is any lesson, and if the Open Source (or Free Software) movmements do in fact "eat their children" we can pretty much understand that, at that point, they have betrayed themselves and everything they stand for, whith only the rhetoric remaining to gloss over an entirely different, probably very detrimental, agenda.

Luckilly I don't see any evidence of anything like that happening just yet.

Eating children .. NOT! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#11543572)

Obligatory Linus quote: "Eat my shorts" .. no, wait !

The replacement is more of a fanatic than ESR (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#11543605)

if there is any difference at all.

Coming ... and going (2, Informative)

fm6 (162816) | more than 9 years ago | (#11543645)

Fanatics like ESR might do good to the cause in the early stages of revolution, but in the longer run, they will always prove to be an annoyance and will be dealt with.
I see ESR not so much a fanatic as a self-righteous twit. And from what little I know of Russ Nelson, he's not much better. From his web site:
I have {no patience} for idiots who think that they can {hide from spammers} by having their email address removed from public HTML pages. Fortunately, they usually forget that Google is {publishing their "secrets"}.
I've used curlies to indicate links, one of which is broken, another points to an obsolete Google cache, and the third points to an old mailing list item [russnelson.com] that doesn't explain anything. If you're going to call thousands of people "idiots", the least you can do is attempt to justify your low evaluation.

If this kind of tantrum junkie is the best spokesperson the open source movement can find, they're really in trouble!

Praise the lord (-1, Redundant)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#11543215)

Hooray!

It looks like.. (4, Funny)

Joseph Vigneau (514) | more than 9 years ago | (#11543220)

Looks like Eric finally accepted the job offer from Microsoft.

Just kidding Eric, don't shoot me! :^)

Re:It looks like.. (-1, Flamebait)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#11543357)

You are such a fucking tool.

"Oh, he owns a gun, he must be a psychotic fucktoad!"
"Yeah, lets all shove our heads up our asses, turn our brains off, and roll around in a state of extreme bigotry and hatred as we insinuate that all gun owners are psychotic fucktoads that will just as soon kill you as give you the time of day!"

Re:It looks like.. (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#11543568)

Dude, you ever seen ESR?

Re:It looks like.. (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#11543586)

or maybe he just said "don't kill me" as a general comment made after implying that ESR would work for MS.

who said anything about the gun thing?

jesus christ man. some people are just looking for a cause.

less sugar in your diet.

Re:It looks like.. (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#11543607)

who said anything about the gun thing?

Umm, the OP did. He said "don't shoot me!"

Re:It looks like.. (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#11543638)

of course, "shoot" doesn't necessarily imply the use of a gun (bow&arrow, syringe, etc.)

But I think in the OP's case, it probably was in reference to a gun.

Re:It looks like.. (1)

Stradenko (160417) | more than 9 years ago | (#11543612)

FWIW, the OP said "Don't shoot me"

More info on Russ Nelson (4, Informative)

xmas2003 (739875) | more than 9 years ago | (#11543223)

The submissions mentioned Russ's Slashdot Page, but a lot more info about him can be found at his home page [russnelson.com] and/or his company Crynwr. [crynwr.com]

And for only $4.99/mo (2, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#11543267)

You can get secret naked pictures of him touching printouts of open source code for all of your F/OSS fetish needs!

Re:More info on Russ Nelson (3, Interesting)

Fruit (31966) | more than 9 years ago | (#11543543)

Interesting. He'll be heading OSI but does qmail and other djbsoftware consulting?

HE'S An ELF!!! (1)

HotNeedleOfInquiry (598897) | more than 9 years ago | (#11543624)

Ahhhhhhh......

Re:More info on Russ Nelson (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#11543682)

Hope his new job doesn't involve designing any web pages...

I look forward to the essay (5, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#11543226)

I look forward to his long-winded rambling pseudo-philosophical treatise on what it feels like to step down, and how that relates to the ethos of the Open Source movement.

Re:I look forward to the essay (2, Funny)

U1timateZer0 (855425) | more than 9 years ago | (#11543255)

I look forward to his long-winded rambling pseudo-philosophical treatise on what it feels like to step down, and how that relates to the ethos of the Open Source movement. I, for one, welcome our new long-winded, rambling, pseudo-philosophical overlords.

Re:I look forward to the essay (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#11543433)

haha no shit, ESR is a certifiable right-wing nutjob, and his writing is piss-awful. what a wanker. i look forward to "an free-market anarcho-capitalist metacontext for Stepping down, etc.."... TOTAL DOUCHEBAG THAT MAN IS.

Re:I look forward to the essay (2, Funny)

TheRaven64 (641858) | more than 9 years ago | (#11543508)

RTFA! He's not our overlord anymore...

Rigged (-1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#11543240)

The elections were rigged.

The way the ballot was designed, your vote counted for Russ Nelson, when in fact you were voting for Pat Buchanan.

Why (0, Flamebait)

superpulpsicle (533373) | more than 9 years ago | (#11543248)

Why the hell do we need another organization to promote open source. This is getting out of hand. Everyone is trying to be a chairman, CEO, head of board, so they start these unnecessary organizations.

How many foundations, consortiums, non-profit organizations we do need?! If you entity don't set financial, technical or legal standards, it's probably not really needed.

"OSI Certified" (3, Informative)

tepples (727027) | more than 9 years ago | (#11543321)

If you entity don't set financial, technical or legal standards, it's probably not really needed.

Open Source Initiative does in fact set legal standards. It maintains a definition of what constitutes an open source license and approves licenses for use with its OSI CERTIFIED branding program [opensource.org] .

Re:"OSI Certified" (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#11543610)

But thats redundant of them because the FSF [fsf.org] does the same thing. OSI was founded on the idea that corporations are scared of the word "freedom" and people with beards.

Re:Why (1)

k98sven (324383) | more than 9 years ago | (#11543359)

Why the hell do we need another organization to promote open source. This is getting out of hand. Everyone is trying to be a chairman, CEO, head of board, so they start these unnecessary organizations.

What 'other' organization? The OSI has been around for years. And they were founded by Bruce Perens, who can make the claim of having coined the term 'Open Source'.

If the OSI is an 'unnecessary' organization for promoting open source, then I don't know which one isn't.

Re:Why (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#11543418)

And they were founded by Bruce Perens, who can make the claim of having coined the term 'Open Source'.

Anyone can make the claim of having coined the term 'Open Source'. I don't think that Bruce would be dishonest enough to do so.

Re:Why (1, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#11543549)

Well, it says here [perens.com] :

"I am the person who first announced "Open Source" to the world, in an article carried on Slashdot and elsewhere."

He also trademarked the thing, wrote the OSI definition, and cofounded the OSI. I don't see why he couldn't or wouldn't be allowed to make that claim.

CALLING BRUCE PERENS (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#11543660)

Come on, we all know you have a Slashdot account. Are you going to let this crap stand? We both know that the term "open source" existed before you had any involvement at all. Please step up to the plate and say so to your adoring fans.

Re:Why (1)

lucabrasi999 (585141) | more than 9 years ago | (#11543371)

How many foundations, consortiums, non-profit organizations we do need?!

Has this post been throught the SUPPRG (Slashdot Users Preferred Posting Review Group) process?

Re:Why (1, Funny)

northcat (827059) | more than 9 years ago | (#11543644)

Know your history, bitch. OSI has been here for a long time, it was one the first ones, it's not "another" organisation. It's not new. It just changed the president.

Re:Why (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#11543675)

It just changed the president.

Three cheers for the OSI! Even ESR has got to be better than Bush. Maybe.

Re:Why (1)

SpyPlane (733043) | more than 9 years ago | (#11543678)

Excellent use of the word 'Bitch' here. Completely unexpected, but very appropriate. Thank you, that put a smile on my face.

Too many acronyms, I should still be working there (-1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#11543249)

ESR steps down from OSI? OMG! WTF! WARGTDN?
Dearest Michael,


It's been 4 long hours since I left your apartment. You looked so innocent as you slept. I kissed your cheek but a tear landed on your face. Thankfully you didn't wake up.

I can't go on like this, Michael. Yes, yes, yes; I have strong feelings for you but I've been so used. When I submit stories to slashdot and you accept them I just know that my bum is in for abuse that night. Certainly the money we split from the advertising should cover that part of our business arrangement, yes?

We never cuddle anymore. You never ask how my day was. When I get home you just say "Well, Roland, I accepted another submission" with your penis already erect and lubricated awaiting me. You never kiss me anymore. You never stroke my hand or send me flowers.

I cannot continue to be used like this.

It's over, Michael. Please don't try to find me.

Roland P.

769bfa901720ca09dd5fda25d1acdea2

MOD UP _ HILARIOUS (-1, Redundant)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#11543305)

hahaha

ObESR Link (3, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#11543254)

Fear not, knowledgeable people, and learn quite how full of shit [1accesshost.com] ESR is.

Re:ObESR Link (2, Interesting)

grub (11606) | more than 9 years ago | (#11543487)


A very interesting read. Thanks for the link.
... and mod the parent as Informative, you silly mods!

Misunderstading... (2, Informative)

Tellarin (444097) | more than 9 years ago | (#11543256)


ESR didn't step down, according to the article, he stepped aside. :)

Re:Misunderstading... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#11543274)

ESR didn't step down, according to the article, he stepped aside. :)

Probably as a prelude to pulling out a gun and shooting everyone present.

ESR stepping down from OSI ASAP? OMG! (2, Funny)

nganju (821034) | more than 9 years ago | (#11543261)


Obligatory Good Morning Vietnam:
"Excuse me sir, seeing as how the VP is such a VIP, shouldn't we keep the PC on the QT, because if it leaks to the VC, you could end up an MIA, and then we'd all be put on KP."

Re:ESR stepping down from OSI ASAP? OMG! (1)

lucabrasi999 (585141) | more than 9 years ago | (#11543402)

Sorry about the Troll, man.

Parent (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#11543436)

Why is the parent a troll?

Approval from the OSI? (4, Insightful)

tepples (727027) | more than 9 years ago | (#11543276)

From the article:

Approval from the OSI is required for all open-source licenses, which are used on thousands of products

Since when? Last time I checked, "open source" was a generic descriptor, and only use of the OSI CERTIFIED mark required approval from the Open Source Initiative.

Re:Approval from the OSI? (1, Interesting)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#11543326)

Approval from the OSI is required for all open-source licenses, which are used on thousands of products

That's why they stopped calling it 'free'. "Free as in you can't even write a license without our say so" didn't have quite the right ring to it.

Nice misinformation (4, Insightful)

Doug Neal (195160) | more than 9 years ago | (#11543280)

From the article:

Approval from the OSI is required for all open-source licenses, which are used on thousands of products, from the Linux operating system to the Firefox Web browser.

Erm, what? I don't need anyone to "approve" my software's license :P These business-orientated news sites have had fucking ages to get the facts right on all this stuff and they still can't do it.

Re: [tt] Nice misinformation (3, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#11543426)

That used to be true, but since the Open Source and Copyleft Act 2004, the OSI has been granted quasi-governmental status over Open Source licensing. Essentially, it's now illegal to create a new license that allows for the free distribution of code unless that license passes muster with the OSI.

The reasons for this are several fold. Part of it is to discourage new incompatable licenses (you can't use APSL code in Apache that can't be used in Perl that can't be used in Linux that can't be used in AROS, to give some examples.)

Part of it is to make sure that a uniform set of licenses is produced. It's no good having open source, if one group thinks you should email all changes to them, or another thinks they should be able to use your stuff in a proprietary program without permission. The OSI can level the playing field somewhat.

As you might imagine, ESR was behind the bill, lobbying for it extensively behind the scenes. "Sometimes, it takes a government to push forward progress" he said in a recent paper, "The Cauliflower and the Mattress". "We expect governments to do a job, and that's to provide for the common welfare. Open Source is a critical part of our welfare. It is at the heart not merely of the software that runs this country, but of our future. Some might say we would be better off in a world without schools, and healthcare, with only guns to defend ourselves. I say no, that's wrong. Totally backward that is. We don't need guns when we have open source. We don't need to defend ourselves when we have control over the code we run."

Google for "The Cauliflower and the Mattress" and you should find a copy. Inspiring words.

looks? (3, Funny)

bano (410) | more than 9 years ago | (#11543308)

Does this nelson guy look as retarded as ESR does?

Re:looks? (1, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#11543453)

You decide [russnelson.com]

Re:looks? (3, Interesting)

Jason Scott (18815) | more than 9 years ago | (#11543493)

Does this nelson guy look as retarded as ESR does?

Russ Nelson is one of the most steady-handed, brilliant, helpful people I've ever had the pleasure to know. I've been involved in small projects with him over the last decade and in every case, if static was being generated, it sure wasn't from Russ' corner.

I think people will be amazed at Russ' wisdom and even hand at making his opinion known or guiding the conversation/productiveness of any projects he leads. He is a uniter.

Any group that has him involved, is a lucky group indeed.

And he looks like a librarian. A really, really cool librarian.

Re:looks? (1)

swillden (191260) | more than 9 years ago | (#11543673)

Does this nelson guy look as retarded as ESR does?

You be the judge [russnelson.com]

A positive move (1)

Gothmolly (148874) | more than 9 years ago | (#11543333)

Anything which reduces the visibility, impact and influence of "ESR" can only be a good thing. Next we take down Cringely, Dvorak, Perens and JonKatz, and the "hoser level" of the technical world drops dramatically. I, for one, welcome our non-obnoxious, bathing-daily, non-debian-fanboy overlords.

Please, please, PLEASE... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#11543429)

...don't forget to sack the most frothing fanatic of them all, RMS!!

Re:A positive move (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#11543544)

Next we take down Cringely, Dvorak, Perens and JonKatz

Nooooo! Don't take away Jon Katz. I'll miss reading about his "adventures" [amazon.com] with sixteen sheep, three dogs and two donkeys. That man has stamina!

Russ Nelson... (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#11543335)

He's a Quaker
He's a Libertarian
He supports Austrian Economics
He seems to ACTUALLY use Gnu/Linux, not just pretend he does... ... AND he contributes to it!

... awesome! This guy might not be a sellout like the rest of the Slashdot guys! Where has Taco been hiding this guy? He looks like the first Slashdot editor I might actually respect.

OSI and its approval of licenses? (3, Interesting)

pikine (771084) | more than 9 years ago | (#11543338)

Approval from the OSI is required for all open-source licenses, which are used on thousands of products, from the Linux operating system to the Firefox Web browser. As open-source software expands in popularity, though, the number of open-source licenses is growing, which opens up myriad legal questions and creates some confusion over the definition of open-source.


I'm not sure I like the idea that OSI is pitching itself as "the authority" of license evaluation. Although it is a lot easier to ask the question, "is license A approved by OSI" to mean "is the software licensed under A open source for me" but the question is flawed. One has to recognized that free software licenses are not created equal. The difference of them, and the choice involved, is what makes open source great.

Re:OSI and its approval of licenses? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#11543384)

They were the ones which coined the term 'open source', why shouldn't they be 'the authority'?

If you don't like it, you can create your own definition and your own organization to authorize it.

OSI approval required for open-source licenses? (1, Redundant)

Eric Smith (4379) | more than 9 years ago | (#11543368)

From the article:
Approval from the OSI is required for all open-source licenses
How can that be? IIRC, OSI was not granted a trademark on the phrase "open source", so anyone can use it for nearly anything.

OSI isn't spreading FUD about the phrase "open source", are they?

Re:OSI approval required for open-source licenses? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#11543466)

OSI under ESR's leadership has become the defacto tyrant of the OS world. And yes, they pretty much lay claim to the definition of "Open Source" and you play by their rules or you get really shit upon. Let's hope that his stepping down will improve the situation.

Re:OSI approval required for open-source licenses? (2, Informative)

k98sven (324383) | more than 9 years ago | (#11543511)

IIRC, OSI was not granted a trademark on the phrase "open source", so anyone can use it for nearly anything.

No, not the OSI, but another organization founded by Bruce Perens, the SPI (Software in the Public Interest). Tradmark #75439502 [uspto.gov] .

Then there was a little scuffle where the OSI wanted the trademark from the SPI, and I think it ended up being abandoned, and now the OSI has their 'certification mark' instead.

But in any case, Perens was the guy who co-founded the OSI and coined the term, and at the very least he has a certain moral right to it.

So who is Russ? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#11543394)

A plant from Microsoft?

The guy who like Sun's "OSI Approved" non-free license?

A good guy?

At least we knew what ESR stood for (Open).

ready to try to spend his sudden wealth? (5, Funny)

chuckfee (93392) | more than 9 years ago | (#11543442)

Or better yet, to write his reflections on going through life with a complete lack of social skills?

Tweedle dumb replaced by tweedle dumber (1, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#11543520)

In other news tweedle dumb replaced by tweedle dumber, and tweedle dumb replaces tweedle dee.

Who the hell is Russ Nelson? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#11543527)

...if I may ask...

Re:Who the hell is Russ Nelson? (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#11543547)

another libertarian nutcase...

Just when I thought (2, Funny)

northcat (827059) | more than 9 years ago | (#11543533)

A slashdot user becomes the head OSI. I think I'll burn down my computer now.

Attn: Bill Gates (1)

stephenisu (580105) | more than 9 years ago | (#11543545)

"One of the most important parts of any founder or leader's responsibility is to know when to step aside." --Eric Raymond, co-founder, OSI

Mod (1)

digitalgimpus (468277) | more than 9 years ago | (#11543661)

Why do I have this feeling some anti open source troll is going to mod down all of his posts just because they know who he is?

I'm surpised slashdot posted his name like that. Especially with recent posts.
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