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Sun Unveils 64-bit Server Line

ScuttleMonkey posted more than 8 years ago | from the long-overdue dept.

Sun Microsystems 287

SumDog is one of many to let us know, PC World is reporting that Sun is expected to reveal the first few of their new 64-bit servers at their quarterly product rollout. From the article: "Formerly code-named Galaxy, the Sun Fire X2100, X4100, and X4200 servers represent the company's bid to woo customers, particularly the financial industry sector, away from rival server vendors Hewlett-Packard and Dell."

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here comes the suns (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#13539224)

been there, done that. got the White Album

wow, 64 bit Sun systems (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#13539235)

that's almost as incredible as Microsoft unveiling a 32 bit operating system.

Linux User (&developer) (1)

CmdrTaco (troll) (578383) | more than 8 years ago | (#13539236)

That mag is pure propaganda. Every sentence in every article was blathering on about free and GNU. $12 bucks too. At least it came with a fedora core 4 dvd. Fucking thing reminded me of slashdot. Pure shit.

And it's based on Opterons... (3, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#13539239)

The future of 64-bit Sun servers is the Opteron.

Should we take this as the final sign that Sun is giving up on Sparc?

And as they move toward "normal" chips, should we expect that Sun will be able to continue to offer the hardware advantages (say, to do with reliability) that they held with Sparc, or are we going to be seeing them move closer to being a plain-box Opteron reseller-- in the same way that as Apple is moving to plain-jane x86, they are also giving up on technologies such as Open Firmware?

Sun is not giving up on SPARC (5, Informative)

turgid (580780) | more than 8 years ago | (#13539273)

Sun has a comprehensive roadmap for UltraSPARC going forward and combining forces with Fujutsu on SPARC64.

These new servers absolutely rock, and at superb prices.

I once had the pleasure of a 4-way Opteron v40z with a development version of 64-bit Solaris 10. It was a screamer, especially compared to our 4-way Dell P4 Xeon box, and 64-bit.

It was plenty fast enough to host 4 zones and several developers working on KDE, gcc and all manner of other stuff.

At last, Sun looks like it's turning the corner (despite the best efforts of some of its PHBs - no names mentioned).

Good luck Sun.

Re:Sun is not giving up on SPARC (0, Troll)

iggymanz (596061) | more than 8 years ago | (#13539370)

as for Ultrasparc, who needs a box that is tied to running only one OS that is rapidly now falling BEHIND what enterprise GNU/Linux distros can do? UltraSparc has been falling behind in performance too, can they introduce something that beats Intel and AMD's new chips? Intel and AMD have roadmaps too.

Re:Sun is not giving up on SPARC (1)

njcoder (657816) | more than 8 years ago | (#13539512)

" as for Ultrasparc, who needs a box that is tied to running only one OS "

How often would you like your bank to switch the OS on the systems that manage your account transactions?

Re:Sun is not giving up on SPARC (0)

saintp (595331) | more than 8 years ago | (#13539561)

Actually, that's my roommate's job. When he does conversions, he routinely finishes early and spends the afternoon getting free beer from his boss.

So in summary: I don't give a damn. As often as they want.

Re:Sun is not giving up on SPARC (1)

moro_666 (414422) | more than 8 years ago | (#13539710)

a) last time i checked, sparc was supported by linux

b) can you show me a x86 box that has 64gb of memory ? nope ? /* 64 bits are cool, but you gotta use them too to make em worth it :p */

Sun should transition away from SPARC (1)

NatteringNabob (829042) | more than 8 years ago | (#13539409)

And hopefully the Galaxy boxes are the first step. I'd really like to see an UltraSPARC IVi chip in a Socket 940 package with hypertransport that would just drop into the Galaxy servers. That would indicate to me that Sun has finally climbed back on the clue train. Other than potentially being a vehicle for generating patents, Niagara and Rock don't look all that interesting to me. If we charitably assume that Niagara actually has specrate numbers that are 8 times as fast as the UltraSPARC IIIi, that only puts them in the same ballpark as a dual Opteron 275, and the Opteron boxes are shipping now.

Re:And it's based on Opterons... (5, Informative)

bradleycarpenter (703005) | more than 8 years ago | (#13539330)

There are not white boxes, they are in house boxes built from the ground up Andy Bechtolsheim. Supposedly sun is working on a 8 socket box...thus you could have 16 opterons cores running in one box. Very interesting future for Opteron and Sun.

Re:And it's based on Opterons... (1)

iggymanz (596061) | more than 8 years ago | (#13539424)

I can buy an 8 way x86-64 box here and now, why would I sit on my keister waiting for Sun to make one? For the pretty logo?

Re:And it's based on Opterons... (3, Insightful)

bradleycarpenter (703005) | more than 8 years ago | (#13539444)

Well, say you are a large corporation that only buys from Tier 1 manufactures. Sure joe schmo can go get one from random white box corporation, but in the corporate world they stick to specific suppliers that they have contracts and provide 24/7 support.

Re:And it's based on Opterons... (1)

saintp (595331) | more than 8 years ago | (#13539646)

HP DL740 [hp.com]

HP DL 760 [hp.com]

yes.... (3, Funny)

fuelvolts (852701) | more than 8 years ago | (#13539241)

...but does it have 64-bit drivers for my HP all-in-one printer?

Re:yes.... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#13539317)

Ummm, you may not be in their target market exactly...

Re:yes.... (1)

Mixel (723232) | more than 8 years ago | (#13539605)

You mean your HP all-in-one scanner... oh, wait.. according to this Free Download Techshow I am watching on my 6Ghz laptop, powered by a .... ... .. . .

specs available? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#13539243)

Are the hardware specs going to be available for the devices and cards used in these boxes? I'd love to port DragonFlyBSD to run on them. Perhaps I can glean the information required from the OpenSolaris code.

Re:specs available? (0, Flamebait)

planckscale (579258) | more than 8 years ago | (#13539285)

Most Fortune 500 companies use IIS webservers - running Solaris 10, or porting linux or BSD to these machines will probably continue to be the reason Sun loses market share to HP or Dell. Companies will continue to buy servers with MS OS's on them in greater quantities, don't you think?

Re:specs available? (3, Interesting)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#13539324)

Most Fortune 500 companies use IIS webservers

Care to show any statistics to back that up?

Re:specs available? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#13539488)

Web Server: http://www.port80software.com/surveys/top1000webse rvers/ [port80software.com]

Application Server: http://www.port80software.com/surveys/top1000appse rvers/ [port80software.com]

Re:specs available? (1)

BigForbis (757364) | more than 8 years ago | (#13539701)

Coincidently, that same company develops applications for IIS webservers, so therefore, I have a feeling there survey is biased towards the windows market since they want more people to switch to windows to keep them in business. "Port80 Software develops tools to enhance the security, performance and user experience of Microsoft's Internet Information Services (IIS) Web server. Simply put, we have combined business and programming expertise in Internet technologies to make IIS Web sites and applications safer, faster, and more user-friendly."

Re:specs available? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#13539318)

Junior writes: "I'd love to port DragonFlyBSD to run on them."

Maybe if you start finishing your chores on time, Mom will raise your allowance. Also, Burger King and McDonalds are always looking for good kids who want an after school job.

Sun 10 years from now (2, Interesting)

AnonymousYellowBelly (913452) | more than 8 years ago | (#13539245)

Do slashdot readers see Sun being relevant 10 years from now? Will they survive by selling 'mostly' software? I know they sell hardware, but they no longer control the full stack like IBM with POWER. Just a question.

Re:Sun 10 years from now (1, Insightful)

TweakMe (909676) | more than 8 years ago | (#13539280)

Sun. Is. Fux0red. Where's the value add?

Re:Sun 10 years from now (4, Informative)

ehovland (2915) | more than 8 years ago | (#13539423)

> Do slashdot readers see Sun being relevant 10 years from now?

It depends on whether you think Sun is turning the corner with these new servers. The original opteron line was basically a company on life support getting pretty much reference models out the door. While these machines show Sun's polish all over it. I think these servers compete well with HP and Dell's offering and they have Sun's polish. I am hopeful. But ten years is a long time from now.

> Will they survive by selling 'mostly' software?

Huh? This is a server line that runs Solaris or Linux. They are definitely still selling hardware and giving away the operating system.

> I know they sell hardware, but they no longer control the full stack like IBM with POWER.

Sun has almost never had control over the full stack. They sold you the hardware with a free (as in beer) operating system on it. Then you put on the application/server software. They might help you buy that application/server software. But they have never made it.

Re:Sun 10 years from now (1)

njcoder (657816) | more than 8 years ago | (#13539497)

"Then you put on the application/server software. They might help you buy that application/server software. But they have never made it."

Huh? There's the Java Enterprise System software stack. Many of the components, including the app server has been around for a while.

Re:Sun 10 years from now (1)

FST777 (913657) | more than 8 years ago | (#13539737)

I have been totaly unable to get Solaris installed on any x86-box I tried... But with their hardware, they could survive.

The value they could add to the market is their extreme robustness... Or at least let us believe that. They should however choose between Solaris + SPARC or pure and simple x86 (Opteron and Itanium are doing fine). With the latter I give them a good chance (running Linux, *BSD, Windows, whatever the customer chooses). With the former, they'll die. With a choice in-between, they'll die slowly.

Sparc will die anyway. Just as PowerPC will.

Re:Sun 10 years from now (2, Informative)

njcoder (657816) | more than 8 years ago | (#13539475)

" Do slashdot readers see Sun being relevant 10 years from now? Will they survive by selling 'mostly' software? I know they sell hardware, but they no longer control the full stack like IBM with POWER. Just a question."

Huh? This story is about a new line of servers and youq uestion if sone is selling mostly software!?!?! And you get modded interesting. I think it's pretty interesting that someone thinks it's a valid question.

These boxes are completely designed by Sun. Though the CPU is not manufactured by them they work together closely with AMD on the chip.

There's a good interview with Andy Bechtolsheim [eweek.com] that includes some of the details between the AMD/Sun relationship concerning opteron.

Re:Sun 10 years from now (0)

drgonzo59 (747139) | more than 8 years ago | (#13539509)

Microsoft, Oracle and others haven't done too badly selling "just software". So selling "mostly software" is part of selling "just software", so - "yes" it is _possible_ for them to survive. It all depends on what kind of software/hardware and how much software/how much hardware. Can they offer something different and better than IBM, HP, Dell, Microsoft and Intel? If so, they might be just fine in 10 years.

Re:Sun 10 years from now (4, Informative)

websaber (578887) | more than 8 years ago | (#13539738)

You would not believe how much sun junk financial companies have lying around. I am talking about I have worked in companies were they have racks and racks of maxed out 4500's (the ram alone can cost 20g) running a single process at low utilization. The advantage of sun is that they are the only company that has a unified industrial grade hardware /software system so financial companies will pay thru the nose for that peace of mind. One admin told me that the only reason they really still use sun is because that it pipes input and output thru the serial port from the second power is turned on. You can give all the TCO arguments in the world no body is going to care if they have to explain to the CEO why a billion dollar (Literally) transaction failed because two vendors blamed each other for a mistake. Until a Linux company REALLY gets it there will always be room for sun.

Suns have been 64 bit for a while now... (5, Insightful)

allanc (25681) | more than 8 years ago | (#13539246)

The UltraSPARC chips have been 64 bit for quite a while now. A more useful article summary would have pointed out the actual newsworthy bit of this story, which is that they're rolling out 64 bit x86 servers (running AMD Opterons).

Re:Suns have been 64 bit for a while now... (2, Insightful)

jellomizer (103300) | more than 8 years ago | (#13539501)

Well Slashdot readers in general are anti-Sun, Because they havent jumped head first in the Linux Bandwagon, but more like test the waters and take a step, and they also produce a competing OS to Linux, Which has some features and ability that is much better then Linux but we wont talk about those, which is not GNU compatible. So Sun has to be Evil. So what better way to post an article that makes Sun seem like a slow to react company then to say that they are just releasing 64 bit processors. While in truth they were one of the first.

Re:Suns have been 64 bit for a while now... (1)

freshman_a (136603) | more than 8 years ago | (#13539572)

Amen, brother. I so do wish I had mod points for you.

Come on, give people more credit then that.. (2, Funny)

cbreaker (561297) | more than 8 years ago | (#13539619)

Seriously, we all know Sparc is 64-bit, has been for some time. Most of us also know that they've dabbled in the Opteron processors not very long ago, and that these new servers are probably all Opterons.

If not, maybe you shouldn't be reading Slashdot. It's too technical for you. Go read C|Net.

Sky banners (3, Interesting)

Chmarr (18662) | more than 8 years ago | (#13539248)

Sun are really tooting their horn on this one. They paid for (presumably) a aircraft-towed banner to fly around the SF Bay today.

Haven't seen one of those in ages :)

Re:Sky banners (1)

suitepotato (863945) | more than 8 years ago | (#13539315)

Beaches in the northeast have them there all summer. Local radio stations mostly.

Re:Sky banners (1)

Chmarr (18662) | more than 8 years ago | (#13539472)

Perhaps they cost too much around here.

Re:Sky banners (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#13539560)

there used to be one of these flying around every Penn State game, mostly doing wedding proposals though, not tech company ads.

Re:Sky banners (1)

Infamous Tim (513490) | more than 8 years ago | (#13539589)

I imagine that Sun is acutally over every beach every single day, unless it's cloudy...

Re:Sky banners (1)

boristdog (133725) | more than 8 years ago | (#13539530)

There's one flying around Austin, TX right now, too. Mostly over AMD, for some reason.

Re:Sky banners (1)

j1bb3rj4bb3r (808677) | more than 8 years ago | (#13539566)

Sun are really tooting their horn on this one. They paid for (presumably) a aircraft-towed banner to fly around the SF Bay today.

Haven't seen one of those in ages :)


Yeah... not since the Solaris 10 launch when RedHat had one flying over San Jose that said "Just Another Day at Red Hat".

64-bitness (1, Insightful)

hkultala (69204) | more than 8 years ago | (#13539264)

All Sun's servers have been 64-bit for the last about 10 years. so why even mention the 64-bitness?

actually, it would be more a news if sun were to release a 32-bit server.

Re:64-bitness (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#13539291)

so why even mention the 64-bitness?

Because it's Slashdot, and because 64-bit automatically makes it 'leet'

Re:64-bitness (0)

burns210 (572621) | more than 8 years ago | (#13539526)

Because this is their first line of x86 64-bit servers from AMD. Their current 64-bit servers are all UltraSPARC.

Re:64-bitness (1, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#13539580)

Wrong.

SunFire V20z (2 socket) and SunFire V40z (4 socket) are AMD Opteron.

These new SunFire x4x00 servers are the FIRST SUN DESIGNED Opteron boxes.

Spells Death for the SPARC (4, Interesting)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#13539267)

The new Sun servers run on Opteron, an implementation of x86-64. These servers spell D.E.A.T.H. for the SPARC implementations.

The marketing talking head will claim that SPARC lives in Niagara and Rock, but note that Intel is now building a new x86-64 implementation that focuses on multicores just like Niagara and Rock. Given a choice between Niagara/Rock and Intel's/AMD's new multicore chips, most customers will prefer the latter.

The only future remaining for the SPARC is in esoteric highend systems built by Fujitsu and destined for simulating weather, nuclear explosions, and overpopulation.

Re:Spells Death for the SPARC (1)

iggymanz (596061) | more than 8 years ago | (#13539340)

and why couldn't soon-to-be released Intel and AMD based systems also be doing those "esoteric highend systems" jobs? Once we get into 32-way and up whether by 8 chips with quad cores or whatever, I don't see UltraSparc being too cost effective or useful.

Re:Spells Death for the SPARC (1, Interesting)

saintp (595331) | more than 8 years ago | (#13539474)

SPARC == Alpha

Sun has started down a long road of realization that their proprietary chips aren't worth the silicon they're printed on in a marketplace that values interoperability over nearly all else. HP realized this a while back, and have all but phased out their Alpha and PA-RISC lines.

That said, there is a place for non-x86 chips. HP has replaced most of their Alpha and PA-RISC lines with x86 chips, but some of the high-end boxes went to Itanium. IBM is still pushing POWER -- hard. I don't suspect that SPARC will die, but I do strongly suspect that, in 5 or 10 years, Solaris on x86 will be the standard and Solaris on SPARC will be the rare beast, still grinding away in a handful of data centers on Wall Street, right next to an HP box running Non-Stop OS.

However, depending on where Sun takes Solaris on x86, they could turn it into a huge market. They're already working on certifying most HP server hardware and, AFAIK, have their sights set on the server hardware of other major manufacturers as well. If Sun could make Solaris as easy to install anywhere as Linux or NetBSD (okay, so that's a bit of stretch), and if they keep giving it away for free, they could see sizable growth in their OS market.

The problem, of course, is that it's hard to make money off of a free OS, but, if you've been listening to Sun's web expos over the past year or so, you know that they label Redhat, somewhat strangely, as one of their primary competitors. Sun is obviously trying to stress their free OS; my question is whether or not they're trying to go too many ways at once. Sun provides not only a free OS, but also tons of enterprise software for it, plus hardware based on two different processing platforms. They're competing with Redhat, Novell, and HP all at once, and that's tough to do without stretching one's self too thin.

My prediction: if Sun is still a player in 10 years, it will be a very different Sun than we see today.

Re:Spells Death for the SPARC (1)

saintp (595331) | more than 8 years ago | (#13539689)

That's a troll? Man, /. is getting weird. I miss the days when GNAA and goatse links were trolls. Seems like this guy [slashdot.org] (who has been modded up to +4 as of this post) was dead wrong on which way the ./ community leans when it comes to Sun.

Re:Spells Death for the SPARC (4, Interesting)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#13539410)

These new Galaxy servers; x4100 & x4200 (x2100 was code named Aquarius and isn't an identical design to the Galaxy architecture) are mainly aimed at grids, we can put 32 of these dual socket, dual core servers into one rack and have a 128-way grid.

When the Niagara based servers are released we'll have a 1 socket, 8 core, 4 threads per core server which in a 32 server rack gives us a 1024-way grid in one rack ...

Now, the Niagara CPUs performance (specifically floating point performance) is lower than Opteron (Sun have made no secret of that) but for heavily threaded/moderate computation workloads, a grid of Niagara CPUs looks like a very interesting proposition.

Rock is rumoured to be SMP capable so rather than building grids of these boxes running seperate OS instances you are able to build 1024-way (maybe more) SMP servers with significantly less power consumption and much higher performance/watt and performance/$ than existing SMP (from ANY company) in a footprint that is a fraction of the size of current highend servers and mainframes.

I wouldn't say SPARC is dead yet, it might have been a bit ill for a while there, but it's on it's way back.

Re:Spells Death for the SPARC (2, Insightful)

SiliconJesus (1407) | more than 8 years ago | (#13539469)

Sun has had x86 servers for a while. It has had no effect on their SPARC sales, nor will it in the future. People who buy Sun will continue to purchace their SPARC servers until they discontinue making them. I'd be willing to say with the SPARC IV's coming out soon, that Sun is in no hurry to switch off their home platform.

Re:Spells Death for the SPARC (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#13539483)

SPARC IVs (dual core SPARC V9s) have been shipping for months and the speed-bumped, high-cached USIV+ started shipping a few weeks ago.

Re:Spells Death for the SPARC (1)

jedidiah (1196) | more than 8 years ago | (#13539705)

Sun has had weak-ass, Apple style x86 servers for awhile. Of course something like that isn't going to cannibalize sales of 4, 8 and 128 cpu boxes.

Re:Spells Death for the SPARC (1)

vasqzr (619165) | more than 8 years ago | (#13539521)

The new Sun servers run on Opteron, an implementation of x86-64. These servers spell D.E.A.T.H. for the SPARC implementations

Just the AMD based systems are 64-bit doesn't mean they'll replace the SPARC systems.

Re:Spells Death for the SPARC (2, Interesting)

ValourX (677178) | more than 8 years ago | (#13539578)

AMD64 may outperform SPARC at a lower price when you're talking about a 4-CPU system, but how many 128-CPU Opteron servers do you see? Only POWER and UltraSPARC can do that as far as I know. Maybe low-end SPARC workstations will die out, but high-end servers will always need serious superscalar RISC processors.

-Jem

Re:Spells Death for the SPARC (1)

jedidiah (1196) | more than 8 years ago | (#13539734)

You're forgetting Itanium.

Linux based Itanium servers from SGI are the biggest Unix servers on the planet.

128 cpus? Why think so small?

Review over at Anandtech (4, Interesting)

Rufus211 (221883) | more than 8 years ago | (#13539297)

Anandtech has a quick review [anandtech.com] of the X2100 up. Fairly standard, but well designed server it looks like. The big news is the entry level one for only $745. True it doesn't come with a HD, but that's still a hell of a deal for a true server (not a dell desktop box lets call it a server).

Re:Review over at Anandtech (1)

saintp (595331) | more than 8 years ago | (#13539494)

<yoda>Mmm, well designed server it looks like.</yoda>

Re:Review over at Anandtech (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#13539502)

not a dell desktop box lets call it a server

What makes you sure that this isn't a "Taiwanese motherboard in a purple box lets call it a server"?

Miracle machine! (2, Insightful)

Bake (2609) | more than 8 years ago | (#13539551)

This must be some miracle machine. From the linked article..
The two hard drives can be setup for RAID 0, 1 or 10 via the BIOS.

Now, it may be a few years since I took classes in college that touched on various RAID levels, but one thing that I DO remember is that RAID 10 requires a minimum of 4 physical drives...

Re:Miracle machine! (1)

bajan_on_ice (32348) | more than 8 years ago | (#13539706)

This is true, but I cant imagine that is a purpose that Sun intented for these machines. A $750 single CPU opteron (with its base config being diskless) has really only one place, in very large grids. In that sort of environment, RAID 0+1 doesnt really fit, since it increases the price of the server (fast disks get expensive when you have to buy four of em), while not really buying you anything performance-wise.

I suspect the 0+1 functionality is a leftover of the Tyan mobo that they use in this box.

X4100 Review at InfoWorld (3, Informative)

PCM2 (4486) | more than 8 years ago | (#13539634)

InfoWorld also got an early look at the X4100, [infoworld.com] though the review doesn't specify that model number because it hadn't even been announced yet. The price tag is ten times more than that of the X2100 the parent mentions, but as far as I understand it, the X2100 is pretty much an Asian white-box system. It's the X4100 and X4200 systems, a 1U and 2U respectively, that are Sun's new flagship custom designs. The big news is that InfoWorld's reviewers actually seem to have some fairly complementary things to say about them, which hasn't always been the case for Sun's AMD hardware in the past.

Favorite line... (3, Funny)

Otter (3800) | more than 8 years ago | (#13539302)

Sun used to dominate the financial industry, but lost its edge during the dot-com era, according to Singer.

"We weren't paying attention, we got distracted by all these people with pierced body parts and blue hair," he said. "We missed changes in the marketplace. It's very distracting to grow at 60 percent per quarter and very humbling to have it disappear. We're now paying attention to Wall Street again."

64bit servers nothing new for Sun...SPARC or x86 (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#13539323)

Hasn't Sun had 64bit SPARC *and* AMD servers for quite some time now? (SPARC longer, obviously). This is like HP rolling out a new line of Proliant servers, no? Hardly news.

They have succeeded with me (0, Offtopic)

Weaselmancer (533834) | more than 8 years ago | (#13539326)

Woo!

No, no, no, no. (5, Insightful)

Karma_fucker_sucker (898393) | more than 8 years ago | (#13539333)

"We weren't paying attention, we got distracted by all these people with pierced body parts and blue hair," he said. "We missed changes in the marketplace. It's very distracting to grow at 60 percent per quarter and very humbling to have it disappear. We're now paying attention to Wall Street again."

Where bold insert Customer

That's simialr to Digital's downfall. They built some of the best computers in the world, thinking if we build it they will come. But it wasn't what the customers wanted. The same goes for catering to Wall Street. They want short term quick earnings growth; not necessarily long term custoemr growth. That may not be be conducive to achieving a product line that will last and the customers will even want.

Re:No, no, no, no. (2, Informative)

HairyCanary (688865) | more than 8 years ago | (#13539598)

Didn't RTFA did ya? When they say they're paying attention to Wall Street, they don't mean as investors. They mean Wall Street as customers.

Re:No, no, no, no. (1, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#13539636)

That's not what the quote means-- although I see your confusion. He's trying to say that: "We're trying to address the technology needs of Wall Street customers." Selling to large ($100M+ USD per year in Sun sales) Wall Street companies is one of Sun's traditional strengths-- this includes Wall Street infrastructure players, who have nothing to do with recommending stocks. Those companies have large and sophisticated IT organizations with worldwide reach. I'm sure there is consideration of a "halo effect"-- if your boxes power Wall Street, then Wall Street will be good to you. But I think that's pretty secondary.

Hey look! (-1, Troll)

blair1q (305137) | more than 8 years ago | (#13539337)

Only 10 years behind DEC...

Troll but (1)

Karma_fucker_sucker (898393) | more than 8 years ago | (#13539394)

True. (TM)

v20z/v40z? (1)

OnyxRaven (9906) | more than 8 years ago | (#13539348)

Am I correct in assuming these lines will replace the v20z and v40z servers, which have very similar specs?

The v[24]0z servers were not manufactured by Sun themselves, and they've mentioned that they're working on their own version.

I love my v20z servers - they are a great alternative to the crap Dell calls 1U servers. I hope these are as good, and maybe a little better supported.

Re:v20z/v40z? (1)

SrJsignal (753163) | more than 8 years ago | (#13539588)

My guess is no. The 20Z and 40Z are more full-featured type servers. These guys are stripped down, "transactional computing" type servers. Also the 40Z is available with 4-dual core processors which makes it more attractive than these guys. It looks like for scientific computing SPARC replacements the Vx0z servers will still be the way to go. I'm still looking over the information, but this looks mostly like non-news to me. Sun has been making x86 - 64 bit servers for awhile now.

Re:v20z/v40z? (1)

angaram (875805) | more than 8 years ago | (#13539663)

I've worked with a v40z. Very impressive. I was surprised at how little l2/l3 cache was available when compared to the counterpart IBM POWER offerings. Currently it maxes out at 32GB of RAM, but supposedly they will have a BIOS update in a while that will let it go up to 64GB, and will allow dual-core Opterons, for a total of 8-ways.

K8SE (1, Interesting)

StupidApe (736137) | more than 8 years ago | (#13539357)

The all-new-sun-designed product is actually the Tyan K8E with a couple of parts removed.

How about 64 bit java? (4, Interesting)

wheelbarrow (811145) | more than 8 years ago | (#13539360)

Does this mean that Sun will get serious about supporting a good 64 bit java for these systems? Java systems application design could change radically if somebody can provide a 64 bit JVM that can process efficient garbage collection across very large java heap spaces.

I love the bit in the article (1, Interesting)

multiplexo (27356) | more than 8 years ago | (#13539365)

where one of the Sun execs says that Sun got disttracted by the dot.com boom and all of those people with blue hair and piercings. Nice try at revisionism coming from someone who works for a company that at one point claimed to be the dot in dot.com. If you were to put hardware companies on trial for hyping the dot.com boom then Sun would be number one in the dock.

The biggest problem I foresee for Sun in competing with Dell is simple, Suns don't run Windows and they don't run Linux. Dell makes nice, solid boxes, they're not imaginative by any stretch, but they work well and reliably and perform decently. One of the nice things that Dell does is that they quote you the price of the service contract in the initial purchase price for the system. Compare and contrast this with Sun and HP who basically say "service, hey, you bought it, the check cleared and if it stops working then come see us about a service contract (which we will charge you up the wazoo for)".

But back to that Windows thing, it's nice to be able to take a Dell and repurpose it from being a Linux system to a Windows system or vice versa. This helped me out this year with a project I was working on, the project was delayed and one of the Windows admins I worked with needed a new box PDQ. So I gave him my quad proc Dell which he put to good use right away and he ordered me a replacement off of his budget. In a mixed environment, which we're all working now, being able to do this is a major plus. If I buy a bunch of shiny new Suns not only am I locked into Solaris (which is painful to use after working on Linux for so many years) but I'm also locked into that hardware. If you have Suns already and want to stay with them then perhaps these systems make sense, but if you've started bringing Linux into your environment then why are you going to go back to Solaris?

Re:I love the bit in the article (4, Informative)

bradleycarpenter (703005) | more than 8 years ago | (#13539387)

Um, they are opteron servers. They run Windows/Linux fine, and any other OS that works on x86. In fact Sun now has a support contract that provides windows support.

Re:I love the bit in the article (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#13539439)

Your post is absolutely wrong. Sun x64 boxes run Windows, Linux, and Solaris. We run all three of those OS's on our V20zs.

Sun's x86 servers are certified to run Windows, Redhat Enterprise Linux, Suse, and Solaris.

http://www.sun.com/servers/entry/x4100/support.jsp [sun.com]

Re:I love the bit in the article (1)

assantisz (881107) | more than 8 years ago | (#13539504)

Where have you been? All Intel/AMD products by Sun have been capable of running Windows from day one on. They even offer technical support for Windows now.

Re:I love the bit in the article (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#13539506)

The cheaper Sun boxes based on IA32 runs Windows just fine, it's just that you can't get support on the OS from Sun.

They also run Linux just fine, and Sun supports that.

If you think that Solaris is painful to use but Linux is nice and dandy I question your sanity. I can run any binary from 2.6 on Solaris 10 on my shiny old Sun, something which not can be said about Linux.

hey no offense, but... (4, Informative)

mihalis (28146) | more than 8 years ago | (#13539531)

you're wrong on every point. Seriously!

Suns don't run Windows and they don't run Linux

Actually, these new machines run Solaris, Linux and Windows - they are even on WHQL. They are the second-gen of Sun's AMD based x86-64 machines, and there were some intel x86-32 based systems before that, so arguably they are on their 3d or 4th gen of machines which can run Windows, if you like.

Compare and contrast this with Sun and HP who basically say "service, hey, you bought it, the check cleared and if it stops working then come see us about a service contract (which we will charge you up the wazoo for)".

Sun always quotes multiple service contract prices right there on the web page when you order the hardware (different levels of service).

Re:I love the bit in the article (1)

saintp (595331) | more than 8 years ago | (#13539545)

Dude, if you can't even figure out how to buy a service contract with your hardware, you sure as hell shouldn't be managing any system more powerful than a toaster.

Sun x64 Servers DO Run Windows and Linux (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#13539552)

Sun's AMD Opteron server do Run Windows and Linux.

Sun's x64 servers are on the Windows Hardware Compatability List (HCL). Sun support is also available for Sun x64 systems running Windows.

Sun has been a reseller of Red Hat Linux for some time now.

Sun has done benchmarks on its x64 servers running both Linux and Windows for some time now.

Re:I love the bit in the article (2, Informative)

j1bb3rj4bb3r (808677) | more than 8 years ago | (#13539624)

The biggest problem I foresee for Sun in competing with Dell is simple, Suns don't run Windows and they don't run Linux

are you on crack?
The Galaxy boxes run Solaris, Linux, or Windoze.
The current Opterons do as well.
RTFA.

why is gross misinformation being modded up as Interesting???

Re:I love the bit in the article (1)

saintp (595331) | more than 8 years ago | (#13539735)

For the same reason that interesting [slashdot.org] stuff [slashdot.org] is getting modded down [slashdot.org] as troll. The mods are on crack.

Re:I love the bit in the article (1, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#13539630)

Umm... sun's do run windows and linux, and we've been seeing a huge influx at my place of employment of support calls for sun boxes that are running everything under the sun (excuse the pun.. and the rhyming). Anyways, at least from my small sample study, Sun is making a lot of headway with these opteron servers, and I mean a LOT... calls for dell based machines has tanked and sun has taken their spot. This is fibre channel related support btw, so it's in the large business/enterprise.

Re:I love the bit in the article (1)

sysadmn (29788) | more than 8 years ago | (#13539664)

Not sure where you got the "don't run windows and don't run linux" bit. I bought Redhat ES from Sun, and it ran fine on a V20z (Opteron). A coworker installed Windows Server, had a few glitches, but found a solution online.

Let's hope they run better than the W2100z WS (4, Informative)

jasonmicron (807603) | more than 8 years ago | (#13539376)

Let's hope that they run better than the W2100z workstations. Dual Opteron 250 processors and 16 gigs of RAM (at least the model that my company bought) and all we have had so far is horrendous problems.

4 BIOS updates later and the problems have dwindled a bit but we constantly get BSP error messages on boot up and random DIMM error messages during POST (on both sockets and chips that have been thoroughly tested and known to be good). Daughter processor cards have been bad as well (already replaced 4 in a batch of 40 which, according to Sun is "acceptable rate of failure").

Their latest BIOS update (version R01_B4_S2, released last month) does resolve the frequency of some of these errors but now we have machines that lock up on that BIOS release but not previous ones.

I only post this because the chips are Opteron 250s by AMD (64-bit) and the main board is another AMD.

Based on my experience with these workstations I wouldn't touch anything put out by Sun until they can get a quality control department set up and running anything with AMD chips.

Re:Let's hope they run better than the W2100z WS (5, Funny)

hkb (777908) | more than 8 years ago | (#13539585)

Standard Slashdot Response:

You obviously don't know how to admin Linux you fucking cluebie, go back to Windows. Oh, Solaris? Sun sucks, use Linux.

+3 Funny

Re:Let's hope they run better than the W2100z WS (1)

jasonmicron (807603) | more than 8 years ago | (#13539632)

Haha.

But these problems are mostly during POST so the OS has nothing to do with it.

By the way, Red Hat Enterprise Linux 3 is our OS of choice on these machines. We're staying away from Solaris. :p

Re:Let's hope they run better than the W2100z WS (2, Informative)

j1bb3rj4bb3r (808677) | more than 8 years ago | (#13539644)

Let's hope that they run better than the W2100z workstations.

They should... they are entirely different boxes. The new ones are from the acquisition of Kealia (Andy Bechtolsheim's startup).

this post reminded me... (0, Troll)

jackstack (618328) | more than 8 years ago | (#13539401)

of how silly Sun's logo is

Re:this post reminded me... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#13539482)

Why?

Microsoft Windows is fully supported by Sun, too (5, Informative)

assantisz (881107) | more than 8 years ago | (#13539428)

Sun also offers full technical support for Microsoft Windows on their hardware. See this [sun.com] for more info.

Re:Microsoft Windows is fully supported by Sun, to (1, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#13539496)

(follows link)
**head explodes**

More proof that AMD is on fire (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#13539547)


The story of the year isn't Sun, HP or Dell servers. The story is definitely AMD. A week doesn't go by when we don't hear about AMD being on the warpath.

Its about time.

One CPU world (1)

VincenzoRomano (881055) | more than 8 years ago | (#13539550)

It seems that our world is dominated by only one CPU: the Intel-like ones.
HP (formerly Compaq, formerly Digital) definitely buried the Alpha [wikipedia.org] RISC CPU roadmap. As well as its own HP/PA [wikipedia.org] (another RISC corpse).
It is not clear whether IBM's PowerPC [wikipedia.org] architecture will have a future other than the one in the gaming consoles with the Cell Architecture [ibm.com] , now that even Apple is jumping onto the x86 cart.
Sun is throwing its SPARC [wikipedia.org] technology ot of the window as we can read in the above announcement.
Lack of diversity will lead to a slow down in the overall computing technology evolution.
But there is still some hope, as declared into the The Book of Mozilla, 7:15 [about] (Only availabe to selected believers).

woo customers? (2, Funny)

blanks (108019) | more than 8 years ago | (#13539575)

"servers represent the company's bid to woo customers, particularly the financial industry sector, away from rival server vendors Hewlett-Packard and Dell."

So these severs will be faster then most intel based processors with a lower price tag?

Didn't think so.

Re:woo customers? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#13539711)

"So these severs will be faster then most intel based processors with a lower price tag?"

Uh, yeah . . . . . up to 3x the performance at as low as 1/3 the price. Intel chokes on the big bone yet again . . . .
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