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145 comments

Michael Sims Fired, Joins GNAA to Troll Slashdot F (-1, Troll)

Yahweh Seba'ot (856211) | more than 9 years ago | (#11568429)

Michael Sims Fired, Joins GNAA to Troll Slashdot Full Time

FREMONT, CA (TECHNEWS) - After a heated debate at Slashdot executive offices, editor Michael Sims was locked out of the building and departed in a tirade of lisping insults, vowing revenge immediately. This morning, industry sources revealed that Sims has joined the infamous trolling organization Gay Nigger Association of America with the intent of trolling Slashdot fulltime.

In a short phone interview with Technews, Sims asserted that he was calm but resolved on his course of action. "The Slashdot editors and I had a disagreement," he explained. "I did it all for the users, but they..." he drew the syllable out painfully, resting on a case full of Little League trophies and certificates of participation from transgendered dating services, "They just couldn't take my truth. They were -- babies, just babies, oh, the horror, the abomination," he said, before being led away by three white-clad male nurses.

According to Harvard Psychology Professor Arnold Rothstahlberg, "trolling" is an internet phenomenon where dissenting users disrupt a site by flooding it with absurd or paradoxical information. "It satisfies the primal id," he said, chewing on a large, bulbous, phallic black cigar. "To justify themselves by forcing their enemies into hysterics. It's a compensatory mechanism much like getting back at the kids who beat you up in high school by installing Linux and using it to pingflood their XP boxes and Macs."

Slashdot editor CmdrTaco was reticent to comment. At an interview conducted in the crap-filled Ann Arbor bungalow he shares with his wife, to whom he proposed over Slashdot, he said, "Well, you know, Slashdot is just a web site. Michael should calm down about this. But if he doesn't, our corporate sponsors will sue him until he's giving $4 blowjobs on Haight Street."

From the GNAA corporate headquarters, a mysterious floating island off the coast of Newfoundland that few reporters have seen and even fewer have returned from with their sexual identities intact, GNAA "Head Programmer" timecop said he was glad to have Sims on hand. "From what I've seen of his postings on Slashdot," said timecop, "he's a total fag. Which is convenient as all our halfops need anal, and I can't handle the drama. That's what's worst about the net: the drama."

Sims has been involved in previous internet firefights, most notably the controversy over the censorware.org website in 2001. While Sims alleges that the site was his creation that was sabotaged by others, his coworkers disagree. Bennett Haselton, security consultant for the "Anarchy Anal" and "Chaos Cumshot" websites, said of Sims, "We set up this website, and left him the password. We have a disagreement, bam, the website goes down and someone raped my two-week-old Labrador puppy with an iPod."

Slashdot Editor CowboyNeal, who was entangled in a whale net after attempting to swim the English channel, spoke fondly of his former coworker. "Michael always brought a certain passion to the work, a passion that was easily ignited and led to many sweaty sessions in the corporate washroom," he said. "I'm not at all surprised he joined an organization of gay niggers. He always like something different and unique in his pasta salads."

Programmer Seth Finkelstein alleges that Sims is "totally unstable" and agreed readily to this interview. "Of course, I'm a disinterested observer," he said. "But anytime I see that closet psychopath and monkey nut-muncher stealing the spotlight from hardworking programmers like myself, I have to speak up, for the benefit of the people, of course," he said. Technews reporters were permitted to leave the premises only after making a PayPal donation to Finkelstein.

Mike Godwin of the EFF, who balances a career as privacy advocate with his hobby of making videos of teen swingers blowing goats, agreed. "I've never met another editor like Michael," he said. "And, since my regimen of retrovirals is already costing me an arm and a leg, I hope I never do." Godwin mentioned that Sims believes his trolling of Slashdot is providing a "different perspective" that benefits "the broader Linux, er, Slashdot, community."

When Technews returned to interview Sims, he spoke softly and with conviction. "They don't have the interests of the user community at heart," he said. Suddenly he was pounding his desk in tears. "Those bastards cut off my lifeline, my raison d'etre," he sobbed. His voice and eyes became clear, a hatred burning behind the lenses. "I'll crapflood every Linux kernel update from now until oblivion. They haven't heard the last... of Michael Sims," he said.



About GNAA:
GNAA (GAY NIGGER ASSOCIATION OF AMERICA) is the first organization which gathers GAY NIGGERS from all over America and abroad for one common goal - being GAY NIGGERS.

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  • Second, you need to succeed in posting a GNAA First Post [wikipedia.org] on slashdot.org [slashdot.org] , a popular "news for trolls" website.
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Talk to one of the ops or any of the other members in the channel to sign up today! Upon submitting your application, you will be required to submit links to your successful First Post, and you will be tested on your knowledge of GAYNIGGERS FROM OUTER SPACE.

If you are having trouble locating #GNAA, the official GAY NIGGER ASSOCIATION OF AMERICA irc channel, you might be on a wrong irc network. The correct network is NiggerNET, and you can connect to irc.gnaa.us as our official server. Follow this link [irc] if you are using an irc client such as mIRC.

If you have mod points and would like to support GNAA, please moderate this post up.

.________________________________________________.
| ______________________________________._a,____ | Press contact:
| _______a_._______a_______aj#0s_____aWY!400.___ | Gary Niger
| __ad#7!!*P____a.d#0a____#!-_#0i___.#!__W#0#___ | gary_niger@gnaa.us [mailto]
| _j#'_.00#,___4#dP_"#,__j#,__0#Wi___*00P!_"#L,_ | GNAA Corporate Headquarters
| _"#ga#9!01___"#01__40,_"4Lj#!_4#g_________"01_ | 143 Rolloffle Avenue
| ________"#,___*@`__-N#____`___-!^_____________ | Tarzana, California 91356
| _________#1__________?________________________ |
| _________j1___________________________________ | All other inquiries:
| ____a,___jk_GAY_NIGGER_ASSOCIATION_OF_AMERICA_ | Enid Al-Punjabi
| ____!4yaa#l___________________________________ | enid_indian@gnaa.us [mailto]
| ______-"!^____________________________________ | GNAA World Headquarters
` _______________________________________________' 160-0023 Japan Tokyo-to Shinjuku-ku Nishi-Shinjuku 3-20-2

Copyright (c) 2003-2004 Gay Nigger Association of America [www.gnaa.us]

Re:Michael Sims Fired, Joins GNAA to Troll Slashdo (-1, Troll)

letchhausen (95030) | more than 9 years ago | (#11568748)

Man I wish I had some mod points to bestow on this baby! I love that movie and only wish that I had documented that slashdot first post that I made cowardly (of course) as "anonymous coward". Oh I am thimply all a tizzy oveth thith!

I am also glad that someone has finally revealed to me the only good use that I have ever heard of for an iPod!

I hope the kid tried to bite him... (0, Offtopic)

Ads are broken (718513) | more than 9 years ago | (#11568430)

Associated Press

JACKSONVILLE, Fla. -- Daunte Culpepper showed off his scrambling ability Wednesday -- in a crowded convention center ballroom.

Daunte Culpepper looks over his baubles before handing them over -- temporarily -- to Jerry Townsend.

The Minnesota Vikings quarterback presented a paralyzed high school football player two diamond necklaces worth about $75,000 during an NFL awards ceremony, but then awkwardly asked for them back after it was finished.

The apparent gift prompted a mother to cry, a father to think about buying a safe to store it and Culpepper to find a way out of the mess.

"I'll get him something else," Culpepper said sheepishly.

The confusion began at the FedEx ground and air player of the year honors, where finalists Culpepper, Peyton Manning, Shaun Alexander and Curtis Martin were on stage for the announcement.

When the master of ceremonies opened the floor for questions, Jerry Townsend spoke up from his wheelchair in the front row.

"Hey Daunte, can I get some of that ice?" he said in a low voice, referring to the two sparkling necklaces hanging around Culpepper's neck.

Culpepper jumped up, pulled them off and brought them over to Townsend, a senior defensive back at Jacksonville Episcopal High School who was paralyzed from the neck down while making a tackle in October.

Townsend spent the last four months in various hospitals and was released Wednesday -- just in time to go to the Super Bowl event.

After Culpepper put the necklaces around Townsend's neck, his mother started to cry. His father talked about needing to get a safe for the expensive jewelry.

Culpepper, meanwhile, went back to his seat and finished the awards ceremony (Manning won the air award, and Martin won the ground one). After it was over, Culpepper patiently answered dozens of questions while keeping a close eye on his jewelry across the room.

One of the diamond-laced necklaces was the No. 11, Culpepper's jersey number, and the other was a large pepper (for Culpepper).

"Where's that kid at? I've got to get my stuff back," Culpepper said.

Culpepper then walked over to the Townsends and asked them to write down their address so he could send them something else. Culpepper wasn't sure what it would be.

In an unrelated note, Culpepper will appear in a 60-second NFL Network commercial to air during the Super Bowl along with several other players and coaches from around the league that didn't make it to the big game. They'll be singing "Tomorrow," a tune from the musical "Annie."

This is easy... (4, Funny)

AntiPasto (168263) | more than 9 years ago | (#11568443)

... Microsoft has to let the Sun shine, or else they'd kill all their customers!

Re:This is easy... (1)

CheeseburgerBlue (553720) | more than 9 years ago | (#11568524)

Nonsense. Since the dawn of time man has yearned to destroy the sun.

Re:This is easy... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#11569408)

Nonsense. If that were true, we'd not have invented lightbulbs or fire.

Best quote (2, Insightful)

bartash (93498) | more than 9 years ago | (#11568455)

Gosling described the DMCA, which was passed in the United States a few years ago, as "really vile."

Re:Best quote (1, Funny)

Sophrosyne (630428) | more than 9 years ago | (#11568502)

He must be a terar'ist!!! If you don't like America- LEAVE!

Re:Best quote (-1, Offtopic)

Relyt (96115) | more than 9 years ago | (#11568597)

How in the heck did this get modded as Insightful?

The mind boggles.

Re:Best quote (1, Troll)

xstonedogx (814876) | more than 9 years ago | (#11568635)

If I understand the moderation system correctly, Funny points don't count towards Karma, and some moderators consider that unfair, so instead use one of the other modifiers.

One of the moderators obviously has an ironic sense of humor since he moderated your question "Informative". :)

Re:Best quote (2, Funny)

Macphisto (62181) | more than 9 years ago | (#11570107)

If I understand the moderation system correctly

Hmm.. given the current score of "0, Troll" for your comment, perhaps you do not understand the moderation system correctly.

Re:Best quote (1)

xstonedogx (814876) | more than 9 years ago | (#11570269)

Does one decision to moderate my post -1 Troll have any relation to whether or not what I said was factual and accurate? If so, given my current karma rating of "Good" for my commenting history, perhaps I understand it correctly after all?

Re:Best quote (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#11568743)

Because Gosling is Canadian?

Re:Best quote (0, Offtopic)

Frogbert (589961) | more than 9 years ago | (#11569247)

Hey if you don't like our American moderation system then you can GEEEDDDOUT

He's indeed a terrorist... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#11569131)

after all, he came from Canuckistan!

James Gosling and Hypocrisy (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#11568529)

When James Gosling talks, nobody listens. He is one of the people who advocated keeping Java within Sun [phrusa.org] in order to prevent Java from being a public standard.

of course it means less and less (1)

Triumph The Insult C (586706) | more than 9 years ago | (#11568457)

and it will continue to do so until Sun realizes this, then sues Microsoft again on the basis that they didn't get quite what they expected from the lawsuit

that sounds familiar

software partnerships / tech partnerships (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#11569637)

They do not work.

The exist for two reasons:
1. Company A wants to slow down / misguide company B
2. Company A wants to learn how to sell, maintain, and build their own copy of software for a given market (e.g., MS partneering with Sybase for Sybase 4.x and then MS releasing Microsoft SQL Server 6.0 withtout Sybase. A perfectly legal thing to do which Sybase agreed to ).

Duh (1)

wombatmobile (623057) | more than 9 years ago | (#11568473)

The $1.9B was a one-time payment.

Re:Duh (1)

Sophrosyne (630428) | more than 9 years ago | (#11568533)

What many people don't realize is that it was paid in Flooz.com stock!

I wonder... (2, Interesting)

rackhamh (217889) | more than 9 years ago | (#11568493)

Will Sun serve as an example for other companies to not pursue Microsoft, and wait for governments to do the dirty work instead?

Re:I wonder... (1, Interesting)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#11569671)


Sun pursued Microsoft for years, and finally got a cool 2 billion for it. 2 billion is, what, 4% of Microsoft's cash? A 4% hit is actually pretty big, considering the size of these companies.

I'm confused (5, Insightful)

PDXNerd (654900) | more than 9 years ago | (#11568504)

Since when did a business partnership with Microsoft ever "mean" anything anyway (except decreased revenues)?

Re:I'm confused (1)

GonerDoug (814114) | more than 9 years ago | (#11568518)

c'mon, aren't you ALL signed up as MicroSoft 'Partners' too?

Re:I'm confused (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#11568531)

If by "partnered" you mean fucking, why yes - I do enjoy fucking Microsoft, thanks.. And no, that doesn't threaten my masculinity (whether it should or not is another question...)

Howdy (Unequal) Partner! (1, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#11568651)

In Republican America, Microsoft fucks YOU!

Re:I'm confused (4, Interesting)

cduffy (652) | more than 9 years ago | (#11568785)

Yup, our VP of Engineering signed us up, much to IT's dismay -- as part of the contract we agreed to do a bunch of stuff we never had any intention of (like building a MS-certified product, though we're a Java shop) and agreed to let the BSA audit us at will... and in return we got a bunch of licenses (time-limited unless we renew), most of which have enough strings on them to be useful for nothing except building products that interoperate with the MS products in question. Bah!

PS - This post is a work of fiction. It's quite certainly not intended to reflect the politics, actions, etc. of any employer of mine, past or present, and any such similarity is mere coincidence.

Re:I'm confused (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#11568584)

Umm, this "partnership" is more along the lines of Sun sucessfully suing Microsoft and making them their bitch.

Re:I'm confused (1)

TOWebstress (855727) | more than 9 years ago | (#11568602)

Oh come on...don't they sometimes partner with them before buying them out and swallowing all their best products?

Re:I'm confused (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#11569004)

You know I honestly read that as "deceased revenues" the first time around.

Re:I'm confused (5, Informative)

FuzzyBad-Mofo (184327) | more than 9 years ago | (#11569124)

Maybe after the FBI's Virtual Case File [cnn.com] disaster, Microsoft Certified Partners [saic.com] will realize that you don't build a mission-critical application from the computer equivilant of Lincoln Logs.

Re:I'm confused (1)

Thundersnatch (671481) | more than 9 years ago | (#11569718)

Ahh, more unfounded MS-bashing.

From the articles cited, it certianly sounds like shoddy management and planning caused this project failure, not a particular piece of software. Certainly it would have been reported widely if bugs in the .NET environment made the project flop?

SAIC, like all huge consultancies, deals with just about every technology and platform. SAIC also does huge Java projects [softwarerevolution.com] . By your logic, why should we not assume that Java at fault for the VCF failure?

Anyway, something as big as VCF almost certainly involved multiple platforms, and I'll bet you dollars to doughnuts there were plenty of non-MS platforms and technologies in the mix.

Re:I'm confused (1)

FuzzyBad-Mofo (184327) | more than 9 years ago | (#11569768)

There seems to be a dearth of actual technology details on VCS, but here's a little tidbit for you: A page on Microsoft's own servers linking MS, SAIC, and VCS [microsoft.com] (near the bottom of the page).

EULA, DMCA and Reverse Engineering. (5, Insightful)

sanityspeech (823537) | more than 9 years ago | (#11568507)

From the article:
"In the past, what we'd have to do is reverse-engineering, and we had been getting into a pickle, because for open-source projects like Samba and OpenOffice, the only way to get the information was by reverse-engineering," he said."Pretty much for ALL the countries in the world, reverse-engineering was a perfectly fine thing to do."
Seeing that EULAs [wikipedia.org] existed long before the DMCA [wikipedia.org] came into effect, how on earth was it possible to develop a wonderful tool like SAMBA [samba.org] without some reverse engineering? My guess is some EULA(s) must have been violated. Surely, Microsoft could not have supported that.

IANAL, so enlightenment on this matter would be greatly appreciated.

Re:EULA, DMCA and Reverse Engineering. (5, Insightful)

cduffy (652) | more than 9 years ago | (#11568567)

Let's say that I'm a UNIX guy. I don't own a copy of Microsoft Windows. I never agreed to their EULA.

I observe and reverse-engineer an over-the-wire file transfer protocol between two computers owned by my friends.

Now, tell me: How is any EULA violated? I never agreed to it in the first place, so I can't be violating it.

Re:EULA, DMCA and Reverse Engineering. (1)

cecom (698048) | more than 9 years ago | (#11568641)

Now, tell me: How is any EULA violated? I never agreed to it in the first place, so I can't be violating it.

Not you - your friends violated the EULA by allowing you to use their computers to reverse engineer the protocol. I have never actually read an EULA in its entirety (who has?), but there must be something in there that prohibits that :-)

Re:EULA, DMCA and Reverse Engineering. (3, Interesting)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#11568679)

No because I never touch there computer, there computer access my network where I capture the packets and reverse engineer it.

They only tell me if it works or not... they try and connect to my implementation and they tell me if it works or not.

I never sign the agreement so I am clean, and they never reverse engineer.

Re:EULA, DMCA and Reverse Engineering. (1)

Pig Hogger (10379) | more than 9 years ago | (#11568825)

No because I never touch there computer, there computer access my network where I capture the packets and reverse engineer it.
Even better: use a wireless network!!!

Re:EULA, DMCA and Reverse Engineering. (2, Interesting)

droopycom (470921) | more than 9 years ago | (#11569094)


Windows guys tell Unix guy if it works or not...
Unix guy ask Windows guys to do some operation...

It seems to me that this is a conspiracy to Reverse Engineer...

I mean, as soon as the Windows guy and the Unix guys start speaking about what they are doing in relation with the product it seems pretty clear to me that the
1/ Windows guy is violating the Reverse engineering clause in the EULA he agreed to.
2/ The Unix guy is using Windows by proxy so he has to agree with the EULA.

This may seem far fetched (even to me) but from a lawyer POV....

Re:EULA, DMCA and Reverse Engineering. (3, Insightful)

KarmaMB84 (743001) | more than 9 years ago | (#11569689)

That's how reverse engineering works and it used to be perfectly legal. How do you think we have "IBM compatible" PCs? ;p

Re:EULA, DMCA and Reverse Engineering. (1)

lawpoop (604919) | more than 9 years ago | (#11568691)

The friends didn't allow him to use their computers. They just all happened to be on the same network. Unix guy observed the wire while Windows guys used their own respective computers to share data. Is there a EULA violation there?

Re:EULA, DMCA and Reverse Engineering. (2, Interesting)

cecom (698048) | more than 9 years ago | (#11568944)

The friends didn't allow him to use their computers. They just all happened to be on the same network. Unix guy observed the wire while Windows guys used their own respective computers to share data. Is there a EULA violation there?

I have no idea. But who knows what could happen in a court ? It could be argued that such reverse engineering can not happen without at least some level of cooperation with the Windows-using friends (the Unix guy must find out in some way what SMB operations they are trying to perform, or ask them to do something, etc).

Realistically, you need extended time with full access to a Windows machine in order to do any useful reveres-engineering. However, does using somebody else's machine consitute an EULA violation, when you didn't agree to the EULA?

My head hurts. I will shut up (and move to Europe) :-)

I will shut up

Re:EULA, DMCA and Reverse Engineering. (1)

superpulpsicle (533373) | more than 9 years ago | (#11569546)

In the U.S you can't breathe the same air as Steve Ballmer and friends approves it.

The irony is that so many other countries are fully using pirated versions of windows, and they don't give a fuck about M$ EULA. I want to say Asia has got to be the worst.

All depends on if I told my friend that I was. (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#11569079)

Packet monitoring is normal for linux servers.

So the EULA does not apply. This reversing happens in server rooms. As part of normal network monitoring. Ok that normal so if I replay that it sould work.

Re:EULA, DMCA and Reverse Engineering. (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#11568663)

I believe this is a set up to one of those classic jokes:

How many lawyers does it take to _____________?

Re:EULA, DMCA and Reverse Engineering. (2)

Chester K (145560) | more than 9 years ago | (#11568761)

I observe and reverse-engineer an over-the-wire file transfer protocol between two computers owned by my friends. Now, tell me: How is any EULA violated? I never agreed to it in the first place, so I can't be violating it.

Probably for the exact same reason you can't legally use a DirecTV decoder; even though you may have never agreed to their terms of service, and even though their signal is being broadcast onto your property.

No, the fact that you'll get yourself in a heapload of trouble by observing something that was presented to you may not seem to be "common sense", but those are the breaks of living in this society. If you don't like it, don't post about it on Slashdot; go buy some Senators and Congressmen.

Re:EULA, DMCA and Reverse Engineering. (1)

cduffy (652) | more than 9 years ago | (#11568817)

Probably for the exact same reason you can't legally use a DirecTV decoder; even though you may have never agreed to their terms of service, and even though their signal is being broadcast onto your property.

Seems a non-sequitur to me: DirecTV's broadcasts include anti-circumvention technology, so the DMCA applies to attempts to reverse-engineer them. The same isn't true of SMB/CIFS.

Re:EULA, DMCA and Reverse Engineering. (3, Funny)

complete loony (663508) | more than 9 years ago | (#11568911)

... the fact that you'll get yourself in a heapload of trouble by observing something that was presented to you ...

Yeah I know what you mean. She was the one standing naked with the curtains open, I don't know what all the fuss was about.

Re:EULA, DMCA and Reverse Engineering. (1)

vandan (151516) | more than 9 years ago | (#11570011)

No, the fact that you'll get yourself in a heapload of trouble by observing something that was presented to you may not seem to be "common sense", but those are the breaks of living in this society. If you don't like it, don't post about it on Slashdot; go buy some Senators and Congressmen.

Good to see someone else has a handle on American politics. The problem is that we don't have the money to buy congressmen and senators. The system is certainly rigged in favour of big business.

This is why I get so offended when I see the US claiming that they will bring their flavour of 'democracy' to Iraq ... and the rest of the world. Democracy is an absolute failure in the US. The DMCA is but one example of this fact. There are a plethory of others, and I'm sure Bush will present us with yet more examples in his coming reign of terror.

Re:EULA, DMCA and Reverse Engineering. (2, Funny)

KarmaBlackballed (222917) | more than 9 years ago | (#11568765)

You have a point about circumventing EULAs to reverse engineer protocols. Thank heaven the DMCA was created to plug that nasty loop-hole!

And it is a win-win. We win because now we can all rest easier knowing that big existing companies have less pressure to waste money on technical innovation. And companies also win because we taxpayers pay for DMCA enforcement through our federal tax dollars! (Or did I get the win-win backward, they win the first, we win on the second? Ahhh, forget it.)

Re:EULA, DMCA and Reverse Engineering. (1)

heybo (667563) | more than 9 years ago | (#11568810)

You got a very good point, Especially if you own the LAN that your two friends are on. You gave them to permission to be on your network. It being your network it would seem you could do whatever you want with captured packets. You have a legal right to sniff your own network. When it is on the wire it is TCP IP packets these are built using open standards and you own the hardware and the wire it is traveling on. There is no M$ on the wire. Bill and Steve's lawyers will figure something out.

Re:EULA, DMCA and Reverse Engineering. (1, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#11568583)

Because along the way, there was some ruling or whatnot, I don't recall exactly, that said a protocol can inherently be reverse-engineered, despite any EULAs about it.

I think the issue is allowing competition. By locking a protocol, the protocol's owner essentially controls the market around that protocol. But people have the right to interop with that service.

This was a big point about the IBM antitrust suit, about the AT&T antitrust lawsuit, etc.

Because a EULA is a contract of adhesion (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#11568746)

It can only enforce certain things. In California one of the things it can't enforce is release of fair use rights including reverse engineering. There are some famous technologies which would not exist if they were enforceable. From another perspective: Federal copyright law trumps state contract law. However some other states have now decided things the other way... maybe someday the Supreme Court will make a final decision one way or the other.

Re:EULA, DMCA and Reverse Engineering. (2, Interesting)

nbert (785663) | more than 9 years ago | (#11568760)

AFAIK SMB used to be an open protocol, so there wasn't any reverse-engineering involved. CIFS might be a different story.

Re:EULA, DMCA and Reverse Engineering. (2, Informative)

fodZ (645669) | more than 9 years ago | (#11568895)

My guess is some EULA(s) must have been violated.

In Europe at least it is an explictly recognised right of a user to reverse engineer software to the extent necessary to make it interoperate with any other software you have. EULAs cannot exclude this right, and you often see it specifically mentioned that you are allowed to do this in European EULAs.

Re:EULA, DMCA and Reverse Engineering. (2, Interesting)

webhat (558203) | more than 9 years ago | (#11569098)

In the Netherlands you can still reverse engineer, even if a EULA forbids it. Once you've paid for it it's yours to do with what you wish. If you want to stick it through a decompiler or examine the assembly you can.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but if I remember correctly the DMCA even provides for reverse engineering if it is for interoperability that the provider won't or can't provide. So if some provider of software doesn't and won't provide a feature it's in your right to create that feature. IANAL so don't take my word for it.

I can't wait for a virus writer to sue Norton or McAfee for DMCA violations. That would be fun.

Re:EULA, DMCA and Reverse Engineering. (1)

Skuld-Chan (302449) | more than 9 years ago | (#11569228)

Isn't samba based on RFC 1001 (written in the 80's)? I suspect Windows used the same documentation. Two things not covered by that RFC are NT 3/4 domain controllers and ADS domain controllers - neither of which samba work with all that reliably.

Re:EULA, DMCA and Reverse Engineering. (1)

Trepalium (109107) | more than 9 years ago | (#11569574)

Microsoft's file sharing uses NETBIOS for naming, etc, but there are other elements to it, too. Microsoft published a draft to the IETF for CIFS [ubiqx.org] (formerly SMB). It's only a subset of the functionality that Windows actually supports, and it was chock full of errors and omissions. There were also several books written about SMB. The earliest I can find is Protocols for X/Open PC Interworking: SMB, Version 2 [opengroup.org] , published October 1992. The first version may have been published more than two years earlier, in January 1990, but I'm having difficulty finding that information. The Samba site says that the first version, developed in 1992, was based on reverse engineering the wire protocol of the MS-DOS SMB client. The later versions may have made use of this other documentation.

Partnership? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#11568517)

Partnership with Micro$oft? It reminds me of this partnership I once had as a gimp with that sadist lady domina...

It's simple (5, Insightful)

michelcultivo (524114) | more than 9 years ago | (#11568522)

Sun dominate the Enterprise users and Microsoft dominate the low-end users with their software, one is trying to acquire knowledge from another. Very simple, even a penguin [linux.com] can see this.

Re:It's simple (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#11568570)

Nice linkwhoring but its a little more complicated than you make it.

Basically, Microsoft controls the directory services in many corporations, and Sun needs to interoperate with them or be left out in the cold for certain applications. (No, NDS flames pls, just telling you how it is).

Slashdotted - Here's the article text (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#11568527)

WASHINGTON, DC--The avian influenza virus, a mutant flu strain that has claimed the lives of 31 people in Eastern Asia since it was first observed passing from birds to humans in 1997, has the nation's foremost alarmists extremely agitated.

Above: Representatives from the Alarmist Council.
"Right now, the bird flu is just a blip in the newspapers, but if the avian influenza virus undergoes antigenic shift with a human influenza virus, the resulting subtype could be highly contagious and highly lethal in humans," Matthew Wexler, the president of the National Alarmist Council and one of the nation's leading fear mongers, said Monday. "My professional opinion, and more importantly, my personal belief, is that this is a cause for great national alarm."

Wexler's sentiments were unanimously upheld by members of the alarmist community.

"The bird flu could cause a global influenza pandemic similar to the Spanish Flu that killed more than 20 million people in 1918," medical alarmist Dr. Preston Douglas said. "Many experts also believe a major global flu outbreak to be imminent, if not--God forbid--already underway. Why, recent observation and documentation has recorded at least one case of human-to-human transmission of a rare strain of the avian influenza virus. If this one case is proof that the animal virus is mutating into a contagious, lethal human virus, then the entire world is basically doomed. Doomed!"

Douglas is best known for his brilliant alarmist analyses of flesh-eating bacteria, Ebola, and SARS--all of which he successfully developed into topics of major international trepidation.

Bird flu was first identified as a strain of infectious influenza in Italy in the early 1900s. Of the 15 subtypes, only subtypes H5 and H7 are known to be capable of crossing the species barrier from birds to humans. The first human outbreak, which occurred in Hong Kong in 1997, killed four people. Since then, the bird flu has remained a relatively minor virus, killing fewer individuals than common-cold variants. The Centers for Disease Control and Prevention have issued neither an epidemic warning nor a public-health alert in connection with bird flu.

According to leading alarmists, the CDC's lack of immediate concern is a cause for alarm.

"So, basically, the CDC doesn't have the first inkling of what to do about a potentially explosive form of flu that infects ducks and chickens," said Fox News Science, Health, and Epidemics Commentator Marylinne Kent. "Given the popularity of these two birds as a food source among Asians, and the fact that we have no idea how many undocumented Asians have settled illegally in our nation, the potential for danger is extremely high."

"I urge you all to think of your families," Kent added.

Harold Jefferson, a founding member of the American National Citizen's Institute for Alarm, read from a prepared statement Tuesday.

"We have to face the facts: This isn't just a rapacious killer that could be incubating anywhere within our borders and for which there is no known cure," Jefferson said. "It is also an indicator of the profound indifference of millions of American citizens. Mark my words: People who aren't scared now will look pretty stupid if it turns out that they should have been."

Jefferson added: "The bird flu could someday claim as many lives as Mad Cow Disease."

Ruth Herrin, the New York Post's veteran panic expert, has relied heavily on information provided by alarmists in the scientific community.

"Listen, I'm no disease expert," Herrin said. "But I know that people should be warned about global devastation any time a devastation scenario can be extrapolated from an actual news report. And for the 16th consecutive month, that time is now."

None of the nation's 15,000 certified alarmists have offered a strategy to deal with a possible outbreak.

"Listen, finding cures is not my job," Wexler said. "I just report the facts as best and as briefly as I can. Then I interpret them in what I, as an alarmist, believe to be the most effective fashion. And if what I perceive here is real--namely, a looming epidemic and an atmosphere of apathy and fatalism in the U. S. medical community--then we are facing Armageddon."

Re:Slashdotted - Here's the article text (-1, Redundant)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#11568920)

I find it funny some mods modded this "Informative".

I beg to differ (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#11568537)

The partnership may mean little to James Gosling in his division's day to day activities, but what about for the rest of the company?

The lines seem to be drawing themselves out - on one side, we have Sun, Microsoft; on the other, it's IBM, Red Hat, Novell and the rest of the pro-Linux crowd.

And then there is HP, trying to do a dance right in the middle, but getting smacked by the fodder coming from both sides.

Re:I beg to differ (2, Interesting)

Bondolo (14225) | more than 9 years ago | (#11568981)

I have to take exception to your definition of the teams. On what basis are you saying that Sun is on the "Microsoft team"?

The Microsoft payout was for civil damages and a settlement in the long ongoing Java suit which it seems they were likely to lose in the long run. They lost, Sun won. Sun gets the money. It was not Microsoft "buying Sun loyalty" or a payoff for Sun to do their dirty work. To characterise it as otherwise would need a lot of evidence--beyond the conjectural crap which seems to dominate these discussions.

The substance of the agreement was that Sun and Microsoft would no longer act like mortal enemies. It was not a pact of eternal friendship and devotion. It did nothing more than normalize relations. Prior to the agreement they wouldn't even agree that an agreement was possible. Going forward Sun will work with Microsoft on some iniatives and oppose them on others. Just like Sun does with Oracle, IBM, RedHat, HP, Novell, etc.

Cmon, do you really think anyone would be stupid enough to repeat SGI's mistake and plan to succeed by being the best Microsoft lickspittle?

Oh, and poor HP. Maybe the reason they are lost in the middle is because they can't decide what direction they're going. Support Itanium? Yep! Support Opteron? Yep! Support PA-RISC? Forever! Support HPUX? Yep! Support Linux? yep! Support Windows? Of course! Hurray for everything! (The same can be said of IBM, but they hide it better).

Re:I beg to differ (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#11569081)

On the basis that Linux is constantly barraged by Sun. On the basis of all the FUD coming from Schwartz about how Linux may have copyright problems (taking the Microsoft/SCO line). On the basis of releasing 1600 patents, but not indemnifying them for Linux.

Re:I beg to differ (1)

njcoder (657816) | more than 9 years ago | (#11569179)

OSRM are claiming that Linux has a lot of IP problems as well.... And for only 150k a year they'll indemnify you. Maybe they're in cahoots with MS as well?

Shut the Fuck up ! (-1, Troll)

wisper (856229) | more than 9 years ago | (#11568547)

you don't know what the hell you are talking about.

will always mean... (1)

Vash_066 (816757) | more than 9 years ago | (#11568598)

Dealing with Micro$oft will always mean the same two things....Lots and lots of $$ to them, and your soul....

I was there (5, Interesting)

harikiri (211017) | more than 9 years ago | (#11568621)

I remember James talking about the whole Microsoft/Sun collaboration. Apparently there is some confusion over what the legal agreement between the two is.

The main thing I remember him saying was that there are issues in working with MS, in that even if MS lets them have insider info on say their filesystem, they can't release this info to the Samba developers because of NDA's and IP licensing restrictions. So they have to be really careful and get signoff before they can open certain things up.

Another interesting discussion was the whole SWT vs SWING debate. James remained an advocate of Swing, and accused SWT of falling into the same traps that AWT had back in the day. From what he said, it sounded like he was saying that Swing is flexible and powerful enough to do whatever you want, but that was also its downside. An example he used was back when they were auditing Netbeans 3.6 to figure out why it was so slow. Apparently the developers had gone overboard with monitoring events, and a single drag of a window resizer would trigger thousands of events (an "event storm" he called it), which would also in turn spawn a bunch of "stormlets", small event loops (events triggering other events which trigger other events ad nauseum). Apparently this was the cause of the slowness.

One of the people who was asking a question of James asked the audience to raise their hands if they used Eclipse. I would guess that around 90% of the audience raised their hands.

When asked his opinion on the IBM vs SCO court case, his response: "I want some of what they're smoking". He didn't get asked about Sun's IP stance however.

I also have a picture that I took of the cake for the 10th anniversary of Java. It's sitting on my phone at the moment, but I saw some other attendees take snapshots too.

Sorry this is a little haphazard. I didn't really take notes. :)

Re:I was there (0, Offtopic)

flacco (324089) | more than 9 years ago | (#11568956)

Man watching 6 MSCE's around a sun box, looks alot like the opening scene's of 2001:space odyssey...

funniest goddamn sig i've seen yet

Swing not the real stumbling block (3, Interesting)

Latent Heat (558884) | more than 9 years ago | (#11569533)

From my perspective, Swing is not the real stumbling block.

Sun has this whole take-it-or-leave it notion about Java, but I have been interested in migrating to Java by rewriting parts of my apps. The JNI allows Java to call C++, but it also allows C++ to call Java, and while parts of it are a little cumbersome, it is well-documented and you can wrap the plumbing in a set of C++ and Java classes. My notion is that I can start with the non-GUI parts of the program, and perhaps even some of the GUI parts by using the MVC and strategy design patterns to uncouple code from the Windows API code, and over time develop something that is easier to migrate away from Windows. Oh, don't worry Chairman Bill, I am probably not leaving Windows anytime soon, it is just that Java has good features and libraries and I am interested in using it.

For mixed Windows API-managed code programming, I like C++/Java better than C++/C# because to access C# modules from Windows API C++, you have to go through a lot of Windows jive with the GAC and other bits of Klingon language. Connecting C++ and Java through the JNI seems easier to me than connecting unmanaged C++ to C#.

The hassle is that I am really reluctant to make any program I distribute dependent on a Java install on a Windows computer because there is so much to go wrong -- not setting up the PATH, CLASSPATH considerations, and so on. It is not insurmountable to get Java going under Windows, but it is something for users of one's software to not get right.

If MS and Sun were to truly make nice, I would like to see the Java runtime integrated with Windows so you could count on it being there if you distribute apps under Windows. Heck, I would settle for the .NET runtime being part of Windows, but even that you have to download and there is a futz factor setting it up.

Re:Swing not the real stumbling block (1)

tim256 (855256) | more than 9 years ago | (#11570188)

I've used swing for the last four years, and I haven't had any performance problems on newer machines. Sure it's a little slower, but that's really not a problem. However, I did find it easier to use C# and a C++ dll easier than using JNI. But, I could never find any good documentation on JNI. I would be nice if you could build exes on Windows that spawned the Sun Java VM kinda like C# does.

Make Samba actually work? (1, Insightful)

desau (539417) | more than 9 years ago | (#11568644)

From the article:

"... but we can't then turn around and be part of the open-source Samba project, and make Samba actually work."

I wasn't aware that Samba didn't work.

Seems to work fine for me.

Sure it works ... (1)

krygny (473134) | more than 9 years ago | (#11568709)

... for now.

Re:Make Samba actually work? (1)

gstoddart (321705) | more than 9 years ago | (#11568741)

"... but we can't then turn around and be part of the open-source Samba project, and make Samba actually work."


I wasn't aware that Samba didn't work.


That's business speak for "until we can figure out how to make money from it". :-P

Re:Make Samba actually work? (1)

Skuld-Chan (302449) | more than 9 years ago | (#11569251)

Can it easily replace an Active Directory Server? Nope. Can it *easily* replace a Windows NT Domain - not really.

Otherwise it works great :).

Re:Make Samba actually work? (1)

stor (146442) | more than 9 years ago | (#11569353)

Can it easily replace an Active Directory Server? Nope.

Not easily but it can replicate a lot of the functionality of AD if you pair it up with a directory server such as OpenLDAP.

Yeah yeah, probably not in the "easy" basket. Fairly straight-forward if you're a half-decent Sysadmin though.

Cheers
Stor

Had me then dropped me (4, Insightful)

KarmaBlackballed (222917) | more than 9 years ago | (#11568648)

The last paragraph of the news story ends like this: In the hour-and-a-half session, Gosling answered many questions on a range of topics, including Eclipse and other Java IDEs (integrated development environments), DVD technology, security in Microsoft's .Net platform, the future of embedded software and more.

Only problem is the author thinks that's all we care to know about that. Sorta like writing "yadayadayada".

No need to actually report what his answers were. (Guess only an extreme geek like myself cares to hear what he said about these obscure technical topics.)

Yes, is there a transcript anywhere?? (2, Interesting)

SuperKendall (25149) | more than 9 years ago | (#11568802)

I'd really like to hear the whole of the talk as well. Anyone out there have anything else with more detail?

Transcripsts. (1)

acomj (20611) | more than 9 years ago | (#11568890)

I said the same thing while at work.. Heh! wheres the interesting part of the article?

FWIW I did a quick google & google news search. nothing.

More is Really Less (4, Interesting)

value_added (719364) | more than 9 years ago | (#11568693)

Gosling offers a bit of insight when he says:

Reverse-engineering in the United States is now "legal for stuff, except stuff doing digital rights management," or DRM, he said. "So what has been happening is folks like Microsoft have been putting DRM into everything. DRM has been put into places you wouldn't think would make a whole lot of sense, like the document format being wrapped in DRM stuff...Under the sheets, the major justification is to make reverse-engineering illegal."

Bill Gates, on the other hand, offers a very different (albeit hardly suprising) point of view in a recent NY Times article [nytimes.com] .

``Over the years, our industry has tried many approaches to come to grips with the heterogeneity of software,'' Gates said, ``But the solution that has proven consistently effective -- and the one that yields the greatest success for developers today -- is a strong commitment to interoperability.''

Microsoft is also facing competition from Linux and other software that can be copied and modified freely. Proponents of such software say its flexible distribution makes it easier to design to work with other software.

Gates argued, however, that open source software encourages the proliferation of different software systems, making it harder to integrate them with other proprietary systems.

Many Microsoft products already work with other non-Microsoft products, and the company will build more interoperability into the design of its products, Gates said.

So, there you have it. Things are fine, and getting better.

Re:More is Really Less (2, Funny)

flacco (324089) | more than 9 years ago | (#11568980)

Gates argued, however, that open source software encourages the proliferation of different software systems, making it harder to integrate them with other proprietary systems.

that's what open standards, file formats, and protocols are for - comp sci 101, you big fucking lying piece of shit goony bastard.

I was there and asked him a couple of questions (5, Interesting)

sonamchauhan (587356) | more than 9 years ago | (#11568792)

I was there at this event and asked James Gosling a couple of questions.

"You spoke earlier about Jython and Ruby -- how Sun does not want to "choose" on the de-facto scripting language for Java.
Will Sun follow the lead of .NET - and now Perl6 - in supporting multiple languages that compile and run within the same virtual machine?"


I impression I got about his answer was: No, Sun won't publicly support multiple languages compiling to the JVM like Microsoft does in .NET (though he did not say this explicitly).

He reiterated the JVM did support multiple languages (the examples he gave were Fortran and Lisp) compiling to Java bytecode and running in the JVM. He said that the JVM architecture has constraints due to which languages like C/C++ cannot run in the JVM efficiently or safely. He said Microsoft actually made a big deal about their support for 'Managed C++' in .NET. He poked fun at this - saying due their support for pointers, etc, their Managed C++ implementation had security security holes "big enough to drive several trucks through".

"Follow up question: Will the JVM architecture ever change? The Parrot/Perl6 folks talk about how their new Register-Based VM architecture is inherently superior to stack based VMs. Any comments?" [Java uses a stack based VM ]
His answer boiled down to: "The Perl guys are wrong". He mentioned a few other complex points to justify this. An interesting thing he mentioned was that an early development version of the JVM used a register based VM "that no one other than me saw", and that he changed Java over to a stack based VM since the register based one "sucked so badly".

At the end of the event, the hosts (Sun Australia I think) brought out a big cake to celebrate the 10th birthday of Java. Gosling said that the day (Wednesday 2/2/05) was "uncomfortably close to the 10th anniversary of the first release of the JVM". The audience gave three hip-hip-hurrahs.

Re:I was there and asked him a couple of questions (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#11568996)

The audience gave three hip-hip-hurrahs.

And then you all started jerking each other off?

Re:I was there and asked him a couple of questions (0, Flamebait)

stor (146442) | more than 9 years ago | (#11569376)

The audience gave three hip-hip-hurrahs.

And then you all started jerking each other off?


No. Then they started writing java programs. Oh, wait...

Cheers
Storf

Re:I was there and asked him a couple of questions (1)

sonamchauhan (587356) | more than 9 years ago | (#11569924)

Java is nice. But I don't program much in it. I like Perl. Though Gosling said what he said, Parrot/Perl 6 should be better than Java.

Sad to see people afflicted by perverse fantasies though - hope you both get better soon.

moD fup (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#11568841)

coomitterbase and As the premiere Please moderate We get there with tired arguments

news.com.com? (1)

Obliviously (846787) | more than 9 years ago | (#11568968)

the hyperlink is to news.com.com? Why would CNET buy com.com?

Re:news.com.com? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#11569003)

Well, I dunno why they bought .com.com but they've had it for a loooooooooooooong time. Where have you been?

Re:news.com.com? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#11569008)

Well, Obliviously!!! ha ha ha ha fuck you.

Doesn't Make Sense... (4, Funny)

Comatose51 (687974) | more than 9 years ago | (#11569181)

Usually pacts with the devil take on greater significance as you get closer and closer to death (*cough* Sun *cough*)...

Re:Doesn't Make Sense... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#11569257)

*cough*$7.5 billion*cough*jackass*cough*

Re:Doesn't Make Sense... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#11569449)

*cough* It's called a joke *cough*

Re:Doesn't Make Sense... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#11569687)


*cough* the *cough* moderators *cough* obviously *cough* didn't *cough* get *cough* the *cough* damn *cough* joke *gag* *choke*

Partnership? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#11569334)

When did partnership with Microsoft mean anything but getting screwed?

Look, google for the links; partnership with Microsoft never meant anything execpt Microsoft wins and you fade into obscurity!

News to who? (5, Interesting)

gnovos (447128) | more than 9 years ago | (#11569505)

I woked at a company a few years ago that was a newly minted "Microsoft Partner". Microsoft came in one day and we all had a big meeting. The rep told us, point blank, that they were developing the same software as us, but were a little behind. The deal was this: We'll liscense them all our software at a n unfathomably great rate, they'll promote our company for two years to thier other partners, and then they'll release thier own version of the software at that point, having built in all the improvements that they can from examining our software, and undercut us.

If we don't agree to the terms, they'll release thier software now and compete with us directly withotu the two-year gap.

So basically, that was life as a Microsoft Partner.

Re:News to who? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#11569633)

... and then you sent your first corporate email and the Microsoft rep saw how poorly you spell, pal (t h e i r, say it after me, t h e i r). He wondered how you ever made it past grade school and then immediately fired you one the spot.

For everybody else: there, their they're.

They're all different.

Re:News to who? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#11570109)

it's 'on' not 'one'. on the spot...

Support for Active Directory (1)

cheu0018 (853704) | more than 9 years ago | (#11569568)

They talked about supporting MS AD for their new Solaris 10 release last year. I haven't heard a thing on this subject. Anyone here know if this is coming?
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