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The Next-Gen Consoles - Sort Fact From Fiction

Zonk posted more than 9 years ago | from the even-the-lies-are-true dept.

XBox (Games) 66

1up.com continues its trend of topical features by delving into Generation Next: Separating the Facts from the Fiction of the Next-Gen Consoles. From the article: "Photorealistic graphics, streaming multimedia content, complete Internet integration and revolutionary new kinds of gameplay are all promises of next generation gaming. Right now, it's all executives blowing hot air and technobabble, but in just a short few weeks, the battle for the living room starts again, as Nintendo, Microsoft and Sony take the wraps off their new babies and show the world their visions of the industry's future."

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Glad to hear it! (1)

-kertrats- (718219) | more than 9 years ago | (#12263567)

I've been looking forward to the next big thing from Morgan Stanley, and it looks like they're entering the gaming market! Article says that they've co-developed the Cell with Sony and Toshiba, sounds fascinating.

anandtech had a great CELL article. (5, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#12263636)

http://www.anandtech.com/cpuchipsets/showdoc.aspx? i=2379

Cell will either make the PS3 much more powerful then the XBox360 or an impossible mess to program for. A lot of it will come down to how well Sony's early generation dev kits are.

The Cell gets it's speed by assuming it is passed in order instructions, unlike almost any other type of CPU. It will choke on anything out of order. Sony better make a kick ass compiler, as I don't see game developers to keen on making assembly langauge level tweaks on something they are unfamilliar with.

My money is on XBox360. The Cell chip is better suited for video cards then a general purpose CPU. Having to tweak code for it will be a disaster.

Re:anandtech had a great CELL article. (2, Insightful)

jonabbey (2498) | more than 9 years ago | (#12263767)

The PowerPC cores on XBox 360 are also rumored to be in-order.

Cell will pose some interesting design challenges to programmers, no doubt about it, but Sony's talking about directly supporting a shader-enhanced version of OpenGL, which should be much easier to program for than PS2 was.

Really, it'll come down to market share. If PS3 dominates market share the way PS2 did, it won't matter all that much how hard or easy it is to program for.

Re:anandtech had a great CELL article. (4, Interesting)

billcopc (196330) | more than 9 years ago | (#12264750)

If Sony had released a half-decent API for PS2 back when it was launched, it would have kicked ass.

Xbox uses a DirectX-flavored API, and I can tell you from experience that it's so much easier to work on something familiar like DirectX, even though it is a mess in itself, at least it's a mess I already figured out long ago. Sure beats learning tricky bare-metal graphics programming on a one-off architecture like PS2's Emotion Engine.

If they release the PS3 with an OpenGL-style interface it would be a pleasure to code for.

Re:anandtech had a great CELL article. (1)

KDR_11k (778916) | more than 9 years ago | (#12267908)

The PowerPC cores on XBox 360 are also rumored to be in-order.

Quite ironic since the IBM 360 was the system that introduced out-of-order execution...

Re:anandtech had a great CELL article. (1)

MBraynard (653724) | more than 9 years ago | (#12266124)

It could also raise the cost of making things cross-platform. So if you have a decent game but not the money to do the biggest seller for you(PS3??) AND another system.

Still, I think MS will win the next round.

Re:anandtech had a great CELL article. (3, Insightful)

Corngood (736783) | more than 9 years ago | (#12268088)

The Cell gets it's speed by assuming it is passed in order instructions, unlike almost any other type of CPU. It will choke on anything out of order. Sony better make a kick ass compiler, as I don't see game developers to keen on making assembly langauge level tweaks on something they are unfamilliar with.

First of all, your description of in-order execution is basically nonsense. All processors are passed instructions in-order. The difference with out-of-order processors is that they can reorder the instructions on the fly. I think Sony/IBM/Whoever have the right idea with this, let the compilers do the optimisation, not the hardware.

Re:anandtech had a great CELL article. (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#12369718)

let the compilers do the optimisation, not the hardware.

What, like Itanium? That really worked for them.

(found in metamods)

Jive Article (2, Informative)

tprime (673835) | more than 9 years ago | (#12263651)

Everyone seems be coming out with a fact/fiction article these days on the newest consoles. Check out this article [jivemagazine.com] [http://www.jivemagazine.com/column.php?pid=3235] for a little more humorous view of some of the same ideas at Jive Magazine.

Funny he should say that... (-1, Troll)

soniCron88 (870042) | more than 9 years ago | (#12263652)

FTA: As IBM Director of Technology for Cell Technology Jim Jahle puts it, Cell "really represents a supercomputer on a chip."

Interesting. I think a more accurate statement may be: Cell "really represents a supercomputer on several chips."

Re:Funny he should say that... (3, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#12264037)

Do you even know what Cell is? It's multiple processing cores on a single chip. Here is a picture together with a single chip quote from IBM itself [ibm.com] .

Re:Funny he should say that... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#12264309)

Twas a joke, my friend. Just a joke. Cheer up, bud! :)

Re:Funny he should say that... (1)

ElectricBrain (452147) | more than 9 years ago | (#12265256)

If that was a joke, then it was a very bad joke.

That time again (5, Insightful)

vain gloria (831093) | more than 9 years ago | (#12263698)

Guess we can look forward to nothing but basic fighting and driving games for a couple of years until programmers figure the new systems out. Rehashed Tekken and Gran Turismo with slightly better graphics anyone?

Re:That time again (4, Funny)

Zangief (461457) | more than 9 years ago | (#12266174)

But imagine the innovations in the WW2 FPS area!!

Always wanting money! :) (5, Insightful)

soniCron88 (870042) | more than 9 years ago | (#12263702)

FTA: "Imagine players slapping down $.99 to buy a one-of-a-kind, fully tricked-out racing car to be the envy of their buddies," says Microsoft

What would be even more "tricked-out" would be not having to pay for it. Ladies and gents: In game customizations will now cost you a buck a pop.

I know "The Sims" would be so much more fun if I had to spend my money on their furniture, rather than Simoleans.

Re:Always wanting money! :) (1)

AzraelKans (697974) | more than 9 years ago | (#12271741)

Well aparently enough people share this thought, so finally forza motorsports went gold WITHOUT the dreaded "sale" component. (I mean you can buy, sell stuff but you use pretend money)

We will have to wait and see if they change their mind on "xbox next" release. (and yes the name is "xbox next", check the "ourcolony" faqs, xbox 360 is a smoke screen)

I don't think so (4, Insightful)

cow_licker (172474) | more than 9 years ago | (#12263743)

Fact from fiction? Not quite. Basically an article that collects the hype from all three console camps.

"the next generation PlayStation "orders of magnitude" more powerful than the next Xbox"

Sure it will. The Playstation 2 will also be able to render Toy Story real time. Nothing to see here folks.

Re:I don't think so (1, Interesting)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#12265209)

Sony NEVER said it would render Toy Story 2 graphics. They said it would render CG quality graphics in real time and proved it with a real time rendered tech demo of the FMV from FF8. I wish fucktards like you would drop the whole Toy Story MYTH

Re:I don't think so (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#12271473)

"CG quality graphics" is a nonsense phrase. All that stuff a NES renders is, duh, CG, and it's not exactly pretty. What's the real story then?

Re:I don't think so (1)

Slashcrap (869349) | more than 9 years ago | (#12279911)

Sony NEVER said it would render Toy Story 2 graphics. They said it would render CG quality graphics in real time and proved it with a real time rendered tech demo of the FMV from FF8. I wish fucktards like you would drop the whole Toy Story MYTH

Ah, it's the 12 year old Sony fanboy troll again. You're the same guy that claimed to have programmed a B-Spline based game engine for the PS2 because that's the only architecture that could handle it aren't you?

You need to stop the bullshitting, stop the completely over the top flaming of anyone that voices a different opinion and most of all - for the love of God, go out and get laid. As I've told you before, once you do all this will seem so insignificant.

Seriously, one day you'll look back and laugh at yourself.

Re:I don't think so (1)

hubang (692671) | more than 9 years ago | (#12271489)

Maybe it won't be able to do Pixar quality work in RT, but the GS Cube did manage to pump out 1:10 resolution version of Final Fantasy: The Spirits Within, and the GS Cube is, at heart, just 16 PS2s.

Besides, most of Microsoft's saving grace on the XBox was NVidia's work, not M$'s. Nvidia lost market position to focus on the XBox, and M$ screwed them over. You think ATI will lose market place for M$'s sake when they're also supplying the competition (Nintendo has already commited to them for their next generation)?

A little disconcerting (2, Interesting)

miyako (632510) | more than 9 years ago | (#12263868)

Historically, I've always found console launches to be pretty exciting. Saving my money up for a year in advance so I can get the consoles on launch date along with a couple of launch titles. Rallying behind your favorite console (even though I really know it's all about the games, and I generally have all the consoles anyway).
But, this round of console launches seems to be a little disconcerting to me. First and foremost, I'm worried about nintend (seems like someone needs to worry on their behalf) - who should be focusing on rebuilding their relationship with third party game makers, instead of going out of their way to make something strange and difficult to make games for. Microsoft looks like they might really do well this year, which worries me more than the thought that nintendo might utterly fail. It's not that I have anything against microsoft personally, it's just that they seem to really be pushing bringing PC style games onto consoles, as opposed to console style games. I find the vast majority of the xbox games to suck horribly (just my opinion).
Sony seems to be doing it's own sony thing, overhyping the system and such. I'm not sure how well they'll do either, there are a lot of people who were burned by the poor quality of the initial PS2s last time around, and they historically have a hard time getting supply to meet demand. They might also be pulling a nintendo and shooting themselves in the foot with the Cell architecture. Difficulty of programming was one of the biggest complaints about the PS2, and from what I know about the cell architecture sony may have exacerbated the problem.
In the end, I predict that Microsoft will win, sony will take a distant second place with a few ports and very few original games, and nintendo will be completely out in left field making some money on things that bear very little resemblance to traditional games, and which may or may not be any fun at all.

Re:A little disconcerting (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#12264218)

Your insights are strange and far removed from reality. But then again, Slashdot moderators have never really understood the difference between "insightful" and "interesting" all that well.

Casualties (4, Insightful)

tprime (673835) | more than 9 years ago | (#12263971)

RIP Nintendo. I really wish I understood what they have been trying to do for the last 8 or so years. Ever since they decided reneg on their agreement with Sony to make the Nintendo64 CD thing (or whatever it was supposed to be called) they have been trying to catch up. I really can't imagine a console gaming world without Nintendo, but 10 years out we might be remembering back to the times when we had Nintendo's like we do now with Atari games.

As for Sony and Microsoft, I am going to enjoy this battle and am, in a lot of ways, rooting for Microsoft to do well. Where Sony has followed their traditional arrogance (lack of support, proprietary hardware, proprietary accessories) with most of their consumer electronics (cameras, CLIE, etc.) Microsoft has really done a good job distancing the xbox from the mothership that we all complain about.
Who would have thought that it would be Microsoft trying to force game companies to support older titles (EA's sports titles to be exact) for longer than the game publisher had intended.

Honestly, I think that the reason that the next iteration of Microsoft's console will include the name xbox in the title is to continue the separation between xbox and the Microsoft name. Sony uses Sony in all of the titles as does Nintendo, where MS is only listed in small print.

Regardless of how things turn out, it will be fun to watch

Re:Casualties (1, Insightful)

Thrakkerzog (7580) | more than 9 years ago | (#12264042)

RIP Nintendo. I really wish I understood what they have been trying to do for the last 8 or so years.

They have actually been quite profitable.

Re:Casualties (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#12264063)

RIP Nintendo.
Why? They've been quite profitable, opposed to Microsoft who has been pissing away billions on Xbox.

Re:Casualties (1, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#12264091)

Your perception of history and reality is fascinating. I like how facts never enter the equation with you at all, just flat out inaccurate bits & pieces you've picked up by being a casual non-interested bystander while things were going on around you, like a dung beetle rolling a shitball back to its mate in the middle of a burning forest.

Now go back and tell the other retards in the loony bin about the time you've wasted here today while the "norms" were discussing something serious.

Re:Casualties (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#12265164)

The "norms?" Chomsky or MacDonald?

Nintendo, like Apple is NOT dying (4, Insightful)

Cadallin (863437) | more than 9 years ago | (#12264138)

I don't know why you think Nintendo is dying. That's exactly like saying apple is dying. Apparently they're "dying" while raking in moderate to large profits each quarter while their competitors struggle to break even. Nintendo isn't going anywhere. And secondly, the joint Nintendo/Sony Venture was an SNES expansion, that gave rise to the PS1.

Re:Nintendo, like Apple is NOT dying (3, Insightful)

cgenman (325138) | more than 9 years ago | (#12265983)

It should be pointed out, though, that the bedrock of Nintendo's large profits have been thanks to GameBoy-related sales. With the PSP looking stronger than the DS currently, it is questionable whether or not this will continue, or whether the significantly cheaper and more durable GBA will continue to rule the market.

Not that the 64 or the 'Cube lost money over it's lifetime, but the GBA has really been key to Nintendo's profits for a while. I'm not saying Nintendo is dying. Nintendo has been a master of making money as the second (or third) console platform, with profit-based payouts to suppliers and the like. I'm just saying their position isn't as assured as before. At some point they may have to start dipping into their bags and bags of money to reinvent themselves.

Re:Nintendo, like Apple is NOT dying (0, Troll)

Elranzer (851411) | more than 9 years ago | (#12267377)

Too bad the PSP was a complete and utter failure. The DS isn't so hot either, but Nintendo at least has GBA. Don't look for Nintendo slipping out of the #1 spot in handhelds anytime in your lifetime.

Re:Nintendo, like Apple is NOT dying (2, Insightful)

cgenman (325138) | more than 9 years ago | (#12267463)

Was a complete and utter failure? While it didn't sell out in the first 10 minutes, it still sold quite respectably. 150 million dollars in sales in the first weeks is not a failure. It hit the 500,000 mark in 2 days, which is a bit ahead of the GBA and DS's launch week to hit that mark.

Plus, it's already engendering certain emotions [redassedbaboon.com] not otherwise seen in the gaming community. (not since Rez [gamegirladvance.com] , anyway). Of course, GGA has a good writeup [gamegirladvance.com] . Anything that can make gaming not dorky is a success in my book, independent of sales.

I don't own a PSP and I don't plan to any time soon. But the system has quickly grabbed a respectable user base, and become a real part of the gaming landscape. They're giving the big N at least a run for their money, and they have a real chance at grabbing the pocket-sized crown. Kudos to Sony for doing what Sega, NEC, Tiger, Bandai, SNK Playmore, and Atari couldn't.

Re:Nintendo, like Apple is NOT dying (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#12269366)

You are mistaking "sucks" for "utter failure."

It may fling media disks across the room like throwing stars, and feel like it will fall apart in your hands if you don't walk in a slow, gliding, heel-to-toe motion at all times, but that doesn't change the fact that they sold a crapload of them, and will continue to sell even more.

Re:Nintendo, like Apple is NOT dying (1)

MilenCent (219397) | more than 9 years ago | (#12268367)

With the PSP looking stronger than the DS currently, it is questionable whether or not this will continue, or whether the significantly cheaper and more durable GBA will continue to rule the market.

I'm not sure about this. The DS is also significantly cheaper and durable than the PSP. And the PSP's strength in the mass-market boils down to (in my opinion) MP3 playback and better graphics, but comes at the expense of much greater price.

The future is cloudy in this area. Neither system has what I consider to be all that great a lineup so far. The one out of the gate with a real system seller (Lumines doesn't count from what I've seen) may go on to win.

Re:Nintendo, like Apple is NOT dying (1)

Mattintosh (758112) | more than 9 years ago | (#12275691)

The GBA is going away soon.
The DS is a placeholder.
The PSP is going to die a swift death.
The "Revolution" is a Gamecube-compatible portable, and the true successor to the GBA.

Nintendo is still king of the handheld. They're quite assured of making still more bags of money. And Sony is quite assured of being sent home with their tail between their legs, much in the same way they've been put in their place by Apple in the portable music player market in recent years.

As a side note, since Nintendo has no plans for a home console release for at least 2 years, how do you think Sony and Microsoft are going to fare against a portable, well-established system with a large library and some incremental hardware improvements to an already good design?

Re:Casualties (4, Insightful)

Spleener12 (587422) | more than 9 years ago | (#12265016)

Christ, people. BEING IN THIRD PLACE != BEING DEAD! If that were the case, Microsoft would be dying too (they're a distant third in the Japanese market.) Yes, their past couple of home consoles have had problems (ie lack of more than a couple of worthwile third-party games.) But they've been dominating the portable market for over 15 years, which has been more than compensating for their losses elsewhere. Yes, the PSP might change this- hopefully it will change this, because monopolies are a bad, bad thing.

Point is, Nintendo isn't dead yet. Do I expect them to make a massive comeback and smash their competitors? Hell no. Nobody expects that save the rabid fanboys. They'll be the Apple of the home console industry- the portion of the market that likes what they make will continue to keep them alive (at least until Miyamoto retires/croaks.)

Re:Casualties (3, Insightful)

superpulpsicle (533373) | more than 9 years ago | (#12265574)

You have a very optimistic view. The pesimistic view saids...

Japan is the only country left on the planet where Nintendo is NOT last place. It is 3rd place in US, Europe, Hong Kong, Singapore, Taiwan, Canada etc etc. And 3rd place = last place. There is no other console after Nintendo.

Re:Casualties (4, Insightful)

Zangief (461457) | more than 9 years ago | (#12266261)

The real view says:

Nintendo posted HUGE profits last quarter. After a initial good sales, PSP sales are slowing down DESPITE the increased availability. Nintendo has huge reserves in the bank, and its major actionist is the Yamauchi Family, so is unlikely to be sold.

Nintendo in on solid ground. Just because Sega had to leave the hardware market, doesn't mean Nintendo has to too. That is just an stupid and shortsighted analysis.

Re:Casualties (1)

Zangief (461457) | more than 9 years ago | (#12266275)

In fact, last week, in japan the DS outsold the PSP.

Re:Casualties (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#12273980)

I correct you: three weeks in a row.

Re:Casualties (2, Insightful)

C0rinthian (770164) | more than 9 years ago | (#12266314)

Okay, they're in last place. If they are still turning a profit and their stockholders are happy, who cares?

Re:Casualties (1)

dbretton (242493) | more than 9 years ago | (#12273077)


You're right! Third place is not the same as being dead in the console industry. Just look at, for example, the...
TurboGrafx-16
3D0
Atari Jaguar
Sega 32x

Re:Casualties (1)

Red Moose (31712) | more than 9 years ago | (#12265177)

Ever since they decided reneg on their agreement with Sony to make the Nintendo64 CD thing (or whatever it was supposed to be called)

That was called Play Station.

The subsequent split left Sony to go on to make the Play Station X, or PSX as it was commonly known back in 1995. The X was dropped and then it was PSone, etc.,

Re:Casualties (1)

Dizzle (781717) | more than 9 years ago | (#12267094)

And it was to compete with the Sega CD, thus it was for the SNES. Not the 64.

Re:Casualties (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#12267168)

Although the grandparent was mistaken, there was a CD based addon for the N64, the N64DD. N64DD [wikipedia.org]

Re:Casualties (1)

oasis007 (840964) | more than 9 years ago | (#12272255)

It wasn't a CD based add-on. It used magnetic discs... I own one. :)

Re:Casualties (1)

Shadowlore (10860) | more than 9 years ago | (#12278811)

As for Sony and Microsoft, I am going to enjoy this battle and am, in a lot of ways, rooting for Microsoft to do well. Where Sony has followed their traditional arrogance (lack of support, proprietary hardware, proprietary accessories) with most of their consumer electronics (cameras, CLIE, etc.) Microsoft has really done a good job distancing the xbox from the mothership that we all complain about.

Like proprietary hardware, lack of support ...

If you want to separate Xbox from MS, you must do the same for PS vs. Sony. Did Microsoft provide teh needfuls for putting Linux on the Xbox? No. Does Sony have a bunch of proprietary PS2 accessories? Not that I can tell. My USB devices work there as well as other places.

Who would have thought that it would be Microsoft trying to force game companies to support older titles (EA's sports titles to be exact) for longer than the game publisher had intended.

Certainly not anybody that *knows* that Sony was the first to bring out backward compatibility, not MS. Sony's PS2 plays PS1 games. Over a thousand of them. They've already announced the PS3 will support PS2 AND PS1 games. I've got games that were put out nearly a *decade* that are still able to be played in my PS2. Do you think the makers of all those games thought that Sony would come out with it's next *two* (so far) console systems still playing them? No, I don't either.

Xbox2 support Xbox1 games? Last I heard the word was "NO".

On the other hand, Microsoft trying to FORCE someone ELSE to do SUPPORT? No, never would have occured to me that they'd do something like that. Not in a million years. ;)

Online console gaming is something to look at too. Unless things have changed in the last six months, only the PS2 can be played on the 'Net over a dialup connection. PS2's SOCOM II on it's own is played online more than all Xbox titles *combined* worldwide.

Will Microsoft continue to sell the Xbox after the Xbox2 comes out? I've my doubts and they are justified. Sony, however, still produces the PS1. Curiously, game makers *still* make games for it. Even after a decade years of production (November 15th marks nine years of PSOne availability in teh US, IIRC, but the PSOne was laucnhed in Japan in 94), sales are still strong for PSOne and PSOne titles/accessories.

I suspect that when the PS3 comes out, we'll still see the PS2 kicking around in supported production format, and games for it, for a long while. Whether PSOne is still around will be an interesting thing to watch.

Yes, it will be an interesting battle between behemoths. But there is not much hope from MS in this battle. Their desktop monopoly gives no assistance to the console world. And in the console world, Sony is the 1600 pound gorrilla.

AntiMS zealots will take heart in this. Personally, I'd hoped for better competition for Sony (drives it all forward), but so afar I've not seen it.

As of December, the PS1/PSOne has over a hundred million units shipped. The PS2 about 81 million. For GameCube we're talking about 18M, and 20M for Xbox. In other words, of actively sold non-handheld gaming consoles, Sony's got about 83% market share. Microsoft and Nintendo split the remainder nearly evenly, with each holding single digit shares. Seen in this light, or even in raw shipments, Nintendo is no more dead than Microsoft is. On the other hand, taking the GB:Advance and GB:Advance SP, as well as the Nintendo DS into account, they too dwarf MS' presence in the non-PC gaming industry. So I wouldn't count Nintendo out just yet unless you count MS out as well. Indeed I expect the handheld gaming scene to spark up some interest in the looming battle between Nintendo and Sony, a section of console gaming left essentially entirely to Nintendo by MS and Sony until Sony's PSP.

The PS2/GC/Xbox generation of consoles is expected to top out at around 160M consoles over the life of the cycle. Sony already has the majority of them for that forseable result. How many honestly and reasonably expect MS to sell over a hundred million Xbox1 models after the release of Xbox2?

These are reasons why MS is not likely to be interested in keeping Xbox01 out after the next gen hits, or why game makers won't be producing many (if any) titles for it for long after the next gen gets released.

From a game maker standpoint if I want the biggest potential market I target PSOne. 182 Million (minus broken ones but that's true for all systems) consoles capable of playing them my games are in the hands of consumers, and all of those consoles are currently being actively marketed, supported, and sold.

The only non-PC gaming platform to rival the PS1/PS2 juggernaut is the GameBoy, released in 1989 in Japan. It tops out with about 139M units shipped IIRC.

Sony hype refers to the PS4 (5, Insightful)

Filiks (578065) | more than 9 years ago | (#12264214)

Remember when Sony said the PS2 could do Toy Story in real time? They did. Turns out they meant the PS3 will be able to do it. So just keep in mind that whatever they say about the visual quality of the PS3, actually refers to the PS4.

Re:Sony hype refers to the PS4 (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#12265061)


Yea, the PS2 was going to be a supercomputer too.

Too bad it runs Linux like a Pentium 75MHz

Re:Sony hype refers to the PS4 (1)

TheSpeedoBeast (863070) | more than 9 years ago | (#12265589)

Remember when Sony said the PS2 could do Toy Story in real time? They did. Turns out they meant the PS3 will be able to do it. So just keep in mind that whatever they say about the visual quality of the PS3, actually refers to the PS4.
Hell, my dvd player can do that!

Re:Sony hype refers to the PS4 (1)

Stolethis (873779) | more than 9 years ago | (#12265805)

Your DVD player can reproduce the images. It can't make them from scratch.

Re:Sony hype refers to the PS4 (1)

geminidomino (614729) | more than 9 years ago | (#12267279)

Eh, Final Fantasy X was much prettier than Toy Story, and IIRC, most of that was rendered rather than FMV.

Re:Sony hype refers to the PS4 (1)

Elranzer (851411) | more than 9 years ago | (#12267387)

The characters in Toy Story weren't shakey figures with torret's syndrome suffering from the jaggies like they were in FFX. Amazing how a game from 2001 couldn't top CGI from 1995, and still can't.

Re:Sony hype refers to the PS4 (1)

geminidomino (614729) | more than 9 years ago | (#12267611)

Are we talking about the same FFX?

I'm talking about the actual cinematic scenes, not the general "running around killing stuff" parts of the game, and those were VERY nice looking.

As much as I hate what's happened to Square in recent years, I have to say in their defense that, if they wanted to make the whole GAME that pretty, they would have had no room for, say, game data. That's a limitation of the storage medium, though, not the processor. If it couldn't render TS in real time, it came damned close.

Re:Sony hype refers to the PS4 (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#12281118)

Oh, you mean the CG scenes then. Because the cutscenes in FFX were CG. Only the map screens and battle screens were done using the PS2 rendering engine. The cutscenes were (not surprisingly) all CG.

And, not surprisingly, the PS2-rendered graphics looked terrible. The hair had to be the worst, though, because it had this strange "reverse alpha" effect where the alpha on the hair would overwrite the alpha behind the characters. So if a character's head was in front of, say, transparent blue water, there would be a random white "halo" wherever their hair extended.

There were plenty of other glitches too, though. Like the fact that the character's movements looked like they had Touretts, since they didn't match up at all with the spoken dialog. (Note to Square-Enix: the next time you translate a game to another language, redo the animation to match the new timing.)

Re:Sony hype refers to the PS4 (2, Funny)

KDR_11k (778916) | more than 9 years ago | (#12267965)

You mean Parkinson's disease, Tourette's syndrome means uncontrolled swearing. Too bad, FFX would have been MUCH more interesting if Tidus had Tourette's syndrome.

Re:Sony hype refers to the PS4 (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#12269436)

Tourette's syndrome means uncontrolled swearing.

No it doesn't.

Tourette's syndrome is a disease which causes involuntary ticks and spasms. In most cases, this is manefested as head and body twitches, sudden grunting noises, and is often accompanied by obsessive-compulsive behaviour disorders

(Abdur-Rahim, an NBA player who chose not to medicate his Tourette's Syndrome for religous reasons, was said to spend an hour and a half tying his shoes, because they had to be just so.)

In some (very rare) cases, these involuntary ticks include outbursts of profanity.

Re:Sony hype refers to the PS4 (1)

TyrionEagle (458561) | more than 9 years ago | (#12267293)


Remember when Sony said the PS2 could do Toy Story in real time?

Links please? I've heard this loads, but nobody ever provides links!

I'm not saying they never said it, I remember it being said, but I can't find any links to press releases, or briefing notes where the quote is directly attributed to a Sony exec.

Re:Sony hype refers to the PS4 (1, Interesting)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#12268635)

They never said it. Though Beyond Good and Evil did look better than Toy Story

Toy story [joelrennie.com]

BG&E [www.gon.se]
BG&E [netvor.sk]
BG&E [netvor.sk]

All in all, Toy story looked like crap. MAny games on PS2 look better than Toy Story

Re:Sony hype refers to the PS4 (1)

Slashcrap (869349) | more than 9 years ago | (#12279925)

All in all, Toy story looked like crap. MAny games on PS2 look better than Toy Story

Didn't I just tell you to go out, get laid and stop posting this shit?

I'll keep on reminding you anyway. Posting anonymously or not, you're not exactly difficult to spot. Everything you write just screams "virgin".

Re:Sony hype refers to the PS4 (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#12268582)

Remember when Sony said the PS2 could do Toy Story in real time? They did

Actually they didnt. They claimed it would render CG quality graphics in real time, and proved it with a tech demo rendering the final fantasy 8 FMVs real time. You fucktards need to drop the toy story myth once and for all

Re:Sony hype refers to the PS4 (2, Informative)

hollismb (817357) | more than 9 years ago | (#12271465)

Actually, they did. They also had George Lucas come out and refer to the fact that it could render movie quality CG comparable to what's in the Star Wars movies. Or was that the PS3? I forget. But yes, at some point, they directly compared the rendering capabilities of the PS2 to Toy Story quality graphics. It was right around the time they announced it and showed us the lame rubby ducky in the sink floating on water demo.

Re:Sony hype refers to the PS4 (0, Troll)

Shadowlore (10860) | more than 9 years ago | (#12278895)

Remember when Sony said the PS2 could do Toy Story in real time? They did.

No, and truth told, neither do you. Know how I know? They didn't claim it. A puff peice written by a so-called journalist said that. Not Sony.

The power of the PS2 will allow for real time manipulation of Toy Story-quality graphics, as well as digital surround sound audio. Full orchestras, rock, techno, hip hop, and punk rock bands have already begun chipping in to make these games sonically as well as visually an art form of their own. If you think I am being a tad dramatic, it may interest you to know that Titanic director James Cameron is currently involved in an underwater action/adventure game similar to "The Abyss".

-- http://www.deadontheweb.com/june_2000/psx2/

There you go, the original. From a "fanboy" of sorts. Not sony.
So no, none of us remember when Sony made that claim. Not even you.

Mods:
No insight to the parent post, just unadulterated crap. Insightful *should* require truth or accuracy. The parent post had neither.

An no, this post isn't insightful either,. informative perhaps but not insightful.

Hardware taking its sweet time... (1)

wandazulu (265281) | more than 9 years ago | (#12271417)

What about software developers? Yu Suzuki seems to be in no hurry to even confirm or deny Shenmue 3's existance, and Rare has done what since the Ghoulies?

As for platform familarity, I cry BS. Shenmue 2 was the triumph of putting a lot of bitmaps on a disc, and seeing as all Rare games look basically the same, the reason why we haven't seen Banjoe Threeie is what exactly?

I know I'm over simplifying things (especially Shenmue 2 which I thought was awesome), but we're not talking about developers trying to push the graphics envelope here. And franky, that's not what I'm looking for...I just want fun games, and Shenmue and Banjo-Kazooie (not so much Twoie) were a lot of fun.

I can imagine Suzuki being tied up doing ... uh...Virtual Fighter?, but that doesn't explain Rare, now that they're just another microsoft division. Maybe they have big plans for the next xbox, but I'll believe it when I see it.

The Phantom will ship by Christmas!!!!! (0, Redundant)

dustin_0099 (877013) | more than 9 years ago | (#12272321)

And even more cool: The next Nintendo will run all Playstation games!
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