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Dvorak Admits To Trolling Mac Users

CowboyNeal posted more than 8 years ago | from the everyone's-favorite-gasbag dept.

354

jalefkowit writes "Tech pundit John Dvorak has long been known for his inflammatory opinions. Many have suspected that these opinions are just a way to drive up traffic to his column. Now, we have it straight from the horse's mouth: Dave Winer has Dvorak on video describing his methodology for trolling the Mac community to pump up his stats." I have to admit I'm also guilty of posting the occasional inflammatory story, but I find it's usually best to suffix the title with a question mark, and let our ever-knowledgeable readers hash out the issue and decide for themselves.

cancel ×

354 comments

Trolling the Mac community? (5, Funny)

Whiney Mac Fanboy (963289) | more than 8 years ago | (#15509506)

Thats an almost impossible task - mac users are too smart to take the bait ;)

Re:Trolling the Mac community? (-1, Flamebait)

grazzy (56382) | more than 8 years ago | (#15509525)

Too busy mirroring themselfs in the latest overpriced mac powerbook.. you mean.

Re:Trolling the Mac community? (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#15509852)

Hey, it's not our fault we're [atspace.com] better [atspace.com] looking [atspace.com] than you.

Re:Trolling the Mac community? (-1, Redundant)

grazzy (56382) | more than 8 years ago | (#15509887)

http://www.macsucks.com/ [macsucks.com]

Re:Trolling the Mac community? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#15509528)

this guy is right, we are way too smart i don't see how he could do it

Re:Trolling the Mac community? (4, Funny)

mkw87 (860289) | more than 8 years ago | (#15509538)

Just like they are too smart to operate the elevator at the NYC Store?

Re:Trolling the Mac community? (5, Funny)

BobPaul (710574) | more than 8 years ago | (#15509632)

Hey! That's not fair! That elevator is really super confusing. It has all of these buttons you have to push... It's hard.

Re:Trolling the Mac community? (5, Funny)

$RANDOMLUSER (804576) | more than 8 years ago | (#15509663)

> Hey! That's not fair! That elevator is really super confusing. It has all of these buttons you have to push... It's hard.

An elevator with the Mac UI would have just one button "THERE". I mean, after all, I'm already HERE.

Re:Trolling the Mac community? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#15509673)

An elevator with the Mac UI would have a picture of the building, and you'd have to drag and drop the elevator to the floor you wanted to go to. With flashy animations and stuff.

Never mind that just pushing a button is quicker, easier, and more efficient...

Re:Trolling the Mac community? (0, Flamebait)

MustardMan (52102) | more than 8 years ago | (#15509708)

Grandparent - funny and insightful comment about the sometimes over-simplification of mac UI's

Parent - stupid troll who doesn't realize that there are about ten different ways to do most tasks in OS X, with more uniform keyboard shortcuts and extensive contextual menus than windows has.

Mods on crack as usual (-1, Offtopic)

MustardMan (52102) | more than 8 years ago | (#15509818)

If anyone is a troll here it's the AC with factually inaccurate garbage. Of course, no one moderates based on logic or facts on slashdot - its all about moderating what you like and don't like. Now this one is offtopic, bitches - mod it down, I've got karma to burn.

Re:Trolling the Mac community? (2)

mattkinabrewmindspri (538862) | more than 8 years ago | (#15509790)

An elevator with the Mac UI would have a picture of the building, and you'd drag the elevator over the floor you wanted to go to, at which point the picture would change to be a picture of that floor, and then you'd drop the elevator on the specific room you wanted to go to, and it would take you to that room.

Re:Trolling the Mac community? (3, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#15509816)

Meanwhile, though, thanks to the underlying UNIXy OS, powerusers who type faster than they mouse can just open a terminal window and type (with tab-completion)
open /Floors/14/Offices/Mike\'s\ Office
to get right there.

Re:Trolling the Mac community? (5, Funny)

stunt_penguin (906223) | more than 8 years ago | (#15509842)

An elevator with a Google interface would be similarly easy to use, if slightly more text heavy, and there'd be some buttons off to the right hand side advertising what's on other floors based on the floors you've already visited, what you were talking about when you came into the elevator and what you're carrying.


Reportedly, Ballmer now prefers to take the stairs

Re:Trolling the Mac community? (3, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#15509861)

Hey! That's not fair! That elevator is really super confusing. It has all of these buttons you have to push... It's hard.

And they go, like, beep-beep-beep-beep... and the doors open up and the floor you were on is, like, gone!
--Ellen Feiss

Re:Trolling the Mac community? (5, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#15509539)

The Mac sites are up in arms, with commentors demanding that PC Magazine pull their columnist because he has no integrity. I don't know why anybody ever takes Dvorak seriously. If you don't, you'll see that he can actually be pretty entertaining.

Too bad Apple does not include a sense of humor with iLife. Even now when Dvorak's let us all in on the joke, they still don't get it.

Re:Trolling the Mac community? (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#15509763)

In other news, CommanderTaco trolls Linux users, Zonk trolls PS3 fanboys, and every /. editor trolls the grammar Nazis.

Its called "Sensationalism" in Newspapers, "Shock Jocks" in Radio, and "Trolling" on the internet.

meta-troll (2, Insightful)

weierstrass (669421) | more than 8 years ago | (#15509764)

This is itself a troll. The video [youtube.com] does not show Dvorak saying these things, but has him talking with the audio completely out of sync. From the FTA:
he started telling a story about how he deliberately pisses Mac users off to get flow for his stories, and I said, hold a minute, I want to record this, and shit if he didn't stop and repeat it for me and my video camera. I guess now I'm an official video blogger
Think about it, if you were doing well by professional trolling (and I'm not saying he's not) would you talk about it on video, and lose all that revenue by 'serious' news sites deciding not to link to you anymore? This is a hoax. It's also probably one of these things that ring so true that everyone goes on acting as though they were even after they're discredited, like Al Gore inventing the Internet.

Re:meta-troll (0)

MustardMan (52102) | more than 8 years ago | (#15509777)

Yeah, because re-encoding a video NEVER puts the sound of out sync.

Watch the original available from TFA - it's perfectly in sync.

Re:meta-troll (1)

IntlHarvester (11985) | more than 8 years ago | (#15509814)

Think about it, if you were doing well by professional trolling (and I'm not saying he's not) would you talk about it on video, and lose all that revenue by 'serious' news sites deciding not to link to you anymore?

Everyone is pretty much on to him at this point, so by admitting it, he can troll the Mac users one last time. In a few years, everyone will have forgotten about it and he can start the cycle by trolling them again. This happened before when he was fired from MacWorld.

Most of the stuff that Dvorak said was so batty (Itanium Macs?) that it was doubtful that anyone really thought he was being all that serious.

Apple on Itanium (1)

jbailey999 (146222) | more than 8 years ago | (#15509836)

I hadn't seen any announcement about Itanium macs, but I'd certainly assumed that's what was going to happen. For all of the money that Intel has pissed away on Itanium, I had assumed two things:

1) They must come out with an interesting version eventually.

2) A great time to announce that they'd made the things interesting would be with a huge splash announcement like Apple adopting it.

The roadmap of desktops now, laptops shortly would be pretty consistant with a technology breakthrough.

Pity it didn't happen. It's sad to see the processor world still dancing around the stinking carcass of x86.

Re:Apple on Itanium (1)

IntlHarvester (11985) | more than 8 years ago | (#15509892)

I suppose it made some sensational sense, but the real news was that HP was dropping Itanium Workstations, and MS was stopping XP for IA64, making it practically impossible for that a desktop Itaniums for Macs would ever appear. Not that I expect Dvorak to know anything about chip roadmaps.

But to be fair, the ultimtely correct Apple/Intel rumors were swirling around and he was just trying to spice them up a bit.

Re:Trolling the Mac community? (-1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#15509614)


WMF, YHBT. YHL. HAND.

Don't use so many caps. It's like YELLING.

LOL.

Re:Trolling the Mac community? (1)

zoomshorts (137587) | more than 8 years ago | (#15509682)

I think NOT. The Apple community are the FIRST to have knee-jerk responses,
despite their being around 4 percent of the PC users on the planet.

Oh well.

Re:Trolling the Mac community? (1)

asuffield (111848) | more than 8 years ago | (#15509874)

mac users are too smart to take the bait

Are those the same mac users who have in the past done themselves injuries by trying to cram a graphite powermac [wikimedia.org] into their mouth and suck on it, believing it to be a throat lozenge?

ever-knowledgeable readers (-1, Redundant)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#15509515)

heh haha hahahahah BWAHAHAHAHAHA!

Torrent download (2, Informative)

nacturation (646836) | more than 8 years ago | (#15509518)

Direct link: http://s3.amazonaws.com/scripting/dvorak.mov?torre nt [amazonaws.com]

Of course, Dvorak will just say that it's not true -- he was just trolling on that recording, thus completing the prophecy and dooming mankind.
 

Re:Torrent download (1)

azav (469988) | more than 8 years ago | (#15509760)

Here's a smaller file at identical quality (1/3 the size, 6 vs 20 MB)

Could someone please torrent this?

http://69.3.167.6/~zav/Dvorak-3ivx-streaming.mov [69.3.167.6]

Cheers. Please don't melt my server.

O RLY? (0, Flamebait)

Ramble (940291) | more than 8 years ago | (#15509521)

If they're so smart then why do they need a dumbed down interface?

Or why do they pay double or triple price for simple pieces of hardware that works with Mac like an external USB hard drive?

Or why do Mac users suggest that a laptop isn't for use on a lap just becuase the MacBook Shit is too hot? (Off the intellectual hotspot Digg)

Re:O RLY? (1)

ParticleMan911 (688473) | more than 8 years ago | (#15509548)

Since when do mac users need to pay any more for an external hard drive? Standard USB 2.0/Firewire external hard drives are compatible with any modern PC and Mac.

Everything in this post is SO OS9 (Re:O RLY?) (1)

aergern (127031) | more than 8 years ago | (#15509694)

Aqua is no more dumbed down the Gnome is in Ubuntu 6.06 which I use at work.. but it is better layed out the Windows is..

Mac users DO not pay double or triple for ANY external device .. you make things up and look stupid for it. I have 4x300G Seagates in plain external enclosures. *ding* Go back to the end of the line and please try again.

The heat issue was a mistake that has been corrected.. IBM, HP or Dell never make mistakes in manufacturing? Yeah.. right. Moron.

Re:Everything in this post is SO OS9 (Re:O RLY?) (1)

BobPaul (710574) | more than 8 years ago | (#15509731)

That's right! You tell him! He should have never posted that helpful link!!

Who are you replying to?

Re:Everything in this post is SO OS9 (Re:O RLY?) (1)

BobPaul (710574) | more than 8 years ago | (#15509748)

Oh, never mind... it looked like the parent was someone else. I'd blame the new discussion system, but I'm probably just dumb.

Re:O RLY? (1)

ThePooka (979798) | more than 8 years ago | (#15509699)

Am I the only one that understood that this was meant to be funny? (Change its score, for chrissakes...)

Re:O RLY? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#15509781)

why do they pay double or triple price for simple pieces of hardware that works with Mac like an external USB hard drive?

If you can get me an external HDD enclosure for $8.00 including shipping, please post the vendor's name and address here.

Otherwise, I'll continue to recommend the $24 enclosures for Mac users.

I've said it before (5, Interesting)

thefirelane (586885) | more than 8 years ago | (#15509522)

Dvorak is nothing other than the worlds most successful troll. As much as everyone here complains about him, we eat it up and come back for more. We used to be able to pretend it was the editors foisting him upon us... but lo' and behold, democratic Digg comes along, and he still makes the front page! [digg.com]

Re:I've said it before (2, Informative)

Whiney Mac Fanboy (963289) | more than 8 years ago | (#15509585)

Dvorak is nothing other than the worlds most successful troll.

I think you meant:

Dvorak is nothing other than the worlds most successful internet troll.

(see Stern, Rush, etc etc)

Re:I've said it before (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#15509774)

Don't worry, WMF, you're not that far behind.

Re:I've said it before (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#15509849)

wmf isn't a troll!!!!!111!!!

Re:I've said it before (5, Interesting)

generic-man (33649) | more than 8 years ago | (#15509604)

Two words: Ann Coulter [wikipedia.org] .

Re:I've said it before (1, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#15509667)

Two words for Ann Coulter: "Itsa Dude"

S(H)e has man hands and an adams apple. Nothing like politics from a repressed christian transexual.

Re:I've said it before (1)

P3NIS_CLEAVER (860022) | more than 8 years ago | (#15509740)

She trolls people about things they have a right to be pissed about...

Dvorak taps into people that get up in arms over their technology choices; pretty pathetic, don't you think??

Overtonnage Overkillers (5, Interesting)

Doc Ruby (173196) | more than 8 years ago | (#15509823)

Ann Coulter is the rightwing Anchor Troll in their "Overton Window" [dailykos.com] strategy.

It's a simple way to force the public debate "spectrum window" to your end of the spectrum by trolling unthinkable statements in public. Successful trolls create only predictable responses, not any further development of the ideas. So the "unthinkable" is now part of the public conversation, without risking rejection by anyone actually thinking about it. Changing the ideas in the public window of the spectrum moves the window closer to the new idea. Now the window includes more of the thinkable ideas that were excluded or marginalized, while the window excludes or marginalizes the ideas previously more in the "center", but further away from the troll.

The only risk with overtonning the window is that the troll discredits its entire end of the spectrum by association. Which is why it's important that the troll make as extreme, ridiculous comments as possible. And frequently defend their statements with "I was just kidding". The associates who benefit from the troll in their neighborhood must also not even repudiate the troll, as any association (positive or negative) is contagious. The troll must work alone. Though of course they can be paid by the same beneficiaries, or have their "home markets" all subsidized by the same beneficiaries.

Now Ann Coulter actually makes sense, probably for the first time. As do her fellow trolls like Rush Limbaugh, Bill O'Reilly, and most of the rightwing talkradioheads.

Re:Overtonnage Overkillers (0, Troll)

thedogcow (694111) | more than 8 years ago | (#15509862)

what? That made no sense at all.

Re:I've said it before (2, Insightful)

DingerX (847589) | more than 8 years ago | (#15509628)

Yeah, he's been doing this for a long time. And the tech world is full of enough fanatics that you can't help but piss people off. Write an inflammatory article on Apple, Open Source, Linux, Nintendo, or any number of other technosacredcows, and bang! instant traffic. Much easier than saying something intelligent.

It's called advertising. (2, Interesting)

conner_bw (120497) | more than 8 years ago | (#15509656)

Ever ask yourself how so many Dvorak posts end of on the front page of Slashdot? Or why any of us would even care about this guy when there is far better blog crapulence floating out there in the sea of manure we call the internet?

It is my contention that someone, somewhere, has a vested financial interest in this guy and continues to prop up his irrelevance for all to ignore. It may even be Dvorak himself...

Seriously, how much to run a rant on the front page?

Re:It's called advertising. (1)

IntlHarvester (11985) | more than 8 years ago | (#15509869)

Ever ask yourself how so many Dvorak posts end of on the front page of Slashdot?

Slashdot owes it's success to posting trolls on it's front page all day, every day.

These Dvorak columns got huge comment responses across every Mac-oriented tech site, ZDNet would be really stupid to be paying people to post them. The slashvertisements are for the random hardware products that get posted or the crappy unknown hardware review sites.

Michael Moore (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#15509666)

Dvorak is nothing other than the worlds most successful troll.
Are we forgetting Michael Moore [michaelmoore.com] ?

Re:Michael Moore (1)

Fujisawa Sensei (207127) | more than 8 years ago | (#15509775)

How about Bill, I'm the only one who gets to spin on my show and the minute I'm shown to be wrong I cut your mike, O'Reilly?

Re:Michael Moore (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#15509891)

I'll grant you they're both blowhards, but I think you'll find that Mike has better name recognition. And that's the whole point of being a Troll, isn't it?

Re:I've said it before (1)

dbzero (64544) | more than 8 years ago | (#15509701)

I used to love flipping PCMag's pages to Dvorak's work. But that's before I knew better. Which was about ten years ago when I let my subscription finally run out.

Re:I've said it before (1)

UnknownSoldier (67820) | more than 8 years ago | (#15509847)

I agree. When they cut out the source for their utilties, Dvorak was the only thing really left reading. (Which isn't saying a lot.)

The thing is, he wrote stuff that "sounded" like it could be "real" -- It was to enjoyable to speculate, on what _might_ happen, for us geeks, when the industry could of gone any number of directions.

At least back then, it didn't sound too crazy.

Cheers

Re:I've said it before (4, Insightful)

telbij (465356) | more than 8 years ago | (#15509702)

We used to be able to pretend it was the editors foisting him upon us... but lo' and behold, democratic Digg comes along, and he still makes the front page!

No, this is backwards. The unwashed masses will never be collectively smart enough to distinguish a troll, statistical certainty and all that. This is the purpose of editorial control, to go beyond the bell curve. Dvorak can be kept off /. All that we need is to convince the few editors that he is, in fact, a full-time troll, And that his rantings do not deserve a place on the front page because they are neither news, nor are they 'stuff that matters'. Unfortunately I think a successful troll is just as good for /. as it is for Dvorak's employers, so there's little incentive for them to change. We can always dream though.

Re:I've said it before (1)

P3NIS_CLEAVER (860022) | more than 8 years ago | (#15509717)

If /. had a dvorak filter I would use it.

Re:I've said it before (1)

slyborg (524607) | more than 8 years ago | (#15509844)

Amen to that. That's how we finally got rid of the other infamous troll moron from the early days whose name shall not be spoken, but which rhymes with Gone Bats....

Re:I've said it before (4, Insightful)

sphealey (2855) | more than 8 years ago | (#15509794)

Dvorak writes a lot of different stuff, including some real journalism and technology analysis. But his best known work, and that which I am sure earns him his bread-and-butter, is technology gossip. Like every gossip column ever written since the first traveling minstrel appeared on the scene 30,000 years ago, Dvoark's gossip columns consist of a mixture of truth, exaggeration, spin (whether planted by the technology companies or generated by Dvorak himself), trolling, and some totally made-up stuff.

For example, Dvorak has been trying to force the monitor companies to bring new technologies to market for at least the last 20 years. That is why he hypes-Hypes-HYPES any rumour of a new display technoloy (seen that 300 dpi Texas Instruments display he reported "almost ready for production" in 1995 yet?). 40% truth, 40% exaggeration, 20% Dvorak-generated spin.

But as I said, that is how gossip columns of any kind work. Don't like it, don't read it.

sPh

Re:I've said it before (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#15509828)

Dvorak is nothing other than the worlds most successful troll.

Just because it is a troll does not mean that it isn't true. When Apple hands you an iBook [wired.com] that looks like a makeup case [wikipedia.org] ... many other tech writers would still write enough "quoteable nice things" to ensure more goodies in the future.

--
I'm not an AC for USA topics.
I'm not an AC for NSA topics.
Be very afraid on Mac topics.

Disgraceful (4, Funny)

Zeinfeld (263942) | more than 8 years ago | (#15509527)

Next you will be telling me that Ann Coulter only accuses the 9/11 widows of enjoying the death of their spouses to get attention.

Re:Disgraceful (1, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#15509619)

Heh, an aunt of mine knows coulter well, and assures me she doesn't believe most of what she says. In her own words, she has no qualms about telling the book buying public what they hope to hear from her, both liberals, conservatives and anyone else. It's just good business.

Others might call it trolling but if you call it "catering to your market" it's a great way to make moniey.

Interesting ... (3, Insightful)

khasim (1285) | more than 8 years ago | (#15509859)

Others might call it trolling but if you call it "catering to your market" it's a great way to make moniey.
Interesting. You know another way to make "moniey"? Have sex with strangers who will pay you.

Now ... if only there was a word for the kind of person who does that.

Who hasn't (2, Interesting)

packetmon (977047) | more than 8 years ago | (#15509546)

? Well? Anyone? Who hasn't trolled up an issue to some extent to get a fix on a certain group of individuals. Military does it, businesses do it, news agencies do it, and the list goes on and on...

There's No Such Thing as Overconfidence

The best in every business are likely to strike most people as irrationally confident, but that's how they got to the top.

Richard Branson, Bill Gates, Michael Dell -- they first believed in themselves, utterly, and let their belief be their guide. Sure they experienced numerous obstacles and setbacks and failures. Confidence allowed them to keep getting up and looking for ways to move forward.

Most importantly, leaders like Branson and Gates prioritized believing in the people around them. Confidence is also not arrogance, and unless your employees think that they're better human beings in general than everyone else, let them believe that they're good enough to do exceptional things.

Legends Never Say They're Sorry

Having a long or frequent memory for mistakes and a short or infrequent memory for successes is a guaranteed way to develop fear of failure. High achievers dwell on what they do well -- and spend very little time evaluating themselves and their performances.

Learn from your mistakes? Of course. The road to success is full of adversity from which we can gain significant insight. The key, however, is to set aside specific, deliberate times for evaluation. Process setbacks, errors, and your performance in general only at times when you have planned to.

The alternative is to get caught up in second-guessing, doubt, and worry whenever things look a bit gray. You excel during the tough moments by having a positive blueprint to look at -- and to have a positive blueprint, you have to spend a lot of time looking at the image of success.

... REVERSE PSYCHOLOGY FOR SUCCESS [thewinningattitude.net]

Cowboy Neal in Slashdot troll shocker! (4, Funny)

caluml (551744) | more than 8 years ago | (#15509547)

Cowboy Neal in Slashdot troll shocker! Read all about it for only $19.99 at all good book stores

well ... (-1, Redundant)

laurensv (601085) | more than 8 years ago | (#15509551)

duh

Idiot moron troll? (1, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#15509557)

Has anyone else noticed tags being censored, as Dvorak seems to be immune to the usual tags of "idiot moron troll"?

Trolling? (5, Interesting)

skinfitz (564041) | more than 8 years ago | (#15509561)

The thing is though one has to understand that the Mac community is a tiered structure. At the top there are we Mac users who are experienced computer users, who understand what we are doing and how computers and operating systems work and accept the existence of things such as 'bugs' and 'vulnerabilities' etc.

Unfortunately the thing that gives us all a bad name are the very vocal ignorant users that for example simply flat out refuse to accept any criticism of Apple or it's products whatsoever - in fact I'd go as far to say it becomes a religious issue as no matter how much evidence they are confronted with, they either are not capable of comprehending what is being presented to them or if they are, refuse to even consider it as this could mean Apple *might* be wrong and as they know, this cannot possibly happen as they consider Apple infallible.

Very, very odd behaviour and quite annoying as for example, should I attempt to get someone to consider a Mac, all it takes is someone they know who has 'heard about those Mac zealots' to put them off.

Consider also that any comment on apple.slashdot that however truthful, might mention a bug or vulnerability or other otherwise is perceived as a criticism gets modded as troll or flamebait (like this comment for example), tells a lot about the community.

Re:Trolling? (5, Interesting)

IntlHarvester (11985) | more than 8 years ago | (#15509706)

The thing is though one has to understand that the Mac community is a tiered structure. At the top ...

Interesting post. If you look at the Mac Community 10 years ago, the "Top technical elite" had almost entirely bailed off the platform.

It was the "very vocal ignorant" zealot-type users that pulled Apple through their dark days. They felt that Apple was getting a bad rap in the press (although it was deserved IMO), and formed this "Evangilista" group which involved flooding the airwaves with denials and counter-arguments to any bit of news which might be perceived as a negative to Apple. The fact that Apple rebounded just validated this behavior and mandated that it must continue.

So, when the technical users returned for the nice UI and Unix-underpinnings of OS X, they're probably scratching their heads over why every silly little Apple lawsuit is worthy of essays worth of Brand-Loyalist attention, or even makes the papers at all. But at this point everyone in the computing press (not just Dvorak) understands that riling up Mac users = Page Hits and Attention. That is why ever little bit of minor Mac news becomes a major trade story.

Another issue is that Apple themselves thrives off these super-loyalists. A key element of their product strategy is based on the fact that there's a large group of wealthy Appleites that will buy anything they put out for a maximum premium. I saw these stats [omnigroup.com] recently that showed that over 40% of Omni users are already running on Intel Macs. Omni is a small developer favored by the super-loyalists, but that's an astounding level of uptake even among that crowd. So, tossing the zealots an occasional pile of red meat really only helps Apple.

I suspect, but can't prove, that the "Evangilista" still exists (formally or infomally, sponsord by Apple or not). There's several Slashot users that one can count on only seeing when there's some bad Apple news to spin.

Re:Trolling? (1)

MustardMan (52102) | more than 8 years ago | (#15509754)

In all fairness, the new intel macs represent a MASSIVE leap forward in terms of speed and flexibility of a system. The laptops were stagnant as hell, with Apple trying to squeeze years of extra life out of the G4, a processor that should have died a long time ago. I had a G4 ibook, and upgraded to a 13" macbook the week it came out - even with the stock 512 megs of Ram, and the shitty intel integrated graphics, my macbook is faster than my ibook...

and the macbook is running two OSes at once via parallels!

Mac folks are certainly ones who like to upgrade and upgrade often - they like to have the newest and shiniest goodies from the Holy Land in cupertino. The Intel switch, though, is something a little bit extra-special, as it represents not an incremental speed bump but a massive leap.

And one final point - you can usually sell an Apple product a year after you bought it and only take around a 10-20% loss. That's pretty remarkable for a computer - a Dell sure doesn't hold its value like that. I know more than one Apple user (myself included) who takes the extra money it would cost to get a 3-year applecare plan, and uses that money to upgrade in a year by selling the old system off on ebay and buying a newer, better one. Part of why mac users upgrade so often is because it's actually fairly cheap to do so if you are smart about it.

Re:Trolling? (1)

IntlHarvester (11985) | more than 8 years ago | (#15509806)

Oh, I agree that the Intel Macs are sweet machines -- and the G4 PowerBook upgrade curve was so bleh that there was probably massive pent up demand for fast laptops.

But even in the PowerPC dark days I observed this behavior among certain users. There's several people I know who continually rotate through multiple Macs and iPods, just because that's a convienent way to spend their (inherited) savings. I don't care what the resale value is, selling a PB 1.3Ghz and buying a 1.5Ghz, or buying a G4 Mini "because it's cute" when you already have a G5 Tower isn't really rational behavior. And these people tend to talk much like the zealous posts seen on the interweb.

Re:Trolling? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#15509888)

I should say that Omni is a favorite for NeXTStep loyalists, not the old Apple loyalists in the dark ages...

Re:Trolling? (1)

MustardMan (52102) | more than 8 years ago | (#15509726)

I ran into this on the macrumors forums just yesterday. There was an article about that DRM protest, and these rabid fanbois were FOAMING AT THE MOUTH defending DRM. It was unreal to see a bunch of people who so strongly supported DRM. In fact, outside of someone who PROFITS from DRM, these idiots were the only people I've EVER seen defend that bullshit. It was really mind-blowing.

A lot of my friends accuse me of being a mac fanboy, or even a zealot, because I strongly believe the platform is superior and try to get as many people as possible to switch. If I'm a zealot, what the hell are those whackjobs over at MR?

Re:Trolling? (3, Interesting)

IntlHarvester (11985) | more than 8 years ago | (#15509834)

There is some rational basis for Mac users defending iTunes DRM -- it runs on Macs while the others don't. After a decade of seeing Macs being cut out of one market or another, having an Apple technology ontop in one segement is small victory. I'm not saying that justifies the extermism, but it does explain it.

Re:Trolling? (3, Insightful)

Handover Phist (932667) | more than 8 years ago | (#15509778)

Thank god us Linux users dont have to put up with that sort of thing!

VIVE LE QUÉBEC LIBRE! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#15509564)

Talk about starting a bonfire with a flamethrower

Re:VIVE LE QUÉBEC LIBRE! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#15509661)

de gaul 'o de man

Like bugs to a bug-zappin light (2, Interesting)

MikeRT (947531) | more than 8 years ago | (#15509565)

He makes great stats for years doing this, ups the ante by admitting that he knows it's the key to his success (thereby getting a lot of people to show up again) and now, the question is, will people stop reading him? Of course not. For the same reason that the right can't ignore Ted Rall and the left, Ann Coulter. He's the Rall and Coulter rolled into one of the tech press.

UI Troll (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#15509568)

Has anyone else ntoiced the resemblance between the new look of Slashdot's Mac and Linux sections and Windows Vista? I'm not sure who exactly our beloved editors are trolling with this one, but I certainly found it amusing.

Re:UI Troll (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#15509867)

Slashdot's new layout fits [imageshack.us] right in with Vista.

So what? (2, Insightful)

eagl (86459) | more than 8 years ago | (#15509569)

In other news, slashdot posters guilty of posting comments intended to spark debate and foster discussion of interesting topics!

It's sort of like accusing a congressman of creating and passing good legislation because he has a secret desire to get re-elected, or accusing someone of going to work to get paid. Imagine the nerve of some people!

advertising, not "stats" (2, Insightful)

SuperBanana (662181) | more than 8 years ago | (#15509581)

[SNIP]Dave Winer has Dvorak on video describing his methodology for trolling the Mac community to pump up his stats." [SNIP] I have to admit I'm also guilty of posting the occasional inflammatory story, but I find it's usually best to suffix the title with a question mark, and let our ever-knowledgeable readers hash out the issue and decide for themselves.

You do it for the same reason Dvorak did it. Not to boost "stats"- to boost advertising revenue by increasign page hits. A 300-post thread is thrilling advertising-wise compared to a 30-comment thread. It's always about increasing advertising revenues.

The evil "main stream media" has a term for it: sensationalism. You should attract readers via the quality of your content, not its controversialism. These days I see the average tech story on the homepage of my city's newspaper 1, 2, 3 days before it hits slashdot- and half the time, it's an AP wire story! Gone are the days when the media outlets didn't have contacts in the tech industry or didn't "understand" it. Slashdot's become a real bore, and the quality of commentary both on the part of editors and readers has gone straight downhill.

Re:advertising, not "stats" (1)

emmons (94632) | more than 8 years ago | (#15509749)

Yet it is wildly successful. What does that say about your argument regarding quality?

Slashdotted, see it on YouTube (3, Informative)

tdvaughan (582870) | more than 8 years ago | (#15509591)

Link to the video [youtube.com] . The sound was out of sync for me, but he basically comes across as a smug arse.

The question mark (2, Insightful)

trifish (826353) | more than 8 years ago | (#15509592)

but I find it's usually best to suffix the title with a question mark, and let our ever-knowledgeable readers hash out the issue and decide for themselves.

Which is, unfortunately, the case with many Slashdot (and most Digg) stories. As soon as I see a sensationalistic title ending with a question mark, I automatically skip to the next story.

Re:The question mark (2)

kfg (145172) | more than 8 years ago | (#15509680)

As soon as I see a sensationalistic title ending with a question mark, I automatically skip to the next story.

He fooled you this time by leaving off the question mark.

KFG

Re:The question mark (1)

kertong (179136) | more than 8 years ago | (#15509756)

"As soon as I see a sensationalistic title ending with a question mark, I automatically skip to the next story."

That's nice. want a cookie?

Question Mark ? (3, Funny)

88NoSoup4U88 (721233) | more than 8 years ago | (#15509594)

I have to admit I'm also guilty of posting the occasional inflammatory story, but I find it's usually best to suffix the title with a question mark, and let our ever-knowledgeable readers hash out the issue and decide for themselves.
Ohwait, make that : Dvorak Admits To Trolling Mac Users ?

:D

ha (1)

Vexorian (959249) | more than 8 years ago | (#15509600)

He can now make another article about how apple paid him to say this. That'll be an awesome way to continue the trolling.

Brace yourselves (5, Funny)

BMonger (68213) | more than 8 years ago | (#15509610)

Dvorak admits to trolling Mac users and Rosen admits the RIAA is wrong... apparently they know the second coming is happening soon and want to get some things off their chest.

REPENT I SAY!

Breaking News! You won't believe it! (4, Interesting)

Kelson (129150) | more than 8 years ago | (#15509631)

Actually, this does remind me of one of those stories where someone does a scientific study to find out something that "everyone already knows."

Except, of course, we didn't all know it before, we suspected it, and assumed it was true. Every once in a while you find out that something "everyone knows" isn't true after all [snopes.com] , so getting confirmation does have value.

Has CowboyNeal stopped beating his wife? (4, Funny)

identity0 (77976) | more than 8 years ago | (#15509635)

We Slashdot users, of course, will never stoop to such measures just to get modded up :)

Two things (1)

Lord_Dweomer (648696) | more than 8 years ago | (#15509647)

Two things...

First, do we have a confirmed source for this? The YoutTube video is INCREDIBLY out of sync. Can anybody confirm that it is indeed him speaking and not someone doing a voice-over?

My second question is, now that Cowboy Neal himself has commented on this, does that mean Slashdot editors will stop posting his stories finally? Something inside tells me it won't change a damn thing because much like Dvorak, Slashdot also gets large amounts of revenue from posting his trolling stories.

Re:Two things (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#15509791)

To answer your first question: The .mov torrent is perfectly in sync, unlike the youTube clip.

I think you already answered the second question yourself.

Since he's still around... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#15509654)

It must be really working. Apple fanboys have no one but themselves to blame.

HAHA I like that guy. (0, Troll)

bazmail (764941) | more than 8 years ago | (#15509720)

MAC users are extremely naive. this guy is milking them for every hit and they are too stupid to figure it out. I respect that guy a lot. MAC users need to grow the fuck up and get a real OS.

The irony... (1)

Chief Typist (110285) | more than 8 years ago | (#15509761)

This video is a troll on the Mac community.

-ch

One thing about Dvorak (1)

MyNameIsEarl (917015) | more than 8 years ago | (#15509772)

Don't forget he gets no spam.

dvorak.org/blog

I think he is funny on TWIT, he is always getting things wrong it cracks me up.

Trolling Nothing New (4, Insightful)

PhreakinPenguin (454482) | more than 8 years ago | (#15509776)

Trolling is nothing new especially when you look right here on Slashdot every day. What gets Slashdot the most pageviews? Stories about Microsoft. The anti MS people comment like crazy while the pro MS people do the same. I swear there could be a story about finding a cure for cancer above a story about Microsoft and the Microsoft story would have more comments.

Can Not Compute! (1)

mattwarden (699984) | more than 8 years ago | (#15509783)

Dave Winer has Dvorak on video

Calculating hatred ratio, Winer:Dvorak...

Warning: overflow
Warning: overflow
Warning: overflow
Warning: overflow
DOES NOT COMPUTE! ERRORRR!!@@

OFF TOPIC but I dont care (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 8 years ago | (#15509820)

"and let our ever-knowledgeable readers hash out the issue and decide for themselves."

And when your not manipulatively inflammatory against "the other camp", your a manipulative kiss-ass to this one.

Mac (1)

mfh (56) | more than 8 years ago | (#15509838)

I don't mind. Mac trolls windows users with their ads -- so it's fair game.

As UK tabloids columnists know.. (1)

abigsmurf (919188) | more than 8 years ago | (#15509895)

Nothing gets people reading like a controversial opinion. When ad services pay per view, writing something that goes against popular opinion and getting it posted endlessly on "I can't believe this guy" theads on forums. Who cares if you have to write something that isn't inline with your own views if it can earn you a quick buck?
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