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Sony Refutes 'No Used Game Sales' Rumour

Zonk posted more than 8 years ago | from the why-do-we-keep-hearing-the-rumour dept.

56

Eurogamer reports that the possibility of no used games sales for the PS3 has been vociferously refuted by Sony. From the article: "'We have definitely not been communicating that,' UK spokesperson Jennie Kong confirmed. 'It's false speculation. We don't have any further knowledge about this topic - either officially or unofficially, to be frank. ' It would appear that the report is based on the resurrection of a much earlier rumour in this regard, which surfaced most recently last November with claims that PS3 software would 'bind' to the first machine it was played on, and would be unusable on any other system." We discussed this possibility on Wednesday.

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56 comments

Interesting (2, Interesting)

flooey (695860) | more than 8 years ago | (#15412143)

It's interesting the way they phrased their comments. The quotations in the article from the present never say they aren't planning on it, they only say that the rumors about them telling people they're going to are false. The one quote in the article that says that every PS3 will be able to play every disc comes from a November statement (though the PR person does say "there has been no official comment on this since the story that came up a few months ago - it hasn't changed since then").

Whatever (1)

mcc (14761) | more than 8 years ago | (#15412172)

If you don't like the way they phrased that denial, here's the other denial [gamesradar.com] they issued:
"These rumours are unfounded and, to my knowledge, SCEE has no plans to change our business model to adopt such a system."
Note that's from Games Radar, the site that originated this rumor in the first place.

Games Will Work... But Will Your Player? (1)

Alaren (682568) | more than 8 years ago | (#15412250)

"SCEE has no plans to change our business model to adopt such a system."

That's nice. Actually, it's really great. I know that it is probably tempting for a lot of their leadership, but here's the thing:

If you can only play your game on one player, how can they force you to buy another player when they remotely disable the first one? [engadget.com] I mean, granted, PS3 games versus Blu-ray movies, totally different problem... right? Right?

It seems to me that Sony is busy vehemently denying the wrong rumors. Almost wonder if they spread the first rumor (again) just so they would have something bad they could deny with a straight face. But even Sony isn't that desperate... are they?

Re:Whatever (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#15412268)

But you still have the "to my knowledge" which comes from some unnamed Sony Europe represenative. Phil Harrison said he didn't think they would do multiple SKUs. What happened? Multiple SKUs. An unnamed Sony Europe rep that basically says, "I don't know about it" isn't much of a rebuttal.

Having wrote that, there's is no way in hell they will do this. I'm not trying to prove they will. I'm simply pointing out that your defense of Sony has a logical flaw.

Re:Whatever (1)

mcc (14761) | more than 8 years ago | (#15412439)

The rumor they are denying here was never reported as concerning any portion of Sony except SCEE UK in the first place.

Re:Whatever (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#15412524)

It doesn't matter. Phil Harrison is head of Sony Europe and he was wrong about the multiple SKUs and your quote comes from an unnamed Sony Europe rep. I don't trust some dude when Sony HQ doesn't even want to keep their head of Sony Europe informed.

BTW, Purdue sucks! IU all the way! We'll see you this fall during foot, uh, I mean basketball season. Too bad about Gene Keady having to quit since his salary wouldn't cover his toupee bill.

Re:Interesting (4, Insightful)

dbhankins (688931) | more than 8 years ago | (#15412337)

Even the way the previous comment was phrased leaves loads of wiggle room.

"It won't be copy-protected to a single system". Well, it's not copy protection that's being contemplated here, so that doesn't make them liars if they nodelock.

"Any PS3 game will be playable on any PS3 system." Again, this would be true even if they nodelocked it. A nodelocking game disk will play on any system you put it in...once. And if you take "game" to mean "title" rather than "disk", it says even less; it only says that PS3 systems will play PS3 games.

And we all know that "We have no plans to do that" is bureaucracy-speak for "We're working feverishly on our plans for doing that but haven't finished those plans yet. But when we do have plans, we'll do that thing as quick as we can." The statement they made was even weaker than "We have no plans." It's "We don't know about any plans."

In other words, their denial is a non-denial that actually communicates no information, besides "I hear nothing, I see nothing, I know *nothing*!", or at best, "I never said *that*!"

Re:Interesting (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#15413017)

I don't think that Sony will actually try to implement a method to stop resale of games in Hardware; with how durable the PS2 was I don't think they would want 1/3 to 1/2 their users getting angry that they lost their game library when their system stopped reading discs.

Sony's being careful with their wording because they may use other methods of preventing used game sales. With how arogant Sony seems lately, I wouldn't be (too) surprised to see them threaten EB games (or whoever) telling them that they wouldn't supply them with new PS3 units unless they did not sell used PS3 games; I personally suspect that if they tried that no matter how EB games replied Sony would be screwed.

Re:Interesting (0, Flamebait)

Shihar (153932) | more than 8 years ago | (#15412947)

Sony is not going to blow off their own foot, especially if they are going to sell a system that cost an arm and a leg. Sony is not going screw the used games market because the resulting hit in their sales would more then make up for the increased revenue from first time sales. It is a stupid idea, and any CEO who would advocate such a thing should be dragged from his office and shot by the shareholders.

Re:Interesting (2, Insightful)

Bogtha (906264) | more than 8 years ago | (#15413381)

It's interesting the way they phrased their comments.

You can say that again. Is that what passes for English these days? Here's a handy translation:

We have definitely not been communicating that

We didn't say that.

It's false speculation.

It's not true.

We don't have any further knowledge about this topic - either officially or unofficially, to be frank.

I don't know anything else.

It sounds like she needs to read Orwell's Politics and the English Language [resort.com] .

RE (3, Insightful)

Alex P Keaton in da (882660) | more than 8 years ago | (#15412150)

When it becomes illegal to sell used products, we will know that teh corporations have won. Wouldn't Ford/GM other car companies love it if you could only buy new cars?
Sony would also like us to only sleep with virgins too, right?

Re:RE (2, Funny)

voice_of_all_reason (926702) | more than 8 years ago | (#15412176)

Sony would also like us to only sleep with virgins too, right?

It's not like there aren't any countries where that is pretty much how it is. Durka durka!

Re:RE (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#15412224)

Sony doesn't make [that kind of] virgins.

Re:RE (1)

Jimmy King (828214) | more than 8 years ago | (#15412258)

Sony would also like us to only sleep with virgins too, right? Who wouldn't like to only sleep with virgins. I fully support Sony's plan for me to only sleep with women who have no way of judging that I'm terrible in bed.

Re:RE (1)

Tweekster (949766) | more than 8 years ago | (#15412277)

The question is...who would want to sleep with a virgin.

Re:RE (1)

LunaticTippy (872397) | more than 8 years ago | (#15412396)

People who are threatened by a lover who knows what they want.

Re:RE (1)

Mistshadow2k4 (748958) | more than 8 years ago | (#15412578)

"Who wouldn't like to only sleep with virgins"

Me. Virgins reach orgasm in seconds and don't how to give even half-decent oral sex, leaving a woman looking for a guy with a modicum of self-control and knowledge of how to soemthing with his tongue other than bragging to his friends about how many bitches he's slept with. Oh, wait, you're talking about female virgins, right? Then I'm definitely not interested. But I probably wouldn't be even if I were male, as I'm not the type to use someone once and then throw them away.

Re:RE (1)

Jazzer_Techie (800432) | more than 8 years ago | (#15412311)

I really think from a business standpoint, banning used game resales just doesn't make much sense, especially with games being $50+. In my experience at least, those who have a little more money buy the games new, and then when they resell them, that money is usually invested right back into new games. If I only have $30, Sony isn't going to get a new game sale. But with a good used market, I can buy GTA VIII from the guy down the street, and while that money isn't going directly to Sony, there's a good chance that he's going to reinvest it in new games.

Re:RE (1)

CastrTroy (595695) | more than 8 years ago | (#15415307)

On the other hand, I only buy games that I will never sell. I only buy games that have enough replay value that by the time I'm done with it, it's only worth maybe $10 used, so I really don't have much incentive to buy it. There's a couple games that I've considered getting rid of, but for the most part, all the games I buy have given my tons of play time.

Re:RE (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#15412508)

It will never be illegal to sell used products as long as it isn't software. What you are posting is nothing more than FUD.

Also, about your SIG, what do you have against Community Colleges? Judging by the way you type, it looks like you need to go to a community college.

Re:RE (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#15450981)

If you believe that, then one word will describe you. Baaaaaa

Judging by the way you post, you have already attended a Community College. Saying someone needs to "go to" a Community College shows your stupidity, thus proving the sig 'Community College : We be learnin' foo'

But you can go back to your Community College anytime for reprogramming to discontinue your thinking. You just prove two facts

1. How much Community Colleges need to be abolished and
2. Natural selection should be allowed to kill off idiotic sheeple like you.

Well to quote blackadders dad (1)

SmallFurryCreature (593017) | more than 8 years ago | (#15412700)

Only one of you needs to be a virgin.

Sounds good! (2, Funny)

jpardey (569633) | more than 8 years ago | (#15412723)

That means that once she is no longer a virgin, she is nodelocked to me!

Then again, that is already enforced in some cases, with shotguns. We must think through the terrible possibilities of our policies before making any such blunders.

Re:RE (1)

ignatz72 (891623) | more than 8 years ago | (#15413375)

I, for one, welcome our virgin peddling overlords!

But nodelock me, and the next virgin through the door better be hot and carrying an xbox under one arm and a wii in the other...

Here's a thought for you... (1)

KitesWorld (901626) | more than 8 years ago | (#15415103)

What if this is something that they *are* actually doing? Who would they be targetting this funcionality at? Tip : It's not the end user. The cost of education (and incoming litigation) regarding this would be extremely expensive, and the lost goodwill would do more damage to the company than even *we* can imagine. If it was implemented, chances are that there would be a bit set in a header somewhere on the disc that says 'this game binds' or 'this game doesn't bind'. The developers or publishers could then set that bit at will. Why would they do that? To stop internal development copies bieng used outside the company. Think about it - you set the bit to 'on' for all development discs - the ones testers are using, for instance. They then get locked to the machine of the respective tester. If the disc gets 'lost' or leaked, the finder (or reciever) cannot use the disc, and gets nothing from it. IE, it's a great way to improve internal security for your projects. Turn the bit back to the 'off' position when it's time to publish (or else make sure that the mass production presses wont stamp an image that has the 'on' switch set), and the general public can use the finished game the same way they always have. They'd never know differently. If one of the console developers ever implemented a system like that, this is what its most likely to be used for.

bah, formatting... (1)

KitesWorld (901626) | more than 8 years ago | (#15415135)

Same post, set to 'plain old text'.

What if this is something that they *are* actually doing? Who would they be targetting this funcionality at?

Tip : It's not the end user. The cost of education (and incoming litigation) regarding this would be extremely expensive, and the lost goodwill would do more damage to the company than even *we* can imagine.

If it was implemented, chances are that there would be a bit set in a header somewhere on the disc that says 'this game binds' or 'this game doesn't bind'. The developers or publishers could then set that bit at will. Why would they do that?

  To stop internal development copies bieng used outside the company. Think about it - you set the bit to 'on' for all development discs - the ones testers are using, for instance. They then get locked to the machine of the respective tester. If the disc gets 'lost' or leaked, the finder (or reciever) cannot use the disc, and gets nothing from it. IE, it's a great way to improve internal security for your projects. Turn the bit back to the 'off' position when it's time to publish (or else make sure that the mass production presses wont stamp an image that has the 'on' switch set), and the general public can use the finished game the same way they always have.

They'd never know differently. If one of the console developers ever implemented a system like that, this is what its most likely to be used for.

Re:RE (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#15433435)

Listen Alex P Keaton, fess up. You're a 15 year old living in your mom's garage. Just admit it, it will be ok. No one will judge you. We already know you're a FAG!!!

Any other clarificaitons? (1, Informative)

crummyname (977083) | more than 8 years ago | (#15412168)

I hope Sony also vociferously refutes speculation of a $600 price tag for the PS3.

Re:Any other clarificaitons? (0, Offtopic)

GeckoX (259575) | more than 8 years ago | (#15412276)

Who the hell modded that Troll? That is simply pathetic.

Can anyone come up with ANY explanation that would show how that post is a Troll in any light? Who DOESN'T want Sony to refute the $600 price?

That's the one thing I truly dislike about slash, you can't get at idiot mods at all. Yes, meta-mod provides a level of checks and balances, but in certain cases one should absolutely be able to argue someones mod.

Re:Any other clarificaitons? (2, Insightful)

Headcase88 (828620) | more than 8 years ago | (#15414450)

Agreed [slashdot.org] .

Not surprised. (1)

Halloran (182820) | more than 8 years ago | (#15412179)

First there is a high price point, and now there are rumors of stringent license/pricing restrictions on software.

Sounds like this console is not being guided in a positive direction...

WTF!!!!111!!!11!!!!!!1 (-1, Redundant)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#15412369)

You should be happy paying Sony $600. If anything it's underpriced. Besides, you will all buy it anyway even if Sony had NO games at all. The PS3 is all quality. They're not interested in gimmicks. Like the PS3 controller that's like the Wii, but not enough to infringe on patents or to be, you know, usable. That's what you buy Sony products; the insight, the vision like when they reinvented Xbox Live! by copying it and giving it a sexier name: Playstation Network Platform. Uh, yeah, you're probably right. You don't need a magic 8-ball to tell you things don't look good. In fact, I think it was the other "magic" 8-ball that got Sony in trouble.

Remember... (4, Insightful)

SoCalChris (573049) | more than 8 years ago | (#15412191)

This is the same company that basically said "Most people don't know what a rootkit is, so it doesn't really matter." and "The PS3 would sell 5 million units, even if we didn't release any games."

I'm taking everything they say with a large grain of salt.

Re:Remember... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#15412212)

I'm taking everything they say with a large grain of salt.

Ah, but you'll place lots of weight on unsubstantiated rumour, along as it's negative right (just like the other posters on this topic). Gotta luv /.

Re:Remember... (1)

Qzukk (229616) | more than 8 years ago | (#15412252)

along as it's negative

Go through life expecting the worst, and you'll occasionally be pleasantly surprised.

Re:Remember... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#15412349)

Sony has also said, many times, that they intend to kill the second hand media market. Now, I highly doubt they'd be stupid enough to do it by linking games to the first PS3 they were played in.

However, the fact that they're planning on restricting them to the first person who purchased them is a given. Since the PS3 is stealing XBox Live from XBox (sort of like it stole the Wiimote from the Wii), I expect that you'll start seeing games that get tied to their online service accounts.

So, even if you do resell the game, the sucker buying it won't be able to play it in any meaningful way because you'll have already used up the key that came with it on your account.

Sony IS planning on killing the second-hand media market in all forms. They've flat-out said that many times. They will be tieing games to the first person to use them, just not the first PS3 to play them.

Re:Remember... (1)

Amouth (879122) | more than 8 years ago | (#15412588)

"I'm taking everything they say with a large grain of salt."

Well i found a sufficient supply for you... althought i don't recommend it (may be toxic to your health)

http://www.pnl.gov/energyscience/03-00/ws.htm [pnl.gov]

What's true is a lot more scary for Sony... (5, Insightful)

ofcourseyouare (965770) | more than 8 years ago | (#15412290)

Okay, so this story seems to be an urban fairytale. Like the one that Sony faked the BluRay demo a couple of weeks back.

But together these stories reflect something real and very scary for Sony: that since Rootkitgate or maybe E3, they've fallen into every PR guy's worst nightmare - a black hole where people resent a company so much that they believe anything bad they hear about it. This is the real story, and Sony needs to be very worried about it...

Re:What's true is a lot more scary for Sony... (1)

ivan256 (17499) | more than 8 years ago | (#15412469)

But together these stories reflect something real and very scary for Sony: that since Rootkitgate or maybe E3

As a percentage of the population, practically nobody knows about the 'rootkit' thing (It wasn't even a rootkit, but we all call it that now ever since the telephone game changed it from 'uses rootkit technology' to 'rootkit'). Same goes for rumors like this. Most people don't follow day to day platform news.

Re:What's true is a lot more scary for Sony... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#15412503)

No, Sony really did fake the Blu-Ray demo, just not in the way originally reported. They compared a Blu-Ray movie with a movie playing on a single-layer DVD+RW. The important part is "single layer."

Almost all modern DVD movies are encoded for double-layer DVDs, taking up at the very least 5GB and frequently over that. In any case, more than you can fit on a single-layer DVD. So how did they get the example movie to fit onto a single-layer DVD?

They recompressed it, bringing down the quality.

So, yes, the Blu-Ray demo was faked, in the sense that the DVD movie was purposely made to look worse than an actual DVD would in an effort to make the Blu-Ray movie look better. If they weren't going to fake it, they would have used an actual DVD instead of a DVD+RW.

Re:What's true is a lot more scary for Sony... (1)

NoodleSlayer (603762) | more than 8 years ago | (#15413363)

EXCEPT for the fact that Sony has a PATENT on this... It's much more then a simple rumor. Does them having a patent mean they're going to use it? No. Does it mean that they've thought about using it? Definately.

Re:What's true is a lot more scary for Sony... (1)

ClamIAm (926466) | more than 8 years ago | (#15414489)

[Sony's fallen into] a black hole where people resent a company so much that they believe anything bad they hear about it.

When you say it like that, it sounds pretty bad. But is it really all that different from entities like Microsoft, EA, or even the Bush Administration? I don't think it is.

Right of first sale Vs. Service fee (2, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#15412381)

Attacking used/rental game sales is not the right way to increase profit. For a long time to come, there will be other consoles that support used/rental games and the consoles that don't will be at a disadvantage for adoption.

The method that will be used to increase profit is to continue the trend of associating a "service fee" with online playing. That way, even if the user has a second hand game, the company still continue to collect if the user wants to take advantage of the full functionality of the game.

Very interesting times (2, Insightful)

TommyBear (317561) | more than 8 years ago | (#15412491)

OT, but what the hell. I've been sitting back watching all this fuss directed at Sony with some interest. What seems to be happening here is that Sony is the whipping boy of the month. There is so much FUD, and yes it is FUD, being spread by Sony's competitors and fanboys of other systems that's it not funny anymore.

This particular FUD which ./ has seen fit to propagate in previous stories, is based on some patent Sony filed in PS1 days and pertains to CD-ROMs from all accounts. Why the hell would Sony want to attack users and their retail partners? While appeasing publishers, moves like this would hurt adoption. No adoption, not content investment.

I'm not impressed with any of the consoles at the moment, but all this FUD being thrown at Sony is unfair, and the ./ crowd know what it feels like more than anyone else, so how about giving it a break.

Re:Very interesting times (1)

TommyBear (317561) | more than 8 years ago | (#15412518)

sorry that was meant to be:

No adoption, no content investment.

Re:Very interesting times (1)

Doodlepants (646546) | more than 8 years ago | (#15412536)

I agree that FUD is being used here.

Re:Very interesting times (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#15412863)

I also agree that its FUD but I love spreading it as well. Ever since Rootgate its clear what Sony's intentions are to its customer, "We don't trust any of you.". So I do not trust Sony, any rumor of bad news is taken at face value until proven wrong by a third-party.

Re:Very interesting times (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#15413651)

Sony earned it. Remember this?
http://games.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=06/02/20/ 1742251 [slashdot.org]
Less than two weeks later, the delay was official mainly because Spring was starting, and developers were saying loudly that they still didn't have a reasonable dev kit let alone final hardware yet. Add in all the other lies about the PS3, the PSP, rootkits, etc and only a masochist or a fanboy would trust anything Sony said without absolute proof.

I see how this works (-1, Troll)

SuperKendall (25149) | more than 8 years ago | (#15412666)

Storys against Sony on the front page!

Retractions favoring Sony hidden in little side stories like this one.

Welcome to Gaming By Zonk - Sony Need Not Apply!

Could Zonk be any more of a rabid Fanboi? Does he sleep with his 360 enjoying the hidden delights of its many ports?

A quick poll (1)

SmallFurryCreature (593017) | more than 8 years ago | (#15412714)

How many of you had to look up what "vociferously" meant? (I did)

And how many of you commented on the story anyway without knowing what it meant?

Re:A quick poll (1)

barefootgenius (926803) | more than 8 years ago | (#15413233)

Vociferous
adjective
Vociferous people express their opinions and complaints loudly and repeatedly in speech, and vociferous demands, etc. are made repeatedly and loudly.

Damn, I read it as veraciously....

Re:A quick poll (1)

ClamIAm (926466) | more than 8 years ago | (#15414501)

I think a larger number of us used our reasoning skills to deduce the meaning from the surrounding words. It's a component of something called "reading comprehension".

Re:A quick poll (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#15416357)

Refute = show to be false, disprove. Deny = claim to be false.
Can we have a poll to see what we think of Sony's statement?

There should be a large public backlash... (1)

Hamster Lover (558288) | more than 8 years ago | (#15412837)

Regardless of whether this story is accurate or not, there should be a large and vociforous reaction from the public that they will not tolerate restrictions on used game sales. It seems that damaging public relations, and by extension a corporation's bottom line, is the only way to get our message through. Likewise with the rootkit fiasco, the next time we even get a whiff of Sony adding new copy protection controls on their CDs, benign or not, we need to twist the knife in that wound to our benefit. God knows Sony are happy to use every lever they have in Congress to achieve their own ends.

Sorry, Sony.

For what it is worth.. (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#15415703)

..a pretty senior manager at a European retail chain that I know has heard nothing about such a plan. So I'm inclined to believe Sony when they say they have not communicated such a strategy to retailers.

As for the future, getting them to deny they will ever consider such a strategy is an exercise in futility. But then it would be the same for any company. The entire publishing industry HATES the used games trade. Inevitably, anyway, we're all going to eventually be downloading our games - which will automatically prevent used game sales etc.

No promise for the future Sony?? (1)

Lifelike (937107) | more than 8 years ago | (#15416604)

I thought it was interesting that, semantic quibbling aside, Sony is screaming that they have never told us about any plans to specially protect their software from second-hand sales- yet they make no promise to not do it again. Hell, they could just as easily come out tommorrow with an announcement that the PS3 will be nodeprotecteed and hell, they wouldn't be contradicting themselves. For me I'd be a lot more reassured if Sony would promise to never nodeprotect any of their software, not that they have "definitely not been communicating that". Geeze. And voiciferously sounds like voice+forcefully to me, so that's the way I remember that little SAT gem.
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