Beta
×

Welcome to the Slashdot Beta site -- learn more here. Use the link in the footer or click here to return to the Classic version of Slashdot.

Thank you!

Before you choose to head back to the Classic look of the site, we'd appreciate it if you share your thoughts on the Beta; your feedback is what drives our ongoing development.

Beta is different and we value you taking the time to try it out. Please take a look at the changes we've made in Beta and  learn more about it. Thanks for reading, and for making the site better!

Blu-ray Coming Out On Top?

ScuttleMonkey posted more than 8 years ago | from the i-copy-blu-leader dept.

Software 360

wh0pper writes "Some interesting information came out at at the latest Blu-ray Disc Association meeting at Twentieth Century Fox Studios. Apparently, 90 percent of the CE industry and seven movie studios now back Blu-ray Disc. And most of the IT industry (except Microsoft) also supports Blu-ray Disc. This has prompted Mr. Parsons, Senior VP of Advanced Products Development for Pioneer Electronics, to say "There's no format war looming because it's not Blu-ray vs. HD DVD. It's simply Blu-ray versus standard definition DVD... Currently, DVD has 50,000 titles presently available, and both formats will co-exist for several years to come with new BD players supporting both formats. BD players make the perfect complement to new HDTVs that are being purchased by consumers." Mr. Parsons then announced that the upcoming CES would be used to launch Blu-ray Disc."

Sorry! There are no comments related to the filter you selected.

Woot (-1, Redundant)

Snowspinner (627098) | more than 8 years ago | (#14244675)

Good news and first post. I've gotta use /. at 1:30 more often.

Bye, Tookie! (0, Troll)

Adolf Hitroll (562418) | more than 8 years ago | (#14244692)

Either you or the guy that got you where you are obviously took the wrong lives. Had Schwarzie been maimed, you'd have one more chance to survive the amoronican idiocy.
Anyway, it's not worse than being sent in Iraq for Bush's banker.
It's now obvious that you, yankees (no capital, you don't desserve it) have to assume what's gonna happen in "Hell A".

Re:Woot (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#14244915)

slashdot should filter out any posts in the first X posts that has 'fp' 'fristy psot' 'frosty piss' or any of the other scrabble misfits that find their way into first posts. Would be nice if worthless posts like this just disappeared off the radar.

fp (-1, Troll)

patmc (136958) | more than 8 years ago | (#14244676)

first post?

fpfpfp (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#14244678)

fp

My DVR doesn't read DVD-RAM discs anymore (3, Interesting)

ReformedExCon (897248) | more than 8 years ago | (#14244681)

It used to read DVD-RAM discs just fine. Now, it says that the disc is unreadable.

I'm another victim of the DVD format wars.

I'm glad that the industry is standardizing the next generation media now when there are very few (any?) players on the market. It's good to have a standard, even if it is a de facto standard rather than a de jure standard.

Re:My DVR doesn't read DVD-RAM discs anymore (4, Insightful)

Docmach (785888) | more than 8 years ago | (#14244685)

I agree. Even though I am on the Blu-Ray side I'll just be happy to have one standard. It does seem that there are many technical reasons to use Blu-Ray, though.

Re:My DVR doesn't read DVD-RAM discs anymore (4, Informative)

Craig Davison (37723) | more than 8 years ago | (#14244717)

I thought it was just one technical reason: the capacity of the disc. That's really all there was to it, right?
The point HD-DVD had going for it was that the discs and players would have been cheaper to make.

Re:My DVR doesn't read DVD-RAM discs anymore (4, Insightful)

el americano (799629) | more than 8 years ago | (#14245107)

Theoretical capacity or capacity-in-a-laboratory is completely irrelevant and is comparable to this press release that claims Blu-ray is what consumers want, even though you can't buy any movies in either format yet. The fact remains that HD movies only require twice the space that a regular movie does, so the first cheap player for cheap discs @ 20GB should be the winner.

Hmmm, let's see... Panasonic's Blu-ray player costs $2780 with $69 for the mythical 50GB disc or $32 for the real-world 25GB disc. Nope, not there yet. Not there in 2006 at all, I think.

Personally, I think consumers are going to be hard to push from good-enough DVDs to over-hyped hi-def anyway. Add to that a ridiculous DRM that requires new TVs and monitors and prohibits copies of media that's likely to be less durable than DVD (especially Blu-ray), then I know I'm going to save a fortune by not buying any of it. Non-DRM dual-layer DVD will be my solution of choice until they offer me something truly better.

Re:My DVR doesn't read DVD-RAM discs anymore (4, Informative)

Jason1729 (561790) | more than 8 years ago | (#14244839)

There's plenty of technical reasons to use blu-ray.

There is very invasive DRM measures in blu-ray that make divx look like it would make Richard Stallman proud. You need to get permission every time you play a disc, and your discs are permanently mated to your player. You can't play your disc at a friends house or in another room in your house, and if your player breaks, you lose your whole DVD collection.

The studios love it but the consumers will be totally screwed over by it.

Re:My DVR doesn't read DVD-RAM discs anymore (0, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#14244870)

>There is very invasive DRM measures in blu-ray that make divx look like it would make Richard Stallman proud. You need to get permission every time you play a disc, and your discs are permanently mated to your player. You can't play your disc at a friends house or in another room in your house, and if your player breaks, you lose your whole DVD collection.

What discs??? I certainly won't be buying any such disks.

Re:My DVR doesn't read DVD-RAM discs anymore (1)

sniepre (517796) | more than 8 years ago | (#14244911)

I don't understand how this is a reason to use Blu-ray.. ? I don't personally want any DRM that comes close to that and I don't think it would last in the market more than a week before someone says "Why is my disc broken?"

I'm assuming the invasive DRM you refer to is not included in those technical reasons to use Blu-ray or something.?? *shrugs*

Re:My DVR doesn't read DVD-RAM discs anymore (4, Insightful)

Scarblac (122480) | more than 8 years ago | (#14244980)

Well, current DVDs already have invasive DRM. Mandatory ads, hard to copy, etc. I guess you refuse to watch them?

Whatever the new standard will be, they're all DRMed out the wazoo. That's just not a choice, seen from the industry.

Re:My DVR doesn't read DVD-RAM discs anymore (5, Insightful)

16K Ram Pack (690082) | more than 8 years ago | (#14244936)

The content industry is going to see a serious backlash if they try this.

They tried region coding, and people over here in the UK just got players chipped and hacked. Everyone I know has a multiregion player so that they can watch unavailable US movies or cheaper far east versions.

Start telling people that they can't lend a movie to a mate, and they'll either boycott, or work out a way around.

Re:My DVR doesn't read DVD-RAM discs anymore (3, Insightful)

moro_666 (414422) | more than 8 years ago | (#14244961)

what a waste of time.

if i have the discplayer, it obviously has output channels to a tv and to a sound system.

so obviously i can rip it off from these same outputs. they can have all the drm they want, a bit divx encoding in there which loses their mighty "identification" spots that have been under discussion here somewhere, and the movies will again be out on the torrent sites. sure it will lose some quality, but i don't really think that downloaders will mind the drop of quality in such tiny amounts. (now camrips and ts's are loss of quality, a clean cablerip is as good as it can be on your tv). if you have a tv/video card with tv-in port, you're the man and the drm people are wasted.

if you really think that drm works, show me a drm that can't be just cableripped or that hasn't been cracked by software already (oh that dvd region joke never expires i guess...).

any measure they make with 3 years will be hacked with 3 months. any big secret about drm that you trust into taiwan hardware makers (hdtv producers for example) will be out soon enough & counter measured to make the whole investment in drm a total waste. and the saddest thing is that taiwan&china produce massive amount of everyday electronics already and the advanced countries can't afford to cut these out of the production system.

don't the movie/soundmakers really understand that the only bloody way to fight piracy is to lower the prices and make the content affordable ? this is the only thing that will ever decrease the piracy.

fight the bloody problem and not the results it creates.

Re:My DVR doesn't read DVD-RAM discs anymore (1)

RoLi (141856) | more than 8 years ago | (#14245020)

(now camrips and ts's are loss of quality, a clean cablerip is as good as it can be on your tv).

Actually when done professionally, a camrip off your TFT-TV can be just as good as transferring it by cable. When using a good test-pattern, you can get 1:1 pixel alignment. A good engineer might also be able to rip off the electronics of a digital TV.

I'm pretty sure professional pirates (in Asia) are willing to do this, so whatever DRM the industry may try won't change a thing.

Re:My DVR doesn't read DVD-RAM discs anymore (1)

Stripe7 (571267) | more than 8 years ago | (#14245064)

They are encoding signals into the HDTV signal and DRM chips into the camcorders so that it scrambles the picture if is sees the do not record signal.

Re:My DVR doesn't read DVD-RAM discs anymore (1)

Kjella (173770) | more than 8 years ago | (#14245120)

They are encoding signals into the HDTV signal and DRM chips into the camcorders so that it scrambles the picture if is sees the do not record signal.

Record the upper half, lower half, left half, right half, turn the camera 90 degrees, 180 degrees, do some kind of stillframe-photo with automatic page step, take your pick... Maybe they can stop consumer camcorders pointed at a cinema screen, but in an environment outside their control it's just not going to happen.

Re:My DVR doesn't read DVD-RAM discs anymore (1)

whogben (919335) | more than 8 years ago | (#14245069)

Downloading fiscally just isn't a big deal. Out here in the real-world, not that many people download, and those who do definitely wouldn't consider buying the movie. Movie rentals are barely impacted by downloading - as a movie rental is a choice of convenience rather than pure economic consideration. It doesn't matter to the big manufacturers that their DRM will be broken by super geeks and the disgruntled tech savvy will download their movies. The actual number of paying customers that choose to download instead is fairly small. DRM just needs to make it inconvenient for the average, perhaps even below average user. How many of our parents would download and burn a copy of a movie to watch it on the downstairs TV - instead of just renting it. DRM is not an all or nothing battle. Its not whether it can be hacked, but how comfortable the hacking process is for the majority of *paying* customers. That said, if it ties down to one player when you put it in, people will rebel! I don't believe that the discs will do that - afterall - video rental would be over. The infrastructure isnt quite in place for all digital delivery yet.

irrellevant (1)

BoneMarrow (577933) | more than 8 years ago | (#14245071)

soon after release you will be able to buy a blu-ray burner all you have to do is rip the protection and 'roll your own' just like we do with dvd today. copy protection is doomed to fail because the scheme is fixed you only have to break it once and anything using that scheme is also unlocked.

People can make up statistics to prove anything... (1, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#14244684)

Forty percent of people know that.

Re:People can make up statistics to prove anything (1)

MikeyVB (787338) | more than 8 years ago | (#14244923)

Forty percent of people know that.

Yes, but seventy-three percent of statistics are made up!

Re:People can make up statistics to prove anything (1)

jedZ (571869) | more than 8 years ago | (#14244969)

but then forty nine percent of people have a below-average IQ

Technology driver (3, Insightful)

MyIS (834233) | more than 8 years ago | (#14244688)

As usual, the pron industry will decide which format wins.

Re:Technology driver (1)

AwaxSlashdot (600672) | more than 8 years ago | (#14244706)

Funny ?! Mod parent interesting/relevant.

Re:Technology driver (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#14244745)

That's pr0n you retarded n00b. If you wanna pretend to be 1337, you gotta know the terminology at least.

Re:Technology driver (-1, Offtopic)

MyIS (834233) | more than 8 years ago | (#14244760)

That's pr0n you retarded n00b. If you wanna pretend to be 1337, you gotta know the terminology at least.

I'm turning in my Slashdot badge as I type this. *rolls eyes*

Re:Technology driver (5, Insightful)

ChadN (21033) | more than 8 years ago | (#14244825)

I have discovered that DVD has easily more than enough picture clarity for my pron watching needs, and I'm not sure I am really looking forward to HD porn... Maybe I just got used to grainy porn, but the high color fidelity, high contrast, and glisteningly realistic porn of DVD (rather than old school film transfer) is already more than a bit off-putting for me, sometimes.

As for dual angles: I wish they'd pick one angle and stick to it (hey, no pun intended), rather than have a movie edited to constantly switch cameras on me. Whenever it switches to bung-hole cam, I hit the alternate angle button, and by the time it actually switches (a few seconds), the movie cuts back to brown-eye-vision. If they really want to advance the technology, they should build a "hairy, bobbing man-ass" pixelizer right into the DVDs, for us more reserved porn enthusiasts.

Hi definition porn (1)

barefootgenius (926803) | more than 8 years ago | (#14245003)

And think of the make up bills. Instead of just covering some unfortunate news anchors face you would have to paint brush the whole porn star so every zit, shaving mark or ingrown hair didn't leap onto the screen. And botox isn't gonna work either (although with some of them you wonder if they have already made that leap).

Re:Technology driver (1)

woolio (927141) | more than 8 years ago | (#14245116)

If they really want to advance the technology, they should build a "hairy, bobbing man-ass" pixelizer right into the DVDs, for us more reserved porn enthusiasts.


Can you imagine someone explaining that one to their PhD committee?

Re:Technology driver (2, Interesting)

NotAnotherReboot (262125) | more than 8 years ago | (#14244831)

Oh, come now. This comment is repeatedly echoed in every article about Blu-ray vs. HD-DVD. It's almost becoming groupthink of a sort, if so many people keep saying it, I might as well say it too!

Do you really think if the porn industry decided to go for HD-DVD while 9/10 of the major movie studios went for Bluray that HD-DVD would win out? And here's another hint: the porn industry is concerned with making money; they will go to either format that wins out.

The only reason this keeps coming up is because years ago, Sony didn't want porn on Betamax and it often cited as one of the reasons for its downfall (hint: it wasn't the only one).

Re:Technology driver (2, Insightful)

Drakonite (523948) | more than 8 years ago | (#14244892)

Porn has a history of adapting to new technology a lot faster than the major movie studios. They end up as essentially the first group to pick up a format, which then gives that format a big lead in terms of acceptance and units sold. The extra lead snowballs into the format dominating over the other.

Admit it, which ever group is the most expiremental and fastest to move and use a new media the most tends to get to choose which direction it goes, and I don't think anyone would argue against the porn industry being the fastest moving and most experimental.

Re:Technology driver (4, Insightful)

Ztream (584474) | more than 8 years ago | (#14245029)

Yeah, but does anyone actually buy porn on a disc anymore? It would seem to me that the porn industry is already way beyond that, having offered downloadable and streaming content for years.

Re:Technology driver (4, Insightful)

Kjella (173770) | more than 8 years ago | (#14244868)

In that case, DVD will win. Seriously, only a few top producers like Hustler, Playboy and such appriciate HDTV, because they got the means to hire real beauties. Your average porn actress does *not* look more attractive in HDTV. The porn industry jumped all over DVD primarily because of random access. No more rewind/forward, easy looping, play at quarter/half speed and so on. Porn does not need to be watched in a linear, start-to-end fashion. What does HDTV bring to porn producers? Honestly, only much higher demands on them. But with HDTV cams at $1600 (Sony HDR-HC1) and dropping, perhaps it'll happen anyway. But I don't think the porn industry will lead it.

DVD will win (4, Insightful)

Aceticon (140883) | more than 8 years ago | (#14245050)

In that case, DVD will win. Seriously, only a few top producers like Hustler, Playboy and such appriciate HDTV, because they got the means to hire real beauties. Your average porn actress does *not* look more attractive in HDTV. The porn industry jumped all over DVD primarily because of random access. No more rewind/forward, easy looping, play at quarter/half speed and so on. Porn does not need to be watched in a linear, start-to-end fashion. What does HDTV bring to porn producers? Honestly, only much higher demands on them. But with HDTV cams at $1600 (Sony HDR-HC1) and dropping, perhaps it'll happen anyway. But I don't think the porn industry will lead it

I have to agree on this one.

Furthermore, as i see it, the only possible benefict that moving to a new format can give to the porn industry is "high definition content". This might be a real benefict for the part of the industry that concentrates on showing naked physically perfect women - aka softcore - (or maybe not if they rely on the technology to disguise the imperfections) but what value does it add to the part of the industry that concentrates on the action - aka hardcore. After all, most hardcore movies are hardly known for the grandeur of the scenarios (or the depth of the stories, or the quality of the acting of their casting)

If you think back to the change from videotapes to DVDs, you can see clear beneficts to the industry:
  • A DVD (in a standaard DVD box) will use 1/2 the space of a videotape. This means you can store and transport twice the number of DVDs than videotapes.
  • Manufacturing of DVDs is cheaper and more reliable. It can be easilly outsourced and also scales up more easilly (pay another 200$, get 1000 DVDs more)
  • DVDs (as long as packed in DVD boxes) are less likelly to get damaged on transport, especially due to external factors such as strong magnetic fields
  • Lets also not forget that resistance to damage on transport and size (and weight) are also relevant for mail delivery


As i see it, none of these new technologies seems to bring any comparable beneficts for a business model such as the one from the porn industry.

Obvious beneficts for the traditional film industry, such as getting their customers to (again) buy their personal film library in another format, are hardly applicable to the porn industry - there is hardly a hot market for a new edition of "Debbie Does Dalas"

Re:Technology driver (1)

this great guy (922511) | more than 8 years ago | (#14244972)

As usual, the pr0n industry will decide which format wins.

Yep. This time they choosed the brunette over the blonde.

I, for one, welcome our SONY & DRM overlords.. (2, Interesting)

Hitto (913085) | more than 8 years ago | (#14244693)

Or maybe not, maybe I'll keep on pirating my movies and music instead of giving another cent to the majors.
Screw them. I prefer indie stuff anyways.

Dubious Victory... (1)

aws910 (671068) | more than 8 years ago | (#14244935)

This was the paragraph that caught my eye:

Apparently, 90 percent of the CE industry and seven movie studios now back Blu-ray Disc. And most of the IT industry (except Microsoft) also supports Blu-ray Disc.

In a PR-War such as this, I think any combatant would be quick to proclaim victory first. It doesn't take Sun Tzu to figure that one out. I mean, who exactly ARE all these "backers" anyway? Without a credible list of backers and non-backers(on both sides), how are we to determine the true victor at this time?

Oh, and about the DRM thing - I wouldn't worry about that. Any system created by man can be defeated by man. Think DeCSS. I think we will see similar hacks with BD, HD-DVD, HVD, etc. The MPAA will get all red-eyed, but there won't be anything they can do about it at the end of the day.

A reich that will last a thousand years! (4, Funny)

Siguy (634325) | more than 8 years ago | (#14244695)

From the bottom of the article: But the bottom-line is that this is an exciting time to be developing next-generation high definition digital TV products that will take us well into the third millennium. ...Right. It's not like we all read news reports last week saying that Blu-Ray and HD-DVD would be replaced with HVDs within 10 years.

Re:A reich that will last a thousand years! (2, Interesting)

thorshammer42 (938406) | more than 8 years ago | (#14244724)

Of course HDTV will be phased out in 15 years and replaced by HrDTV (Higher Def TV). Anything so the TV companies can keep us buying for years to come...

Re:A reich that will last a thousand years! (2, Insightful)

wanax (46819) | more than 8 years ago | (#14244767)

Saying we are in the 3rd millenium (2001-3000) is the same thing as saying we're in the 21st century (2001-2100), or that you're in your 25th year.... it simply implies that we're no longer in the 2nd millenium (1001-2000) or 20th century (1901-2000).

Re:A reich that will last a thousand years! (2, Insightful)

Preeminence (784375) | more than 8 years ago | (#14244768)

Millenium 1: 0-999
Millenium 2: 1000-1999
Millenium 3: 2000-2999

It doesn't have to last a thousand years... it only has to last 10-15 for us to be "well into the 3rd millenium"

Re:A reich that will last a thousand years! (5, Funny)

Siguy (634325) | more than 8 years ago | (#14244861)

I don't see how 10 years can be considered "well into" a thousand years.

If I'm saving up a million dollars to buy a date with Charlize Theron and I save 100 dollars, I'm not really that close, am I?
Sigh, not very close at all.

Re:A reich that will last a thousand years! (1, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#14245055)

If I'm saving up a million dollars to buy a date with Charlize Theron and I save 100 dollars, I'm not really that close, am I? Sigh, not very close at all.

You'll be glad to know that after the terrible mistake that is Aeon Flux, that Charlize will soon be on the market for more affordable prices.

So keep saving good sir. Get to a thousand and you may be in with a chance!

Re:A reich that will last a thousand years! (1)

Eric Smith (4379) | more than 8 years ago | (#14244988)

Actually, they are 1-1000, 1001-2000, and 2001-3000. The year 1 C.E. was the first year of the common era, so the year 1000 was the last year of the first millenium. It's like counting pennies. Your 100th penny is part of your first dollar, not your second dollar.

Re:A reich that will last a thousand years! (1)

Colm Buckley (589428) | more than 8 years ago | (#14245007)

Millenium 1: 0-999
Millenium 2: 1000-1999
Millenium 3: 2000-2999

Someone's got to say it... nope, there was no year 0

Millenium 1: 1-1000
Millenium 2: 1001-2000
Millenium 3: 2001-3000

It appears that the guys who devised the Common Era calendar were a bit hazy about the concept of "zero".

Years are Ordinal Numbers (1)

Derling Whirvish (636322) | more than 8 years ago | (#14245046)

It appears that the guys who devised the Common Era calendar were a bit hazy about the concept of "zero".

It appears that you are a bit hazy about the concept of ordinal number versus cardinal number and the concept of a point versus a period of elapsed time. Years are ordinal numbers describing a period of time equal to 12 months. The "First Year" is the "First Year of the Common Era" or AD 1. It describes the whole 12 months, not the single point in time at the beginning of the year and the point separating the last year before the common era (1 BCE) from the first year of common era (AD 1). Zeroes on a number line describe points not elapsed time. This is the end of the 2,005th year of the common era. Next month we will start the 2006th year. Adding a zeroth year between 1 BCE and AD 1 would be extraordinarily stupid and mathematically innumerate.

More info.... (3, Informative)

Cherita Chen (936355) | more than 8 years ago | (#14244698)

Everything you ever wanted to know about Blue Ray... http://www.blu-ray.com/ [blu-ray.com]

Re:More info.... (1)

cablepokerface (718716) | more than 8 years ago | (#14244979)

The wikipedia community also has a descent explanation [wikipedia.org]

Oh, and donnie is here [imdb.com] .

Skip Blu-Ray - Go To 300GB Holographic Discs (1, Interesting)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#14244700)

I'm going to skip Blu-Ray (54GB max. storage on dual layer) and go straight to 300GB holographic discs instead. And I'll avoid the crappy DRM Blu-Ray is saddled with.

Re:Skip Blu-Ray - Go To 300GB Holographic Discs (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#14244751)

I'm going to skip Holographic discs (300gb max. storage on single layer) and go straight for *insert the bigger disc format here* instead. And I'll avoid the crappy DRM Holographic discs are saddled with.

if you honestly belive the holographic discs will get released to the public without some sort of DRM protection you can just continue dreaming. Unless you own a multi-billion dollar company you won't be able to afford the burner and the discs alone are $100 a pop (granted that is sometimes less then a 300gb hdd) so unless you got tons of money and don't know what to do with it you won't be using holo discs (if they even release them to the public) anytime soon.

untill the day comes where more then a few internet people understand what DRM is and how bad it is you won't be seeing anything without DRM for a good long while...naturally by then it will be to late since there will be laws past outlawing anti-DRM measurse passed everywheres in the world...maybe if the anti-everything people could colonize the moon and setup servers and everything there then it would work but were going down the toilet right now and all the wrong people are in control.

Re:Skip Blu-Ray - Go To 300GB Holographic Discs (3, Insightful)

Tekoneiric (590239) | more than 8 years ago | (#14244807)

I think this is going to be the view of a lot of people including myself. I just don't know how successful a new movie disk format will be given the time for general adoption by the masses vs speed of Internet connections. About the time it hits it's stride in the mass market, faster Internet connections and better on-demand video services will be available.
It took DVDs years to be accepted by the market. They'll have to offer much more with the movies to get the public to want to buy new copies of what they have. With DVD, it was all the extras and the supposedly non-degrading format. Since the consumer already has that with DVD, Blu-ray can't push that so they'll have to push the higher resolution but the general public doesn't really understand that much so it's something really abstract to them. Are they going to sell their soul (DRM) and empty their pocket book to replace their current movies? I doubt it.

Re:Skip Blu-Ray - Go To 300GB Holographic Discs (1)

Teddy Beartuzzi (727169) | more than 8 years ago | (#14244829)

I agree. I think we're looking at many more years before HDTV is ubiquitious, and several years more after that before a dvd replacement really hits big (and I don't believe it will be Blu-ray).

For most of us, dvd quality is all we need.

Re:Skip Blu-Ray - Go To 300GB Holographic Discs (1)

Tekoneiric (590239) | more than 8 years ago | (#14244886)

I like the higher res but it's not enough to prompt me to replace my hundreds of TV & movies DVDs. Plus that awful DRM is a huge negitive. Basically +1 for high-res, -1000 for soul stealing DRM.

Re:Skip Blu-Ray - Go To 300GB Holographic Discs (1)

16K Ram Pack (690082) | more than 8 years ago | (#14244963)

When DVD came out, you could see an improvement with your existing equipment.

With HD you need a new TV to watch HDTV. I'm sure that over time we'll all end up with it, but I'm not going to spend £3000 to replace my TV to watch movies at a slightly higher resolution. I'd rather spend £3000 on cinema tickets than that.

Re:Skip Blu-Ray - Go To 300GB Holographic Discs (1)

ObsessiveMathsFreak (773371) | more than 8 years ago | (#14245094)

they'll have to push the higher resolution but the general public doesn't really understand that much so it's something really abstract to them.

Oh the general public understands HD very well alright. They really just don't care, and at current prices, honestly counldn't be bothered with it.

Re:Skip Blu-Ray - Go To 300GB Holographic Discs (1)

Jugalator (259273) | more than 8 years ago | (#14244921)

Yeah, because when holodiscs have arrived, no one will think of using DRM anymore?
You know both that DRM will be a problem on all BD-ROM discs and it won't be on holodiscs... how?

IPv6 switchover date: December 31, 2008 (0, Offtopic)

Wikipedia (928774) | more than 8 years ago | (#14244704)

So last we heard, some high-tech honchos had gotten together to press Congress on the issue of the official digital IP (Internet Protocol) switchover date. That legislation is now drafted, and sets a December 31, 2008 date by which ISPs who're still hogging those analogous IPv4 addresses have got to give it up. One of the issues still unresolved is what to do about the nagging problem of the 100 million American households that are still using IPv4 in-addr.arpa style addresses, who are gonna be understandably disgruntled at the prospect of needing to go in on some new gear just to keep the net a-pumpin'. Lawmakers are (this just in!) split down party lines, with Republicans favoring a subsidy for low-income households and Democrats favoring a subsidy for anyone who buys a set-top box.

Blu Ray is lame technology (-1, Redundant)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#14244707)

There exist better technology such as the 300GB+ holographic disk. Why be stuck with Blu Ray crap? Anyway it is too late now. But, I hope the next standard is a jump to 1 Terabyte ..instead of some incremental advance on blu-ray that gives us 100 GB or something lame like that.

Re:Blu Ray is lame technology (4, Funny)

wo1verin3 (473094) | more than 8 years ago | (#14244801)

>> instead of some incremental advance on blu-ray that gives us 100 GB or something lame like that.

* wolv looks at spindle of 100 DVD-R
* wolv looks at 5-pack of 100GB discs

Yes... damn them and they better not give us those lame 100 GB discs.

HD-DVD will win (4, Funny)

skyman8081 (681052) | more than 8 years ago | (#14244710)

I think that HD-DVD will win the end, simply because it is the inferior format. Which is usually is the one that wins in the end.

But Greedo shooting first must be nice at 1080p, either way.

Re:HD-DVD will win (1)

Cryptnotic (154382) | more than 8 years ago | (#14244859)

I heard that Lucas is going to change it back for the Star Wars "Special Jedi Edition" box set.

No, really.

Re:HD-DVD will win (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#14245126)

Ugh... I have the VHS box set of the remastered original eps. That's it. George Lucas isn't getting another penny from me by releasing 200 slight iterations of every Star Wars movie. In fact, that kind of fan abuse has taken any credibility he had left away. He's shamelessly milking his few actual successes. ._.;

Not decided if Blu-ray will have component video? (2, Insightful)

mjrmjr (936676) | more than 8 years ago | (#14244712)

That seems kind of odd. What would it have instead... S-Video and HMDI?

Re:Not decided if Blu-ray will have component vide (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#14244763)

blu-ray will only support hdmi as my memory recalls it.. this is due to hdcp compliance issues and the want to control that..

yep. HDMI (2, Insightful)

YesIAmAScript (886271) | more than 8 years ago | (#14244883)

Sending the video out over analog (component) or unencrypted digital is forbidden.

The DVD CCA won't even let you send out uprezzed DVDs over analog or unencrypted digital (if the Macrovision flag is set).

It's completely ridiculous.

DVI w/HDCP is electrically identical to HDMI I guess, so that's probably permissible.

Birds of a Feather (2, Insightful)

Nom du Keyboard (633989) | more than 8 years ago | (#14244721)

...and seven movie studios

Birds of a feather, or in this case movie studios in this chummy chummy business, flock together. Since Sony is one of theirs, well you get the picture [pun alert].

In short, this is hardly surprising. Especially considering how many households will quickly enough have one player in the kid's must-have PS3. Might have been different if XBox 360 was shipping with HD-DVD, but that's clearly not the case.

BD? HD-DVD? Does it really matter? (1, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#14244723)

My concern isn't really with which one will win out, we've seen DVD+R and DVD-R co-exist side by side for the last few years without too many problems, even DVD-RAM still gets a look in on many drives.

So, however this pans out, will it really matter to the consumer?

This is great (4, Funny)

Depris (612363) | more than 8 years ago | (#14244739)

I love it when major corporations fight large battles against each other instead of the consumer. ...Oh wait.

One question I have (4, Insightful)

Hao Wu (652581) | more than 8 years ago | (#14244765)

The pits on HD are 6-times the length of those on Blu-ray. So shouldn't there be less degradation, meaning a longer lifespan for the disk? (One would think that marks only 1/6 the size would deteriorate faster, no?)

Re:One question I have (4, Interesting)

jZnat (793348) | more than 8 years ago | (#14244815)

I guess you didn't notice, but the point behind Sony's tactics here is to provide an extremely fragile media so that you'll both not be able to back up your videos due to draconian DRM and you'll end up rebuying your videos every time they fuck up.

Re:One question I have (1)

gbobeck (926553) | more than 8 years ago | (#14244816)

Theorhetically, yes. But according to Murphy's law, something else will cause disks to fail at the same rate, either new formats or the companies finding a way to sabotage the disks.

Re:One question I have (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#14244823)

I guess this makes me ignorant, but I was unaware that discs had a quantifiable physical shelf life. Where might one corroborate on that claim? It's just that my oldest DVDs play just as well as my newest ones.

What about HD-DVD? (5, Insightful)

Nermal6693 (622898) | more than 8 years ago | (#14244769)

OK, so 90 percent support Blu-Ray, but what percentage support HD-DVD? It won't be 10 % because some companies (eg. Apple) support both formats, and others probably don't support either of them.

Re:What about HD-DVD? (2, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#14244947)

..well.. seeing that Apple is on the board of Directors of the Blu-Ray group, I doubt they'll back HD-DVD that much.

Re:What about HD-DVD? (1)

chomprock (927088) | more than 8 years ago | (#14245018)

as you're implying, it's a marketing trick. "90% support blu-ray" implies "blu-ray leads HD-DVD 9 to 1", but says nothing about companies supporting both. i wouldn't be surprised if HD-DVD had 70% of the market to blu-ray's 90%

Yet no mention of the DRM (1, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#14244773)

Its intresting how the Blue Ray go to such great lenghts to hide the imbedded DRM all player and disks will have.

For me until I heard about the Massive amounts of DRM being stuffed into Blue Ray I was in the Blue Ray camp, after I got a look at Blue Ray's DRM I changed my mind very quickly.
Its the consumer that will ultimitly decied.

I agree (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#14244794)

I was at the Blu-ray camp and I thought it was pretty cool until the counsellors hogtied me and gave me an atomic wedgie. I knew it had happened to another kid earlier that summer, but I didn't expect that I would fall victim to those bastards.

I pissed in the potato salad and called my mom to pick me up. I haven't ever wanted to go back to that camp.

Re:Yet no mention of the DRM (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#14244836)

Good lord man. Go back to 8th grade english class.
It's Blu-Ray, too. Not Blue.

you're right... (1)

the_greywolf (311406) | more than 8 years ago | (#14244964)

and i agree with you in principle.

however, i see Blu-ray as an excellt technological achievement. not all Blu-ray discs will have DRM. this is especially the case when single-layer Blu-ray writer drives hit the market in force. who doesn't want to store 25+GiB on a single disc?

i'm behind this format because it's technically very good. i'm against the DRM it mandates for movies, but there is little we can do about that short of a boycott.

my plan: buy a Blu-ray writer when they become affordable and hold out on movies until pirated stuff becomes common fare - because by then, DRM issues are moot.

Re:you're right... (1)

Timberwolf0122 (872207) | more than 8 years ago | (#14245044)

The DRM will get sorted in time, even if it is a dirty hack, say shoving the HDTV-OUT in to a HD-Capture card and re-encoding on another pc, or as I suspect someone will crack it just as john cracked CSS.

I think the best way to avod piracy is to embrace in an I-Tunes making the cost of a legal copy of a track/movie so cheap as to make illegal downloads not worth it (what with the quality issue and occasion accidental pron download).

On the subject of pirated movies howlong befor DVD rips will include a DTS/Dolby Digital Sound Track, it pisses me off when downloading a movie (that I already own.... yes that should cover me) that my lovely 7.1 THX system only has 2 channels to play with. grr.

and now, for (0)

chomprock (927088) | more than 8 years ago | (#14244797)

the obligatory premature "i told you so." no better feeling than being right, even if you aren't

sounds cool.... footage? (1)

topper24hours (853597) | more than 8 years ago | (#14244808)

The descriptions of the interactive menus sound great anybody got some footage?

Both will fail (2, Interesting)

ad0gg (594412) | more than 8 years ago | (#14244851)

Older HDTVs and almost all computer monitors do not support HDCP. People have little incentive to pick bluray or HDDVD when they can't take advantage of the HD content without being forced to upgrade their monitors or tvs. Company that wins will be the first one to remove the HDCP requirement for video out but I have feeling both will not and they'll end up as the same fate DVD audio. Consumers will just ignore the technology.

Re:Both will fail (1)

mrchaotica (681592) | more than 8 years ago | (#14244986)

I sure as hell hope you're right!

The PS3 (3, Insightful)

wyldeone (785673) | more than 8 years ago | (#14244867)

It has seemed pretty clear to me that Blue-ray will win, because thanks to the PS3, it defeats the chicken-and-egg problem of any new media, which is that no one will spend hundreds of dollars on a player for a new format when there are no movies, and no studio will produce movies if no players exist. Because the PS3 will put millions of blueray players in homes, compared with the meagre amount of early-adopters who will have hddvd players, studios will by neccessity go with blueray.

A Sony format winning in the marketplace... (2, Funny)

DCheesi (150068) | more than 8 years ago | (#14244876)

...Law of Averages? Or sign of the Apocalypse??

(Analog) HDTV... I will need HDMI?? (3, Interesting)

green pizza (159161) | more than 8 years ago | (#14244904)

From what I gather, neither BluRay nor HDDVD will suport full HD resolution via component video, instead consumers will have to use HDMI for its HDCP copy protection.

Well, this is fine if I had a new TV... but instead I have a beautiful 3 year old rear projection HDTV that uses analog component inputs. This is currently connected to a HD DirecTV reciever and my DVD player. The DVD player is of course 480p but I do get as high as 1080i with some of the DirecTV channels.

So now what am I going to do when BluRay or HDDVD comes out and I want to view the full resolution siginal? What are the odds Sony will sell me new electronics to add HDCP digital to my TV? Will I have to use an illegal device to convert the digital stream to component for my TV?

Re:(Analog) HDTV... I will need HDMI?? (1)

Kris_J (10111) | more than 8 years ago | (#14244998)

Will I have to use an illegal device to convert the digital stream to component for my TV?
Most likely. I bought a Sony PS2 as a DVD player because of Datel's DVD Region X. Most big companies simply have no idea how much of their sales are due to grey-market (or even black-market) products. Heck, the original Sony Playstation was so popular because you could so easily get cheap copies of the games.

Now, however, Sony is dead to me. I was already moving away from big brands like that anyway. In fact, my new Zensonic DVD player should be arriving soon.

A victory for Java, too ! (1, Interesting)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#14244905)

And we all know why micro$oft hates BluRay so much : Java is embedded in every BluRay unit !

What DRM *is* in there? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#14244957)

The "Advanced Access Content System" where a permanent internet connection must be present at all times sounds like the worst of the worst to me. But is that merely rumor, or will it be a requirement for all BD players, INCLUDING the PS3? If that's the case, then they're yachting for a boycotting, as my mother used to say.

at at (1)

commrade (79346) | more than 8 years ago | (#14244997)

I thought there was something wrong with my MergedFB (dual monitor) setup, but I moved the window and it really does say "at at". I should have expected that on ./ this late at night I, eh?

When DVD first came out... (1)

el_womble (779715) | more than 8 years ago | (#14245067)

I was really excited. VHS was a dumb format. Expensive, low quality, quality reduced with time and it needed rewinding. It was so dumb, that people didn't even mind loosing the ability to record TV when they moved over. In addition to that DVDs usually contained more than just the show, they also had extras, another great incentive. What has blu-ray got? Higher resolution... but only when you've bought a new TV.

Now don't get me wrong, I'll buy one... but then I'm finding it increasingly more difficult to listen to compressed AACs and I can't watch DVDs on my iMac because of pixelation (DVD on high res screens look awful) - I'm not your average consumer, however I can see very few reasons for the more sane members of my family and friends to buy one. Even if I buy the box, I'm unlikely to rebuild my DVD collection (like I did with my VHS and tape collections) because I'm finding that I buy DVDs a lot less than I used to. It's too cheap and easy to rent from the likes of Amazon and Netflix, TV-on-demand is looking better with Telewest's Teleport and I'll soon have a 10MB data pipe to get HD films when iTMS finally gets its act together with the studios.

I will be very suprised if Blu-ray does half as well as DVD. People were happy with VHS, in much the same way as they're happy with DivX now, video quality is much less of a concern than the studios would like you to think.

UMD II (1)

^_^x (178540) | more than 8 years ago | (#14245077)

For those of you who think the big game consoles dictate the next video format:

C'mon! Didn't you see what Sony did with UMD? It was brilliant. A non-controversial proprietary format of their own, that if it failed, they still had games at least. But if it succeeded... and it seems to be doing way better than I expected, it would set a precedent for Sony setting the video format, making PS3 + Blu-Ray video a natural winner.

After all, Sony got the studios to invest in UMD (Already a totally Sony format) releases, and they're turning a decent profit on it, how hard would it be to tip them from HD-DVD to Blu-Ray? Even if Sony was the ONLY one to adopt it, they could probably make a decent profit selling Blu-Ray discs just for PS3 owners.

They very purposefully made Blu-Ray the obvious choice, even regardless of its technical capabilities.

Consumers will return them (3, Insightful)

tekrat (242117) | more than 8 years ago | (#14245079)

Think about it. Joe Consumer sees the Blu_ray at "The Wiz" or "Best Buy", and drools "Wow, what a sharp picture!!!". He buys the unit, takes it home, pops in a standard DVD on his standard TV set, and then wonders where all the extra resolution is.

You think I'm kidding but I'm not. I deal with people who hook their DVD into the VHS machine and then wonder why they can't see the DVD's play -- because the VHS machine is still set to "tuner", when it needs to be changed to "Aux" or "line in".

Believe me. People will return these things like mad when they don't get the same quality of image they saw in the store. They are not being told that they have to buy new DVDs and New TVs as well as the new player. It's like saying "This new stereo requires that you throw away your old speakers and buy new speakers too, plus, you can't play your old CD's in it either!"

I predict phantom warehouses of returned merchandise to keep it off the books so the stocks don't tumble.

Trust me on this. People are stupid.

Re:Consumers will return them (1)

^_^x (178540) | more than 8 years ago | (#14245102)

People will never buy this new "DVD" format. They'll get it home, then realize it can't record their favorite shows! It'll never replace VHS!

And just wait until they find out they're not getting the full experience on their home stereo unless they get a new tuner, and 4 more speakers! These things are going to be returned in droves!

I predict a few computer geeks starting a collection of these before the whole thing flops.

Trust me on this. People are stupid.

Always knew Blu-Ray would win (1)

Bertie (87778) | more than 8 years ago | (#14245109)

And I don't know very much about the relative technological merits of either product. It's just got a cooler, more memorable name.
Load More Comments
Slashdot Login

Need an Account?

Forgot your password?