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Book 'Em, Dano

CowboyNeal posted more than 9 years ago | from the digital-pawn-shops dept.

Books 150

theodp writes "An Oregon library worker was arrested after selling at least $10,000 worth of stolen library books, CDs and videotapes online in the past six months. The thief, who scanned the Net to find items in demand and went to the library to check them out, was busted after an alert college president noticed his copy of the recently-published I am Charlotte Simmons, purchased on Amazon.com, sported a library receipt with a due date of Dec. 26. Earlier this month, it was reported that a VT man was arrested for stealing hundreds of books from college libraries and bookstores and selling them on Amazon, realizing more than $4,000. The library thefts are somewhat ironic, since Amazon CEO Jeff Bezos and the NY Times seemed to suggest there might be fewer books in libraries if the Authors Guild, who opposed Amazon's used book sales practices, had their way. Bezos also once told angry booksellers there's no reason why Amazon should have to collect sales taxes, arguing that Amazon gets no police services from other states."

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150 comments

in sr (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#12053862)

In soviet russia Danio books'em

PLEASE (1)

cmdr_shithead (527909) | more than 9 years ago | (#12053863)

do not eat pork, it is dirty

dummer than a bag of hammers (2, Funny)

mwilliamson (672411) | more than 9 years ago | (#12053865)

Damn, this guy's a smart one... genious.

Re:dummer than a bag of hammers (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#12053904)

It's "genius", genius.

Re:dummer than a bag of hammers (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#12053983)

It's "dumber", dummy.

Re:dummer than a bag of hammers (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#12053912)

If you're lucky, maybe he's still selling a dictionary for 5$, then you can learn to spell genius like a human being. What is it with this "genious" spelling anyway? Are you Greek? Gee-nee-ooooooooooooooooooooouss?

Re:dummer than a bag of hammers (3, Funny)

justforaday (560408) | more than 9 years ago | (#12053922)

That's the British spelling, moran!

Re:dummer than a bag of hammers (1, Informative)

deggy (195861) | more than 9 years ago | (#12054150)

No it isnt - what the hell are you on about??

Re:dummer than a bag of hammers (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#12054568)

It's this thing called "humor" (or "humour" for you Brits). Dummer than a bag of hammers is right...

Re:dummer than a bag of hammers (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#12054333)

You didn't get the humour in how he spelled... you're a true besserwisser.

I.T. Specialist Review (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#12054068)

Here is an article from the December edition of BSD Journal which IT specialists (in particular, Unix administrators) thinking of moving overseas might find interesting. It compares various countries and the salaries, cost of living, and general IT industry of the country. The countries reviewed were: Australia, the United States, Canada, Spain, South Africa, Sweden, and the United Kingdom. The article was rather long, so I won't post the entire thing, only the summaries and conclusions.

UNITED KINGDOM

Infrastructure: The UK has technologically advanced domestic and international systems in terms of basic telecommunications services, and the UK's I.T sector has grown rapidly since the late 1980s, making the UK's I.T infrastructure amoung the world's best. There is active competition amoung various ISPs and other telecommunications service providers and the quality of service is generally excellent. According to our tests, the UK was placed 2nd out of the 7 tested countries in this category, behind only Sweden. Final Score: (4/5)

Salaries: I.T. workers can expect higher salaries in the UK than in any of the other tested countries, and our results indicate that the UK's I.T. job market is expanding rapidly and has a very healthy outlook. Adjusted for taxes and living expenses and local exchange rates, the average I.T worker had a take-home pay of $45,692. Final Score: (5/5)

Cost of Living: The UK has a high cost of living, although this is mitigated by very high salaries for I.T. workers. Final Score: (2/5)

Working Conditions: The UK has relatively bad working conditions compared to the other countries that we tested, and we found that the average UK I.T. worker works 51.6 hours a week, a horrendous 11.6 hours longer than the traditional 40 hour (9-5) working week. Final Score: (2/5)

Conclusion: The UK leads the pack in terms of average salary package size, but the working conditions and cost of living remain valid concerns. Still, the UK has an excellent I.T infrastructure and the overall outlook for I.T. workers is very good. The UK was placed 2nd out of the 7 nations that we tested, with a final score of 62%.

UNITED STATES

Infrastructure: The USA has a large, technologically advanced, multipurpose communications system in terms of basic telecommunications services. The USA has traditionally been touted leader in technological development worldwide, and this is evident in its I.T. infrastructure in and around major centers. However, a lot of the USA's infrastructure, basic as well as I.T, is rapidly aging and much of it is indeed of upgrading, repair or replacement, especially in less populated areas. Recent problems with the USA's telecommunications and electricity grid in particular cannot be overlooked. Final Score: (3/5).

Salaries: The US has been a world leader in I.T. and telecommunications since the 1940s, and experienced a massive I.T. boom in the 1990s and early 2000s. However, our review period was 2000-2004, and during this time frame, the outlook for I.T. workers has slumped and only recently been revived to some extent. The high number of forgein workers, particularly from India and Asia, competing both locally and through outsourcing, has dampened the prospects for I.T workers in the USA. Despite this, the average take-home pay of US I.T workers remains higher than all other tested countries aside from the UK, at $41,500. Final Score: (4/5).

Cost of Living: The USA has an enviable cost of living, although the differences between various areas are immediately noticable and a huge factor in our tests. The USA was placed 3rd, behind only South Africa and Australia. Final Score: (3/5)

Working Conditions: The USA's working conditions have plummeted since the dot-com boom of the early 2000s, with employers taking advantage of the high amounts of immigrants and outsourcing possibilities available to them. The average working week of the US I.T worker has soared to 55.1 hours, a gigantic 15.1 hours longer than the traditional 40 hour (9-5) working week. Add to this the average US I.T. worker's comparitive lack of vacation time, and the current situation looks hazy for the average US I.T. worker, although trends are slowly turning back in favour of I.T. workers. Final Score: (1/5).

Conclusion: The USA's bad working conditions for I.T workers are offset by its low living costs and good infrastructure, although it isn't the I.T. haven that it was in the 1990s. It's final score was 55%, and it has only been placed 5th out of the 7 countries that were tested.

AUSTRALIA

Infrastructure: The I.T sector in Australia has been growing steadily since the early 1990s, and the country has excellent basic domestic and international telecommunication services, however, a lot of the infratructure specific to the I.T sector is outdated, and in need of upgrading or repair, especially in areas outside of Sydney and Melbourne. The leading telecommunications provider, Telstra, continues to abuse its monopoly despite recent attempts by the Australian government to introduce competition and improve the Australian telecommunications sector's outlook. As a result, I.T infrastructure in Australia is in a poor state and along with I.T. skills shortages, this threatens to hamper or even stagnate the I.T industry in Australia in the near future. The Australian government is planning on countering this by introducing further telecommunications reform and by increasing the number of skilled workers allowed to enter the country, but only time will tell if this will be enough to avoid impending stagnation. Overall, our tests indicate that Australia's infrastructure puts it in 6th place out of the 7 tested countries, only ahead of Spain. (Final score: 2/5)

Salaries: Australian I.T workers are currently in a comfortable position, with major staff shortages increasing demand for their skills. Adjusted for taxes and living expenses as discussed in our Methodology section, the I.T workers can expect an average take-home pay of US$29,250. This puts Australia 5th out of the 7 tested countries in this area, ahead of both Canada and South Africa. (Final score: 3/5)

Cost of Living: Australia's cost of living is enviably lower than most of the other countries reviewed in our tests. Placed 2nd, it was only bested by South Africa in this category. Final Score: (3/5)

Working Conditions: Although demand for I.T workers is high in Australia, and there are set regulations for working conditions and labour relations, our surveys indicate that many Australian I.T workers still put in a lot of over-time and have hectic work schedules. On average, our tests indicate that Australian I.T workers work 45.1 hours a week, or 9 hour working days, more than the traditional average working week of 40 hours (9-5). Final Score: (2/5)

Conclusion: Australia attained an overall score of 50%, placing it in 6th place out of the 7 tested countries, only ahead of Canada. Unless you have a vested interest in Australia, it might be more profitable to look elsewhere to continue your I.T. career.

SPAIN

Infrastructure: Spain has adequate and modern facilities in terms of basic telecommunications infrastructure, and its I.T. infrastructure is growing at a rapid pace, faster than almost any other European nation. Despite this, it is still not up to the standards of any of the other nations that we tested, being placed last. Final Score: (2/5).

Salaries: I.T. workers in Spain are in high demand due to the recent growth of the economy, including the I.T sector. It has been placed 4th out of the 7 nations that we tested, with a take-home pay, adjusted for taxes and local living expenses, of $35,308 for the average I.T. worker. Final Score: (4/5).

Cost of Living: The cost of living in Spain is higher than the USA, but not as much so as Canada, the UK, or Sweden. It was placed 4th out of the 7 tested nations. Final Score: (3/5).

Working Conditions: Spain's working conditions are more relaxed than most of the nations that we tested, although significant problems with the labour law still exist, such as employers often flouting over-time pay and vacation time. Spain's working week is one of the shortest, however, at 40.9 hours, almost on par with the traditional 40 hour working week (9-5). Final Score: (3/5).

Conclusion: Spain's I.T sector is growing fast, and there is a high demand for skilled I.T workers. I.T. workers receive good pay, and although the I.T. infrastructure of the country leaves a lot to be desired, Spain has an overall bright outlook in terms of I.T. competitiveness. Spain's final score was 60%, placing it 3rd out of the 7 nations that we tested.

SOUTH AFRICA

Infrastructure: South Africa's telecommunications system is the best developed and most modern in Africa, and its I.T. infrastructure has been growing steadily. Although the monopoly of Telkom, South Africa's only functional telecommunications provider, continues to hamper the I.T infrastructure, South Africa was placed 5th out of the 7 nations that were tested. Final Score: (3/5).

Salaries: I.T. workers in South Africa receive the second lowest pay, on average, in any of the nations that we tested aside from Canada, with a take-home pay of $23,877. Final Score: (2/5).

Cost of Living: South Africa has an enviable cost of living, having been placed 1st out of the countries that we tested in this category, although there are slight fluctuations depending on area. Final Score: (4/5)

Working Conditions: South Africa's working conditions are generally more relaxed than most of the nations we tested, although problems do exist in terms of employers flouting labour law and taking advantage of I.T. workers by skimping on over-time pay and vacation-time. However, South Africa had one of the shortest working weeks of the nations we tested, at 40.2 hours, almost on par with the traditional 40 hour (9-5) working week.

Conclusion: The average pay for I.T. workers in South Africa may be low, but its lower living expenses offset this. Many skilled I.T workers have left the country, and therefore there is great demand for skilled I.T workers to fill these positions. Although there are signification economic and political problems in South Africa, it scored 58% overall, placing it 4th out of the 7 countries that we tested.

SWEDEN

Infrastructure: In terms of basic telecommunicatiosn infrastructure, Sweden has excellent domestic and international facilities, as well as the most automated telecommunications system in the world. It's I.T infrastructure is highly developed and modern, and this is true of almost any area in the country. Comparitively, it's infrastructure is one of the best in the world, placing it 1st out of the 7 tested nations in this category. Final Score: (5/5).

Salaries: Sweden has high taxation, but this is offset by the generally high salaries that I.T. workers receive, as well as the huge demand for I.T and telecommunications workers. Sweden has traditionally been held as a world leader in I.T and telecommunications and this is evident in its excellent services and ample opportunities in the I.T. field. Sweden's average take-home pay, adjusted for taxes and local expenses, was $37,815. (Final Score: 4/5).

Cost of Living: Sweden has a high cost of living, but this is mitigated by excellent infrastructure and social services. Final Score: (2/5).

Working Conditions: Sweden's working conditions are the best of any of the nations that we reviewed, with 32 days of mandated vacation-time, labour laws that are fair to both the employer and I.T. worker, and the shortest working week of any of our tested nations, at 35.7 hours, below the traditional 40 hour working week (9-5). (Despite this, Sweden's I.T industry is amoung the world's most productive). Final Score: (5/5)

Conclusion: Sweden had the highest score in this test, with 79%. In terms of infrastructure and working conditions it is unmatched, and the take-home pay that I.T. workers in Sweden receive is competitive.

CANADA

Infrastructure: Canada's basic telecommunications system is based very closely on its US counterpart, and boasts modern technology and facilities. However, as in the US, there are serious issues with the power and telecommuncations grid, especially along the Canadian east coast, and a lot of the infrastructure in outlying areas is in need of upgrading or replacement. The government has pushed for better I.T infrastructure and these these plans are slowly taking effect, making the Canadian I.T infrastructure better than the USA's overall. Final Score: (3/5).

Salaries: Due to high numbers of immigrants from India and China, and the low salaries many of these immigrants are receiving, as well as competition from US firms and other overseas outsourcing, Canada's I.T salaries, which were not high even during the dot-com bubble, have plummeted, making Canadian I.T. workers, on average, the lowest paid of any in the nations that we tested, with a take-home pay adjusted for taxes and local expenses of $23,365. Final Score: (2/5)

Cost of Living: Canada has a high cost of living, lower than the UK and roughly comparable with Sweden. Unfortuantely for I.T. workers, this is not offset by the average I.T worker's salary at all, although some areas are slightly more affordable than others. Final Score: (2/5).

Working Conditions: Canada's working conditions resemble the USA's to a large extent, and shockingly, the average working week of the Canadian I.T. worker is 57.4 hours, 17.4 hours more than the traditional 40 hour working week (9-5). Although Canadian I.T. workers have more vacation time on average than US I.T. workers, their working conditions are not much better. Final Score: (1/5).

Conclusion: Although the demand for I.T workers in Canada is still quite high, Canada is not a good place for I.T workers at present, and this does not seem to be changing as fast as it is in the USA. Unless you have a vested interest in Canada and have enough assets and capital to see you through, we would recommend looking elsewhere to continue your I.T. career. Canada scored 43%, placing it 7th of the 7 nations that were tested.

Ebay is rampant with theves (5, Interesting)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#12053872)

To be honest, this sort of thing really grips my shit. Ebay is full of people doing this sort of thing - not what people might think of as 'stolen goods' but things they've borrowed from work or been issued and then flog on ebay.
I'm in the military and every now and again do a search for Military kit, ebay is crawling with brand new stuff that could only have come from stores, so basicly someone is getting it issued, or taking a few bits home and then flogging them straight onto eBay to make a few extra dollars - it still amounts to the same thing.

Re:Ebay is rampant with theves (4, Interesting)

NewStarRising (580196) | more than 9 years ago | (#12053959)

"not what people might think of as 'stolen goods' " ...

just goods that do not belong to them, being sold with no intention of passing any of the sales price to the owner of the goods...

ok, IANAL, but surely most people realise that taking something that is not yours, selling it and keeping the money is stealing?
I agree that it may, in some people's eyes, be too small an infraction to be prosecuted for (one book, the odd army hat), but this does not mean it is not stealing.
Epsecially if it is done with the express purpose of selling for personal profit.

To be issued with an Army Hat and keep it at home for years, then think "Oh, they've probably written it off now, i don;t want it, I wonder if I can get a few $ for it on EBay?" is quite different from wandering into the Army Stores thinking "I wonder which items I can get most for on EBay? "

Re:Ebay is rampant with theves (2, Insightful)

zotz (3951) | more than 9 years ago | (#12054387)

" "not what people might think of as 'stolen goods' " ..."

"ok, IANAL, but surely most people realise that taking something that is not yours, selling it and keeping the money is stealing?"

Perhaps what the poster was referring to was that the person doing the selling did not come into posession of the item in question by a means that would normally be looked at as stealing. Not that selling them doesn't amount to stealing them.

I go to the library and check out a book and take it home and read it. At this point I am in posession of the book and it is not considered stolen.

As opposed to I sneak the book out of the library and take it home and read it. At this point, I am in posession of the book and it is (isn't it?) considered stolen.

Also as opposed to I break into the library at night and take the book home and read it. At this point, I am in posession of the book and it is considered stolen.

In all three cases, when I sell the book, it is certainly "stolen" although the law can be funny and may have a different term for this type of misappropriation of the property of another. (Anyone know? I do not like to use the wrong terms in matters like this, especially by mistake or out of ignorance.)

I took it to be that the poster was talking along these lines.

all the best,

drew

http://www.archive.org/search.php?query=creator%3A %22drew%20Roberts%22 [archive.org]

Re:Ebay is rampant with theves (1)

NewStarRising (580196) | more than 9 years ago | (#12054488)

I see your point.

Yes, this is not the "usual" way of stealing, but at the point where he registered the book as returned, yet still kept it, I consider it stealing.

Re:Ebay is rampant with theves (1)

zotz (3951) | more than 9 years ago | (#12054701)

"Yes, this is not the "usual" way of stealing, but at the point where he registered the book as returned, yet still kept it, I consider it stealing."

Certainly, although like I say, there may actually be another legal term for this.

I my country, I have heard the phrase: "stealing by reason of employment."

Does anyone know what this relates to?

all the best,

drew

http://www.archive.org/search.php?query=creator%3A %22drew%20Roberts%22 [archive.org]

Re:Ebay is rampant with theves (2, Funny)

johannesg (664142) | more than 9 years ago | (#12053963)

I'm in the military and every now and again do a search for Military kit, ebay is crawling with brand new stuff

Ah-ha, so *that's* where that 2nd hand aircraft carrier came from!

Boats and Bridges (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#12054189)

You mean like this one [defenselink.mil] that I just paid $999.99 cash for, and will be delivered next Tuesday?

The gentleman who sold it to me, never did catch his name, said he could also get me a deal on a famous bridge. [visit-new-york-city.com]

A bigger operation (1)

Frankie70 (803801) | more than 9 years ago | (#12054374)

There was something similiar which happened at
Microsoft a few months back [theregister.co.uk] .

maybe ebay isn't the problem ... (1)

Heisenbug (122836) | more than 9 years ago | (#12054705)

My dad was a paratrooper in Alaska about 25 years ago, and says this kind of thing happened all the time -- a couple of supply sergeants stole literally half the stores, transferring stuff between them to make accounts add up any time there was an inspection. Another time, my dad borrowed a lock from another guy for his locker, and the guy opened it up and took all his stuff (it's possible he was a bit naive back then, huh?).

Anyway, the way I read this, it's probably the military that's rampant with thieves -- not too surprising for the world's largest and best funded bureaucracy. It's possible that eBay aided the process, but I bet it simply put all the thieves into a searchable database and made the problem a little more visible.

Not that I know shit about shit, as my dad would say. What do you think?

Theft? In VT? Say it ain't so! (3, Interesting)

Lawrence_Bird (67278) | more than 9 years ago | (#12053878)

As a part time resident of VT the past 5 years (the majority of the fall/winter), I can't say this surprises me. Norwich is about 10 miles away and is a military oriented university. I wonder what titles he was pulling out? Anyways, this is just another creative theft of product/services. Contrary to many popular beliefs, Vermont is not the idllyic paradise many would have you believe. High welfare rates, little job growth, few police and much unreported crime. I'll give that this guy was more creative than most, but he is still the typical dirtbag.

Where wear the library cops? (0, Troll)

Joe123456 (846782) | more than 9 years ago | (#12053879)

Where wear the library cops?

Re:Where wear the library cops? (4, Funny)

Kjuib (584451) | more than 9 years ago | (#12053888)

probably with the Spelling Police...

Re:Where wear the library cops? (1, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#12053984)

But where do the grammar nazis fit in?

Re:Where wear the library cops? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#12054173)

right next to the english snobs

Was this really illegel? (0, Troll)

Saven Marek (739395) | more than 9 years ago | (#12053880)

Is this really an arrest its legal to make? When signing up to library you agree if you dont return book you pay for it so you might borrow something from library worth $20 to library but find a buyer online who will pay $250 for it.

Well library rules say you pay $20 to library so what is the problem? If youve paid for it you can do what you like with it the library shouldnt have any say over it then.

This is like RIAA when they say they get to control how you use music when they sell it to you but still control what you can do with it, or so they think

Re:Was this really illegel? (0, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#12053891)

Well library rules say you pay $20 to library so what is the problem?
Because you are not paying the library money in exchange for a book. You are paying a fee for not having returning the book. It's what you agree to when you sign up.

Your argument is a little like saying that when you order two burritos, then eat one but leave the other on the table, you're entitled to a 50% refund.

Re:Was this really illegel? (1)

Saven Marek (739395) | more than 9 years ago | (#12053910)

> Because you are not paying the library money in exchange for
> a book. You are paying a fee for not having returning the
> book. It's what you agree to when you sign up.

OK I have on my bookcase two books that I failed to return to a library many years ago. I have alreaddy paid the late fines and "fail to return" fines on them and all is closed between me and the library

Are you saying I do not own these books? will I be arrested for trying to sell them on to someone else? Will I get the library police coming after me if I try to sell them? I don't think so.

Re:Was this really illegel? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#12053927)

Read the fucking article. You'll be arrested if you used the computer system to report that you returned the books on time, paid no fees, then sold the books.

Re:Was this really illegel? (3, Insightful)

Eric604 (798298) | more than 9 years ago | (#12053932)

These fines are not there for you to deliberate hold back a book. You should return them. It's a fine, not a price tag, you did't buy them.

Re:Was this really illegel? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#12053970)

Thats not what he said. If you were to misplace several books from the library and paid the fine, then maybe like a year later, find out that they had fallen under a large and heavy piece of furniture, would it be so wrong to sell them? It is not likely the library will want the books back (and issue a refund), having replaced them already. What you pay is not a fine, its the actual value of the book posibly plus charges to cover the institutiional labor involved in acuqiring a replacement copy. There needs to be no fine, having to pay for the book is sufficent punishment.

Oh, by the way, IAL (I am a librarian).

Re:Was this really illegel? (1)

Eric604 (798298) | more than 9 years ago | (#12054304)

That's not what I said, I clearly said deliberate. It's like stealing a car and putting some equalivant amount of cash in the owner's mailbox.

Re:Was this really illegel? (2, Insightful)

yar (170650) | more than 9 years ago | (#12053980)

You didn't purchase the books. I'm honestly not sure if it's considered theft. But there are certainly laws that refer to legitimately required copies of materials (some parts of copyright law), and I don't think that this would fit the bill (certainly not if this was done intentionally, and I'm not sure about accidentally). Some of it depends on how your library policy reads- do they drop the situation entirely once the fine is paid?

The library police won't be coming after you because both libraries and the police have better things to do with their time (unless this becomes a regular occurence because people think that paying the fine means they bought the book). Libraries have scarce enough resources as it is.

People not returning books sucks for libraries. The reason fines are so high often isn't because they want the fine to act as a detriment- it's to make sure that they can get as close a replacement as possible to the missing item (which is often impossible in out of print books) and to pay for the cost of processing the book. Processing the book is not as easy as slapping on a tag and making the item available for checkout again. There's cataloging and recataloging involved.

At any rate, libraries are a public service. Taking advantage of their services in the way the article describes, whether or not the person falsely checks in the book, is unethical if nothing else.

Re:Was this really illegel? (1)

zotz (3951) | more than 9 years ago | (#12054425)

"People not returning books sucks for libraries. The reason fines are so high often isn't because they want the fine to act as a detriment- it's to make sure that they can get as close a replacement as possible to the missing item (which is often impossible in out of print books) and to pay for the cost of processing the book. Processing the book is not as easy as slapping on a tag and making the item available for checkout again. There's cataloging and recataloging involved."

Interesting, so do we need a POD compulsary license for libraries which have non-replaceable books that are not returned?

That may help alleviate the problem. In fact, would a POD compulsary license be a good thing for out of print books in general?

all the best,

drew

Re:Was this really illegel? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#12053900)

You sir, are a moron.

Re:Was this really illegel? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#12053960)

Another quality Slashdot post that contains insightful analysis, facts, and shows such elegant command of the English language!

Re:Was this really illegel? (5, Informative)

jonbryce (703250) | more than 9 years ago | (#12053911)

That's not what happened in this case though.

Here, he made use of his employee access to the library computer system to say that the book had been returned, when it had not been.

Secondly, I don't think he sold them on Amazon for more than the list price. These are current, in print books that you can get from a bookstore anywhere, including Amazon's new books section.

I would say this is a clear cut case of theft.

Re:Was this really illegel? (1)

Illserve (56215) | more than 9 years ago | (#12054033)

That poor library, they'll be doing a complete reinventory.

Probably lost some of their best works.

RTFA (1)

NewStarRising (580196) | more than 9 years ago | (#12053985)

"According to Jim Strovink, a sheriff's office spokesman, Gray would check out books, then tap into the library computer system and record them as returned."

IANAL, but that sure sounds like stealing to me.

The answers to your questiones are easily found by clicking the link to the Page that has much of the information on it.

This is nothing like the RIAA. This is a man stealing books and selling them.

Re:RTFA (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#12054216)

Wow, he actually violated personal trust to get the stolen goods. That's nothing like how movies get onto the file sharing networks.

And besides, me and my classmates and all my friends don't steal library books. So we have no use for this particular type of stealing. Why that's just criminal behavior! People could lose their jobs and not be able to make a living.

Re:Was this really illegel? (1)

SquadBoy (167263) | more than 9 years ago | (#12054057)

That is only true in good faith cases. Lost book etc etc. If you take it with the *intent* to never bring it back that is theft.

Re:Was this really illegel? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#12054155)

If that is the case, why didn't he just buy the darn books first and then flog them! By your argument, this would've been the better thing to do. He wouldn't have been caught!

Re:Was this really illegel? (4, Insightful)

cerebis (560975) | more than 9 years ago | (#12054379)

As a digression.

I appreicate libraries and don't condone the theft of their resources but... Libraries don't always think through their fines and charges. (or for that matter most rental businesses)

I put it to an elderly University librarian that a $100AU maximum on late fees was stupid when the charge for a lost book was also $100AU. I asked her why she would expect anyone to return a book that hit the maximum fine. Even before the maximum, people might just decide to lump the extra cost and keep the book if the difference between the fine and the replacement charge equals the retail cost.

I pointed out that higher level texts often retailed in the campus bookshop for over $100AU, so the replacement charge seemed even more short sighted. Why didn't their system pull up the real cost of each book to determine it and cap late fees at half the cost individually?

She looked at me like I was evil incarnate.

Sales Tax (4, Interesting)

selectspec (74651) | more than 9 years ago | (#12053882)

Great, so we get to pay taxes on online orders because some asshole stole some library books? Instead of paying the taxes, why not just shoot the jerk. Then nobody else will try it. I buy a lot of books online and they are expensive enough as it is.

Re:Sales Tax (2, Insightful)

NewStarRising (580196) | more than 9 years ago | (#12053940)

Indeed Sir, You are correct.

No murders have been commited since the first implimentation of the Death Penalty.

Re:Sales Tax (4, Insightful)

Jeff DeMaagd (2015) | more than 9 years ago | (#12054009)

That is a separate issue that the story discription didn't need to go into.

now he'll have to spend the rest of his life (3, Funny)

jacquesm (154384) | more than 9 years ago | (#12053884)

on the run for the library policemen...

Re:now he'll have to spend the rest of his life (2, Funny)

Qzukk (229616) | more than 9 years ago | (#12053933)

Nobody can run from Conan the Librarian!

Re:now he'll have to spend the rest of his life (1)

dodobh (65811) | more than 9 years ago | (#12054769)

Oook!

Bleh (1)

Mustafu (867201) | more than 9 years ago | (#12053890)

Heh, and I used to think that knowledge was power...profitable power in this case :)

No hard feelings? (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#12053893)

What do you know about hard feelings? Ever kill a man? Ever have someone die in your arms?


If we had the library cop from Seinfeld, this wouldn't happen.

ebay policy (5, Interesting)

stefanmi (699755) | more than 9 years ago | (#12053903)

They are. No sales of stolen property are ever valid. A clueless person who buys stolen property at a thief's yard sale not knowing the seller stole it still is in possession of stolen property. That item can be taken from the unwitting buyer by the police and returned to the rightful owner, the person it was stolen from. If the buyer wants their money back, they have to sue the thief, which is usually a fruitless effort. So, eBay's role is that whenever they realize that property's stolen, they've gotta kill the auction in order to maintain buyer confidence in their marketplace. They don't want transactions that aren't going to work happening over their system, simply because that'd undermine the trust people have in their system.

Thieves are stupid (4, Interesting)

Jafafa Hots (580169) | more than 9 years ago | (#12053908)

Just shows how dumb and lazy most criminals are. I sold books on Amazon until 2 years ago, and I was able to get great stuff for virtually nothing jusst be forging ties at the library and getting their discards - plus buying cheaply from other sources. I never paid more than about ten cents per book. Is saving a dime worth going to jail for? (not to mention the moral compromise involved in stealing.)

Re:Thieves are stupid (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#12054144)

No, the kind of thieves talked about here are a tiny minority. The real thieves, like the government, CEOs, universities, are pretty smart.

Re:Thieves are stupid (1)

carpe_noctem (457178) | more than 9 years ago | (#12054265)

It's not "stealing"... I'm sure the guy was eventually planning on returning the books, right?

Go Bezos! (-1, Troll)

Quiet_Desperation (858215) | more than 9 years ago | (#12053915)

Hey, when the guy is right, he's right. Anything I can do to not give the League Of People In Vegetative States (AKA the California State Legislature) any tax money is fine by me.

As for the thief, actually, that's kind of a clever idea, morality aside. Someone should hire him as a marketer, although leave implementation to someone else. That's where he faltered. At least remove the library tag. I knew to do that in junior high when I stole books from my school library.

Hey, the librarian falsely accused me stealing books because she hated for reasons I was never able to discover. I was one one of the "good" kids. Fortunately, no one bought her story, but I stole several way cool science books in revenge. I carefully obliterated any evidence that they were library books, put a price inside the cover, and claimed to my parents that were from a remaindered clearance and a small bookstore. You know, when they put the books on tables outside.

And I hope that bitch had a long, slow, miserable and medically unsound old age. You don't take your personal problems out on some random kid.

Re:Go Bezos! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#12053966)

HEY! I'm in a Vegitative State, you Insensitive Clod (TM)!

Re:Go Bezos! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#12053975)

Massachusetts?

Re:Go Bezos! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#12054039)

I had a teacher pretty much beat me up in first grade because a kid near me was talking and she thought it was me. If she is alive today she would have to be about 85 and in a wheel chair but it wouldn't stop me from pushing her over today if I saw her.

Re:Go Bezos! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#12054194)

Anything I can do to not give the League Of People In Vegetative States (AKA the California State Legislature) any tax money is fine by me.

With the Terry Schiavo affair still on first page news, aren't such jokes a tad tasteless? You didn't make any airplane jokes after 911, or flood/perfect wave jokes after the tsunami either!

Re:Go Bezos! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#12054326)

9/11 was an international incident killing thousands of people and disrupting the lives of millions.

Terry Schiavo is a domestic squabble that has somehow been escalated to the point where some members of the family feel they should appear before the supreme court.

Move along now.

Mannix (4, Informative)

pipingguy (566974) | more than 9 years ago | (#12053921)


For the less age-challenged, the Dano (sic) reference is to Hawaii Five oh. [mjq.net] I almost wrote "Mannix", such are the problems of being over the hill. I.E., over 40.

Re:Mannix (1)

zotz (3951) | more than 9 years ago | (#12054558)

"such are the problems of being over the hill. I.E., over 40."

One of the benefits of being over the hill is that you can still keep going even if you run out of gas.

No wait, it doesn't quite work like that now does it?

Columbo, Kojak, Mike Hammer, Cannon, Spenser, Baretta, McCloud, McMillan & Wife, Banacek, Barnaby Jones, Dragnet, The Equalizer, The Fugitive, The Green Hornet, Hart to Hart, Hawaii Five-O - I watched too much TV with my family growing up.

all the best,

drew

http://www.magicdragon.com/UltimateMystery/tv.html [magicdragon.com]

Re:Mannix (1)

pipingguy (566974) | more than 9 years ago | (#12054635)


Columbo, Kojak, Mike Hammer, Cannon, Spenser, Baretta, McCloud, McMillan & Wife, Banacek, Barnaby Jones, Dragnet, The Equalizer, The Fugitive, The Green Hornet, Hart to Hart, Hawaii Five-O.

You apparently forgot about Kolchak, The Night Stalker. That was quirky and interesting and didn't last very long.

Re:Mannix (1)

zotz (3951) | more than 9 years ago | (#12054743)

"You apparently forgot about Kolchak, The Night Stalker. That was quirky and interesting and didn't last very long."

Yes, Kolchak slipped my mind. I do remember enjoying at least some of those though.

all the best,

drew

http://www.archive.org/search.php?query=creator%3A %22drew%20Roberts%22 [archive.org]

"Cloacal vision" What a great review. (4, Funny)

crovira (10242) | more than 9 years ago | (#12053934)

I almost fell of my chair laughing as my wife brought me a coffee, Thank god I wasn't drinking it at the time, because my monitor would be a mess right now.

I bet that the possibility of writing really shitty reviews about really shitty books like that only come once in a very great while.

The beauty of self publishing authors is that, once in a very great while someone dissapoints this reader by being as charming and erudite as their subject is pithy, most of the time I am reminded that the value of editors come as much from what they don't publish, and there for spare us from, as how well they do publish what they.

To quote Dorothy Parker: "That's not writing, that's typing."

Re:"Cloacal vision" What a great review. (1)

Nevenmrgan (826707) | more than 9 years ago | (#12054813)

To quote Dorothy Parker: "That's not writing, that's typing."

That would be Truman Capote on Jack Kerouac.

Dorothy Parker said, "This is not a novel to be tossed aside lightly. It should be thrown with great force" and, in response to an inquiry about her recent absence from the theatre, "I've been fucking busy, and vice versa."

what did you expect (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#12053935)


greed is good right ? at least it worked for Kenny "Boy" Lay , George Bush, Dick Cheney, even Martha Stewart is richer from going to prison, great messages to send to the kids

just do whatever you can to make cash, if you have to fuck over society , your kids , my kids, anyones kids, while you are doing it then who gives a shit that 30,000 sqft house and 6mpg SUV is more important

people are products of society, if they are bad then society has failed somewhere

So what exactly (4, Insightful)

the_skywise (189793) | more than 9 years ago | (#12053943)

does the theft of books from libraries have to do with:

a> Amazon's selling of used books depriving the author's of collecting revenue.

b> Amazon saying that it shouldn't collect state taxes because it gets no police services.

Other than that we want to make an ad-hominem attack on Amazon and Bezos?

Would it change what the thief did if the books showed up on EBay?

Re:So what exactly (5, Insightful)

Dun Malg (230075) | more than 9 years ago | (#12053991)

So what exactly does the theft of books from libraries have to do with: a) Amazon's selling of used books depriving the author's of collecting revenue. b) Amazon saying that it shouldn't collect state taxes because it gets no police services.

Not a damn thing. Like you say, the dumbass was looking for some way to denounce Amazon and Bezos. Also, he probably thought he'd finally found a good way to use the word "irony".

Re:So what exactly (1)

josecanuc (91) | more than 9 years ago | (#12054255)

Speaking of irony... Isn't it ironic that Terri Shiavo's brain condition came about because of an eating disorder...

Re:So what exactly (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#12054373)

yeah.. but her parents keep saying she "wouldn't have wanted to die of starvation!" THAT is irony..

Re:So what exactly (1)

mOdQuArK! (87332) | more than 9 years ago | (#12054395)

Isn't it ironic

Uh no, not really...

Re:So what exactly (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#12054493)

I think what they are getting at:

Her brain condition came from an eating disoder...

And they are killing her by depriving her of food and water...

Kind of amusing, in a sick and twisted way,

Re:So what exactly (1)

sarastro_us (745933) | more than 9 years ago | (#12054651)

Obviously this person doesn't even know what 'irony' really is. It's like goldy or bronzy, right?

Amazon knows that people hate sales tax (4, Interesting)

G4from128k (686170) | more than 9 years ago | (#12053947)

I know why Amazon does not want to pay sales tax and its not just the small price difference of the tax or the administrative headaches. The fact is that people really really hate paying taxes to the point of irrationality. I saw the results from an e-commerce study done by MIT on people's on-line spending habits. It showed that a person would rather go with a more expensive online store in order to avoid paying sales tax. In fact, the data suggested that people would pay $5 more for the product to avoid $1 of sales tax.

I'm not sure what the solution is, but I'm sure that Amazon knows that being tax-free means more than it seems when it comes to consumer behavior.

Re:Amazon knows that people hate sales tax (1, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#12053979)

.

That's the wrong conclusion. The conclusion that can be drawn from that study, is that many people are stupid. I see them everyday. They are out there, intermingling with the population on the other half of the curve. It's frightening when you think about it -- for every smart person, there's a complementary stupid person.

.

Re:Amazon knows that people hate sales tax (1)

gl4ss (559668) | more than 9 years ago | (#12054056)

well, some of the customers ARE just plain stupid.

and so bezos can pull their legs, it's not amazons police service that's supposed to be paid with the sales taxes. It's the customers police protection that the cash is going to.

"next in line pays"

What is Amazon's fair share of sales tax? (1)

G4from128k (686170) | more than 9 years ago | (#12054218)

well, some of the customers ARE just plain stupid.

Agreed! And a smart business gives its customers what they want, even if that is stupid.

and so bezos can pull their legs, it's not amazons police service that's supposed to be paid with the sales taxes. It's the customers police protection that the cash is going to.

You don't think local retailer get any benefit from police protection? I would imagine that crime against tax-paying retailers is a big deal, too. Armed robbery, shoplifting, embezzlement aren't crimes against customers. Amazon gets no benefit from police protection against crimes against retailers. In fact, it would be in Amazon's interests if local retailers become more frequent targets of crime as that would drive more customers to Amazon.

Sales tax pays for other services that a local retailer benefits from such as tourism promotion, local festivals, parking (if not metered), and downtown rejuvenation projects. One can even argue that sales taxes for stadiums are, at least a partially, for the benefit of local businesses that get a boost from tourism. If local governments stopped maintaining the infrastructure of the downtown and shopping areas, that would hurt local retailers and help Amazon.

You are right that sales tax does pay for services that go to the customer, but its not 100%. Some fraction of the sales tax subsidizes local retailers abilities to do business and attract customers. I can see why Amazon would not want to fund the competition, especially as Amazon (and its employees) have no vote in local elections.

Re:Amazon knows that people hate sales tax (1)

timeOday (582209) | more than 9 years ago | (#12054149)

It showed that a person would rather go with a more expensive online store in order to avoid paying sales tax. In fact, the data suggested that people would pay $5 more for the product to avoid $1 of sales tax.
I think it's because people hait bait-and-switch. Many online stores don't let you see the real price (including shipping and any taxes) until after you've taken the time to enter a lot of personal information. Only then, finally, do you know what the deal really is.

Personally I'd be much happier if they simply let you enter your zip code once to show accurate, complete prices throughout the site.

Re:Amazon knows that people hate sales tax (1)

G4from128k (686170) | more than 9 years ago | (#12054313)

I think it's because people hait bait-and-switch. Many online stores don't let you see the real price (including shipping and any taxes) until after you've taken the time to enter a lot of personal information. Only then, finally, do you know what the deal really is.

You are partially right. The data also showed that people avoided shipping fees, too. But they were only willing to pay, IIRC, $1.40 to avoid $1 of those bait-and-switch shipping costs. Perhaps its a matter of expectations. On the one hand, people expect to pay some shipping costs, but may jump to a more expensive retailer if that retailer promises "free shipping" or if the low-cost retailer has excessive, hidden, shipping costs. On the other hand, people don't expect to pay sales tax and always jump to another, often more expensive, retailer when faced with paying sales tax.

Personally I'd be much happier if they simply let you enter your zip code once to show accurate, complete prices throughout the site.

I agree 110%. Some retailers do a good job of this and I tend to use them more. Curiously, in my experience, Amazon does not do a good job on this where the order is being routed to one of Amazon's partners.

Re:Amazon knows that people hate sales tax (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#12054310)

I dislike paying sales tax. But not to that point. I like the pricegrabber Bottom Line approach... whomever has got the best total with tax (if applicable) and shipping included will probably get my business.

Right idea. (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#12054044)

If more people did this, then physical libraries would pretty much be pushed out of existance. They could then be replaced by online libraries without taking up valuable space and be open 4 hours a day.

And, they would only be available to people with broadband Internet connections, thus eliminating old farts, homeless bums that just sit there all day and anyone else that isn't technologolically in step with the times.

At least they're reading (3, Funny)

Easy2RememberNick (179395) | more than 9 years ago | (#12054074)

Look on the bright side, it's nice to see that people are reading!

How 'bout Blockbuster... (5, Funny)

anthony_dipierro (543308) | more than 9 years ago | (#12054122)

Maybe it'd be legal to do this with Blockbuster DVDs. After all, there aren't any late fees with Blockbuster.

Doesn't surprise me (1)

evilviper (135110) | more than 9 years ago | (#12054147)

It doesn't surprise me at all. I buy from Amazon.com resellers commonly, and everything usually works out fine. However, on a couple of occasions, I have recieved cheap imported pirated DVDs. Complaining on /. is more useful than contacting Amazon.com :-)

Even if you explain, in-detail, what evidence you have that a product is illegal, the only response you'll ever get is an apology that you didn't recieve what you wanted (!!!) and an offer to refund your money if you return the item.

They don't want to know anything about illegal activity on their site. They'd rather refund you money so you'll be quiet, and they can ignore it.

Amazon isn't nearly as bad as eBay when it comes to illegal activities (in my experience) but it's certainly not good, and how they (don't) deal with it is the real problem.

Re:Doesn't surprise me (1)

bani (467531) | more than 9 years ago | (#12054311)

isnt this what the RIAA is for? it would be nice to see the RIAA beat up on real criminals for a change, and not college students.

Re:Doesn't surprise me (1)

jfengel (409917) | more than 9 years ago | (#12054317)

I hope that they're at least tracking complaints against stores and banninating frequent offenders.

If your complaint doesn't come with, "Oh, we're so sorry, we'll call the police immediately," it may be because they're worried about people with a grudge. That doesn't make ignoring illegal activity through the site right, but it doesn't seem entirely unreasonable to wait for a second or third complaint before taking serious action. And they're probably not going to tell you if you're the first, third, or thousandth complaint.

Out of curiosity, have you ever found that some of these retailers disappear from Amazon's site? Even if they do it's not evidence of bannination so much as criminals simply moving on, but still, I'd like to think that Amazon isn't completely ignoring illegal activity. It's bad for business: some people are already reluctant to use eBay because they're afraid of getting in trouble.

Re:Doesn't surprise me (1)

evilviper (135110) | more than 9 years ago | (#12054480)

If your complaint doesn't come with, "Oh, we're so sorry, we'll call the police immediately," it may be because they're worried about people with a grudge.

I understand, and wasn't expecting any such action. If they even acknowledged what I said about illegal activity, I'd assume they are doing something... Instead, they completely ignore what I've said, and talk about it like a simple return. They've never asked for additional about the illegal products, which no doub would be very useful to them if they were doing anything about it.

Out of curiosity, have you ever found that some of these retailers disappear from Amazon's site?

Amazon is made-up of so many different resellers that I wouldn't likely notice if one disappeared. I am watching those I've had complaints about, and they are still selling on Amazon.

Only advice I can offer, is read their feedback... Most of it is probably their friends who bought $1 items just so they could get a good rating, and it's a hassle for customers to give feedback, so if they do, it's probably because something is very wrong.

A.G. says Bezos misinterpreted them... (2, Interesting)

Qubit (100461) | more than 9 years ago | (#12054191)

Although Bezos claimed that the AG "is the same organization that from time to time has advocated charging public libraries royalties on books they loan out," (from news.com.com)

the A.G. website has a slightly different story. [authorsguild.org] Apparently the A.G. did investigate government-sponsored royalties, but funding issues and higher-priority concerns for the A.G. have halted their efforts.

I find it interesting that the A.G. promotes such a system, described as "...a small government-funded royalty paid to authors of books borrowed from libraries." I mean, how could you determine who gets royalties without keeping track of how many times each item gets checked out? Wouldn't that raise serious privacy concerns, not to mention issues of fraud and checkout-padding for certain books?

And then who gets to put media in the library? I mean I could put together some pamphlets about linux or FOSS, and then give them to my local library to put on the shelf. If my friends and I check them out (for free) every few days, we can get money back, right?

What would we do with websites? People coming into the library are increasingly doing so to access the Internet (especially in lower-income areas where most people do not have access at home). If someone does research online and finds good information on Wikipedia.org, shouldn't Wikipedia get some money for that? Who is to say that Britannica deserves royalties for its 3year-old Encyclopedia but Wikipedia doesn't deserve them for its own upkeep of hardware and bandwidth?

If this happens I can see people forming new "free libraries" -- not free for borrowing, but free from any monitoring or recording of who checked out what, when. I thought up a couple of neat ways to do this a while back as a way to 'get around' terms in the PATRIOT Act -- generally including public/private keypairs and money held in escrow (in the event that the materials were not returned). It would be a shame if people felt forced to go out and implement something like this.

Yes, Jeff, you do get police services (0, Flamebait)

Rude Turnip (49495) | more than 9 years ago | (#12054225)

The police help maintain law and order. That way, it's easier for me to go out into the world and earn a living without having the double duty of helping to protect my town. That's how I was able to afford that $500 vacuum cleaner from your website, dumbass.

Re:Yes, Jeff, you do get police services (1)

ClipDude (31730) | more than 9 years ago | (#12054828)

When you order off of Amazon, do you have to pay Washington sales tax? (I don't think so, but I honestly don't know for sure, since I've never actually bought anything from there.) If not, then it is only fair that Amazon purchases be taxed by the buyer's jurisdiction.

As a side note, some stores in Washington will cover the sales tax of their Oregonian customers, if we show identification, since Oregon does not have a sales tax.

Re:Yes, Jeff, you do get police services (1)

ClipDude (31730) | more than 9 years ago | (#12054846)

Not to mention, sales tax also goes to fund the educational systems which teach many people how to read. (There wouldn't be much a market for books without widespread literacy.)

Re:Yes, Jeff, you do get police services (1)

gbulmash (688770) | more than 9 years ago | (#12054900)

The police help maintain law and order. That way, it's easier for me to go out into the world and earn a living without having the double duty of helping to protect my town. That's how I was able to afford that $500 vacuum cleaner from your website, dumbass.

Actually, he was stating he didn't get police services in North Carolina, so why should he do the work of collecting North Carolina's taxes for them. Jeff and Amazon are in Washington and they collect WA state sales tax from all WA residents. They get police and fire services, their employees use public transit, the school system, etc. They collect sales taxes for WA and pay business taxes to WA.

OTOH, it's often cheaper for WA residents to shop at other e-tailers with locations outside the state, or go to a local "bricks and mortar" retailer who may have a similar price, as they'll pay sales tax anyway and they get instant gratification with no shipping costs or shipping wait.

- Greg

Saw it on the news. (1)

Patrick Mannion (782290) | more than 9 years ago | (#12054234)

Maybe they should only give network acess to full-time library workers.

Well maybe Bezos will get police service now... (1)

museumpeace (735109) | more than 9 years ago | (#12054460)

or do the police serve subpoenas?

Authors Guild re: Used Book sales (1)

TFGeditor (737839) | more than 9 years ago | (#12054737)

As an author, I am tempted to concur with the Author's Guild re: used book sales.

As a voracious reader, I very much like buying used books at reduced cost. (I also buy many for reference when doing research for my own writing.)

My libertarian leanings also give me pause at the notion of restricting free enterprise and doing what one wishes with one's own property (selling used books).

My capitalist leanings (okay, greed, profiteering, whatever) give me pause because, after all, I write for fun AND profit.

Any other authors here with an opinion?

Oregon sales tax (1)

ClipDude (31730) | more than 9 years ago | (#12054759)

An Oregon library worker was arrested after selling at least $10,000 worth of stolen library books, CDs and videotapes online in the past six months. [. . .] Bezos also once told angry booksellers there's no reason why Amazon should have to collect sales taxes, arguing that Amazon gets no police services from other states.

Of course, Oregon does not have a sales tax. (We're weird that way.)

I have a question... (1)

Black Jack Hyde (2374) | more than 9 years ago | (#12054875)

Why is a college president reading I Am Charlotte Simmons, a book about the sex life of a college co-ed? I think the perv-o-meter just hit eleven.
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