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Xbox 360 Launch to Face Several Hurdles

ScuttleMonkey posted more than 9 years ago | from the how-will-I-afford-another-console dept.

XBox (Games) 428

JamesO writes "Microsoft's J Allard has said that the Xbox 360 will be released in differing versions over the next five years. "It's something we're not ready to announce yet," he said. "I don't think it's a one-size-fits-all [approach] over the next five-year horizon." Relatedly JamesO writes "Microsoft is saying that anywhere up to 40 games could be released for the Xbox 360 during its launch period, but which of those will make or break the console's launch? Pro-G choose their ten most important Xbox 360 launch games. Not the ten best launch games, but the most important for the success of the Xbox 360."

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Backflip (5, Funny)

bugmenotus (907674) | more than 9 years ago | (#13328066)

So it seems Microsoft has done a complete 180 on previous statements? How ironic!

Re:Backflip (1)

ThinkFr33ly (902481) | more than 9 years ago | (#13328078)

Which statements?

They've said almost nothing about the console, and certainly nothing offical.

Re:Backflip (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#13328099)

Nevertheless, you must admit it is still highly ironic.

you keep using that word (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#13328128)

I do not think it means [] what you think it means.

Re:you keep using that word (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#13328169)

Well, I guess that's kind of ironic, ain't it?

Re:you keep using that word (1)

Surye (580125) | more than 9 years ago | (#13328352)

The irony is you still didn't get it right.

Re:you keep using that word (2, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#13328387)

See, I knew it was ironic, somewhere! And in one ironic twist, the whole situation becomes an instance of irony!

Re:you keep using that word (-1, Flamebait)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#13328355)

Ironic: Poignantly contrary to what was expected or intended

Poignant: Astute and pertinent; relevant

Contrary: Opposed, as in character or purpose

I see this crap on /. all the time about how "ironic doesn't mean what you think it does" and other such nonsense. Sure as fuck seems that it DOES mean what most people think it does. What kind of crack are you guys smoking and is a creationist your dealer?

It's called "360", so one could assume that it's supposed to spin us until we don't realise that it is really taking us in the same direction as the previous xbox, since I think we all discounted the idea of an integrated lazy susan a long time ago. But if it is in fact only partially spinning us (like bill o'reilly too close to a wall) and ends up going in the opposite direction, that seems "relevantly contrary to what was expected."

Most of you guys who say this shit are just english n00bs, but you are an idiot. Next time read your fucking links, moron.

Re:Backflip (5, Insightful)

James_Aguilar (890772) | more than 9 years ago | (#13328113)

I know that they haven't said much, but I've read between the lines and I can tell you everything you need to know:

"Guys, listen, the XBox 360 that you've all been waiting for . . . well . . . it's really just a PC with a graphics card that will be out of date next week." -- BillG

+ Unified SDK for PC and XBox game programming
+ XBox original is also a PC
+ Say no more, sir, say no more

Re:Backflip (5, Funny)

aichpvee (631243) | more than 9 years ago | (#13328365)

Isn't it actually more like a mac with a graphics card and some half-assed windows emulation software for running original xbox games?

Re:Backflip (0, Redundant)

Surye (580125) | more than 9 years ago | (#13328087)

What did you expect? A 360?

Haha, goodbye karma.

Re:Backflip (1)

michaeldot (751590) | more than 9 years ago | (#13328256)

Then they'd be chasing their own tail.

Re:Backflip (5, Interesting)

Strokke (772031) | more than 9 years ago | (#13328092)

I figured out Microsoft's tactics on this! Beat all the other companies to the market by using a soon to be out of date system! It's brilliant! Take the money from R&D and pump that into thing you know cha-ching! They'll actually release their real system around the same time as PS3....but not before they've sold millions of the "basic" systems. Hey Bill....high five!

lol (-1, Redundant)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#13328067)

omg fp

Re:lol (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#13328147)

Haha lol []

eat my ass (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#13328069)

I like a good butt-fucking once in a while!

Several hurdles? (1)

a no n y man 123 (712893) | more than 9 years ago | (#13328079)

Xbox 360 Launch to Face Several Hurdles

This may be true, but does it really reflect the article(s)?

Re:Several hurdles? (1)

bugmenotus (907674) | more than 9 years ago | (#13328126)

I guess the only way to find out is to RTFA(s).

Relates directly (4, Insightful)

SuperKendall (25149) | more than 9 years ago | (#13328184)

From article summary:

Microsoft's J Allard has said that the Xbox 360 will be released in differing versions over the next five years.

That's several hurdles right there. The story summary didn't say anyone but Microsoft was actually putting the hurdles in front of them.

Re:Relates directly (1)

a no n y man 123 (712893) | more than 9 years ago | (#13328198)

That's several hurdles right there.

I don't think it's that clear cut. Sorry, I expected /. headlines to be relatively objective. I must be new here.

Re:Relates directly (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#13328237)

You must be new here.

Skip TFA (5, Informative)

kirkb (158552) | more than 9 years ago | (#13328081)

10: Kameo: Elements of Power
9: The Elder Scrolls IV: Oblivion
8: Ridge Racer 6
7: N3: Ninety-Nine Nights
6: Dead or Alive 4
5: Call of Duty 2
4: Tom Clancy's Ghost Recon Advanced Warfighter
3: Project Gotham Racing 3
2: Madden NFL 06
1: Perfect Dark Zero

Re:Skip TFA (4, Insightful)

kusanagi374 (776658) | more than 9 years ago | (#13328149)

I don't know about you, but for me that list seems HIGHLY biased to the american market. Why the hell would the rest of the world worry that much about a NFL game to justify it being the SECOND PLACE on that list??

Same goes to Perfect Dark Zero being the top game on that list... Well, I surely love FPS, as most americans and europeans. But what about the asian market? That list is way too "western world"-focused IMO. And we all know what is the whole point behind Xbox 360: take over Playstation's home market.

Re:Skip TFA (4, Funny)

Burning1 (204959) | more than 9 years ago | (#13328211)

Is it me, or are all of those sequels?

Re:Skip TFA (1)

Slothy (17409) | more than 9 years ago | (#13328220)

Kameo and Ninety-Nine Nights are not sequels.

Re:Skip TFA (5, Interesting)

kusanagi374 (776658) | more than 9 years ago | (#13328223)

Kameo and Ninety-Nine Nights are the only ones that aren't sequels. The rest, on the other hand...

It seems that the market is fucked up in such a way that the only thing companies can come with are SEQUELS. Same happened for the PS2, and now it's going to happen for the Xbox 360 and PS3.

Re:Skip TFA (2, Insightful)

rm999 (775449) | more than 9 years ago | (#13328262)

Perhaps this isn't relevant to the list, but not all sequels are unoriginal. Some notable examples I can think of:

Super Mario Brothers 2
Grand Theft Auto 3
Duke Nukem 3D

Of course, for each of these, there are 1000 sequels with nothing at all new. Can anyone think of any other games for this list? I am sure there are plenty more.

Re:Skip TFA (1)

Coryoth (254751) | more than 9 years ago | (#13328321)

Wolfenstein 3D and Commander Keen 4,5,6 (as advanced from 1,2,3).

Re:Skip TFA (5, Informative)

Bobartig (61456) | more than 9 years ago | (#13328382)

Super Mario Brothers 2 wasn't really a sequel to SMB. Nintendo took a game called Doki Doki Panic, which had a completely separate cast of characters, and its own story, redrew all the characters to be from the mario world, and released it in the US as Super Mario Brothers 2. I mean, can we really call this a sequel when its just a completely different game with a Super Mario name tag slapped on it?

Then in a bizarre twist, they released the american version of the japanese game as Super Mario USA (since the japanese already had a Super Mario Brothers 2, in a game that was very similar to the first title, and has been released several times in various forms on US carts as "Lost Levels")

Despite the wierdities of its sordid past, SMB 2 is still a great game!

Re:Skip TFA (1)

Owndapan (789196) | more than 9 years ago | (#13328281)

According to TFA, I should be interested in Call of Duty 2 because "The smoke looks stunning". Yeh, because that's the primary thing I'm after in a game. Sheesh.

Okay, that's it... (4, Interesting)

the_skywise (189793) | more than 9 years ago | (#13328082)

Who wants to buy my preorder?!

I put a down payment for an XBox 360 under the assumption that WHAT THEY HYPED was what would be in the unit. Not some pie in the sky, it'll have HiDef DVD next year and then the year after that we'll introduce XBOX360 3.0 which, as you all know, is when Microsoft gets it right so hooo-baby, get your preorders in for that one, and oh sorry about that built-in wireless router but that was too expensive.

I completely and totally understand that some features may change from preorder to launch. But all of this hype now about different consoles and such and I'm ready to just drop the whole thing until they actually ink the final shipping product features.

Fool me once, shame one you... fool me twice...

One things for sure, it'll be a LONG time before I preorder any Microsoft game system again.

Re:Okay, that's it... (1)

SFalcon (809084) | more than 9 years ago | (#13328098)

I'm betting it'll be at least 5 years..

um... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#13328119)

Who did you preorder with? I'd think you can cancel without penalty up until 2-4 weeks before release date.

Most likely you can even cancel up until it ships, if you're willing to spend enough time calling them up and complaining. (and being transferred & put on hold repeatedly...)

Re:Okay, that's it... (3, Insightful)

AvantLegion (595806) | more than 9 years ago | (#13328122)

Oh dear. I seem to be drowing in the crocodile tears of the whiners and the overreactors. And me without a life raft.

Everything that MS ANNOUNCED would be in the system is still in the system. If you were so dumb as to bite on hype from random "gaming press" sources, well, why is it MS's fault that you don't know any better?

Re:Okay, that's it... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#13328136)

Why did you preorder anyway? Can't you live without a console a week from its release date?

Re:Okay, that's it... (1)

mek2600 (677900) | more than 9 years ago | (#13328195)

Who wants to buy my preorder?!
Fool me once, shame one you... fool me twice...

You're quite the salesman.

Re:Okay, that's it... (3, Funny)

im_thatoneguy (819432) | more than 9 years ago | (#13328288)

... and can you believe those bastards at Alienware, every time I plan to put down an order, they hoodwink me again and release the "fastest computer in the world". It's almost like they're trying to offer the most up-to-date technology as it's released to the public. I can NEVER seem to figure out when they're going to release the final spec gaming system, it's driving me crazy.

Re:Okay, that's it... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#13328300)

"There's an old saying in Tennessee I know it's in Texas, probably in Tennessee that says, fool me once, shame on shame on you. Fool me you can't get fooled again." President George W. Bush, Nashville, Tenn., Sept. 17, 2002 []

Quick survey (1)

ReformedExCon (897248) | more than 9 years ago | (#13328085)

How many people reading this are planning on buying an XBox 360? What sold you on it?

I am genuinely curious as to the anticipation level here. The last game that I anticipated was Master of Orion 2, but that was years and years ago.

Re:Quick survey (2, Insightful)

gozu (541069) | more than 9 years ago | (#13328154)

I am. Then again, I have vowed to buy all systems since the dreamcast came out so that doesn't really mean much. All this noise about different versions of the xbox360 is bullshit. What you buy on launch day is what games will be coded for throughout the life of the console. That's *ALL* that matters. Ayone who can't see that is a moron...

Re:Quick survey (1)

Punboy (737239) | more than 9 years ago | (#13328173)

I'm gonna buy one. Not for the games, but for the actual hardware inside.

Re:Quick survey (1)

michaeldot (751590) | more than 9 years ago | (#13328244)

May buy one. Then get bored of it and sell it on eBay a few months later and buy a PlayStation 3, which I think will be a superior console.

Or may just stick with the PSP and be less of a couch potato about gaming - gaming on the move is hip!

Re:Quick survey (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#13328245)

I'll get one, since I don't believe the rumours on /. are worth worrying about.

Rare makes some awesome games, and have proved that they don't need Nintendo for that.
I imagine the next KotOR game will be for the 360, and I'm fairly certain that the sequels to Jade Empire and Fable also will. Those are all games that I'd buy a console for, without question.

I love Nintendo's games, though, so I'll probably get a Revolution when it comes out, too.

Re:Quick survey (1)

lastberserker (465707) | more than 9 years ago | (#13328247)

What sold you on it?

How about John Carmack's choosing it over PS3 as a primary development platform? [] I trust the man :-)

...that, and Halo 3

Over a PC, not the PS3 (1)

SuperKendall (25149) | more than 9 years ago | (#13328282)

The choice for him though was between a PC and the 360 - I don't think the PS3 really entered into the equation as a primary platform since, as he said, he still plans to release for the PC first.

He did berate both consoles for going the muti-processor route.

But between the UT engine and the Doom3 engine, I have to say the new UT engine looks more impressive. That will be out for both platforms anyway.

Let's read it again (3, Informative)

lastberserker (465707) | more than 9 years ago | (#13328374)

Right here [] :-)

On Xbox 360

the Xbox 360 has an architecture where you essentially have got three processors and they're all running the same memory pool and they're all synchronized, and cache coherent, and you can spawn off another thread in your program and make it go do some work. That's kind of the best case and it's still really difficult to turn into faster performance or getting it to get more stuff done in a game title.

On PS3:

Is the performance benefit that you get out of this worth the extra development time? There's sort of an inclination to believe that, and there's some truth to it, that Sony sort of takes this position where, 'okay it's going to be difficult, maybe its going to suck to do this, but the good game developers are going to suck it up and make it work.' There's some truth to that. There will be the developers that go ahead and have a miserable time and do get good performance out of some of these multi-core approaches. And Cell is worse than others in some respects, here.

Re:Quick survey (1)

Cheapy (809643) | more than 9 years ago | (#13328257)

I've always planned on buying the Xbox 360, not for the specs or things like that, it seems as of right now that the PS3 has beaten the Xbox 360 in that regard, but rather for the games.

I know that my computer would NOT be able to play some of the games that are (supposedly) coming out for the Xbox 360. Half-Life 2 and The Elder Scrolls 4 come to mind. My computer is one of those 20 gig, 697 MHz, GeForce 440 MX computers that can't run anything. It obviously won't be running any next-generation games any time soon.

The fact that I know someone who works at Microsoft so I can get games for about $10 US may also be a factor in my decision...

Re:Quick survey (-1, Flamebait)

ed1park (100777) | more than 9 years ago | (#13328269)

minimun HD 720 Progressive support from all titles. (I believe I read that somewhere...) And from seeing the incredible screenshots of various games at, I'm totally sold. 480P from current Xbox titles don't cut it for me on my HD displays, especially when I'm used to playing 1600x1200 on my pc at 60FPS.

Some games I'm looking forward to include DOA4, Tony Hawk, Forza, Project Gotham, etc.

Normally I wait before I buy console. I waited more than a year before I bought an xbox. But the Xbox360 has appeared to cross a critical threshold for me in graphics/HD capability that I can't wait for. I'm playing on a 105" (not a typo) screen with a native resolution of 1366x768, so I need all the resolution, polys, and graphical eye candy I can get. Even on my 32" LCD display, 480 just barely cuts it for me. A little hard on the eyes especially when I'm playing a game like Forza.

"Look at how COOL I am!" (2, Funny)

Petersko (564140) | more than 9 years ago | (#13328347)

You managed to get in the monstrous size of your display, the massive strength of your computer hardware, the size of your ALTERNATE television - an LCD, and you even put "(not a typo)" in there, as if to suggest we might all suspect you mean 10.5 inches, or perhaps 15 inches, rather than 105 inches.

Your penis must be less than 2 inches. It's the only explanation.

Re:Quick survey (1)

binkzz (779594) | more than 9 years ago | (#13328380)

The last game I anticipated was Duke Nukem Forever, but that was years and years ago too.

Hell for consumers (2, Interesting)

Unsus (901072) | more than 9 years ago | (#13328094)

I would be pissed off if I bought version 1 of the X-Box, and then find out that X Game 001 only works on version 4 and above because it requires a HD. If games are compatible across all versions, I think this would still make consumers less willing to buy the X-Box. Why would I buy an X-Box now when version 2 with HDTV could be out in two more months?

Re:Hell for consumers (4, Interesting)

Morgon (27979) | more than 9 years ago | (#13328164)

The thing that you should remember, though, is that the hard drive is a confirmed (both in specs and photos) to be a removeable piece. Just because the system might not ship with a HD doesn't mean it's an inferior system, it just allows the purchaser to buy what size they want, and what price they can afford.

What I don't like is that games will be programmed to 'potentially not use the HD', which means that some incredibly content may or may not be available because of all of the contingencies with creating essentially two underlying versions of each game.

For example, a game like Fable, already plenty of things were ripped out of the game at the last minute -- if they had to spend extra safeguards to make sure that people without HDs get a comparable experience -- which doesn't sound like a lot of programming code in theory, but in practice, would that cause more functionality to require removal?

Re:Hell for consumers (1)

Morgon (27979) | more than 9 years ago | (#13328186)

Good god, remind me not to post at 2 AM (or 1:49 AM, whatever). Hopefully you can make out that drivel.

Re:Hell for consumers (2, Insightful)

jlarocco (851450) | more than 9 years ago | (#13328199)

Not only that, but one of the big benefits of console systems is that it usually simplifies things. On the computer, I have to check a game's memory, CPU, and video card requirements before I can buy it. For the PS2, I just have to look in the PS2 section.

Granted, it's not rocket science, but if they're going to radically change the hardware, maybe they should just release a new system.

And I can't say I envy the MS tech support people. "But it said XBOX 360", "Oh, sorry sir, that game is for XBOX 360 service pack 2" "Oh. Well can I have my money back?" "Oh, haha... yea, about that... um no." Click.

This is an awful idea. (5, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#13328097)

The whole concept that drives consoles is that they are easy to use. You see the Xbox logo, you know you can play it. This idea has obviously degraded some with the online movement (not everyone will be able to play online), but this is taking it too far. When I buy a game system, there should be no compatibilty question. That's what my PC is for.

The average parent isn't going to know what to pick for their kid, and faced with a choice they might just turn around and pick up a console they know will be able to support any game on the system.

More experienced/older gamers might look at the inferior versions of the system as worthless, and will simply wait until the maxed out system comes down to a reasonable price. A good analogy would be with computers. The average slashdotter isn't going to go buy a celeron notebook (lets go with plain old celeron, when they sucked) when there are vastly superior Pentium M notebooks available. They will wait for the better system's price to come down. Maybe not such a great analogy, but hopefully it gets the point across.

Hardware (3, Insightful)

Spacejock (727523) | more than 9 years ago | (#13328103)

It's a good idea to revamp the console over its lifetime, but it's not really a selling point for people buying the first generation. Either you get games which push the hardware now, but will work better on future, unreleased hardware (sounds like PC gaming). Or you get future games which work only on future revisions of the console, and are unplayable on the current generation. (sounds like PC gaming). Alternatively, you get generic titles which will work on the lowest common system. (ditto)

MS Flight sim is an example from the PC world. When first released, there's no hardware which can render smooth frame rates with all settings maxed out. As the hardware improves over time, the visuals can be pushed higher and higher until... the next version comes out and we start all over.

Re:Hardware (4, Insightful)

ZosX (517789) | more than 9 years ago | (#13328341)

Time and time again has shown that developers will not support addons or upgrades to a console. I don't possibly see how fragmenting your market is a good thing. The abysmal PS/2 hard drive sales should be a good indicator of how willing the public is to spend money on upgrading their console. For reference of history, look at the Sega CD, the 32X, the light gun, ROB the robot, and a whole slew of other useless failed addons. I will say that network adapters for the PS/2 have done fairly well though, but very few games actually require the hard drive, with FFXI being a notable exception. FFIX's population is about 2 million by the way. Good for a MMORPG, terrible for a blockbuster console game. How many did FFVII sell worldwide? 5? 6 million?

If you were a developer what market would you choose? The market that your game will run on the most consoles (base 360) or the market that is likely just a small fraction of the overall maximum market?

Your comparison the PC world is completely absurd in that PCs are constantly upgraded and evolving whereas the typical console is a single target that never moves. It is an awful lot easier to make a game for one console with fixed specs than the hundreds and thousands of possible PC hardware configurations. It should be no secret that most PC games these days are RTS, first person shooters, a few RPGs here and there and of course, the simulator. Not much variety to be found. A great deal of developer shops have fallen quite recently due to poor sales in the PC market. Most kids these days seem to prefer the TV versus the monitor and I hate to say it, but I would imagine that a large number of computer game players are also software pirates given the ease of downloading an ISO and mounting it with the convieniently free daemon tools, whereas on the console you have to mod the console or pay to have someone do it for you and that is really out of the grasp of a lot of people.

I don't honestly think that Microsoft is choosing a good plan here. It is better to have a unified market than one that is potentially fractured. If you make a console that much better than the original and manage to convince a foolish developer to produce games that only run on the newer console, then why bother at all when instead you could have just waited a few years and released a whole new console with a slew of upgrades? Oh wait. That is precisely what they do now.

If there were a market for upgradeable consoles, it would have surely materialized by now. I think that the average gamer cares far less about the platform and a great deal more about the actual games themselves. IF you want to win a console race you need a lot of killer apps like GTA3 and the first Xbox had about 3 triple A titles and that just isn't going to cut it.

Re:Hardware (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#13328359)

It's some baaaad idea t'revamp de console ova' its lifetime, but it's not really some sellin' point fo' sucka's stealin' de fust generashun. Eida' ya' git games which push de hardware now, but gots'ta wo'k betta' on future, unreleased hardware (sounds likes PC gamin'). Or ya' git future games which wo'k only on future revisions uh de console, and are unplayable on de current generashun. (sounds likes PC gamin'). Alternatively, ya' git generic titles which gots'ta wo'k on de lowest common system. 'S coo', bro. (ditto) MS Flight sim be an 'esample fum de PC wo'ld. When fust released, dere's no hardware which kin renda' smood frame rates wid all settin's maxed out. As de hardware improves ova' time, de visuals kin be pushed higha' and higha' until... de next version comes out and we start all over. Ah be baaad...

/.ed (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#13328104)

5 replies and TFA is already slashdotted ! Wonder if the server was running on an X-Box?

Sticking with my PS2 for now (4, Interesting)

ducomputergeek (595742) | more than 9 years ago | (#13328107)

Until there are games and the final hardware version is released, I think I am just going to stick with my PS2 for at least another couple years until the HD-DVD/Bluray and platform wars are decided.

Re:Sticking with my PS2 for now (1)

ImaLamer (260199) | more than 9 years ago | (#13328166)

Why, I'm still using my Dreamcast a lot...

No hard drive (4, Insightful)

mrshowtime (562809) | more than 9 years ago | (#13328109)

No hard drive will seriously take away one of the advantagest the Xbox2 will have against the PS3, which also is planning on not having a hard drive. The hd comes standard on the current xbox, removing it now will only confuse the consumer base Also MS does NOT need to upgrade the optical drive at a later date to an HD DVD drive, unless the cost is as cheap a dvd drive. Why does Microsoft think that their plan of offering three to five different versions of the xbox will do anything but segment their own market is beyond me. Sony has always made on system and then figured out ways to shrink everything over a few years and then make money off of that hardware.

Relax, 360 will most likely include hard drive (3, Insightful)

a no n y man 123 (712893) | more than 9 years ago | (#13328191)

The 360 will almost certainly include the hard drive at launch. Remember, it is detachable, so what Allard is doing is making sure you can still play games when the hard drive isn't attached. He's also saying that sometime in the next five years, they may or may not sell a version of the 360 without the HD included.

Re:No hard drive (1)

tklive (755607) | more than 9 years ago | (#13328210)

I guess cost would be the biggest factor . there are significant psychological price points and having a sufficiently differentiated variant across them would increase their sales. *if* they do get most of the games to work equally well on all the variants , then i really dont see what the issue is. They have communicated, rather strongly, to the devolopers about this same thing. So I would expect all the flagship games to be equally playable across all the models. sure, there could be a minor set of games that dont do this, but MS would make sure the buyer is aware of it. and anything that gives me more choice is definitely good in my books.

Not mentioned... (2, Funny)

Infinityis (807294) | more than 9 years ago | (#13328112)

The article failed to mention the two main setbacks. First, they based the OS off of Longhorn. Second, they want to ship every console with a copy of Duke Nukem Forever.

Re:Not mentioned... (1)

rowama (907743) | more than 9 years ago | (#13328168)

"they want to ship every console with a copy of Duke Nukem Forever."

Please stop. You're killing me with temptation. I played Duke Nukem years ago and loved it. To think I can play it again; and Forever? Here's kissin' my PS2 goodbye.

Re:Not mentioned... (1)

kusanagi374 (776658) | more than 9 years ago | (#13328185)

The article failed to mention the two main setbacks. First, they based the OS off of Longhorn. Second, they want to ship every console with a copy of Duke Nukem Forever.

I know you were joking here, but actually the Xbox 360 OS is based off the Xbox1 OS which is based on Windows 2000, which is based on Windows NT which is based on OS/2 which has Unix code which has SCO code.

Oh, and Longhorn is definitely coming next year... sure, they remove 95% of the features meant to be there, but I guess I just ruined part of your joke! :D

Looking forward to Duke Nukem Forever ported to the stable release of GNU/Hurd.

No more sequels!! (1)

rkruse (837943) | more than 9 years ago | (#13328115)

Any good-looking games going to be released for the xbox360 that isn't a sequel?

Re:No more sequels!! (1)

Morgon (27979) | more than 9 years ago | (#13328202)

How about Gears of War? (maybe this isn't a launch title, but they sure were hyping it like one back at E3)

Oblivion also isn't a true sequel.. it takes place in the same "world", but the characters, the timeframe, and most likely even the locations, will be incredibly different.

Not a sequel (1)

a no n y man 123 (712893) | more than 9 years ago | (#13328302)

A prequel: Perfect Dark Zero.

Versions? (1)

rowama (907743) | more than 9 years ago | (#13328116)

I don't know much about Xbox except that it is MS, which leads me to the question, "Will the 40 games still work after the release version is superseded?"

Viva la PS2!


Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#13328117)

Look at that BSOD go, I bet im getting at least 100fps on the dam thing. I feel sorry for all those people who didn't buy M$ new and "improved" game console, i heard they dont get cool BSOD's like us, heck i dont think they get any.

You can help! (2, Funny)

Infinityis (807294) | more than 9 years ago | (#13328129)

Taking a cue from their competition (Nintendo), Microsoft announced that we can help them overcome these hurdles by repeatedly pressing A-B-A-B-A-B-A-B-A-B-A-B as fast as possible.

Good Job MSFT(hehe...) (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#13328134)

I am not too into consoles, I used to be when I was young, but I find that computers are more versatile(duh). The last console I bought was the regular playstation and that system is still kicking after 9 years despite some things that have been said about the original PSX. With this new move, I dont see a reason to ever own a console, from microsoft at least, ever. Why? So I can get screwed out of some features later? How can microsoft think that it is a good idea? Undoubtedly they have heard of the "Sega CD" and other bastard children from other companies. I cannot see how anyone over there calling the shots can think that this is good.

So, um. (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#13328139)

I take it that means the first generation system will be significantly cheaper than predicted, right? Right, guys?

*crickets chirping*

This is why I won't bother with consoles. Ever.

Version Release Order (5, Funny)

SoulMaster (717007) | more than 9 years ago | (#13328145)

1. XBox 360 95- Way better than the Xbox, but you have to take it apart and rebuild it monthly. Optional "Plus Pack" to add themes.

2. XBox 360 98- Plug and Play joystics added (sort of). Though it crashed less, its not really that much different than XBox 360 95 but everyone thinks they want it.

3. XBox 360 CE- This is the portable version, Duh!

4. XBox 360 98SE- Exactly the same as XBox 360 98, but it costs more, and M$ says it's better so people think they want it more. Also included, a Weezer Video.

5. XBox 360 ME- This version crashes almost as much as the XBox 360 95, but it has built-in backups for when it corrupts, so you've got that going for you.

6. XBox 360 XP- Much better than all previous versions, but the EU and SEC will make Microsoft remove the browser, which is full of bugs... The linux community will absolutely hate the XBox 360 XP, even though it really isn't all that bad, if you know how to secure it, which is a serious pain in the ass.

7. XBox 360 Vista- This version will totally rip-off all other 3rd Generation consoles, and is the whole reason they have the tiered release plan anyway...

Re:Version Release Order (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#13328177)

I want the XBox 360 2000 :(

Re:Version Release Order (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#13328200)

Take your "humor" and go shove it up your ass, you fucking dickhead.

Re:Version Release Order (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#13328225)

You got it wrong, the Weezer video was on the 95 CD, not 98.

Re:Version Release Order (1)

The Wooden Badger (540258) | more than 9 years ago | (#13328227)

7. XBox 360 Vista- This version will totally rip-off all other 3rd Generation consoles, and is the whole reason they have the tiered release plan anyway...

Isn't the 3rd generation console something like SNES and Sega Genesis?

I also think M$ is being stupid (business as usual?) with the different versions thing. I can understand if there is one type that is a media center, one is a home theater, one is an internet appliance type of thing where the different versions have different extras, but the way they are going about it is stupid. It would have been slightly more intelligent to not tell anyone that version 1 is stripped and then version 2 has some of the main features. But you still have pissed consumers that aren't going to trust you anymore after the 2nd iteration comes out. And then the 3rd one comes out, and then the 4th one, 5th... If all flavors can't play all the games then the whole thing is a bad idea. Maybe Sony needs to rethink their idea of waiting to release the PS3 and just release it at the same time with all the advertised features at launch.

Re:Version Release Order (3, Funny)

Anubis350 (772791) | more than 9 years ago | (#13328274)

don't forget:

Xbox NT - stable, briefly ported to ps3 and gamecube but no games made for ports or for itself for that matter

Xbox NT4.0 - more stable, though not nearly as stable as Xbox haxxor linux, most games still won't run

Xbox 2000 - Only useful/useable version of Xbox. Games run, Xbox stable, unfortunately doomed to be retired in favor of flashy chrome looking, resource eating Xbox XP.

fly karma fly. Go free!

Best game ever! (1)

schnoid (834307) | more than 9 years ago | (#13328158)

Why not just come out with a new version of the guy game!? That should get some more sales for Microsoft.

Tell me again about "the Apple tax," chumps. (1)

Orrin Bloquy (898571) | more than 9 years ago | (#13328172)

Schaedenfreude much?

Way to make different versions work? (2, Interesting)

Kevin143 (672873) | more than 9 years ago | (#13328193)

What if Microsoft's plan is to give every single Xbox 360.v1 owner a coupon for a free HD-DVD drive by mail? It could make sense, economically, if the difference in cost between the HD-DVD changes enough over the course of two years. Two years from this Christmas, then, Microsoft launches the Xbox 360.v2 with the HD-DVD drive and all Xbox 360.v1 owners are told that they can send in a copy of the bottom of their Xbox to receive their free HD-DVD drive upgrade. It could save a lot of money I think, and not cause the Osborne effect or the Sega CD effect.

Re:Way to make different versions work? (1)

Senjutsu (614542) | more than 9 years ago | (#13328278)

And mom & pop console purchaser is going to want to swap drives by hand?

Nailing your own coffin (4, Insightful)

FidelCatsro (861135) | more than 9 years ago | (#13328196)

The Mega CD , the 32X , jaguar CD ...
We all remember how successful extensions to your console are(Though the jaguar CD was a great add on , it was expensive and the console was struggling at the time anyway ) .

MS in an attempted to create an extendable console .... By which i mean more money via add ons ,are making a fatal mistake here "those who do not learn from history are doomed to repeat it".
People like consoles because they are simple to use
They certainly don't want to waste much money on upgrades for it and to start having to worry about requirements ... well maybe one small add on you can get away with (Though nintendo were quite lucky with the N64 RAM pack , not that it didn't have a few problems itself) , change the disc format and you are nearly guaranteed to have limited success if not damage done to your market.

"I don't think it's a one-size-fits-all [approach] over the next five-year horizon."
People like consoles in a One size fits all ,they are like comfortable track suit trousers that you can slip into of a night , pig out on a massive pizza and remain calm in the knowledge you wont need to undo a button as time goes on .

Guarantees I won't be an Xbox 360 early adopter (4, Insightful)

garagekubrick (121058) | more than 9 years ago | (#13328209)

Why buy now when later I'll be able to get an HD-DVD compatible mode. Why bother when the hard drive is being removed from the equation and will cost extra as an addon, thereby limiting developers' use of its potential, thereby removing the outstanding feature of the original Xbox.

I got to see the Xbox 360 in closed doors demos at E3 this year, and I have to say despite the ringing hype endorsement of the PS3 over a prerendered demo (Killzone) which everyone on the floor as developers could name who created it - the Xbox 360 really did blow me away technically and the games were impressive looking and desirable - especially the new EA sports iterations (not to say anything of their gameplay and the company's lack of innovation).

But this latest news really puts me off bothering to pick one up soon. I recently had a ton of games stolen and went to eBay to load up on games I lost in the theft that were out of print. When it came time to find all the titles for the Xbox, there were very, very few I even wanted to bother replacing.

The current lineup, Call of Duty 2 excepted (which looked exceptional at E3 running in a limited capacity), does nothing to make me jones for Xbox 360. It still is a box dedicated towards dumbed down PC games played on a television. For now, I'll wait and see if an HD-DVD model ever comes out. I'll pick up a PS3 and use it as my Blu-Ray player.

Got the version map right here (1, Funny)

SuperKendall (25149) | more than 9 years ago | (#13328216)

Round 1 (this year):
One model with hard drive, one without. (360HD and 360).

Round 2 (next year, one week before Sony launch):
One model with HD-DVD and HD, one model with HD-DVD and no HD (360 HDDHD and 360 HDD).
360 HD and 360 reduce in price (1/2 cost of PS3), still offered.
Halo 3 re-issued on HD-DVD media with added content.

Round 3 (year after Sony launch)
New model with improved graphics performance to pass Sony, hard drive and no hard drive models - 720 HDDHD and 720 HDD.
360 HDDHD and 360 HDD reduced in price.
360 HD and 360 discontinued.
Halo 4 issued in HD-DVD, requires 720 XXXxx model to work.

Funny or insightful? You decide!

Re:Got the version map right here (1)

im_thatoneguy (819432) | more than 9 years ago | (#13328342)

HAHAHAAHA. That was very amusing.

The funniest part was the expression was on Micrsoft Accountants' faces when they were told that Microsoft would try to sell a loss leader to the same customer twice.

*snicker* I'm sure they would just love that.

If M$ is truly worthy of the dollar sign monicker, they're clearly bright enough to know that they don't want to sell a product to Joe Smith twice, in which they lose $100 dollars every time he buys it. The longer Joe User holds on to his Xbox and continues to buy games, the better Microsoft does financially. So let's put behind us all of these rediculous conspiracy theories that MS is going to try to milk the customer into buying two consoles.

If you want an HD-DVD player, it will always be cheaper to just buy an HD-DVD player when they become available. However, most likely most of you will just be buying it off of Netflix: Broadband by that point.

Xpod rumors (1)

a no n y man 123 (712893) | more than 9 years ago | (#13328235)

There are rumors that one of the reasons the HD will be detachable is that it will double as a portable music player. We probably would have heard more about this already if it were true, though.

Comment on ten most important games: (3, Funny)

SuperKendall (25149) | more than 9 years ago | (#13328265)

10) Relies on someone going back in time to a point when Rare made a good game.

9) Built to convince PC RPG gamers to switch to a console.

8) Kills two birds with one stone, great arcade racer and greater Japanese interest in console.

7) Makes sure that second bird is really dead and not just faking it.

6) The first lesson of Breast Physics dictates the pull of the console is proportional to the bounce of your fighter.

5) Because the WWII genre is just so fresh.

4) "Ubi-quitous" stealth action game.

3) To draw people tired of the license grind.

2) It's the only way to have football on when there's no football on.

1) Make that two games that rely going back in time and... loop detected!

You know so far... (4, Insightful)

aztektum (170569) | more than 9 years ago | (#13328271)

I think MS and Sony might have a tougher time than they think this time out. I hear a lot of 12-13 year olds saying "Xbox 2 is gonna be l33t!" or "I so need a PS3 when it comes out." but I spend a lot of time at a nearby game store talking to the guys that work there and from the sound of things, it's gamers that have the cash to burn on new systems that are saying things like, "The only one I know I'll get is the Revolution." and "I'm sick of all the bullshit hype."

So yeah, hey Sony and MS: fire your marketing departments and put the money towards game development. Everyone already knows that your next gen shit is coming, shut up about it and give us games that make it a worthwhile purchase.

Re:You know so far... (1)

shadexiii (723888) | more than 9 years ago | (#13328375)

I hate to have to remind you, but few companies these days legitimately ask you, the consumer, what you want. Most companies believe that they already know what you want, and if you don't want it, well, you're mistaken. Here's some examples off the top of my head:

Microsoft, in its infinite wisdom, not only made the XBox incapable of playing DVD movies out of the box, but also charged a good amount for a remote and receiver package. Many of us thought that we would want a remote bundled with the unit, or at least the ability to use a controller as a remote....sort of like the PS2. We were clearly wrong.

Nintendo realized that us gamers were misled in wanting a Zelda game with realistic graphics. They reminded us by giving us Windwaker. (Granted, Nintendo appears to have given in to the will of the consumers on this one for the next game, and many people said that Windwaker's style grew on them with time, was appropriate, etc, but this insomnia-fueled rant wouldn't be complete if I didn't bitch and moan enough about industry tyrants.)

Sony decided that a hard drive and network card were best sold seperate from the PS2, so the consumer could buy them later if they wanted. Wait....the hard drive bit sounds familiar.... (Again, in all fairness there aren't too terribly many games...that I'm aware of....that use the network adapter, and fewer still (FFXI? Is that all?) that actually need the HDD.)

Console makers aren't the only ones who know better than consumers, this kind of attitude seems to be running rampant these days.

And as for the 12-13 year old kids? No, they may not have the money to buy the console, but mommy and daddy, assuming they can afford it, will buy one of these consoles as a gift at some point to shut the child up/ make the child love them/ make the child happy/(The list continues...enough examples.) Convince the child your system is the best, and the child will convince the parent. Thus the hype. Children like shiny things.

Oh, and hopefully Sony doesn't suddenly follow suit with Microsoft. If the only two options are to buy an upgradeable console or buy no console, most people that would like a new console will eventually give in. The money flow to the console giants won't stop....and anyone who believes they care about much more than that needs to be slapped with some sort of ridiculous object or another. I can't think of a good one, so I'll leave that to the reader's imagination.

I'm not saying I like/agree with any of these problems, but then again, Microsoft, Sony, or any other corporation for that matter, hasn't told me that I should yet. Hold on...someone's at the door.....

Re:You know so far... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#13328390)

The 12-13 year olds' parents have cash to burn too and they don't know anything about the bullshit hype. They just want their kid to stop bugging them about that new "l33t" game machine. So they plunk down the cash.

Planned releases (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 9 years ago | (#13328307)

Actually, Microsoft is innovating the concept of gaming console: they planned some revisions of their product (not in number but in time period).
Each release will be a fix for the flaws borrowed by the previous one.

Oh, wait...

Obvious development (2, Insightful)

SuperKendall (25149) | more than 9 years ago | (#13328314)

Fact: XBox 360 will not ship with HD-DVD drive.

Theory: After the PS3 is released (heck, while they are developing PS3 launch titles) game developers will scream to Microsoft they need the storage space HD-DVD offers to port the mammoth games they have just developed over to the XBox (and even then they may have a to cut and/or heavily compress some content to fit in the smaller space the HD-DVD format offers).

How can anyone really doubt this will not be true? How can anyone even hold a moment of doubt that at the very least a 2nd model with an HD-DVD drive will be released, and some game in the future (probably from EA) will require it? The only reason you are seeing Madden is that they will have another version next year anyway and this one will get the engine kinks worked out.

I think the only real surprise going forward would be Microsoft deciding to go with Blu-Ray instead of HD-DVD. But I just don't think they could swallow thier pride enough to do so, they are driven to be seen as the market leader.

Re:Obvious development (2, Insightful)

im_thatoneguy (819432) | more than 9 years ago | (#13328395)

Can you think of a game that uses more than 6 GB now? There is not and will not be a game during the next generation that will require more than 9 GBs. Should in the unlikely event a game discover a use for more than 9 GBs, there is always the always appreciated multi disc shuffle.

In the last 6 years, I have seen little to no increase in storage demand from my games. For instance I'll use the ever bloated RPG genre, specifically Bioware's line as an example:

(Full Installs)
Baldur's Gate 1 (circa 1998): 500 megabytes
Baldur's Gate 2 (circa 2000): 1.2 gigs
NeverWinter Nights (Circa 2002): 2.1 gigs
Knights of the Old Republic (2003): 4.0 gigs
So about every 2 years, the largest games on the planet double in size. Two years from now, Bioware will probably have to release it's massive upcoming RPG on two DVDs for the 360, or simply employ a few compression algorithms on it's discs. But there is clearly no 45 GB demand in the forseeable future. DVD games are going to more than sufficient during this next generation.

An Idea! (5, Funny)

10Ghz (453478) | more than 9 years ago | (#13328323)

Instead of offering the console in several different versions, why not let the people customize it by themselves? Want a HD with the console? Buy one and add it in! Want better optical-drive? Replace the one that came with the system with a better one! The user could also add better CPU and more RAM to the system.

Since these consoles would be more personal than the identical model they have sold in the past, we need a new name for these consoles. I suggest a "Personal Console", or "PC" for short.

Just from the snippet (1)

tod_miller (792541) | more than 9 years ago | (#13328357)

JamesO writes "Microsoft's J Allard has said that the Xbox 360 will be released in differing versions over the next five years.

If you don't like the first one, stick around, give us a chance to make a better one, but lets do the traditional announcement to lock the market into 'wait-and-see' for the next 5 years. Problem is, does this work on gamers?

"It's something we're not ready to announce yet," he said. "I don't think it's a one-size-fits-all [approach] over the next five-year horizon."

I am not actually ready to make this comment, but since I already have, isn't this proclaimation redundant? Or are they pointing at more details?

Relatedly JamesO writes "Microsoft is saying that anywhere up to 40 games could be released for the Xbox 360 during its launch period, but which of those will make or break the console's launch?

Between 0 and 40 games will be released!

Anyway, Sony are locking up their consoles, everyone is. I would rather not sponsor these types of locked down computer systems blindly, under the guise of games, and people should start realising that.

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Most important Xbox game... (1)

Bloodlent (797259) | more than 9 years ago | (#13328358)

1.Whichever game has the exploit to install Linux. 2-10.Crap no one cares about.
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