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Back to the Bunker

CmdrTaco posted more than 8 years ago

404

Oldsmobile writes "On Monday, June 19, about 4,000 government workers representing more than 50 federal agencies will say goodbye to their families and set off for dozens of classified emergency facilities stretching from the Maryland and Virginia suburbs to the foothills of the Alleghenies. They will take to the bunkers in an "evacuation" that sources describe as the largest "continuity of government" exercise ever conducted, a drill intended to prepare the U.S. government for an event even more catastrophic than the Sept. 11, 2001, attacks. The vast secret operation has updated the duck-and-cover scenarios of the 1950s with state-of-the-art technology -- alerts and updates delivered by pager and PDA, wireless priority service, video teleconferencing, remote backups -- to ensure that "essential" government functions continue undisrupted in an emergency."

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first post fish tits (0, Troll)

Asshat_Nazi (946431) | more than 8 years ago | (#15466851)

you suck the long shlong!

...never to be seen again (3, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#15466855)

Farewell!

Re:...never to be seen again (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#15466903)

Fresh food for the larder!

Re:...never to be seen again (1)

Saven Marek (739395) | more than 8 years ago | (#15466951)

You may joke about it but don't be surprised if it's the real thing. There are many government tracking sites noticing some big changes happening like this, preparing for larger disasters than the country can be prepared for with the general populace. chemtrail deposits are up, a recent upsurge in volcanic and earthquake activity, communications between the government and operatives in foreign countries are up, and the recent comet breakup could bring some catastrophic impacts. Aanyone see a pattern here? Check out Save Lives [savelivesinmay.com] to read up on what one researcher has discovered.

It all fits. Keep your mind open.

Re:...never to be seen again (4, Funny)

h4rm0ny (722443) | more than 8 years ago | (#15467016)


Hold on... they're "saying goodbye to their families"? Oh, that can't be good for a marriage. "Yes, darling, I'm just practicing for when there's a national disaster and I abandon you to the collapse of civilisation."

My advice - stay in the bunker!

Re:...never to be seen again (5, Funny)

TubeSteak (669689) | more than 8 years ago | (#15467145)

Muffley:

You mean, people could actually stay down there for a hundred years?

Strangelove:

It would not be difficult mein Fuhrer! Nuclear reactors could, heh... I'm sorry. Mr. President. Nuclear reactors could provide power almost indefinitely. Greenhouses could maintain plantlife. Animals could be bred and slaughtered. A quick survey would have to be made of all the available mine sites in the country. But I would guess... that ah, dwelling space for several hundred thousands of our people could easily be provided.

Muffley:

Well I... I would hate to have to decide.. who stays up and.. who goes down.

Strangelove:

Well, that would not be necessary Mr. President. It could easily be accomplished with a computer. And a computer could be set and programmed to accept factors from youth, health, sexual fertility, intelligence, and a cross section of necessary skills. Of course it would be absolutely vital that our top government and military men be included to foster and impart the required principles of leadership and tradition. Slams down left fist. Right arm rises in stiff Nazi salute. Arrrrr! Restrains right arm with left. Naturally, they would breed prodigiously, eh? There would be much time, and little to do. But ah with the proper breeding techniques and a ratio of say, ten females to each male, I would guess that they could then work their way back to the present gross national product within say, twenty years.

Muffley:

But look here doctor, wouldn't this nucleus of survivors be so grief stricken and anguished that they'd, well, envy the dead and not want to go on living?

Strangelove:

No sir... Right arm rolls his wheelchair backwards. Excuse me. Struggles with wayward right arm, ultimately subduing it with a beating from his left.

Also when... when they go down into the mine everyone would still be alive. There would be no shocking memories, and the prevailing emotion will be one of nostalgia for those left behind, combined with a spirit of bold curiosity for the adventure ahead! Ahhhh! Right are reflexes into Nazi salute. He pulls it back into his lap and beats it again. Gloved hand attempts to strangle him.

Turgidson:

Doctor, you mentioned the ration of ten women to each man. Now, wouldn't that necessitate the abandonment of the so called monogamous sexual relationship, I mean, as far as men were concerned?

Strangelove:

Regrettably, yes. But it is, you know, a sacrifice required for the future of the human race. I hasten to add that since each man will be required to do prodigious... service along these lines, the women will have to be selected for their sexual characteristics which will have to be of a highly stimulating nature.

DeSadeski:

I must confess, you have an astonishingly good idea there, Doctor.

Strangelove:

Thank you, sir.

So with that in mind, what makes you think they don't want to say goodbye to their families?

And from the bunker (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#15466856)

The quote was "slashdot first post w00t!"

Where are the bunkers to protect Citizens ? (5, Insightful)

unity100 (970058) | more than 8 years ago | (#15466859)

Huh ?

It seems evertyhing is provided for survival of "government" elite - who have the wealth and/or connections to get elected and appointed.

But what about hordes of people who constitute 'the people' in the declaration of independence ?

Re:Where are the bunkers to protect Citizens ? (5, Funny)

servognome (738846) | more than 8 years ago | (#15466908)

But what about hordes of people who constitute 'the people' in the declaration of independence ?

*sigh* how easily we forget history. Watch those old training films. Hiding under a desk or picnic blanket will provide protection in the event of a nuclear attack.

Re:Where are the bunkers to protect Citizens ? (3, Funny)

Markus Landgren (50350) | more than 8 years ago | (#15467171)

Hiding under a desk or picnic blanket will provide protection in the event of a nuclear attack.

Or just go around the corner and down the street [ready.gov] .

Re:Where are the bunkers to protect Citizens ? (1)

sgt scrub (869860) | more than 8 years ago | (#15466931)

The children have their desks to hide under.

Re:Where are the bunkers to protect Citizens ? (4, Funny)

Deadstick (535032) | more than 8 years ago | (#15466976)

I'm gonna cover my roof with school desks. That's 5/8 inch particle board...nothing goes through that.

rj

Re:Where are the bunkers to protect Citizens ? (0, Troll)

Knuckles (8964) | more than 8 years ago | (#15466952)

But what about hordes of people who constitute 'the people' in the declaration of independence ?

This is America - every man for himself, I guess. At least this is what I hear when it's about taxes and health care.

Yeah, why wasn't CmdrTaco invited? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#15466995)

Where are their priorities?!?!?!

Re:Where are the bunkers to protect Citizens ? (4, Interesting)

Dorsai65 (804760) | more than 8 years ago | (#15467001)

As we were instructed during my Navy boot camp: find a shielded spot, sit down, place your head between your knees, and kiss your 4ss goodbye...

Nobody should be surprised by this. I mean, surely I wasn't the only one that noticed that the Federal governments first response after 9/11 was to protect itself (i.e. Federal buildings, etc.)? State, County, and City governments were left to fend for themselves until the Fed had its ass covered; us mere citizens don't get squat, if you don't count the 'protection' we get from TSA airport screeners, the Patriot Act, and other catchy-titled programs.

Re:Where are the bunkers to protect Citizens ? (1)

mapkinase (958129) | more than 8 years ago | (#15467203)

There is more reason to it than you think. Hint: what do you hear on the loudspeaker after you boarded the plane and it is ready to take off?

Re:Where are the bunkers to protect Citizens ? (3, Insightful)

Shelled (81123) | more than 8 years ago | (#15467287)

This takes it a step further though. The implications of the following:

"Moreover, since 9/11 and Hurricane Katrina, the definition of what constitutes an "essential" government function has been expanded so ridiculously beyond core national security functions -- do we really need patent and trademark processing in the middle of a nuclear holocaust?...."

are horrific. Placing government officials above citizens is old news and expected, planning (presumably) to enforce who has the right to print 'Coke' on a can or copy a CD under terrorist nuclear attack moves the government into territories until now the sole domain of Dali or Escher. It's yet another example of how corporate lobbying have twisted and distorted government.

FF? (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#15466860)

first faggot?

Scheduled Revolutions (4, Insightful)

Doc Ruby (173196) | more than 8 years ago | (#15466866)

"an event even more catastrophic than the Sept. 11, 2001, attacks"

Would that be the November 7, 2006 Congressional elections? Or the November 4, 2008 elections, showing exceptionally long-range planning?

This Is Insightful??!!! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#15467041)

Has it really come to this? Paranoid conspiracy theory mewlings without a shred of evidence is considered "insightful" here?

It's really sad that the black-helicopter crowd has so infiltrated slashdot and its moderators. It used to be a decent place to get some real insightful comments once in a while. Now garbage like this is the cream of the crop. Really sad.

conspiracies (0, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#15467219)

The only conspiracy here is insiders in government hijacking the elections with their pals in the blackbox voting businesses. This (or similar moves) is called a coup d'etat when it happens in other nations. Here, the order followers just keep following orders, despite the fact of numerous lies being exposed, such as the actual stated reason to go to a semi major war over. They obviously don't care enough to consider what the heck they are doing, or want to go along with the coup. If you can't see these events have happened, oh well, consider some google searches and educate thyself. If you think it doesn't effect you, oh well again, too bad you got the ostrich with it's head in the sand syndrome. It effects everyone on the planet what the fatcat government goons do here, you don't even have to be a subject for their rules.

  The only black helicopters are the ones the government owns, in fact, one of them crashed the other day carrying the "nightstalkers" and some spec ops guys. Most didn't make it, one guy lived throgh it. They apparently hit a TV tower guide wire.

Oh, BTW, we are all informed now that the government itself employs thousands of "cyber warrior" coup supporters to manufacture fake news-a-ganda, and to post on forums and blogs, among other things, it is no longer a "secret". If you are one of them, or some civvie coup supporter, you know what? Eat shit you sniveling fascist bastard.

Re:conspiracies (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#15467321)

"we are all informed now that the government itself employs thousands of "cyber warrior" coup supporters to manufacture fake news"

It's called Foxnews.

Re:Scheduled Revolutions (1, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#15467152)

Because as we all know the 2000 and 2004 elections lead to.... ... less intrusive government ... enforcemnent of the bills of rights ... a balanced budget ... seperation of church and state ... more fair tax assessments for the suffering rich ... a golden age in stem cell and evolutionary science ... better foreign relations ... security for Americans caught in natural disasters ... protections of the human rights of prisoners of war ... action to protect the environment we live in

Yupper great steps forward.

  Heck even the Libetarians would be worth a shot if it wasn't for the fact William Crystol works for Murdock. This is the problem that occurs when successful businessmen also try to pretend they are philosophers. They really are clueless about the subject matter beyond cherry picking a few facts to suit their greedy needs.

    The term "greed" exist for a reason you know.

Re:Scheduled Revolutions (0, Troll)

archangel85j (905305) | more than 8 years ago | (#15467243)

Aid: "Mr. President, please come out of the bunker."
Former president Bush: "But I don wanna..."

Credibility gap (4, Interesting)

Mostly a lurker (634878) | more than 8 years ago | (#15466869)

When the emergency preparedness procedures are woefully inadequate in cases where the responsible agencies are operating from their regular offices, why should I believe they would be effective when staff are trying to react in a situation of real chaos.

Re:Credibility gap (3, Insightful)

Kjella (173770) | more than 8 years ago | (#15467172)

When the emergency preparedness procedures are woefully inadequate in cases where the responsible agencies are operating from their regular offices, why should I believe they would be effective when staff are trying to react in a situation of real chaos.

Well, there are two things:
1) Being able to continue critical operations in times of an emergency
2) Actually doing what makes sense in the situation

For example, if they put all the think-tanks in a scenic office of the WTC, they'd be running around like a bunch of headless chicken because the head just got chopped off. That has really more to do with "can we get hold of people", "where should people go to get work done", "how do we get information from the field", "who will take over these responsibilities" than how they actually act on that information.

Yes, you need a good strategy in case of an emergency... which is not that easy to create, imagine trying to plan for everything from the WTC attack to the hurricanes in the US to the Tsunami in SE Asia. Someone got a nuke from old Soviet? Chemical weapons from Iraq? Picked up an ebola strain in Africa? A natural pandemic (bird flu)? But you also need a contingency on how to execute it - unless your strategy is so completely without merit it makes no difference at all, and quite frankly they're not quite that bad. That is why you need drills like this.

Kjella

Re:Credibility gap (2, Insightful)

Andy Gardner (850877) | more than 8 years ago | (#15467218)

Good point, maybe they should like have a practice run or something.


Oh wait...

Re:Credibility gap (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#15467225)

That, plus it is five years later. It took them five years to come up with this plan. Talk about inefficient government. (Unless the Washington Post is recycling old news -- I don't click thru to them on principle.)

Meashh (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#15466881)

Anybody else picture The Penguin descending in to the sewers flanked by thousands of radio controled penguins with Batman hot on his trail?

For the record, even though Dick Chaney is a Penguin-esque mass murderer, I have a bit of grudging respect for the guy, and almost want to be like him. I mean, when he wants oil, people die.

Shit, when I want oil I just go to the gas station. Nobody dies. Well, I guess some people died to help get the gas into my car, but I didn't personally order their deaths.

I want to send Americans to their deaths and murder foreign nationals to steal their resources. I want to be Dick Chaney.

7 Emergency 911 calls were interrupted to... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#15466884)

...bring you this Wireless Priority Service message.

The showgirls will arrive on 06/18/2006 at 16:30 hours and they'll be sooo lonely....

M:F Ratio (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#15466892)

With a male:female ratio of 1:10 of course!

Re:M:F Ratio (1)

paraleet (650112) | more than 8 years ago | (#15466973)

Doctor, you mentioned the ratio of ten women to each man. Now, wouldn't that necessitate the abandonment of the so-called monogamous sexual relationship, I mean, as far as men were concerned?

Great, just great. (1, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#15466894)

What happened last time everyone went for training exercises? If you've watched loose change [loosechange911.com] , you know. And since bush's ratings are in the toilet I suspect it'll happen again.

To the evacuees... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#15466895)

Bring along a few spare water chips, okay?

Men/Women Ratio? Dr. Strangelove wants to know (2, Interesting)

TibbonZero (571809) | more than 8 years ago | (#15466897)

Is the men to women ratio favourable in Dr Strangelove's eyes? I mean, of course every many would have to perform his 'duty to his country' often with many women to repopulate the earth, but I think they can all suck it up and deal with it.
 

Re:Men/Women Ratio? Dr. Strangelove wants to know (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#15466947)

I think another question raised by Dr. Strangelove [amazon.com] is, what are the Russians doing about it? Do they have their own exercises planned for continuity of government, or will they allow a mine-shaft gap?

Re:Men/Women Ratio? Dr. Strangelove wants to know (1)

Poppler (822173) | more than 8 years ago | (#15467027)

I hasten to add that since each man will be required to do prodigious... service along these lines, the women will have to be selected for their sexual characteristics which will have to be of a highly stimulating nature.

Bright!!! Save the people who are responsible... (5, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#15466902)

for the mess to begin with.

Mmmmm... maybe be sure to save the Telephone Sanitizers this time around.

Tinfoil hat time! (3, Interesting)

ruiner13 (527499) | more than 8 years ago | (#15466911)

What if there is an asteroid about to hir Earth and the governement knows this and planned a "drill" to evacuate people underground that really isn't a drill. It would save people not on the list from trying to get there :)

Ok, conspiracy theory over!

Re:Tinfoil hat time! (4, Funny)

DannyO152 (544940) | more than 8 years ago | (#15466987)

Three thoughts. Glad I'm taking vacation this week. I'll be sure to see Cars on Friday. And, I for one, posthumously welcome our underground bureaucratic overlords.

Re:Tinfoil hat time! (2, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#15467248)

I for one, posthumously welcome our underground bureaucratic overlords.

Wouldn't that be underlords?

Re:Tinfoil hat time! (1)

Dorsai65 (804760) | more than 8 years ago | (#15467015)

It's only a conspiracy theory if they wouldn't actually do it. Since I trust that our government really would do something like that, your suggestion is merely 'letting the cat out of the bag' :-/

Re:Tinfoil hat time! (3, Interesting)

czarangelus (805501) | more than 8 years ago | (#15467205)

I thought the exact same thing... I wonder if there's a big terrorist attack coming. I never used to be this paranoid... *sigh*

Re:Tinfoil hat time! (0, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#15467276)

A couple problems with that scenario.

If there was an asteroid about to hit earth, hiding a few hundreds yards beneath the surface isn't going to do much for you, as an appropriately sized asteroid is going to turn the surface of the earth into a giant molten mess. You would have to be down pretty far, hope the asteroid didn't hit where you were, hope you could drill your way out afterwards, and have plenty of food.

If the asteroid was sufficiently small, you are going to be killed by the population when you come out anyway.

That said, it would come as no surprise to me if they were expecting _something_, just probably not an asteroid. But then, I'd expect them to bring their families with them if they were really expecting something.

Re:Tinfoil hat time! (1)

FudRucker (866063) | more than 8 years ago | (#15467324)

if a meteor hit the earth causing catastrophic damage where most life died, i wont want to be protected in a bunker only to come out and see a dead planet, what then? slowly starve to death because the environment is ruined, or die quickly from a poisoned atmosphere? living in a sterile bubble wont be a life it would be a prison sentence

Continuation of Coffee Breaks and Rude Service (5, Funny)

Lew Payne (592648) | more than 8 years ago | (#15466914)

"...to ensure that 'essential' government functions continue undisrupted in an emergency."

So now they're going to practice their coffee breaks, giving rude service to the public and wasting our tax dollars on dubious projects... all from underneath a fortified bunker, to ensure this very fine tradition is not lost in the event of a nuclear attack?

Re:Continuation of Coffee Breaks and Rude Service (3)

QCompson (675963) | more than 8 years ago | (#15466966)

No, no. They're going to make sure that any survivors left after a nuclear attack are not trading copyrighted music or movies. Catastrophic attack or not, sharing files is wrong, and people must be punished!

Re:Continuation of Coffee Breaks and Rude Service (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#15467208)

... someone modded the above "troll" ?

Completely unrelated point, so I'm posting anonymously. The moderation on slashdot is getting really awful.

Troll does not = "He's mocking something, and I don't find it that funny".
Flamebait does not = "I disagree".

People should be forced to moderate a selection of prefab comments before they are set loose with mod points. Moderation exists so that we don't have to see flamewars and freeipod links, not so that someone can make judgements as to the worth of a valid comment with relation to their own personal opinion.

A Waste of Time (5, Funny)

thecitruskid (468923) | more than 8 years ago | (#15466929)

The leadership of this country has a wildly overblown sense of self-importance. Even if we were to lose every politician in Washington, we have the largest prison population in the world, a vast pool from which to build a new government.

Re:A Waste of Time (4, Insightful)

TubeSteak (669689) | more than 8 years ago | (#15467184)

we have the largest prison warden population in the world, a vast pool from which to build a new government

Fixed that for you

Not so secret after all (5, Insightful)

LiquidCoooled (634315) | more than 8 years ago | (#15466933)

The vast secret operation has updated the duck-and-cover scenarios of the 1950s with state-of-the-art technology

So, posting it on slashdot counts as secrecy nowadays.

text messages (5, Funny)

SuperBanana (662181) | more than 8 years ago | (#15466946)

The vast secret operation has updated the duck-and-cover scenarios of the 1950s with state-of-the-art technology -- alerts and updates delivered by pager and PDA

RICE_BABY: "LOLZ IN DA BUNKA WHERE U @?"

CHAIN_MAN: "AT DA DOOR OPEN UP LOL"

SHRUB: "B SERIYUS U 2"

BROWNIE: "YEAH U NEVER KNOW WHOS GONNA SEE YER MESSAGES"

WASH_POST: "YEAH LOL IN UR NETWORK READIN YER MESSAGES SEE YOU IN THE PAPERS"

RUMMY: "LOL SEE YOU IN GITMO ALL YOUR RIGHTS ARE BELONG TO ME"

WASH_POST: "OH SHI..."

Re:text messages (1)

mrraven (129238) | more than 8 years ago | (#15467084)

Nice one... Wish I had some mod points for a +1 funny.

oh come on... (1)

mangus_angus (873781) | more than 8 years ago | (#15466954)

"a drill intended to prepare the U.S. government for an event even more catastrophic than the Sept. 11, 2001,"

a drill my ass! They go off in their little holes and the next thing we know we have Goa'uld mother ships over new your or something....

Why (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#15466977)

Why do they think we would want the government to "continue" and/or "to be safe"? When an entity develops a survival instinct, that is the true test as to whether or not it has evolved artificial intelligence. (cf. Hal in 2001)

I can still see a need... (4, Insightful)

ChePibe (882378) | more than 8 years ago | (#15466985)

While the Wa Post columnist - it should be noted that this is an opinion piece, not an article - is obviously not too fond of the idea, I'd say it still has at least some merit.

With increased WMD proliferation - from big budget nukes to dirt cheap chemical weapons - that can be used to attack the U.S. capital and government installations, I'd say that such a plan is smart to have as a backup. Should Iran wake up one day and decide to nuke Washington (a possibility in the future), we would certainly be able to retaliate and turn it into the Islamic Republic of Glass Bowl or Parking Lot (pick your favorite), but what would happen to all of the government infrastructure there? We're not just talking about continuity of elected leaders, but about the civilian side of the government as well, which this plan seems to focus on, too.

While nuclear war with Russia or another fairly heavily armed power (i.e. China) remains an enormously remote possibility, exchanges with countries that possess only a handful of nukes (Iran, North Korea, etc.) are much more likely. In such an event, the U.S. would not need to focus simply on making sure the attacker is completely wiped out - this is a given - but that it can survive a relatively small attack affecting only a handful of cities such as Washington and New York rather than a widespread nuclear holocaust in which all of this would simply be moot anyways.

The author is obviously unhappy with the inefficiency of this program, but I'm not entirely convinced by his arguments. Security, backups, etc. are always inefficient. Security and efficiency are always at odds with each other. Spending hundreds of millions on a backup that MIGHT be used is entirely inefficient EXCEPT when you need it, in which case it becomes a necessity. Combine this with the fact that the government is also not known for its efficiency and you've got a problem.

The U.S. isn't getting ready for nuclear holocaust any more, as many slashdotters have claimed and the author seems to hint at. It's getting ready for a limited nuclear exchange in which, yes, things like the patent office and budget offices must continue operating in the months and years to come when their main offices have been wiped out but a vast majority of the U.S. has been left unscathed.

Don't get me wrong - I'm not defending every action of this program. I would encourage others, however, to take a more nuanced look at it. And nuance is something slashdot appears to be lacking these days. It's likely my karma will pay for it, but so be it.

(As a side note, my "confirm I'm not a script" word was "senate"... coincidence?)

Re:I can still see a need... (1, Interesting)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#15467089)

How far the future are you looking where "Should Iran wake up one day and decide to nuke Washington" be possible? I mean, they'd have to develop a nuclear weapon, a long-range delivery system (Arguably harder than making a small fission device), weaponising their little pop-gun fission device so their long range delivery system can carry the thing (Very hard) and then be Bat Shit Crazy enough to use it, hoping that the US don't simply shoot it out of the sky before it gets to them. Then they'd be turned into the world biggest sheet of glass.

I mean, I'm all for sensationalist propoganda and fear based war-mongering, but that's some pretty futuristic fture you've got there.

Re:I can still see a need... (4, Insightful)

ChePibe (882378) | more than 8 years ago | (#15467160)

How far the future are you looking where "Should Iran wake up one day and decide to nuke Washington" be possible?

My personal opinion? 10 years or so.

I mean, they'd have to develop a nuclear weapon,

Perhaps you haven't been following the news...

a long-range delivery system (Arguably harder than making a small fission device),

Iran presently possesses the ability to launch against Southern Europe with its existing devices and can acquire other technology as needed.

weaponising their little pop-gun fission device so their long range delivery system can carry the thing (Very hard)

Iran presently possesses ballistic missile capability. While they have yet to develop ICBMs, their regional weapons are quite good. Additionally, why would it need to be ground launched from Iran? They have a wide terrorist network (yes, they actually do...) capable of using a nuke, and if recent GAO reports are any indicator of the present quality of border control when it comes to fissile material, I've got my doubts.

and then be Bat Shit Crazy enough to use it,

Again, perhaps you haven't been keeping up with the news...

hoping that the US don't simply shoot it out of the sky before it gets to them.

Countermeasures to missile defense systems exist.

Then they'd be turned into the world biggest sheet of glass.

Would they? I'm not entirely convinced. A small nuclear attack of that sort would likely result in a proportional strike - good bye Tehran, for example. Massive retaliation MAY not be the response, though it certainly is possible.

I mean, I'm all for sensationalist propoganda and fear based war-mongering, but that's some pretty futuristic fture you've got there.

I think you meant to post that over here [dailykos.com] . Go knock yourself out.

Re:I can still see a need... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#15467255)

a long-range delivery system (Arguably harder than making a small fission device)

A truck is a long range delivery system. I'm not saying that smuggling a fission device into the states would be trivial, but it wouldn't be the hardest thing ever accomplished either. Once in you just need to drive it to its destination. You shuouldn't need to be nearby to detonate but if you do then suicide bombers are hardly new.

Re:I can still see a need... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#15467263)

a long-range delivery system (Arguably harder than making a small fission device)
A fancy one is expensive. A boat plus a truck is not.

I for one welcome... (1, Funny)

mrraven (129238) | more than 8 years ago | (#15467118)

I for one welcome my unelected shadow government over lords. Permanent marshal law? Mmmmmm donuts. I mean why hold elections for a new government or any of that silly outdated inefficient 18th century human rights crap?

Re: nuance (1)

Jerf (17166) | more than 8 years ago | (#15467142)

And nuance is something slashdot appears to be lacking these days.

Nuance is for people who aren't already absolutely, positively certain that they are 100% correct and anyone who disagrees in the slightest way is stupid. Also evil. Possibly eats babies.

Yeah, but would they go? (4, Insightful)

Foerstner (931398) | more than 8 years ago | (#15467149)

Looking back at the Cold War-era bunkers, several (civillian) VIP's noted that, although they had been informed of the facilities and the contingencies for their use, they never would have actually gone into them.

Because, as this article hints, they would have had to leave their families to do so.

Thinking about the "human factors" involved...would their be enough warning for anyone to be able to make it to the bunker in time? Would the roads/airspace/transit function well enough to get them to the bunkers? Would they leave their families to do so?

Re:Yeah, but would they go? (1)

ChePibe (882378) | more than 8 years ago | (#15467250)

An excellent question, to which the best answer is a "maybe".

Roads? Heh, if you've ever driven in the DC area, you know that's just not a possibility. Airspace, however, should be much more open given the post 9/11 measures.

This plan is about more than bunkers though - it also involves posting civilian backups away from the capital that are poised to take over should D.C. get nuked. Given the concentration of senior personnel in D.C. it would certainly be impossible to get all - or even most - out in a 30 minute period (assuming they would have that long). But the government should certainly try its best to get all of its elected officials and most senior staff out as quickly as possible, including the SecState, SecDef, and other cabinet level positions.

But, moving beyond cabinet positions and elected officials, one would also need to consider the need to keep basic government bureaucracy running, such as the Patent Office, Budget Office, GAO, and other important functions of government that the people would still need after a small, limited nuclear exchange. This plan doesn't focus on evacuating these individuals but on creating civilian backups ready to take over in case of an attack. The U.S. would still need to be able to function even with D.C. gone. Would there be bumps as these new officials came on? You betcha - big ones. But they'd still be needed in the long run is my argument.

if the US developed... (1)

zogger (617870) | more than 8 years ago | (#15467258)

...an actual credible bona fide anti missile defense that really worked, the other major nuclear powers (china and russia) would be sorely tempted to launch a first strike before the new system was widely deployed. If they waited, it would place them in a position of being defenseless against an attack, without even a good chance of a good sized retaliatory stike. MAD only works when all the sides are at rough parity in other words.

Re:I can still see a need... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#15467264)

You're suggesting that Iran might one day nuke Washington, which implies that you don't think Iran developing nuclear weapons is such a great idea, while you still protect the idea that the US is entiteled to it's nukes because they need them to protect themselves and completely waste anybody who tries to attack them. This could maybe be justified if Iran was accustom to attacking other nations, but as for the moment it's the US that's invading other countries close to Iran. So if you use your explanation and turn it around, Iran would certainly need to develop nukes as soon as possible in case the US invades Iran as well and then they would, using your words: "would not need to focus simply on making sure the attacker is completely wiped out".

I'm not saying that Iran should develop nukes, but you're saying that any country that's attacked is well within their authority to completely destroy the other side, which means that the moment the US invaded Afghanistan and Iraq either of these countries would be well within their rights to completely waste the entire US.

Just politics, folks! (2, Funny)

creimer (824291) | more than 8 years ago | (#15466990)

... for an event even more catastrophic than the Sept. 11, 2001, attacks.

The 2006 mid-term elections?

Bury the devils while we have the chance (4, Insightful)

tengu1sd (797240) | more than 8 years ago | (#15466991)

As Leslie Fish [random-factors.com] points out in The Digwell Carol [hamienet.com] if we take the chance to bury them now, maybe we can get on with our lives. Anyone else feel like chipping in for a concrete pour to be arranged at the mouth of bunker this week?

Hate to rain on the party (2, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#15466997)

but the USA PATRIOT Act forbids discussing this in any form.

I am at risk myself because I told you this as discussing what the USA PATRIOT Act forbids is also forbidden.

at least the patent system will live on... (2, Funny)

ofcourseyouare (965770) | more than 8 years ago | (#15467003)

"Moreover, since 9/11 and Hurricane Katrina, the definition of what constitutes an "essential" government function has been expanded so ridiculously beyond core national security functions -- do we really need patent and trademark processing in the middle of a nuclear holocaust? -- that the term has become meaningless."

Just before the blastwave hits, as I put my head between my legs and kiss my ass goodbye, my final thought can be "maybe I'll be dead but at least the patent system will live on..."

We'll Be Prepared for the Rarest of Events (4, Insightful)

courtarro (786894) | more than 8 years ago | (#15467032)

I, for one, feel that my money could be going to much more useful places, like developing alternative fuels to oil or cures for common lethal diseses. Frankly, if these bunkers became necessary, I'd probably be pretty offended that they don't consider me valuable enough to warrant a place in one. I hope they're also reserving space for scientists, physicists, doctors, civil engineers, electrical engineers, computer engineers, etc. etc. However I have a feeling that these bunkers will be filled with politicians who will have no purpose, after arising from nuclear holocaust, but to attempt to get surviving mutant population to vote for more defense programs while they struggle to find food.

It's good to know we will be able to handle an occurrence that has killed less than 1000 people each year. I wonder if we'll be prepared for another realistic disaster like Katrina or Rita, or if we'll be prepared for the millions who die of heart disease. Hurry to the bunkers!

Re:We'll Be Prepared for the Rarest of Events (1)

mrraven (129238) | more than 8 years ago | (#15467141)

Wow an American still capable of rational long term thought who hasn't been paralyzed with fear, who'd have thunk it?

Re:We'll Be Prepared for the Rarest of Events (3, Insightful)

Bogtha (906264) | more than 8 years ago | (#15467309)

That isn't rational long-term thinking, it's complacency and short-term thinking. Schemes like this are simply insurance policies.

How many times has your home burned down? None? You still have home insurance though, right? Having home insurance doesn't mean you are "paralysed by fear" of your home burning down, does it?

Yes, things like heart disease are immediate problems, but that doesn't mean you can simply stick your head in the sand and ignore potential long-term problems.

Re:We'll Be Prepared for the Rarest of Events (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#15467302)

I, for one, feel that my money could be going to much more useful places, like developing alternative fuels to oil or cures for common lethal diseses.
Go for it.

Meanwhile, the constitution requires the government to do a few things (and research into medical or energy technology is not mentioned). The government is working on a way to increase the probability that it can remain capable of doing those things.

What about the other 5,000,000 or so? (2, Insightful)

InsurgentGeek (926646) | more than 8 years ago | (#15467063)

First, my personal observation is that about 98% of Federal employees are dedicated and hardworking. Unfortunately the 2% that are not tend to be a) executives or b) customer-facing. Second, if we can provide essential services with 4,000 people - why are we paying for millions?

Speaking of 9/11 (1, Insightful)

Dracos (107777) | more than 8 years ago | (#15467081)

NORAD was running several drills on the morning of 9/11, amazingly, to simulate almost the exact 9/11 events. This is why so many air traffic controllers and military personnel in various tape recordings seem confused and ask for numerous confirmations that what actually happened was not an exercise.

[/tinfoil-hat]

Not a troll what actually happned (3, Interesting)

mrraven (129238) | more than 8 years ago | (#15467188)

"Agency planned exercise on Sept. 11 built around a plane crashing into a building
Wed Aug 21, 7:45 PM ET

By JOHN J. LUMPKIN, Associated Press Writer

WASHINGTON - In what the government describes as a bizarre coincidence, one U.S. intelligence agency was planning an exercise last Sept. 11 in which an errant aircraft would crash into one of its buildings. But the cause wasn't terrorism -- it was to be a simulated accident.

Officials at the Chantilly, Virginia-based National Reconnaissance Office had scheduled an exercise that morning in which a small corporate jet would crash into one of the four towers at the agency's headquarters building after experiencing a mechanical failure.

The agency is about 4 miles (6 kilometers) from the runways of Washington Dulles International Airport.

Agency chiefs came up with the scenario to test employees' ability to respond to a disaster, said spokesman Art Haubold. No actual plane was to be involved -- to simulate the damage from the crash, some stairwells and exits were to be closed off, forcing employees to find other ways to evacuate the building.

"It was just an incredible coincidence that this happened to involve an aircraft crashing into our facility," Haubold said. "As soon as the real world ( news - Y! TV) events began, we canceled the exercise."

Terrorism was to play no role in the exercise, which had been planned for several months, he said.

Adding to the coincidence, American Airlines Flight 77 -- the Boeing 767 that was hijacked and crashed into the Pentagon ( news - web sites) -- took off from Dulles at 8:10 a.m. on Sept. 11, 50 minutes before the exercise was to begin. It struck the Pentagon around 9:40 a.m., killing 64 aboard the plane and 125 on the ground.

The National Reconnaissance Office operates many of the nation's spy satellites. It draws its personnel from the military and the CIA ( news - web sites).

After the Sept. 11 attacks, most of the 3,000 people who work at agency headquarters were sent home, save for some essential personnel, Haubold said.

An announcement for an upcoming homeland security conference in Chicago first noted the exercise.

In a promotion for speaker John Fulton, a CIA officer assigned as chief of NRO's strategic gaming division, the announcement says, "On the morning of September 11th 2001, Mr. Fulton and his team ... were running a pre-planned simulation to explore the emergency response issues that would be created if a plane were to strike a building. Little did they know that the scenario would come true in a dramatic way that day."

The conference is being run by the National Law Enforcement and Security Institute.

___

On the Net:

National Reconnaissance Office: http://www.nro.gov/ [nro.gov]

Central Intelligence Agency ( news - web sites): http://www.cia.gov/ [cia.gov]

National Law Enforcement and Security Institute: http://www.nlsi.net/ [nlsi.net] "

Although his link is from "prison planet" the original article is from AP.

I, for one, am prepared! (2, Funny)

elgee (308600) | more than 8 years ago | (#15467087)

I still have my stash I prepared for the Y2K crises.

Mmmm. I think some of this stuff needs to be updated. And all the beer I stashed is long gone.

Maybe this isn't such a bad thing (-1, Offtopic)

hacker (14635) | more than 8 years ago | (#15467095)

If the current administration continues down the path its going, with its self-destructive, Holier-than-thou (and-everyone-else) mentality, thinking that they are the World Police, they may actually NEED these bunkers, not to defend against a foreign attack, but to defend against a domestic uprising .

Note to those who currently think they are in "power": WE the people, give you your rights and power, you do not give them to us. There are many more of us than you (and you are MADE of many of us). You might not want to get on our bad side, and you might want to consider re-reading your Constitution [wikipedia.org] , Bill of Rights [wikipedia.org] and Declaration of Independence [wikipedia.org] .

Scary but true, General Michael Hayden, former head of the NSA (yes, the one being accused of wiretapping millions of Americans without a warrant), doesn't even know the 4th Amendment [gnu-designs.com] , and insists he does. He's going for a position to head the CIA? Scary, scary stuff.

Repeat to yourself: Erosion of civil liberties... is a threat to national security.

Re:Maybe this isn't such a bad thing (1)

werewolf1031 (869837) | more than 8 years ago | (#15467317)

Note to those who currently think they are in "power": WE the people, give you your rights and power, you do not give them to us. ...you might want to consider re-reading your Constitution, Bill of Rights and Declaration of Independence.

While the rest of the post may've been a bit tinfoil-hat-ish, parent is right. Offtopic? Sure, a little. Troll? No way in hell. Bad mod.

umm (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#15467120)

"government survival"? If something bad enough happens that they need to run to their bunkers, they deserve to be shot when they come back out.

But of course... (1, Offtopic)

trellick (67244) | more than 8 years ago | (#15467121)

The RIAA must be able to continue to prosecute US citizens even after the dazed survivors of a cataclysmic attack emerge from the smoking ruins!

"even more catastrophic" ??? (3, Insightful)

l33t-gu3lph1t3 (567059) | more than 8 years ago | (#15467134)

I'm sorry, 9/11 wasn't a catastrophe of national or even regional concern. It was an isolated, one-off local emergency. It didn't threaten the average american, it didn't interrupt or negate the federal and regional bureaucracy's ability to operate, and it certainly wasn't a national crisis. To this day its greatest long-term effect has been the destruction of an entire country as simple retaliation

9/11 was a local disaster affecting one municipality.
Hurricane Katrina was a regional disaster affecting a couple states.
The race riots in France were a regional crisis
The student riots in France were a localized crisis
If bird flu suddenly spread like wildfire killing hundreds of thousands to millions in multiple states, THAT would be a national-level crisis.

Re:"even more catastrophic" ??? (4, Informative)

Mr. Slippery (47854) | more than 8 years ago | (#15467182)

9/11 was a local disaster affecting one municipality.

Two municipalities. Let's not forget that a lot of people died at the Pentagon; a former co-worker of mine [ucsb.edu] was on that plane.

Re:"even more catastrophic" ??? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#15467186)

To this day its greatest long-term effect has been the destruction of an entire country as simple retaliation

We nuked a country and I overlooked it?

Which country, pray tell, was it?

Re:"even more catastrophic" ??? (-1, Troll)

frank249 (100528) | more than 8 years ago | (#15467234)

9/11 wasn't a catastrophe of national or even regional concern. It was an isolated, one-off local emergency.

The towers were in Nrw York but air flights were grounded nation wide and Bush was hustled off to an undiclosed location where he was not heard from for what 24 - 48 hours?. The repressive police state measures brought in[and continue to this day] affected every American. 3,000 people died but 300 million lost many civil rights and privacy. That was the national catastrophe.

Essential services, such as.. (1)

mustafap (452510) | more than 8 years ago | (#15467143)

>- to ensure that "essential" government functions continue undisrupted in an emergency."

yea, like DRM and IP. I wonder if the drill is sponsered by anyone...

Thank god (1)

DerWulf (782458) | more than 8 years ago | (#15467156)

... seriously, at least we will be safe in the knowledge that government WILL go on when disaster strikes. Go on being a complete and utter failure that is. And for the cost of only a few trillions. Bargain I say!

On a related note, picturing a civilization descentant completely from government workers is quite amusing. What will leeches do without hosts? Man-on-Man cani-action, thats what! At least the TV programming will be entertaining, as long as it lasts.

Just what i wanted (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#15467183)

a bunker to to protect a government which will spy on its own people. yea!

What a perfect opportunity (2, Interesting)

HangingChad (677530) | more than 8 years ago | (#15467187)

If you were a corrupt, failing administration what a perfect cover to launch some type of coup. Speaking hypothetically, of course. Say you were a neo-conservative right wing type, I'm sure you could find a pretext for sweeping aside Congressional oversight and an "activist" judiciary. But when to pull it off? When most government officials were safely out of harms way in "secret" locations. In case any of you liberal types didn't like the idea of a neo-conservative monarchy.

All you'd need to happen with the execs were safely away is some cooked up "terrorist" attack, maybe a series of dirty bombs going off coupled with a financial crisis. Good excuse to roll the military out into the streets.

Nah, couldn't happen here, right? Just because something similar happened...well, several times in the past is no reason to think it could ever happen here.

Who should be saved? (1)

ultramrw21 (889103) | more than 8 years ago | (#15467193)

If there is a massive terrorist attack and many innocent people are killed these are the last people that should be protected in some uber-bunker. Why? because these are some of the few people in this country who are not innocent and could have stopped an attack. Shouldnt we be putting our best and brightest (pretty much all the /.ers) in something like this? Last time i checked the politicians are at the bottom of that list.

Re:Who should be saved? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#15467281)

You think the slashbots are our best and brightest? I mean they might be better than average, but you have a damn inflated opinion of yourself.

Hey ... Wait a damn minute here... (5, Interesting)

zappepcs (820751) | more than 8 years ago | (#15467196)

Weren't government agencies practicing for the exact same situation as 9/11 just prior to it happening?

I might need a tin-foil hat here, but it just seems to convenient that they are having a 'practice run' like they were practicing before 9/11.

The only thing to survive the US government is... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#15467198)

...the US government. It's nice to see that the US government is making sure that it can survive itself. Nothing else seems to have a chance against them. I don't know what they'll have to destroy if they ever have to put this plan into effect.

Maybe they should just put nuclear bombs in every major city and configure them to go off if the government hasn't been around for a while. Doing so would be functionally equivelant to "Back to the Bunker." It's really just a question of what costs less. Oh wait, this is the US government, whatever costs more.

What a bunch of fucking cunts.

you F41l It? (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#15467231)

we don'7 sux0r as 7000 use8s of I burnt out. I

whatever. (1)

araczynski (265221) | more than 8 years ago | (#15467249)

gotta make sure the status quo is maintained, god forbid we ever get a clean start again and try to make a government this time for the PEOPLE...

Essential government functions (1)

Trouvist (958280) | more than 8 years ago | (#15467273)

I doubt that 99% of the current government's 'essential functions' will be taken down into the holes. Let's see what might get left behind:

1) RIAA/MPAA lawsuits
2) USPTO
3) Speed limits
4) Taxes
5) Regulation of the economy
6) The Department of Homeland Security
7) The NSA's collection of everyone's phone and data transmissions
8) etc.

Lately it seems that 99% of the government bloat and "protection" would get left behind and it would be reduced to what the Constitution orgininally intended. Have a nice day.

are you sure (0, Flamebait)

plbg32 (778456) | more than 8 years ago | (#15467301)

its benn said that this is not an excercise, that its a cover for a goverment take over concisting of....... ..............THIS POSTING DELETED BE YOUR FREINDLY NSA OVERSEER

If I was a rogue nation. (1)

forgotten_my_nick (802929) | more than 8 years ago | (#15467331)

I'd be watching the mock evacuation to see where each group goes and then add the locations to "Nuke the hell out of" list. although its possible the places has been publically known for ages.

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