Firefox-Based Netscape 8 Beta Goes Live 320
pigmelon writes "According to BetaNews, 'America Online's Netscape team has opened its doors to the public, releasing the first beta of the revived Netscape Web browser. (screenshot) Based upon Firefox, Netscape version 8 focuses on security and user privacy, and supports rendering with both Mozilla's Gecko and Microsoft's Internet Explorer browser engines.' Before downloading the beta, remember that it uses Firefox 1.0, which contains some vulnerabilities."
Does it fix the shyte rendering of slasdot? (Score:3, Funny)
Re:Does it fix the shyte rendering of slasdot? (Score:3, Interesting)
Re:Does it fix the shyte rendering of slasdot? (Score:5, Interesting)
Re:Does it fix the shyte rendering of slasdot? (Score:2)
Re:Does it fix the shyte rendering of slasdot? (Score:5, Informative)
Re:Does it fix the shyte rendering of slasdot? (Score:5, Informative)
Re:Does it fix the shyte rendering of slasdot? (Score:2)
Re:Does it fix the shyte rendering of slasdot? (Score:2)
Re:Does it fix the shyte rendering of slasdot? (Score:4, Informative)
Re:Does it fix the shyte rendering of slasdot? (Score:3, Informative)
Re:Does it fix the shyte rendering of slasdot? (Score:3, Informative)
Ctrl +
Ctrl -
Forces Firefox to re-render the page for you.
Mirror (Score:3, Informative)
http://www.betanews.com.nyud.net:8090/article/Net
http://fileforum.betanews.com.nyud.net:8090/detai
Re:Mirror (Score:5, Informative)
Download [netscape.com]
it's on netscrape bandwidth so it should fare just fine.
Re:Mirror (Score:2, Funny)
What did you expect from someone whose username is "Broke Mirror"?
Extensions (Score:5, Informative)
Re:Extensions (Score:4, Funny)
Wow the dot-com bubble is back from the dead!
Re:Extensions (Score:4, Funny)
I'm pretty sure people were making more than 75 cents per hour during the dot-com bubble. Unless you meant the 17th century tulip bubble.
The skin... (Score:3, Funny)
one word (Score:3, Insightful)
Horrible color scheme and very cluttered.
Re:one word (Score:2)
2. Ever heard of browser themes/strong?
Re:one word (Score:2)
Re:one word (Score:2, Insightful)
Re:one word (Score:5, Funny)
No, no, no, you got it all wrong. Not all Windows users are going to accept that crappy interface.
That's what AOL-brained people will like. They're willing to take crappy software from anyone, as long as it comes with flashy buttons and a "Me Too!" auto-posting button, too.
Re:one word (Score:3, Funny)
(Darn it! Had to do that manually, there's no automagic ME TOO button in FF). Oh, and you forgot the auto-caps-lock preference (on by default) so that they can post in ALL CAPS!
Merged Menu Bar (Score:5, Interesting)
Is there such plug-in for FireFox?
Re:Merged Menu Bar (Score:2)
I'm not at my home computer right now so I can't test it.
Re:Merged Menu Bar (Score:5, Informative)
I was going to suggest you load view-source:chrome://browser/content/browser.xul to see how the chrome does that top part, but their view-source: code seems to be broken. Ooops! Still, you could probably browse the .jar files if you were interested.
Re:Merged Menu Bar (Score:5, Funny)
Re:Merged Menu Bar (Score:2)
LOUD (Score:5, Funny)
Re:LOUD (Score:2, Insightful)
Re:LOUD (Score:2)
(You should see the Hawaiian shirt I'm wearing right now... blue palm trees, yellow bamboo
Re:LOUD (Score:2)
My eyes!
why? (Score:4, Interesting)
Re:why? (Score:2, Insightful)
Re:why? (Score:2)
But I can install Netsacpe though. Almost every one exclusively uses IE and these guys waste half their budget fixing PCs , removing spyware/adware , trying to contain worms etc.
You won't belive the idiocy found in some of the coroporate sector. So I am content using atleast netscape instead of IE.
Re:why? (Score:5, Interesting)
What is the advantage of a separate browser? Why not make an AOL theme for firefox, drape it with AOL extentions/plugins and just use firefox?
Supposedly the netscape version has built in the IE rendering engine for compatibility, while still maintaining the security of Firefox. We shall see. This may mean a browser that is vulnerable to every exploit. If done properly, however, it could be a very nice feature.
Re:why? (Score:2)
Re:why? (Score:2)
I'm guessing that like most of the Mozilla browsers, you might be able to adjust it using about:config
However, I haven't downloaded this and am only speculating.
Re:why? (Score:3, Informative)
Re:why? (Score:5, Informative)
According to Walt Mossberg's review [wsj.com] in the WSJ:
"If a site is considered trustworthy, Netscape automatically renders it using the Internet Explorer method, for maximum compatibility. Internet Explorer's method for rendering Web pages opens security vulnerabilities that Firefox's doesn't. Netscape figures that, at trusted sites, it's OK to take that risk."
Re:why? (Score:3, Insightful)
This is a dangerous statement to be making. A large number of the security flaws in IE lie within the rendering engine itself, not in the surrounding wrappers. There was a big stink with yahoo messenger, because it uses IE mshtml.dll to render text, and was thus vulnerable to the iframe exploit. If a program renders in mshtml.dll, no amount of wrappers are going to sud
brand recognition (Score:5, Insightful)
When will they package it with AOL? (Score:3, Insightful)
Custom widgets (Score:5, Insightful)
What's so wrong with using standart window captions, buttons and so on? There's a reason for that: consistency ammong applications.
Leave themes and eye candy for the OS level, and obey it if present; but please, not a single application should implement it's own custom UI controls, that's just wrong.
Re:Custom widgets (Score:2, Insightful)
Re:Custom widgets (Score:2)
No they don't. For some strange reason the producers of those apps like to make their apps look like the physical counterparts but they just wind up producing unusable pieces of crap. A knob, for instance, makes sense on a physical device but is difficult to use on a computer screen.
Re:Custom widgets (Score:4, Funny)
Can you imagine how boring it'd be if you already knew where to find, say, the 'minimize' button on EVERY application? Where's the fun in that?
My eyes! The goggles do nothing! (Score:5, Insightful)
Holy crap! [betanews.com] That has to be the worst browser interface I've ever seen. Awful color scheme, buttons everywhere, three different input bars (one for searching, one for addresses, and one for "shopping"?; worse, the most important bar, the address bar, is too small to show even the domain portion of a normal URL, and is not in a properly prominent position), funky menu positioning (by putting the menu in the title bar, I suppose you can no longer grab that part of the bar to drag the window), etc. Netscape really needs to invest in some competent UI designers ASAP.
Re:My eyes! The goggles do nothing! (Score:2)
Comment removed (Score:4, Interesting)
Re:My eyes! The goggles do nothing! (Score:2)
Re:My eyes! The goggles do nothing! (Score:2, Informative)
I dunno, my nVidia card can rotate the screen, and my LCD monitor can rotate (meant for access to inputs on the back of monitor). I don't think I'd actually use my monitor that way, but I could if I wanted to.
Re:My eyes! The goggles do nothing! (Score:3, Funny)
Re:My eyes! The goggles do nothing! (Score:2)
Re:My eyes! The goggles do nothing! (Score:3, Interesting)
After that I realized, the address bar, is mainly a power user feat
Had to use a screenshot with Microsoft Headline... (Score:5, Funny)
Re:Had to use a screenshot with Microsoft Headline (Score:2)
windows only? (Score:3, Informative)
Re:windows only? (Score:3, Insightful)
I'm willing to bet they couldn't figure out a way to implement that abortion of an interface design on other OSes.
The goggles! They do nothing! (Score:5, Insightful)
Why the heck do I need the weather below my address bar?
Why is the menu bar over by the close/minimize/maximize widgets (don't miss click the help menu or your window will vanish to the task bar)?
I
I think i'll leave my family/neighbors/girlfriend with Firefox or Mozilla thank-you. They may not be the perfect interface but they're an order of magnitude more useful than this monstrosity.
And no, it doesn't run on Mac OS X, Linux, BSD, or anything but Windows. I guess that's a good thing in this case.
Who cares? (Score:5, Interesting)
Let's be honest. You're going to get the same rendering engine (at least for the most part, probably with more problems though) but with a bloated skin, no theme support, no extension support, and the Netscape icon.
I think it's totally worth it, ha.
Because of the name (Score:2)
It may be a theme fully bloated without extensions support but the Netscape name and logo have been more around than Firefox.
Silly marketing stra
Crap (Score:2)
I'm sorry, but this is crap. Netscape slid from the consciousness of 99% of the "average Joes" several or more years ago, and this version will have an equally weak to non-existent effect on most of the surfing public. The "average Joe" is now only vaguely aware that something called Netscape ever existed, and though they have heard of this new "alternative" browser called FireFox, they are
Finally! (Score:3, Funny)
Best Review So Far (Score:2, Interesting)
Typical AOL-ish Theme (Score:3, Insightful)
The new Netscape browser is based on Firefox, but it looks, well, awful. It doesn't look as bad as some of the previous betas, but it still doesn't look good. It breaks many of the Windows design standards, such as its substandard menus, windows, icons, and title bars. Secondly, when I'm browsing the Internet (or doing anything else with my computer), I don't want to be looking at all of these flashy icons and weather and shopping and all of this other stuff. Why is the RSS icon on the URL box blocking the full URL? Where do AOL hire its UI designers from?
Next, another feature about this browser is that it can switch its rendering engine from Gecko to IE's rendering system. Well, why? IE's rendering system doesn't support the latest web standards, and even for web pages that uses a lot of IE-only extensions (ActiveX, for example), Firefox handles these situations with a couple of extensions.
Besides that, this will hurt in trying to remove substandard and nonstandard technologies from the Internet, such as ActiveX and non-standard HTML. Windows-only web developers need to get out of their Microsoft-funded cave and hop on the nearest bus to Standards Land and start dumping MSHTML, their Visual Basic-designed ActiveX programs, and ASP in favor of CSS and XHTML (standard web pages), Java or Perl/Python (standard programming languages), and PHP (to replace ASP). It will make the Internet a better and safer place for the rest of us.
In short, what's the point of this Netscape release? Firefox and Mozilla is spreading like wildfire, and they are better browsers. Safari, Opera, and Konqueror do their jobs nicely, too, so what's the point of Netscape?
Re:Typical AOL-ish Theme (Score:2)
Re:Typical AOL-ish Theme (Score:2, Funny)
*POOF*
My brain just exploded. The tin-foil hat did nothing to help me.
Meanwhile at Beijing (Score:4, Interesting)
Comment removed (Score:5, Interesting)
Re:And so it comes full circle. (Score:4, Insightful)
Profit is exactly the motive behind such UI-hostile interface elements as a permanent shopping search bar. AOL is throwing in several ways to get the user directly to AOL's own web properties. It looks as if they already pre-installed a few of those spyware toolbars.
don't look a gift-horse in the mouth (Score:4, Insightful)
The old Netscape might have been junk. This new Netscape might also be junk. But who the heck cares? You don't need to like the smell of manure to appreciate roses at the flower shop.
Netscape's decision once upon a time to release the source code gave us an excellent browser. The license for that browser is such that anybody can take it and release their own abomination, so if Netscape itself wants to do that, more power to them.
Re:And so it comes full circle. (Score:2)
Re:And so it comes full circle. (Score:2)
Unfortunately, no one can be told what Firefox is. You have to see it for yourself.
Return on investment (Score:5, Insightful)
However, I think that the general attitude on
Isn't this really an open source success story? "If you open the source code to your product, other developers will extend it and improve it in ways that you couldn't dream of (let alone afford), and you will be free to incorporate these improvements back into your product!". Isn't this the return on investment that the OSS community talks about?
If we're talking about the same uneducated mass of Internet users that were convinced to use IE because of Microsoft's brand recognition, isn't that a good thing?
The UI really is something (Score:3, Funny)
"this Firefox UI is great and easy to use, so let's add a bunch crazy buttons and just generally shit all over it! Oh and throw in a theme that makes our customers want to claw out their eyes. And for extra confusion, make sure some of the pages load with IE so people are never sure what behaviour they're going to get!"
Shock! Horror! (Score:2, Funny)
Cyan killed Netscape (Score:2)
Re:Cyan killed Netscape (Score:2)
Re:Cyan killed Netscape (Score:2, Funny)
Me. I demand some hazard yellow added to the interface immediately! Perhaps in some sort of warning box. A big caution sign, that's the ticket.
And then, on to the neon! Wheeeeee! Neon green, neon blue (Do they make neon cyan?), maybe we can even get some neon yellow and use that instead of hazard yellow.
And, dare we dream it? Yes, we dare.
Pink. I said it. PINK. BRIGHT PINK ALL OVER!
But don't worry, all these bright colors will be balanced out by the
Cool! (Score:2, Funny)
The worst of all worlds.
(Now that was serious.)
I've been hoping someone would do this.
(Unserious, more like fearing someone would do this.)
I guess I'll switch.
(Nearly coughing after fit of maniac laughter.)
No, not really. Sticking with Firefox. It seems to be what Netscape could have been had Netscape not believed its own hype and what IE should have been if only MS could see past proprietarily customizing everything that doesn't move fast enough.
(Looks like that IE-based browser that came wit
One question (Score:2, Funny)
Bad user skin (Score:2, Insightful)
The menus in the top are located on the right unlike their usual place on the left. This is something that will cause irritations.
This is horrible (Score:2)
Well, it turns out that ANY site that is on the 'trusted site list' is set to display like IE. I don't know what's on this list, but I can tell you that's a LOT of sites this browser is using the IE engine for. It only defaults to Gecko when it's an "I'm not sure of this site" or "I dont trust this site" setti
Re:Well, there goes the neighborhood! (Score:2)
License (Score:3, Interesting)
3. RESTRICTIONS. Except as otherwise expressly permitted in this Agreement, you may not: (i) modify or create any derivative works of the Beta Browser or documentation, including customization, translation or localization; (ii) decompile, disassemble, reverse engineer, or otherwise attempt to derive the source code of the Beta Browser, or in any way ascertain, decipher, or obtain the communications protocols for accessing the AIM Service, or the underlying ideas or algorithms of the Beta Browser (e.g. in an effort to develop other applications or services that provide similar or substitute or complimentary functionality to the Beta Browser);
and so on. There is no mention of the Mozilla license and no source code. How is this legal? Did they buy special rights from the Mozilla Foundation or something?
Re:License (Score:2)
Remember that there's a difference between Mozilla and Netscape
Netscape has some proprietary components that are Netscape-only. Those parts are under a completely different licence than Mozilla is; therefore, the source isn't available. All of the Mozilla sources that they used is already open and widely available, and Netscape must not had changed the Mozilla sources; therefore, Netscape didn't have to re-release components of the broswer that were borrowed from Mozilla.
Re:License (Score:2)
Sorry, that doesn't make sense. Whether or not it's already available makes no difference to Netscape's responsibilities. In fact, the license also says about binary distributions:
You may distribute Covered Code in Executable form only if the requirements of Sections 3
AOL is doing all it can... (Score:2)
...to destroy the Netscape brand, becasue they don't have the will to escape from Microsoft's nutgrip on them. First they ignored that they even owned Netscape (7 year option deal to use IE), then they try to turn it into a low cost ISP, now they are wasting time and effort on a hybrid browser. This browser is doomed to fail for a number of reasons:
Rendering defaults to IE engine (Score:2)
Which all begs the question, what the hell is a browser based on Firefox, branded with Netscape, rendering with IE? Hey, at least it's modular!
Netscape? (Score:3, Insightful)
They bought Netscape, continued to use IE, started Mozilla then let Mozilla go (to become the Mozilla Foundation), and now they are developing their own browser, which is based on IE
Impressions (Score:3, Informative)
As far as regular users go, I can not think of any reason why they would prefer this browser over something like IE or firefox. I have thought that for a while, IE has been so popular because of its simplicity. Even though it doesn't support features like tabbed browsing and typeaheadfind and RSS.. your average user doesn't want that stuff anyway, thus IE meets their needs so why change to anything more complex?
So, unless I am missing something, we have a browser here that power users will not use and average users will not use. Perhaps Netscape can get some people to use it if they bundle it with their ISP. It is only beta though, maybe it will get better..
I'm quite disapointed really... (Score:3, Insightful)
Firefox could grow by at least 10% if netscape proclaimed it as the next version of there browser and included download links on there primary netscape download page.
Windows only? (Score:2)
I understand that this is a beta version, but if they're embedding the IE rendering engine, I can't imagine that this browser will be cross platform. This is significant because it will be the first Netscape which is not cross platform. Seems like a giant step backwards.
Also, does the MPL (Mozilla Public License) affect their ability to close the source? I'm not that familiar with the MPL, but I think it's more BSD-ish than GPL-ish.
Finally, I can't think of a greater disservice to those of us interested w
From the "bad ideas" department... (Score:2, Insightful)
I guess I'll have to add Netscape to my list of banned applications, along with IE, Outlook, Windows Media Player, and Realplayer... basically, any application that uses the MS HTML control to render outside-sourced documents.
After seven years of exploits and failed fixes, why does anyone outside Microsoft still use this "Typhoid Mary" of the software world?
Re:Firefox exploits (Score:2)
Re:Firefox exploits (Score:2)
The vulnerabilites labeled as unpatched are all described as "less critical":
Mozilla Firefox Image Javascript URI Dragging Cross-Site Scripting [secunia.com]
Mozilla / Mozilla Firefox Cross-Domain Cookie Injection Vulnerability [secunia.com]
Mozilla / Mozilla Firefox A [secunia.com]
MOD PARENT UP - FUNNY! HA HA HA (Score:2)
That's funny. Firefox, you have to dick around a lot, downloading extensions and whatnot. Opera is good to go from the get go.
Re:This makes sense.. (Score:2)
Why start trying to take advantage of their Netscape resources now, after 7 years?
If, by "bundled", you mean "install the Netscape browser as one of many, many unasked for applications when installing the AOL software", I guess I can see that.
If you mean "use it as the integrated browser inside the AOL software", they can't do that. As part of the settlement of the Netscape lawsuit with Microsoft (which mearked the death knell for 95% of the remaining "Netscape",