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Dell Protests 'Not Wintel's Lapdog'

Zonk posted more than 8 years ago | from the doth-protest-too-much dept.

449

An anonymous reader writes "C|Net is reporting on a protestation by Dell's CTO, Kevin Kettler, who says quite loudly that they are not Microsoft and Intel's puppet." From the article: "Essentially, Kettler argued, Dell was responsible for selecting, if not necessarily developing, many of the technologies in today's desktop computers and servers. Among standards for which he said Dell deserves credit are 802.11 wireless networking, PCI Express communications technology and 64-bit extensions to Intel's x86 line of processors."

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449 comments

Uhhhh.... (5, Funny)

LinuxGeek (6139) | more than 8 years ago | (#15101857)

Isn't this like Pinocchio claiming that he isn't Geppetto's puppet?

Re:Uhhhh.... (-1, Flamebait)

Zardus (464755) | more than 8 years ago | (#15101872)

Its also like the "Al Gore invented the internet!" garbage.

Re:Uhhhh.... (5, Funny)

rblancarte (213492) | more than 8 years ago | (#15101947)

Yea, I gotta agree. This is funny.

Dell, you don't use AMD chips because you are afraid of Intel.
Dell, you don't sell Linux because you are affraid of MS.

You, know they are right. They are not their puppet. They are their BITCH.

RonB

Re:Uhhhh.... (4, Informative)

dekemoose (699264) | more than 8 years ago | (#15102108)

For the record, Dell does sell Linux on servers, workstations and (allegedly) their N series desktops. However, it appears that you can only get Optiplex and Dimensions in their N series without an OS, not with Linux installed, at least from what I can determine on their somewhat mysterious website. They do move a pretty decent number of Linux servers.

Re:Uhhhh.... (2, Informative)

rbannon (512814) | more than 8 years ago | (#15101959)

I'm no apologist for Gore, but I believe this often quoted statement was never made by Gore. It's plan ridiculous.

Re:Uhhhh.... (3, Informative)

gfxguy (98788) | more than 8 years ago | (#15102070)

"During my service in the United States Congress I took the initiative in creating the Internet."

Yes, he did say it, and he later acknowledged that he should have phrased it differently. He obviously meant he supported some of those technology initiatives and grants way back when.

I'm sure as hell no Gore apologist (look at my signature), and I think Gore is practically certifiable these days... but at the time, while I didn't vote for him, I got very annoyed when Bush supporters who brought up this subject. Of all the valid things to debate, people had to keep repeating this crap.

Re:Uhhhh.... (4, Informative)

Onan (25162) | more than 8 years ago | (#15101972)


That misquote just gets funnier and funnier over the decades, doesn't it?

(He helped in the creation of the Internet the only way that politicians ever do anything: he voted to fund it. And he never claimed to have done anything more than that.)

Re:Uhhhh.... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#15102109)

It's even funnier the way Bush haters keep trying to deny what Gore said.

"During my service in the United States Congress I took the initiative in creating the Internet." - Al Gore

That may not be what he ment to day, but to keep denying that is what he said only shows your own bias.

Re:Uhhhh.... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#15101890)

Dell: We're not Microsoft's bitch, really!

Re:Uhhhh.... (1)

vivek7006 (585218) | more than 8 years ago | (#15101911)

Dell to Intel:

I get a lot of money for you, and that makes you MY bitch.

Re:Uhhhh.... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#15101926)

But he's a real boy!

Re:Uhhhh.... (2, Interesting)

heatdeath (217147) | more than 8 years ago | (#15101929)

Isn't this like Pinocchio claiming that he isn't Geppetto's puppet?

Not at the end of the story. Pinocchio ended up being a real boy. :-)

I don't see much of a future for dell ever becoming a real boy.

It's even funnier when you RTFA. (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#15101934)

Dell's basically saying that because they used Xeon instead of Itanium, they're not an Intel puppet; and because they encouraged the adoption of many but not all Wintel standards they're not a Wintel puppet.

Had the guy pointed out their AMD systems (thanks to their Alienware brand) or their Linux systems (thanks to Novell and Red Hat), he might not have been laughed at in this article.

But instead most Dell web pages still say that they "recommend...XP" and the dell.com-branded pages never seem to admit the AMD computers they sell.

They're not only a Wintel lapdog, they're a puppet with MSFT and Intel's hands so far up their but it wiggles their toung when they talk

www.dell.ca (4, Interesting)

BigBlockMopar (191202) | more than 8 years ago | (#15101956)


Isn't this like Pinocchio claiming that he isn't Geppetto's puppet?

I want a new computer.

On www.dell.ca, I selected a Dimension 3100 - it's all that I need in a general purpose PC. I clicked on the "Customize it!" button. And it seems that I can't get it without Windows. [dell.com] (Not sure if that link will work, it set a few cookies in Firefox.) Furthermore, I have serious issues with any technology company sufficiently ignorant to run IIS.

Though I've always liked Dell hardware, Pinocchio gets no sale from me.

Re:Uhhhh.... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#15101965)

Also "I Love Lucy" is responsible for creating the television and Neil Armstrong for making the first space ship...

Re:Uhhhh.... (2, Insightful)

JordanL (886154) | more than 8 years ago | (#15102005)

Best quote ever:

"Microsoft may bitch, Intel may bitch," but the customers want Blu-ray, and that's what matters to the PC maker, Kettler said.

At least he had something right, eh?

Re:Uhhhh.... (1)

Anonymous Freak (16973) | more than 8 years ago | (#15102037)

I think it's more like Pinocchio claiming he's the master, and Geppetto is the puppet.

Re:Uhhhh.... (2, Funny)

jspoon (585173) | more than 8 years ago | (#15102098)

I've got no strings
To hold me down
To make me fret, or make me frown
I had strings
But now I'm free
There are no strings on me

-Michael Dell

Re:Uhhhh.... (1)

c_forq (924234) | more than 8 years ago | (#15102126)

I think he is more of saying "We are the Wal*Mart of Computers". I think he has a good point to, they have push and power over their suppliers (the same way Wal*Mart is able to bend suppliers to Wal*Mart's needs).

Yeah (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#15101858)

First post!!

-Mantra-

Big Whoop (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#15101864)

"Among standards for which he said Dell deserves credit are 802.11 wireless networking, PCI Express communications technology and 64-bit extensions to Intel's x86 line of processors.""

In other words he was a member of a standards body. So were MS and Intel.

Re:Big Whoop (2, Interesting)

Austerity Empowers (669817) | more than 8 years ago | (#15102066)

No their argument is that by choosing which technologies to include support for, even when the market was not already demanding them, they have made them successful. Apple, for example, may do some R&D and provide technologies standard on its laptops, but since they're usually proprietary, and so little of the market is Apple, they often are of limited success. PC makers often duplicate the useful ones in an open way. Dell would argue it chooses which of the knockoffs to succeed.

It's a lame argument, but to a suit, it makes sense. Choosing which finish product to propogate is not quite as helpful as funding and partipating in the development, but to a suit those are just "expenses".

Dell also invented Fr1st P0st !!!!!! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#15101866)

Fr1st P0ts !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

huaazaahahhaha..

WTF? (4, Insightful)

corrosive_nf (744601) | more than 8 years ago | (#15101870)

He's taking credit for 64 bit extensions. Uh didnt AMD do that, NOT Intel, and therefore NOT Dell?

Re:WTF? (1)

microbee (682094) | more than 8 years ago | (#15101885)

I am not sure about this, but I think Al Gore did invent Internet.

Re:WTF? (4, Funny)

joe_bruin (266648) | more than 8 years ago | (#15102033)

I am not sure about this, but I think Al Gore did invent Internet.

That's a common misconception. Al Gore is actually the inventor of the Algorithm. The Internet was invented by AOL.

Re:WTF? (2, Insightful)

corrosive_nf (744601) | more than 8 years ago | (#15101887)

And also, just because you sell more computers than anyone else doesnt mean you were responsible for adoption of a standard. When dell begins to sell AMD will they claim responsibility for AMD?
If anything apple is responsible for wireless. They had it standard before anyone else did.

Re:WTF? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#15101893)

He ment more that DELL noticed that AMD sells more CPUs because of 64bit and foo and that DELL forced INTEL to hack a cheap Copy of it (on any coasts) into their totaly fucked up "Networst"-based CPUs...

LOL (0)

IHSW (960644) | more than 8 years ago | (#15101900)

No. Just no. [wikipedia.org]

1991: MIPS Technologies produced the first 64-bit CPU, as the third revision of their MIPS RISC architecture, the R4000. The CPU was commercially available in 1991 and used in SGI graphics workstations starting with the Crimson, running the 64-bit version of the IRIX operating system.

64bit Extensions (1)

LinuxGeek (6139) | more than 8 years ago | (#15101967)

64bit extensions to the IA32 instruction set. No one here is claiming that AMD or intel developed the first 64bit processor.

Re:WTF? (1)

uofitorn (804157) | more than 8 years ago | (#15101921)

No, I'm pretty sure AMD was not responsible for Intel's own implementation of the 64-bit x86 extensions.

Re:WTF? (1)

corrosive_nf (744601) | more than 8 years ago | (#15101941)

You should reserch before you respond. Intel has admitted they reverse engineered AMD's extensions for their own chips.

Re:WTF? (1)

IronTek (153138) | more than 8 years ago | (#15102012)

You should reserch before you respond. Intel has admitted they reverse engineered AMD's extensions for their own chips.

Intel didn't reverse engineer anything. AMD and Intel have a cross-licensing agreement in place. Intel simply implemented AMDs spec.

Re:WTF? (1)

sznupi (719324) | more than 8 years ago | (#15101924)

Well, in some way we can say he's right. Note that he sayd specifically about promoting 64-bit extensions for Intel processors, not 64-bits in general. Essentially it was Dell who made for Intel big numbers of 64-bit chips sold possible.

Re:WTF? (1)

drinkypoo (153816) | more than 8 years ago | (#15102027)

I'm pretty sure that's a bunch of crap. Statistically, no one is buying AMD chips because they're 64 bit outside of cluster use and maybe some Linux servers. Intel just had to go 64 bit because AMD did, not because anyone actually wanted it - especially not the type of people who buy Dell.

Did anybody even RTF Article? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#15102000)

There are 20 posts pointing out that AMD developed the 64Bit extensions. Did you guys even look at the article. He doesn't claim to have invented or developed them, he claims to have *pressured Intel into adopting them*. Here is the paragraph from the article:

especially when Intel was faced with a move to advanced chips with 64-bit abilities. Instead of endowing its x86 chips, such as Pentium and Xeon, with 64-bit features, Intel aggressively pushed its Itanium line. Dell, though, urged Intel to boost x86--the direction rival chipmaker Advanced Micro Devices took.

The same goes for the other points: He doesn't claim to have developed 802.11, he claims to have convinced Intel to adopt it over HomeRF.

Re:Did anybody even RTF Article? (5, Insightful)

kfg (145172) | more than 8 years ago | (#15102105)

He doesn't claim to have invented or developed them, he claims to have *pressured Intel into adopting them*

Indeed, and just because the dog drags the owner about by the leash a bit doesn't mean he's not still the dog.

One good tug on the choke chain'll bring 'im up short.

KFG

Dell....developing? (1, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#15101871)

Isn't that like MS innovating?

Re:Dell....developing? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#15101898)

Dell's definition of development:

--insert Dell executive title here-- walking into a room screaming at the top of their lungs:

"EVERYONE MUST USE STANDARDS, EVERYONE MUST USE STANDARDS."

Leave room.

64-bit extensions??? (3, Informative)

Andy Dodd (701) | more than 8 years ago | (#15101878)

Um, Dell, you don't use AMD chips in any of your products. (I'm not counting Alienware here, since they were purchased long after AMD64 and EM64T came out.) AMD was the first company to release 64-bit extensions to IA32.

Dell also had nothing to do with IA64, considering Intel's primary partner for that was Dell's competitor HP.

Re:64-bit extensions??? (3, Informative)

GraZZ (9716) | more than 8 years ago | (#15101953)

For all the people that haven't read the article, Dell isn't saying they developed 64bit extensions for Intel. What they're saying can be summed up in the following hypothetical dialog:

Dell Strategist: "This AMD 64 bit thing is really being marketed well, and demand for 64 bits is increasing. You'd better have 64 bit soon or we'll be forced to start selling AMD machines."
Intel Strategist: "Yikes, ok, ok, we'll get R&D on ripping off*cough* working on a similar solution"

Re:64-bit extensions??? (1)

hawkbug (94280) | more than 8 years ago | (#15102068)

Exactly - without Dell suggesting 64 bit extensions be picked up by Intel, I'm not sure if it would have ever happened. Now what I don't understand is why in the hell are 64 bit instructions not present in the new CoreDuo chips that Apple is using? That just blows my mind, Apple went from 64 bit G5s to 32 bit Intel chips. That tells me Apple has no immediate plans to have a x64 bit operating system. If they do, people buying the new CoreDuo chips are SOL.

Never seen... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#15101886)

I've never seen an option to get Windows in 64bits on the Dell site.

Re:Never seen... (3, Informative)

HardCase (14757) | more than 8 years ago | (#15101980)

I've never seen an option to get Windows in 64bits on the Dell site.

You didn't look very hard. My Precision 470 came with XP64:


Important: Not all current applications and/or peripherals are compatible with 64-bit and may not function properly. Be sure to verify compatibility with all application and peripheral vendors prior to purchasing a Dell Precision platform with a 64-bit operating system.
        Genuine Windows® XP Professional SP2 with media
        Genuine Windows® XP Professional SP2 without media
        Genuine Windows® XP Professional x64 w/ media
        Genuine Windows® XP Professional x64 w/o media

        Red Hat Linux v4.0 No Media
        Red Hat Linux v4.0 with Media
        Red Hat Linux v4.0 64bit No Media
        Red Hat Linux v4.0 64bit with Media

Re:Never seen... (1)

Ex Machina (10710) | more than 8 years ago | (#15102008)

Wow, they should really think about using a newer version of RedHat / Fedora. I mean even 5.2 is light years less awful!

802.11b???? (5, Informative)

Pfhor (40220) | more than 8 years ago | (#15101888)

What about apple and Airport, built into the ibook, released in 1999. I do not believe ANYONE had a builtin 802.11b solution back then, except for apple. (there was 802.11b, just as a pc card).

In fact, the ibooks were delayed because they had yet to pass FCC testing when they were announced at MacWorld.

Re:802.11b???? (1)

DurendalMac (736637) | more than 8 years ago | (#15101904)

As well as PCIe being standardized and ramped up to be the next expansion architecture long before it ever got into a computer...and that Dell had nothing to do with 64 bit computing...they're blowing a lot of hot air because they used some stuff around the time it came out. Oooh, big deal. As for not being an MS/Intel puppet, Michael Dell made that comment as he took a break from giving Bill Gates a rusty trombone.

Re:802.11b???? (1)

krakelohm (830589) | more than 8 years ago | (#15102120)

I know I am going to regret this... What is a rusty trombone?

*cough*bullshit*cough* (1)

Azreal (147961) | more than 8 years ago | (#15101894)

802.11 - IEEE with netgear dlink et al
Pci-e - nvidia and ati
intel x84-64 - AMD

And most importantly, it could be argued that early adopters were the ones who were most responsible, which is a market share Dell is not known for.

This Just In (5, Insightful)

masterpenguin (878744) | more than 8 years ago | (#15101896)

Apple Exec Claims "We're Not IBM's Lapdog" And they've proven that. If Dell's CTO wants some crediblity on his statement, maybe he should try to make public moves that show it.

Re:This Just In (-1, Flamebait)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#15101968)

"And they've proven that"

You mean if Dell wants as much credibility as Apple they should be so much of a pain in the ass to work with that Intel ends up dropping them as a customer like IBM did with Apple?

Oh wait, you're one of those poor fucks who took at face value Steve Jobs' damage control about getting dumped by IBM...

They aren't Intel's lapdog.... (1, Redundant)

corrosive_nf (744601) | more than 8 years ago | (#15101905)

they have proven they are Intel and Microsofts' bitch however.

In other words (1, Interesting)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#15101909)

So, Intel develops PCI express and [the version of] x86-64 [which Dell uses], and is part of the 802.11 development process.

But Dell were the ones who.. um.. repackaged and resold them to consumers! And, y'know, Dell didn't have to do that! Dell could have just decided to stop making computers altogether and instead just sold ice cream. So Dell really deserves the credit here. Intel creates, Dell... "selects".

So in other words, sure, Dell isn't Intel's lapdog. They're just Intel's marketing wing.

Hey, didn't Apple get some or all of those technologies (802.11, PCI express) in shipping products before Dell did? Just curious, my memory sucks...

Re:In other words (1)

MemoryDragon (544441) | more than 8 years ago | (#15101942)

Actually this sounds more like a laptog to me.

Re:In other words (1)

Penguinoflight (517245) | more than 8 years ago | (#15101954)

Dell was actually fairly early to adopt PCI express. Before the Intel Macs, but I dont know if apple was using pci express with their g5s.

The guy is obviously lying, and I cant see why. If I want a dell it's only because they are intel's lapdog, and therefor a cheap option.

Re:In other words (1)

Col Bat Guano (633857) | more than 8 years ago | (#15102061)

Apple only came out with their PCI-Express in their G5 towers & iMacs in October 2005, which was fairly late compared to the availability of x86 motherboards.

Dell didn't invent, but did coerce Intel a bit. (1)

Anonymous Freak (16973) | more than 8 years ago | (#15102076)

No, Apple was late to the game with PCI Express. Dell could very well have been the first OEM to ship a desktop with it; but it was destined to be the standard no matter what Dell had to say about the matter.

Now if Dell ships computers with ONLY PCI Express slots, forcing add-in board makers to move their legacy PCI boards (TV tuners, WiFi cards, etc,) to PCI Express, THEN Dell can claim some leadership. (As Apple did with USB.)

802.11? That's a joke, right? Apple pushed that one, and Dell was late to the game with making it standard on their laptops.

I can see Dell having a major influence on adding AMD's 64-bit extensions to Intel processors though. Dell sells enough server hardware that Intel would be very brave indeed to ignore a Dell request on server features. I'm not saying, and I don't think the OP or the quoted CTO is saying, that Dell invented the AMD 64-bit extensions. Only that Dell was pivotal in convincing Intel to adopt them. Dell canned Itanium, and was probably ready to sign a deal with AMD for Opterons before Intel caved and put AMD64 into Xeons. Moving that to the desktop line is just a nice bonus.

OK... (1)

Shadow Wrought (586631) | more than 8 years ago | (#15101910)

So I'm not as up on CPUs as I once was, but I am curious about Dell saying that they should get credit for 64-bit extensions to Intel's x86 line of processors. Didn't AMD bring the 64bit game to the Big League level? I thought that Intel were the ones rushing to try and keep up on that front.

Re:OK... (1)

Shadow Wrought (586631) | more than 8 years ago | (#15101952)

Note to self:

  1. </i> means something completely different than <li>, and

  2. The "Preview" button ain't just there for show...

Uhhh... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#15101913)

Among standards for which he said Dell deserves credit are 802.11 wireless networking, PCI Express communications technology and 64-bit extensions to Intel's x86 line of processors.

Let me be the first to say that Mr. Kevin Kettler is the sockpuppet [wikipedia.org] of Al Gore. I vote to ban.

Awwww. (5, Funny)

Wellington Grey (942717) | more than 8 years ago | (#15101914)

Of course you're not a wittle doggie woggie, are you Kettler whettler? Now who wants a treat? Who wants a treat? Good boy!

-Grey [wellingtongrey.net]

Re:Awwww. (1)

Joey Patterson (547891) | more than 8 years ago | (#15102015)

Now who wants a treat? Who wants a treat? Michael Dell wants a boney-woney!

So sad. (5, Insightful)

Majikk (60247) | more than 8 years ago | (#15101915)

Delusions of Relevance.

64-Bit (4, Funny)

LightningTH (151451) | more than 8 years ago | (#15101916)

"64-bit extensions to Intel's x86 line of processors", and here all this time I thought Intel ripped AMD's 64-bit spec for x86.

Why So Defensive? (5, Interesting)

mveloso (325617) | more than 8 years ago | (#15101919)

Dell doesn't really need to be defensive. They do one thing, and they do it really well: Dell builds cheap computers. There's a lot of value there, the quality of their product and support notwithstanding.

Sure, they don't really do R&D. But they don't need to - they have Intel, Microsoft, Lexmark, and the rest of the OEM partners to do that. They are a gateway to the market, not a market-maker. That's their niche. It's a really big one, and they do it really well. After all, they do make billions a year. And unlike Microsoft, they do it without being a monopoly.

Re:Why So Defensive? (2, Interesting)

BigBlockMopar (191202) | more than 8 years ago | (#15102034)


Dell doesn't really need to be defensive. They do one thing, and they do it really well: Dell builds cheap computers. There's a lot of value there, the quality of their product and support notwithstanding.

Quality of their products? I've always found it to be good - sure, ECS motherboards may be one of their OEM suppliers, but they demand better quality control than ECS' own generic boards.

A big test of the quality of any PC is opening the power supply. In Dells, Compaqs (haven't opened one since the HP merger) and IBM (haven't opened one since the Levono or whatever selloff) I usually find Sprague, Vishay or Nichicon electrolytic capacitors. That's good with me - it means I probably won't have 50 computers waiting for me to recap the power supplies in a year.

(By the way, most of the time when modern electronics fails, it's because of dried out (high ESR) electrolytics.)

We are not evil! (1)

twitter (104583) | more than 8 years ago | (#15102103)

Admitting to anti-competitive practices would get them fined or jailed. I get this picture of Bill Gates patting a small dog on the head. "Good boy, you even fooled some of the Slashdot crowd for me. Have some more Designed for Vista stickers and a biter bone." Dog drools.

unlike Microsoft, they do it without being a monopoly.

My state has a sole source contract with Dell. For them, it's a monopoly and it sucks. Your state may have a similar contract. They swore it would save money, choke, gag.

It's not a perfect monopoly, yet. You can, with four months of effort and a PhD, purchase a non Dell laptop at LSU. Given the performance of some Dell laptops lately, the effort might be worth it. Act quickly, before they close the loopholes. Next they will forbid private laptops from connecting to the new interweb.

Hah! (5, Insightful)

Onan (25162) | more than 8 years ago | (#15101922)


The ironic part is that Dell has always been very up-front about the fact that they do no research, pioneer no technologies, and create nothing new. Dell is all about execution, not creation: they manufacture devices based upon the technologies of others, deliver them to consumers, and do it with very low overhead.

Which is a perfectly fine thing for them to do. It's not heroic work, but neither is being a plumber, and we still like to have them around.

But I have to admit that my respect for any plumber would go down if he started trying to convince me that he's the one that actually discovered the Bernoulli Principle.

Dell not a real computer company. (2, Insightful)

LWATCDR (28044) | more than 8 years ago | (#15102041)

Dell is the worlds biggest mom and pop computer store.
They take off the shelf parts and put them into a case. Nothing wrong with that but they really don't make computers they assemble them.

yea sure (1)

MemoryDragon (544441) | more than 8 years ago | (#15101923)

the x86 64 bit extensions were an AMD invention, this claim is as hilarious as the one that Microsoft invented the internet. Dell was not even selling AMD back then!

Re:yea sure (0, Troll)

Baloo Ursidae (29355) | more than 8 years ago | (#15101997)

It was Al Gore [wikipedia.org] that claimed to have invented the Internet.

Re:yea sure (1)

xevocius (513222) | more than 8 years ago | (#15102002)

this claim is as hilarious as the one that Microsoft invented the internet

Wait.. I thought Al Gore invented the internets!?

Re:yea sure (1)

drinkypoo (153816) | more than 8 years ago | (#15102051)

Dell isn't selling AMD now, either. Do they own Alienware yet? Even if they ware, those aren't Dell branded (yet?) so the statement stands. Regardless you have a reading comprehenshion problem, since they claim they were the driving force behind intel's adoption of x86-64 extensions (although they couldn't manage to use AMD's name for 'em or anything.)

Re:yea sure (1)

GeXX (449863) | more than 8 years ago | (#15102090)

There's a link to dell's website showing that they are selling AMD processors :)

http://accessories.us.dell.com/sna/productdetail.a spx?sku=A0558328&c=us&l=en&cs=19&category_id=2999& page=external [dell.com]

So Dell is selling AMD, and I heard a rumor that dell does have AMD based systems, but only to huge companies.

Cry Baby cry (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#15101928)

Do they start to realize that nobody can be trust in this cruel world? They have shown a deep allegiance to Wintel since the beginning and now they realize that the Wintel gang are cheating them with Apple because the beauty is by far more sexy. Can be a good new for AMD and Linux if Dell turn to them to revenge the lost love.

My goodness.. (1)

Sassinak (150422) | more than 8 years ago | (#15101930)

So they want credit on the adoption of a standard that people have been demanding for ages?.. That is hilarious.

Dell could not be any more in bed with Microsoft and Intel that if Microsoft and Intel OWNED them..
Oh, wait.... Umm.. never mind.

oh wrinklepaws! (1)

Ex Machina (10710) | more than 8 years ago | (#15101936)

You mean AMD's x86 extensions [wikipedia.org] ?

The whole article is very silly; who cares about Dell's market clout -- it seems to be like Apple made a much bigger impact on the tech sector during its dark days -- releasing USB on the legacy-free iMac, a popular 802.11 implementation with non fixed length passwords (LEAP I believe?) .. oh... and uh... the iPod!

Dell's losing it... (1, Offtopic)

creimer (824291) | more than 8 years ago | (#15101938)

Why does my Dell Inspiron laptop of three years ago still beats Dell's current offerings? In fact, if I want a better laptop than what I got today for the same price that I paid three years ago, I would have to go with Alienware. I think my next laptop will probably be a dual-booting MacBook.

I Once Read (1)

Comatose51 (687974) | more than 8 years ago | (#15101939)

I once read somewhere, maybe in the Prince or some similar book, that the best way to rule over someone is let them think that they have a choice. Just make sure you take away all the other choices that you don't like first.

But overall, Dell tends to follow Intel's lead and isn't setting the agenda, said Gartner analyst Steve Kleynhans. "They tend to get involved at the point where technology is getting standardized, and they popularize it. They get it out to a lot of people," he said. "But I don't see them as being the driver of a technology or the one that sets the direction."

Right so Intel already made the decision and Dell goes and figures out how to package it and market it. Don't most subordinates do the same?

So that means I can order what I need, right? (1)

Baloo Ursidae (29355) | more than 8 years ago | (#15101940)

C|Net is reporting on a protestation by Dell's CTO, Kevin Kettler, who says quite loudly that they are not Microsoft and Intel's puppet.

I can order that Debian GNU/Linux-preinstalled Dell desktop when?

Re:So that means I can order what I need, right? (1)

salzbrot (314893) | more than 8 years ago | (#15102111)

How about right now [dell.com] ?

Okay, okay it is not Debian. But Linux nonetheless.

Well... (0, Redundant)

jigjigga (903943) | more than 8 years ago | (#15101945)

Al Gore did invent the intarweb so I guess this flies.

More like Intel is Dell's puppet. (5, Insightful)

LOTHAR, of the Hill (14645) | more than 8 years ago | (#15101949)

Dell is Intel's best customer. Intel bends over backwards seven different ways to keep them happy. Intel will give Dell what they want, or Dell will build AMD systems. There's been several times when rumors of Dell selling AMD based systems. Shortly after that, Dell quashes the rumor and announces a major new partnership with Intel.

The article went on to say... (3, Funny)

wbren (682133) | more than 8 years ago | (#15101970)

Among standards for which he said Dell deserves credit are 802.11 wireless networking, PCI Express communications technology and 64-bit extensions to Intel's x86 line of processors.

The article went on to say Dell deserves credit for developing the Internet, two-button mouse, and sliced bread.

Who cares about Dell (2, Insightful)

octopus72 (936841) | more than 8 years ago | (#15101981)

Their innovation is inserting cards into sockets, connecting cables, using screwdriver and putting label onto their "product".

Anybody rtfa? (3, Informative)

SocietyoftheFist (316444) | more than 8 years ago | (#15101982)

The blurb at the top of the page isn't in context. Dell is saying they pushed Intel to use 802.11b instead of HomeRF, that they asked for 64 bit extensions in their processors and pushed for PCI Express.

So what they're really claiming... (1)

msauve (701917) | more than 8 years ago | (#15102063)

is that Dell is responsible for what goes into Dell computers?

If they wanted 802.11 and 64 bit extensions and PCI Express support, but chose to push Intel for those technologies, I suppose that supports their premise - they're not a lapdog, they're a dog that pulls on the leash.

Re:Anybody rtfa? (1)

Reapman (740286) | more than 8 years ago | (#15102084)

rtfa? to quote... "you must be new here"

Thank God for Instant Replay (4, Funny)

djupedal (584558) | more than 8 years ago | (#15101987)

"We don't agree on that one, Dick - I'm sure no one here in the stadium does, so let's go up to the booth for a quick moment and see what Zandy, our replay commentator, has to say."

"Well, Bob, we're seeing the same footage as the refs down on the field, and they seem to be simply making sure they all have the same opinion. Caution is good. Our view was blocked from up here, but on the tape, you can clearly see that Dell never had control of the ball, and there doesn't seem to be anyt...wait... - there's the ruling! No innovation by Dell! The refs are in complete agreement too - back to you Bob!"

Al Gore Protests "Not Clinton's Vice President" (1)

Hootenanny (966459) | more than 8 years ago | (#15101988)

In related news, Al Gore protested that he was, in fact, not Bill Clinton's vice president. Mr. Gore went on record by further saying that he is personally responsible for such innovations as the "internet" and "global warming".

I was gonna say Dell claimed to create Al Gore (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#15102017)

But you beat me to it. :-)

Risk aversion (5, Insightful)

erice (13380) | more than 8 years ago | (#15102039)

HomeRF (Intel) vs 802.11 (Dell)
DDR (Dell) vs RAMBUS (Intel)
Itanium (Intel) vs x64 (Dell)

Sounds to me like Dell always follows Intel, unless Intel's choice is too risky. The last item is an excelent example. Itanium is risky so Dell wanted nothing of that. On the other hand, using non-Intel processors is risky so Dell just waited until Intel brought out 64bit x86 processors.

Dell isn't Intel's puppet. Dell is simply run by cowards and, most of the time, Wintel is the safest choice. Dell will follow wherever Intel leads, unless it's out on a limb.

Obligatory RTFA request (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#15102065)

If all you smucks who bitched about Dell not inventing any of these things actually read the article, you'd realize that they are talking about the influence the company had on setting standards and driving adoption.

They certainly have a high enough volume of sales to influence other players.

They're NOT claiming to have invented the tech. (3, Insightful)

WoTG (610710) | more than 8 years ago | (#15102079)

RTFA folks, the Dell guy in the article is not claiming that Dell inventied WiFi, x86-64 or anything like that. They're claiming that by virtue of their throwing their weight behind a technology, they can be the catalyst to make standards actually be useful. In many ways I tend to agree. It's pretty clear to me that Dell has huge sway over Intel these days. Against MSFT? I'm not too sure.

Ok then.... (1)

Nonillion (266505) | more than 8 years ago | (#15102080)

"Dell's CTO, Kevin Kettler, who says quite loudly that they are not Microsoft and Intel's puppet."

Fair enough, then how come I cannot get a dual opteron with ultra320 SCSI and a linux disrto of my choice?

Dell did no such thing. (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#15102089)

Dell is in no way responsible for the technologies found on modern motherboards. This is a ludicrous statement. They weren't even remotely close to determining which features nor what the features did. I've been in this industry for over 20 years and I'm insulted by this.

Dell may have been early adopters of some technologies, such as the ATX standard but they didn't develop and only minimally contributed to it.

That foul mouthed puppet needs to stick his head back in the toilet.

Ok, it's easy to be cynical about this... (4, Insightful)

Aphrika (756248) | more than 8 years ago | (#15102093)

...but he's talking about those technologies from a business perspective.

Let's have a look at PCI Express. Early in 2004 it had competition from PCI-X - PCI extended - however, Dell here [dell.com] are discussing the implications of swapping from PCI to PCIe. Now, at the time, PCI-X was seen as an interim measure, but Dell skipped it, instead opting to use PCIe across their desktop range. See, they didn't 'invent' it, but a big company like Dell deciding to run with a specific technology is going to have an impact. No doubt we'll probably see the same with ExpressCard, which seems to be standard on pretty much all Dell laptops released since Fall last year - point me in the direction of another manufacturer who's committed to ExpressCard and not still releasing PC card stuff - HP? Lenovo? Fujitsu? Toshiba?

Right, 64-bit extensions. Again, they didn't invent it, but I know that they had an instrumental role in convincing Intel (who needs 64-bit computing?) to add EMT 64 extensions to the Xeon range. That might have been partly forced by Dell's customers asking for 64-bit availability, but you cannot deny that with a big player like Dell dumping out 64-bit Xeons, it did give the market a huge kick up the arse - and one that I'm pretty convinced Intel wouldn't have done on their own. Remember, they stubbornly sat on their hands for ages insisting point blank that 64-bit was not the way to go and that if you wanted it, you had to buy Itaniums (*shudder*).

Wireless? The only evidence I can find that supports this is that Dell were the first company to offer an 802.11b wireless card in a desktop config. I don't for once think that drove any kind of market force as it was an option on the Dimension desktop line, but his points in the article that they stopped Intel marketing that awful HomeRF standard might be justified.

So it's not really 100% bullshit - the guy has some valid points. Yes Dell has helped promote a couple of standards over the years - USB 2 first appeared on Dells, Centrino laptops first appeared as Dells, they were second (behind Apple) to ship LCDs as standard with PCs. However, they've also bombed in other areas: they still don't have a coherent Mediacenter PC and seem to offer the OS on anything you'd want, and they don't have a tablet option. Now if they could pull their finger out and try to push those down people's throats, we might be getting somewhere.

So, before you're moronic enough to read bullshit into what he said, sit back and have a think about how a company's size can dictate whether technologies succeed or not, then think about what didn't succeed but could've, like Itanium, HomeRF and PCI-X...

The power of DELL is simple. (3, Insightful)

JollyFinn (267972) | more than 8 years ago | (#15102100)

If Dell says Intel in 2003 that they buy only x86-64 supported chips in 2006, while certain portion earlier. Now Intel has two choices, give dell chip they want or let AMD give dell chip they wan't.

Also for popularizing pci-express, if DELL says they are phasing out AGP in favour of pci-express in certain time scale, the gfx-card manufacturers are going to listen very carefully, as the chipset vendors too, since they know that if they don't have product that dell wants to buy the other guys will. And by dell making such decision practicly guarantees a reasonable market to go full production of the new interface.

As far as Blue Ray Disc Vs HD-DVD, if Dell chooces BD, then they will wait until they can get BD in pricepoints that fit the Dell model, and skip the HD-DVD unless the situation becomes such that it's no-brainer to include instead of DVD, and BD would still be too expensive.

But with Dell committed on one side, that side has big edge on PC:s once the prices come down, if there is competition between formats going on anymore, but don't assume dell stays that way if HD-DVD drive costs 20$ while BD costs 300$ . Dell is still volume manufacturer, but BD will be what they prefer if price difference is reasonable, and that whats will be in many peoples machines when the drive isn't too expensive for dell to put as default option in many of their lines.

The lawyers told them to say it (1, Interesting)

Glacial Wanderer (962045) | more than 8 years ago | (#15102133)

I bet Microsoft and Intel's lawyers were worried about their companies being charged as monopolies again. So they told Dell to say this.
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