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Boot Camp For Suckers?

Zonk posted more than 8 years ago | from the bet-it-works-too dept.

610

DigitalDame2 writes "PC Magazine's Editor-in-Chief says the whole Mac/Windows dual-boot thing is really nothing to get excited about. He writes that Boot Camp is really just a plan to get Windows users to convert to OS X." From the article: "Once you've laid out a few kilobucks on your BC system and been frustrated a few times with Windows limitations, what are you going to do? Jobs's bet: You'll start spending more and more time in OS X, until you--too--become one of the pod people. It's sad to see so many of my compatriots being turned into lemmings. Perhaps they'll wake up and smell the Apple pie in the sky--and realize they've been taken for a ride. But I doubt it."

cancel ×

610 comments

Message for Captain Obvious (5, Insightful)

MoxCamel (20484) | more than 8 years ago | (#15265675)

Boot Camp is really just a plan to get Windows users to convert to OS X.

Well...duh! Did anyone think Apple was doing it as a public service?

Next up: Publishers put nice pictures on their book covers so you will buy them. Bastards!!

Mox

Re:Message for Captain Obvious (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#15265693)

Well...duh! Did anyone think Apple was doing it as a public service?

In a roundabout way ...duh!

Re:Message for Captain Obvious (1, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#15265949)

Uh oh, this isn't going to sit well with the Apple faithful. My advice: turn down all offers of grape Kool-Aid for the next couple of computer news cycles.

Re:Message for Captain Obvious (3, Insightful)

jcr (53032) | more than 8 years ago | (#15265752)

Did anyone think Apple was doing it as a public service?

The main purposes of boot camp are: 1) keep people from destroying their Macs by trying to follow the directions they found on the web for hacking the boot sequence, and 2) allow Mac users to forego having an extra PC around to run that one windows-only app that they have to use for work.

-jcr

Re:Message for Captain Obvious (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#15265882)

And 3) Boost the quarter's sales numbers while key products (Intel iBook) are still MIA.

Praising with Faint D@mns ... (5, Insightful)

rewinn (647614) | more than 8 years ago | (#15265858)

Once you've .... been frustrated a few times with Windows limitations, what are you going to do? .... start spending more and more time in OS X

I don't know whether the article is confused or trying to be clever, but I don't think Apple minds 'criticism' such as that.

So what you're telling me is... (3, Interesting)

AKAImBatman (238306) | more than 8 years ago | (#15265680)

...the editor of PC Magazine reads Slashdot [slashdot.org] ? What a shocker. And he even ads* in the requisite amount of Jobs hating because he knows his readers are Windows fans.

All I have to say is: Where's my royalty check?

* Whoops, freudian slip

P.S. What does everyone think of the new comment system? [slashdot.org]

P.P.S. Yes, I really typed ads. I figured it was more insightful to point it out rather than correct it.


Re:So what you're telling me is... (1, Troll)

Ohreally_factor (593551) | more than 8 years ago | (#15265848)

I started to reply "I want to have a threesome with your mom and dad", but I caught the typo before I hit submit.

Re:So what you're telling me is... (1)

AKAImBatman (238306) | more than 8 years ago | (#15265893)

My point being that this anti-Mac trolling is a cheap attempt at driving up ad revenue. I caught the "ads" typo when I was proof-reading, and thought it fit right in. Especially since I don't see my royalty check! We should tag this article with "stolenfromakaimbatman" in protest. :-P

Apple's Confidence (4, Interesting)

RunFatBoy.net (960072) | more than 8 years ago | (#15265688)

In economics, the most efficient markets are those that can be directly competed against one another. It's a definite statement of confidence by Apple that they will *support* the means to run a competing OS on their system. This may be the first time (myself included) that users will see the two OS's, side by side. BC is the only economic way of doing this comparison.

While there may be drivers lacking initially, I have full confidence that the open source community will fill this void. And with both OS's available and with XP trying my patience, maybe I'll finally take the dive full-time into OSX and BC will be a non-issue. :-)

Jim http://www.runfatboy.net/ [runfatboy.net] -- A workout plan that doesn't feel like homework.

Re:Apple's Confidence (5, Informative)

ect5150 (700619) | more than 8 years ago | (#15265859)

In economics, the most efficient markets are those that can be directly competed against one another.

I'm just nitpicking here, but that's not what defines efficient markets in economics. A discriminating monopolist market is also efficient. Efficiency is defined by Pareto efficiency ...
Here is a link
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pareto_efficient [wikipedia.org]

Although, its true a perfectly competitive situation results in an efficient market. Most of the time, people like perfect competition mainly because its the market with the lowest prices, not because of its efficiency to allocate resources.

By the way, neither Apple nor Microsoft exist in a highly competitve market (as defined by those terms in economics).

First post! (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#15265692)

first post!

Re:First post! (0, Offtopic)

Caste11an (898046) | more than 8 years ago | (#15265741)

Umm..... No, there's a greater chance that you are an idiot. [albinoblacksheep.com]

ASSERT (i == R0X0R! ) (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#15265892)

Firstus postus, beeeeeooootchae!!!

Bow down a worship my mellifluent profundity!!!!



plllllleeeeeasssee?!!

Mom and Apple Pie (4, Funny)

yancey (136972) | more than 8 years ago | (#15265694)

I'd rather have Apple pie than Windows pie. Ewww.. gross!

Re:Mom and Apple Pie (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#15265937)

I'd rather have Apple pie than Windows pie. Ewww.. gross!

Mmmmm... Floor Pie.

Re:Mom and Apple Pie (1, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#15265947)

What about your mom's pie?

wait a minute (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#15265698)

Isn't there an old commercial from Apple, I seem to think it concerned MS Office for some odd reason, where people moved along in a queue, like lemmings, off the precipice?

Re:wait a minute (1)

Spy der Mann (805235) | more than 8 years ago | (#15265755)

Do you mean This one [youtube.com] ?

Re:wait a minute (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#15265869)

That's the one. ;-) Thanks

Jealousy is a terrible thing. In the meantime... (4, Insightful)

Sierran (155611) | more than 8 years ago | (#15265701)

...those of us who have a reason to use it will reap the benefits. Yes, Virginia, there are some. Battlefield 2, for example. Annoyingly-single-platform hardware updaters, like cell phone flashers and the like. Those little one-off tasks that I used to have to go find a windows PC for? Not so much anymore. Whee! When I need to do real work? Yep, you're right, I turn back into a pod person.

Seriously, why does this guy care so much?

Re:Jealousy is a terrible thing. In the meantime.. (1)

aCapitalist (552761) | more than 8 years ago | (#15265817)

..those of us who have a reason to use it will reap the benefits. Yes, Virginia, there are some. Battlefield 2, for example.

And unfortunately, you're stuck with an underpowered graphics card. I'll pay the premium for a cohesive Unix desktop, but if Apple is not going to give me a little bit more GPU choice, then I'll just stick with running windows and linux at the same time on the same machine [colinux.org] , or remote my Kanotix laptop that lives in the basement.

Re:Jealousy is a terrible thing. In the meantime.. (5, Insightful)

Lewisham (239493) | more than 8 years ago | (#15265951)

"Seriously, why does this guy care so much?"

Apparently he's noticed that John C. Dvorak's trolling puts the hit count through the roof. Only makes sense to start using the rest of the magazine's brand to start trolling as well.

He's obviously got some sort of logic malfunction, his arguments are both bizarre and full of emotive language. It's professional trolling.

Re:Jealousy is a terrible thing. In the meantime.. (5, Interesting)

Lewisham (239493) | more than 8 years ago | (#15265970)

I forgot to mention, that of particular note, is the last paragraph:

"In fact, I'm blaming the AAF for a wide-range of habits espoused by supposedly "creative people." I'll bet it's responsible for tattoos, piercings, and the wide-spread adoption of the phrase "no worries." In fact, I believe that most of today's societal ills can be either indirectly or directly attributed to Apple. Widespread hearing loss? Blame the iPod. Carpal tunnel? Blame the Newton."

This is so insane that it seems he's trying to hint that the rest of the article was just a troll as well. He also links to a piece he wrote where he thought Boot Camp was pretty sweet. I don't know what he's trying to pull, but I'm sure his advertisers are happy.

Re:Jealousy is a terrible thing. In the meantime.. (1)

Mononoke (88668) | more than 8 years ago | (#15265957)

Seriously, why does this guy care so much?
From the synopsis: PC Magazine's Editor-in-Chief says...

He's got ad space to fill. Mac users don't read his crappy little rag.

Sounds like the legendary comments made by carriage-men as internal combustion began to catch on.

lemmings? (2)

airdrummer (547536) | more than 8 years ago | (#15265703)

sorta like the pot calling the kettle black;-)

Confused? (3, Insightful)

TheRaven64 (641858) | more than 8 years ago | (#15265707)

So, users are going to try OS X, find it works better for them, keep using it, and this makes them lemmings and pod people? I would have thought that this term applied better to people who used a system that didn't work as well for them as the alternatives. By starting the argument assuming that OS X is less frustrating than Windows pretty much destroys any change the author had of making a coherent argument that people should now switch.

Nice spin (1, Flamebait)

eln (21727) | more than 8 years ago | (#15265708)

It's refreshing to finally see such a non-biased article about Apple.

Honestly, of course Apple did it to get more Windows users to try MacOS. Why else would they do it? They want to grab more market share, that's what the whole Intel shift is all about. To make them out to be evil because they want to improve their own market share at the expense of the competition is silly.

Strange definition of "lemming" (4, Insightful)

vanyel (28049) | more than 8 years ago | (#15265709)

So let me understand this: people compare two os's side by side on the same hardware. When they find that the one they're not familiar with is much better than the one they're used to, and they switch, they're lemmings? I always thought a lemming would be doing what everyone else does just because everyone else does it, which sounds a lot more like your typical Windoze user to me...

Unfortunately, I don't think anyone's going to buy a relatively expensive mac just so they can try osx on a machine that will still run windoze. Boot Camp's primary utility is saving mac users from having to buy a pc to run applications that they need to run, but which only work in windoze. If/when a native mode virtual pc comes out, boot camp will be even less relevant. To that end, I can agree that boot camp is nothing to get excited about, but that doesn't mean it's without merit.

Re:Strange definition of "lemming" (5, Interesting)

AnimusF6 (765091) | more than 8 years ago | (#15265800)

Though I hate to prove you wrong, I, a long time Windows advocate, bought a MacBook Pro solely because of Boot Camp. Yes, Boot Camp convinced me to switch. I found myself in a position that required that I buy a laptop, and intead of going with a boring old Windows box I was able to experiment. I still get the Windows access that my position requires, but I can play around with an entirely new (to me) toy.

Re:Strange definition of "lemming" (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#15265881)

It sounded good until I saw 'Windoze'. At that point, all of your credibility went straight out the window.

Re:Strange definition of "lemming" (1)

WindBourne (631190) | more than 8 years ago | (#15265959)

Funny thing is, that windows is more of a lemmings OS than any other going. You do it not because you like the BSOD, virus, worms, stolen id, the high cost of the OS, software, etc, but you do it because it has MARKET SHARE. i.e, you do what everybody else is doing, even though they are jumping off cliffs.

If Jobs really wanted people to switch... (0, Troll)

ZSpade (812879) | more than 8 years ago | (#15265714)

He would make OSX available for the masses, and not tied down to MAC computers alone. How is letting MAC owners put windows on their MAC going to make them switch to MAC?

Re:If Jobs really wanted people to switch... (2, Insightful)

jmelloy (460671) | more than 8 years ago | (#15265765)

Enh, I think Jobs would rather have more money than more market share.

I'll wait until you figure out the difference between $3,000 and $130.

Re:If Jobs really wanted people to switch... (1, Insightful)

AuMatar (183847) | more than 8 years ago | (#15265775)

Who said he wanted people to switch to Mac OS? He wants people to switch to Mac hardware, thats how Apple makes its money- by selling their hardware for inflated prices. MacOS is just something they use to differentiate themselves from Dell, HP, etc so they don't have to compete on price.

Re:If Jobs really wanted people to switch... (3, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#15265958)

Why would Steve care what switches you used with your Media Access Controller?

-1 Idiot (1)

yabos (719499) | more than 8 years ago | (#15265967)

How many times do we need to hear this crap?

That seems illogical... (1, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#15265723)

So let me get this right...

You buy a *Mac* system to run *Windows*
You find that Windows blows so you increasingly use OS X
And this gives Apple money.

But, you bought the god damned system in the first place! Why do they care if you use Windows or OS X on it?

Re:That seems illogical... (1)

tmjr3353 (925558) | more than 8 years ago | (#15265750)

Not endorsing the theory, necessarily, but I think I can answer your question. Because if they get you hooked on and using OSX then you will be more likely to *continue* purchasing Mac hardware. If after your first experiment you are still using solely Windows, you may be very likely to go back to putting together your own system or buying from Dell et all.

Apple pie? (1)

labalicious (844887) | more than 8 years ago | (#15265726)

McDonalds or homemade?

Duh.. (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#15265727)

Come on, who doesn't know this? In an earlier article there was even mention of a specific statement that they wanted windows software to run, but, to run badly. The thing is, whether they mean for it to force people to go to OSX or not, it will end up working against them in the end. The fact is, Windows sucks lemons (particularly sour, probably not even ripe ones) but, it's still the most well supported OS you'll find. What this works out to more than anything else is letting mac users not have to throw away all of their old software while finally getting to join the majority in their use of windows.

Sorry linux fans, I'm a big supporter of linux, but, I still have to dual boot to that windows crap (particularly since I'm a gamer, and don't even BOTHER trying to sell linux gaming on me because I've tried it and Unreal Tournament is about the only thing that plays even somewhat well in linux with just a few very rare exceptions.)

What's the problem again? (2, Insightful)

Cl1mh4224rd (265427) | more than 8 years ago | (#15265735)

"Jobs's bet: You'll start spending more and more time in OS X, until you--too--become one of the pod people. It's sad to see so many of my compatriots being turned into lemmings. Perhaps they'll wake up and smell the Apple pie in the sky--and realize they've been taken for a ride. But I doubt it."
If you have two products side-by-side, and one is clearly better in your mind, how the hell does that make you a lemming?

I don't his compatriots are the ones who need to wake up.

Re:What's the problem again? (2, Interesting)

Bogtha (906264) | more than 8 years ago | (#15265895)

If you have two products side-by-side, and one is clearly better in your mind, how the hell does that make you a lemming?

If people find OS X to be clearly better, then that conflicts with his belief that Windows is clearly better. He can resolve this conflict [wikipedia.org] in two ways:

  1. Admitting he might be wrong in his unquestioning belief in Windows and reexamining his practices.
  2. Finding some way of explaining the behaviour of people who switch that doesn't bring him to the conclusion Windows is inferior in some way.

Which do you think makes him uncomfortable? Which do you think makes him feel superior?

Re:What's the problem again? (1)

Kelson (129150) | more than 8 years ago | (#15265930)

The entire article is the author saying, "I'm not in the target audience for this product." I've seen these "I don't want this, so no one else should either" posts here on Slashdot, and they're usually labeled as trolls. Or +5 Insightful.

He probably is right about Boot Camp being intended to bring more Windows Users to the Mac side of the force. Too bad it's embedded in a steaming pile of vitriol. His disdain for Apple, Steve Jobs, and Mac users is so thick, you have to wonder how he managed to come up with any insight at all.

Why they think evey one will switch? (1)

aka_big_wurm (757512) | more than 8 years ago | (#15265737)

When OSX came out I was excited about it being built on FreeBSD. And not much later I had the chance to work with it for a few months. The switch is not that easy if you are used to a windows world. Fustrations grew when I had to program on them. Nothing really worked the same way and was a real headach. I know there are many more that would have a hard time making the switch even if they wanted to.

Rember Macs are now just PC's that run OSX too.

Re:Why they think evey one will switch? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#15265909)

I know of a number of "IT people" who are stuck in the windoz world, because "a mac doesn't work like a windoz box"

Well no crap. It works better.

How did this guy even get a job? (5, Insightful)

scrondle (805647) | more than 8 years ago | (#15265742)

I knew there was a reason I haven't looked at PC Magazine since 1998. That's not an article, it's a rant. How about some technical details/reasons why he doesn't like boot camp? What a tool.

Re:How did this guy even get a job? (2, Interesting)

TheRaven64 (641858) | more than 8 years ago | (#15265871)

I stopped reading dead-tree computer magazines a while ago for a few reasons. I used to subscribe to Computer Shopper, but I stopped about 6-8 years ago.
  1. I originally liked it because a lot of suppliers published their entire catalogue in the adverts section. It was nice to be able to compare prices. Then then Internet happened to them all. They would have updated their prices by the time the dead-tree edition arrived, and so it became worthless. Since this was a good 60-80% of the magazine by page count, it was a big drop in value.
  2. The news started getting really old. Stuff I'd read about online a month ago would be being presented as news.
  3. The editorials were really dull. If you've got an entire month to prepare something, you could at least try to make it interesting...
  4. They canned most of the non-PC sections. They used to have Acorn, Atari, Amiga, and a few other sections. While I didn't use these platforms, it was nice to keep up to date with what was going on with them.
I eventually realised that the only column I was reading was the Mac column. That was always entertaining because it was some old guy complaining about how much his Mac sucked (or a neighbour's PC, or kids today, or something completely irrelevant). A sort of artsy BOFH, if you will. Anyway, I decided it wasn't worth paying for 900 pages when I only wanted to read 2.

Idiot... (2, Insightful)

Glock27 (446276) | more than 8 years ago | (#15265746)

Once you've laid out a few kilobucks on your BC system and been frustrated a few times with Windows limitations, what are you going to do? Jobs's bet: You'll start spending more and more time in OS X, until you--too--become one of the pod people.

Um, fool, the "pod people" are the 90%+ who are Windows lemmings, putting up with the myriad faults of that OS. I guess that's what I'd expect from a "PC Magazine" editor...mindless Apple bashing, whether it makes sense or not.

Re:Idiot... (1)

Hao Wu (652581) | more than 8 years ago | (#15265919)

I have always felt "bashing" necessarily demands that there is something to bash, or that the act was successful, and therefore justified.

"Attempted bashing" is usually more accurate, if one makes such an argument...

What PC MAG's editor really thinks... (1)

pjrc (134994) | more than 8 years ago | (#15265747)

PC Magazine's Editor-in-Chief says the Mac OX X is nothing to get excited about. He writes that Boot Camp is really just a plan to get Windows users to convert to OS X. "Once you're with Windows limitations, what are you going to do? You'll start spending more and more time in OS X, until you too discover just how much better things can really be. It's sad to see so many windoze-only patriots being exposed to the superior Max OS. Perhaps they'll wake up and realize they've been taken for a ride by Microsoft all these years.

And your point is? (2, Insightful)

n2art2 (945661) | more than 8 years ago | (#15265749)

I mean really. . . . . We all aready knew this. It wasn't some big shocker.

What is a big shocker is that this guy doesn't get the fact that that is exactly the reason that many people are thinking about buying a mac, because they can try out a mac and still have windoz to fall back on (ouch that would have to hurt).

He touts this as if people are jumping into it blindly, and being swindeled. Come on, get with it. Pleople realize this, and are looking forward to it. It's a benefit, not some underhanded sucker punch.

frustrated a few times with Windows limitations? (-1)

deft (253558) | more than 8 years ago | (#15265751)

I have the opposite experience.

Mac works great for what it does/what its intended, and I'm in the graphic design business so I even have more use for it. But in my overall experience, it is most often the Mac users I know having issues with wanting to do something a Windows box can and not being able to.

Also, most of the programmers I work with like windows because it allows for tweaking much easier... whereas mac closes off its systems so normal users cant screw it up.

Re:frustrated a few times with Windows limitations (1)

painandgreed (692585) | more than 8 years ago | (#15265873)

"Mac users I know having issues with wanting to do something a Windows box can and not being able to"

In other words...playing games.

Re:frustrated a few times with Windows limitations (4, Interesting)

goMac2500 (741295) | more than 8 years ago | (#15265898)

I'm sure you know some great programmers, but honestly, they don't know what they're talking about. First, I like OS X because frequently when I have trouble, I can go pull up the source code to Core Foundation and look at the source of the API I'm using. You can't do that with Windows. while Mac OS X's Core Foundation is open source, Windows has no equivalent Open Source code from the OS. Secondly, the Security API allows me to obtain authorization from the user for my application to do anything it. If I wanted, I could use the Security API to get authorization from the user, and then set about destroying the entire operating system. Yes, there are bounds given so that the user can't accidently delete the system folder, but as soon as a Mac OS X application obtains user authorization via the Security API (by the user inputting his/her name and password), the operating system assumes that program is trusted by the user, and at that point, the program can do anything they want.

For your Windows programming friends to say OS X closes off systems, they must have had very little or no Mac programming experience. Apple restricts applications for security reasons, but as soon as an application obtains authorization, all bets are off.

Re:frustrated a few times with Windows limitations (4, Interesting)

FeloniousPunk (591389) | more than 8 years ago | (#15265923)

whereas mac closes off its systems so normal users cant screw it up.

How did this get modded "interesting?"

Care to elaborate how Mac OS X "closes off its systems so normal users can't screw it up?"

Re:frustrated a few times with Windows limitations (1)

TheBigMacMan (938594) | more than 8 years ago | (#15265938)

Also, most of the programmers I work with like windows because it allows for tweaking much easier... whereas mac closes off its systems so normal users cant screw it up.
I am very interested to hear what the slashdot crowd thinks of this statement about programing. What are your findings when compairing programming on different platforms.

Who are the real "pod people"? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#15265756)

how are you more of a "pod person" for using a system 90% of computer users don't use? shouldn't people start asking why the majority blindly follows Microsoft's every beck and whim? i'd say the people who don't question their OS choice are more "pod people" then anyone who dual/triple/quadruple boots.

Huh? Oh the twisted irony... (1)

ScooterComputer (10306) | more than 8 years ago | (#15265759)

Let me get this straight...those people who are currently computing like ALMOST ALL the other people (94% of them at least), who can probably not give a particularly good reason why that is other than "because that's what everyone else is using", and who on a whim decide to try out something new, something different AND LIKE IT...wait for it...are LEMMINGS?

Up is down, left is right, black is white, and now the lemmings are deviants. Fuck me, I need a drink.

Consider the source: Louderbeck (4, Insightful)

sakusha (441986) | more than 8 years ago | (#15265764)

Remember that screed was written by Jim Louderbeck, one of the more notorious anti-Mac PeeCee trolls. I still remember him doing the commentary on a Stevenote carried on ZDTV a few years back, he nitpicked on everything, for no good reasons. Note that his employer, Ziff-Davis, has a major investment from Vulcan Ventures (Paul Allen). Loudermouth knows he has to cater to his owner's financial interests. Nice little doggie, sit up and beg, little Loudermouth!

Re:Consider the source: Louderbeck (1)

wallingford (740882) | more than 8 years ago | (#15265877)

Check out the last paragraph [pcmag.com] :

"In fact, I'm blaming the AAF for a wide-range of habits espoused by supposedly "creative people." I'll bet it's responsible for tattoos, piercings, and the wide-spread adoption of the phrase "no worries." In fact, I believe that most of today's societal ills can be either indirectly or directly attributed to Apple. Widespread hearing loss? Blame the iPod. Carpal tunnel? Blame the Newton. Upswing in hernias? That Infinite Loop idiot who decided to put a handle on the first iMac--and started the whole luggable trend. No, Boot Camp is just the latest diabolical piece of Steve Jobs's grand plan to dumb us down and mangle our bodies.
...
So go ahead and Boot Camp if you must. But don't come running to me when your mind and body prematurely degenerate. I'll be smart, fit, and enjoying my real Windows computers, while you ooze slowly into the Pixar-Disney-ABC swamp of mindlessness. Chump."

I assume that he's trying to be funny here, but come on. How can anyone take this guy seriously?

thats chock full of metaphors (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#15265766)

until you--too--become one of the pod people. It's sad to see so many of my compatriots being turned into lemmings. Perhaps they'll wake up and smell the Apple pie in the sky--and realize they've been taken for a ride.

I count 4.

Let me get this straight (2, Funny)

Tx (96709) | more than 8 years ago | (#15265769)

A feature to encourage people to buy a Mac is really a cunning plan to get them to switch to Mac? Wow, he must be a genius to have figured that one out...

Re:Let me get this straight (1)

Tx (96709) | more than 8 years ago | (#15265794)

"... switch to Mac OS" that should read.

Holy crap! (5, Interesting)

Ambiguous Coward (205751) | more than 8 years ago | (#15265777)

Boot Camp is really just a plan to get Windows users to convert to OS X.


Holy crap! Revelation of the year! I can't imagine this being true!


Seriously, how is this possibly a new idea? Of course that's what it's for. And switching because of "limitations" in the other OS makes you a lemming? No, I'm afraid not. That makes you "smart." See, when people decide to stop hitting themselves in the head with a hammer, and instead opt for hitting themselves in the head with, say, a a soft piece of fruit, or an old ham, we call that "learning one's lesson."


The author here needs to get over his own case of being a lemming, and try something new. Pod-people? The whole article stinks of the exact same thralldom the author envisions anyone who switches being caught in.


Yes, I own a mac. Oh, but guess what, I also own a Windows box, and a Linux box! I'm not going to say which one I prefer, because doing so would, at least according to this article, make me a lemming.

Re:Holy crap! (1)

Gilmoure (18428) | more than 8 years ago | (#15265945)

You're one of those lemmings that refuses to specialize and instead, generalize. Don't you know that generalizing skills has never done any good for humanity?

i wrote this guy an email (2, Interesting)

signore pablo (544088) | more than 8 years ago | (#15265780)

before i saw it here on slashdot. The article is a big troll. I told him he should title it "I don't like Macs and Here's Why:" Seriously he compares a lot more than boot camp here. He compares macs to windows as a whole and doesn't say all that much about boot camp in itself. Besides, its still in beta so wait for Leapard before a review like this. He mentions hardware that might not run and upgradability being a problem, but come on the hardware he mentions is the kind of stuff that people that would be using it would know whether or not it would be beneficial to use a mac or not with. The kind of people Boot Camp is for ain't what he thinks it is. Either that or again, he's trolling. Boot camps good for gamers, period. (in my opinion) Everyone else that uses a mac and needs to run Windows software can use virtualization software. OR, boot into windows... but i still see it as mostly for gamers and/or people with some lingering other high powered windows software that doesnt run in mac osx. but again, why would you buy a mac if you do professional editing or some other thing in windows? as he mentioned professional sound cards and such, whatever... this guy is a deuschebag

Seems to be working.... (2, Interesting)

Sergeant Beavis (558225) | more than 8 years ago | (#15265788)

It seems to be working because I have every intention of buying a MacPro laptop and dual booting OSX. Apple finally took away my last excuse to give them a shot.

Now I just need to give up an arm and leg to get the money to buy one.

Might work the OTHER way around (1, Insightful)

elrous0 (869638) | more than 8 years ago | (#15265789)

Once you've laid out a few kilobucks on your BC system and been frustrated a few times with Windows limitations, what are you going to do? Jobs's bet: You'll start spending more and more time in OS X

And what happens when Joe Machead tries out Windows for the first time and realizes "Hey, you mean you can play GAMES on this thing?!?" OS X might suddenly not look so attractive and his next purchase be a lower-priced PC.

-Eric

Bah--- windows and mac been done.... (1)

acomj (20611) | more than 8 years ago | (#15265797)

I have (somewhere) and old powerpc mac with the 486 card.. It could run windows and mac.

Re:Bah--- windows and mac been done.... (1)

digitalhermit (113459) | more than 8 years ago | (#15265862)

Heh... I have a Quadra 650 with a rigged PC card from a Performa. I had to remove a riser card then modify the monitor passthrough cable to fit in the Quadra slot. It allowed me to boot Windows 95 and... umm, not a lot more. But it was cool to see though.

Apple's Plan For x86 OEM Survival (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#15265799)

1) Get unwilling thrown into the x86 OEM market
2) Release Boot Camp so Mac users can start supplementing OS X with native Windows applications
3) Virtualization so Apple can leverage the already gigantic Windows software market
4) Finish migrating Apple/OS X application and media APIs onto Windows
5) Dump OS X and pass the savings on to you.
6) Sell pretty x86 OEM boxes and leverage their control of digital media market the same way Microsoft does with their office suite formats

You have to be crazy if you think Apple can survive as the only x86 OEM that is saddled with funding their own niche operating system. Or that Apple marketshare is moving more than a percent or so over the next year.

How real the huge drop in iPod sales went through last quarter will determine the fate of OS X/Mac hardware. If the drop is real and lasting Apple needs to transform themselves rapidly to a real x86 OEM that can compete on price.

Apple isn't out to steal Windows users (4, Insightful)

Shazow (263582) | more than 8 years ago | (#15265810)

My understanding is that BootCamp allows current Mac users to run Windows on their Mac. The article seems to argue that this will encourage Windows users to get Macs and stick with OSX instead of BootCamping in Windows. That may apply to a few people, but for the most part I disagree.

As others have pointed out, it seems that the primary strategy behind BootCamp is: Give people the option to use whatever operating system they like. Apple has allowed their consumers to install Linux on their machines since forever, and now they're allowing Windows, too.

What does Apple have to gain? Profits from hardware sales, of course. Plus, whenever you're buying a Mac, you're also buying OSX, so they're not losing much software profits either. Who else has to gain? Possibly Microsoft in the short run (all those Mac kiddies giving Windows a shot without having to buy a PC).

And then there is the whole other market of people who aren't concerned about software expandability so much as hardware. Macs aren't great for upgrading their hardware. Windows or no windows.

- shazow

The More Effete Among Us (5, Insightful)

American AC in Paris (230456) | more than 8 years ago | (#15265815)

From TFA:

The more effete among us have embraced BC because now they can run all their favorite Windows apps on a saucy, sexy Mac.

Wow. Nothing says "class" like a thinly-veiled "Macs are for fags" joke.

You'd exect this sort of thing from a random blogger or Slashdotter, not the freakin' editor-in-chief of PC Magazine.

think they've got it backwards (1, Interesting)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#15265825)

My next computer will probably be the new mac book - i've been wanting to switch to apple for a while cuase windows just drives me nuts, but I need a buffer while i make the transition and I don't feel like having two computer systems. My switch won't be BECAUSE of the macbook, it'll be with it's assistance. I'm sure I'm not the only one.

Lemmings (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#15265830)

TFA implies that you're a mere lemming if you switch from one OS to another due to frustration with limitations of the former. If that's not reason enough, what is?

Suckers? Yesss! (5, Funny)

MobyDisk (75490) | more than 8 years ago | (#15265832)

Did anyone else read the headline "Boot Camp For Suckers?" and imagine that this was a camp run by Dogbert? I was ready to sign-up some coworkers.

Missing the point? (4, Insightful)

abes (82351) | more than 8 years ago | (#15265833)

I suspect that the majority of people are not buying macs to run windows as their primary OS. If so, I'm going to agree with him. If I wanted to spend the same amount of money and run windows, I'd get a tablet. If only Apple made one...

The fact is, the majority of people buying the MacTel, are buying it because it runs OSX AND Windows. No other laptop can really claim that -- at least legally (and easily). This is a really important distinction. I love OSX. I'm a linuxhead, but just having things work, and work together seamlessly. Priceless. (though my desktop is still a linux box)

For my laptop, I have no desire to run windows. I'm through with that agony in my life. I want to enjoy my computing experience. However, I am realistic. There are some applications, unfortunately, that still require windows. Bootcamp gives me the perfect compromise.

So, this editor is way off base. It's true, Apple isn't performing a public service. But they are taking down one more barrier that would normally stop people from buying their computers. And it's true. Once you start using OS X, you find yourself much less likely to go back to Windows. But not because of some strange Apple conspiracy. Because it kicks M$'s ass (comparing apples to lemons?). And this is from someone who wouldn't touch a Mac a couple years ago.

the only suckers (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#15265837)


are the people who keep visiting another Ziff Davis spam submission, click next for more pages of adverts...

file this under Not News (1)

doctor handshake (773669) | more than 8 years ago | (#15265838)

I think this opinion sacks

When will I be able to multiboot into Windows CE? (1)

lokiman (972867) | more than 8 years ago | (#15265857)

I am sure when Bill clues into the idea, we will all be multibooting into Windows CE.

A few kilobucks? Try a few Centabucks. (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#15265861)

Once you've laid out a few kilobucks on your BC system

Oh, except you can have a bootcamp-able system for well under $1000.

Damn, more poor research on the part of a journalist.

PC Magazine's Editor-in-Chief? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#15265865)

Since when did Steve Balmer become PC Magazine's Editor-in-Chief? *rimshot*

ever have one of those days (1)

Jherico (39763) | more than 8 years ago | (#15265876)

ever have one of those days where you wish you could just rate the article 'troll'.

Actually, I think it's just the opposite. (1)

flatland_skier (656906) | more than 8 years ago | (#15265889)

I am telling friends to buy a mac for exactly the opposite reason. Buy the mac and try it out... if you don't like it you can always put Windows on there. I am convinced that they will come to believe that the Mac/OS X are better anyway and keep using it.

The Pope is Catholic, Water is Wet, and... (1, Insightful)

DragonWriter (970822) | more than 8 years ago | (#15265896)

Boot Camp is really just a plan to get Windows users to convert to OS X.
Well, obviously (that, and to prevent Mac users from switching to Windows.) I mean, that's not even like a secret plan. Its fairly overt, if not spelled out in so many letters. Next you are going to tell me that OOo's support for MSOffice formats is just a plan to get MSOffice users to switch to OOo.

Apple attract a lot of suckers (2, Insightful)

kentrel (526003) | more than 8 years ago | (#15265903)

Apple do what they do very well, but they also market extremely well, and a lot of suckers are attracted to their products because they think they're "cool", such as this nonsensical obsession with iPods.. I listen to music while I'm running, walking to work etc all the time (for several hours a day) - I'm the kind of person that would get a huge amount of use out of such a product, yet I still don't feel I need one. My 256MB flash player does the job superbly, is lighter and the single AA battery lasts longer. I'm not saying iPod isn't a great product, all of these Hard Disc music players are great.. but i don't think the majority of people who bought them bought them out of necessity, or even just want but simply because it was cool, it was fashionable.

There are a lot of suckers out there, and many slaves to the marketing machine that is Apple, and I bet even most geeks blindly believe "tech specs" and out of context benchmarks if it gives them a good excuse to be fashionable, have the latesty trendy useless gimmick, and for bonus points, send Microsoft a Fuck You.

Also, what's with macs and Hollywood? Pretty much everyone I know who works in the film industry owns a mac. Is it because of the product placement Apple likes to do? They swear they're better without knowing much about them, or even knowing what Linux is.

Re:Apple attract a lot of suckers (1)

FeloniousPunk (591389) | more than 8 years ago | (#15265968)

Also, what's with macs and Hollywood? Pretty much everyone I know who works in the film industry owns a mac. Is it because of the product placement Apple likes to do?

Or, they are cooler/ hipper than you.

Truly sad! (4, Funny)

Jerry Coffin (824726) | more than 8 years ago | (#15265910)

...Boot Camp is really just a plan to get Windows users to convert to OS X.

You sir, have a mediocre grasp of the blindingly obvious!

I'm tempted to go into a lot more detail, but it would just weaken the message...

Jim Louderback (5, Funny)

jayhawk88 (160512) | more than 8 years ago | (#15265913)

Making John Dvorak look sane and reasonable since 1988.

Is there any objectivity where Apple is concerned? (1)

Slithe (894946) | more than 8 years ago | (#15265921)

What did other people think of the last part of TFA?
But I doubt it. Because I'm a firm believer that once you start using a Mac, your IQ begins to creep downwards, inversely proportional to an increase in your AAF (Apple Acceptance Factor). In fact, I'm blaming the AAF for a wide-range of habits espoused by supposedly "creative people." I'll bet it's responsible for tattoos, piercings, and the wide-spread adoption of the phrase "no worries." In fact, I believe that most of today's societal ills can be either indirectly or directly attributed to Apple. Widespread hearing loss? Blame the iPod. Carpal tunnel? Blame the Newton. Upswing in hernias? That Infinite Loop idiot who decided to put a handle on the first iMac--and started the whole luggable trend. No, Boot Camp is just the latest diabolical piece of Steve Jobs's grand plan to dumb us down and mangle our bodies. It's no coincidence that all this is happening just as Jobs has taken over as the head of Disney (which also owns ABC). Pretty soon we'll be good for nothing but sitting on our butts and watching TV. So go ahead and Boot Camp if you must. But don't come running to me when your mind and body prematurely degenerate. I'll be smart, fit, and enjoying my real Windows computers, while you ooze slowly into the Pixar-Disney-ABC swamp of mindlessness. Chump.


I think this guy is trolling for advertisements, even though I agree that Macintoshes are not the end all be all of computers. (I think such a thing does not exist!) There may be a case to be made against Apple Computer's sainthood, but this guy is DEFINITELY NOT the person to make it.

Just once, I would like to see a Macintosh article that is neither dripping with Apple fanboyism nor mindlessly bashing the Mac.

Jeepers! I hope Jimbo has.... (1)

bev_tech_rob (313485) | more than 8 years ago | (#15265922)

put his flame retardant suit on!

Windows = MacMame (5, Funny)

Yergle143 (848772) | more than 8 years ago | (#15265931)

I run two curious little game emulators. The first is called Mame and it permits me run a bunch of antique games once written for public coin-fed consoles. The second is called Boot camp and it permits me to run games on a kooky antique dollar-fed operating system. 537

why would I want windows on my mac ... (1)

SlashSquatch (928150) | more than 8 years ago | (#15265935)

when I can't even get the damned thing to run X11 properly.

They are trying to walk the line between open source and proprietary and it is stupid sometimes.

Call me crazy but the main thing I really want from a computer is a nice xterm. I can do without the penny ante annoyances like paper clips and file opening drama.

self-preservation (1)

wardk (3037) | more than 8 years ago | (#15265941)

not much work for a windows hack when the users move on.

Huh? Isn't That Peculiar (1)

willard34 (971306) | more than 8 years ago | (#15265942)

I work in a PC and MAC environment as I work directly with our Graphics Department. All the POD people have been sweating the new MACs and taking Bootcamp courses on Windows XP for the MAC to familiarize themselves with the OS. It's kind of fun being ambi-OS...I like to see them sweat.

Apple Computers... (1)

wall0159 (881759) | more than 8 years ago | (#15265943)


Those Apple copmputers are a plague on this land. A plaaaauuuugge! We won't be safe until they're all destroyed, and all their users dead! Go forth, and cleanse our great world, PC-users!!!

-Bill Gates, spoken through Jim Louderback (Editor of PC Mag)

PC Magazine's Editor in Chief on TV (1)

fortinbras47 (457756) | more than 8 years ago | (#15265953)

You can see his tv appearance here [apple.com] :P

My favorite clip is the restart one [apple.com]

Warning: Humour Alert (5, Insightful)

ickoonite (639305) | more than 8 years ago | (#15265973)

Guys, guys, guys! Calm down, calm down!

I think he's trying to be funny.

I am English. I know sarcasm. It's what we do. And I think that's what he's trying to do here. It's not very well done, but there are little hints. It's why he links to himself and calls himself "some idiot". It's why he specifically mentions the M-Audio [m-audio.com] and Kona [aja.com] kit (the latter is Mac only). Of course it works with the Mac.

So all those who are praising him for his insight, for debunking the Mac myth - stop now. Same goes for the Mac fanbois who are trying to find fault with his article.

It's subtle, I'll allow that, but remember: always consult the nearest Brit before responding to something that sounds a little bit too stupid to be true. It probably is.

iqu :P
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