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Mandriva Linux 2006 Released

CowboyNeal posted about 9 years ago | from the hot-off-the-burners dept.

Mandriva 190

mhrivnak writes "Today, Mandriva Linux 2006 was released to Club members, and the tree will be publicly available on October 13. New features include the Kat Desktop Search Environment, an interactive firewall, and enhanced wifi support with Mandriva being the only Linux distribution certified for Centrino hardware. The integration of technology from Conectiva and Lycoris has led to improved installation (in 40+ languages), better package management, and quicker boot time."

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You mean released today, right? (5, Insightful)

ReformedExCon (897248) | about 9 years ago | (#13737908)

After all, it is just Linux, so it should be covered by the GPL. Any "club members" who want to can upload a torrent.

Or is there some aspects of the system that aren't GPL and can't be uploaded?

Re:You mean released today, right? (1, Interesting)

Anonymous Coward | about 9 years ago | (#13737918)

Dont understand this certified shit. Dont they use the same kernel as everybody else or the they have special modules made from intel??

Re:You mean released today, right? (3, Insightful)

soikoban (152341) | about 9 years ago | (#13737937)

Certifications usually cost money. No money == no certification.

Re:You mean released today, right? (4, Informative)

arivanov (12034) | about 9 years ago | (#13738533)

Intel will not allow you to use Centrino BRANDING if you cannot deliver the battery life and WiFi features promissed by Intel Marketing in the Centrino marketing campaign shots. This essentially means that you cannot mention the name Centrino in any of your promotional literature, adverts and compliance statements.

In order to comply with this spec (and use the name)you must have a system that is capable to use runtime frequency alteration and do it effectively enough to deliver the battery life promissed for an average load. No linux kernel prior to 2.6.7 can do it. 2.6.9-2.6.11 with a correctly configured cpufreqd gets close, but not quite enough. If you want to really do it you need to have the on-demand CPUfreq kernel policy manager working. Which means IIRC 2.6.12+ or a heavy dose of backported patches. Further to that you have to have Intel wifi drivers and improvements to the 802.11 stack which are not mainline kernel yet.

There are also a few other conditions, but these are the important ones.

Frankly, the only reason to get through all this idiocy is if there is a laptop manufacturer there waiting to start shipping Linux as an option on their laptops. Wonder who this is...

Re:You mean released today, right? (3, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | about 9 years ago | (#13737988)

The images available to silver and above members contain proprietary programs like Sun's Java, drivers, Flash and other Adobe Acrobats, which are free as beer but not as speech, and cannot be legally redistributed.
So it is legal to redistribute the first 4 CDs, but not the whole shebang.

I guess the distributions that get away with 'freely' distributing those are simply low-profile enough to not fear the lawyers (and yes, PCLinux OS or Buffalo Linux for example are low-profile, commercially speaking).

Re:You mean released today, right? (1)

ammoQ (454616) | about 9 years ago | (#13738232)

I can't imagine why Sun, Realmedia or Adobe would care enough to send lawyers after people "pirating" Java, Flashplayer or Adobe Reader,
since all this applications are available for free download anyway.

Re:You mean released today, right? (1, Insightful)

prr56 (661675) | about 9 years ago | (#13738305)

Ohh, you mean like on my Gentoo install I just can't "emerge nvidia-kernel" for free but have to pay to get the same as on Mancrap? No thanks, sparky. I'll never understand Mandrake-Mandrivel's approach to this issue. I used to be a Silver Club member when they were on the brink of fiscal death, and I thought that I would reap some benefit from it, but alas I could get the same everywhere else. I think this is just a scheme to pimp money from the users. Your OP's may vary, but mine don't.

Re:You mean released today, right? (5, Informative)

timbo234 (833667) | about 9 years ago | (#13738028)

Or is there some aspects of the system that aren't GPL and can't be uploaded?

Yep. The powerpack versions (either the full DVD or 7 CD set) contain closed-source software and aren't redistrutable. The 4CD version (1 more than the publicly available download version) that's available to the lowest level of club membership should be alright though.

As always with Mandrake all the software available in the powerpack, except the closed-source stuff, and more is available through the mirrors listed at http://easyurpmi.zarb.org/ [zarb.org]

Re:You mean released today, right? (4, Informative)

imr (106517) | about 9 years ago | (#13738124)

The CDs available to standard club membres now countains the proprietary drivers. It's not equivalent to the download edition that should hit the mirrors in 2 weeks.
The standard members complained that they didnt get much for their 60$/ and have been listened to.

In Soviet Russia (-1)

Anonymous Coward | about 9 years ago | (#13737909)

Mandriva changes name to mandrake!

Yawn... (2, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | about 9 years ago | (#13737910)

This time of morning... if it doesn't make coffee, I don't want to know about it.

KAT (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 9 years ago | (#13737911)

"Kat is similar to the Windows application Google Desktop Search and the Mac OSX utility Spotlight. It is completely written in C++, using Qt3, KDE and KIO libraries." Lets see how it fares...

Re:KAT (1)

RiotXIX (230569) | about 9 years ago | (#13737978)

Yeah, I just read this about KAT, and had a look at the google desktop search bar thing (I don't use it). Could someone please fill me in - do either of these two tools offer any additional functionality over grep, find/locate?

Re:KAT (1)

Professor S. Brown (780963) | about 9 years ago | (#13738020)

I don't know about KAT, but Spotlight on OSX (and the indexing service on Windows) gives huge advantages over grep. For one, they are orders of magnitude quicker. Secondly, specific importers are used to index specific file types, so you aren't restricted to plain text searches. For instance, I could write an importer that performs voice recognition or OCR.

Re:KAT (4, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | about 9 years ago | (#13738036)

KAT is similar to Google Desktop Search -- it needs to build a huge database before being able to search -- and that takes time and HD space. (It takes multiple hours on my AMD64 to index my 20GB Home directory). After indexing however, Kat's pretty instantaneous to search (it takes a few seconds to search for a phrase inside my home directory -- not bad at all! That's the advantage over grep/find/locate, not to mention that these tools can't search inside PDF's or ODT/SXW's without a struggle!

Compared to Beagle, I have to rank it below. Beagle searches virtually instantaneously with the help of Extended Attributes, with no need for a giant search index.

Re:KAT (2, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | about 9 years ago | (#13738348)

I have to refute this. Beagle does not use extended attributes for searching. It uses a (possibly equally large) lucene repository for that.
Beagle, like Kat, uses bxtended attributes for remembering what files have already been indexed to avoid to reindex them.

Re:KAT (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 9 years ago | (#13738079)

Speed (always instant) and searching in binary files whose format grep does not understand (such as PDFs).

Damn, Linux is fast (5, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | about 9 years ago | (#13737912)

It's not even 2006 and Linux is already there.

Re:Damn, Linux is fast (1)

Al_Lapalme (698542) | about 9 years ago | (#13738012)

I never understood why cars are like that...

:Sighs: (1, Funny)

TubeSteak (669689) | about 9 years ago | (#13738051)

Its GNU/Linux dammit

GNU GNU GNU

:Starts tearing out his hair:

I've spelled it out for you, but there's going to be several hundred posts that only say "Linux"

:Stallman starts pounding his head against a wall, hoping everyone else will follow along:
G......N......U....../......L......I...... N......U......X

Re::Sighs: (0)

m4dm4n (888871) | about 9 years ago | (#13738109)

What did you say? Linux?

Re::Sighs: (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 9 years ago | (#13738130)

It says Mandiva Linux right in the title, and no slash. Get with the program.

Re::Sighs: (2, Insightful)

jellomizer (103300) | about 9 years ago | (#13738219)

But is everything part of this distribution GNU? Or does it have apache?

RMS is actually quite wrong about it. He just want to gain attention by saying it should be called GNU/Linux Linux is the kernel the Operating system is actually different from each version. I think in order to have an Operating System called GNU Linux all the parts need to be GNU not just some of the parts. RMS needs an other hobbie something that will help him release some of the stress in his life, maybe he should take voice lessons or something, or skiing. If not having you license as part of a name really makes you annoyed you should reconsider your life.

Re::Sighs: (3, Insightful)

Nasarius (593729) | about 9 years ago | (#13738350)

No no no. The operating system is more than just the kernel, but it does not encompass everything in the distro. In particular, glibc is a crucial part of the OS. That said, "Linux" has come to mean any Linux-based OS, so RMS will just have to deal.

You can say what you want (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 9 years ago | (#13737928)

But Mandriva is still the easiest Lunix distros, and it comes with everything most people would need. They're one of the few distros I'd raise a glass to.

Interactive firewall ? (4, Funny)

HawkingMattress (588824) | about 9 years ago | (#13737931)

Knock knock, can i enter ?
I'm sorry sir, but i've been charged to disallow any bad guy to enter this particular port 25.
Uh bad news, but i have a very important message to send my grandma, and couldn't find any open relay to send it to her. it's a matter of life and death.
mmmmmm i see, since i'm not in a bad mood i'll let you pass this time but %@dùù%ù^$
Broadcast message from root (pts/6) :
The system is going down for system halt NOW!

What next... (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | about 9 years ago | (#13737933)

...do we get EA TRAX with a soundtrack by Lil' John?

Great day for linux (0, Redundant)

darteaga (806257) | about 9 years ago | (#13737936)

With the release of the big three* user oriented linux distros: SUSE 10.0, Mandriva 2006 and the RC of Ubuntu 5.10.

(*) No flame intended.

Re:Great day for linux (1)

thebdj (768618) | about 9 years ago | (#13738103)

Actually by DistroWatch [distrowatch.com] the big three [distrowatch.com] in order are: Ubuntu, Mandriva and Fedora Core. I personally run FC3 on my laptop, but think I will switch to Mandriva once this goes public. I've been looking for some excuse to change and it has been a while since I ran Mandrake/Mandriva.

Re:Great day for linux (3, Informative)

a.different.perspect (817184) | about 9 years ago | (#13738254)

Actually, according to DistroWatch [distrowatch.com] , the top ten distributions are:

1 Ubuntu 2724
2 Mandriva 1739
3 SUSE 1415
4 Fedora 1268
5 MEPIS 1115
6 KNOPPIX 931
7 Debian 888
8 Damn Small 679
9 Gentoo 612
10 Slackware 597

Perhaps my counting skilz are not as honed as yours. Really, though, DistroWatch visitors are notoriously fickle, and the rankings for the distributions in #2-4 usually depend on how long ago their last release was. Expect to see Mandriva's numbers soar shortly, and Fedora's to decline further, at least until FC5.

Re:Great day for linux (1)

thebdj (768618) | about 9 years ago | (#13738341)

No, I just use 12 month numbers because it evens out the jumps that occur when a new version of a distro releases. Granted on the 12 month Suse and FC are close anyway.

rsbac (0, Interesting)

Anonymous Coward | about 9 years ago | (#13737947)

it has rsbac :)
http://www.rsbac.org/ [rsbac.org]

Mandriva 2006 on Mini ITX? (4, Interesting)

deno (814) | about 9 years ago | (#13737950)

I'm currently downloading the M2006, and I wonder how will it work with SP8000 mini-ITX motherboard.

It took me a while to decide upon actually buying such a slow system, but I presume it will be fast enough for a job at hand, which is: "quietly sit in my living room, act as a web, DynDNS, login and file server for my local network, and do the multimedia stuff when needed (mp3, TV, DVDs and DivX).

The problem is that VIA doesn't really play nicely with Linux, and one had to do quite a lot of work on his own in the past before getting a reasonably well working system. Wonder how much work has been done in this direction (if any) by Mandriva folks since 2005LE?

Re:Mandriva 2006 on Mini ITX? (1)

Nailer (69468) | about 9 years ago | (#13738107)

The problem is that VIA doesn't really play nicely with Linux, and one had to do quite a lot of work on his own in the past before getting a reasonably well working system.

Conversely, how much work have the VIA guys done?
It's their responsibility to write, or pay someone to write, their drivers. If you find them either non-existant or lacking, vote with your dollars.

Yes, this isn't an answer to your question, and no, I don't have one. Just making a point, hope you don't mind.

Re:Mandriva 2006 on Mini ITX? (4, Interesting)

imr (106517) | about 9 years ago | (#13738160)

Well, there is a lot done by via toward linux and open source.
More than other at least.

There are drivers that are released, some are even free and concern their graphic adapters.
I think this is part of one of their strategy which is to take a big part of the asian market where there is a demand for low cost low end solutions.
They are also very interrested in low energy solutions for the same reasons.

I kinda think they are wiser than some other who rely on selling high end more power hungry closed solutions in a world where oil price and therefore electricity prices are going to rise.

I go weekly there:
http://www.viaarena.com/ [viaarena.com]
to find infos about this very interresting company. They even have tutorials for installing their new drivers on Mandriva and Fedora over there.

Nope, I don't have shares or anything.

Re:Mandriva 2006 on Mini ITX? (1)

imr (106517) | about 9 years ago | (#13738135)

Are you THE deno from mandrake's club of old days?

Re:Mandriva 2006 on Mini ITX? (1)

zogger (617870) | about 9 years ago | (#13738178)

I've never tried it, but Beatrix linux [watsky.net] claims to be originally optimized for Via mini-itx mobos/cpus.

Re:Mandriva 2006 on Mini ITX? (1)

SCHecklerX (229973) | about 9 years ago | (#13738499)

Huh? Doesn't play nicely how? I'm using VIA PD10000's for linux firewalls all over the place where I work (including as branch office IPSec gateways). They work flawlessly. Granted, that isn't desktop use (no video), but for what I am using them for they can't be beat. And this is on basically a stock Redhat 8 distro.

Its too soon. (2, Insightful)

Zombie Ryushu (803103) | about 9 years ago | (#13737955)

Its too soon. This version of Mandriva still has Mozilla FireFox 1.0.6, with backported patches. I would have waited until Christmas. I would have waited to refine some more. I think they moved too fast on this. I think that major work should have been done on Heimdal Kerberos Support. Because better LDAP backend support for Kerberos is critical to doing thinngs like Linux's "Almost but not quite" Active Directory.

Re:Its too soon. (1)

timbo234 (833667) | about 9 years ago | (#13738037)

This version of Mandriva still has Mozilla FireFox 1.0.6, with backported patches.

Which is exactly the same as having 1.0.7 AFAICT. They freeze the version number and backport so they can keep a consistent updates policy.

Re:Its too soon. (3, Interesting)

buchanmilne (258619) | about 9 years ago | (#13738235)

This version of Mandriva still has Mozilla FireFox 1.0.6

Why are version numbers important? Do you check the version number of every single package you use, and always update it even if it is one point release behind?

Realise that a distribution has a release schedule, and usually that involves imposing a version freeze, to prevent new bugs creeping into an otherwise well-understood release (with it's known bugs that must still be fixed etc). Regressions have occured in Firefox releases ... so there is no reason Firefox should be exempt (though the Firefox team seems to believe all linux distros should treat Firefox differently to the other 5000 packages they ship).

I think that major work should have been done on Heimdal Kerberos Support

So do I, but there are more important issues. And, since we don't build any packages against the heimdal libraries at present ... it's easy enough to provide updated packages for the distro later.

Because better LDAP backend support for Kerberos is critical to doing thinngs like Linux's "Almost but not quite" Active Directory.

Well, part of that requires a stable, supported LDAP server, which was one of those more important issues. The OpenLDAP packages we ship are quite decent, and all packages were rebuilt against the new major version, plus we are committed to shipping updates as 2.3.x matures (although most users of 2.3.x seem to find it more stable than 2.2.x already).

Of course, real "Active Directory" features will come with samba4, which won't be available any time this year.

So, delaying the release for one aspect would not compare to the commercial comittments Mandriva has to shipping this release in time for stocking shelves ahead of the festive season.

But, the work in preparation for samba4 will continue, and as always [warwick.ac.uk] , packages for older releases will be made available as well.

Re:Its too soon. (3, Funny)

FullCircle (643323) | about 9 years ago | (#13738456)

I agree with the Firefox team.

Firefox is too much of a high-profile application and web browers are an easily hit target. IMHO, Apache and SSH among others, should be treated similarly. The risk factor is too high not to give them special attention.

The fact that the team wants everyone to keep Firefox updated is just quality control and looking out for the end user. They may have regressions occasionally, but they are trying and it works more often than not.

They could have been more specific (1)

bogaboga (793279) | about 9 years ago | (#13737957)

When it comes to a product,

- that I believe has been tested,

- is so popular,

- is expected to improve,

- has acquired other distros in order to improve,

- is regarded as one of the simplest distros,

Mandriva could afford to be more specific especially on boot times. Heck, the developers know how long it takes this new distro to boot. So they could have been more specific.

Re:They could have been more specific (4, Informative)

pterjan (740570) | about 9 years ago | (#13738061)

Err the developpers don't know how much time it will spend to boot on your machine with your set of services activated...
Some examples on tuxmachines for the RC1 http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/2551 [tuxmachines.org] vs http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/2569 [tuxmachines.org]

AMD 2800+, kt400 mb, 512mb 333ddr ram, and a NVIDIA 6800.

        * Boots: 20 seconds
        * KDE: 12 seconds
        * OpenOffice: 4 seconds
        * Mozilla: 3 seconds
        * Shutdown: 15 seconds

Compared to opensuse on the same machine :

        * Boot up: 26 seconds
        * KDE: 22 seconds
        * OpenOffice: 7 seconds
        * Firefox: 3 seconds (not counting loading the default Novell webpage)
        * Shutdown: 20 seconds

Re:They could have been more specific (2, Insightful)

LittleLebowskiUrbanA (619114) | about 9 years ago | (#13738545)

Why is everybody obessed with boot/shutdown times on Linux boxes? Thought the whole point of Linux was to avoid reboots.

who comes up with this names? (4, Funny)

AnonymousYellowBelly (913452) | about 9 years ago | (#13737961)

I really want the source code for the IA software that 'invents' this names for Linux distributions and every little piece of OS/GNU/libre software out there. What comes next?

- RTFA, an 'HTML' editor?
- CowboyNeat, a file duplicator?
- IMHO, a trolling tool for /. posters?

Just in case some OSS developer reads this post, use the following names for your next text editor: Tlaloc, Escuintle, Vivanderix or Parangaracutirimicuaro. Highly descriptive names, right?

Re:who comes up with this names? (2, Funny)

Al_Lapalme (698542) | about 9 years ago | (#13738018)

Vista?

Re:who comes up with this names? (4, Interesting)

TubeSteak (669689) | about 9 years ago | (#13738073)

You might mock them, but there are companies whose sole job is to pick out names for stuff.
Naming Products Is No Game [businessweek.com]

Coming up with catchy product names is a lot harder than the layman might imagine, especially in this Global Age, when a word that might inspire admiration in one country can just as easily inspire red faces or unintended guffaws in another

Re:who comes up with this names? (1)

imr (106517) | about 9 years ago | (#13738170)

This was an inspired comment from TubeSteack.

Re:who comes up with this names? (1)

eibon (825176) | about 9 years ago | (#13738295)

That reminds of the time some car company (Honda, I think), decided to name a new model "Honda Fitta." Which, in my native language, translates to something like "Honda The Cunt."

Re:who comes up with this names? (1)

frn123 (242374) | about 9 years ago | (#13738394)

Honda Fitta - "Small on the outside but large on the ... "

Re:who comes up with this names? (1)

LarsWestergren (9033) | about 9 years ago | (#13738434)

Yep, Honda. That's a good example. A friend also told me a counter-example, a Swedish headache medicine had to change name before launch in Thailand, as the name sounded something like "The stench of a fart" in Thai.

Re:who comes up with this names? (1)

hotdiggitydawg (881316) | about 9 years ago | (#13738552)

Likewise the "Mitsubishi Pajero" [chameleon-...ations.com] ...

Re:who comes up with this names? (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 9 years ago | (#13738306)

True, especially when names are trademarked and you can sued for using someone else's trademark. But "Mandriva"? Sounds like a kinky website for putting big, hairy men on 4-wheeled flatbed carts, steering them by grabbing their ears, accelerating by stepping on them with your high-heeled red stilletto heels yelling "Faster, faster!", and I don't even want to think about how you downshift.

improved wifi support? (1)

freak117 (822047) | about 9 years ago | (#13737977)

What I really want to know is: Will my crappy D-Link Air DWL-520 Wireless Adapter(rev.E) be supported? It uses a Prism2.5 chipset that seems to confuse several distributions, including Ubuntu. I was using Mandrake and then Mandriva with functioning ethernet, but when I dropped my cable internet subscription a few months ago and started piggybacking on the neighbor's wifi, I could no longer use linux to get online. I am not a linux guru, but I can edit config files and such. I tried some 3rd party drivers but I had no luck. Getting this piece of hardware to work is over my head.

I'd love it to just work out of the box.

(The neighbors are cool with sharing their bandwidth.)

---------- My blog: Both of Us http://jspjbbphilly.blogspot.com/ [blogspot.com]

Re:improved wifi support? (2, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | about 9 years ago | (#13738065)

I'd love it to just work out of the box.

You are barking at the wrong tree. Blame the HW vendors...

Re:improved wifi support? (1)

ozmanjusri (601766) | about 9 years ago | (#13738142)

Not sure if you're trolling of not, but my DWL 520 works out of the box with both Suse 10 RC1 and Knoppix 3.9. If you're for real, try here http://www.linux-wlan.org/ [linux-wlan.org] for drivers and help.

Re:improved wifi support? (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 9 years ago | (#13738154)

That card is a royal pain to get working, but I was (partially) successful with Mandrake 10.0. I purchased it because one of the earlier revisions was listed as working with linux, and I neglected to check exactly which one I was getting. The card requires at least part of its firmware to be uploaded to it at boot / initialization time to be detected and set up properly. I don't remember the full procedure, as it was over a year ago that I did it, but here are a few hints to get you started. I used the hostap drivers, with the hostap_fw_load script. Check this howto [dyndns.org] for some helpful info. It looks similar to what I did to get it working. It was still a bit buggy, though, and worked only two out of every three boots. Good luck.

Elitism (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 9 years ago | (#13737993)

"Today, Mandriva Linux 2006 was released to Club members..."


Mandriva: We treat Linux like a snobby nightclub.


That's okay though, at least it'll protect us "normies" from winding up with fried disc drives when yet another fatal flaw is discovered in their distro like last time [theregister.co.uk] .

fatal flaw in LG's CD-ROM firmwares (4, Informative)

buchanmilne (258619) | about 9 years ago | (#13738200)

Come on, you can read, you should know by now that:
1)Mandrakesoft tested on LG hardware (including affected models) for this release, but none of the CD-ROM drives they tested had an old enough firmware to be affected
2)Gentoo had the same bug in their ready-for-the-world live gaming CDs (and hadn't tracked it down).
3)The bug was on LGs side, using a valid CD-RW command to flash the drives on their CD-ROM drives, violating standards
4)LG replaced/fixed drives
5)Mandriva did their bit in tracking down the issue, re-issuing installation media, providing a list of affected devices
6)If Mandriva hadn't merged the patch, some other popular distro would have, and would also likely not have picked it up until the release was out the door. Since Mandriva found it, the packet-writing patch was fixed to use another means to check if the drive has write capabilities, and now all linux users can have the feature without danger.

Stop bringing this up, hardware problems due to a vendor's faulty firmware is irrelevant.

Re:Elitism (2, Informative)

GraemeDonaldson (826049) | about 9 years ago | (#13738278)

Yes, because it's totally Mandr[ake|iva]'s fault that LG decided to use a certain ATAPI command (which, according to ATAPI spec, should do nothing or return an error) and make it nuke the firmware. For the record, I experienced the same problem on 2 other mainstream distros which I shall not name, to minimise flamewars.

Kat vs Beagle? (1)

zeth (452280) | about 9 years ago | (#13738000)

How does Kat fare against Beagle? I have used Beagle for a while and I find it really nice.

Has anyone tried Kat?

Re:Kat vs Beagle? (4, Funny)

Gibberx (631490) | about 9 years ago | (#13738047)

Cats vs. Dogs! Now that's taking a shovel and widening the trench between GNOME and KDE!

Re:Kat vs Beagle? (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 9 years ago | (#13738159)

I dunno... but unless it's just not rendering correctly for me,
http://kat.mandriva.com/ [mandriva.com] has to be the *fugliest* web page I've
laid eyes on in quite a while. It's sad. Really.

Re:Kat vs Beagle? (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 9 years ago | (#13738310)

The site works just fine for me and it is not ugly at all. Simple, clean and well structured. What browser are you using?

Re:Kat vs Beagle? (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 9 years ago | (#13738347)

Better not come to any of my sites then. :)

Re:Kat vs Beagle? (5, Informative)

imr (106517) | about 9 years ago | (#13738189)

kat is not really ready for primetime. It has been included already as a gesture of faith toward the developper and his solution.
The mandriva KDE guy is working a lot on this, and they are hosting the site of the developper.
I expect it will improve and get updated frequently, but tight now, the best solution is to disable it:
Before login do this in your home directory
touch ~/.mdv-no_kat
or for all new users:
touch /etc/skel/.mdv-no_kat

Simpler, remove it:
urpme kat

Now, that I said that, I think they did the wise thing in choosing kat. Kat is the first brick in what will be tenor, the underlying search engine of KDE4.
They have to make a move in this direction because google and others are already moving toward it. And if linux is not to be left behind once more, distros need to move now.
By not choosing beagle, they imply they don't want to go the (patented) mono road. (beagle will still work on a mandriva, one dev wants to have it soon because he doesnt like kat :) ).
All this is pure speculation on my part.

By supported file types: (2, Informative)

a.different.perspect (817184) | about 9 years ago | (#13738206)

Beagle [beaglewiki.org] :

Office: OpenOffice.org 1.0 (SXW, SXC, SXI, and more), OpenOffice.org 2.0 (ODT, ODP and more), Microsoft Office (DOC, XLS, PPT), AbiWord (ABW), Rich Text Format (RTF)

Standard: PDF, HTML, Plain text

Documentation: Texinfo, Man pages, Docbook, Monodoc, Windows help files (CHM), Application launchers

Multimedia: Images (JPEG, PNG, SVG), Audio (MP3, OGG, FLAC)

Network: Evolution mail, calendar, and addressbook, Gaim IM and IRC logs, Firefox/Epiphany web pages (as you view them, through browser extensions), Blam and Liferea RSS feeds, Tomboy notes

Kat [mandriva.com] :

Office: OpenOffice.org 1.0 (SXW, SXI, SXC, SXM), OpenOffice.org 2.0 (ODT, ODP, ODS, ODF, ODS, ODC), Microsoft Office (DOC, XLS, PPT), Rich Text Format (RTF), Gnumeric, KOffice (KWD, KPR, KSP, KFO), Lyx, Tex, Device Independent Document (DVI)

Standard: PDF, PostScript, HTML, Plain text

Documentation: Man pages, Debian Package (DEB)

Other: BibTex Bibliographic database (BBL, BIB), Molecular Database Limited Molecule (MDL), DocBook Document (DBK)

Re:By supported file types: (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 9 years ago | (#13738224)

Kat also supports MP3, OGG, etc... Actually, it uses KDE's kfile meta data plugins, and there are *many* of those. The list given is only for full text plugins, but MP3 does not really have full text. Or, does Beagle download the song text from the internet??

Egon

Re:By supported file types: (1, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | about 9 years ago | (#13738231)

Just a note on Kat's list of supported formats.
The formats you mentioned are only those for full text extraction. Kat is able to extract metadata information from a lot of non-textual formats such as images, videos, sounds, mp3 and so on.
Kat uses the standard KDE metadata plugins for that.

Re:Kat vs Beagle? (1)

hcob$ (766699) | about 9 years ago | (#13738400)

Well, last time I tried Kat, she had the Herpes. Now that's cool and all cause she let me slip in the back way instead. Of course that was after she let her "roomate" and I have some fun to...

Oh, wait! KAT... that search thing... nah, haven't had that before.

hardly newsworthy (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | about 9 years ago | (#13738025)

This will probably get modded down as trollish, or as flamebait. Perhaps I deserve it to, but I feel compelled to add my $0.02 anyway. This point really bothers me - so I will probably sound fairly harsh.

Ho Hum. Another distro in the fragmented Linux world featuring the same desktop as most of the rest of them, featuring the same software as most of the rest of them. What people precieve as Linux's greatest strength, I see as it's greatest weakness.

Doesn't anyone find it hard to get excited over this? I mean, a new and improved search tool. Whoop-te-do. I like linux as much as the next enthusiest, but it sure would be nice if choice went by the wayside long enough to consolidate things. This "50,000 distros doing nearly the same thing" crap is old -- way old. It's probably one of the biggest reasons why it's still lagging behind everything else. For example, look at OSX (I'll admit, I don't like Macs, but one should recognise their accomplishments) - it hasn't been around nearly as long, and it's getting further along than Linux. Why? One leader, one vision. There aren't a bazillion OSX distros out there trying to be like each other. Look at Ubuntu and Debian - another fine example of counterproductive BS where they fragment, have different ideas about how things should be done, and wind up not really helping each other like they should be. The internal politics alone are enough to make my hair stand on end.

Want to amaze me? Invent a new desktop that doesn't suck, and actually works without all the glitchiness I've come to expect from the two (KDE and Gnome) most popular desktop environments. Do something different! Innovate! Change the way I look at my computer! Don't give me *yet another* search tool. Or, at the very least, don't make it the *focus* of your new release.

If people wanted to help Linux mature, they'd stop fragmenting in to dozens and dozens of distros, and focus on *one* of them. Imagine what could be achieved if we weren't all pulling the same horse in different directions at the same time.

Re:hardly newsworthy (1)

John Nowak (872479) | about 9 years ago | (#13738201)

Apple is ahead because they built on top of NEXTStep, which has been around for quite awhile. Perhaps you recall OS 9 and what a mess what was? Well, I suppose it did have a nice desktop...

Re:hardly newsworthy (1, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | about 9 years ago | (#13738247)

Ho Hum. Another "Another distro in the fragmented Linux world featuring the same desktop" post.
This will probably get modded down as trollish, or as flamebait
"Redundant" would be my pick, as I can't remember a distro article in recent memory that didn't have at least one post raising the same old issue as yours.
Look at Ubuntu and Debian - another fine example of counterproductive BS where they fragment, have different ideas about how things should be done, and wind up not really helping each other like they should be.
The perception of some weird kind of "rift" between Ubuntu and Debian is way overblown. Read this for more information: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MarkShuttleworth [ubuntu.com] Suffice to say that Ubuntu obviously makes excellent use of Debian, and also contributes plenty back.
Want to amaze me? Invent a new desktop that doesn't suck, and actually works without all the glitchiness I've come to expect from the two (KDE and Gnome) most popular desktop environments. Do something different! Innovate! Change the way I look at my computer! Don't give me *yet another* search tool. Or, at the very least, don't make it the *focus* of your new release.
Woo - another desktop. Won't that be grand! As for innovation, check out the plans for KDE 4. Also, if you're not going to whine and offer up interesting and new ideas rather than vauge accusations of glitchiness, I can think of no reason at all why distros maintainers (who, incidentally, are not responsible for inventing brand new desktops) would wish to "amaze" you.
If people wanted to help Linux mature, they'd stop fragmenting in to dozens and dozens of distros, and focus on *one* of them. Imagine what could be achieved if we weren't all pulling the same horse in different directions at the same time.
Very well - if it were up to you, *which* distro would you choose to dictate that people focus on? If you say "SUSE", ten people will say "Mandriva". If you say "Mandriva", ten people will say "Ubuntu". If you say "start a brand new one from scratch" - well, why do you think there are 200 distros already available? Fact is, rallying all developers across the globe - many of which contribute purely voluntarily, remember - to One United Cause is an impossible dream. The only thing we can do is let nature take its course.

If it so happens that a handful of distros attain such a degree of superiority that developers drop their tools and flock to work on it, then great. If it simply transpires that the constant flow of code causes all distros to become completely alike in terms of capabilities, then that's fine, too - somewhat wasteful of resources, yes, but there's nothing you can do about it, certainly not by posting Tired Old Arguments Against Fragmentation v2110 on slashdot.

Finally, a word about distros themselves. Here's my theory - distros aren't important, or at the very least, they are far less important than the body of open-source software available is. The function of a distro is to package a bunch of code together into a whole for consumption by the end-user who has no time to do this for themselves, and to improve the end-user experience as much as is possible - after all, a distro that fails to do the latter will quickly descend into irrelevancy, at which point it ceases to be either a "confusing" additional choice, nor a waste of significant man-power. This improvement often comes from improving the desktop environments, or productivity software offered. Here's the crucial point - all of these types of improvements can (and are) adopted by other distros. For example, Novell have put a lot of work and effort into Beagle, and this work can be and is harnessed by other distros. Put like this:

The fragmentation of distros, and really the distross themselves, are almost wholly irrelevant, as each produces code that can be adopted by the others.

The power of open-source melts down the fragmentation as code and improvements from one distro flows into all others, making the end-choice of distro almost wholly irrelevant. Besides varying degrees of hardware detection, and whether non-Free packages are installed by default, there are vanishingly small differences between distros, and the apparent redundancy of this barely matters because each contributes to the quality of code available to the others. Sorry to belabour this point, but I'm a clumsy writer and am finding it difficult to explain it exactly :)

Oh, and one other minor point - about 95% of the distros are not only utterly irrelevant for the mainstream user, nor a significant drain on resources (probably 95% of the available manpower goes into the top 5%), but were actually created not because of some idealogical differences, but because there was a demand for a distro that performed one specific task well - surfing for pr0n being the most popular example :) These distros have required minimal effort to develop and simply shouldn't even be counted, unless of course you happen to require the specialist adaptations that the distro was designed to cater for. To summarise: 95% of distros are so completely small, specialised and irrelevant - intentionally - that they hardly merit inclusion in an argument about fragmentation.

Re:hardly newsworthy (2, Informative)

Thanatos Starfire (915874) | about 9 years ago | (#13738298)

OSX gets further along than linux not just because of one vision, but also because of one set of hardware specs. They are the manufacturer of the equipment, making development of an OS a helluva lot simpler. Also, they charge for their software.

Release date... (5, Funny)

Mad_Rain (674268) | about 9 years ago | (#13738033)

Mandriva Linux 2006 [...] will be publicly available on October 13.

Funny, that's also Ubuntu's 5.10 (Breezy Badger) final release date. I wonder - does "Ubuntu vs. Mandriva" sound like a knock-off of a Japanese monster movie to anyone else? Or is this a "friendly" competition between linux distros?

Re:Release date... (1)

Alwin Henseler (640539) | about 9 years ago | (#13738453)

I wonder - does "Ubuntu vs. Mandriva" sound like a knock-off of a Japanese monster movie to anyone else? Or is this a "friendly" competition between linux distros?

No, that's really a knock-off of another innovation in the software industry, known as "Microsoft Patch Day". Which is expected around the same date - coincidence, you think?

Ofcourse with Linux, patches are streamed directly from developers' keyboards to your machine for beta-testing, you get a lot more patches for less money, and you can make your own if you feel like it ;-)

-- Sig generator version 20050721/dot-pre18u2. Send bug reports to:

Oct 12: Apple! (1)

bach37 (602070) | about 9 years ago | (#13738602)

Could have made it Oct 12 [macrumors.com] ....

Re:Release date... (1)

AussieVamp2 (636560) | about 9 years ago | (#13738611)

ManDrake the fire breathing dragon, what special powers does Ubuntu have? :)

Or to quote The Blue Oyster Cult: "Oh! No! There goes Tokyo!"

Same announced release day as Ubuntu 5.10 final... (1)

GozzoMan (808286) | about 9 years ago | (#13738045)

(Mentioned in the Release Candidate annoucement [ubuntu.com] )

Is this telling us something?

Apple Save US Please! (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | about 9 years ago | (#13738074)

After Apple got dumped by IBM, the writing is on the wall for Mac hardware - no one but the diehard Mac folk are going to be wasting money on overpriced x86 machines from Apple next year.

Apple needs to overcome their 'Linux is teh suck' attitude and move their desktop stuff over to run on top of Linux. Save us from two half-assed Windows 95 ripoffs. Save us from retarded software installation. Give me Cocoa with Eclipse + Interface Builder. And bring me the head of the clown responsible for Xcode.

Help me Apple engineers, you're my only hope.

MOD PARENT UP (0, Offtopic)

John Nowak (872479) | about 9 years ago | (#13738212)

Such brilliant trolling deserves a reward.

Oh... and if he was serious, please shoot him.

fp 7roLl (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | about 9 years ago | (#13738161)

Things I sti7l

Not the only centrino certified Linux (2, Insightful)

stm2 (141831) | about 9 years ago | (#13738171)

Linspire people said they also were centrino certified, the even sell laptops with Linspire on in [com.com] .

All Right! (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 9 years ago | (#13738191)

OMG, Just what I was looking for- another Linux distro!

Released Today? (1)

1000baseFX (120418) | about 9 years ago | (#13738199)

Hell, I had my Official PowerPack DVD and CD's (for my machines w/o DVD's) at the end of September.
Early seeders advantage I guess. I suppose I need to reseed them on the company OC3

Mandingo Linux? (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 9 years ago | (#13738229)

What is mandingo Linux?

Mandriva 2006 rocks (4, Insightful)

Azureflare (645778) | about 9 years ago | (#13738244)

I installed it on my desktop and laptop, and this version of Mandrake/Mandriva is definitely one of the best in a while. Everything just works (wireless setup/installation has become a breeze). If you haven't used Mandriva before, wait until the Discovery shows up on some torrent sites or wait for the public release. It's well worth it. Especially after the Connectiva merger, Mandriva seems to have gained a lot in terms of stability. I don't use KDE all the time so I can't speak to the features, but when I fired it up it looked very nice

A lot of the artwork has changed to a much more professional look than 2005LE (You will know what I'm talking about if you installed/used 2005LE).

I'm using the powerpack since I'm a silver club member and I volunteered to be an early seeder so I got it early, and I couldn't be happier. If you want a linux distro that Just Works, try it out some time.

Re:Mandriva 2006 rocks (2, Interesting)

Maqueo (766442) | about 9 years ago | (#13738301)

Mandrake 9.2 was my first linux distribution, and I have to say, it was the ONLY distribution that supported everyhting out of the box correctly on my laptop (except wifi, but that was quite easy to install). Stuff that still nowadays takes me a good while to get going on another distribution.

What I really didn't like was Mandrake's logo all over the place, and the rpm installs. Dependencies were a real pain in the ass.

How's the package handling? I prefer downloading it from the net, as opposed to installing from the CDs (that is if they had what I needed on them).

Re:Mandriva 2006 rocks (3, Interesting)

Azureflare (645778) | about 9 years ago | (#13738373)

Yeah, really in the long term downloading from the net is the way to go. After the urpmi mirrors come up, usually a few days from release due to propogation delays, I uncheck all my removable media and use only net sources. It's the only way to go; it's so convenient since the internet is always on.

Dependencies are really not a problem with urpmi, as long as you stick to official mandrake/mandriva rpms. As soon as you go on pbone or get rpms from other distributions, problems will probably happen.

Usually if it's not in the mandrake main or contrib repositories (that's pretty rare) then the best option is to either search for a mandrake rpm, look for a .i386.rpm (one that isn't distribution specific) or failing that compiling from the tar file.

Mandriva isn't for everybody of course, if you've got debian working great then that's the way to go. I really like it because I just don't have to waste time (though debian is pretty awesome, if you know what you're doing).

Re:Mandriva 2006 rocks (1)

Fred_A (10934) | about 9 years ago | (#13738398)

I don't understand what your problem with packages is, Mandk[ake,iva] has dupported installing packages from the net (or a local server, or a local disk) for a while now via the urpmi tools (or the graphical frontends if you are so inclined).

They work more or less in a similar way to the apt tools of Debian or whateverit'snameis of RedHat (haven't used RH in ages).

As with any other distribution, it's up to you to setup the sources for your packages though.

After that, basically you do "urpmi foo" and it installs "foo" and whatever is required for it to run, pulling stuff off the network as necessary.

I seem to remember urpmi was there in 9.2 and already worked pretty well.

Re:Mandriva 2006 rocks (2, Funny)

Rinnt (917105) | about 9 years ago | (#13738568)

A lot of the artwork has changed to a much more professional look than 2005LE (You will know what I'm talking about if you installed/used 2005LE).

Yeah, I do know what you mean. I'm assuming you're refering to that crazy, star-eyed looking penguin that is displayed on boot. Man that's embarrassing. My wife seriously though it was Daffy Duck! So now whem I'm booting my LE2005 install at work, I have people thinking that Daffy Duck is built into my OS?

Up next (1)

Khlept0 (887217) | about 9 years ago | (#13738273)

Coming to a torrent near you.

Just use Windows (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 9 years ago | (#13738375)

Its free. Bunch of geeks!

One thing I'd like to see (1, Interesting)

ajs318 (655362) | about 9 years ago | (#13738388)

I can name one feature I'd like to see in Mandriva.

Either Debdrake or Portagedrake.

RPMs are bollocks - either that, or every RPM distro that I've used or seen had a package repository that was bollocks, which amounts to the same thing either way: bollocks. Anyway, back in the days when I was using Mandrake 8.2, one of the first things I learned was how to spell "make install".

Re:One thing I'd like to see (1)

jiawen (693693) | about 9 years ago | (#13738534)

I agree, RPMdrake is a pain in the butt. I have been stuck in dependency hell probably a dozen times. Latest example: I was trying to install something that required Gnome-Panel. Gnome-Panel requires libhowl, which requires howl -- which requires libhowl! Arrgh!

However, I don't think Mandriva including an additional DEBdrake or Portagedrake or whatever would solve the problem. I've tried installing Apt-Get on Mandriva and, while the app itself installs fine, getting a decent source for packages is a huge pain. Why? Because, due to architecture, it looks like (from my experience) Mandriva would have to come up with their own .debs, etc. Otherwise, the packages won't install right. (I've tried using non-Mandriva apt sources, and they don't work.) In other words, for Mandriva to have both an RPM-based application installer and a .deb installer, Mandriva would have to split its time between two complete package sources. (If anyone knows otherwise, please correct me! I'd love to stop having dependency problems.)

I'd rather see Mandriva move to a completely .deb based system -- or better yet, make a concerted effort to get rid of dependency conflicts. That would probably even get me to buy into the Club.

Nice bootup times (2, Interesting)

ashyanbhog (852510) | about 9 years ago | (#13738411)

Have been using Mnadrake at home since their 9.1 release, running LE2005 now. They did have a buggy release in 10, but 2006 seems to have shaped up to be a good distro.....

I stick to centos in office. Why do people keep cribbing about the zillion linux distros? KDE feels great at home and gnome looks perfect for office..... and after having used both for few years, I can say they have come a long way.....

We have started to slowly roll out CentOS to other workstations here, and people who have began using prefer CentOS over WinXP. Only issue holding us back from a complete rollout is lack of Catia(CAD) for Linux

Even my bro has mostly stopped booting Win at home. Looking forward to Mandy 2006.... I think it'll be a distro that will allow me to recommend Linux to a lot of people

Some tips and first impressions (4, Informative)

InodoroPereyra (514794) | about 9 years ago | (#13738530)

Allright, I am running it (from the development branch, Cooker, when they froze all checkins).

If you are planning to run it, you may consider a quick look at: The Mandriva 2006 Twiki Page [mandriva.com] . It has links to the Errata Page, Release Notes and the Distro Changelog

My first impressions:

  • Very Fast. Boots fast (see the link above). It runs very fast, I guess because of the use of gcc4. Very, very responsive.
  • Sexy. Fonts look great, KDE 3.4.2 looks fantastic. It also is very useable, again, mainly because of KDE in my setup. The Mandrake tools are, as always, greatly appreciated, including urpmi. Haven't tried using s.m.a.r.t. yet.
  • No Kat, No ACPI. YMMV, but Kat brings my desktop down ot its knees. It takes way too much CPU usage. I uninstalled it. And there is a know bug (follow the links above) in X org that they will try to fix soon, but the quick workaround is to disable ACPI. Please don't bitch, if you can't live without it (like if you have a laptop), just wait a couple weeks for the fix and then you install
  • OOO 2.0. I am running the Open Office 2.0 from the contributed packages, it runs great, I am really loving it. Point your software manager to the Contrib medium and install (or join the Club and everything will be even easier). There is a nice ooo-kde package to integrate (not perfect yet) with KDE. Sweet.

Cheers,
Don Inodoro

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