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Senate Proposes Patriot Act Extension

Zonk posted more than 8 years ago | from the just-a-little-bit-longer dept.

The Courts 519

geekylinuxkid writes "Senate leaders reached a bipartisan agreement Wednesday night to extend expiring and controversial provisions of the Patriot Act for six months. Senate Majority Leader Bill Frist, a Republican from Tennessee, announced the agreement from the Senate floor, ending an impasse over the measure." From the article: "Last week, the House voted 251-174 to renew the 16 provisions after striking a compromise that altered some of them. The provisions were set to expire at year's end if not renewed. Controversial measures include those allowing the FBI -- with a court order -- to obtain secret warrants for business, library, medical and other records, and to get a wiretap on every phone a suspect uses." More commentary on the BBC. We reported on last week's failure of the original renewal.

cancel ×

519 comments

OUTGOING (2, Interesting)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#14320025)

HELLO WORLD
51596 51596
HELLO WORLD
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K-BYE

Re:OUTGOING (-1, Offtopic)

Freexe (717562) | more than 8 years ago | (#14320070)

What is all this shit about?

Re:OUTGOING (0, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#14320075)

read the rest of the comment. It's really quite enlightening.

Re:OUTGOING (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#14320269)

Read the first line Hello World, the numbers 51596 correspond to:
http://www.seifried.org/security/ports/51000/51596 .html [seifried.org]

Re:OUTGOING (0)

myth24601 (893486) | more than 8 years ago | (#14320119)

You had me at HELLO.

Flip Flop (-1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#14320034)

Sounds like a bunch of flip floppers to me.

Someone please explain (5, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#14320047)

As has been pointed out before... who needs an extension to the PATRIOT act, when the President can just issue an executive order?

Re:Someone please explain (1)

TubeSteak (669689) | more than 8 years ago | (#14320199)

Don't bother asking the same question over and over.

They didn't have a good response for it the first time around.

/not trolling, just tired of seeing semi-informed talking points being used as legitimate replies.

Re:Someone please explain (5, Insightful)

Council (514577) | more than 8 years ago | (#14320208)

who needs an extension to the PATRIOT act, when the President can just issue an executive order?

Moderation: +1 Funny


What we really need is a mod for "Funny, but it's that sort of awkward laugh, where you're not sure if you should be crying instead."

Re:Someone please explain (1)

dkoulomzin (320266) | more than 8 years ago | (#14320218)

While not currently specifically cited as such, the administration could use the (newly extended) Patriot Act to support the executive order. They can always mention this (and other acts of congress) to show that Congress has made it clear that the executive branch is supposed to be spying on bad guys.

Not that this argument holds any kind of water in my view.

Re:Someone please explain (1)

myth24601 (893486) | more than 8 years ago | (#14320231)

"As has been pointed out before... who needs an extension to the PATRIOT act, when the President can just issue an executive order?"

One reason might be that information gathered without warrents might not be admissible in court. Another might be that executive order that Bush used to wiretap International calls wouldn't give access to the Domestic calls that the suspect makes. Lets not forget that the PATRIOT act would allow access to Library records which could be used to embarass a suspected terrorist into cooperation if it came to light that the suspect checked out back issues of "Cat Fancy" or something like that.

Re:Someone please explain (1)

trickofperspective (180714) | more than 8 years ago | (#14320260)

I think maybe the point of the joke was that the President could issue executive orders to do any of those things.
But, then, a joke that needs explaining...

Re:Someone please explain (1)

MillionthMonkey (240664) | more than 8 years ago | (#14320283)

As has been pointed out before... who needs an extension to the PATRIOT act, when the President can just issue an executive order?

This is the rhetorical question that was posed by judges on the FISA court in recent days. They don't seem to realize the importance of PR.
If your actions are made legal, there are positive PR consequences to be had!

I think they mean... (0, Offtopic)

captainbeardo (868266) | more than 8 years ago | (#14320050)

Extension, not extention...

Re:I think they mean... (1)

Pacifix (465793) | more than 8 years ago | (#14320156)

Well, Bush said he wouldn't sign an extension. Maybe they think they can sneak it past him if they spell it differently. "No, Mr. President. An extention is totally different from an extension. It's a good thing. Sign it and you'll get a cookie and then naptime!"

Re:I think they mean... (1)

olibri (848744) | more than 8 years ago | (#14320210)

I propose a Slashdot spelling contest. Gheese.

Re:I think they mean... (2, Funny)

Mr Pippin (659094) | more than 8 years ago | (#14320216)

Too bad they didn't mean "extinction".

Win a little - lose a little (2, Insightful)

teutonic_leech (596265) | more than 8 years ago | (#14320071)

This is not what I hoped for, but 6 months is probably the best the republicans can get for now. After all, 2006 is election year and everyone is switching into CYA mode. This will only hit the garbage can AFTER we elect a democratically controlled senate/house.

Re:Win a little - lose a little (-1, Redundant)

sedrules (643301) | more than 8 years ago | (#14320121)

yep when the democrats leave our country open for attack again! at least that should make the communist happy again

Re:Win a little - lose a little (1)

aplusjimages (939458) | more than 8 years ago | (#14320328)

What's funny is that the terrorist killed 3000 americans on a republican presidents watch. Too bad the terrorist aren't following your logic.

Re:Win a little - lose a little (0)

CmdrTaco on (468152) | more than 8 years ago | (#14320343)

This post is not a memoir. Nor is it a policy memorandum issued by the government or by a local think tank. Rather, it is an assessment of how Pres. George W Bush ducks the issue of demagogism by using words and phrases so vague and subject to interpretation that they have no true meaning at all. Let's review the errors in Bush's statements in order. First, Bush's little schemes are bound to fail. He is like a stray pigeon. Pigeons are too self-absorbed to care about anyone else. They poo on people they don't like; they poo on people they don't even know. The only real difference between Bush and a pigeon is that Bush intends to cheat on taxes. That's why no one has a higher opinion of Bush than I, and I think Bush's an antisocial, temperamental stirrer.

When Bush says that he has his moral compass in tact, in his mind, that's supposed to end the argument. It's like he believes he has said something very profound. It is pointless to fret about the damage already caused by his dishonest smears. The past cannot be changed. We must cope with the present if we hope to affect our future and fight for our freedom of speech. Until we address this issue, we will never move beyond it.

Re:Win a little - lose a little (1)

Buelldozer (713671) | more than 8 years ago | (#14320249)

Someone needs to lookup the definition of "Bipartisan". May I suggest www.dictionary.com

Re:Win a little - lose a little (1, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#14320518)

Right. Just like how the original PATRIOT act was voted against by all the democrats. Oh wait.

It will be extended only to a certain extent (5, Insightful)

digitaldc (879047) | more than 8 years ago | (#14320086)

Frist makes me laugh, he says "This is a win for America's safety and security, and I'm pleased the Senate was able to rise above the partisan politics being played by the minority to do the right thing."

And we know the majority would NEVER play partisan politics to get what they want.

Re:It will be extended only to a certain extent (3, Insightful)

JesseL (107722) | more than 8 years ago | (#14320274)

The formation of cult of the majority is one of the most dangerous tools that tyrants have ever devised.

...a win for America's safety and security... (5, Insightful)

TubeSteak (669689) | more than 8 years ago | (#14320277)

I'm going to quote an old post [slashdot.org] [slashdot.org] from the "DMCA Abuse Widespread" [slashdot.org] [slashdot.org] article:
Whenever a controversial law is proposed, and its supporters, when confronted with an egregious abuse it would permit, use a phrase along the lines of 'Perhaps in theory, but the law would never be applied in that way' - they're lying . They intend to use the law that way as early and as often as possible.
To extend that idea a bit further: If we lose liberties present in The Constitution, The Amendments and The Bill of Rights, have the terrorists won?

I think that goes directly back to what Benjamin Franklin was saying when he talked about people who give up freedom for security deserve neither.

Re:...a win for America's safety and security... (1, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#14320540)

If we lose liberties present in The Constitution, The Amendments and The Bill of Rights, have the terrorists won?

NO. It seems you've bought into the propaganda that "they hate us because of our freedom!" That's bullshit. They hate us because we won't stop fucking around in the middle east. Get out of Israel, get out of Afghanistan, get out of Iraq, get out of all the other sovereign nations we are interfering with, and then the terrorists will have won. And you know what? We'll have won too. This isn't a zero sum game. It's only religious presidents and arse-licking prime ministers with agendas beyond doing what's best for their countries that lose.

Re:It will be extended only to a certain extent (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#14320292)

Always makes me smile. Americans referring to their senators as _they_ as if they're running the place however they want to run it with no regard to the people's wishes. Huge disconnect between what people want and what American politicians end up doing/voting on. Ya I know about the republic etc. Its BS when you vote them in and then whine when they do what they think is right.

Hell mark me redundant or whatever.

Re:It will be extended only to a certain extent (1, Flamebait)

xs650 (741277) | more than 8 years ago | (#14320315)

Let me translate. The phrase "do the right thing" is conservative talk for bend over and grab your ankles.

Re:It will be extended only to a certain extent (1)

TubeSteak (669689) | more than 8 years ago | (#14320488)

I think you're confusing "do the right thing" with "go to jail"
JUDGE
And now the sentence for these heinous crimes committed against Initech.

I hereby sentence you, Michael Bolton and Samir Na...Ananajibad...to a term of no less than four years in federal-pound-me-in-the-ass-prison.

Peter Gibbons, you've lead a trite and meaningless life. And you're a very bad person.

Root reason for change... (1)

1992 Called (893858) | more than 8 years ago | (#14320092)

Worst. Country. Ever.

So... (2, Insightful)

Lord_Dweomer (648696) | more than 8 years ago | (#14320093)

So is this going to be one of those things that gets renewed temporarily...and then renewed temporarily again and again and again until people give in and just accept it? Cuz it sure seems like it.

Re:So... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#14320214)

Sounds like something that happened in Germany back in the 30s.

Re:So... (3, Insightful)

garcia (6573) | more than 8 years ago | (#14320372)

So is this going to be one of those things that gets renewed temporarily...and then renewed temporarily again and again and again until people give in and just accept it? Cuz it sure seems like it.

Well, at this point that's better than the alternative... A permanent extension to the already overreaching powers that the Federal Government has. If this extension is going to have to come up and up again, perhaps -- just perhaps someone will have the fucking balls to stand up and tell the New Aged GOP douchebags that eroding the civil liberties of the American people isn't what this country was founded on. While it may not work, we can at least have it in the news and possibly get more and more people pissed off about it.

When it's already written into law, permanently, it gets ignored and more important news items like the breakup of Jessica and Nick and the possible pregnancies of Angelina and Jennifer get all over airwaves instead.

But what does that all matter when the President can just got behind the public's back and act like a dictactor and issue whatever atrocities against the American public that he feels like -- just as long as it's "to protect us" from the terrorists. Sounds like something that would have happened in Iraq, doesn't it?

Re:So... (4, Insightful)

Hrodvitnir (101283) | more than 8 years ago | (#14320533)

Of course. GW did say that these powers should stay in effect "as long as we are in danger." I've got news for you. Terrorism has been around a long time, and it's not going away any time soon. As long as there are terrorists in the world (an ever broadening group, due to the changes in how we define "terrorist"), there will be a reason to keep these laws around.

The current government has no plan to EVER give up the these powers.

Yeah!!! (2, Funny)

eno2001 (527078) | more than 8 years ago | (#14320106)

Put me on the top of the list of supposed "terrists" because I oppose everything the jackbooted thug Republicans stand for. Let's see the idiots open a file on me now if they already haven't! Up the rebels!!!

Re:Yeah!!! (0, Troll)

sycamore_days (844237) | more than 8 years ago | (#14320202)

I oppose everything the jackbooted thug Republicans stand for
You idiot -- your comments are a perfect reflection of how much of an imbecile you really are.

Re:Yeah!!! (1)

eno2001 (527078) | more than 8 years ago | (#14320378)

Touched a nerve did I? Fucking Thug...

Re:Yeah!!! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#14320371)

ME TOO!

6months is not enough time (0, Flamebait)

sycamore_days (844237) | more than 8 years ago | (#14320117)

I don't understand why the Patriot act must expire, it should be in force all of the time. Terrorism is not a seasonal enemy

Re:6months is not enough time (1)

dkoulomzin (320266) | more than 8 years ago | (#14320291)

Totally. Also, I don't know why W.'s presidential term should expire.

Please.

Re:6months is not enough time (2, Insightful)

phillymjs (234426) | more than 8 years ago | (#14320306)

The Patriot Act was passed in 2001 while the WTC rubble was still smoking. They built in the expiration because it was obviously a piece of knee-jerk legislation guaranteed to be overreaching-- it was expected that four years later, we'd have simmered down, we'd have the benefit of hindsight and the expiration date would force re-examination and adjustment of the law's provisions.

Nobody imagined that that son of a bitch Bush II and his minions would have spent the intervening years abusing/hiding behind it while turning the U.S. into a police state, and that they'd not want to pare down any of the civil-liberties-stomping aspects.

~Philly

Re:6months is not enough time (2, Insightful)

TripMaster Monkey (862126) | more than 8 years ago | (#14320410)


Nobody imagined that that son of a bitch Bush II and his minions would have spent the intervening years abusing/hiding behind it while turning the U.S. into a police state...

Um...just for the record...I imagined it. I started imagining it just about when the Republican-dominated Supreme Court of the Unites States handed Dubya the Presidency.

Re:6months is not enough time (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#14320452)

He wasn't "handed" anything. He legally won the election. If you're going to bitch, get your facts straight first.

Re:6months is not enough time (1)

jav1231 (539129) | more than 8 years ago | (#14320416)

"Nobody imagined that that son of a bitch Bush II and his minions would have spent the intervening years abusing/hiding behind it while turning the U.S. into a police state, and that they'd not want to pare down any of the civil-liberties-stomping aspects."
And how has he done that? I don't see any police hanging around my neighborhood. No one's checking my papers. No one's stopping me and asking me where I'm going. No one's tapping my phone because I'm a) not calling overseas to countries that might harbour terrorists and b) I'm not linked to any terrorist organization.

Re:6months is not enough time (1)

Junior J. Junior III (192702) | more than 8 years ago | (#14320437)

Nobody imagined that that son of a bitch Bush II and his minions would have spent the intervening years abusing/hiding behind it while turning the U.S. into a police state, and that they'd not want to pare down any of the civil-liberties-stomping aspects.

I imagined it, and a lot of other people did as well. We were quashed right out of public discourse, the corporate controlled mass media completely suppressed all dissent until sometime around mid 2004.

Re:6months is not enough time (1)

SeattleGameboy (641456) | more than 8 years ago | (#14320443)

Your logic is flawed.

Vast majority of Patriot Act is permanent. Only few fringe statues are in play here. Even with those, majority of them have bi-partisan support (sad, but true).

We are only talking about 2 or 3 provisions being RENEWED with added safeguards.

NO ONE is talking about getting rid of the Act all together.

Agh (3, Insightful)

RexKwando (935479) | more than 8 years ago | (#14320120)

This is sad. 1984 anybody.

Not 1984 (1)

TubeSteak (669689) | more than 8 years ago | (#14320388)

They haven't figured how to spy on us through our TVs.... yet.
/tinfoil tv cover

And thank God we don't have mandatory morning calisthenics.
Half the /. population would leave the country overnight.

/. UID 1984 (1)

TubeSteak (669689) | more than 8 years ago | (#14320523)

Sorry for replying twice, but I wonder who's got the /. UID 1984

blah blah blah (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#14320126)

I dont care

So long for... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#14320127)

..."Mission Accomplished!"

Why is a warrant needed? (2, Interesting)

rscrawford (311046) | more than 8 years ago | (#14320129)

Why would the FBI need a warrant when King George can simply bypass FISA and issue a secret and pointless decree allowing domestic spying without a warrant? Especially when, under FISA, a wiretap or other device can be requested without a pre-existing warrant (as long as a warrant comes within 72 hours)?

Re:Why is a warrant needed? (1)

TheUncleD (940548) | more than 8 years ago | (#14320149)

Perhaps for the same reasaon the old Kings of England could execute someone at will and the US must pay for them to live in prison for 20 years before they can get the execution to finally take place.

Other presidents have done the same thing... (2, Insightful)

geoffrobinson (109879) | more than 8 years ago | (#14320313)

from what I've read case law supports this. Since it involves foreign powers and influence, the President, any President, can use those powers with no need for a warrant as is within his right as commander and chief.

How about we strike a deal? The government will prevent people from blowing stuff up, like the Brooklyn Bridge, and they won't use those tapes in court at a trial.

Re:Other presidents have done the same thing... (2, Insightful)

rscrawford (311046) | more than 8 years ago | (#14320474)

I'm very interested to see how this goes down. My understanding of the law is that Bush's order was very likely illegal, but I'm not a lawyer and I suspect my natural (and, to my mind, very well-earned) distrust of Mr. Bush is getting in the way here.

Nevertheless, I can't help but wonder if all of the new "domestic security measures" are actually any better than the pre-9/11 security measures. Those measures failed to prevent 9/11 (and I doubt that anything could have), true; but it seems likely to me that they DID prevent a good number of attacks before 9/11 anyway. The Administration says they've prevented a number of attacks since 9/11; I say (and Congress should be saying), "Show me the money."

Re:Why is a warrant needed? (1, Informative)

jav1231 (539129) | more than 8 years ago | (#14320327)

Just for the record, Clinton authorized the Attorney General to do the same type of wiretapping (without a warrant) as did Carter. Oh, but they were Democrats.

Re:Why is a warrant needed? (3, Informative)

SeattleGameboy (641456) | more than 8 years ago | (#14320387)

Liar!

Clinton and Carter created Executive Orders PURSUANT to FISA - which FOBIDS spying on US citizens. The executive orders that Clinton and Carter create were nothing more than a list of delegates (in his cabinet) who can use FISA powers.

NO WHERE in ANY ONE of those Executive Orders or FISA about search US citizens without warrants (in fact, it is specifically prohibited).

Why don't you research something on your own instead of repeating what Rush and Fox News says? ...Idiot

Re:Why is a warrant needed? (2, Informative)

BorgCopyeditor (590345) | more than 8 years ago | (#14320468)

For the record, the reference to Clinton is a red herring [thinkprogress.org] . Totally different situation (a kind of search that was not covered under the law), totally different response (they went to Congress and asked for an amendment to the law specifically authorizing the new kind of serach). The kinds of searches implemented by Bush & co. were covered under the existing law, and they could have gone to the court within 72 hours of beginning surveillance to ask for authorization, but instead they chose not to. AG Gonzales actually said in press interviews that they chose to do things this way because they supposed that the court would have denied their requests. So they just did it anyway, law be damned.

Do you see the difference?

Re:Why is a warrant needed? (0, Troll)

tenchiken (22661) | more than 8 years ago | (#14320475)

More to the point, Clinton actually went much much further then this currently goes. He used it in purely domestic areas [washtimes.com] . Not that I expect this to actually change anyone's mind. What is being brandied about has very little to do with thought and everything to do with emotion (typically hate and fear -- on both sides).

BTW, critics of this. How do you explain that the one program that actually might have been able to stop 9/11 (Able Danger) would be illegal under your incomplete reading of the law? The FISA court itself ruled that Bush's constitutional duties and rights trumped FISA when it came to intellegence gathering?

Re:Why is a warrant needed? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#14320420)

well they really don't need all this stuff, all they need to do is "suspect" someone of beeing high and then bash down their doors...

Extending our Freedom to be Safe? Or Spyed on? (5, Informative)

TheUncleD (940548) | more than 8 years ago | (#14320130)

Last week, the House voted 251-174 to renew the 16 provisions after striking a compromise that altered some of them.

Fortunately, this doesn't guarantee it will pass. One of the provisions I agree with is the one that eliminates barriers to intelligence agents and prosecutors sharing information. This act has already infringed on many peoples freedom, but has also opened up the government to be more scrutinous in the case of certain suspicious entities. Has it overall had a positive or negative effect? Since we as the general public cannot easily gauge what information they have collected entirely as a result, who can say for sure.

For those interested in the provisions the House passed, this site explains most of them in plain english LA Times Provisions [latimes.com]

This site has the latest in how the patriot act [epic.org] currently stands.

and anybody who disagrees with the Patriot Act... (3, Funny)

cparisi (136611) | more than 8 years ago | (#14320155)

must be hiding something...

I guess- (4, Funny)

IWantMoreSpamPlease (571972) | more than 8 years ago | (#14320159)

We just got Fristed?

Re:I guess- (1)

BushCheney08 (917605) | more than 8 years ago | (#14320284)

Certainly better than being Santorumed.

Re:I guess- (1)

nearlygod (641860) | more than 8 years ago | (#14320359)

From urbandictionary.com

santorum

The sometimes frothy, usually slimy, amalgam of lubricant, stray fecal matter, and ejaculate that leaks out of the receiving partner's anus after a session of anal intercourse. Named, by popular demand and usage, after legislator Rick Santorum because of his homophobic political statements.
"That move was about as slick as santorum!"

Re:I guess- (1)

BushCheney08 (917605) | more than 8 years ago | (#14320462)

As I said...

Re:I guess- (2, Insightful)

TubeSteak (669689) | more than 8 years ago | (#14320341)

I'd rather just be ass-raped.

Since it wouldn't be a law, it wouldn't continue Fristing my future children.

Now is the time! (4, Informative)

Stanistani (808333) | more than 8 years ago | (#14320163)

US citizens:
Write, phone, email your Representatives and Senators - and ask them to knock down at least some of the more onerous provisions of the Patriot Act - I'm thinking of provisions like the one allowing secret warrants, for example.

Many of them will be back in their districts for the holidays. Visit their offices and talk politely with their staff. Inform yourselves of the Act's details, and make to-the-point suggestions.

Exercise democracy. The Act is vulnerable at this moment.

Re:Now is the time! (2, Funny)

Billosaur (927319) | more than 8 years ago | (#14320380)

You have been reported to the Dept of Homeland Security for scurrilous and subversive talk about the Patriot Act. Turn yourself in. We know where you live.

Brought to you by the Government of the United States, keeping it's citizens safe from democracy for over 200 years.

Aaaand... (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#14320164)

Slashdotters propose spelling skill "extention." So go ahead and put on your +5 Robe of Spelling Wisdom.

Ever heard of Stasi? (4, Insightful)

forgoil (104808) | more than 8 years ago | (#14320221)

It's better to fight for freedom by _providing_ freedom. The same goes for a whole bunch of other nations as well... *looks at a bunch of European countries wanting to play Stasi as well*

Put the money on finding terrorists, diplomatic solutions to end hostilities and good old fashion not too bright police officers who screw up in a way we can find out.

Spelling bee (2, Funny)

hackshack (218460) | more than 8 years ago | (#14320242)

"Extention?"

Almost as bad as the guy that posted "czech this out" on the front page.

Better than nothing... (4, Insightful)

kerrle (810808) | more than 8 years ago | (#14320253)

At least we don't have never-expiring extensions that never come up for review.

The simple fact of the matter is that I just don't trust our current administration with the powers they've been granted - and that's quite a change considering I voted for Bush in 2000. He's done a lot to convince me I didn't pick the best man for the job - you'd almost think he was trying.

Re:Better than nothing... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#14320350)

I guess you were satisfied with the body count of those heretic arabs and all those latino mendicants that make up the US army... but getting spied on, no way, thats too much.

Note to next US president: fuck only with the outside.

Re:Better than nothing... (1)

kerrle (810808) | more than 8 years ago | (#14320422)

Yeah, that's it. I don't see anything in my post that said my change of opinion was recent.

Thanks, but I was dissatisfied before 9-11, and I he'd completely lost my support well before we were ever in Iraq.

Maybe next time you can cut the sarcasm long enough to actually find a target that's worth it.

Re:Better than nothing... (1)

TubeSteak (669689) | more than 8 years ago | (#14320419)

I voted for Bush in 2000. He's done a lot to convince me I didn't pick the best man for the job - you'd almost think he was trying.
Nah, he's not trying.
It comes naturally to him.

Re:Better than nothing... (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#14320473)

The simple fact of the matter is that I just don't trust our current administration with the powers they've been granted

Well, just wait until we get people in office who are more willing to abuse these powers. I think Bush and Friends are actually trying to battle terrorism, instead of deliberately stripping rights from us in order to enable a police state. But when we get around to electing someone truly unscrupulous, they'll find all the tools they need to build their own 1984 ready and waiting for them.

House voted for original renewal, not extension (3, Interesting)

frdmfghtr (603968) | more than 8 years ago | (#14320276)

I haven't read the linked article yet, but I did read a story in the Wisconsin State journal about it...

Apparently the bill still needs to go to the House, as the House originally voted for it to be renewed in it's original form, not an extension. According to that article, because it's different than what the House voted to pass, it has to go up for another vote.

It was also pointed out that the House is scheduled to be in recess until January 31, a month after the original provisions will expire and be off the books--and it's hard to extend something that is already expired (although I wouldn't put anything past this administration--I'll be so glad when W is out of office!)

In my not-so-educated opinion, it would appear that given what little I know, the extension doesn't stand much chance of passing since a recessed House would have to reconvene, debate, and vote on the changes, in less than nine days, during the holiday season.

Re:House voted for original renewal, not extension (1)

frdmfghtr (603968) | more than 8 years ago | (#14320374)

OK, I read the link, and the House is meeting today at 4 p.m...so much for not reading the article first.

Palpatine anyone? (2, Funny)

dsaraujo (798502) | more than 8 years ago | (#14320282)

What will be the next step? Start gathering a clone army or start building the Death Star?

News for nerds (1, Insightful)

tlynch001 (917597) | more than 8 years ago | (#14320289)

I can understand how this would appeal to the lefty whiners on slashdot, but how is this news for nerds?

Lefty whiners? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#14320362)

How about Republican liars and cheats?

woo-hoo! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#14320336)

All your civil rights are belong to us!

PATRIOT act mythology (0, Flamebait)

the computer guy nex (916959) | more than 8 years ago | (#14320345)

The sheer amount of ignorance around the PATRIOT act by liberals is astounding. You do realize that it was passed 98-1 initially?

The USA PATRIOT act does NOT introduce one new power not already available to the government or a DA in some form to Drug Dealers. Flexible roaming wiretaps, "after the fact" search notices, applying wire taps to Internet usage, etc.

Please, do the research and actually read through the entire legislation before making a judgement. I know it isn't the liberal way, but try it once.

Re:PATRIOT act mythology (1)

SQLz (564901) | more than 8 years ago | (#14320412)

I bet you $100 I can show you one.

Re:PATRIOT act mythology (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#14320489)

And that makes it OK why?

Mod Parent (-1, Moron) (1, Insightful)

thewldisntenuff (778302) | more than 8 years ago | (#14320505)

This isn't a partisan issue - this is an AMERICAN issue. The USA Patriot Act was passed right after 9/11 - who in their right mind wasn't going to vote against it (Whomever did, I forget whom, said that we were rushing into things). People wanted a response, and this is what they got. You do realize that the act was thrown together in 3 weeks and was about 400 pages long, don't you? Do you think anyone had time to read through all of it.

The point of the matter is - some provisions violate the 4th and 5th Amendments of the Constitution, which, among other things, are supposed to protect the right to unreasonable searches and seizures and the rights of the accused. I did a long report on this my first year in college, and there's a lot to be worried over.

Quit blowing partisan smoke out your ass AND WAKE UP! America as we know it is falling apart, and idiots like you that spout off talking points aren't helping matters any.

Surprised? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#14320391)

And exactly *who* is surprised by this?

neverending soap opera (3, Insightful)

heroine (1220) | more than 8 years ago | (#14320392)

The most amazing thing about this soap opera is how all that government spying was accepted to be really happening ever since the 50's by every conspiracy theorist or anyone with common sense.

What did you think those thousands of CIA agents, NSA agents, FBI agents did all day? Eat donuts?

Now that they actually tried to ratify their activities on paper, every conspiracy theorist now says it never happened before and acts like defeating the patriot act is going to make a difference.

can someone provide an example? (4, Insightful)

bkirkby (133683) | more than 8 years ago | (#14320424)

i'd like to see an example of where the patriot act provisions were used egregiously by the current administration.

Re:can someone provide an example? (1)

Limburgher (523006) | more than 8 years ago | (#14320537)

The problem is that you can't, by the Act's very nature.

Which Countries Are Upholding Their Civil Rights? (1)

s7uar7 (746699) | more than 8 years ago | (#14320492)

With the UK & USA seemingly going down the route of 'the more we can track our citizens, the safer they'll be', which 'western' countries have we got left to emigrate to where we can at least trust the government not to be listening to our conversations or tracking our cars - Canada? Sweden?

Let's get it out of the way... (2, Informative)

sigzero (914876) | more than 8 years ago | (#14320534)

President Bush is NOT the only president that believes the office of the president has executive power to conduct warrantless searches to acquire foreign intelligence information. President Clinton did it in 1995 and President Carter did it in 1979.

Even the FISA court itself admitted "that the President did have inherent authority to conduct warrantless searches to obtain foreign intelligence information." President Bush stated that these were only done where ties to Al Qaeda were suspected and so it falls into his authority.

Also in 2002 when the Patriot Act and the FISA act were being looked at for constitunality it was determined by the court "We take for granted that the President does have that authority and, assuming that is so, FISA could not encroach on the President's constitutional power."

Previous administrations believed and faught for the same thing!

That doesn't mean we should not be cautious about any of this though. We should!

FOOD FIGHT! (1)

John Jorsett (171560) | more than 8 years ago | (#14320549)

A six-month renewal of the Patriot Act would put another renewal squarely in the middle of election season. I'm thinking both sides are going to try to tar the other with it ("You want to give the terrorists free reign!" No, you want to trample the freedoms of the American people!"). Should be an interesting screaming match.

Often overlooked (3, Insightful)

gcranston (901577) | more than 8 years ago | (#14320553)

One thing that no one seems to realise - and is very important for Canadians and other countries who do business in the United Sates (so almost everyone) - is that this law also allows US intelligence agencies to spy on our businesses and citizens who have dealings with the US. They have no right to do this. It is an act of espionage and just another example the gross hypocrisy and mass stupidity of an administration claiming to stand for personal freedoms, civil liberties, and human rights.
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