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Windows Guru Calls For IE7 Boycott

Zonk posted more than 9 years ago | from the it's-that-bad dept.

Internet Explorer 895

Anonymous Cowherd writes "Paul Thurrott, a journalist that usually writes about all things Windows related (and sometimes about Apple affairs too), made a call in a recent article to boycott Internet Explorer, due to Microsoft's approach (continued in IE7) of not supporting web standards: 'My advice here is simple: Boycott Internet Explorer. It is a cancer on the Web, and must be stopped. IE is insecure and is not standards-compliant, which makes it unworkable for both end users and Web content creators... You can turn the tide by demanding better from Microsoft and using a better alternative Web browser. I recommend and use Mozilla Firefox, but Apple Safari (Mac only) and Opera 8 are both worth considering as well.'"

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frosty pist (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#13224279)

woot!

you fail it (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#13224293)

you fail it

Ok with me (4, Funny)

tclark (140640) | more than 9 years ago | (#13224286)

In fact, I think I'll take it a step further and boycott Windows as well.

Re:Ok with me (2, Funny)

richman555 (675100) | more than 9 years ago | (#13224365)

That works for me too, call it a "Halo" effect.

Re:Ok with me (1)

KillShill (877105) | more than 9 years ago | (#13224390)

and what do we do with all our windows software?

just stop using it and throw away all the money we spent on it?

yeah, getting off proprietary OS's is the best thing for the computing industry but it'll take more time.

and lots of education.

Wine? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#13224421)

"and what do we do with all our windows software?"

Wine ;)

Re:Ok with me (1, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#13224430)

who spends money on microsoft products?

Microsoft-free Fridays (1)

einhverfr (238914) | more than 9 years ago | (#13224403)

You could enforce this using the Microsoft-Free Fridays Apache module. :-)

Re:Microsoft-free Fridays (2, Funny)

therodent (253032) | more than 9 years ago | (#13224498)

Oh that would play out well out work.

Boss: "What happened to our friday numbers? We owe Audi 200,000 more impressions and we'll never make it"

Me: "Oh, that! It's the Microsoft-Free Fridays Apache module."

(grumbling and hushed tones)

Me: Didn't know you'd be such a d1ck about it. Okay, I'll get my things....

Re:Ok with me (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#13224445)

Boycott IE, and Windows? No problem. Been boycotting it since 2002. But /. readers aren't the problem. If you can get the majority of the unwashed masses to boycott you're on to something.

Bah. (1)

Dthoma (593797) | more than 9 years ago | (#13224288)

Zonk's link leads to an advertisement on your first clickthrough for some reason. How much is Thurrott paying you guys?

Re:Bah. (1)

The Other White Boy (626206) | more than 9 years ago | (#13224321)

and if you deny the cookie request you'll never get past it.

sweet.

Re:Bah. (1)

outz (448278) | more than 9 years ago | (#13224330)

Agreed. Whats the matter /. not make enough revenue off the massive banners on your index so you have to link to ads as well? I'm counting the days until you require registration to read the ads, I mean articles

Re:Bah. (1)

EnronHaliburton2004 (815366) | more than 9 years ago | (#13224355)

If you have a URL that is ad free, please post it.

If you can't find such a URL, quit whining. Some sites are very clever about requiring an advertisement view before reading the article.

Re:Bah. (1)

Headcase88 (828620) | more than 9 years ago | (#13224467)

"How much is Thurrott paying you guys?"

Some sweet, sweet anti-microsoft sentiment ;)

(not even sure if the word sentiment is even appropriate here, but I like the ring to it)

Wow! (1)

XanC (644172) | more than 9 years ago | (#13224290)

Maybe this will make people sit up and take notice of how horrible IE is. This guy's one of the loudest pro-MS voices out there, and if he's not satisfied, something's really wrong!

Re:Wow! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#13224367)

This guy's one of the loudest pro-MS voices out there, and if he's not satisfied, something's really wrong!

It may be difficult to spot from a /. perspective, but he is actually quite often quite critical of MS and MS products, from the perspective of a MS user/site.

Re:Wow! (1)

Stray1 (862245) | more than 9 years ago | (#13224381)

I couldnt agree more, considering how grounded his opinions are most of the time, its amazing to see something like this occur. It couldnt come at a better time, with Vista (slowly) ocming out of the gate- it would make more sense to make these changes now rather than after its released. PErsonally i cannot stand IE, but as we all know, some things can't be done any other way. I see Pauls boycott as a good thing, and if we are lucky a positive blow for standards. -Stray

Re:Wow! (1)

NineNine (235196) | more than 9 years ago | (#13224395)

What "people" exactly, are going to notice an article in a relatively obscure Windows developer website?

awesome (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#13224291)

Thats awesome

Microsoft's reasoning is flawed (2, Interesting)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#13224295)

They claim they don't want to support all the standards because it will break poorly coded website. Well, there's an easy solution they already somewhat support... turn on the correct rendering engine with doctype switching! Regular users with badly coded sites are unlikely to have a correct doctype (or any doctype at all) that would trigger this mode. Standards supporters win, and users win.

Re:Microsoft's reasoning is flawed (1)

Lumpy (12016) | more than 9 years ago | (#13224456)

They claim they don't want to support all the standards because it will break poorly coded website.

you forgot to translate that first

  They claim they don't want to support all the standards because it will break [translated]MSN.[\translated]

Now does everyone understand?

Boycott pickles (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#13224296)

Because I say so!

Standards Compliance (1)

l33t.g33k (903780) | more than 9 years ago | (#13224301)

IE is insecure and is not standards-compliant
And Slashdot is?

Re:Standards Compliance (1)

A beautiful mind (821714) | more than 9 years ago | (#13224323)

There is a difference between an interpreter or source code being broken. Although i'd certainly welcome /. improving on these matters aswell anyway.

Re:Standards Compliance (1)

Amouth (879122) | more than 9 years ago | (#13224438)

Slasdot has standards???

can we see them?

How to tell users to boycott it when... (1)

IIDX (873577) | more than 9 years ago | (#13224302)

It comes pre-installed and has a nice big INTERNET button on your desktop ;)

Re:How to tell users to boycott it when... (2, Interesting)

lukewarmfusion (726141) | more than 9 years ago | (#13224351)

After my third time removing spyware from my wife's grandparents' computer I did the following:

1. Install Firefox.
2. Change IE shortcut to Firefox.
3. Rename Firefox icon as "Internet"
4. I told them that their computer was slow because of the IE and AOL browsers.

This worked wonders. These are the same people that were told to defrag once to make your computer faster and interpreted it as a "defrag every day."

You have buttons on your desktop? (1)

BlackCobra43 (596714) | more than 9 years ago | (#13224371)

Wow! Mine are on my keyboard, mostly.

Wait, what??? (1)

Knight Thrasher (766792) | more than 9 years ago | (#13224305)

Wait wait wait, WHAT? IE is not secure?!? MY DATA!

Hmm... (1)

neccoant (3345) | more than 9 years ago | (#13224308)

He was so pro-MS until recently. Now, he's biased against Apple and MS. It seems untenable.

Re:Hmm... (1)

Swamii (594522) | more than 9 years ago | (#13224454)

Huh? Most of the stuff I've read from Paul is very objective; despite running a Windows-centric site, he's not afraid to offer criticism where criticism is due (WinHEC Longhorn build, IE7, Longhorn in general), nor is he afraid to offer praise of the competition when that is due (his recent praise of Mac OS 10.3).

Will never happen... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#13224316)

...in the near future at least.

Most people don't know there are other browsers beside IE, so how could they boycott it?

Don't have to ask me twice... (1)

Dysantic (901927) | more than 9 years ago | (#13224317)

I boycott Internet Explorer out of principle. Sure, I'm mainly a Mac user, but I don't use IE on my PC unless it's to use one of those various virus-scanning packages (like Symantec). Sort of ironic though.

Nobody cares (2, Insightful)

TommyBlack (899306) | more than 9 years ago | (#13224318)

I doubt a boycott of this sort would have much impact. Anyone who cares already uses something other than IE. Your average user will just say "Why bother? I've never had a problem." That's what I did.

I tried.. (1)

Kyani (566689) | more than 9 years ago | (#13224319)

..to change to firefox at work, but our vendors supply web applications written to run on IE only -- it was a sad day when I found this out :(

Re:I tried.. (1)

mixmasterjake (745969) | more than 9 years ago | (#13224374)

I work for a similar place. You can try the FireFox User Agent Switcher [chrispederick.com] plugin and set it to IE. It works as long as the vendor didn't put in some really IE specific stuff. ActiveX controls in particular tend to not run in FireFox. I know there is even an ActiveX plugin for FireFox, but I have not tried that.

Firefox can't even pass acid2... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#13224320)

Unless I'm missing something firefox (at least on every computer I've attempted on) can't pass the acid2 test. So why is that a recommended alternative? Firefox obviously isn't passing the test so how are they "better". If acid2 isn't just a wish list and truly is standards compliant I guess we should all just abandon the web as there isn't a browser out there that currently can pass the test.

Re:Firefox can't even pass acid2... (2, Insightful)

kg4gyt (799019) | more than 9 years ago | (#13224480)

You're right, but firefox is working on it, Microsoft announced [msdn.com] that they won't even try to pass [com.com] the Acid Test. Neither one may be able to meet the standards yet, but at least the Mozilla group is working on it. Which would you rather use, the group that tries, or the group that knowingly blows it off.

Apple says that safari has already passed in their test builds, and Opera is said to be "very close". Rather than the market telling the users what they want, perhaps by boycotting IE the users can tell the market what they want.

Link to actual blog (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#13224322)

Here's a link to the actual blog posting [msdn.com] from the story to which the /. article links.

what the hell? (2, Insightful)

liquidpele (663430) | more than 9 years ago | (#13224327)

Microsoft tries to improve it's product, which everyone has been asking them to do for years, and now we should Boycott it? Fuck that. If they're allowing for PNG and better CSS, I'm all for it, and want it for windows 2000 too.

Re:what the hell? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#13224344)

Just because they fix a few things for PR (and apparently they fooled you) doesn't mean IE still doesn't suck.

Microsoft isn't doing anything to fix its inconsistent and improper use (or ignorance) of web standards.. Nor is it doing anything to make it more secure.

Re:what the hell? (1)

Tumbleweed (3706) | more than 9 years ago | (#13224369)

Sure, IE7's CSS support will be better, but will it be good enough? Think about this - fixing the major bugs is great, but think about how long we'll have to support this thing. Is it REALLY good enough? What marketing deadline are they trying to meet here? Vista isn't due out until 4Q2006 (or 2H2006, best case), so what artificial ship date are they trying to meet? What's the upside for them to ship it before it's as good as it can be?

Re:what the hell? (1)

liquidpele (663430) | more than 9 years ago | (#13224472)

Okay, let me explain.
I'm not saying I'll use IE7, and I'm not saying it'll be a good product. IE still has a 90% marketshare though, and as a web developer, anything that gets better standards, even if they're not complete standards, to such a large portion of the market can't be bad, because lets face it: some people will never use anything but the blue e.

Re:what the hell? (1)

Virak (897071) | more than 9 years ago | (#13224389)

what the hell?

Exactly what I was thinking as I read your post. It may be more standards compliant than before, but it's still not near as good as other browsers that have been around for years. I'm not going to applaud them for their efforts because they suck slightly less than before.

Re:what the hell? (2, Insightful)

jellomizer (103300) | more than 9 years ago | (#13224490)

There is a term...

Too Little Too Late.

Yes the next version SHOULD be better then the last one. But it is not what we want. Why Can't we follow the CSS Specs 100%, We can excuse free software for not because it is free and you get what you paid for but for a company like Microsoft who has a lot of resources and cash it should be head over heals better then anything out there. And it is not even close.

MS response to IE7 beta1 (1)

FerretFrottage (714136) | more than 9 years ago | (#13224334)

There is a blog entry about this here [msdn.com]

The more that know (1)

jhoegl (638955) | more than 9 years ago | (#13224338)

IE has been an issue since the destruction of Netscape, its only widely known compeditor. Now that IE thinks they are alone, they think they can develop the web without going through the standards comitties put in place to ensure open dialogue with developers and artists alike. The word is out, however the normal mom and pop have no idea the browser issues and problematic security holes. The goal now is to educate, and the more people talk, the more the issues are heard. Fight on my brave Windows fanbois, fight on.

Re:The more that know (1)

JadeNB (784349) | more than 9 years ago | (#13224414)

Netscape is the only widely known competitor? Firefox is very widely known, and it's reasonable to believe that some of the new developments (cough, tab browsing, cough) were made implemented because of Microsoft's fear of Firefox -- precisely not because they think they're alone.

Boycott works? (1)

anandpur (303114) | more than 9 years ago | (#13224341)

Do you think Boycott realy works?

Kind of hard to boycott (1)

alvinrod (889928) | more than 9 years ago | (#13224345)

It's hard to boycot something when the product comes installed on over 90% of new computers and can't be completely removed from those computers.

MS will contine to dig their own grave, but very slowly because they package the software with their OS and there are still a lot of people out their ignorant to the fact that something else exists.

Ok all you web designers out there .... (4, Funny)

scharkalvin (72228) | more than 9 years ago | (#13224350)

Have your webpages check to see what browser the client is using, and if it is IE7 (or hey, ANY version of IE) refuse to render the page and pop up a link to Mozilla or Firefox and tell the user that his current browser is broken, and a plague on the web, and that he should follow the given link and download a REAL broswer if he (or she) wants to see your content. (turn around is fair play I say!)

Re:Ok all you web designers out there .... (1, Informative)

NineNine (235196) | more than 9 years ago | (#13224449)

You go right ahead and do that. Those of us poor slobs that actually pay our bills based on our web sites will be supporting IE 7, though.

Sorry Paul.... (2, Insightful)

plutonium83 (818340) | more than 9 years ago | (#13224352)

... unforunately Microsoft won't give a damn about you and your ideas.

That would be almost as easy.. (1)

dannyd933 (904582) | more than 9 years ago | (#13224353)

as boycotting cancer. In future news: Paul Thurrott has been hired by Microsoft to lead its new Marketing and Strategies Division.

Windows Guru (1)

Alex P Keaton in da (882660) | more than 9 years ago | (#13224354)

Does this windows Guri post on slashdot....
I thought I saw this exact comment modded +500 insightful
'My advice here is simple: Boycott Internet Explorer. It is a cancer on the Web, and must be stopped. IE is insecure and is not standards-compliant, which makes it unworkable for both end users and Web content creators... You can turn the tide by demanding better from Microsoft and using a better alternative Web browser. I recommend and use Mozilla Firefox, but Apple Safari (Mac only) and Opera 8 are both worth considering as well.'"

Boycott Not Practical (1)

rlp (11898) | more than 9 years ago | (#13224356)

Any Web site developer that produces content for the general public has to deal with IE (like it or not). It's not wise for a commercial site to tell a large block of potential customers - sorry, we won't interact with you, go load another browser.

Hahahaha (1)

NineNine (235196) | more than 9 years ago | (#13224357)

Oh, this was a good one. this article actually made me laugh out loud. What in the hell does he really think that even developers can accomplish? That's so ridiculous it's funny. If people will use it (and rest assured, people will), then we'll develop for it. Even a large boycott by developers will have -zero- impact on the acceptance/usage of IE 7.

Already done. (1)

TripMaster Monkey (862126) | more than 9 years ago | (#13224363)


I've already pretty much boycotted IE myself...use Firefox pretty much exclusively, and IE only gets used for Windows Update.

However, the real issue is not what browser the tech geeks use (a tiny percentage), but what browser Mr. and Mrs. Joe Sixpack use. IE comes with Windows, and Windows comes with their PC. Any sort of boycott that fails to address the vast majority of Windows users is doomed to failure.

Re:Already done. (1)

wh00dini (644984) | more than 9 years ago | (#13224429)

I think Television adds are the only way to go for FF. I know that they have done some (not sure where but I never saw them) but need one simple and easily understood ad. Is there an open source ad agency out there will to work on one? I would be happy to help. Even share some cpu cycles.

What took him so long? (1)

Thaelon (250687) | more than 9 years ago | (#13224368)

Why did he wait until IE7 to call for a boycott?

Internet Exploder has been a piece of shit since 5.0 and possibly earlier (I just didn't realize it until I discovered Firefox).

Or is he just trying to draw attention to himself?

Acid2 test looks fine in IE7 (3, Funny)

David Horn (772985) | more than 9 years ago | (#13224376)

I just visited the Acid2 test page in the Internet Explorer 7 beta, and it looks exactly the same as it does in FireFox. Am I doing something wrong?

Re:Acid2 test looks fine in IE7 (1)

FnH (137981) | more than 9 years ago | (#13224404)

Then you're probably looking at the reference image.

Re:Acid2 test looks fine in IE7 (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#13224453)

Screen snapshot?

Re:Acid2 test looks fine in IE7 (1)

someonewhois (808065) | more than 9 years ago | (#13224493)

Well, it doesn't look the same, but you are correct - Firefox doesn't support it either.

To what end? (1)

Red Flayer (890720) | more than 9 years ago | (#13224378)

Exactly how will boycotting IE7 affect Microsoft? Aside from the bad PR, a boycott aims to hit the target in the wallet.

Since IE7 will be bundled into Vista, and not purchased separately, there is no way to effectively boycott this product...

...unless we boycott Windows or, even better, Microsoft as a whole.

Re:To what end? (1)

pe1chl (90186) | more than 9 years ago | (#13224410)

Put a "best viewed with a standards-compatible browser" on your site and make sure no workarounds are enabled for IE7?

Re:To what end? (1)

AntEater (16627) | more than 9 years ago | (#13224431)

There is some point to it. If it were possible to get a significant number of people to boycott its use, web developers might be forced to move away from the lazy practice of making IE only pages. It will not impact MS directly but it would loosen one (of many) strangleholds it keeps on the web and user's data.

Yep! (1)

Karma_fucker_sucker (898393) | more than 9 years ago | (#13224382)

Windows Guru Calls For IE7 Boycott

Been there, done that, got the T-Shirt.

Firefox Baby! Yeah!

Fuck Boycott. Put Up Or Shut Up (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#13224383)

Block access to your site with any browser that ids itself as IE.

Put up or shut up Thurrott you clown.

PS. It must really suck to be Microsoft fanatic as the company is beging to rot from within...

Many MS Products non-standard compliant (1)

MyNameIsMok (462188) | more than 9 years ago | (#13224384)

hi,
          Not only is IE not compliant, but neither is their usage of ISO9660 (CD-ROM), nor TCP/IP. None of these has been so since the early days of MS. Where has everyone been?
sTc

They are trying to be standards compliant. (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#13224388)

Considering they have http://blogs.msdn.com/ie/archive/2005/07/29/445242 .aspx [msdn.com] already stated that IE is moving towards standards compliance, I think he is jumping the gun a bit here. Internet Explorer is just now moving towards being operable in a developer environment and should be recieving our blessings that it will succeed in order for web developer's nightmares to subside.

I think it's too late... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#13224392)

Most people interested in boycotting IE already do so... People that are using it do it either because they are forced (workplace politics) or they are stupid and ignorant (people could be stupid, but have made the good choice anyway in this situation)...

Re:I think it's too late... (1)

hexalite (904492) | more than 9 years ago | (#13224423)

Exactly, nothing is going to change just becuase web developers are upset. Normal people won't boycott IE becuase they don't care. Web developers won't boycott IE becuase they need to ensure they reach the lagest audience. So I don't know what else you could do except for continuing to push Firefox up in the browser market. Oh sorry wait, Paul Thurrott is upset.

I'm Okay with That... (1)

dygital (591967) | more than 9 years ago | (#13224396)

I already boycott IE, even in tech support calls I tell end users to check out www.getfirefox.com to prevent most spyware from being put on your system.

Microsoft has to know by now that web developers and power users want a standards compliant browser for once. Even with competition (Mozilla, Opera, Apple/Mac)... they still can't strive to meet the basic expectations.

Also, IE7 breaks Trillian, as evidenced by http://journals.aol.com/gregsblog/aimInfo/entries/ 417 [aol.com]

I'd be wary of upgrading IE7 and Windows Vista. :(

Boycott a product that hasn't even shipped yet? (2, Insightful)

MoiTominator (75986) | more than 9 years ago | (#13224398)

Boycott a product that hasn't even shipped yet? We have no idea how secure/insecure it is, or how standards compliant IE7 is going to be. Just stop blustering already.

Advice (1)

FLAGGR (800770) | more than 9 years ago | (#13224400)

More sites should put up warnings when the user agent is msie. It's easy to do on php. Page still loads for IE users, but they get nagged (yay.) It would be cool if Slashdot did it, I assume most of the /. crowd uses FF anyways though. Put this PHP code at the beginning of your , and put the rest of your code after it:

<?
if (strpos($_SERVER['HTTP_USER_AGENT'], 'MSIE') !== false && strpos($_SERVER['HTTP_USER_AGENT'], 'Opera')
=== false) {
?>
<br><br><b>Warning:</b> You are using the Microsoft Internet Explorer browser.
IE sucks, and therefore you suck.<br>
If you want to stop sucking, which is understandable, install <a href="http://www.getfirefox.com/"
target="_blank" >Firefox</a>, or get the fuck out.<br><br><br><br><br><br>
<?
}
?>

M$-speak translated (1)

pin_gween (870994) | more than 9 years ago | (#13224407)

What Chris Wilson says "Our intent is to build a platform that fully complies with the appropriate Web standards"

What Chris Wilson means : When the web standards are modeled after OUR wants and desires.

Not such a shill after all (0, Redundant)

jjohnson (62583) | more than 9 years ago | (#13224409)

Until now, I'd thought Paul Thurrot was a paid tongue-bather for Billy G. But this was a pretty unequivocal statement. I'm impressed.

How very true that is... (0, Offtopic)

Cally (10873) | more than 9 years ago | (#13224417)

Now I personally am an atheiest of the Dawkins type, but sometimes teh King James' language is too good a fit not to use:

I say unto you, that likewise joy shall be in heaven over one sinner that repenteth, more than over ninety and nine just persons, which need no repentance. 8 Either what woman having ten pieces of silver, if she lose one piece, doth not light a candle, and sweep the house, and seek diligently till she find it? 9 And when she hath found it, she calleth her friends and her neighbours together, saying, Rejoice with me; for I have found the piece which I had lost. 10 Likewise, I say unto you, there is joy in the presence of the angels of God over one sinner that repenteth.
(Matthew, Chapter 15, verse 8.)

Thank You! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#13224418)

Thank you Captiain Obvious!!

Whats next? Is he going to recommend OSX over Windows??

How refreshing (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#13224419)

An Anti-Microsoft article on Slashdot! What a refreshingly new idea!

Hell no! I won't click go! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#13224424)

Here's how he ends the article:

My IE 7.0 review will be available later this week.

Gee, I wonder if it's going to get a thumbs up? Actually, that would be the article for Slashdot to post instead of this melodramatic page churner. Give us details. Let us know the implications of actual IE 7 deployments. Instead we get this useless political tripe. Like it or not, IE 7 is coming. We need to know what to wait for and what to push for. I'd accept even minimal movement towards standards rather than what we have now. Instead we get this naive call for boycott of something thats going to end up on almost everyone's desktop. And I'm an Opera 8 user.

Some PHP Code... (1, Interesting)

Compholio (770966) | more than 9 years ago | (#13224432)

if(strstr($HTTP_USER_AGENT, "MSIE") != FALSE)
{
print "You are running an outdated, boycotted, browser - please upgrade:<BR><BR>";
print "<A HREF=\"http://www.spreadfirefox.com/\"><img border=\"0\" alt=\"Get Firefox!\" title=\"Get Firefox!\" src=\"http://www.spreadfirefox.com/community/image s/affiliates/Buttons/180x60/get.gif\"/></A><BR><BR >";
print "<A HREF=\"http://it.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=05/08 /02/1853256&tid=113&tid=218\">IE 7.0 Technical Changes Leave Web Developers, Users in the Lurch</A><BR>";
exit;
}

More Firefox ground I hope. (1)

Nijika (525558) | more than 9 years ago | (#13224433)

For user-friendlyness alone, I'm hoping this brings FF to the attention of even more people. I don't want to have to explain to my grandparents why IE7 looks completely different from the browsers they've been using for the past like 6 years.

Is it me, or does the new IE7 look like a step backwards from an interface perspective? It looks like some bad pre-Gnome/KDE usability exercise.

If MS wanted to get on the ugly-chic bandwagon they're about 8 years too late. What year did people stop using FVWM again?

Safari for Windows (1)

Chiisu (462604) | more than 9 years ago | (#13224440)

I think along w/ iTunes Apple should release a Windows version of Safari. I'd like to see a browser for Windows that uses the KHTML engine, and it would be another web-standard choice for Windows users....

i would love to, but.. (1)

timhillu03 (903863) | more than 9 years ago | (#13224443)

I'm a web designer, and i use mostly Firefox (Lynx and Safari at times as well, depending on target audience) while i'm working until it's time to debug, at which time i open up IE. And curse. And sometimes cry.

But does boycotting mean that i don't make special design changes just to accomodate IE users? Unfortunately, part of my job requires making sure the 90% (or 88%, wherever it is now) of morons out there who use IE on a regular basis can view my sites.

But for personal use, i never touch IE. I simply can't stand the thought of soiling my personal laptop by opening it up.

Ahhh, the infamous "Boycott" (1)

TSI Jman (901387) | more than 9 years ago | (#13224447)

Yeah lets boycott gas too!! (Then we can walk everywhere). Boycott Computers (then our data is really safe). Boycott Credit cards (then no one can steal our identity). Don't waste your time crying. Design something better!

Safari an alternative? (1)

prodangle (552537) | more than 9 years ago | (#13224463)

How exactly is Safari an alternative to IE7? If I am in a position to use IE7, then I'm not in a position to use Safari, unless he's suggesting I throw away my current computer to get rid of IE!

I wonder if the author... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#13224465)

...who urges a boycott of IE7 would be willing to do browser detection and instead of showing the content to users tell them that if they use IE7 they will have to get their information elsewhere?

I doubt it.

And how about YOU? (including /.)

I don't know about this (1)

Quick Sick Nick (822060) | more than 9 years ago | (#13224469)

Use something besides the bloated applications that come pre-installed on a shitty operating system?

I wouldn't dream of it.

Just a wild idea... (1)

remikun (748998) | more than 9 years ago | (#13224470)

But maybe the W3C could be an authoritative entity certifying Web browsers for compliance, or another method would be to declare that all browsers not complying to the standards cannot be called Web browsers. This is weak, I know. Same goes for the .NET name. Why can Microsoft freely use a name that is from a TLD? I didn't hear any complaints about that!

Unfortunately.. (1)

pickyouupatnine (901260) | more than 9 years ago | (#13224474)

Most users I know don't use firefox.. "Internet Explorer" - just the name - is so well entrenched into the masses that people will gladly bend over whenever the next Windows OS comes out. I'm the only one in my family that uses Firefox. Eventhough the IE icon has been removed from the desktop, my father (finally) learned how to use the Start Menu just so he could get to the IE icon.

For the first time I agree with Paul Thurrot (1)

network23 (802733) | more than 9 years ago | (#13224479)


For the first time I agree with Paul Thurrot.

Previously he called Longhorn "a trainwreck".

Now he writes:

Windows Vista Beta 1 Review [winsupersite.com]

What the heck am I looking at here?

A long time ago--I mean, like two and a half years ago--I was secreted into a room on the Microsoft campus for my first Longhorn demo. At that time, Longhorn was still the Kitchen Sink (tm) of computing, promising to deliver every single bit of technology you could imagine, all wrapped around a Flash-like UI that was based on Anark technology. It all looked really impressive.

I have yet to see anything like that materialize in an actual Longhorn/Vista build.

...while the early Aero Glass demos I saw seemed to raise the OS at least to Mac OS X levels visually, they didn't really go much beyond that. I was told to wait and see, wait and see, and promised that things would get better.

Instead, things got much worse.

The bad news is that a lot of the super futuristic stuff appears to be gone, and may be gone forever.

We were promised a revolution, dammit, and I want a revolution.

The negative reviews are so overwhelming, even from the toughest Microsoft-fans, my guess is that massive amount of blood will float in Redmond.

Microsoft is now in the same position as the Board of Directors at Apple 1996, fucked up beyond all recognition, with a useless beta OS as a dead end street. No one, absolutely no one believes in Microsoft Vista. Customers don't even want to upgrade from Windows 2000 to 2003.

But unlike Apple, Microsoft won't get salvaged by a Steve Jobs.

Ladies and gentlemen of the Slashdot forae, I really think we are witnessing the exakt spot - the mistake that in the end brought down Microsoft. Our grandchildren will read about "the Vista mistake" in Economics 101.

Average Joe Solution (1)

TheSneak (904279) | more than 9 years ago | (#13224488)

Well you can change the skin on windows xp and they'll think it's a new version of windows, so maybe we can change firefox to an IE skin, give it the blue "E" logo, and hopefully they'll never see the difference since IE7 is a tabbed browser.

Wow... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#13224492)

This article is absurd, completely ignoring the promises of Beta 2.
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