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BBC Trial of TV Show Download Service

Zonk posted more than 9 years ago | from the working-for-the-viewers dept.

Television 257

Little Hamster writes "Five thousand households with broadband access has been selected for a trial of the BBC's new interactive Media Player. The trial will run from September to December, and users can 'time shift' and download selected BBC TV shows, radio programmes, regional programming and feature films. After seven days, the content will be automatically deleted from the user's computers. BBC will use this trial to iron out any outstanding rights issues and resolve teething difficulties with the technology ahead of a full launch next year." The BBC Press Office has a release about this as well.

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TiVo? (1, Insightful)

astro_ripper (884636) | more than 9 years ago | (#12554938)

So this is like TiVo, except you have less control, and the content get's deleted after a week. And people want that?

Am I missing something?

Re:TiVo? (4, Insightful)

maharg (182366) | more than 9 years ago | (#12554981)

yes, you don't get a free TiVo with a UK tv license

Re:TiVo? (1)

astro_ripper (884636) | more than 9 years ago | (#12555050)

I guess that is a pretty good difference. I wasn't aware there was such as thing as a TV License.

Re:TiVo? (5, Interesting)

andrewbaldwin (442273) | more than 9 years ago | (#12555686)

Where have you been?

The UK TV licence fee is regularly moaned about on Slashdot!

For info:

In the UK you need to have a licence for each address which has a TV receiver (you can have dozens of sets in the same house and one licence if you want*)

FWIW I'm happy to pay it for TV free from adverts disrupting the shows and with greater freedom to express ideas without worrying about business withdrawing advertising revenue. And don't worry about the 'tax' aspects meaning state direction - the Beeb regularly clashes with the government of the day - as both main parties seem to complain about it, it must be reasonably neutral. (BTW I have no connection with the BBC)

Others may dislike the licence on philosophical / political / dogmatic grounds (esp if they like watching the commercial channels more) - I accept that I have to subsidise, through higher prices, the advertising 'industry' and through them the other channels.

* actually there are some restrictions (eg multiple independent occupancy of a house split into flats) but the principle holds for most cases

Re:TiVo? (1)

jantheman (113125) | more than 9 years ago | (#12555690)

You're right - it's called a TV Licence.

Re:TiVo? (3, Interesting)

TheRaven64 (641858) | more than 9 years ago | (#12555130)

Although this does raise the question of why the content is deleted at all. Since the license payers have already paid for it to be produced, why can they not do whatever they want with the content?

Re:TiVo? (2, Insightful)

Richard_at_work (517087) | more than 9 years ago | (#12555717)

Simple - they havent paid for it to be produced, theyve paid a TV license fee, which is entirely differnet. It just so happens that the BBC receives this money, but that does not automatically mean that the viewers have all rights to the productions.

Re:TiVo? (4, Insightful)

taskforce (866056) | more than 9 years ago | (#12554995)

Yes, you have access to the BBC's entire library Napster style, except it's *free* (As in TV Liscence, not beer.)

TiVo I believe you can only record shows that were on and watch them later, or am I missing something?

you dont have access to the BBC's entire library (1, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#12555342)

From TFA:

"...which allows viewers to download any show from the previous week that they may have missed."

Re:TiVo? (1)

Stibidor (874526) | more than 9 years ago | (#12555011)

They will if the price is right. For instance, from what I gather, this trial is free. I would try something like that for free. It may just be that the trial users get hooked and sign on for whatever the BBC has down the pipeline. And if the eventual public release costs less than TiVo, why not?

Re:TiVo? (2, Insightful)

/ASCII (86998) | more than 9 years ago | (#12555078)

This is a test. Once this is mature, you will have all of these advantages:

Watch programs that are several years old, whenever you want, without having to record them. Watch three or more programs which all originally ran at the same time. Set up playlists of arbitrary programs, i.e. 'show me season two of Buffy'.

This is all assuming the BBC continues to try and develop it's offerings. I sure hope they do.

Re:TiVo? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#12555651)

And they implemented the special "delete after seven days" code just for the test and plan to remove it later? That sounds unlikely.

Re:TiVo? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#12555178)

No, you have more control. You get to pick when it 'airs'.

Want to keep it longer than a week? Record it just like you would if it only aired at 8:00pm on Friday.

Re:TiVo? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#12555191)

I think that they may have a hard time deleting the content of computer literate people. Just how do they plan to stop people from recording the content onto a video camera plugged into the s-video port?

Re:TiVo? (1)

Trigun (685027) | more than 9 years ago | (#12555304)

They don't have to. They just have to make it easy enough that everybody uses it. After that, who cares about a 1% piracy rate.

Re:TiVo? (-1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#12555192)

actually yes you did miss the point, completely.

i mean i am shocked, did you stop reading half way through the summary

Re:TiVo? (3, Informative)

gowen (141411) | more than 9 years ago | (#12555212)

From TFA
Unlike personal video recorders such as Sky Plus, viewers will not have to signal their chosen programmes in advance, allowing critically acclaimed shows to benefit retrospectively from a favourable review or word of mouth.
Wow. It's almost as if you didn't RTFA.

Re:TiVo? (1)

astro_ripper (884636) | more than 9 years ago | (#12555370)

Actually I did. But regardless, if it only saved programs for a week, you'd better hope a friend is on the ball enough to be able to recommend a good show and hope you have enough time to see it before the next episode airs in the next week, when your old copy will be gone. Much of my misunderstanding is in that I don't know much about cable in the UK. I ass-u-me-d that a TiVo like product existed there. "That's why you ask questions, that's how you learn *kicks Lenny*"

Re:TiVo? (1)

Stween (322349) | more than 9 years ago | (#12555243)

All the other responses are entirely valid, and this does indeed look like a good and useful service.

It's worth pointing out though, that certainly in the UK, most 'people' won't know what a TiVo is. This is New and Exciting for them, and is perhaps a step up from Sky Plus.

Re:TiVo? (1)

Goth Biker Babe (311502) | more than 9 years ago | (#12555551)

Actually it's not a step up from Sky+.

Why would I want to convert digitally received signals to analogue only to digitise them again, before undigitising them to view them? It makes more sense to record the data straight from the transport stream.

I'm waiting for the DVD recorder with the freeview tuner built in.

Re:TiVo? (1)

Technician (215283) | more than 9 years ago | (#12555549)

So this is like TiVo, except you have less control

I would expect that. I have found many of the subscription services to be expensive on top of the rest of the insult.

As a case in point, one of the online radio stations permits you to subscribe to a NPR show "Car Talk". The subscription for one program on one channel is $12.95/month.

Why would anyone pay for one show on one channel for almost the price for XM radio? On XM you get many channels and all the programms on each channel. It just doesn't make sense the rates they try to charge for one program.

Something needs to be done about the prices for a-la-carte programming.

If the RIAA realy wanted to rake in the dough, they could have charged $0.05 per track in the heyday of Napster. I would be buying MP3's. Instead they drove the consumers away. For most people the prices are a showstopper.

At a nickel a track, it could have been paid by either the consumer or a sponsor for ad placement.

What's it cost the RIAA. They wouldn't have to press the CD's, put them in boxes, warehouse, and retail them. Instead they killed the golden goose.

I expect if you select 8 or 10 shows, your subscription for the a-la-carte TV could be as high as a regular cable bill if they get greedy and don't contain the retail price.

Re:TiVo? (1)

Goth Biker Babe (311502) | more than 9 years ago | (#12555733)

It's just another way of viewing TV. Rather like their radio service [bbc.co.uk] .

Tivo never really took off over here (UK) because the sort of people who would buy one are the sort of people who would have satelite or cable and something like a third of the population now receive digital television so all the EPG services and the like they already get. And the quality of an HQ VCR is good enough when compared to the loss in quality because you have to convert digital to analogue back to digital (when recording) and back to analogue (when playing back that recording).

Those who are interested in harddisk recorders have bought one of the PVRs/DVRs available here like the Sky+ [sky.com] box.

The Office? (2, Funny)

FriedTurkey (761642) | more than 9 years ago | (#12554944)

Hopefully they will allow downloads of the "The Office". It is a great series. Although as an American, I have to turn on the subtitles to understand what they are saying. Also I didn't understand any of the British pop culture references except the Benny Hill ones.

Maybe BBC should allow downloads of Benny Hill too?

Re:The Office? (2, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#12555062)

Benny Hill was on ITV (Thames IIRC)

Re:The Office? (3, Informative)

gowen (141411) | more than 9 years ago | (#12555504)

"The Benny Hill Show" started on the BBC in 1955, but transferred to ITV in 1969. The ones that are seen in the US are entirely from the ITV run, and with many of the ruder bits cut out.

Re:The Office? (-1)

Malc (1751) | more than 9 years ago | (#12555156)

Benny Hill was deported in the early 80's. He wasn't acceptable on British television. For some reason the rest of the world put up with him though.

Re:The Office? (4, Interesting)

BenjyD (316700) | more than 9 years ago | (#12555341)

I often read Americans saying they had to turn on subtitles to understand parts of The Office. As an English person I've always wanted to know which parts/characters Americans find hard to understand. Or is it just the slang terms used?

From an English person's point of view, the accents are fairly standard mid-England/London accents. But then, having driven round rural Georgia, I know we are two countries divided by a common language.

Re:The Office? (1, Interesting)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#12555533)

Heck, we in the US are one country divided by a common language. I moved to northern California from the midwest a couple of years ago. There are many large but distinct ethnic groups here all with their own version of English.

For weeks when I first arrived (and sometimes even now) I had to have my wife translate what people were saying to me. She's from here originally and so grew up understanding the different dialects.

Those first few weeks were like visiting a foreign country with only a high school level understanding of the language.

Re:The Office? (1)

FriedTurkey (761642) | more than 9 years ago | (#12555543)

Mostly just the general slang. I can assume most of them refer to sex. I think Americans find some of the humor [humour] in the cheeky British "shagging" words.

Also David Brent's songs are hilarious when you actually see the words.

Re:The Office? (1, Redundant)

metlin (258108) | more than 9 years ago | (#12555573)

I *am* from Georgia, ye' insensitive clawd. x-(

Re:The Office? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#12555641)

Some British slang is totally lost on me, but then again, I'm not sure how many of you guys understand "For shizzle my nizzle" from our side :-) Anyway, some Americans have huge problems understanding anyone with an accent. I used to watch Monty Python regularly on re-runs, so I can understand most British people. Scots are sometimes difficult for me though. The only Brit I can think of that I can't understand very well is Liam Gallagher. I have no problems with Noel, but Liam often sounds like he's got a potato in his mouth.

Re:The Office? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#12555656)

It's easy... Most of my fellow Americans don't even speak American English well enough for locals to understand (e.g. the Ebonic and Hillbilly/Texan variants). There's no chance that they'd understand British English as well. Rural Georgia is a good example, as you mention. The further south you go in the USA, the more slowly everyone speaks. The further north, the more you hear all sorts of bizarre twists on the language (like New Englanders and Canadians). It's probably similar in the UK. I suspect that typical English speakers might have trouble with strong Cockney dialects just the same.

Re:The Office? (1)

Takeel (155086) | more than 9 years ago | (#12555659)

I often read Americans saying they had to turn on subtitles to understand parts of The Office. As an English person I've always wanted to know which parts/characters Americans find hard to understand. Or is it just the slang terms used?

Often, people speaking any sort of accented English are subtitled via lower-thirds in American programming. I guess I find it to be a sad situation, but it's the nature of things.

Re:The Office? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#12555692)

If you drove around more of the US than Gerogia than you also know that the Georgia is more different from Boston than Cockney is from BBC news. (to my ears)

Re:The Office? (1)

Reignking (832642) | more than 9 years ago | (#12555484)

...or watch it on BBC America [bbcamerica.com] ...

Re:The Office? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#12555521)

Um, maybe you should read the end of the BBC press release. Unless you are an American living in the UK (or with some proxying through the UK) it looks like you won't be able to get this sutff.

Am I missing something? (3, Insightful)

frankthechicken (607647) | more than 9 years ago | (#12554946)

If the BBC essentially runs a public domain service anyway, why are the shows deleted after seven days?

This ceratinly doesn't need to happen on a video recording.

Re:Am I missing something? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#12555120)

Because the BBC are the copyright holders. Just because they are (mostly) publicly funded doesn't mean their output is "public domain".

Re:Am I missing something? (4, Insightful)

AKAImBatman (238306) | more than 9 years ago | (#12555140)

If the BBC essentially runs a public domain service anyway, why are the shows deleted after seven days?

I don't think it's that simple. For one, I believe that BBC doesn't own all the shows they broadcast. (Although they do own quite a few.) As such, they are licensed to provide public distribution of the shows, but are not necessary able to just give them away. This would seem to be backed by the article's mention of Hollywood and independent studios.

In addition, it also mentions that the acting unions are "acting up"^H^H balking at the idea of Internet distribution. They don't give any details, but my guess is that actors are concerned that rampant piracy would result in lower wages and fewer acting jobs. It's probably pretty hard to convince them that if given a good for-pay alternative, the majority of people will use the convenient pay service. (The only reason why Napster ever appeared was that the music industry failed to respond to market pressures. What did they THINK was going to happen?)

Re:Am I missing something? (2, Interesting)

gowen (141411) | more than 9 years ago | (#12555241)

actors are concerned that rampant piracy would result in lower wages and fewer acting jobs
It's more likely that they're balking at the fact that on-demand video won't supply them with the repeat fees that they get when shows are rebroadcast by traditional means.

Re:Am I missing something? (1)

AKAImBatman (238306) | more than 9 years ago | (#12555300)

It's more likely that they're balking at the fact that on-demand video won't supply them with the repeat fees that they get when shows are rebroadcast by traditional means.

That's a good point. I'm not too familar with British styles of acting compensation, but if I had royalties, I'd definitely like to hold onto them. Once the time-shifting issue is figured out, I suppose what they'd need to do for pay-per-view is make sure that royalties are properly earmarked for each download. This would give actors a similar income, but probably more frequent payments. Plus, actors might see royalties for shows that have all but disappeared from reruns.

Re:Am I missing something? (1)

VdG (633317) | more than 9 years ago | (#12555799)

Actors generally object to too many repeats, despite royalties. They'd much rather see new programmes being made.

Re:Am I missing something? (1)

NetNifty (796376) | more than 9 years ago | (#12555157)

I seem to remember a while ago that it was taking so long for them to do this (they announced it first quite a long time ago) because of the issues of paying actors (IIRC they get paid royalties each time it's shown, or something like that), so DRM is probably their solution they could agree on. Also the BBC gains a lot of capital from DVD sales.

Really is a pity though they are using DRM, and a custom application, as I wouldn't be surprised at all if it only ran on Windows. I also hope the P2P part of it actually lets me cap upload and download bandwidth, and the application allows me to watch the video on my TV which is connected to my PC.

Re:Am I missing something? (4, Insightful)

erroneus (253617) | more than 9 years ago | (#12555215)

If they didn't delete content, people's computers would crash. You seem to forget we're talking about the public here...

Re:Am I missing something? (2, Insightful)

Mwongozi (176765) | more than 9 years ago | (#12555306)

Disclaimer: The following is a guess.

The system uses a P2P network to distribute the shows. By forcing the erasure of old shows, they ensure that only the latest shows are being shared, resulting in more efficient use of bandwidth, and faster downloads.

Having said that, it's probably just because they can.

Re:Am I missing something? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#12555481)

P2P scales well with demand. They would not be hurt by allowing older files to exist on the network.

Re:Am I missing something? (1)

DigitalBubblebath (708955) | more than 9 years ago | (#12555613)

I imagine it's so less clued-up users don't run out of disk space, after all video takes up a lot of room. Would be nice to have the option though - I suppose that's what this trial's for though eh?

UK has a yearly TV "tax" (0, Flamebait)

SuperBanana (662181) | more than 9 years ago | (#12555699)

If the BBC essentially runs a public domain service anyway, why are the shows deleted after seven days?

Unlike American public television which is largely supported by private grants/donations/fundraising, the BBC is supported by advertising and (are you sitting down?) a yearly television tax.

A friend was at Suffolk University for a semester abroad. One day everyone in the dorm started running around like they were chickens with their heads cut off, and she asked what was going on. "The TV tax police!" She thought they were trying to do "pull a joke on the stupid American", until she looked out the window and saw a big van with antennas on top and what looked like police officers going building to building. (The vans use the RF from the heterodyne tuners to locate TVs that are on, I believe).

She said the scene would have made Orwell proud. Don't I recall hearing London has a 1:4 CCTV cameras:people ratio?

Re:UK has a yearly TV "tax" (4, Informative)

NetNifty (796376) | more than 9 years ago | (#12555726)

"the BBC is supported by advertising and (are you sitting down?) a yearly television tax."

Nope, just a yearly TV tax, no advertising.

More info about the TV License (tax) (3, Informative)

SuperBanana (662181) | more than 9 years ago | (#12555818)

More information:

One guy who doesn't own a TV, but gets harassed by the TV Licensing Agency (which is actually a private company contracted by the BBC, to the tune of a quarter billion pounds a year): http://www.marmalade.net/lime/ [marmalade.net]

Information about BBC revenue and expenditures, TVLA, etc: http://www.turnoffyourtv.com/international/bbc.htm l [turnoffyourtv.com]

Re:Am I missing something? (1)

m50d (797211) | more than 9 years ago | (#12555746)

It's not public domain. A significant amount of it is produced by other studios under license, licensed from other channels/countries, or will be licensed to other places for money. Now one can argue it should be public domain, but it presently isn't.

Well (2, Insightful)

metlin (258108) | more than 9 years ago | (#12554951)

If it is available digitally, it would certainly be possible to find a way of copying it without the whole deletion procedure.

Even if its a custom media player, how long is it going to take for someone to hack it up?

From the BBC Press release (4, Insightful)

Alranor (472986) | more than 9 years ago | (#12554955)

The BBC's interactive media player (iMP) is a new application in development which will allow users to download tv and radio programmes from bbc.co.uk to their PC or laptop and watch or listen to them for seven days after the transmission date.


Anyone wanna bet it'll be Windows only.

Guess i'll probably end up sticking to bittorrent.

Re:From the BBC Press release (1)

gowen (141411) | more than 9 years ago | (#12555155)

Anyone wanna bet it'll be Windows only.
Given the BBC's previous experiments with transmissions in OGG format, and their continued development of a video codec free of patent encumberances, I'd be very surprised if it was Windows only.

Re:From the BBC Press release (1)

Alranor (472986) | more than 9 years ago | (#12555309)

All true, but bear in mind this is an application not a codec, and it apparently has some form of DRM attached which will prevent the shows from being played later than a week after they've been downloaded.

Re:From the BBC Press release (1)

gowen (141411) | more than 9 years ago | (#12555454)

If iTunes has taught us anything, it is that DRM can be completely crossplatform.

Re:From the BBC Press release (1)

m50d (797211) | more than 9 years ago | (#12555791)

It has also taught us that the makers won't bother making a linux client.

Re:From the BBC Press release (1)

IamTheRealMike (537420) | more than 9 years ago | (#12555302)

Naturally, it might be out on the Mac too in time but I doubt it'll have a Linux version. There's no builtin DRM with Linux like there is with Windows so it'd be a lot harder to protect the content files.

IMHO DRM and Linux don't necessarily have to be enemies. For instance take the Windows XP "Secure Audio Path". It relies on driver co-operation and essentially means the audio passes from the media player encrypted into the kernel: there's no way to get the audio out of the media player in a cleartext form. The kernel will only decrypt and forward the audio to the driver if it's SAP enabled, which means it agrees to prevent recording at the same time as playing. In other words, you can't do a "play and record simultaneously" attack using only software.

At this point somebody will point out that you can still connect two computers (or a recording device) together using a minijack-to-minijack cable and use the analog hole. Yes. But doing so is awkward and requires cables I think most casual pirates don't have. Of course you can go down to your local Radio Shack and buy one if you know what you're looking for, but fundamentally DRM is about making things awkward - it's not about totally 100% secure uncrackable systems.

Let's say that the Linux kernel implemented an equivalent to SAP. Of course you could hack the source to disable it. But even if there were widespread RPMs of the patched kernels available, how many people would take the time to track them down and use them, simply for the privilege of using up bandwidth spreading them on p2p networks? For most people DRM isn't the fundamental religious issue it is to many here on Slashdot - they use P2P systems because it's a lot easier to search, point, click than the alternative (which is usually buy a DVD box set). The more awkward it is, the fewer people will do it, and the harder it becomes to find pirate copies of new material. Having the source means you can do something, not necessarily that you will do something.

Re:From the BBC Press release (1, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#12555406)

Yes it's some ActiveX gunk. I discovered the install URL and it runs in Crossover Office IE, but it doesn't show any programmes (maybe because I'm not a 'selected household').

Re:From the BBC Press release (1)

steeler359 (674331) | more than 9 years ago | (#12555606)

This brings up another issue, one that I have been pondering for a while...

I am a TV Licence payer, and like most people in this country pay the BBC over £100 a year for the privilege of having a publicly-funded independent broadcasting body show me the programs that I have directly paid for.

No problem with that (though I haven't always thought that way). Now what I'm wondering is what about the legal status of p2p downloads that I have on my computer of shows that have been produced and broadcast by the BBC?

This is particularly topical in my case as I have missed most of the new series of Dr Who for various reasons over the last coupla months, but have been able to download and watch them only a few days after their broadcast by the efforts pf the wonderful p2p community (Cheers lads and lasses). ...And what about all those freeloading citizens of other countries who have the nerve to download BBC shows off us? ***runs for cover***

(never mind the fact I may have downloaded chunks of my download from someone in another country..)

Gawd bless the ed2k network...

Jerry

: )

Sweet! (1)

AKAImBatman (238306) | more than 9 years ago | (#12554964)

I'm off to see if I can get the good Doctor here in the states! Cherrio!

Re:Sweet! (1, Interesting)

AKAImBatman (238306) | more than 9 years ago | (#12555048)

Dang. This is just a beta to 5000 homes. BTW, anyone notice this:

Laser disc This early forerunner to the DVD used giant 12-inch discs and was a conspicious flop.

That's like saying that oversized cassette cartriges were failures. Yeah, no one used them at home, but Laser Disks are still used at the industrial level to store master digital recordings of movies. Without laser disk technology, we'd probably still be splicing film!

Re:Sweet! (1)

elgaard (81259) | more than 9 years ago | (#12555255)

>but Laser Disks are still used at the industrial level to store master digital recordings of movies.

Laser Disks does not store video digitally.

Re:Sweet! (1)

AKAImBatman (238306) | more than 9 years ago | (#12555403)

Laser Disks does not store video digitally.

Seems you're right. From Wikipedia:

Video was stored on LD as an analog signal, while audio could be stored in either analog or digital format and in a variety of surround sound formats. Like on a CD, the surface of the disc is an aluminium foil covered by pits and lands, but whereas on a audio CD (or DVD) the pits and lands will signify binary codes, on an LD the pits are created using frequency modulation of an analog signal.

I always assumed that LD stored information in a manner similar to CDs. Turns out that Laser Disc is an OLDER technology than CDs, going all the way back to 1958! I used to have a Laser Disc player and never knew this. Guess you learn something new every day. Thanks for the info! :-)

Re:Sweet! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#12555371)

Laser discs store the signal in analogue form: The (non-discretized) length of the pits and lands encodes the signal.

Re:Sweet! (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#12555429)

Mods, the "Laser Disc" quote is from the article. It is not offtopic.

Re:Sweet! (1, Funny)

Golias (176380) | more than 9 years ago | (#12555069)

You can.

The new-ish group for it is alt.binaries.doctorwho (IIRC)

Re:Sweet! (1)

AKAImBatman (238306) | more than 9 years ago | (#12555174)

The new-ish group for it is alt.binaries.doctorwho (IIRC)

BBC: The DOC-TOR shows? EXTERMINATE! EXTERMINATE! ;-)

Re:Sweet! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#12555261)

You can get the new Doctor Who series with Eccleston off TVtorrents.com... all 8 episodes that have aired are up there now, at about 350 MB each. They are GREAT!

Re:Sweet! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#12555737)

Either you got a typo or the site is gone

If I Read TFA Correctly (1)

ultimabaka (864222) | more than 9 years ago | (#12554984)

This kinda deal has been around for quite a while in the US already. Concepts like Time Warner Cable's HBO/Showtime/Porn on Demand systems with their TiVO-esque receivers allow you to do something very similar, albeit over their high-speed cable connections only. The article doesn't seem to mention whether you can download the TV shows to your computer in any kind of HD, (or whether you can send them to others within the 15-day period for that matter), but I imagine you probably could, since, at least stateside, I believe you now can with the On-Demand stuff.

Of course, as usual, I could be totally wrong.

Its Positive (2, Interesting)

Digital Warfare (746982) | more than 9 years ago | (#12555017)

But I don't think they'll beat products like the Nebula [nebula-electronics.co.uk] because they are so easy to use, and no DRM
My Dad uses it often to record shows and burn them to DVD
very reliable

I like it...but need more than a week's worth. (1)

PenguinBoyDave (806137) | more than 9 years ago | (#12555021)

I like it. I think that you should be able to keep stuff for a month (what if you are on vacation, etc.) because you can't always watch what you need. I don't have Tivo because when I got it a while ago there was no interoperability with my VOIP phone. If I was told I could have this service I would have taken it. It might not suit everyone, but it works for me.

BBC and DRM (3, Insightful)

tdvaughan (582870) | more than 9 years ago | (#12555032)

I was disappointed at first to see that the BBC is implementing DRM but it's worth bearing in mind that not all the content broadcast by the BBC is owned by them. Much of it comes from independent studios who license it to the BBC. So I remain hopeful that the BBC will offer its own copyrighted material to UK license payers on more permissive terms.

Re:BBC and DRM (2, Interesting)

taskforce (866056) | more than 9 years ago | (#12555076)

Agreed, I thought the most interesting deveolopment was that they were allowing downloads of feature films (which presumably they've liscenced to show on the TV channels as well.) That's a step forward if anything.

broadcasters, telecom and hardware manufacturers (1)

ch-chuck (9622) | more than 9 years ago | (#12555034)

are pouring hundreds of millions of pounds into defining the way we will watch television in the next decade.

What about the writers, directors, actors and the audience? Don't they get any input in the electronic theatre?

Re:broadcasters, telecom and hardware manufacturer (2, Insightful)

JWW (79176) | more than 9 years ago | (#12555099)

Writers, directors, actors, yes.

Audience, no.

Re:broadcasters, telecom and hardware manufacturer (1)

Technician (215283) | more than 9 years ago | (#12555775)

Writers, directors, actors, yes.

Audience, no.


Wanna bet? Simply refuse to deal with hard to use content. It will show in the ratings. Ratings matter. Tell the sponsors. I wanted to watch the show, but I didn't because ....

Could not time shift, did not have the needed software upgrade, I dont' have a Windows computer, could not stream due to a proxy, subscription is exposing too much personal information and is an ID theft risk, I couldn't download and watch on my commute to work on the laptop, etc.

You do have a say. The question is; are there enough of you to be heard? Fear of not being heard is not a reason to not vote and speak up.

Christian singles (1)

ninja_assault_kitten (883141) | more than 9 years ago | (#12555039)

How they hell did Google associate this article with an ad for Christian singles?

Call me weird (5, Funny)

c0ldfusi0n (736058) | more than 9 years ago | (#12555105)

But with that headline, i first thought it was refering to a lawsuit. Trial and Music in the same headline, and it's not a lawsuit?! Expect a letter from the RIAA soon, guys!

Heh. (1)

Aldric (642394) | more than 9 years ago | (#12555173)

The RIAA like to sue people that can't fight back. The BBC can most definitely fight back.

Scary... (0)

sznupi (719324) | more than 9 years ago | (#12555139)

/. stories about MPAA brainwashed me to the point that I thought it's about court case or something...

Time-shifting (3, Funny)

RealProgrammer (723725) | more than 9 years ago | (#12555159)

Dr. Who fans will note that their house now looks a lot smaller on the outside than it really is on the inside.

Quit Complaining - And Read My Journal ;) (4, Insightful)

TheFlyingGoat (161967) | more than 9 years ago | (#12555196)

I've had a decent idea for legal TV distribution online in my journal for a while now. Most of the posts I see so far about this BBC service are negative. Finally a media outlet is trying to embrace technology instead of calling their lawyers every 5 minutes, and all people can do is complain. Downloadable shows will probably never be free without the show including some form of DRM or advertising... get used to it. I'd much rather have DRM or ads than no downloadable shows at all.

If you don't want the DRM or ads, get a Tivo or TV capture card and skip the commercials or edit them out.

Re:Quit Complaining - And Read My Journal ;) (1, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#12555780)

Finally a media outlet is trying to embrace technology instead of calling their lawyers every 5 minutes, and all people can do is complain.


Well, this media outlet gets its money from a tax on every TV in the land. Regardless of whether you actually watch any of the shows it makes, I suspect this is the Beeb's thin end of the wedge for demanding a broadband tax on every computer in the Uk, regardless of whether you ever actualy download any of their DRM's material. Yes, I know you could pay per download of stuff you actually want, but that's not what the BBC is about. What the BBC is about is getting money from every actual or potential viewer, regardless of what they actually watch, if anything.


disclaimer: I've no TV. I've downloaded some streaming radio programs (countable on the fingers of one hand, excluding the thumb) using Mplayer to enamble me to save the Real streams and convert to something sensible.

7 days - pah (0, Redundant)

DrSkwid (118965) | more than 9 years ago | (#12555205)

we want 0 day !!

my $ is on it taking less than 7 days to find unencumbered versions

modP do3n (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#12555232)

BSD 7anatics? I've

This is exactly what I want (2)

j-cloth (862412) | more than 9 years ago | (#12555254)

I will pay subscription fees to whoever will take the money so that I can download Six Feet Under or Lost or whatever else within minutes of broadcast without having to go looking for a torrent. Even more important, I want to be able to get series that I missed (Firefly, Sopranos) .... The nature of most P2P services (esp bittorrent) is that this older stuff is harder to come by.

I don't really care if I can keep the episodes forever. I do now, but I never rewatch any of them an only keep them around so I have a big enough share to get into the good Direct Connect channels.

Hopefully the test goes well and it's introduced in other markets soon.

Countdown to Angry Beeb (0, Redundant)

Racter (804902) | more than 9 years ago | (#12555276)

DRM broken in three...two...

Deletion after 7 days and VCRs (-1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#12555284)

Technically legally in the UK once you have watched a home recording of show you're meant to wipe the tape. This is part of UK copyright

Automatically deleted? (2, Interesting)

ChaosCube (862389) | more than 9 years ago | (#12555327)

Automatically deleted from user's computers? That would make me a bit uncomfortable. Why would I want someone poking around MY computer deleting stuff, even if it is authorized? Computers, especially systems running Windows should not be open to others for manipulation (IMAO). Then, there's the issue of Linux. Will there be a special BBC account set up, or should users just hand over their root password?

I don't know. It's just too much control over private property by a governmental/corporate entity. That's trouble. However, the people of Britian are used to being watched constantly anyway. There's cameras everywhere on that island! King Arthur would be disgusted!

Well, that's just my initial reaction. I'm too lazy to read the article right now.

Re:Automatically deleted? (3, Insightful)

Pakaran2 (138209) | more than 9 years ago | (#12555385)

The issue of Linux is that it simply won't be supported. Isn't that obvious?

FTFA: (3, Funny)

oneandoneis2 (777721) | more than 9 years ago | (#12555336)

Commercial rivals have already voiced fears that the BBC's substantial investment in iMP and the Creative Archive could damage their chances of making money from the concept.

[rant]Well, maybe they should have been worrying about that for the last bloody decade then, instead of spending all their time & money trying to legislate the whole bloody concept out of existance!![/rant]

*ahem*

Yay, BBC! It's times like this I don't object to paying my license fee!

Whistle Test? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#12555398)



Sure hope we can get to the OGWT archives..

anyone?

And I don't need a license fee... (1)

JackJudge (679488) | more than 9 years ago | (#12555538)

Now I can finally watch the BBC in the UK and I don't need a license fee, PCs and internet content don't need one.

So.... either they've shot themselves in the foot here (unlikely) or after the trial they'll press for PCs to be require a "TV" license.

Re:And I don't need a license fee... (1)

Mwongozi (176765) | more than 9 years ago | (#12555735)

Or they'll simply require registration - and limit users to those who have a TV license.

Re:And I don't need a license fee... (1)

RikF (864471) | more than 9 years ago | (#12555771)

Or perhaps you'll get your user-name and password as part of your TV licence... C'mon, think a little! What I am hoping is that they don't limit this to UK IP addresses - I travel a lot and the ability to keep up with BBC programming (especially the news) will be very valuable to me.

To those that see this as a tivo-lite system, remember that this won't require you to buy anything new, assuming you have suitable hardware at home. You won't need to pay any subscription above the tv-licence fee. The 7-day limitiation seems to be pretty much in line with what you are 'supposed' to do with VHS recordings. Also remember that if it is a TV series you want and it is produced by the Beeb, it is normally out on DVD within weeks or months (the start of the new series of Doctor Who is already available)

RikF

This is fantastic (1)

Kev_Stewart (737140) | more than 9 years ago | (#12555819)

Clearly they are being cautious with the content they're providing but this could be the start of something beautiful.

Brings a tear to this tired ol' Torrent seeders eye - so it does.

It is MY computer (3, Insightful)

rtkluttz (244325) | more than 9 years ago | (#12555820)

They still don't get it. DRM will still be unnacceptable.

It is MY computer and it should only delete something when I tell it to. No one else. It should not police me. It should not tell me what to do, I should tell it what to do. If I break the law using my computer, then I should be held responsible, but I should NOT be limited if I choose to use the computer in a fashion that some short sited company didn't plan on.

This is British (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#12555846)

There is the download and a agreement to delete, this will satify rights holders and copyrights lawyers that something has been done to defend the rights.
Of course what you do in the privacy of your own home is up to you.
So it is in fact as perfect as things will get for now. And a lot more perfect than it appears on the surface.
This will stimulate broadcasters to allow this for other shows as new funding models are rolled out more along the lines of product placement and show sponsorship than advertisement or viewing restriction.
The BBC is a public Service so it can innovate, but advertisers will soon realise that there is a huge rich technogadget buying alphageek trendsetting market wanting to watch whatever whenever and that more distribution iss very good for advertisers when products are embedded into the shows themselves.
Think of Transformers, He-man cartoons, specific breakfast cereals on soap opera tables and ask-jeeves referneces on the Simpsons - content restriction hurts adverts such as these.
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