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What's Known About the PS3

Zonk posted more than 8 years ago | from the devil-in-the-details dept.

234

1up has an expansive piece up exploring everything they know about the PlayStation 3. They cover rumours, prices, technology, and the limited information currently out there on upcoming games. From the article: "While the hard facts are still tough to nail down, the general consensus is that the PlayStation 3 is the most powerful of the three next-generation systems, although probably not by as much of a margin as Sony would like us to think. The arguments for the technical strengths of the PS3 go into CPU floating-point capabilities and the difficulties surrounding programming for parallel architectures, but the long and short of it is that whether or not the advantages of the PS3 are apparent will depend on developers' ability to utilize the PlayStation 3's unique architecture."

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fristage (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#14843733)

FP

But.. (1, Flamebait)

Dimentox (678813) | more than 8 years ago | (#14843738)

Does it look cool? Most end users care only about graphics, sound and ease of use. Personally I think the X-Box 360 will reign King.

But..Over a Barrel. (1, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#14843786)

I'm surprised that none of them have a physics chip. That is the next avenue that needs development. Graphics and sound are already "good enough".

Re:But..Over a Barrel. (5, Insightful)

AuMatar (183847) | more than 8 years ago | (#14843808)

Because physics was good enough in Super Mario 1. Not all games need, or want, realistic physics. In most cases, unrealism is prefered (try a true Newtonian physics space sim- changing directions is hard). Whats needed is gameplay innovations, and they don't make hardware for that.

Re:But..Over a Barrel. (0, Redundant)

OnlineAlias (828288) | more than 8 years ago | (#14843933)

So true...I wish I had mod points...

Re:But..Over a Barrel. (3, Funny)

Winterblink (575267) | more than 8 years ago | (#14843969)

I can't imagine true physics in a Mario game. Wait, maybe I can.

Mario tries to jump over a fence, but his foot catches. Small splinters of wood are torn from the wood as he comes tumbling over the fence. He tries to brace himself for the fall, but breaks his arm. Game over.

Or, he tries to buttstomp some shroom and ends up with an impacted vertebrae and shattered pelvis.

Re:But..Over a Barrel. (3, Funny)

XenoRyet (824514) | more than 8 years ago | (#14844097)

Realistic physics != vunurable character.

Just because the turtles bounce like they should doesn't mean Mario can't have super-human abilities.

Re:But..Over a Barrel. (2, Insightful)

Silverstrike (170889) | more than 8 years ago | (#14844689)

Who said the chip has to compute realistic physics?

Millions of blocks all falling on the same screen takes a ton of CPU time. Now, weather they are falling with an acceleration of 9.8 m/s^s is immaterial to CPU time -- millions of real-time collisons take loads of number crunching, realistic or not.

Re:But..Over a Barrel. (1)

KDR_11k (778916) | more than 8 years ago | (#14844162)

Agaeia says they want 199$ (or 299$, not sure) per chip if bought in numbers that would happen with a console. If a console were to include that you'd see an MSRP of 600$ minimum.

With any luck... (5, Funny)

PastAustin (941464) | more than 8 years ago | (#14843742)

It won't cost $1,000,000 and thanks to Sony not having Microsoft's "Rush To The Market" attitude you don't have to worry about it melting to your carpet!

Re:With any luck... (5, Funny)

Dimentox (678813) | more than 8 years ago | (#14843771)

Thats a feature of the X-Box 360, "a portable foot heater and Cooking stove."

Re:With any luck... (1)

Andrzej Sawicki (921100) | more than 8 years ago | (#14844583)

Weird, I thought Intel was already making those. Ahh, I see, Intel's are less portable.

Re:With any luck... (5, Funny)

PastAustin (941464) | more than 8 years ago | (#14843789)

FTA: Even Sony Computer Entertainment president Ken Kutaragi has been quoted as saying "It'll be expensive [...] I'm aware that with all these technologies, the PS3 can't be offered at a price that's targeted towards households."


Hell Yes! I've always wanted a PS3 at work. I knew it would happen!

Re:With any luck... (0, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#14843874)

Right! With Sony's past "new console" performance, you'll just have to worry about running it upside down or buying a new one in four months when the completely untested media drive craps out! And then there's the rumored hard drive, wireless controllers, and new ethernet adapter! The new PS3 will have more points of failure than any Sony console to date!

Re:With any luck... (2, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#14844125)

and thanks to Sony not having Microsoft's "Rush To The Market" attitude you don't have to worry about it melting to your carpet!

Considering all the launch problems with PS2 this is good if it's meant as irony, and funny if not.

The next gen Phantom (4, Funny)

British (51765) | more than 8 years ago | (#14843754)

...is the PS3. Yes, this will have TWICE the delays with its new marketing and rumor engine. Capable of thousands of speculations a second!

(it's a joke kids, someday that PS3 will come out).

Re:The next gen Phantom (1)

OSS_ilation (922367) | more than 8 years ago | (#14843895)

How is this comment flamebait? With all of the information (not) available today, this simple comment rings more like fact than fiction

Re:The next gen Phantom (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#14844244)

I agree with you, I thought the parent was funny, some people are obviously fanatically touchy about this subject.

Re:The next gen Phantom (1)

NcF (847200) | more than 8 years ago | (#14844215)

I wish I had a mod point to counteract the -1 mod point for "Flamebait". That was funny, not flamebait. Seriously, it has soo much seemingly truth in it though. =\

Re:The next gen Phantom (0, Redundant)

richardablitt (897338) | more than 8 years ago | (#14844474)

how about underrated?

Mod parents Funny (1)

audi100quattro (869429) | more than 8 years ago | (#14844292)

It's too funny to be flamebait...

Re:The next gen Phantom (1)

wolfmanXUG (747138) | more than 8 years ago | (#14844373)

I guess flamebait is the new "funny"

Re:The next gen Phantom (1)

keyrat rafa (856668) | more than 8 years ago | (#14844649)

It'd be funnier if Sony had some kind of history delaying consoles, but they don't. I guess the speculation is on point. Mod it 'E' for effort.

It's not all speculation! (1)

MS-06FZ (832329) | more than 8 years ago | (#14844677)

...is the PS3. Yes, this will have TWICE the delays with its new marketing and rumor engine. Capable of thousands of speculations a second!


Sources have verified that the controllers will have ten buttons, two analog sticks, and a D-pad. Some have doubted the validity of this claim in the past but it is now quite certain that it's true.

More emphasis on functional languages. (3, Funny)

CyricZ (887944) | more than 8 years ago | (#14843757)

In the near future we may see more emphasis being placed on strict functional languages, such as Haskell, for such massively multithreaded and parallel development at the commodity level. Many of the issues associated with concurrent development with traditional imperative or imperative OO languages can be avoided via stateless computation.

Even a language like Erlang may begin to gain widespread popularity among game developers, as they begin to see the benefits that it brings when writing multithreaded applications.

With more industry support behind such technology, we may witness a computing revolution. It has been decades in the making, but its time is quickly coming upon us.

Re:More emphasis on functional languages. (1)

man2525 (600111) | more than 8 years ago | (#14844483)

Maybe I'm not smart enought to know why this post is modded "Funny", but didn't Naughty Dog already use LISP for Jak and Daxter [franz.com] ? That's a functional language, right? OP's suggestion sounds like a great one for the PS3 hardware.

So In Essence, They Know Nothing (1)

Cranky Weasel (946893) | more than 8 years ago | (#14843761)

An article of guesswork. Oh yay.

Doesn't really matter. The rabid fanboys alone will make it a success, even if it's unreasonably expensive, sucks at online play, and runs a twenty percent failure rate on its first production run.

I'm not buying a next-gen console. I'm perfectly content with my "old" XBOX.

why the big secret? (3, Insightful)

psycho chic (958251) | more than 8 years ago | (#14843768)

i think the thing that gets me is "hey, why all the secrecy?" if you are gonna release a product, at least TRY to convince me its better then the competition. when people start getting (publically) fired for making opinions known, it makes you wonder

Re:why the big secret? (1)

Eightyford (893696) | more than 8 years ago | (#14844012)

"hey, why all the secrecy?"

It works for Apple. Well, at least it did until they made a big stink about a crappy "boombox" and 100 dollar leather case (with an Apple logo!).

Re:why the big secret? (2, Interesting)

smaddox (928261) | more than 8 years ago | (#14844699)

You've obvioulsy never heard of a little game called Fable.

The developers started talking about it 2 years before its release, and hyped it up to be the best thing in the world with all these amazing features. Problem is, by the time it was released, 90% of those features had been cut due to problems with implementation, and time and budget limits.

Hyping up a product should only be done when you know exactly what the product is, because otherwise, you just spent a bunch of advert money on something that is never going to exist.

Other things known about the PS3: (4, Funny)

dr_dank (472072) | more than 8 years ago | (#14843777)

Other things known about the PS3:

* It is not a strapless evening gown.

* Ducks may not try to mate with it.

* It is not a flotation device.

* Is not a good substitute for snow chains.

* It will not remove tough grease stains.

* It will not get you an automatic first post on Slashdot.

Re:Other things known about the PS3: (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#14843867)

You Forgot:

* Not particularily useful against an insurgency.

* Will welcome its rabid fanboy overlords.

* The Russian version will in fact, play you!

Re:Other things known about the PS3: (2, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#14844294)

* It is not a flotation device.

The Nintendo Revolution, on the other hand...

Re:Other things known about the PS3: (2, Funny)

Have Blue (616) | more than 8 years ago | (#14844365)

* Do not taunt PS3.

Re:Other things known about the PS3: (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#14844442)

I'm not so sure about that last one... I mean, it's got network hardware and can run Linux. What's to stop someone writing a /. spambot on it?

Of course now you've said it, someone out there's going to try to prove you wrong (even though it's meant as a joke).

Not me though, I don't have $500 to blow on a hype machine.

More power, $400, Anime Dating, Puppies (2, Interesting)

WillAffleckUW (858324) | more than 8 years ago | (#14843778)

OK, so it's slightly more powerful than the xBox360, will probably retail around $400 without HDD (and $500 for Net/HDD config bundle) (figure initial cost to start at $500 so they can drop to $400 over a year, unless you get it cheap at Costco in a bundle), has 100-150 original content games, including an Anime Dating sim "Akira Project", a Nintendogs non-clone "Active Dogs", a lot of wierd anime games, a lot of RPGs, a lot of scary games, the obligitory sports games, the obligitory FPS games, Bomberman, Clown Combat (yup), ...

OK, looks like xBox360 is going to lose a lot of market share when it ships, probably starting in December when most of the new titles ship.

Hmm, maybe I should sell my MSFT stock ...

Re:More power, $400, Anime Dating, Puppies (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#14843822)

Why? Those games all sound shit.

Re:More power, $400, Anime Dating, Puppies (1)

XenoRyet (824514) | more than 8 years ago | (#14844351)

Yea, they sound like shit if you're in the frat boy halo2/madden demographic...

Re:More power, $400, Anime Dating, Puppies (2, Insightful)

nearlygod (641860) | more than 8 years ago | (#14843856)

OK, looks like xBox360 is going to lose a lot of market share when it ships, probably starting in December when most of the new titles ship.

Probably since the XBox 360 has 100% market share for the newest generation.

Clown Wars, Anime Dating, RPGs, oh my (1)

WillAffleckUW (858324) | more than 8 years ago | (#14844221)

Well, I'm just basing this on the actual games that will be there by December for the PS3, and their broad range of appeal, which will give the PS3 a category killer that has appeal to non-FPS, non-Sports gamers, such as boys, girls, women, and guys who don't like to play FPS because they spent too many years actually doing that when they were in the Army and it tenses them up too much so it's more fun to play other games.

But, hey, whatever. I'm still saying, since I've seen no real moves in the 360 area to broaden the appeal, kind of like the Big Three pushing cars/SUVs/trucks noone wants, that the market will expand, but the 360 won't be getting much of that action, unless something is happening I haven't heard about.

Re:Clown Wars, Anime Dating, RPGs, oh my (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#14844694)

I think the important issue, the question on everyone's mind is this:

Do you have Microsoft stock?

Just curious.

Re:More power, $400, Anime Dating, Puppies (4, Funny)

amliebsch (724858) | more than 8 years ago | (#14843990)

OKAY. We GET it. You have Microsoft stock. You can stop mentioning it in practically every thread you post in.

Re:More power, $400, Anime Dating, Puppies (1)

KDR_11k (778916) | more than 8 years ago | (#14844205)

ONE dating sim? Have you seen the rate at which those japanese indies churn those out?

Re:More power, $400, Anime Dating, Puppies (1)

WillAffleckUW (858324) | more than 8 years ago | (#14844375)

Actually, based on the review, I think I saw about four Anime Dating Sims, so I'm in Anime Heaven. Nose bleeds! Obligitory panty flashes! Ultra-violence without real injury! Stolen kisses after eight hours of game play! Now I won't be stuck playing the flash versions of Love Hina and other ones ...

Well, ok, since I've got a steady girlfriend for six months now, I haven't had time to do that, but still ...

Re:More power, $400, Anime Dating, Puppies (1)

jchenx (267053) | more than 8 years ago | (#14844403)

OK, so it's slightly more powerful than the xBox360, will probably retail around $400 without HDD (and $500 for Net/HDD config bundle) (figure initial cost to start at $500 so they can drop to $400 over a year, unless you get it cheap at Costco in a bundle), has 100-150 original content games, including an Anime Dating sim "Akira Project", a Nintendogs non-clone "Active Dogs", a lot of wierd anime games, a lot of RPGs, a lot of scary games, the obligitory sports games, the obligitory FPS games, Bomberman, Clown Combat (yup), ...

Well, TFA is sort of all over the place on price. I think the consensus is that the PS3 will definately be expensive to build, but no one knows how much Sony will subsidize it. That said, even assuming a $400/500 price tag, that's going to be expensive. You also have to consider MS may be in a position to drop the 360 price tag by the time the PS3 comes out. I have no idea if it will, but it seems like the smart thing to do. If you're Joe Gamer or Gamer's Mom on a budget, and you're presented with a $250/350 system and a $400/500 system, what will you choose? (Keep in mind that the 360 AND the Revolution might be at the lower price point)

Sony's list of 3rd party titles and developers is, and has always been, very impressive. That's the primary reason why I've played more PS/PS2 games than on any other console. The big question is how many of those titles are platform exclusive? (Several on the list already mentioned they were cross-platform) IMHO, Sony's major success comes from snagging exclusives from companies like Square-Enix, Capcom, Konami, etc., or at the very least, making sure they have the title before everyone else does (like GTA3).

OK, looks like xBox360 is going to lose a lot of market share when it ships, probably starting in December when most of the new titles ship.

Hmm, maybe I should sell my MSFT stock ...


Well, of COURSE it's going to lose market share, seeing how it's at 100%. Even with the supply problems, it's still the only provider of next-gen consoles. :)

As for selling MSFT stock, as a fellow shareholder (read my profile), I'd hold onto it for now. Ignore the 360. As we all know, most of the money comes from the OS and Office sales, and with new versions supposedly coming out this year, it should be interesting to see how the stock does. (It's been in a funk for the past few years)

Re:More power, $400, Anime Dating, Puppies (0, Troll)

WillAffleckUW (858324) | more than 8 years ago | (#14844682)

OK, looks like xBox360 is going to lose a lot of market share when it ships, probably starting in December when most of the new titles ship.

Hmm, maybe I should sell my MSFT stock ...


Well, of COURSE it's going to lose market share, seeing how it's at 100%. Even with the supply problems, it's still the only provider of next-gen consoles. :)

As for selling MSFT stock, as a fellow shareholder (read my profile), I'd hold onto it for now. Ignore the 360. As we all know, most of the money comes from the OS and Office sales, and with new versions supposedly coming out this year, it should be interesting to see how the stock does. (It's been in a funk for the past few years)


Right, I meant it looks like PS3 will regain top dog market share by December.

Personally, I think we make more money as shareholders from all the companies MSFT owns plus the returns on all those billions in cash that are just coming in ... not seriously thinking of selling my shares, but might do a swap of my Konami holdings and buy back into Sony (did well when I had it, sold it high before drop). Concerned about Blu-Ray and DRM impacts on that, though.

Akira Dating?! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#14844574)

[...] has 100-150 original content games, including an Anime Dating sim "Akira Project"
That would be COOL. I want to play a dating sim where I can go to a restaurant, psychokinetically levitate the waiter and turn him inside out, then splatter my date with his dripping remains, all to a sinister chorus of "DAAAAAA, DAAAAAA, DAAAAAA, ..."

Too many variables, too little information (5, Interesting)

netnemmy (947142) | more than 8 years ago | (#14843779)

The thing that's going to kill the PS3 is the price. If they don't release at the same point, or less, than the X-box, people are going to have to strain their wallets to afford this thing. Very few people are about to spend $800 for a console - there's a lot better ways to spend that money (you could even buy a 360, and several games).

Not to mention that, by the time the PS3 comes out, there will be many titles available for the 360. Although (as TFA shows) there are a good deal of games in development, the 360's titles will have matured while those for the PS3 will remain untested.

Finally, the longer it takes for Sony to put this console out, the less people will have confidence in it. Console developers are always hush-hush about their products, but at this point, it would do Sony well to clarify some things; they keep saying that they're going to release on-schedule, but nobody else sees how they can possibly do that. If they _do_ release on schedule, I for one will be forced to assume that it was rushed to market, and therefore not worth the risk (especially at that price).

It's what's inside the box that counts (4, Informative)

wuffalicious (896539) | more than 8 years ago | (#14843950)

I was under the impression that the original Playstation 2 took a while to come out as well, and did just fine on release despite the dreamcast being available long before it (and, in some ways, being a superior piece of hardware). I look at all the hype that's being slung around, and I wonder why people obsess so much about the systems themselves. Ultimately it's going to come down to a matter of games - it doesn't matter what your system is capable of if no one developes for it. The Dreamcast should be proof positive of that.

Release titles are what will matter - how many people would have picked up an xbox had it not been for Halo?

Re:Too many variables, too little information (1, Informative)

garcia (6573) | more than 8 years ago | (#14843989)

Very few people are about to spend $800 for a console - there's a lot better ways to spend that money (you could even buy a 360, and several games).

Umm, that's how much is costs Sony, not the consumer. Sony is going to be selling it at a considerably larger loss than Microsoft is for the 360. The PS3 will likely be priced at (or very near) that of the 360.

Things we know about the PS3: (1, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#14843785)

  1. It will cost $900
  2. It will come out in late 2007
  3. It will not have an online service
  4. It will not have vents
  5. It will be illegal and impossible to play used or rented games on the PS3
  6. It will not be capable of reading from or writing to memory
  7. The Cell chip will mean that it will require nine billion dollars to develop a single game
  8. XBox fanboy bloggers are always right

Slashdotted (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#14843790)

The site has been felled by the mighty Slashdot, or at least by its millions of minions..

maybe I can read it later at home when the newness factor dies down.

Short summary: (4, Interesting)

SharpFang (651121) | more than 8 years ago | (#14843793)

XBox360: Most hype.
PlayStation 3: Most CPU power.
Nintendo Revolution: Most fun.

Personally I'd say Nintendo is the best in the means of innovation. The competitors are just "the same old, just faster, better, stronger", while Nintendo takes a step in a completely new direction.

Re:Short summary: (3, Interesting)

fr0dicus (641320) | more than 8 years ago | (#14843871)

Weird, I found Nintendo least fun this time round. Waiting for games to trickle out isn't my idea of fun.

Re:Short summary: (1)

Castar (67188) | more than 8 years ago | (#14844523)

There are certainly more games being released for other platforms, but honestly, how many good games get released? Nintendo generally releases good games, but they don't do so very often. On the other platforms, you have tons of crappy sports titles, Barbie Horse Adventures, Generic Shooter #57, and Collection of Old Arcade Games released every month, sure, but how often do you get a GTA or a Halo? Is it really less often than you get a Zelda, Donkey Kong Jungle Beat, or Killer 7?

Re:Short summary: (1)

Manmademan (952354) | more than 8 years ago | (#14844608)

Killer 7 was not only multiplatform but IIRC, also fairly poorly reviewed.

Re:Short summary: (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#14843883)

The day they have GTA 4 on the revolution is the day I buy a revolution. o_O

A correction (2, Insightful)

toupsie (88295) | more than 8 years ago | (#14843893)

XBox360: Shipped

New Directions (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#14843924)

The competitors are just "the same old, just faster, better, stronger", while Nintendo takes a step in a completely new direction.

Right. Because the shape of the controller is the real innovation. Moving to the Cell processor is not a step in a completely new direction. Right...

Re:New Directions (1)

chrismcdirty (677039) | more than 8 years ago | (#14844116)

Last I checked, there was a lot more to the Revolution controller than just the shape.

Re:New Directions (2, Insightful)

bigman2003 (671309) | more than 8 years ago | (#14844438)

ANYTHING you've heard at this point is just hype.

It stops being hype when it ships. Until it ships...it is nothing but hype, rumor, and PR.

Re:New Directions (1)

Kenshin (43036) | more than 8 years ago | (#14844141)

Moving to the Cell processor is not a step in a completely new direction. Right...

Moving to the Cell architecture is like a car moving to a hybrid engine: It's not really gonna change the way you drive.

Re:New Directions (1)

SharpFang (651121) | more than 8 years ago | (#14844192)

uh, shape...? Shape is irrelevant.
Try to use the XBox360 controller as a tennis rocket handle, as a frying pan handle, as a steering wheel etc.

Let's count in the means of variables of space, starting from oldest.
Directional Keys: 4 bits in separate devices, one key one bit.

Everything since incorporated some keys so let's omit the key=bit count.

Paddles: 2 floats in 2 separate controllers.
Digital joystick: 4 bits combined in one manipulator with combinations limits. 8 directions.
Mouse: 2 floats indicating position (relative)
Analog joystick: 2 floats indicating position (absolute) in one device.
Analog joystick and analog trigger: 3 floats in 2 devices.
Manipulator with 2 analog joysticks: 4 floats in 2 devices.
Manipulator with 2 analog joysticks and analog triggers: 4 floats in 2 devices plus 1 float 1 device for each trigger.

Nintendo manipulator: 8 floats in one device (pitch, roll, yaw, acceleration X,Y,Z, angle horiz,vert from the base station (no distance)),

The direction is obvious: Put more variable generators in the controller, at first splitting them over multiple sub-devices (2 joysticks in 1 controller), and later trying to integrate them into one (paddles->mouse). Nintendo made an enormous leap here.

And add the funny fact of 360 degrees rotation freedom against some 30deg which you can turn the XBox 360 joystick ;)

Re:Short summary: (1)

totustuusmaria (957262) | more than 8 years ago | (#14843943)

I bowed out of the game back when Nintendo was still the top dog, Sega had just lost the game, and Microsoft hadn't established their reputation yet. Still, the Revolution intrigues me because I could play all the older nintendo games on it. Not that it's time to jump back in, but, I'll tell you, someone like me would never consider getting a $400-800 gaming machine like the PS2, even if it can strong arm the devil. We just don't have the money to waiste.

Re:Short summary: (1)

amliebsch (724858) | more than 8 years ago | (#14844045)

FWIW, you can also play all the older Nintendo games (and Sega, and Atari, and Coleco, and arcade, and a kickass media frontend) on a softmodded Xbox, which you can probably pick up used for less than $100.

Re:Short summary: (3, Interesting)

acidrain (35064) | more than 8 years ago | (#14844053)

Sony makes hardware that is difficult to program. But game developers have a financial gun to their heads and will ultimately do whatever it takes.

Remember how the XBox looked set to eat the PS2's lunch? However after 5 years of hardcore low level programming on freakish hardware the latest round of PS2 titles look just as good as the XBox titles.

Frankly the PS3 is a *lot* easier to program than the PS2. All the complaining is coming from PC developers (a.k.a the current crop of Unreal engine licensees) who never touched the PS2 and don't know the meaning of pain.

The weak developers will die out, and the rest will push the PS3 way further than the XBox360.

Re:Short summary: (1)

Kjella (173770) | more than 8 years ago | (#14844529)

Nintendo Revolution: Most fun.

Let me guess, from press shows and short demos, or are you one of the elusive alphatesters under NDA? Didn't think so. Yes, it's definately different, and I'm sure that alone will be fun to start with. But when we get together some friends we can easily play the GC for 4-5 hours straight (just swapping the losers). How? Well because it's tiny little finger movements.

I honestly can't see any of us waving the revolution controller around for that amount of time. Also, I think it makes it way too easy to make games where extereme wrist movement = good, like say hard left/right in mario kart. I guess it all depends on how it is used, you can do some very cool things with it. But if the "big thing" separating it from the others is that you need to wave it around like crazy, I'd rather take a traditional gamepad.

Re:Short summary: (1)

Knuckles (8964) | more than 8 years ago | (#14844683)

It has been repeatedly stated by people who used it (e.g., Edge magazine), that you can just as well use tiny movements, holding it in your lap, as big ones.

Re:Short summary: (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#14844696)

I honestly can't see any of us waving the revolution controller around for that amount of time. Also, I think it makes it way too easy to make games where extereme wrist movement = good, like say hard left/right in mario kart.
Don't be fooled by the commercial they aired. The few reviewers who demoed it said that you use tiny little wrist movements, not big sweeping gestures.

Yeah but seriously (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#14843810)

who actually gives a fuck what happens to Sony anyway? Screw 'em.

Jumping Herbert Christopher in a dump truck... (2)

Austerity Empowers (669817) | more than 8 years ago | (#14843845)

Just wait for the damn thing to come out already. Does it really matter if it's got 26 super nano vector spline processing engines with 18 pixel flushers and a quantum video output if it is still vapor? Will it make the games any better if it DOES? No, just prettier with more depth. Boring.

It's a waste of breath, any of thsoe features can disappear between now and then. Further, I've done HW design long enough to know that the only people who actually know what will and will not work on launch are 2-3 HW guys who actually work on it, and 2-3 SW guys who actually work on it. Their managers, coworkers, beta customers, that guy in procurement? They only know some post-processed garbage that the engineers came up with to get some sleep, or worse, some counter-garbage politics devised by unfriendly managers to look for an excuse for why they can't make a commitment (look up the term "estoppel").

WoW and Galactic Civilizations 2 should be able to tide all of us over until the console wars v4 have subsided enough to make a buying decision.

Re:Jumping Herbert Christopher in a dump truck... (1)

fr0dicus (641320) | more than 8 years ago | (#14843896)

More depth is boring? Aw :(

Re:Jumping Herbert Christopher in a dump truck... (1)

stringycheese (949470) | more than 8 years ago | (#14844594)

You forgot about the flux capacitor and the fact that it takes 1.21 gigawatts of power to run.

Played a Cell processor Demo (4, Interesting)

Kraegar (565221) | more than 8 years ago | (#14843852)

Recently at an IBM conference for pSeries hardware, they gave a small demo on the Cell processor. The demo was a Mac G4 running a sort of flight sim, with data for Mount St. Helens. The display was a 35" flat panel running at some obscene resolution. They began the demo with just the G4 processor, and no help from the Cell. It was painfuly slow, at less then one frame every 5 seconds. Jagged lines were obvious, and it looked terrible.

In the software demo, they then enabled the cell processor, or re-routed the processing to it in some way (it was hard to tell exactly, and they weren't too forthcoming). The difference was remarkable. 30 - 40 fps, and a crystal clear picture. The data they were using was from (or at least they said it was from) satellite images, GPS data, aerial photo surveys, and USGS maps. It was extremely well rendered, down to pebbles. Clouds and such were just remarkable.

At the end they offered to let us "fly", so I jumped at it and took the first turn. While not a real game by any stretch, it was a lot of fun to manuever through the terrain and look at the detail. So, taking what they said was going on at face value, the cell was a very impressive processor.

One thing of note, though... the "cell processor unit" they had hooked up to the G4 was HUGE. Bigger then a standard PC case, with 6 120mm fans on it. Not exactly heartening for something that's supposed to go into a console.

Still, my impression of it was that it's got a TON of possibility, and it really is working hardware.

Played a Cell processor Demo-A Fan of Fans. (1, Interesting)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#14843912)

"One thing of note, though... the "cell processor unit" they had hooked up to the G4 was HUGE. Bigger then a standard PC case, with 6 120mm fans on it. Not exactly heartening for something that's supposed to go into a console."

Maybe they overclocked it? Or it was more than one cell processor in a module.

Re:Played a Cell processor Demo (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#14844029)

Shocking. A CPP CPU more than 10 times the physical size of a conventional desktop CPU is more powerful?

Who would have thought?

That's without the PS3's NVidia GPU (5, Informative)

Animats (122034) | more than 8 years ago | (#14844046)

I went to a talk at Stanford where the lead architect of the Cell processor described that demo. That's running on a Cell processor which is actually doing the rendering. Sony's original plan for the PS3 worked that way, but they eventually put in a conventional NVidia chip.

So in the PS3, the Cell processors aren't doing the rendering. The Cell should render about as well as everything else with a current NVidia part.

Flyovers are easy if you have enough RAM and a GPU. How much RAM did the demo rig have?

Project New Jersey (1)

acvh (120205) | more than 8 years ago | (#14843920)

say no more. I'm getting one.

The question is... (1)

Zaatxe (939368) | more than 8 years ago | (#14843966)

From TFA:

Sony claims the machine is 35 times more powerful than the PlayStation 2, and has implied that the machine may be capable of nearly twice the performance of the Xbox 360.

My question is: will it have any game that can provide me some fun time?

Not known... root kit. (1, Troll)

fahrbot-bot (874524) | more than 8 years ago | (#14843985)

Someone at Sony accidently played one of their DRM'ed CDs on the development system and they're having a devil of a time getting the root kit off the platform and restoring the system image.

No film at 11.

Look! Vapor... (0, Redundant)

jferris (908786) | more than 8 years ago | (#14843991)

I just made you say Vapor Where.

I'll tell you what I know. (0, Offtopic)

Lord Kano (13027) | more than 8 years ago | (#14844011)

I'm not fucking buying one!

LK

More like "What is not known about the PS3" (3, Informative)

javaxman (705658) | more than 8 years ago | (#14844031)

Really, the article is a bit more like "here's the stuff we really don't know the answer to :"

- when will it ship
- what will it cost
- will games actually be able to live up to the great graphics and model/AI processing promised by the Cell processor marketing, or will they look pretty much like XBox360 games ?
- will there be a halfway decent online component ?
- is a hard drive included ? An add-on ? What's the deal ?

All we *really* seem to know is that there's a Cell processor inside, it'll support HD, include a Blu-ray drive, will take some sort of hard drive ( at least as an add-on ), will have built-in networking ( like crazy ), and will have a *ton* of games written for it... seriously, that's a long, long list of games. Oh, and it'll play existing PS2 games, though the article doesn't say that I think it's a well-known given. That and the controller they showed just looks weird.

Re:What we do know about PS3 since its on slashdot (1)

WillAffleckUW (858324) | more than 8 years ago | (#14844498)

Really, the article is a bit more like "here's the stuff we really don't know the answer to :"

- when will it ship


Fall 06, in time to get one-to-two months of buzz and hit stride for Novemeber-December sales.

- what will it cost

I'd say $500 at ship time retail, premium if preorder, $400 about a year later.

- will games actually be able to live up to the great graphics and model/AI processing promised by the Cell processor marketing, or will they look pretty much like XBox360 games ?

Don't really care. They'll look as good, which is the mark. The wider selection of more fun, more multi-gender, more age-range-capable, plus extra stuff that Euro and Asian zones go hot over means higher market share. My guess is 360 will have edge for standard US sports games and standard US FPS, but will lose out for most other categories.

- will there be a halfway decent online component ?

Don't really care. If you want a babysit-me version, probably not, go with 360. If you want a good quality one, yup. Looks like lower entry so far.

- is a hard drive included ? An add-on ? What's the deal ?/I.

My guess is it would probably be a removeable/upgradeable, shipping version included, larger one add money, ultra-gamer version out with multi-disk Blu-Ray library capabilities within six months.

Hope this helped.

What I Want to Know... (1)

necro81 (917438) | more than 8 years ago | (#14844090)

Is will it have a new version of Star Wars: Masters of Teras Kasi [lucasarts.com] ?

Or, as my friends in college liked to call it: Jedi Bitch-slap

Graphics power (4, Insightful)

MobyDisk (75490) | more than 8 years ago | (#14844198)

Today, game consoles compete on graphics capbility. I find that kinda funny since most people I know can't tell the difference between 640x480 and 1440x1080, can't distinguish a progressive image from an interlaced one, aren't bothered by aliasing, think 24fps isn't choppy, and can play Mario cart in 1/4th of the screen just fine. I bet the console manufacturers could support 480p, wide screen, and then upscale to everything else. Just keep it above 24fps. The gamers wouldn't notice or care.

Personally, I'm more interested in new controls and new game play innovation.

Maybe the consoles are really made just to impress the reviewers?

Re:Graphics power (1)

wift (164108) | more than 8 years ago | (#14844272)

I think if you showed someone 640x480 and then a screen at 1440x1080 they will notice a difference. I agree with the other analogies though. Maybe I'm just to literal minded. Game innovation is a sticky problem. Game publishers aren't going to throw millions at an unproven game genre. So smaller developing companies pick up the innovatino flag and run with it. The problem is they have litte or no backing. I just saw a google based video of a game called Spore that might force me to purchase a game for my PC for the first time in 3 years.

Remember the Atari? (1)

Belial6 (794905) | more than 8 years ago | (#14844581)

What are the games on the 2600 that were among the best, and never replicate.

Warlords
Circus Atari
Kaboom

These games were great because largely because of the controller. The joystick/pad has limited us in what we do with games. When Nintendo swapped the buttons from our left hand to our right, we became even more limited in what the games can really do. The Atari paddle was just a pot and a switch, but it allowed a game like Kaboom to be played. There is not a game console out today that can run a decent game of Kaboom.

So, yes. Controls are absoultuly important on game design, and have been terribly neglected.

Re:Graphics power more important than game? (2, Insightful)

WillAffleckUW (858324) | more than 8 years ago | (#14844613)

I agree with you that game quality and play are far more important than resolution, but I should point out that I went and bought the xBox version of Sims 2 instead of the GameCube version, due to the better graphics.

So, for a cross-platform game, I think it's critical.

For a single-platform, or console (PS3) plus portable (PSP) decision, I don't think it matters that much. It won't make me buy one console over the other.

As long as the games are there... (0)

kex (752312) | more than 8 years ago | (#14844245)

If they can release 1/4 of the games on that list with the system in September, they win.


If they just release metal gear 4 with the system, they win. I'll buy one.

holy proxy batman! (1)

BecomingLumberg (949374) | more than 8 years ago | (#14844247)

Can somebody please post the text? The proxy at work is keeping me down.

Will it be sold at a loss? Of course! (2, Interesting)

WoTG (610710) | more than 8 years ago | (#14844252)

I'm tired about all the speculation about how much of a loss Sony will take on each initial device. Of course there will be a loss, and the amount of the loss depends MORE on how you decide to distribute the cost of engineering (both at the component level, and at the system level) over the lifespan of the PS3.

How much will it cost to manufacture, excluding the up front investments? Probably reasonably close to the XBox360. Just look at the pieces. 200M transistor CPU and GPU's cost pretty much the same no matter the design. The cases are reasonably comparable. Power supplies will be similar -- unless the PS3 magically is able to use a whole lot less power than the Xbox, but I doubt it. The one difference major difference would be the DVD drive vs whatever the PS3 will have, but this added expense is offset by helping Sony launch their next-gen DVD format.

Re:Will it be sold at a loss? Of course! (2, Interesting)

WillAffleckUW (858324) | more than 8 years ago | (#14844409)

if it integrates with the PSP and people end up shelling out for:

PS3 - break even
PS3 controllers (extra, say two or three) - profit
PS3 game - profit, after first two
PSPs to attach and interact with PS3 - profit
PSP versions of PS3 games that interact with PS3 - profit
PS3 extra services - classic games, etc - profit

Not a bad market move.

Daikatana (1)

C_Kode (102755) | more than 8 years ago | (#14844323)

The PS3 is starting to look more and more like a Daikatana scenario. Is Sony changing the specs trying to make it better considering the competition? (As John Romero did with Daikatana) This could be ugly for Sony. All of the Kings of the Industry always come tumbling down sooner or later. (3dfx->NVidia->ATI, Sears->Walmart, etc)

Re:Daikatana (1)

filterban (916724) | more than 8 years ago | (#14844714)

Those are good examples, however - what about Microsoft?

In the end, it all comes down to the games (1)

WillAffleckUW (858324) | more than 8 years ago | (#14844339)

and based on the review and the titles shown, I'd say the 360 just had their clock cleaned.

Sure, some will be multi-platform, but most won't.

hmm (1)

slashdotwannabe (938257) | more than 8 years ago | (#14844411)

I'm curious why these discussions always seem to devolve into some variation of "a is better, and you're a poopyhead for even thinking that b will be better."

Personally, I'm buying them both, the same way I have since the Atari 2600 (Coleco, Vectrex, Intellivision, nintendo, playstation, etc etc).

Overhyped analysts (3, Interesting)

magicsquid (85985) | more than 8 years ago | (#14844441)

It is obvious to me what Sony is doing with the PS3. They are letting the analysts talk about how expensive it will be. The analysts are commenting on how hard it will be to develop for. The analysts talk about potential delays.

All this does is get the consumer to expect the worst.

Then when Sony prices it at $399 and delivers it on time, consumers will flock to it because now to them "It's $400 cheaper than I thought it would be! I've got to go get it!"

Sony loves right now that people are talking about $800 and $900 price tags. When they deliver at around $400 it will seem like the bargain of the century.

Re:Overhyped analysts but it works (1)

WillAffleckUW (858324) | more than 8 years ago | (#14844577)

Ssh. That's called marketing.

And it's working, since xBox360 set the bar so low by rushing to market.
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