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IE7 Bugs and Reviews

Zonk posted more than 9 years ago | from the several-points-of-view dept.

Internet Explorer 851

An anonymous reader wrote to mention a Register article in which the possibility is raised of the current build dumping Yahoo and Google toolbars. At the same time, GWBasic writes "I've posted a review on IE 7 Beta 1. It is very clear that, unlike when Microsoft targeted Netscape, they are using their classic method of producing superior software by catering to the needs of the user. This is not IE 6 with a few features borrowed from the competition, but rather a clear step in the evolution of user-centric design." Flexbeta and ZDNet have looks at the new browser as well.

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Err? (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#13193823)

No comment.

Gentoo?? (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#13193825)

I use Gentoo; how does this affect me?

I liked Internet Explorer 7 the first time... (4, Funny)

jolande (852630) | more than 9 years ago | (#13193833)

When it was called Firefox.

Re:I liked Internet Explorer 7 the first time... (5, Funny)

James_Aguilar (890772) | more than 9 years ago | (#13193957)

I think the problem is, as this guy said, "I stopped using non-Microsoft browsers over two years ago because I found them to be unpolished." That is the only possible explanation for how he thinks that IE7 isn't "borrowing from the competition."

List of things borrowed:
1) Search bar
2) Tabs
3) Tabs in context menus
4) Not passing the acid test
5) TINY REFRESH BUTTONS THAT ARE IMPOSSIBLE TO CLICK ON OMGZ?

That is all.

Re:I liked Internet Explorer 7 the first time... (0, Troll)

sp3tt (856121) | more than 9 years ago | (#13193986)

IE7 is still a poor ripoff. Look at the UI, completely fucked up. What is up with the main menu so far down and the buttons all spread out?

The real questions is.... (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#13193842)

....how much was Register paid for this ad?

Oh for god sake.... (0, Flamebait)

REBloomfield (550182) | more than 9 years ago | (#13193843)

Does no one find bitching about a beta a little less than productive? Hasn't anyone got anything better to do?

Also, the latest version of Yahoo's toolbar *does* work.

Re:Oh for god sake.... (4, Insightful)

RangerRick98 (817838) | more than 9 years ago | (#13193960)

Does no one find bitching about a beta a little less than productive?

While a review on a website probably doesn't accomplish this, the whole point to a beta is to get user input on bugs and other criticisms so that the end product is improved from what the engineers originally thought was a good idea.

Re:Oh for god sake.... (3, Funny)

Col. Klink (retired) (11632) | more than 9 years ago | (#13193981)

Yeah, what do you people think betas are for? You got comments, wait until the final release is out!

Re:Oh for god sake.... (1)

I confirm I'm not a (720413) | more than 9 years ago | (#13193984)

Does no one find bitching about a beta a little less than productive? Hasn't anyone got anything better to do?

3 points:

  1. We've been anticipating this for four years;
  2. We're spoiled by Google;
  3. It's Friday - of course we haven't got anything better to do!

Seriously though, aye, you're right. None of this means much until the final product hits our hard-drives. And personally (and I'm *not* an IE fan - been using FF since *before* it was Firebird ;-) I'm impressed that MS have placed some emphasis on security rather than listening to developers like me calling for better standards-compliance. Now the Beta's here it occurs to me - finally! - that security trumps standards, whether I like it or not.

Man that Rocks (0, Troll)

Mateo_LeFou (859634) | more than 9 years ago | (#13193848)

It might take a month for all the new stuff to be available for free in a dozen other browsers.

Re:Man that Rocks (1)

It doesn't come easy (695416) | more than 9 years ago | (#13193899)

New stuff? Oh, you mean new to IE...

Re:Man that Rocks (5, Informative)

/ASCII (86998) | more than 9 years ago | (#13194000)

Didn't read the article, did you? The author admits to only beeing experienced in the use of the 'Crazy browser' browser. He states that the new features in IE7 are not copies of features from other browsers. It is obvious from this that he hasn't used Safari or Firefox, which combined have implement every feature he lists except for the merged history. Even the design decisions on tabs, like the single close button at the right, is stolen verbatim from Firefox, which the author is obviously oblivious to.

You want IE7? Use Safari or Firefox.

Looks like firefox (5, Insightful)

nurhussein (864532) | more than 9 years ago | (#13193849)

Yup, Microsoft looks like it made a poor imitation of Firefox. But hey, according to Microsoft apologists, nothing exists until Microsoft (re)invents it. So there you go.

But the next time someone says "OSS only copies from Microsoft", remind them of IE7.

Something borrowed, nothing new (4, Insightful)

alvinrod (889928) | more than 9 years ago | (#13193894)

After glancing over the screenshots and reading some of the comments the author had, the appearance to firefox is remarkable.

Tabbed browsing has been added, dropdown search, add-on manager. Now where have I seen those all before?

Seems like a good effort by Microsoft to play catch up, but that's it. Aside from the anti-phising feature, I've yet to see one new feature of any importance.

Re:Something borrowed, nothing new (5, Insightful)

bigman2003 (671309) | more than 9 years ago | (#13193945)

But if it is a solid browser, that addresses the shortcomings of IE 6, then it will do what it needs to do...

All it NEEDS to do is catch-up. Microsoft is in the position of dominance, and all they need to do is produce something 'good enough.' It is the upstarts that need to aspire to 'great.'

Because, being good enough, and coming installed on 90% of the computers sold is a very powerful combination.

Not to mention the fact that it still has the IE specific features that people use. It is the only browser that runs a good percentage of the WYSIWYG editors out there. And people will keep using it because of things like that.

Re:Looks like firefox (2, Interesting)

millahtime (710421) | more than 9 years ago | (#13193898)

You claim it's a poor imitation... but could it be a good imitation? I am curios to what other /.ers think.

I don't like the evil empire as much as the next guy, but sometimes they do something not to shabby.

Re:Looks like firefox (1)

Skye16 (685048) | more than 9 years ago | (#13193931)

I'd have to agree, it's pretty poor. I don't even care if it's "the evil empire", mozilla foundation, google, or apple - that UI is disgusting.

Just my opinion, of course...

The Reason It's Poor (4, Interesting)

Mateo_LeFou (859634) | more than 9 years ago | (#13193966)

is that Microsoft is Rich. And therefore: 1. Could've afforded to invest in thinking up new concepts for the new browser, rather than having reading an article on why people like firefox, and putting that stuff in IE7. 2. Will now parade around with a colossal advertising campaign about how IE7 takes you to the Next Generation of the Internet, or Enables the Future of Web Interaction to Integrate You Ass Off, or whatever.

Re:Looks like firefox (3, Insightful)

Mateo_LeFou (859634) | more than 9 years ago | (#13193905)

"View Selection Source" is one of the best things in firefox. is it in there?

Re:Looks like firefox (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#13193918)

Why has nobody modded this guy a troll yet?

Re:Looks like firefox (1, Informative)

Curien (267780) | more than 9 years ago | (#13193951)

Yup, Microsoft looks like it made a poor imitation of Firefox.

Yup, and Firefox is just a poor imitation of Opera.

Didn't follow Firefox? (4, Insightful)

matt_king (19018) | more than 9 years ago | (#13193851)

Almost all the new features in that review (minus the "anti-phishing" functionality) are duplicates of things already done by firefox (tabs, customizable search box in the top right, etc).

Re:Didn't follow Firefox? (-1, Redundant)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#13193908)

You mean kinda' like how Firefox has copied Opera?

Re:Didn't follow Firefox? (5, Interesting)

antek9 (305362) | more than 9 years ago | (#13193930)

Yes, and what's worse: MS' anti-phishing technique involves sending each link you click to Microsoft for verification against a blacklist. Scary, if you ask me.
'We advise you not to click on that link to cracks.am, which is a well known phishing site.' Oops, or is it?

I liked it better the first time... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#13193853)

...when it was called "Mozilla"

Re:I liked it better the first time... (1, Interesting)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#13193877)

It does look like those screenshots could be from Firefox. Has this person actually seen IE7, or has he just taken Firefox and changed some icons?

I'm not sure whether this would help firefox or not. Firefoxe's addin system is more mature and has a lot of good addins, so that is still in its favour.

What's with the Hello World segment? Are rumours true that IE7 will break a lot of old IE6 sites?

Its actually pretty good (0, Interesting)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#13193856)

I like it better than Opera and Firefox, only because the security features might actually work this time. I use Firefox most of the time, since my IE went crazy with infections and pop-ups.

Re:Its actually pretty good (2, Insightful)

ZeroExistenZ (721849) | more than 9 years ago | (#13193910)

Hmmm.

fraudeliminator [mozilla.org] Shows a toolbar that indicates whether the site you are at is really the one you think it is. Utilizes constantly-updated blacklists and artificial intelligence. Helps prevent phishing.

There you go. And the cool thing about FF is, that you can ADD to it. Without needing to wait until a big corp does it for you in a blackbox kindof way. (because the button is there it doesn't mean it's failproof or it actually works.)

Re:Its actually pretty good (4, Funny)

sqlrob (173498) | more than 9 years ago | (#13193942)

only because the security features might actually work this time

  "Insanity is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results." - Albert Einstein

LONG LIVE MICROSOFT (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#13193857)

Long live the empire

Features (0, Redundant)

millahtime (710421) | more than 9 years ago | (#13193858)

Many of the UI features in here look like the same features as Firefox/Safari. This has the potential to hurt the firefox market share. At the same time, I wonder what the OS browser developers can do to add new toys to them. I have not seen anything worth noting in deer park (the next gen mozilla browser).

It has SFA to do with features (3, Insightful)

Colin Smith (2679) | more than 9 years ago | (#13193956)

That is not the reason people switch to FireFox. Yes, it's nice when they get there, but the reason people are switching is because they are easy meat when using IE.

I haven't heard about any security enhancements to IE 7 but if we can assume any that have been added are on the same level of ability as "Genuine Advantage" then the Firefox developers have absolutely nothing to worry about.
 

"evolution of user-centric design"? (5, Insightful)

LordBodak (561365) | more than 9 years ago | (#13193860)

Oh come on. There was not a single revolutionary thing in that entire review. Safari shares its stop and refresh buttons, a feature which is extremely annoying. Half the time you want stop you end up hitting it right when it changes to refresh and now you're reloading the page you were trying to stop.

The only thing that could be called truly new is the combined dropdown box for Back and Forward. Interesting idea, but it's certainly not "a clear step in the evolution of user-centric design."

Re:"evolution of user-centric design"? (2, Informative)

dJOEK (66178) | more than 9 years ago | (#13193884)

Try Hitting Escape ...

Re:"evolution of user-centric design"? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#13193917)

Who's this Escape guy, and will the Stop/Refresh button go away if I hit him hard enough?

Re:"evolution of user-centric design"? (1)

dloose (900754) | more than 9 years ago | (#13193952)

I like that Safari shares the stop and refresh buttons, but I agree than it can be annoying at times. I'm one of those guys who smashes buttons seven or eight times 'cause, you know, sometimes the computer didn't hear me. I had to consciously train myself to stop this behavior because on Safari it would do stop, reload, stop, reload, ad nauseum. I think that actually started with Windows '98 or 2000. When a program hung, I'd do the 3-finger salute -> end task. Of course, that doesn't mean the program is actually going to end, so if it wasn't gone in a few seconds, I'd do it again. Eventually this devolved into a pattern where I'd just do it constantly for any program until it disappeared.

Re:"evolution of user-centric design"? (4, Funny)

hoggoth (414195) | more than 9 years ago | (#13194019)

> I'm one of those guys who smashes buttons seven or eight times

You must be a barrel of laughs waiting for an elevator.

Maybe.... (2, Interesting)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#13193863)

Perhaps it doesn't copy other browsers. But its very existence is driven by the others. Who really thinks that if Firefox were not getting popular that MS would go back on their statement that there would be no major revisions after IE 6?

Horrible GUI layout (0)

Deep Fried Geekboy (807607) | more than 9 years ago | (#13193867)

Jeesh. Is that a disgusting window layout or what?

Classic method? (3, Funny)

hedleyroos (817147) | more than 9 years ago | (#13193868)

they are using their classic method of producing superior software by catering to the needs of the user

What does this mean?

Re:Classic method? (5, Insightful)

PhilHibbs (4537) | more than 9 years ago | (#13193961)

It means that the reviewer doesn't know what he's talking about. Sharnig Stop and Refresh is a *GOOD* idea? So if I want to stop a page, and it finishes just as I'm about to click it, the Stop button becomes THE EXACT OPPOSITE of what I want to do! That's screen-smashingly stupid!

Re:Classic method? (2, Insightful)

jocknerd (29758) | more than 9 years ago | (#13193963)

In other words, copying from other software so that Microsoft can eliminate the competition. Used to work when the competition charged for their product.

Acid Test (4, Informative)

TripMaster Monkey (862126) | more than 9 years ago | (#13193869)


From TFA:
Unfortunately, having tabs doesn't always mean you'll pass the acid test.
OK...so IE7 fails the acid test...just like IE6. Are there any browsers out there (other than that patched-up Safari version) that have actually passed the Acid Test? Any of them available for use?

Re:Acid Test (4, Funny)

nick-less (307628) | more than 9 years ago | (#13193895)

Are there any browsers out there (other than that patched-up Safari version) that have actually passed the Acid Test?

No, because passing the acid test, breaks ./ compatibility...

Re:Acid Test (1)

kybred (795293) | more than 9 years ago | (#13193964)

No, because passing the acid test, breaks ./ compatibility...

That's because /. is the LSD test.

kybred

Re:Acid Test (1)

c0l0 (826165) | more than 9 years ago | (#13193979)

Yes, there is. Konqueror, a part of the K Desktop Environment for X11.

Re:Acid Test (1)

I confirm I'm not a (720413) | more than 9 years ago | (#13194014)

Yes, there is. Konqueror

Is that vanilla Konq or heavily-patched Konq? I've not followed Acid2 for a few weeks now, but the last time I was paying attention it looked like the KHTML-based browsers needed heavy patching, but that was back when Safari (patched) had just managed to pass Acid2.

Don't get me wrong; I want you to be right, Konqueror's a great browser. Just I can't be bothered patching it when I only use it in the evenings!

/me lazy

Re:Acid Test (1)

hixie (116369) | more than 9 years ago | (#13194021)

I believe some versions of Konqueror do pass it. However, the point isn't so much that IE7 fails it; as you say, most browsers do (which was the intention, after all! Not much point in a test that every passes). The point is more that IE7 fails it so much more dramatically than every other modern browser.

Also, every other modern browser is getting closer with every release, whereas the IE team seems to have, as yet, made no effort whatsoever. Of course it's early days yet.

Clippy for IE? (3, Funny)

goof21 (872039) | more than 9 years ago | (#13193870)

"This is not IE 6 with a few features borrowed from the competition, but rather a clear step in the evolution of user-centric design."

IE Clippy: "It looks like you're trying to surf porn while avoiding spyware. Sorry, that just won't happen. Would you like to do it anyway?"

It's Amazing! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#13193874)

This is not IE 6 with a few features borrowed from the competition, but rather a clear step in the evolution of user-centric design.


It's definitely coming to an end soon. The world that is. I, for one, am scared.

Gestures? (2, Interesting)

vspazv (578657) | more than 9 years ago | (#13193878)

Even with tabs, without mouse gesture support it is useless to me.

It's what?!?!? (1)

Exitar (809068) | more than 9 years ago | (#13193883)

This is not IE 6 with a few features borrowed from the competition, but rather a clear step in the evolution of user-centric design.

Re:It's what?!?!? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#13193985)

You know, they took ALL the features of the competition and called it innovation. I think they've done something along those lines before..

Re:troll on the main page (1)

jasongetsdown (890117) | more than 9 years ago | (#13193989)

Can a post on the main page get (score: -1 troll)?

Re:It's what?!?!? (1)

stinerman (812158) | more than 9 years ago | (#13193995)

You know ... the UI is now designed with the user in mind instead of ... well, something else. They need to change it back to whatever they were designing for previously as that UI was awful.

Does it support W3C standards? (4, Insightful)

dduardo (592868) | more than 9 years ago | (#13193887)

I think everyone is putting too much emphasis on the new IE7 GUI and not even considering if there are any major impovements in supporting W3C standards. This is our chance to push Microsoft to support the web features of 2005. I know people are already jumping on the IE7 bandwagon and leaving firefox/opera but this is not wise.

Microsoft wins if people allow IE7 to be a crippled browser in terms of web development.

Re:Does it support W3C standards? (1)

nick-less (307628) | more than 9 years ago | (#13193959)

Joe Average User doesn't care about W3C standards, he cares about tabs, nice guis, phishing and virus warnings (but not too many, and not while browseing his favorite p0rn sites).
Some web developers care about standards, but unfortunatly nobody is going to ask them.

Re:Does it support W3C standards? (1)

Xiaran (836924) | more than 9 years ago | (#13193992)

This is a good point. Has anyone with cross browser compatible web apps done any testing on IE7b1? Does it break anything fundamental?

Re:Does it support W3C standards? (4, Informative)

Reckless Visionary (323969) | more than 9 years ago | (#13194009)

I checked out every css selector/property that I could find that I knew didn't work in IE 6. I was able to find no added support in IE7. They failed.

Re:Does it support W3C standards? (5, Informative)

barzok (26681) | more than 9 years ago | (#13194023)

From what I've read so far (direct from MSDN), there's nothing that significantly improves the lives of web developers. Only 2 of the many CSS bugs have been resolved, no improvement in CSS implementation/support, no good debug tools.

So IE7 will continue holding us back.

toolbars are supposed to be working (0, Redundant)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#13193888)

According to the IE team leader,
http://radio.weblogs.com/0001011/2005/07/28.html#a 10776 [weblogs.com] the toolbars should work in IE7.

The Only Feature That Matters... (5, Funny)

creimer (824291) | more than 9 years ago | (#13193889)

The only feature in IE7 that I need is the ability to download the lastest version of Firefox.

Stop bitching about Microsoft "copying" Firefox (2, Interesting)

Bonzor (856075) | more than 9 years ago | (#13193890)

Firefox "copied" Opera. IE with XP Sp2 has had a pop up blocker in it for over a year now. Firefox has security issues the same as IE. The only difference is Firefox offers more customization options. Hop off the bandwagon and get your fingers out of your ass.

Re:Stop bitching about Microsoft "copying" Firefox (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#13194016)

Firefox has security issues the
same as IE
Except of course that Firefox's have been fixed before a single exploit has been found in the wild. The kind of malware-ridden mess that Microsoft have gotten into with IE can only be accomplished by gross neglect of security issues, something which the Firefox team have not exhibited at all.

Yes! (5, Funny)

Luscious868 (679143) | more than 9 years ago | (#13193892)

I'm so glad IE is supporting tabbed browsing. Now when you visit a malicious website, it will be able to open up multiple tabs and install 30 pieces of adware / spyware / malware simultaneously. Isn't progress wonderful?

Gotta love that totally inconsistent UI (1)

anthropolemic (860028) | more than 9 years ago | (#13193893)

I know this is a beta, but I am not a fan of this screwy UI at all, ESPECIALLY on XP. The menu placement is awful and totally inconsistent with the rest of the system (even with MS Office). This will confuse scores and scores of XP users.

Wha..... huh??! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#13193896)

This is not IE 6 with a few features borrowed from the competition ...

Huh? The reviewer says the above comment, yet his lead-off of innovative features is "tabbed browsing", which Firefox has had since... well, forever. Looks to me a helluva lot like IE 6 with a few features stolen from Firefox.

I can't wait until Microsoft partners with a Nigerian phishing ring and all of a sudden that particular page stops showing up on the phish protection page.

Wow! (1)

KeensMustard (655606) | more than 9 years ago | (#13193900)

More of the same! It's refreshing to see a reviewer so excited about sameness.
It's good to see they've taken the next step in the evolution of the user interface, and combine two functions into a single button - now you too, can accidently click the 'stop loading' button twice to reload the page you didn't want. Revolutionary stuff.

The Browser Wars : The Empire Strikes Back (2, Insightful)

markpapadakis (115698) | more than 9 years ago | (#13193906)

Considering the Web the new platform for building applications ( using AJAX, CSS2 and whatever else the Web gurus come up with ), it is a given that Microsoft cannot afford to loose the browser wars.

This actually may turn out to be more important than loosing to Apple or even Linux ( on the desktop ). Their product is the most popular in the market, but the underdogs are catching up fast. They are better in all respects, they get evolved where IE rarely gets updated, geeks love them.. Its a touch call for Microsoft. They are placing their bets on Lonhorn and IE7. Should their new toys fail to meet the raised expectations, Microsoft will loose big. By Google, Apple, IBM and everyone waiting to get his chance against the King.

Wow (5, Interesting)

Microlith (54737) | more than 9 years ago | (#13193915)

They completely broke the UI.

First they violate their own guidelines by removing the menu from the top of the window. To boot, they made the UI a whacked around version of every other browser UI, with the back and forward buttons at the top next to the address and search bars, but the home button elsewhere and stop/reload mashed into one button at the other end of the address bar. They also don't have a dropdown menu on the back button, which is essential for getting away from sites that break that functionality.

Suffice it to say, this is what we've got for "progress" thanks to microsoft's browser dominance. No true significant advancements in the technology because microsoft's held it stagnant for so long. Thankfully they've got competition now, so maybe things can improve.

They've still got a long way to go.

.02 (1)

hardgeus (6813) | more than 9 years ago | (#13193922)

He admits early in the writeup that he hasn't used non-IE browsers in over two years, yet says the IE7 feature set isn't borrowed from competitors.

Any Firefox user can see that almost all of the features being touted are simply borrowed from Firefox.

Re:.02 (1)

jurt1235 (834677) | more than 9 years ago | (#13194004)

He used an IE wrapper component, so actually he has been using IE with some plugins for the last two years, and clearly with his head stuck up in a dark place where no other browsers venture.

2 years.. (0, Redundant)

malkavian (9512) | more than 9 years ago | (#13193925)

Wow.. While stating his preferences, the author stated that he stopped using non-microsoft browsers over two years ago, as they "seemed unpolished".
That's akin to saying 'Oh. I'm writing a review on a new typewrite. Does everything you could ever need it to! By the way, I'll state my preference, I stopped using those word processor thingies 20 years ago because they looked unpolished'.

For a review to be meaningful in the context of current technology, you have to at least have a good overview of the state of current tech.
Perhaps a useful view for those that are MS only shops about how things have come along, but.. For the rest of the world.. Nothing to se...

Nothing much to see here, move along (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#13193929)

"I stopped using non-Microsoft browsers over two years ago because I found them to be unpolished."

and yet you say:

"This is not IE 6 with a few features borrowed from the competition, but rather a clear step in the evolution of user-centric design."

How would you know? You don't use the competition. After reading the review, IE7 so far doesn't provide anything much over Safari or Firefox. Tabs? Search bar next to the URL bar? Combined Reload/Cancel buttons? Try running Safari and Firefox more, these features have been around for a long time.

Prefer IE?? (1)

rinoid (451982) | more than 9 years ago | (#13193933)

Before I continue, I'd like to identify my bias. I stopped using non-Microsoft browsers over two years ago because I found them to be unpolished. Ever since then I've been using Crazy Browser. It uses the IE component available to all Windows applications, and it adds tabbed browsing and its own popup blocker. It's a great program for those of us who prefer IE, but still want tabbed browsing.
I stopped reading the review after reading this. "...those of us who prefer IE..." ???? Who "prefers" the IE rendering engine and why? What is there to prefer? Love poorly rendered CSS and insecure ActiveX components. I don't get it.

DANGER!!! Fanboy alert! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#13193935)

Stopped using non-IE browsers because they were unpolished????

IE has spent the last couple of years behind the times! Firefox and Opera have shown more innovation than IE ever has!

Furthermore, in true MS style, they are using a new product to entice users to upgrade to XP. Kind of an expensive proposition! Firefox and Opera have no such requirements.

I'll never know if IE7 is good or not...I don't make OS decisions based on a browser.

phew, now I can browse again (1)

jasongetsdown (890117) | more than 9 years ago | (#13193936)

Thank you once again Megasloth. I've been looking over the fence at all these "firefox" renegades, flouting you with their arrogance. Flaunting their "tabs" and their "security". But now I can browse confident in the fact that my penis is just as large as theirs. You've come through for me again, and right on time!

Good Read (2, Interesting)

kinglink (195330) | more than 9 years ago | (#13193937)

Definatly worth the time it took to read it. And good critism, but don't expect them to fix the Compatibility errors, from what I've heard MS is trying to steal another standard and make it their own.

Although... (1)

concept10 (877921) | more than 9 years ago | (#13193940)

..Microsoft is trying to gain on Google's success with the recent attempt to copy the mapping application and the 'Start preview' website http:/// [http] http://www.start.com/3/> they will not make the mistake of disabling the ability to use these tool bars and search functions in the final release of IE7. That would be a self-imposed massacre of IE's browser market place. They should be spending this time to disable the various malware search boxes that magically appear in the browser. Futhermore, is anyone else sick of the hype of IE7? How long does it take to update and release a browser? I guess this is one of the reasons that they have hired open-source developers to find out how to 'release early and release often' I'm sick of Microsofts continuing efforts to dominate everything IT.

What a terrible "review" (5, Insightful)

Darren Winsper (136155) | more than 9 years ago | (#13193943)

At least the author is pretty open about his bias. The writer goes on and on about the usability of IE, but proves he knows jack-shit about usability with three simple sentences:

"When only one tab is open, the tab bar is visible. At the right of all tabs is a small tab that immediately opens a new tab. This would make more sense as a button immediately to the right of the X to close a tab."

Yeah, that's sensible, put the "open new" button right next to the "close" button, that'll make sense for 99% of the population who don't have perfectly precise mastery of the mouse pointer. He also talks about dropping non-IE browsers years ago because they were "unpolished" but then mentions he switched to CrazyBrowser, which is a cluttered mess in its default configuration! The entire article screams of unprofessionalism.

Acid2 Test Woes (2, Interesting)

c0l0 (826165) | more than 9 years ago | (#13193946)

I consider it rather strange that the renderings of the acid2 test pages IE7 produced in this guy's review [clothedandy.com] differ somewhat from the results a colleague of mine got [overclockers.at] during his test with IE7 on Longhorn Beta 1.
 
Not that unreproducible behaviour of certain MS products is strikingly unfamiliar to me, though I still wonder what has happened there, and if this is going to be fixed (as well as the whole rest of the CSS-mess in IE) in the final version...

I don't mean to. (2, Insightful)

Digital Warfare (746982) | more than 9 years ago | (#13193949)

I don't mean to defend Microsoft. But anything they do will pretty much look like any other browser currently with those features already present
 
So it's no suprising it looks like Firefox, how else could they design it ? Still, its in beta and GUI could still be rough until finished.
 
Incidentley, the GUI in Windows Classic looks disgusting :|

pretty freakin similar (1)

BoomTechnology (832547) | more than 9 years ago | (#13193950)

pretty friggin similar to firefox if you ask me with tabbed browsing and extensions (sorry, "add ons") and all (and search toolbar). Then there's a combined cancel and reload button --I guess that's what this line: "they are using their classic method of producing superior software by catering to the needs of the user" is all about -- saving me a few pixels of clutter.

sorry sorry, don't mean to be a hater. My word is that of humble opinion! (and props to this Andrew Rondeau character for taking the time to download such a product and checking out -- thought his feedback was good too).

They left out the potentially coolest feature... (1)

Momoru (837801) | more than 9 years ago | (#13193954)

Since IE is integrated in with the Windows Explorer, it would have been awesome to be able to tab your file system windows in Vista...unfortunately you can't (As far as i can tell). Even though the windows explorer looks just like IE7 (i'm assuming it's using it), it doesn't integrate ENOUGH (maybe this is from their previous legal issues). The new interface is not very intuitive, but like you apologists always say for Google...Its in Beta! Well thats my 2 cents (and a lot of parenthesis).

IE7 beta (1)

springbox (853816) | more than 9 years ago | (#13193958)

"This is not IE 6 with a few features borrowed from the competition, but rather a clear step in the evolution of user-centric design."

So is that why they decided to put the menu (file, edit, view, ..) below the tabs in a totally unintutive place? Not trying to be mean about it but everything else that they've ever made has placed that menu at the topmost position on the window.

Enable tabbed browsing (1)

91degrees (207121) | more than 9 years ago | (#13193962)

Enable tabbed browsing requires a restart!

Why do you need to restart the browser for something so trivial!?

Imitation (1)

suman28 (558822) | more than 9 years ago | (#13193968)

They all copy features from each other. I hate to say this, but neither OSS and most definitely not Microsoft has come up with anything original. The real question that you should be asking is, how much has all this helped in terms of competition. We now have a browser (Firefox) that rocks and gaining support. So, what if they copy features. Imitation is the cheapest form of flattery.

Review of the review (1)

jurt1235 (834677) | more than 9 years ago | (#13193972)

The added value of IE over the main competitors (Firefox & opera) is not proven by this review as claimed in the intro (Quote: It is very clear that, unlike when Microsoft targeted Netscape, they are using their classic method of producing superior software by catering to the needs of the user. This is not IE 6 with a few features borrowed from the competition, but rather a clear step in the evolution of user-centric design.)

It is clear that this person is not ready to write reviews of software since he has not seen enough of the competition.

Also MS is again trying to bend the rules by purposely not making things work correct (browserbars as mentioned, but also again not able to pass the acid test while css was one of the reasons they claimed for having to rewrite IE6).

The phishing filter of IE is an interesting concept, but since it works on blacklisting basics (like with spam blacklists, see how well that works!!), I think it is a waste of time to use it. Just display the URL correct and disallow all those fals URL presentations as allowed in IE6.

Interesting is the opening of a new tab on middle click of the mouse. I would appreciate it if firefox was able to assign this to the middle mouse button as standard for opening links. Since tabs exist, I always use tabs.

MSN Search vs Google (1)

SiGiN (679749) | more than 9 years ago | (#13193983)

Quote from article:
Search
The upper-right corner of the IE 7 window contains a form that allows the user to launch a search. Major search engines are supported, but unfortunately, the setting isn't remembered when opening a new window.
Guess which choice is remembered? Bets this "minor " bug will not big fixed till release?

Weird Interface (4, Insightful)

Bodero (136806) | more than 9 years ago | (#13193987)

I'm usually a fan of what Microsoft creates, and I follow it closely. I can't help but agree with some of the criticisms of IE7, which, so far looks like a turd.
  • "Phishing?" Do not use that word in the final version. It looks stupid, it sounds stupid, and worst of all, like the one review said, no one but Slashdot users will know what it means.
  • The menus. What the hell? I can understand the concept that by placing the menus next to the browser, the options apply to the tab, but honestly, most of them don't. This is totally inconsistent and just plain stupid.
  • The tabs look alright. Not great, just alright. I think the "blank" tab to create a new tab is also stupid. I mean, maybe it's a good concept, but it needs more. Maybe a different color, or a small label, but just blank, it looks dumb.
  • As usual, The Register is wrong. My Google Toolbar worked fine in IE7. Problem is, it looked like Firefox with the Google toolbar, simply redundant. I disabled it.
However, there are large improvements, like the rendering engine, and the Feeds (which I didn't play around with too too much). It's a good start, Microsoft, but I hope they're not finished yet. There's a lot of work left to do.

"classic method of producing superior software"? (4, Interesting)

narrowhouse (1949) | more than 9 years ago | (#13193988)

I'm not sure I was aware of this method.I seem to remember a few times Microsoft "met the needs of the user" by supplying a "good enough" solution for less cost than the competition, but if I had to pick ONE time when they may have provided a better solution to take a market it would have been IE 4 (after ealier IE versions sucked) versus an aging and slow to develop Netscape, even then they had to bundle it, make illegal deals, and include ActiveX to screw up any chance at security. Mind you the author of this review would seem to think that was not a case of superior software winning out.

I'm not saying MS has never made a good peice of software, but in the past to dominate the market, price and vendor pressure seem to have been the preferred weapons. After they GET the market they have sometimes made a product that is amoung the best of breed (Excel would be my example here)

Microsoft is slowly losing around here (2, Informative)

ShatteredDream (636520) | more than 9 years ago | (#13193994)

My university, which is one of the largest in Virginia, has already prominently placed Firefox or Mozilla on virtually all of its lab machines. We also have a general user lab that runs Red Hat Enterprise Linux Workstation 4. More and more students are being conditioned to think "IE=bad for me" because if you live on campus or in an apt that uses the school network, then if you use an unpatched OS or browser, you can come back home if there's a major worm problem and find your access cut off until you upgrade. Firefox is the easiest way to get around that.

Just not a quality review (1)

ZackSchil (560462) | more than 9 years ago | (#13193997)

Revolutionary user-centric design? Who the hell let Microsoft's marketing department post a story here?

Now I'm not just blowing smoke here because I hate IE, but that "review" was the grossest, most one-sided waste of my time that I'd ever read. The guy praised Microsoft (and rightly so) for adding the search field and generally making the browser feature complete with every single other browser that has been out since 2002, but I don't think I heard one single critisizm other than the author not liking the use of the word "phishing". He said that there wasn't one default setting he would have changed, but what about the fact that phishing protection is OFF by default? We're talking about people who fall for phishing scams here. They won't have a clue how to enable something like that. Good UI design? How about the fact that the menubar is UNDER the tabs. What crack-smoking UI designer thought that one up? Ugh, the broswer looks like Firefox with a bad interface, the atrociously bad IE render engine (check out how badly it butchers the acid test!), and a phishing protection sceme that's off by default. Is that what user-centric design means?

UI funkiness (1)

wyoung76 (764124) | more than 9 years ago | (#13193998)

I'll name my bias: I'm a Mozilla Firefox user by default.

However, overall I think the options that have been put into IE7 will work for most "mom 'n' pop" households.

With regards the actual UI:

  • the combination refresh/stop button makes a lot of sense to me.
  • the History button doesn't make sense. Which way is forwards? which way is back? granted, this isn't particularly clear in Firefox either, but still...
  • The new tab tab (what the heck?) might get a bit mashed up with a lot of tabs in the same window
Otherwise, not too bad an upgrade to IE6.

tabbed browsing (0, Troll)

bitsformoney (514101) | more than 9 years ago | (#13194003)

Does anyone get the issue with tabbed browsing? IE has always had tabbed browsing, just like all other windows apps, except the tabs are down there in the task bar and not 'inside' the app. The inside tabs are reminiscent of the old MDI apps like Word 6.0 that I was so glad to get away from. The taskbar integrating all apps' windows is much better.

Only those UNIX people apparently don't have that, so they get all excited about tabbed browsing.

Totally inaccurate introduction (5, Informative)

It doesn't come easy (695416) | more than 9 years ago | (#13194017)

The Slashdot introduction says "This is not IE 6 with a few features borrowed from the competition, but rather a clear step in the evolution of user-centric design."

I'm sorry but that is about as wrong as it can be. Every single "new" feature mentioned in the article is already present in every other browser that I know of as a built-in feature or an add-on. This refresh of IE is clearly borrowed from the competition. Unless IE7 includes more changes than what was mentioned in the article, it will still be behind the day it comes out in Vista/Longhorn.

Looks like (1)

MemoryDragon (544441) | more than 9 years ago | (#13194022)

Interface overhaul, but same old crappy engine, just like I expected... Wake me up when the IE passes the Acid2 test, which will be in about never...

Last straw... (1)

psyburn (790106) | more than 9 years ago | (#13194025)

Through the Vista it is clear.....

I'm not buying it

I can't bring myself to use a high end machine just so I can make it feel like my Pentium-II laptop.

i'd rather shell out for broadband and get back to using Linux
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