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Apple Unveils New Pro Products

ScuttleMonkey posted about 9 years ago | from the make-room-for-intel-tech dept.

Announcements 590

porcupine8 writes "As many had speculated, today Apple unveiled upgrades to their PowerBook and Power Mac lines (although no PowerBook G5). They also introduced a new professional photography application known as Aperture, rounding out their software lineup for creative professionals. Can't wait to find out what they announce next week!"

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my take on the new PowerMacs (5, Informative)

Tumbleweed (3706) | about 9 years ago | (#13829433)

So the dual-core G5 finally arrived (with the top end machine having 2 of them), plus PCIe and 533MHz DDR2. I expected PCIe, but didn't expect DDR2. This is a very nice transition machine to wait for the Intel Macs.

Things to note:

All nVidia videocards, now -- one of which is a Quadro FX 4500 for $1650. Nice knowin' ya, ATI, don't let the door hit you in the rear on the way out.

"In addition to the 16-lane graphics slot, the Power Mac G5 features three PCI Express expansion slots: two four-lane slots and one eight-lane slot. Each slot uses a standard connector that can accommodate a card of any size."

This mobo has better PCIe support than any other mobo I've heard about, by _far_. Crazy. 2 x4 slots and an x8? The new Fibre Channel Card seems to be an x4 PCIe, which is the first x4 card I've heard of. There are hardly any x1 cards, yet, either, and PCIe has been out quite a while.

Dual gigabit ethernet now, too, instead of just single. (they were just single before, right?)

The optional modem is now an external USB dongle style model, instead of an internal card. The end of an era. Good riddance.

I guess Apple finally stepped into the 'future.' :)

The bad:

Only SATA '1', no 'SATA2' (no such thing, really, but...).

Still only 2 internal HDs? C'mon - these are supposed to be workstations, Apple. Get with it.
I wants my internal RAID 10!

I'm definitely waiting for the Intel Macs, but for those who are opposed to the idea of an Intel Mac, these machines are about as sweet as one could ask for. The low-end PowerMac is now a 2gHz dual-core G5, which is pretty nice (and meets the recommended specs for their new application, Aperture, as long as you upgrade the hell out of the RAM).

Re:my take on the new PowerMacs (1, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | about 9 years ago | (#13829464)

Dual gigabit ethernet now, too, instead of just single. (they were just single before, right?)

  Yes.

Re:my take on the new PowerMacs (3, Insightful)

Pfhor (40220) | about 9 years ago | (#13829570)

My one take away issue is the fact that a lot of audio card makers are having trouble getting high quality audio out of their PCIe cards. as mentioned here [guru3d.com] . Everybody else will start cranking out the 8 port SATA 2 cards soon (I don't think they have settled on that standard yet, have they?), looking around i've seen x1 firewire cards, but x4 multiport fw800s cards are sure to be in the works also.

Re:my take on the new PowerMacs (2, Interesting)

Anonymous Coward | about 9 years ago | (#13829628)

Actually, the current PowerMacs DO NOT meet the minimum specs for Aperture. The graphics card included will all new PowerMacs (NVidia 6600, with either 128MB for the low/mid and 256MB for the high) is not listed as meeting the minimum requirements. The "lowest" NVidia card listed is the 9800.

Re:my take on the new PowerMacs (2, Insightful)

Tumbleweed (3706) | about 9 years ago | (#13829690)

Hmm, sort of true. The 9800 is an ATI, not nVidia, but you're right about the base videocards not meeting the recommended spec. I'd be willing to bet the requirements having the most affect on Aperture are memory and CPU speed (in that order), though who knows.

Re:my take on the new PowerMacs (4, Informative)

daveschroeder (516195) | about 9 years ago | (#13829660)

All nVidia videocards, now -- one of which is a Quadro FX 4500 for $1650. Nice knowin' ya, ATI, don't let the door hit you in the rear on the way out.

...except that the new iMac, introduced just a week ago, uses ATI Radeon X600 and X600 XT PCI Express graphics.

They're not all the way out of the door yet. ;-)

Re:my take on the new PowerMacs (3, Insightful)

Jeff DeMaagd (2015) | about 9 years ago | (#13829749)

Also now avalable: ECC memory.

No self-respecting workstation went without it (same with the graphics cards), and finally, Apple has true workstations available, not just high end desktops priced like workstations.

Re:my take on the new PowerMacs (2, Interesting)

Jeff DeMaagd (2015) | about 9 years ago | (#13829779)

I also noticed that the prices of 23" and 30" displays dropped, to $1299 from $1499 on the 23", to $2499 from $2999 on the 30".

Yay (-1, Redundant)

Anonymous Coward | about 9 years ago | (#13829435)

Pro FTW!

fp (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | about 9 years ago | (#13829436)

only faggots and hippies use apple products

Re:fp (3, Funny)

FosterKanig (645454) | about 9 years ago | (#13829503)

Which one are you again?

Details (5, Informative)

daveschroeder (516195) | about 9 years ago | (#13829443)

As usual, the submission leaves out critical details.

The new Power Mac G5 [apple.com] highlights include dual core G5 processors [apple.com] (IBM PowerPC 970MP [com.com] ), PCI Express [apple.com] , DDR2 RAM, and dual gigabit ethernet on all models:

Single 2.0, single 2.3, or dual 2.5 GHz dual-core IBM PowerPC 970MP (G5) processor
1.0, 1.15, or 1.25 GHz frontside bus per processor
512MB PC2-4200 DDR2 RAM, expandable to 16GB
160GB or 250GB Serial ATA drive
16x dual layer CD-RW/DVD+/-RW SuperDrive
Three open PCI Express expansion slots: two four-lane slots and one eight-lane slot
NVIDIA GeForce 6600, 6600 LE, 7800 GT, or Quadro FX 4500 video
Dual gigabit ethernet
USB 2.0, FireWire 400 (IEEE-1394), FireWire 800 (IEEE-1394b)
AirPort Extreme (802.11g), Bluetooth 2.0+EDR
Analog and optical digital audio in and out
Mighty Mouse (Two button scroll mouse)

The new PowerBook [apple.com] highlights include higher resolution screens, longer battery life, and standard SuperDrives:

1.67 GHz Freescale PowerPC 7458[1] (G4) processor, 512MB PC2700 DDR RAM, expandable to 2GB, 80GB or 120GB Ultra ATA/100 drive
8x dual layer CD-RW/DVD+/-RW SuperDrive
1440x960 (15") or 1680x1050 (17") resolution screen
ATI Mobility Radeon 9700 with 128MB DDR SDRAM and dual-link DVI (supports 30" display)
Gigabit ethernet, 56K V.92 modem, PC Card slot
USB 2.0, FireWire 400 (IEEE-1394), FireWire 800 (IEEE-1394b)
AirPort Extreme (802.11g), Bluetooth 2.0+EDR
Illuminated keyboard
Analog and optical digital audio in and out
DVI/VGA/composite/S-Video out

Also new is the amazing pro photography software Aperture [apple.com] , as well as new lower pricing on Apple Displays [apple.com] .

I might as well send my writeup on last week's announcements as well, since the submission (and discussion) there were really light on info too...

---

iMac G5 [apple.com]

A new, even thinner, iMac G5 with an integrated 640x480 iSight camera and integrated media center software called Front Row.

1.9 or 2.1 GHz IBM PowerPC 970fx (G5) processor
512MB PC2-4200 RAM, expandable to 2.5GB
160GB or 250GB Serial ATA drive
8x dual layer CD-RW/DVD+/-RW SuperDrive
ATI Radeon X600 Pro or XT PCI-Express video
Gigabit ethernet, USB 2.0, FireWire 400 (IEEE-1394)
AirPort Extreme (802.11g), Bluetooth 2.0+EDR
1/8" stereo audio or optical out, 1/8" line in
VGA/composite/S-Video out
Mighty Mouse (Two button scroll mouse)

The inclusion of PCI-Express and PC2-4200 RAM in the new iMac bodes well for the upcoming updates to the Power Macs and PowerBooks.

---

Front Row [apple.com]

Media center software currently only included with the iMac G5. Allows for seamless interface with music, movies, movie trailers, pictures, TV shows, and so on via either the iMac's screen or an external screen such as a projector or TV. Includes an infrared remote control. A demonstration of Front Row is available here [apple.com] .

It is likely that Front Row will make its way to other products in the near future, such as the Mac mini. It is only available for the iMac G5 "at this time", according to Apple.

The one feature of typical media centers that Front Row does not support is TV recording. But Apple seems to have a different idea for TV shows, as will be seen below. (However, TV recording can be accomplished with a wide variety of third party tuners.)

---

iPod (iPod video) [apple.com]

Apple introduced two new iPods to completely replace the existing "larger" iPods. The same height and width as the older iPods, they're actually about half the thickness and feature a larger, 320x240 2.5" TFT display. The iPods also support native hardware decoding of 30fps H.264 and MPEG-4 video.

The new iPods also support the new Apple Remote [apple.com] , available separately for $29, with the new Apple Universal Dock [apple.com] . Via the dock or the Apple AV Cable [apple.com] , the iPod also supports composite and S-Video output (for hookup to a TV) as well is line level audio output. The dock could be part of an entertainment center, and content from the iPod, including movies and TV shows, can be navigated via remote control.

Interestingly, the new iPods seem to have eliminated FireWire support in favor of exclusive USB 2.0/1.1 support.

The new iPod comes in traditional white, and now black, like the iPod nano.

---

iTunes 6 [apple.com]

Just five weeks after the announcement of iTunes 5, Apple has already released a new version of iTunes they're calling "iTunes 6". The major version increase is likely justified, because the new features are, you guessed it, video content downloads. There are now over 2000 music videos available for download, at a price of $1.99.

Apple has also struck an arrangement with Disney/ABC and Pixar (surprise!) to host TV shows, both current run and previous seasons, on iTunes. Currently, five TV shows are available to begin with, and more will be available shortly. You will be able to download the most current episodes of TV shows they day after they are broadcast on TV. The price per episode is $1.99. The episodes are commercial free. Apple appears to also have special pricing for entire seasons, such as the first seasons of Desperate Housewives and LOST.

The video is currently encoded in H.264 at 320x240, the native resolution of the new iPod. While that sounds low, I downloaded a couple of shows to test, and full screen on a computer or on a standard definition TV, it looks just like, well, TV. The quality is VERY good, considering the ridiculously small download size.

Any downloaded content can be viewed on any computer with iTunes 6, on any new iPod that supports video, or on a TV or any external video device (such as a projector) via the video output capability of the new iPod dock or any Mac with video out.

---

Naturally the first questions on peoples' minds are: when will they be higher quality? When do we get HD? When do we get movies? The answers are probably:

When...

1.) ...the iPod can handle playing them back;
2.) ...the storage of iPod-like devices increases even more. Remember, even a 640x480 video isn't twice, but *four times* the size of a 320x240 video;
3.) ...general broadband bandwidth increases in a majority of markets to beyond 3Mbps;
4.) ...content providers let them;
5.) ...it will take minutes instead of hours to download said movies and/or TV shows at higher resolutions
6.) Probably a bunch of other reasons.

For now, the 320x240 size is a compromise, and does actually look great for standard definition content.

Another big question is "can I rip my own DVDs into iTunes and use them on the iPod", etc. The answer is yes. I will not address the legality of using your own DVDs as you see fit, but there are many utilities, such as Handbrake [m0k.org] , that let you rip DVDs in the same fashion that CDs which you own are ripped.[2] HandBrake, for instance, lets you specify the desired format (H.264 or MPEG-4), resolution, datarate, and so on, and will archive the video from DVDs you have purchased onto your computer. It can then be imported into and managed via iTunes, and can also be moved to an iPod for viewing.

---

This is a big series of announcements, and represents Apple's the beginning of Apple's foray into the living room. It began tentatively with AirPort Express and the original iPod photo dock with video out, and now begins in earnest with Wednesday's announcements.

[1] I am almost positive it is the 7458, but could be mistaken.

[2] A big aside: Technically, any tool that removes or bypasses (in a non-approved fashion) the Content Scrambling System (CSS) protection on a copy-protected DVD is illegal to use in the US. This is because of the Digital Millennium Copyright Act (DMCA), and because according to the Motion Picture Association of America (MPAA) - the trade group that represents content owners - you don't actually own the movie when you buy it; you're buying a license to the movie, and must abide by the license terms, which include not reverse-engineering the copy protection. This argument is curious, however, because if you truly owned a license to the movie, you should then be able to run over the DVD with your car, and obtain replacement media for a nominal cost. After all, you already own the license, according to the MPAA.

The issue is muddier when you're talking about copying a copy-protected DVD with CSS intact: at first glance, it seems clear you should be able to do it. But the license provisions of many DVDs disallow this.

The fact that removing CSS is "illegal" has even resulted in a possibly "illegal" prime number: when you compress the DeCSS code, which is the basis for CSS removal tools, in a certain fashion, and represent it in binary form, the decimal equivalent of the number is a prime number. Since it's illegal to possess a representation of DeCSS in digital form, is this number now illegal? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Illegal_prime_number>

Interesting considerations. :-)

Apple displays (1)

totallygeek (263191) | about 9 years ago | (#13829512)

Also new is the amazing pro photography software Aperture, as well as new lower pricing on Apple Displays.

I am completely ignorant when it comes to the this, and no place in town sells Macs retail. What is the connector on the back of the Apple monitors? I am interested in a nice display for my computer, but cannot go Mac for compatibility reasons (hardware). Can I hook up my Intel workstation to one of those sweet monitors, or is there another display I should be looking into?

Re:Apple displays (3, Informative)

Wesley Felter (138342) | about 9 years ago | (#13829585)

Apple monitors use DVI. But be careful; the 30" is only compatible with a handful of video cards.

Re:Apple displays (1)

dave1212 (652688) | about 9 years ago | (#13829595)

DVI. Just make sure that your video card can handle the resolution needed.

Re:Apple displays (1)

HaloZero (610207) | about 9 years ago | (#13829605)

As far as I can tell, the adaptor on the Apple Cinema displays is a standard-issue DVI connector. However, the two larger models require you drive that connection with an nVidia GeForce 6800 or better adaptor. I tried it with my 5950 FX Ultra, and the display quality was... decent, but not as good as I'd expect from a DVI adaptor. And yes, you can plug the Apple Cinema display into a Linux/Windows/Intel/IBM-Compatible PC.

Re:Apple displays (1)

daveschroeder (516195) | about 9 years ago | (#13829609)

It's DVI. And yes, you can hook it up to any video card that has DVI.

(The 30-inch requires "dual-link DVI", which some PC video cards also support.)

But the general answer is, yes, you can hook them up to PCs.

I'd however recommend looking at Dell's flat panel displays, which are amazingly priced and also feature DVI, VGA, composite, and S-Video inputs, with some models even having built-in media readers for memory cards (e.g., from digital cameras). Apple's displays only have DVI. But if you're going for the 30", it can't be beat.

You'll probably be able to go Mac once the Intel transition is made, as they'll essentially be high-end conventional PCs, and will (very, very likely) be able to natively boot Windows, or run Windows at full speed in a virtual machine type environment while still booted into OS X.

(On another note, where do you live? Nowhere near any Apple Retail [apple.com] store or any CompUSA?)

Re:Details (1)

Thalagyrt (851883) | about 9 years ago | (#13829547)

I don't see the 7800 GT in their store at all, I wonder why they'd mention it in a press release but not make it an option? :|

Re:Details (1)

timeOday (582209) | about 9 years ago | (#13829567)

The new PowerBook highlights include higher resolution screens, longer battery life, and standard SuperDrives
I can't help but notice the omission of "faster processor" there, is there really no boost in speed? Yikes!

first (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | about 9 years ago | (#13829444)

first

Aperture info (5, Informative)

dogmatixpsych (786818) | about 9 years ago | (#13829446)

Aperture is geared toward professional photographers. It allows you to work directly with RAW files (as well as many other file types). It is similar to Googles Picassa but on steroids. It doesnt look like it will compete with Photoshop though at this stage. It is more of a basic organization and editing program. It looks pretty slick but has some fairly hefty system requirements.

Re:Aperture info (1)

Jsutton1027w (757650) | about 9 years ago | (#13829497)

If this is just an organization and editing program, then how is this any different than iPhoto?

Re:Aperture info (4, Interesting)

Mikey-San (582838) | about 9 years ago | (#13829498)

It is similar to Googles Picassa but on steroids.

More accurately:

Aperture : Google's Picasa :: Final Cut Pro : iMovie

Re:Aperture info (1)

Omnieiunium (872399) | about 9 years ago | (#13829550)

From what I've read, Aperture is different from Photoshop.

Apple downplayed the competitive threat that Aperture potentially poses to Adobe's popular Photoshop software, describing it as "complementary" to Photoshop. "This is to do a whole different set of things," Schiller said in an interview. "There's been no software that does what aperture does."
From CNET

Re:Aperture info (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 9 years ago | (#13829725)

Yeah, and it's complemntary in price too. Eeesh.

Well, I guess the pocket-heavy amateurs and some new pros will buy it.

Re:Aperture Screen shots.. (1)

acomj (20611) | about 9 years ago | (#13829680)

http://www.apple.com/aperture/gallery/ [apple.com]

Some interesting screenshots (on a big screen) You have to click the next button to see all of them

Much more robust than iphoto. Seems to allow more adjustments, and organization and albums, and raw conversion. It seems more photographer oriented than photoshop

Re:Aperture info (4, Insightful)

archdetector (876357) | about 9 years ago | (#13829702)

Aperture's feature set is different from Photoshop's, yes, but where they overlap is significant from a photographer's point of view. I'd say that 95% of what I do to photos is now covered by Aperture. I'll still need PS, but as of today it's been relegated to secondary importance, and will be much more easily replaced if something simpler/cheaper/better comes along. For people like graphic designers and digital artists, Aperture may only be a nice accompaniment to PS, but for photographers, this is huge. It's actually quite perfect.

Re:Aperture info (4, Interesting)

mozumder (178398) | about 9 years ago | (#13829716)

It looks to use CoreImage for it's image processing, which would be cool, as that would mean it uses the GPU for image processing. The demo shows some very responsive image processing. My goddammed photoshop CS1 RAW import may take a day just to generate thumbnails from RAW files. I am so upgrading.

photoshop is dead (2, Insightful)

same_old_story (833424) | about 9 years ago | (#13829720)

Photoshop was created a long time ago, when no professional photographers were using digital cameras. It's feature set / interface is actually very cumbersome for people shooting large number of pictures on a professional basis.

With Aperture, Apple has spent a long time analyzing photographer's workflow, and design the app on top of it. It has just what is needed for pros, a clean workflow that includes:
- easy import of raw images
- easy way to see / search metadata
- non destructive editing
- project management
- easy backup of negatives (raw files)
- differentiation between masters (raw) and versions (treated images)
- easy export and soft color spoofing
- easy backup on masters and collections

I can't wait o get my hands on this one...

p.s.: Aperture is to iPhoto somewhat like Solaris is to windows 95...

First Pro Post (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | about 9 years ago | (#13829451)

Commin' at ya from NYC Bitches!

No PowerBook G5 (5, Interesting)

Mikey-San (582838) | about 9 years ago | (#13829453)

"Although, no PowerBook G5."

Were you asleep during the Intel announcement?

Everyone who actually thinks there will be G5 PowerBooks at this point, please stand up.

Crickets?

Re:No PowerBook G5 (1)

s4ck (895807) | about 9 years ago | (#13829587)

Everyone who actually thinks there will be G5 PowerBooks at this point, please stand up.

*not standing up*

still.
Just would like to point out that not many people actually thought apple would released the ipod/itune video feature last week.

i'm not saying.. it's just that apple has treated us with some golden suprises this year.

who knows? really...

Re:No PowerBook G5 (1)

nuggetman (242645) | about 9 years ago | (#13829700)

Just would like to point out that not many people actually thought apple would released the ipod/itune video feature last week.

The two scenarios are completely different
The iPod is a continuing product line that isn't going away soon, massive upgrades are expected
the PowerPC line is nearing its end starting middle of next year - they wouldn't launch a completely new PowerBook line to kill it in under a year

Re:No PowerBook G5 (1)

FosterKanig (645454) | about 9 years ago | (#13829734)

You spelt "showers" wrong.

Re:No PowerBook G5 (1)

kitzilla (266382) | about 9 years ago | (#13829657)

Everyone who actually thinks there will be G5 PowerBooks at this point, please stand up.

Crickets?

No, even the crickets are sitting this one out.

I'm ready for a new laptop, and these are very nice machines. But I'll nurse my iBook alsong until Intel. Those PowerMacs, though: wow. Well worth buying TODAY. If this is a peek at the next generation of Macs, they're going to be both muscular and modern.

Re:No PowerBook G5 (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 9 years ago | (#13829752)

Hell, I'm amazed anyone is actually planning on buying ANY Apple hardware based on the obsolete PowerPC architecture. I know I'm kind of pissed I got stuck with a 1.67 GHz G4 Powerbook that I bought at the end of May before I knew they were switching to Intel.. otherwise I would've just waited an extra year for a shiny new Intel-based Powerbook. Hopefully I'll get at least 2 years of service out of this laptop before I have to junk it though... you never know when software vendors will just up and decide to drop PPC support completely. Could be next summer, could be a year after that, but they will do it.

Next week. (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | about 9 years ago | (#13829458)

Apple Announces Google Buyout.

Slashcrew Jizz All Over The Place.

Internet Destroyed By Microsoft And the Unite Nations.

50% Off Sale @ Macy's

New Apple Products (-1, Flamebait)

Profane Motherfucker (564659) | about 9 years ago | (#13829466)

Does it really matter what Apple releases? I'm sure it will come in a white/silver box, offer relatively little functionality but excellent form, and eagerly be gobbled up by the swine at the trough.

People, I used to have that MacOS hysteria too. It passes once you realize that you could have purchased a dirty bomb for the same amount of money Apple products cost.

Powerbook Resolution (4, Insightful)

rjstanford (69735) | about 9 years ago | (#13829472)

Finally Apple has upped the resolution on their powerbooks to something more reasonable (at least, reasonable to me - other people have different requirements). Whoops, no, I tell a lie, its only on their 15" and 17" models. The 12" i^HpowerBook is still at 1024x768. If this had been equally increased, I'd be very happy. As it is, the form factor is perfect but the resolution just too limiting for it to be my standard road machine.

Re:Powerbook Resolution (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 9 years ago | (#13829541)

As it is, the form factor is perfect but the resolution just too limiting for it to be my standard road machine.

I guess Apple didn't get your TPS report. Did you include the cover sheet?

Re:Powerbook Resolution (2, Interesting)

Thu25245 (801369) | about 9 years ago | (#13829615)

The 12" i^HpowerBook is still at 1024x768

And it's hard enough to read at that resolution. Trust me, I have one, and I use an external monitor to take some of the burden of of my eyes. Remember, a Mac has traditionally rendered 1point=1pixel.

Aperture prerequisites (4, Interesting)

Lord Satri (609291) | about 9 years ago | (#13829476)

An interesting surprise is the prerequisites. Based on http://www.apple.com/aperture/specs.html [apple.com] , Aperture requires a state-of-the-art mac:

Recommended System
        * Dual 2GHz Power Mac G5 or faster
        * 2GB of RAM
        * One of the following graphics cards:
                    o ATI Radeon X800 XT Mac Edition
                    o ATI Radeon 9800 XT or 9800 Pro
                    o NVIDIA GeForce 6800 Ultra DDL or 6800 GT DDL
                    o NVIDIA GeForce 7800 GT
                    o NVIDIA Quadro FX 4500
        * 5GB of disk space for application, templates, and tutorial
        * DVD drive for installation

Probably they'll eventually offer a "light" version of Aperture, like they did with Final Cut and Logic Audio, other "Pro" software.

Re:Aperture prerequisites (1)

Wesley Felter (138342) | about 9 years ago | (#13829509)

Probably they'll eventually offer a "light" version of Aperture

Isn't that iPhoto? Is there really room for a third product in between iPhoto and Aperture?

Re:Aperture prerequisites (1)

FidelCatsro (861135) | about 9 years ago | (#13829641)

Well they are missing a Semi-pro option

Re:Aperture prerequisites (1)

Lord Satri (609291) | about 9 years ago | (#13829656)

Isn't that iPhoto? Is there really room for a third product in between iPhoto and Aperture?

Well, for Logic Audio:
Logic Pro / Logic Express / GarageBand
For Final Cut:
Final Cut Pro / Final Cut Express / iMovie

So I guess they could create an Aperture Express!

Re:Aperture prerequisites (1)

Tumbleweed (3706) | about 9 years ago | (#13829593)

There's a big difference between 'recommended' and 'required,' which you didn't catch. Check again - the required is only a single 1.8gHz system with (only) 1GB of RAM, a far cry from the recommended setup.

Re:Aperture prerequisites (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 9 years ago | (#13829659)

Actually, you need to check again as well.

The last system they list under the Minimum System Requirements is:
"15- or 17-inch PowerBook G4 with a 1.25 GHz or faster PowerPC G4 processor"

I agree the OP was wrong, but so were you.

Hmmm, (3, Interesting)

temojen (678985) | about 9 years ago | (#13829477)

A product in the same price-class as Photoshop CS, but not the same feature-class... I wonder how that'll fair in the market...

Re:Hmmm, (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | about 9 years ago | (#13829546)

FARE, not FAIR, you dumb nigger.

Re:Hmmm, (2, Insightful)

idobi (820896) | about 9 years ago | (#13829568)

It's a totally different product. Photoshop doesn't have anywhere near the workflow that Aperature provides. Non destructive RAW processing, applying exposure processing to multiple files, and desktop organization is a godsend for professional photographers.

Re:Hmmm, (1)

neonstz (79215) | about 9 years ago | (#13829717)

Adobe Camera Raw, which is included in Photoshop, can do non-destructive RAW processing (crop, white balance, brightness, exposure, saturation etc), use the same settings for multiple raw files etc. Combined with Adobe Bridge it is quite powerful.

Re:Hmmm, (4, Insightful)

Mikey-San (582838) | about 9 years ago | (#13829579)

Aperture isn't competing with Photoshop, it's competing with things like this:

PhaseOne's Capture One [phaseone.com]

Re:Hmmm, (3, Informative)

jedrek (79264) | about 9 years ago | (#13829613)

It's a different piece of software. The most similar thing I can find is Capture One [phaseone.com] which is in exactly the same price category with a much shorter feature list. This is pro software for photo professionals. If its organizational tools (and that really is a possibility) save a pro 5 hours (at $100/h) of work or a single reshoot, it'll be worth it.

Re:Hmmm, (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | about 9 years ago | (#13829639)

Ice cream is more expensive than soup, but it tastes different. I'm thinking soup will become the next dessert.

Re:Hmmm, (1, Insightful)

Kaa (21510) | about 9 years ago | (#13829713)

A product in the same price-class as Photoshop CS, but not the same feature-class... I wonder how that'll fair in the market...

I'd say, badly (and you probably meant "fare", not "fair"). Cut the price to under $100 and things may change.

God knows, Photoshop needs competition, but this isn't it (at least yet). Aperture is in the Photoshop Elements class for photo editing purposes, but it also seems to have useful database/organisation features.

It may turn out to be a decent tool for "serious amateurs" :-) but it won't replace Photoshop for professionals.

The time to buy is now for PowerMac G5 (4, Insightful)

rizzo320 (911761) | about 9 years ago | (#13829478)

These are some of the most expandible workstations Apple has ever released. 16GB of RAM and a TB of storage makes a killer multimedia editing workstation all around. If you are weary of the Intel switchover, the time to buy is now. The workstations should hold you over well into the second and third revisions of Apple Intel hardware at least.

Re:The time to buy is now for PowerMac G5 (1, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | about 9 years ago | (#13829706)

it's 'wary', not 'weary'. weary means tired of.

Re:The time to buy is now for PowerMac G5 (1)

blamanj (253811) | about 9 years ago | (#13829708)

The workstations should hold you over well into the second and third revisions of Apple Intel hardware at least.

Not only that, but buying PPC Macs will save you money in software upgrade costs. Yes, the Intel hardware will run your software in emulation mode, but if there's anything you really need to use at full speed, you'll have to pay for an upgrade.

Price? (0, Flamebait)

jshaped (899227) | about 9 years ago | (#13829482)

Great... but why don't they also decrease the price of entry?
- they could easily sell the older models at a decrease price.
I would love to try a Mac, but they still don't have any try-me prices.
(yes, I know there's the mac mini, but from what I've read, I don't consider it to be fully representative of what apple and OSX can offer.)

Re:Price? (1)

temojen (678985) | about 9 years ago | (#13829571)

Mac Mini, eMac, and iBook are their low-end models. No, they're not everything a Mac can be. The reason is obvious. They are low-end models.

Re:Price? (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 9 years ago | (#13829583)

$1299 for the new iMac with 1.9GHz G5 and 17 inch LCD monitor is not a terrible entry price point. Much better than historically for Apple.

And while Apple doesn't sell their old models direct after a rollout, many others (macmall, etc) do.

Re:Price? (1)

BandwidthHog (257320) | about 9 years ago | (#13829588)

I know there's the mac mini, but from what I've read, I don't consider it to be fully representative of what apple and OSX can offer.

It is. I’ve used one. It’s just like a larger Mac, only not as large. And with a slower hard drive. In fact, it’s essentially an iBook with no LCD or battery.

Yes, G5/Quad would be much faster, can take more RAM, has a better video card, etc. But it works just the same.

Re:Price? (5, Informative)

CrawlingEvil (750859) | about 9 years ago | (#13829638)

Go to the Apple Store [apple.com] and look on the opening page. Near the bottom on the right hand side you'll see a red "Sale" tag. Click that and then scroll down about 2/5 the way down the page.

In general, this is where Apple sells over stock and refurbished machines. Unfortunately, there's no way to tell the difference, but whether refurbished or old stock, they come with the same warrantees. No, they don't really advertise these in proud, bold print accross the front page of the store, as they want to sell new machines, but they're there for the buying, if you know where to look.

Re:Price? (1)

jshaped (899227) | about 9 years ago | (#13829695)

thanks!!!
those are some substantial savings...

Re:EDU pricing (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 9 years ago | (#13829643)

Check out their Educational discounts on their home page.

Re:Price? (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 9 years ago | (#13829664)

Well, you're wrong. It is fully representitive. Get one and love it.

Lame (-1, Flamebait)

Anonymous Coward | about 9 years ago | (#13829486)

Still only one mouse button. Apple sucks.

Re:Lame (1)

FidelCatsro (861135) | about 9 years ago | (#13829684)

Parent is a joke I think .. Apple are now shipping them with the new Mighty mouse

It should be noted that..... (3, Informative)

8127972 (73495) | about 9 years ago | (#13829495)

.... With all of these updates, the 12" PowerBook Specs are exactly the same as before this announcement (that is it uses DDR333 RAM, has NVIDIA Go5200 64MB video, etc.) with the exception of the DVD-RW drive being standard.

Re:It should be noted that..... (1)

CrazyWingman (683127) | about 9 years ago | (#13829692)

The hard drive also got bumped up 20GB (from 60 to 80). RAM is also cheaper now - 1GB is down to $250 from $475.

Re:It should be noted that..... (2, Informative)

tktk (540564) | about 9 years ago | (#13829757)

Well, not exactly...the price got lowered. $1499 used to be the price of a 12" with only the combo drive. Now for $1499 you get the Superdrive. I think it's a $200 price drop.

Re:It should be noted that..... (1)

Empty Yo (828138) | about 9 years ago | (#13829766)

And that it now has a digital audio out according to the website. My 12" has analog only.

Powerbook Screen (1)

Tiberius_Fel (770739) | about 9 years ago | (#13829499)

The powerbook screen upgrade is a really nice thing. It was one thing that always made me not feel so good about the apple laptops. But now they've got great screens. If only they had a touchpad equivalent of the mighty mouse...

Apple and Adobe (1)

JymBrittain (880082) | about 9 years ago | (#13829502)

Aperture...one more slap in the face of Adobe. I'm waiting for Adobe to wake up and give Apple the big ..|.,

Re:Apple and Adobe (4, Interesting)

CountBrass (590228) | about 9 years ago | (#13829559)

Some time ago Adobe announced they would no longer target the Mac first. I think you'll find this is Apple responding to a slap in the face from Adobe.

Re:Apple and Adobe (1)

idobi (820896) | about 9 years ago | (#13829607)

Not to mention that it can also be a warning to Adobe that Apple is ready to fill the void should Adobe drag their feet on OS X support.

Re:Apple and Adobe (0, Flamebait)

JymBrittain (880082) | about 9 years ago | (#13829748)

That's what the world needs...a computer by Apple that runs only software written by Apple. Oh wait...we pretty much have that now.

Next Week (3, Insightful)

jessebs (777428) | about 9 years ago | (#13829506)

I hope next week they finally add something to itunes to monitor changes to a directory. thats all I really need at this point

Re:Next Week (1)

clf8 (93379) | about 9 years ago | (#13829577)

Like, to see when you've added a music file to the directory, then it automatically get's added to iTunes? Write a Folder Action Applescript, or use the Automator. Not that I know how to do either of these, but it can be done. Or check out Doug's Applescripts, one might already exist.

G5s (1)

dogmatixpsych (786818) | about 9 years ago | (#13829514)

Some more random info:
You can also add up to 16 Gb of RAM!
In addition, you could add 4 graphics cards (1 16x, 1 8x, 2 4x) and connect 8 digital montiors to your Mac.
You can add a Quadro FX 4500 card and have dual 30" displays hooked up to your G5.
They also come with dual independent gigabit ethernet.

These look like pretty cool computers. I'll still wait for the Intel-based macs, but Apple keeps innovating.

All that... (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | about 9 years ago | (#13829515)

and it still can't play Half Life 2.

Loving the Dual Core Hype (2, Interesting)

intmainvoid (109559) | about 9 years ago | (#13829519)

Apple must really be loving the hype over dual core cpus - looks like they're getting away with "upgrading" the two lower dual cpu Powermacs to a single dual core cpu. Isn't that going to be, uh, slower?

Only the 2 x dual core top of the line model is an improvement over the mac it's replacing, the dual 2.7GHz.

Does the software keep the ... (2)

Karma_fucker_sucker (898393) | about 9 years ago | (#13829522)

old darkroom paradigm? I loved working in darkrooms and there were things that one could do with an enlarger for effects - lightening/darkening some areas of a photo, increasing contrast, masks & filters, tectures, etc... use your imagination.

Or are they using their own terms for prcedures and effects? I ask this because I used to work in darkrooms with film and I'm wondering how would I transition to digital.

On another note, I really miss using the chemicals, film, and paper. Digital still hasn't achieved the image quality of film - but it's getting there real quick! Sigh....

Needs this (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 9 years ago | (#13829539)

What Apple needs to do is to release a PowerMac with a much snappier user interface (even the fastest Mac is not snappy when it comes to handling the user interface). That will make a significant difference to desktop users like me, rather than more CPU power for "certain applications."

One can hope this wish will be satisfied, at least to some extent, in the upcoming x86 Macs.

-srr

Not Bad, Not Spectacular (2, Interesting)

dave1212 (652688) | about 9 years ago | (#13829551)

New Power Macs can take up to 16 GB DDR2 RAM, have PCI Express, and can power up to four 30" displays or eight 23" or 20" ones.

The thing that caught my eye was the addition of a second gigabit ethernet port. Dual gigabit ethernet ports means instant network rendering for Logic Node, XGrid, or any app that supports it. No expensive (given, these Macs are costly enough as is) gigabit router needed.

Aperture looks interesting, although it requires a more powerful machine than mine, just like Motion. Working with RAW data from start to finish sounds wicked. Not sure about US$499 wicked, but cool nonetheless.

For some reason, Apple offers an upgrade price on the product page, that links to the Motion 2 upgrade. Not really sure what's going on with that.

Re:Not Bad, Not Spectacular (1)

dogmatixpsych (786818) | about 9 years ago | (#13829669)

I think they can only do 2 30" displays max. Still cool nonetheless.

Attention PRO Apple Fags! (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | about 9 years ago | (#13829561)

Don't forget to snap your thin gay dicks shut in the lids of your crappy PRO PowerBooks!

Operator Overloading (4, Funny)

Tackhead (54550) | about 9 years ago | (#13829569)

> no PowerBook G5). They also introduced a new professional photography application known as Aperture, rounding out their software lineup for creative professionals.

...but when they do, they'll guarantee that the living hell is confused out of of camera buffs, Macheads, Photoshop users, and, well, just about every search engine on the planet.

"Your problem is that you didn't correctly set the aperture on your G5 [dpreview.com] , which accounts for the bad results in Aperture [apple.com] on your G5 [apple.com] . That's because aperture data isn't recorded in the Aperture suite, so creative professionals should use Creative Suite [adobe.com] , and don't even think of swapping your iPod Photo for a G5 and the Zen player made by these guys [creative.com] , and be thankful that Creative doesn't make a sound card for the G5 either.

Who the hell hired Bjarne Stroustroup as a product marketing specialist, and why, dear, God, why, did he accept? :)

Re:Operator Overloading (1)

ek_adam (442283) | about 9 years ago | (#13829771)

"Your problem is that you didn't correctly set the aperture on your G5, which accounts for the bad results in Aperture on your G5. That's because aperture data isn't recorded in the Aperture suite...

Ah, you haven't looked at the EXIF information. Aperture does capture the aperture.

More like a PowerCrook (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 9 years ago | (#13829573)

I bought my 15" PB in November 2003 - I'll mark it down in the annuals that this was the best time is history to buy a powerbook. With the upcoming intel chips, now it is the worst.

Is this really newsworthy? (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 9 years ago | (#13829586)

Do we really need to frontpage it every time apple announces a new release? Especially one that's relatively trivial (oooh, higher resolutions on powerbooks and an application 95% of us will never use)? I wonder if the Slashdot wankery over Apple has finally gone overboard.

Oh my! (1)

dhoughal (711859) | about 9 years ago | (#13829644)

My actual computer is a Centrino ThinkPad, but after the buy-out of the ThinkPad line I'm sure that my next laptop will surely be a 15" Powerbook. What a neat machine!

Aperature is not Photoshop (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 9 years ago | (#13829653)

It's competition is CaptureOne from PhaseOne. And a little bit of Extensis Portfolio.

Why make this release now? A tiny Apple error... (1)

andyatkinson (896462) | about 9 years ago | (#13829665)

I think Apple should have "released" their refreshed Powerbook and G5 models in a few weeks, and let the new iPods and iMacs "settle in" a bit. It seems like they are rushing their release milestones a bit. Is piracy to blame? Also, I noticed a small image error on their Apple page, check my blog for details.
http://andyatkinson.blogspot.com/2005/10/new-power books-g5s-aperturebut-why.html [blogspot.com]

I sure can (-1, Flamebait)

Anonymous Coward | about 9 years ago | (#13829672)

I sure as hell can wait. What, more repackaged crap that already existed on Windows with a clunky interface and stupid idealistic imagry of Job's utopia universe?

I'll pass.

Please Apple, save us from Finale (2, Interesting)

radicalskeptic (644346) | about 9 years ago | (#13829673)

In the past couple years, Apple has been releasing really great pro-level apps for music, video, and now photography. This is good, but what *I* really want is a competitor for MakeMusic's Finale [finalemusic.com] , which is a professional-grade program for music notation (like Microsoft Word, but for musical scores).

Finale is actually really powerful (and expensive). It can do pretty much anything most people need for their notation. Unfortunately, it is the worst UI trainwreck I have ever encountered. It is lacking in a clear, simple, unified interface or an intuitive organization. Seemingly simple and basic options are buried deep in the mess. And the help files are almost worthless.

For example, instead of clicking notes in, you can use your keyboard to enter notes.

But I don't know what key does what.
So I go into the key map options, but I still can't find the default key map. It just allows me to create a custom key map.
I'm like 'okay the help files will learn me where the default or current key map is--or maybe even tell me WHAT it is!'
Nope. No search results for "key map" in the really outdated help software that comes with it (it looks like it is a port from OS 9).

This kind of stuff happens to me all the time. Apple, please release "Notes" or something! You could make a killing!

30" display price drop (2, Informative)

happyemoticon (543015) | about 9 years ago | (#13829705)

This is the first I heard of it, but when I was going to play around with the new pricing options, I noticed that the 30" display was $2499 instead of 3 grand. I'm pretty sure it was 3 grand a week ago.

Nikon Capture (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 9 years ago | (#13829774)

Can't find much actual information on that Apple site about Aperture because of all the white blocks where the stupid plugins would go, but anyone able to give a good guestimate of how it'd compare to Nikon Capture [nikonimaging.com] ? (Other than supporting all kinds of raw files?)

I tried switching to that a year ago, but it just never happened. Far too much of my workflow is in Photoshop, and all the little user interface details that I never really consciously noticed before were missing in Capture.
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